@@vagabond734it’s still taking advantage even if someone lets you. Idk why you think that’s different. Appreciation with money would be setting up opportunities and a platform for them to sell their own goods. Not selling their style for thousands for rich people to cosplay with.
@@vagabond734if u truly want to appreciate them, have 50% of the money go to supporting them AND have them to be the models!!! no one can rock those jewelries as good as the people who made these intricate beautiful masterpieces
I almost never trust a corporation’s intentions with the delicate balance of appreciation of culture versus appropriation. Its safe to assume corpos appropriate anything they get their hands on
I'm Kenyan. No it is NOT appreciation. Those in the photoshoot barely got paid, and standing next to a group of people just because of how they look, is WEIRD AS HELL FOR A BRAND TO DO. I understand tourists doing it, but not a whole damn brand.
If there were masaai aritsts, models, and advisors, the meanings were accurate and the community profited off it and it helped then no, but that’s not what happened.
I think a lot of people didn’t learn you can’t touch but you can look. My mother would always tell me that at stores and museums as a kid 😂 I’ve been thinking about that a lot
If Valentino involved local artisans and cooperatives in the design and profits - appreciation. If Valentino just used the communities for the photos and overall look- appropriation.
Not appreciation, no appropriation, just corporatism, and capitalism. It's just about money. They don't give an iota about Masai culture, craft, and art unless they can make money from it.
Claiming that something is social appropriation can be a form of racism, and this attitude needs to change. I'm against labeling cultural expressions as social appropriation because it often reflects underlying racist beliefs.
Im going to Valentino instagram and literally going to talk trash, did you even build water well for them at least for a payment like wtf lifetime supplies of food
Do you guys think the massai give a shit about Valentino using their aesthetic for an ad? No. They literally use cows as a currency. Do you think they’re tapped into to western consumerism. They don’t need you guys defending their honor lmao
I have no problems with cultural appreciation, since cultures have long been sharing influences. Cultures are living organisms. My problem is when the culture is destroyed by outside influences due to capitalism views. I see uninformed tourists in Europe buying made in China cultural images instead of paying for local artisan work. It would bother me if, as consequence of this campaign, Masai inspired beading jewelry being made by corporations took over the Masai artisans.
And not used for profit! Valentino could have easily shared the culture without making a product. Or their product could have been in collaboration with the culture. But referencing a culture to make money isn't sharing a culture, it's using the culture.
@ No, these two ideologies are mutually exclusive. If they are shared, they are free to be enjoyed. Cultures aren’t owned. If someone wants to profit off of it, they can! You don’t make any sense.
There's a difference between appreciation and appropriation. Appreciation would be like a chunk of this video, showing the actual culture and learning the implications of the jewelry in the culture. Appreciation could also be buying jewelry made by these people to show support. If Valentino really did care about proper appreciation their collection could be in collaboration with this group and having their direct input so the references to their culture were accurate and sharing the profits. Appropriation is only picking out the small details that are usable for a narrative and erasing the greater cultural context, in this case for profit. The designs Valentino made are not correct for this culture. Honestly the campaign didn't even need to reference this culture because the jewelry is so far removed from the culture. In that case there should have been no reason to reference the tribe, but they did so to use the "exotic" nature of this culture to sell their jewelry. If you are only using a culture to boost sales and not actually caring about the culture then it's appropriation.
If it were appreciation, then it would be by Masaai artists, supporting Masaai communities, supported by Valentino; not, by Valentino, period.
I don't think you're supposed to profit off of appreciation.
I think you should and can. Since the masai people agreed to it.
@@vagabond734it’s still taking advantage even if someone lets you. Idk why you think that’s different. Appreciation with money would be setting up opportunities and a platform for them to sell their own goods. Not selling their style for thousands for rich people to cosplay with.
Were they paid?
@@vagabond734if u truly want to appreciate them, have 50% of the money go to supporting them AND have them to be the models!!! no one can rock those jewelries as good as the people who made these intricate beautiful masterpieces
I almost never trust a corporation’s intentions with the delicate balance of appreciation of culture versus appropriation. Its safe to assume corpos appropriate anything they get their hands on
I wrote almost exactly this, then I saw your comment! You are absolutely 💯 right!
This is well written and I agree. The corporations are like children that just snatch the ball away. There is no sharing.
I'm Kenyan. No it is NOT appreciation. Those in the photoshoot barely got paid, and standing next to a group of people just because of how they look, is WEIRD AS HELL FOR A BRAND TO DO. I understand tourists doing it, but not a whole damn brand.
i learned about the maasai in my history of photography class, so cool to learn this fact about the jewelry they wear!
i’ve visited the maasai villiage and even bought some of their jewelry, very nice people who are super inviting
If there were masaai aritsts, models, and advisors, the meanings were accurate and the community profited off it and it helped then no, but that’s not what happened.
APPROPIATION!!!
❤❤❤
Appropriation
I think a lot of people didn’t learn you can’t touch but you can look. My mother would always tell me that at stores and museums as a kid 😂 I’ve been thinking about that a lot
Chanel dolce gabana can be jelaous.on them
If Valentino involved local artisans and cooperatives in the design and profits - appreciation.
If Valentino just used the communities for the photos and overall look- appropriation.
Appropriation.
Kenyan here
Just no.
Don't use our culture for profit if you're not going to give money back ... Appreciation and appropriation are different
Hire Kenyan artisans ... Kenyan models... Do more
Not appreciation, no appropriation, just corporatism, and capitalism. It's just about money. They don't give an iota about Masai culture, craft, and art unless they can make money from it.
Peak example of appropriation lol
Claiming that something is social appropriation can be a form of racism, and this attitude needs to change. I'm against labeling cultural expressions as social appropriation because it often reflects underlying racist beliefs.
Im going to Valentino instagram and literally going to talk trash, did you even build water well for them at least for a payment like wtf lifetime supplies of food
As long as they’re given credit I suppose it’s okau
Crtl V ahh models
Do you guys think the massai give a shit about Valentino using their aesthetic for an ad? No. They literally use cows as a currency. Do you think they’re tapped into to western consumerism. They don’t need you guys defending their honor lmao
Hard appropriation
I have no problems with cultural appreciation, since cultures have long been sharing influences. Cultures are living organisms.
My problem is when the culture is destroyed by outside influences due to capitalism views. I see uninformed tourists in Europe buying made in China cultural images instead of paying for local artisan work. It would bother me if, as consequence of this campaign, Masai inspired beading jewelry being made by corporations took over the Masai artisans.
Cultures are supposed to be shared
And not used for profit!
Valentino could have easily shared the culture without making a product. Or their product could have been in collaboration with the culture. But referencing a culture to make money isn't sharing a culture, it's using the culture.
@ No, these two ideologies are mutually exclusive. If they are shared, they are free to be enjoyed. Cultures aren’t owned. If someone wants to profit off of it, they can! You don’t make any sense.
Wait why was valentino fired against for showing the beauty of the culture? Fackin humans 🙄
There's a difference between appreciation and appropriation.
Appreciation would be like a chunk of this video, showing the actual culture and learning the implications of the jewelry in the culture. Appreciation could also be buying jewelry made by these people to show support. If Valentino really did care about proper appreciation their collection could be in collaboration with this group and having their direct input so the references to their culture were accurate and sharing the profits.
Appropriation is only picking out the small details that are usable for a narrative and erasing the greater cultural context, in this case for profit. The designs Valentino made are not correct for this culture. Honestly the campaign didn't even need to reference this culture because the jewelry is so far removed from the culture. In that case there should have been no reason to reference the tribe, but they did so to use the "exotic" nature of this culture to sell their jewelry.
If you are only using a culture to boost sales and not actually caring about the culture then it's appropriation.
@ yet the people of that culture agreed to it, so does it matter?
Appropriation
Appropriation