Frank Herbert's point was never to discuss whether Paul was a Messiah or not, he was, the real point was that Messiahs are bad for society. Actual quote from the book - "No more terrible disaster could befall your people than for them to fall into the hands of a hero."
Herbert was a genius. The story is very complex and I think Grace once again missed the point. But I am glad that she at least didn't "fall asleep" on this one. I loved both part One and Two. I think Chalamet was able to portray the inner turmoil that Paul has to push through. Thanks!
@@jadedspadesindeed part one and part two were amazing and part three will be for sure too. 23 books in the meantime and even comics what quite impressive. The messiah topic goes through several books and who didn’t get it in part two will certainly gets it in part three, cant wait
also the evolution of religion for good or lets be honest it's always for the worst as a Muslim i was fascinated by dune cause frank Herbert used a lot of stuff from Islam and i know it doesn't exactly puts us in the best light but that's the point
@@jurgenmathiae6682 I wouldn’t recommend reading anything in the Dune series not written by Frank Herbert(the first 6 books). Brian Herbert perverted and misfolded his father’s story into a mindless Star Wars style story for profit.
There is just a lot of nuance to so many of the scenes. For example, when Paul defeats Feyd, it's in the same way he loses to Gurney during the first movie. Paul thinks he has landed the killing blow on Gurney but Gurney's knife is already pressed up to Paul's stomach below. Feyd thinks he has Paul checkmated but then gets stabbed through the stomach.
Paul is not the Messiah. He is not any messiah. He is a perfectly curated disaster to the culture of the Fremen. He fits the Fremen religion which is as a result of propaganda. I mean look at Stilgar. In Part One he's a somewhat regal naib of the Fremen. I don't know if this is intentional but in Part Two Stilgar is basically destroyed by belief. He loses his individuality, becomes even comedic sometimes, a microcosm of the Fremen. It's really tragic to me. Paul is a warning. I love that the movie makes this really clear.
This is exactly it. Stilgar is one of the most tragic characters in Dune. In the second and third book the story goes further in on this with Stilgar and how Fremen culture is changed because of the Atreides.
I would argue that there technically is no Messiah. It's not like with Anakin where you have actually have a prophecy from some mystical greater force. Here, the Bene Gesserit wanted this powerful being and literally engineers it to happen, and then spins it as this great prophecy to everyone else.
Isn't that the point. Commentary on the entire foundation of religion and the concept of a Messiah worshiped by downtrodden people turned fundamentalist.
I know! It's a testament to the brilliance of everyone involved in the production of the film that not once did I feel bored during the nearly 3 hr runtime. I only looked at my watch to time the changes during important arcs and scenes.
I loved Léa Seydoux's very brief role. I thought she did such a good job of manipulating Butler's character through seduction and intelligence. The way they shot it and the music was also incredible!!
Watched it last night. They seldom make movies like this anymore. Intelligent science fiction that doesn't talk down to it's audience. I never thought much about Timothée before but that last hour shows what a powerhouse he is. I listened to the soundtrack on the way home after the screening. Everyone is fantastic in this, but Ferguson is superb and Butler is not wasted here either.
@@Xavier-ty4jw Feyd's new blade, he asked his girls what they wanted to eat. Then he killed the servant. Second scene, he is on Arrakis, said they haven't eaten since they traveled and killed another. Each time he kills, it was to feed his harem.
I’ve watched it TWICE, the scene that sold me was Paul’s resurrection and his speech towards the Freman leaders, I got so many chills both times such a an amazing movie!
I love science fiction and I love interplanetary war movies like Star wars. But this is the first time that a movie actually made me feel small in the universe. This was epic
Paul turned full-Darth Vader by the end. I mean, the robe switch from brown to dark brown is kinda of a gimme. Dune 2 is ABSOLUTELY the Empire Strikes Back of the soon-to-be trilogy. The way Paul acknowledged the Baron as his grandfather, cemented his truth that he was Harkonnen, destined to be one with the enemy of his father and his family. I'd like to think that the Baron died in shock with the realization that even with all his scheming, a grander scheme was in place, even greater than he realized, and he dying with that knowledge. I LOVED the change that he was the one to kill the Baron vs. Lynch's Dune.
Having read the book version of the gladiator scene, I thought they adapted Feyd’s whole approach to fighting so well. Cause in the book it goes into how Feyd very much respects valiant fighters and touches on the idea that if he wasn’t raised in the brutal Harkonnen world where he was taught to deal with tragedy violently, he could’ve ended up more like Paul as a more controlled patient, less impulsive figure. Also loved the way he kinda respects Paul fairly in the end, cause despite the violent front he actually might very much be the most respectful and understanding of the Harkonenns
The Bene Gesserit are very cynical in creating or adjusting religions to suit their purposes. Chani was right in saying that's how they are controlled by outsiders, though she became tiresome very quickly.
@@JGeeNbDZZU8k9YHfsxkcZFumFiXBhj For some reason they didn't want her to be a lovey-dovey girl that seduces Paul. I don't know why he'd be attracted to "angry girl" unless something happened in the first movie, which I haven't seen.
Hi Grace! The author originally intended for Paul's messiah arc to serve as a warning for worshipping people/heroes. But many readers didn't catch this, so he wrote dune messiah. Dennis villenueve also talks about this in interviews.
I didn’t catch that the first time I read the book. I cheered that Paul checkmated everyone so hard in the end. I was initially unsettled about the changes to Chani’s arc but am coming around to it because it serves a purpose for the plot and audience. You are to feel unsettled that such a powerful person is wrestling authority. Chani is the movies moral compass.
It was also supposed to be a book about ecology, published in 1965, just a few years after _Silent Spring._ But somehow that gets lost in the sequels, as it does turn green, but people want to convert their planets to desert to try to transplant sandworms.
Been waiting all week for this 😂 Watching Paul change through the movie it reminded of of Eren from Attack on Titan, with the power of seeing both the past and the future, turning them into somewhat emotionless shells of themselves that simply follow what the future has told them already would happen.
Yes! There’s a lot of similarities between the 2 with being able to see a horrific future but destined to move forward no matter what. Also a lot of political maneuvering and fanatical followers.
You would hope so, considering the first movie was a pandemic release. Although this one may go above and beyond because of how much better it is also.
_God Emperor of Dune_ was my favorite of the books. But I think they don't expect a work titled "God Emperor" to do well. They also avoided "Messiah" in the title of the sy-fy series.
@@AlkalineInsides all I’ve seen is comparisons of Paul to Anakin Skywalker and similar characters. So I know he is forever changed. Also that this series spans generations. I’m not sure how many movies they plan to make but it seems the first three are all the first book.
1 and 2 are based on the first book. Denis hopes to make a third based on the second book Dune: Messiah. After that Paul is no longer the central character.
20:32 i feel like by the end it’s very clear that he’s not the messiah and that while his intentions were at first for the people, it’s all going to his head.
Paul cannot be a real messiah because, as far as I'm aware, there is no God in the Dune universe. Paul is the result of the Bene Gesserit's careful crossing of bloodlines, mentat training (human supercomputer) and sword training by some of the best fighters in the universe. Over the centuries, the Bene Gesserit have popularized a profecy that says there will be someone like Paul coming in the future. So when Paul comes to Arrakis and the spice boosts his mentals capacities and visions, he becomes the Kwisatz Haderach, but it's the result of planning and training, not intervention from God. Although it is hard to see how the tear situation could be engineered, I agree
Yes they seeded that propaganda and religions around the universe. But they still were designing a human mind capable of becoming superhuman and seeing through time. Which is actually true. So it’s both a story they pushed but something they were genetically engineering. If you can see the future you basically fulfill both destinies anyway.
Although I do understand your distinction - Paul is not divine, he is in fact the Messiah for the Fremen. The Bene Geserit created him and created the prophecy only be could fulfill there. He is the fulfillment of their political aspirations, but also this fulfills the religious aspirations of the Fremen. We see the distinction because we are outside observers to this universe.
As I continued to watch the movie I was amazed at the richness of the story. I genuinely got scared of Paul as he transitioned into the Messiah figure willing to go to war
I love the book story of Dune and I didnt know if Chalamet could bring the Paul I envisioned in the second half of the book to life... But he did. Incredible acting.
I'm noticing a significant portion of younger generation Z viewers are struggling to connect with the deliberate pacing and complex worldbuilding of Dune, finding it dense or dull at points rather than gripping. This could speak to broader trends around shorter attention spans and accessibility standards in media, though also highlights the challenges in adapting such a sprawling novel series. While Dune has resonated critically and with whole generations of audiences, its philosophical and political depth may not be as accessible for viewers accustomed to more straightforward plot dynamics and worldbuilding unfortunately.
It's a good thing Dune 2 & Oppenheimer don't have to go up against each other @Oscars! Definitely think Denis with any 5 from both Dune movies, Sicario, Arrival, Blade Runner 2049 & Prisoners can go toe-to-toe with Nolan in a Top 5 debate :) Hoping for an $80m+ domestic opening wkend for Dune 2 🤞
Still Nolan here. Considering Batman Begins/Dark Knight EIther or, Momento, Prestige, and Interstellar. Its actually not even close. Dune 2 Rules and is still not as good as any of Nolans best.
I mean, he handled it far better in the book and the rapport he has with Chani is a stark contrast with his supposed wife especially in the second book. I hope DV can explain that in the upcoming movie.
@@azmodanpcBut Messiah is set 15 years in the future, im unsure how denis is going to lead into part 3 without having a 15 year time jump at start of movie and yet still explain how chani and paul are still together.
I haven’t read Messiah (yet) but Paul said in the movie that he foresees that Chani would understand or implied some reconciliation. I was hoping to hear the line from the book that Paul would marry Irulan but she would be a wife in name only, but that obv never came.
In the books, the sand worms would tire out from being used as “vehicles” by the time the rider reached their destination. Much easier to get off a worm than on one. 😂
The scene where the Baron is coming out to the balcony for Feyd’s battle and he goes from color to black and white because of the black sun… CHILLS!! Chills just even typing this and this is only one (1) of the many scenes that gave me chills but I think it’s so underrated I haven’t seen anyone talk about it
I read the books and love how much more sophisticated they are. Nonetheless, I still appreciate the changes made for the mainstream audience. I hope it does great because I want to see the rest of the story!!
I watchit last night and this was the best Space Opera I have seen in the theatres to date. Star Wars which heavily borrowed from the Dune series pales in comparison. It is an intelligent and artistic film.
One detail the movie took out was that Chani was the daughter of a Fremen woman and an imperial planetologist. Her part in the prophecy could have been pre-arranged by the Bene Gesserit, and Paul seeing her in his vision could be his genetic memory from a past Bene Gesserit seeing one of Chani's ancestors.
Your description of Paul starting out not having agency of his own, where everything happens TO made me think of Michael Corleone, so there's a similarly wide character arc!
BABY GOATS! What a colorful and important point Grace, I think this cast really will be looked back on as a collection of acting GOATs all in their early shine. A couple of story points you might find interesting: 1. Chani's name had originally come from "some stupid prophecy", so in a way her fulfilling the prophecy can still be seen as a Bene Gesseritt manipulation - this might point to why Jessica was so insistent on her being the one to revive Paul. 2. The sand compactors were shown by Duncan Idaho in the first movie and explain how the Fremen hide in the sand and build their tents in them - it sense out sonic vibrations in the sand that cause it to become liquid -like. The sandworms use a version of this to move through the desert - it's based on real physics! 3. This is strictly a book detail but in the novel, the Fremen have actually developed the ability to heal cuts quickly to preserve their bodies' water content - a mix of evolution and one of the health benefits of the spice melange. This is why book readers were not surprised to see Paul survive several cuts at the end.
I think having Feyd-Rautha fight mostly drugged oppoenents kind of cheapens his eventual duel with Paul. Should have made him more of a threat. Paul definitely used his visions to manipulate the Fremen and he's not really their messiah but something more powerful in a way since he has the ability to affect the entire fate of the known universe.
I mean that literally is how it is in the book. the two knife that he have in the arena the short white blade is supposed to be poison and his opponent are supposed to know that but he cheat so that the long black one is poison instead. Feyd is a character that will manipulate everything to get his way. The Atreides that wasn’t drug was to show if he could really thrive in a fair fight.
Just went back to read the arena section of the book: apparently he sets it up himself so he knows his enemy is not going to be drugged, in order to sow doubt in his uncle and get the master in charge of the arena killed.
SPOILERS*** Irulan will not be producing any heirs and that is not why he married her (unless Villeneuve decides to change things up from the book). More for the legitimacy of marrying into the Emperor's family and to make abdicating the throne easier for the Emperor insuring that his daughter would be safe. Great review, Grace!
Yeah, Paul never says he is marrying Irulan to produce an heir. I don't know where Grace got this. Of course, they don't produce an heir. Paul reassures Chani before he proclaims he will marry Irulan to keep her safe. I guess she just inserted her own assumptions?
Zendaya’s Chani is my favorite character. She’s the most grounded character to me. She falls in love with Paul when he shows his sincerity in wanting to fight with the Fremen. But once she sees that Paul’s ambitions are outgrowing her desires to free her people, she abandons him, choosing not to follow him. She sees through all the Bene Gesserit manipulation and constantly questions and pushes back against the “miracles” she witnesses.
Great review! As a book person I love seeing something so well done even if the source material is slightly altered. This was my favorite cinematic EXPERIENCE in many years. Can’t wait to see it again in imax.
I think the answer about Paul being the messiah or not id not answered by some characteristic of Paul, but by what is the messiah. Is the messiah a god or a superior being? So Paul is not. Is the messiah someone who meets the criteria made by propaganda and eugenics? So yes, he is.
I noticed that but I searched within myself and realized maybe I learned to expect lengthier action scenes because of all the other blockbusters I’ve seen. I learned to embrace the direction Denis had for this film and not compare it to other films. The action felt appropriate for the story trying to be told.
I really like how the final duel really contrasted Paul's and Fey'd characters. For Feyd pain is pleasure: he relishes and enjoys pain. Instead of quickly ending Paul when he had the upper hand he slowly approaches and wants to make the whole thing intimate almost. Whereas for Paul pain is purpose: he knew he had to get close to Feyd, pain be dammned, so he can deliver the killing blow. Fascinating stuff
Grace! Hearing you talk so eloquently about one of my favorite stories (huge fan of the books) made my day. Glad you enjoyed the movie so much and all its layers!
He is the messiah, but the messiah has nothing divine attached to it, it's manufactured by the Bene Gesserit, which also explains everything you discuss during the "he is the Nexus, at the right time", that's not by chance, even if it happens 1 generation too soon.
That fact that he eventually brought green paradise to Arakkis was the exact reason that doomed Fremen and their culture, you would still believe he was the Messiah? Wait until you watch part 3.
I think events were out of his control once he agreed to Jihad to be the emperor. The greening of Dune was already part of their culture and manifest destiny.
SPOILER: The scene where all of the Fremen attack the emperor and the reveal of the multiple sandworms coming out of the storm? FULL BODY CHILLS. I’ve genuinely never had a movie give me such a purely emotional reaction like that. At that moment I thought to myself, “Am I seeing the LotR of my generation?” So so good.
Actually the black & white palette for the harkonnen world is because they orbit a black sun. If you noticed when the Bene Gesserits step into the sunlight area of the arena, their cloaks turn from black to white. And when they are inside buildings, we see everyone in color.
Even with the changes from the book, Denis Villeneuve managed to make Dune Part 2 an amazing cinematic experience. I'm eagerly waiting for Part 3 to come out to see how his vision for this epic story will conclude. Hans Zimmer also upped his game in this sequel, which I partially listened to before watching the movie. Wow. Zimmer's score is just stunning. Anyone going out to see this movie, really owes it to themselves to see this in IMAX if possible
My most anticipated part of Paul's story is the moment when a student outperform their teachers and infuse all that lessons in Arrakis which makes him the real deal. What i found surprising is despite everyone call him the real deal, he doesn't want to just take that title the easy way, he wants to do the hardwork to prove to mostly himself (and others) that earn it, and that also speaks to his long term thinking that by doing that, he'll be able to convince the skeptics in the Fremen to accept him as their own and gain an absolute loyalty from the whole Fremen. That's a quality trait of leadership
Paul is the Messiah in the sense that he matches all of the qualities the Bene Gesserit solidified into myth through the Missionaria Protectiva. Once the Fremen come to fanatically believe in him as the Messiah, his ability to control his own myth is completely out of his own hands - even as someone who can see the future. All paths lead in the same general direction (unless Paul chooses death which was never an option in his mind, he is not that self-sacrificing). The criticism the books bring up is the very concept of a Messiah. Messianic figures never lead to wider happiness and prosperity. More likely they will lead to death, doom, and tragedy for everyone involved. Paul is the Messiah, but he is more a figure of incoming doom and dystopia rather than the utopian dream their religion preaches.
I've read the book (the original 6 book including Dune Messiah), and I got my tickets today for Saturday. Still have some good seats at imax mall of Georgia. But I'm so ready for this.
Oh, you are going to love the visual storytelling here. There are lots of goodies especially for book readers in this. I was so incredible. I actually do not think anyone can really "spoil" the film because it is an experience to just observe. Paul's evolution is great. I hope you love it as I did.
I've been a fan of Timothee Chalamet since I first saw him in "Call Me By Your Name." He is just incredible. He and his agent deserve some awards because they have outstanding taste in film projects. I think Dune could make a good Game of Thrones-type HBO series at some point. I've also become a huge fan of Dene Villanova and his aesthetic.
I would actually compare this movie more to TROY starring Brad Pitt, Orlando Bloom and Eric Bana (which came out 20 years ago!) moreso than Batman and TDK.
@@matiasdevaglia4541 yes I know but I actually enjoyed Dune Part 1 more. Maybe its just my taste, or maybe i went in with misplaced ideas from the excellent 2nd trailer and the "glow up" comparisons from BB to TDK, but the analogy just doesn't fit imo. But throughout the entire movie I kept thinking of Troy. The war to please a ruler's hubris, the reluctant warrior, the love of a good woman being the only motivation to keep going despite all odds, etc.
Troy is the movie that changed Brad Pitts career. He hated it so much he refused to do a blockbuster after that. He refuses to watch it. He considered it the opposite type of movie he wanted to be remembered for.
@@MaxxRemKing1 LOL youre saying he thinks Mr & Mrs Smith is a better product of his film career? idts. Troy is the last big movie he got to make before wasting his life on Angelina
wow great review Grace, but the messiah I think ending with Chani not agreeing with what is going on, show how Paul is going through the wrong path, I like this change from the book
yes I think the way they will do the next movie, is that she's pregnant with the twins, Paul come back to her after the war, and princess Florence gives her birth control so Shani dosent get to have the heirs of Paul but fails and is responsible of shani's death after giving birth to the twins
WHY do so many people boil down the end with Chani's reaction as just a "haha yay you go girl!" woman scorned moment...? She was drastically different from the book, but even the movie version of Chani is deeper than so many (at least in the scope of critics/reviews) people seem to realize. I absolutely LOVE that I can watch someone call this an intellectual blockbuster, while at the same time providing surface level "hur dur thats my girl boss" forms of commentary.
I didn't see part one; was she nice and charming in that movie? I can't see Paul falling for such a b**** in this movie when there would have been so many women fawning over him as this religious figure, though the women shown with Chani were scorning and mocking him.
They did a lot of 'popping up out of the sand' in the first movie too ❤ I did love how the Giedi Prime 'black sun' made everything black & white (though indoors was pretty monochrome too, with only hints of blue & green) 😄
Hollywood loves recycling the same actors. The trailers playing before this movie, I was thinking where are all the thousands of actors trying to make it.
I thought a little differently about the end fight wish they did longer shots so u can see the good choreo clearer. The editing is so choppy. Maybe they had to cut it up so much bc they had to use stunt doubles too much. But the sound design was so good u really felt the hits and when they got stabbed amazing.
I never read the books, but its been implied that paul became almost invinsible or immortal after drinking the water of life. Thus beaing able to sustain two blade wounds and surviving so many battles.
After drinking the blue liquid, Paul can see various paths to completing his mission. He recognizes a hard option path, which is why he repeatedly tells Chani that he loves her to death. Because this difficult path involves challenging the emperor and especially marrying Princess Irulan.
He saw multiple outcomes . Just choose the one the thought had less “ bad “ consequences for the Universe. Even if it was the worse for his own person and family .
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
The Bene Gesserit did such a good job planting the seeds that they have almost convinced Grace that Paul is the Messiah
Frank Herbert's point was never to discuss whether Paul was a Messiah or not, he was, the real point was that Messiahs are bad for society. Actual quote from the book - "No more terrible disaster could befall your people than for them to fall into the hands of a hero."
Herbert was a genius. The story is very complex and I think Grace once again missed the point. But I am glad that she at least didn't "fall asleep" on this one. I loved both part One and Two. I think Chalamet was able to portray the inner turmoil that Paul has to push through. Thanks!
@@jadedspadesindeed part one and part two were amazing and part three will be for sure too. 23 books in the meantime and even comics what quite impressive. The messiah topic goes through several books and who didn’t get it in part two will certainly gets it in part three, cant wait
@@jurgenmathiae6682 same. I am so looking forward to watching part 2 again and Messiah. Can not wait. Make it now, lol.
also the evolution of religion for good or lets be honest it's always for the worst as a Muslim i was fascinated by dune cause frank Herbert used a lot of stuff from Islam and i know it doesn't exactly puts us in the best light but that's the point
@@jurgenmathiae6682 I wouldn’t recommend reading anything in the Dune series not written by Frank Herbert(the first 6 books). Brian Herbert perverted and misfolded his father’s story into a mindless Star Wars style story for profit.
There is just a lot of nuance to so many of the scenes. For example, when Paul defeats Feyd, it's in the same way he loses to Gurney during the first movie. Paul thinks he has landed the killing blow on Gurney but Gurney's knife is already pressed up to Paul's stomach below. Feyd thinks he has Paul checkmated but then gets stabbed through the stomach.
Wow I didn't catch that! So coool
Saw it today on IMAX in Sydney. Visually stunning, but I think if you don’t already know the story, the narrative is missing.
@@willcc3I don't think it's missing. But, just like with the first movie, you do need to actually think about things.
Great use of foreshadowing
An question. Paul got stab twice how come he didn't die? and looks less built-up(he is skinny)
Paul is not the Messiah. He is not any messiah. He is a perfectly curated disaster to the culture of the Fremen. He fits the Fremen religion which is as a result of propaganda. I mean look at Stilgar. In Part One he's a somewhat regal naib of the Fremen. I don't know if this is intentional but in Part Two Stilgar is basically destroyed by belief. He loses his individuality, becomes even comedic sometimes, a microcosm of the Fremen. It's really tragic to me. Paul is a warning. I love that the movie makes this really clear.
This is exactly it. Stilgar is one of the most tragic characters in Dune. In the second and third book the story goes further in on this with Stilgar and how Fremen culture is changed because of the Atreides.
I would argue that there technically is no Messiah. It's not like with Anakin where you have actually have a prophecy from some mystical greater force. Here, the Bene Gesserit wanted this powerful being and literally engineers it to happen, and then spins it as this great prophecy to everyone else.
So it's.
I mean, with all his powers and accomplishments he pretty much feels like one
Isn't that the point. Commentary on the entire foundation of religion and the concept of a Messiah worshiped by downtrodden people turned fundamentalist.
The mouse getting close to Paul's breathing stick is a cute addition. Muaddib likes the smell of Muaddib
The mouse should’ve taken down the Baron with the Gom Jabbar
@@ebransc09
well Paul stabbed the Baron in the place of the neck where the Gom Jabbar is usually used...
Them 3 hours FLEW BY, not once was I bored. 10/10
Guy in my theater said, “damn it was too short” lol
Same!!!!
I needed more! 😅
It was way too short. I want the next one now!
Good job, without plot!🤣🤣🤣
I know! It's a testament to the brilliance of everyone involved in the production of the film that not once did I feel bored during the nearly 3 hr runtime. I only looked at my watch to time the changes during important arcs and scenes.
Grace: "That's great writing." Dune Book Readers: "We know. We've been saying it for years." 🤣
This film is not from Dune book 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@radeknekola9040 yes it is 🥴🥴
@@irish6783 no stop this🤭🤣🤣
@@radeknekola9040you may need to read it again then
Many lines in the film are directly from the book. The book explores many complex ideas, this being why it has been so hard to adapt.
I loved Léa Seydoux's very brief role. I thought she did such a good job of manipulating Butler's character through seduction and intelligence. The way they shot it and the music was also incredible!!
Great scene. It implies that Feyd went through the Gom Jabbar, though, which I don't think is in the book. Either way, it worked for the film.
Their chemistry in the scene was through the roof.
The speech Paul gave to the southern Fremon deserved to be mentioned. Very powerful moment.
One of the few moments of cinema where I literally got goosebumps.
Bill Pullman did it better
That was my favorite scene in this movie full of incredible scenes!
@@jrm371 same
Watched it last night. They seldom make movies like this anymore. Intelligent science fiction that doesn't talk down to it's audience. I never thought much about Timothée before but that last hour shows what a powerhouse he is. I listened to the soundtrack on the way home after the screening. Everyone is fantastic in this, but Ferguson is superb and Butler is not wasted here either.
I know! I was shocked that Chalamet could be so frightening and intimidating. Wtf. Incredible.
Did you notice.... Fayd's harem were cannibalistic?
How so?
@@Xavier-ty4jw Feyd's new blade, he asked his girls what they wanted to eat. Then he killed the servant.
Second scene, he is on Arrakis, said they haven't eaten since they traveled and killed another. Each time he kills, it was to feed his harem.
Ya you’re correct hahah. Pretty simple to understand
His harpies were sooo cool. Little details like them make it
I wondered if that was a general Harkonen thing. So it was just them?
I’ve watched it TWICE, the scene that sold me was Paul’s resurrection and his speech towards the Freman leaders, I got so many chills both times such a an amazing movie!
I paused the review to say “if the Met gala had fight sequences” is great and I agree.
About the mouse scene with the snorkels, you can hear a muffled Paul tell the mouse to go away but it’s BARELY audible. At least in my showing
Subtitles helped.
I love science fiction and I love interplanetary war movies like Star wars. But this is the first time that a movie actually made me feel small in the universe. This was epic
Paul turned full-Darth Vader by the end. I mean, the robe switch from brown to dark brown is kinda of a gimme. Dune 2 is ABSOLUTELY the Empire Strikes Back of the soon-to-be trilogy.
The way Paul acknowledged the Baron as his grandfather, cemented his truth that he was Harkonnen, destined to be one with the enemy of his father and his family. I'd like to think that the Baron died in shock with the realization that even with all his scheming, a grander scheme was in place, even greater than he realized, and he dying with that knowledge. I LOVED the change that he was the one to kill the Baron vs. Lynch's Dune.
Thats interest! Who killed the Baron in the the David Lynch film?
Having read the book version of the gladiator scene, I thought they adapted Feyd’s whole approach to fighting so well. Cause in the book it goes into how Feyd very much respects valiant fighters and touches on the idea that if he wasn’t raised in the brutal Harkonnen world where he was taught to deal with tragedy violently, he could’ve ended up more like Paul as a more controlled patient, less impulsive figure. Also loved the way he kinda respects Paul fairly in the end, cause despite the violent front he actually might very much be the most respectful and understanding of the Harkonenns
*First Dune:* _"Because your a Jessica's Son, you have more than one birthright boy !"_ - Now I understand ! ( Chill's & Shock ) 🤯
The thing is that Paul IS the Kwisatz Haderach; the Messiah myth is clearly a fabrication of the Bene Gesserit.
Not leto 2 is the real KH
Exactly
The Bene Gesserit are very cynical in creating or adjusting religions to suit their purposes. Chani was right in saying that's how they are controlled by outsiders, though she became tiresome very quickly.
@@sandal_thong8631 Perfectly said. It is also tiresome how cynical she is about Paul, even though she loves him.
@@JGeeNbDZZU8k9YHfsxkcZFumFiXBhj For some reason they didn't want her to be a lovey-dovey girl that seduces Paul. I don't know why he'd be attracted to "angry girl" unless something happened in the first movie, which I haven't seen.
Hi Grace! The author originally intended for Paul's messiah arc to serve as a warning for worshipping people/heroes. But many readers didn't catch this, so he wrote dune messiah. Dennis villenueve also talks about this in interviews.
I didn’t catch that the first time I read the book. I cheered that Paul checkmated everyone so hard in the end. I was initially unsettled about the changes to Chani’s arc but am coming around to it because it serves a purpose for the plot and audience. You are to feel unsettled that such a powerful person is wrestling authority. Chani is the movies moral compass.
It was also supposed to be a book about ecology, published in 1965, just a few years after _Silent Spring._ But somehow that gets lost in the sequels, as it does turn green, but people want to convert their planets to desert to try to transplant sandworms.
Literally just got out of the theatre for this movie
Yeah i got out at 1am and popped on Dune on Max as soon as I got home.
Was it worth the effort?
Been waiting all week for this 😂
Watching Paul change through the movie it reminded of of Eren from Attack on Titan, with the power of seeing both the past and the future, turning them into somewhat emotionless shells of themselves that simply follow what the future has told them already would happen.
Yes! There’s a lot of similarities between the 2 with being able to see a horrific future but destined to move forward no matter what. Also a lot of political maneuvering and fanatical followers.
Dune 2 is about to blow the first Dune outta the water in Box Office numbers $$$
Not surprising since part one was released in theaters and had day 1 streaming on HBO Max
You would hope so, considering the first movie was a pandemic release. Although this one may go above and beyond because of how much better it is also.
Shai Halud, I hope so, I really want them to give him a ridiculous budget to close out the Trilogy.
This is probably the peak of this franchise. It doesn't get better than this.
The 2nd movie in a good trilogy is always the best.
Nahh part one is better.
@@Denariusjay It's like saying the Star Wars prequels are better because we get to know the characters.
@@Denariusjay More action in Part Two
_God Emperor of Dune_ was my favorite of the books. But I think they don't expect a work titled "God Emperor" to do well. They also avoided "Messiah" in the title of the sy-fy series.
I thought the stare down looks between the reverend mothers was hilarious.
The Bene Gesserit are so fascinating to me I don't think I can wait anymore to spoil the full story for a part 3
What will part 3 be like ?
@@AlkalineInsides all I’ve seen is comparisons of Paul to Anakin Skywalker and similar characters. So I know he is forever changed. Also that this series spans generations. I’m not sure how many movies they plan to make but it seems the first three are all the first book.
1 and 2 are based on the first book. Denis hopes to make a third based on the second book Dune: Messiah.
After that Paul is no longer the central character.
I love that part when Paul say to Feyd:
“May Thy Knife Chip & Shatter”
And he smirks & says it right back to Paul
The framing of the fight between Paul & Feyd was some of the most epic and beautifully subtle filming I've ever seen. Reminded me of Blade Runner.
That room and the sunset is very like Tyrell's meeting room.
20:32 i feel like by the end it’s very clear that he’s not the messiah and that while his intentions were at first for the people, it’s all going to his head.
Paul cannot be a real messiah because, as far as I'm aware, there is no God in the Dune universe. Paul is the result of the Bene Gesserit's careful crossing of bloodlines, mentat training (human supercomputer) and sword training by some of the best fighters in the universe. Over the centuries, the Bene Gesserit have popularized a profecy that says there will be someone like Paul coming in the future. So when Paul comes to Arrakis and the spice boosts his mentals capacities and visions, he becomes the Kwisatz Haderach, but it's the result of planning and training, not intervention from God. Although it is hard to see how the tear situation could be engineered, I agree
Yes they seeded that propaganda and religions around the universe. But they still were designing a human mind capable of becoming superhuman and seeing through time. Which is actually true. So it’s both a story they pushed but something they were genetically engineering. If you can see the future you basically fulfill both destinies anyway.
Although I do understand your distinction - Paul is not divine, he is in fact the Messiah for the Fremen. The Bene Geserit created him and created the prophecy only be could fulfill there. He is the fulfillment of their political aspirations, but also this fulfills the religious aspirations of the Fremen. We see the distinction because we are outside observers to this universe.
As I continued to watch the movie I was amazed at the richness of the story. I genuinely got scared of Paul as he transitioned into the Messiah figure willing to go to war
I love the book story of Dune and I didnt know if Chalamet could bring the Paul I envisioned in the second half of the book to life... But he did. Incredible acting.
It was so much more impactuful than I imagined. Holy shit this movie.
this movie will become the biggest litmus test for who lacks media literacy for years to come
🤡
I'm noticing a significant portion of younger generation Z viewers are struggling to connect with the deliberate pacing and complex worldbuilding of Dune, finding it dense or dull at points rather than gripping. This could speak to broader trends around shorter attention spans and accessibility standards in media, though also highlights the challenges in adapting such a sprawling novel series.
While Dune has resonated critically and with whole generations of audiences, its philosophical and political depth may not be as accessible for viewers accustomed to more straightforward plot dynamics and worldbuilding unfortunately.
@@WeylandLabs Dune Part 1 was dull most of the time.
@@aryaman98 Fully disagree! I found Dune Part One to be rich and deliberate.
@@nathanhittle348 Yeah it was deliberate in being dull and boring.
It's a good thing Dune 2 & Oppenheimer don't have to go up against each other @Oscars! Definitely think Denis with any 5 from both Dune movies, Sicario, Arrival, Blade Runner 2049 & Prisoners can go toe-to-toe with Nolan in a Top 5 debate :) Hoping for an $80m+ domestic opening wkend for Dune 2 🤞
I mean Denis last 5 movies are better than Nolan’s.
Still Nolan here. Considering Batman Begins/Dark Knight EIther or, Momento, Prestige, and Interstellar. Its actually not even close. Dune 2 Rules and is still not as good as any of Nolans best.
I never read the books, but I gotta say, this definitely was an epic sci fi movie. Surprisingly well shot, directed and acted.
this may be one of the best adaptations of a book i’ve ever seen. you can term it was made with love and reverence for the source material
The opening scene alone with the floating soliders was enough to sell me on the movie.
1) He traded up for the Emperor's Daughter
2) Heaven hath no fury like a woman scorned (Zendaya)
I mean, he handled it far better in the book and the rapport he has with Chani is a stark contrast with his supposed wife especially in the second book. I hope DV can explain that in the upcoming movie.
@@azmodanpcBut Messiah is set 15 years in the future, im unsure how denis is going to lead into part 3 without having a 15 year time jump at start of movie and yet still explain how chani and paul are still together.
I haven’t read Messiah (yet) but Paul said in the movie that he foresees that Chani would understand or implied some reconciliation. I was hoping to hear the line from the book that Paul would marry Irulan but she would be a wife in name only, but that obv never came.
Amazing movie!! I just want to know… was anyone else wondering how they got off of the sand worms when they were riding them??
In the books, the sand worms would tire out from being used as “vehicles” by the time the rider reached their destination. Much easier to get off a worm than on one. 😂
Dune 2 rrally is shaping up to be the savior of the box office
Nope
Yup
Lol no
I absolutley loved the changes they made. I also absolutley adore everything in this movie
The scene where the Baron is coming out to the balcony for Feyd’s battle and he goes from color to black and white because of the black sun… CHILLS!! Chills just even typing this and this is only one (1) of the many scenes that gave me chills but I think it’s so underrated I haven’t seen anyone talk about it
I read the books and love how much more sophisticated they are. Nonetheless, I still appreciate the changes made for the mainstream audience. I hope it does great because I want to see the rest of the story!!
Its an impressive adaptation for sure
I watchit last night and this was the best Space Opera I have seen in the theatres to date. Star Wars which heavily borrowed from the Dune series pales in comparison. It is an intelligent and artistic film.
One detail the movie took out was that Chani was the daughter of a Fremen woman and an imperial planetologist. Her part in the prophecy could have been pre-arranged by the Bene Gesserit, and Paul seeing her in his vision could be his genetic memory from a past Bene Gesserit seeing one of Chani's ancestors.
Your description of Paul starting out not having agency of his own, where everything happens TO made me think of Michael Corleone, so there's a similarly wide character arc!
Well said
BABY GOATS! What a colorful and important point Grace, I think this cast really will be looked back on as a collection of acting GOATs all in their early shine.
A couple of story points you might find interesting:
1. Chani's name had originally come from "some stupid prophecy", so in a way her fulfilling the prophecy can still be seen as a Bene Gesseritt manipulation - this might point to why Jessica was so insistent on her being the one to revive Paul.
2. The sand compactors were shown by Duncan Idaho in the first movie and explain how the Fremen hide in the sand and build their tents in them - it sense out sonic vibrations in the sand that cause it to become liquid -like. The sandworms use a version of this to move through the desert - it's based on real physics!
3. This is strictly a book detail but in the novel, the Fremen have actually developed the ability to heal cuts quickly to preserve their bodies' water content - a mix of evolution and one of the health benefits of the spice melange. This is why book readers were not surprised to see Paul survive several cuts at the end.
I think having Feyd-Rautha fight mostly drugged oppoenents kind of cheapens his eventual duel with Paul. Should have made him more of a threat.
Paul definitely used his visions to manipulate the Fremen and he's not really their messiah but something more powerful in a way since he has the ability to affect the entire fate of the known universe.
I mean that literally is how it is in the book. the two knife that he have in the arena the short white blade is supposed to be poison and his opponent are supposed to know that but he cheat so that the long black one is poison instead. Feyd is a character that will manipulate everything to get his way. The Atreides that wasn’t drug was to show if he could really thrive in a fair fight.
Just went back to read the arena section of the book: apparently he sets it up himself so he knows his enemy is not going to be drugged, in order to sow doubt in his uncle and get the master in charge of the arena killed.
They probably used exploding ink due to how explosives and bullets work on thier shield systems explained in part 1
SPOILERS***
Irulan will not be producing any heirs and that is not why he married her (unless Villeneuve decides to change things up from the book). More for the legitimacy of marrying into the Emperor's family and to make abdicating the throne easier for the Emperor insuring that his daughter would be safe. Great review, Grace!
Spoilers
Yeah, Paul never says he is marrying Irulan to produce an heir. I don't know where Grace got this. Of course, they don't produce an heir. Paul reassures Chani before he proclaims he will marry Irulan to keep her safe. I guess she just inserted her own assumptions?
@@jadedspades Grace is going off the Emperors dialog. About his daughter being emperors and continuing the bloodline.
Zendaya’s Chani is my favorite character. She’s the most grounded character to me. She falls in love with Paul when he shows his sincerity in wanting to fight with the Fremen. But once she sees that Paul’s ambitions are outgrowing her desires to free her people, she abandons him, choosing not to follow him. She sees through all the Bene Gesserit manipulation and constantly questions and pushes back against the “miracles” she witnesses.
Great review! As a book person I love seeing something so well done even if the source material is slightly altered. This was my favorite cinematic EXPERIENCE in many years. Can’t wait to see it again in imax.
Sitting waiting to watch this now in Liverpool! Will be sure to check out the video when I'm out!
I think the answer about Paul being the messiah or not id not answered by some characteristic of Paul, but by what is the messiah. Is the messiah a god or a superior being? So Paul is not. Is the messiah someone who meets the criteria made by propaganda and eugenics? So yes, he is.
Argument reminds me of an exchange in _Lawrence of Arabia:_
"You will cross Sinai [Desert]?"
"Moses did!"
"Moses was a prophet!"
My only complaint is that some action scenes (except the third act) felt too brief, epic but brief
Yes that battle scene had the qualities to go to toe with lord of the rings battle scenes but it quite literally falls short
I noticed that but I searched within myself and realized maybe I learned to expect lengthier action scenes because of all the other blockbusters I’ve seen. I learned to embrace the direction Denis had for this film and not compare it to other films. The action felt appropriate for the story trying to be told.
I literally just GOT OUT of the theater 2 minutes ago and the spoiler review is up! Is it fate!
The black and white outdoors is because of their sun.
That was super cool
The black sun, it was so badass.
Just got out of the theater and it’s a 10/10
I really like how the final duel really contrasted Paul's and Fey'd characters. For Feyd pain is pleasure: he relishes and enjoys pain. Instead of quickly ending Paul when he had the upper hand he slowly approaches and wants to make the whole thing intimate almost. Whereas for Paul pain is purpose: he knew he had to get close to Feyd, pain be dammned, so he can deliver the killing blow. Fascinating stuff
Grace! Hearing you talk so eloquently about one of my favorite stories (huge fan of the books) made my day. Glad you enjoyed the movie so much and all its layers!
He is the messiah, but the messiah has nothing divine attached to it, it's manufactured by the Bene Gesserit, which also explains everything you discuss during the "he is the Nexus, at the right time", that's not by chance, even if it happens 1 generation too soon.
The Fremen believe in Shai-Hulud: the worm that is God.
Just saw it, every frame is breath taking
I kid you not, the movie finished I got this notification. 🔥🔥🔥film
I actually got scared of Feyd-Ratha. And when he got the cape?! OH MY GOD!
Rewatched Part One before and after watching Part Two and the through lines are incredible and meticulous. Strongly recommend!
Came here after rigjt finally i get to see this amazing movie . Love your spoiler review Grace. Greetings from Guatemala. 🇬🇹
That fact that he eventually brought green paradise to Arakkis was the exact reason that doomed Fremen and their culture, you would still believe he was the Messiah? Wait until you watch part 3.
I think events were out of his control once he agreed to Jihad to be the emperor. The greening of Dune was already part of their culture and manifest destiny.
SPOILER:
The scene where all of the Fremen attack the emperor and the reveal of the multiple sandworms coming out of the storm? FULL BODY CHILLS. I’ve genuinely never had a movie give me such a purely emotional reaction like that. At that moment I thought to myself, “Am I seeing the LotR of my generation?”
So so good.
I was in disbelieve. I couldn’t believe what I was witnessing.
Actually the black & white palette for the harkonnen world is because they orbit a black sun. If you noticed when the Bene Gesserits step into the sunlight area of the arena, their cloaks turn from black to white. And when they are inside buildings, we see everyone in color.
A black sun? How ridiculous!
Can’t wait to watch it in glorious IMAX 70mm Saturday night
That will be glorious
Saw Dune part 2 yesterday and loved it. Seeing it again today. Love this franchise. I hope a 3rd one gets made.
Even with the changes from the book, Denis Villeneuve managed to make Dune Part 2 an amazing cinematic experience. I'm eagerly waiting for Part 3 to come out to see how his vision for this epic story will conclude. Hans Zimmer also upped his game in this sequel, which I partially listened to before watching the movie. Wow. Zimmer's score is just stunning. Anyone going out to see this movie, really owes it to themselves to see this in IMAX if possible
My most anticipated part of Paul's story is the moment when a student outperform their teachers and infuse all that lessons in Arrakis which makes him the real deal.
What i found surprising is despite everyone call him the real deal, he doesn't want to just take that title the easy way, he wants to do the hardwork to prove to mostly himself (and others) that earn it, and that also speaks to his long term thinking that by doing that, he'll be able to convince the skeptics in the Fremen to accept him as their own and gain an absolute loyalty from the whole Fremen. That's a quality trait of leadership
Paul is the Messiah in the sense that he matches all of the qualities the Bene Gesserit solidified into myth through the Missionaria Protectiva. Once the Fremen come to fanatically believe in him as the Messiah, his ability to control his own myth is completely out of his own hands - even as someone who can see the future. All paths lead in the same general direction (unless Paul chooses death which was never an option in his mind, he is not that self-sacrificing). The criticism the books bring up is the very concept of a Messiah. Messianic figures never lead to wider happiness and prosperity. More likely they will lead to death, doom, and tragedy for everyone involved. Paul is the Messiah, but he is more a figure of incoming doom and dystopia rather than the utopian dream their religion preaches.
This is a great perspective Grace! But we need more haha do a breakdown or spoiler review part 2 please!!!!
I've read the book (the original 6 book including Dune Messiah), and I got my tickets today for Saturday. Still have some good seats at imax mall of Georgia. But I'm so ready for this.
Oh, you are going to love the visual storytelling here. There are lots of goodies especially for book readers in this. I was so incredible. I actually do not think anyone can really "spoil" the film because it is an experience to just observe. Paul's evolution is great. I hope you love it as I did.
The cast was soooo good,these are the future of Hollywood legends!!
I've been a fan of Timothee Chalamet since I first saw him in "Call Me By Your Name." He is just incredible. He and his agent deserve some awards because they have outstanding taste in film projects. I think Dune could make a good Game of Thrones-type HBO series at some point. I've also become a huge fan of Dene Villanova and his aesthetic.
I would actually compare this movie more to TROY starring Brad Pitt, Orlando Bloom and Eric Bana (which came out 20 years ago!) moreso than Batman and TDK.
She means the jump in quality from Dune Part 1 to Dune Part 2 is similar to the one from Batman Begins to The Dark Knight
@@matiasdevaglia4541 yes I know but I actually enjoyed Dune Part 1 more. Maybe its just my taste, or maybe i went in with misplaced ideas from the excellent 2nd trailer and the "glow up" comparisons from BB to TDK, but the analogy just doesn't fit imo. But throughout the entire movie I kept thinking of Troy. The war to please a ruler's hubris, the reluctant warrior, the love of a good woman being the only motivation to keep going despite all odds, etc.
Troy is the movie that changed Brad Pitts career. He hated it so much he refused to do a blockbuster after that. He refuses to watch it. He considered it the opposite type of movie he wanted to be remembered for.
@@MaxxRemKing1 LOL youre saying he thinks Mr & Mrs Smith is a better product of his film career? idts. Troy is the last big movie he got to make before wasting his life on Angelina
wow great review Grace, but the messiah I think ending with Chani not agreeing with what is going on, show how Paul is going through the wrong path, I like this change from the book
Doesn’t she die in Messiah
yes I think the way they will do the next movie, is that she's pregnant with the twins, Paul come back to her after the war, and princess Florence gives her birth control so Shani dosent get to have the heirs of Paul but fails and is responsible of shani's death after giving birth to the twins
I watched this film in DBox and atmos. What an experience!!! I would encourage anyone and everyone to watch this movie in atmos and DBox.
It's unreal. 10/10
I just got out of the movie, your review was just waiting for me. Thank you Grace
WHY do so many people boil down the end with Chani's reaction as just a "haha yay you go girl!" woman scorned moment...? She was drastically different from the book, but even the movie version of Chani is deeper than so many (at least in the scope of critics/reviews) people seem to realize. I absolutely LOVE that I can watch someone call this an intellectual blockbuster, while at the same time providing surface level "hur dur thats my girl boss" forms of commentary.
I didn't see part one; was she nice and charming in that movie? I can't see Paul falling for such a b**** in this movie when there would have been so many women fawning over him as this religious figure, though the women shown with Chani were scorning and mocking him.
With your point about the prophecy about the desert spring tears you have to remember that the Bena-Jezeri are the ones who wrote the prophecy
Timothy Chalamet was adorable in Wonka, but he seriously flexes his acting chops in these Dune two movies
I think the black/white coloring on Geidi Prime is because it’s sun is black, when the harkonnens are indoors the coloring is normal
They did a lot of 'popping up out of the sand' in the first movie too ❤
I did love how the Giedi Prime 'black sun' made everything black & white (though indoors was pretty monochrome too, with only hints of blue & green) 😄
I just love how you are talking, I'll subscribe to your channel 😊
Hollywood loves recycling the same actors. The trailers playing before this movie, I was thinking where are all the thousands of actors trying to make it.
Dune Part TWO was AMAZING!!!!! That stealthy desert action was so good!!!!
It’s so cinematic. Every frame is a work of art.
I thought a little differently about the end fight wish they did longer shots so u can see the good choreo clearer. The editing is so choppy. Maybe they had to cut it up so much bc they had to use stunt doubles too much. But the sound design was so good u really felt the hits and when they got stabbed amazing.
I never read the books, but its been implied that paul became almost invinsible or immortal after drinking the water of life. Thus beaing able to sustain two blade wounds and surviving so many battles.
Did anyone notice Paul held on to Feyd-Rauthas knife after their fight? Little moment that was really interesting to me
After drinking the blue liquid, Paul can see various paths to completing his mission. He recognizes a hard option path, which is why he repeatedly tells Chani that he loves her to death. Because this difficult path involves challenging the emperor and especially marrying Princess Irulan.
He saw multiple outcomes . Just choose the one the thought had less “ bad “ consequences for the Universe. Even if it was the worse for his own person and family .
He drank Blue Milk? I'm not watching it now.
@@davidjames579 The girls call it worm-piss in the movie.
Grace using a picture of SpongeBob to represent her taking her notes lmao I can't 😂 Grace is SpongeBob your spirit animal?
People who've read the books hearing Grace talk about Irulan carrying Paul's heir... how do we tell her? 😭
😆
Grace is so precious sometimes.
Careful, that could change
😅
This movie was amazing. I will be seeing it multiple times at the theater and IMAX. This is a must see at IMAX.
Ms.Grace did you watch the 1984 Dune version with a young Patrick Stewart (Gurney Halleck) 🤔