Book of Enoch Discoveries & Joseph Smith: WOW! Evidences
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- Опубликовано: 4 янв 2020
- This video discusses the stunning similarities found between the 110 Enoch verses found in the Book of Moses and the Enoch material discovered and published after Joseph Smith’s death. Of particular note, and of greatest similarity, are the stunning ties related to the material found in the Dead Sea Scrolls - Cave 4, discovered in 1948! Hugh Nibley reported his discussion with Matthew Black, who translated the Enoch portion of the Dead Sea Scrolls (known as the ‘Book of Giants’), who after being stunned with what Joseph Smith had done said ‘someday we will know what source Joseph Smith used’ (or in other words there has to be an explanation for this!)
HERE IS A DIRECT LINK TO THE TRANSCRIPT OF THIS VIDEO FROM THE WEBSITE
latterdaysaintsqa.com/book-of...
Resources:
Interpreter articles referenced in the video:
journal.interpreterfoundation...
journal.interpreterfoundation...
journal.interpreterfoundation...
RUclips video of Hugh Nibley discussing Book of Enoch evidences: interpreterfoundation.org/kno...
www.pearlofgreatpricecentral....
Books:
Hugh Nibley, Enoch the Prophet, The Collected Works of Hugh Nibley: Volume 2
Jeffrey Bradshaw & David Larsen, In God’s Image and Likeness Volume 2: Enoch, Noah & The Tower of Babel
Terryl & Fiona Givens, The God Who Weeps
Many translations are available of 1 Enoch, 2 Enoch, 3 Enoch and the Book of Giants (lost part of 1 Enoch found with the Dead Sea Scrolls). The two I held up near the start of the video - one was from Joseph Lumkin and the other from the trio of Paul Schnieders, Robert Charles & WB Henning.
Between the two, I would recommend the version from Lumpkin because he has an amazing section before getting into the text showing the impact of the Book of Enoch on the New Testament. He even shows the very specific quotes from Jesus himself that were quotes of the Book of Enoch! The amazing thing is it was always assumed after discoveries and dating of 1 Enoch, 2 Enoch & 3 Enoch, that the Book of Enoch came after Christ because of some of the material, but the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls flipped everything around - this showed the dating of Enoch material was over 500 years earlier than previously thought, so it was actually the New Testament quoting the Book of Enoch (including Jesus), not the other way around!!
![Megan Thee Stallion - Rattle [Official Audio]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/qY6qwqVCsww/mqdefault.jpg)
I’m not of a particular religion, but I do know Joseph Smith was correct about things that were not known. Thank you brothers and sisters of light!
Thank you for tuning in to the channel! I hope you continue to find it beneficial. If you ever have specific questions I am happy to dialogue with you directly - reach out through my website latterdaysaintsqa.com using the contact me button
It’s amazingly clear! to me. Joseph Smith could not have known all of these words, ideas, and phrases he included in the book of Moses-from any books, manuscripts, or documents about Enoch available in his day. I don’t have to be a scholar of ancient history to understand that Joseph Smith could not have known these things except by revelation. It’s very obvious to me.
Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge about Joseph Smith, the Book of Moses, and the 3 Books of Enoch from the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Thank you!
First non member that I have witnessed to see the truth and for embracing that Joseph Smith was right. Thank you!!
Are you going to upload more one day? From watching your videos I've started to take mormonism more seriously and I even got a copy of the book of mormon and read it all
Thank you for support and so happy to hear of the impacts the videos have had on your desires to study! I left the door open to make some additional content if the need arises - a new criticism that I haven’t already addressed in a video in some way. The video library project that I set out to build has been completed, but I am still actively involved, spending an hour or two a day answering questions and comments (as well as emails sent through my website latterdaysaintsqa.com). Please feel free to reach out to me directly through the website (use the contact me link) if I can be of any personal help on your faith journey!
Hey Gregg, so you read the book. What do you think about it?
What did you think about the Book of Mormon?!
That’s awesome 🙌
People who take the Book of Mormon seriously are people who think for themselves and who value truth. IMHO 😊❤❤❤
It is not their wickedness but their misery, not their disobedience but their suffering that elicits the God of Heaven`s tears. I felt and experienced this in my life. I testify it is true.
Thank you for sharing!
Joseph Smith most certainly is a prophet of God. I know this because of my testimony in the Book of Mormon. I’m so grateful for what I know to be true.
I share your testimony as a new convert of the true church.
I read the Dead Sea scrolls . I don’t remember anything about Enoch . But there was some things about Enoch I read in those extra books Joseph Smith said h we didn’t need to read as it had many truths and many errors unless read by the spirit . I can’t remember anything in the Dead Sea scrolls. Could you put it up?
It is the Book of Giants, which is considered part of the Enoch literature and was discovered amongst the Dead Sea Scrolls. Here is the wikipedia link on the Book of Giants: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Book_of_Giants
You are on the right path! 🙏😉👍
I think what's really inspiring about your videos is you. Someone who has totally dedicated themselves to the Lord.
Thank you - I am humbled by your words and grateful my testimony radiates through!!
Ayyyyyyyy, I agree :)
How many "coincidences" before it is a statistical impossibility for Joseph to NOT have had divine help?
"If anti-mormons's are right then that means Joseph Smith was a racist, folk magician, counter conspirator, Freemason infiltrator/leaker, drug spreading, Hebrew scholar, legal expert, freelance abortion doctor, and a time traveler with perfect memory... or he was a Prophet"
-Kwaku El
Chalane Casdorph Wride Nice! Is that from one of his videos? If so can you point me to it? Thanks!
Well said!
@@freedomfriday2.040 Sorry I didn’t see this until now! He tweeted it a long time ago
@@freedomfriday2.040 I seem to remember him saying it in a video, haha, but I don't remember which one
I appreciate that you mention books. I'm always looking for books, like the Ethiopian book about the 1777 explorer, to read and to buy for my children. I care not if the books are by LDS authors or non-LDS authors, I care about learning and learning facts. Biblical information fascinates me, and if it connects to the church, it makes it all the better. Thank You!
Another tie to Joseph Smith's Enoch and antiquity is the New Testament's story of the man born blind that Jesus healed in John Chapter 9, which picks up right after Jesus tells the Jews that he is the great "I AM" at the end of Chapter 8. If you read John chapter 9 while considering that the jews were also aware of what we have as Moses 6:35 and 36, Christ's response to John about why the man was blind, the pool he was told to wash in, the Jewish leaders' utter astonishment at how he was healed (they ask multiple times and it caused a division among them), and the blind man's remark, "Since the world began was it not heard that any man opened the eyes of one that was born blind." Vs 32 all make sense on a much deeper and richer level. Jesus essentially said, "I'm Jehovah. And because I knew you wouldn't believe me, I'll open the eyes of a man born blind the same way I opened Enoch's eyes." This is one of my favorite stories from Christ's life and ministry - and a powerful testimony of Joseph Smith's Enoch.
Thanks for sharing this - it is very powerful. I didn’t include it in the video because it is referenced somewhat in 1 Enoch and I made a point to say I was excluding that source, since it was published in English (in Europe) in 1821, so Joseph could have technically had access (although there is no evidence and I quote Richard Bushman in the video saying it was scarcely conceivable that Joseph even knew about the 1 Enoch translation in 1830). If I hadn’t of limited myself to excluding 1 Enoch on this basis - I would have included several other items, of which your comment here would have been at the top of the list. I am glad you shared this though as a way for people to see an example of the additional evidence that most likely should be included!
@@latterdaysaintsqa thanks for responding, and I'm glad to share. I really enjoy you videos. Keep it up.
Always learning from you. Thank you for seeking out these little gems of truth and sharing them. As always you've done a fantastic job. Thanks for your time in preparing this.
Thank you so much!
Been waiting for this! 😁😊 Thanks!!
I am glad I waited - included some great new stuff just published (last 1/4 of the video!)
For real!!! I was impressed and happy about this as well. This made me happy. Glad ya waited as well! Thankyou thankyou:)
I enjoy your videos very much. For me they'd be easier to listen to if your audio recording was clearer. There's a reverberation or something that makes it harder to take in. Also, please slow down and .....pause.....from time to time ;-) . I know you're excited, but much of this is new to your viewers and we can't take it all in as quickly as you're delivering it! Maybe if your mike was closer or you used a different one? I have to turn on the subtitles to make sure I catch everything.
Thanks for the feedback on the audio - I did upgrade the audio side of things twice now (having started in the beginning simply with my iPhone!), but will try putting the large mic more in front of me than to the side. It might also be the room I am using possibly. If I was just starting I would try and figure it out but I am almost done with the library of content project so I think I will just try these small tweaks and hope it is a little better. Thanks also for the speed of the video issue - it has been a problem lately as I have had longer videos, I have worked with a balancing act of trying to include all the content I hoped to while also not making the video too long eliminating a large number of viewers. The downside has been what you pointed out - maybe trying to stuff too much into the time frame. Sincerely appreciate the feedback and will try to consider it further on the remaining videos I have left.
@@latterdaysaintsqa I would suggest you consider splitting your videos up into clearly defined parts. Part 1/3, or another form.
@@latterdaysaintsqa the format, speed, and audio quality is perfectly fine. People are always gonna find something to complain about. The visuals are a fantastic inclusion, so people can pause and read for themselves and even take screenshots if they are worried about not being able to absorb all the info as you say it. You've done a great job with this channel. It's an invaluable resource.
I love your enthusiasm, incredible knowledge, and strong testimony that are so evident in your presentations. Thank you, I always learn tons.
Glad to hear it - thank you!
Thank you for all of the time and work you have put into these incredible videos. They have been a tremendous help to me. You were inspired to do them.
Thank you so much! It has been an exhausting project but hearing comments like yours makes all the work feel worth it!
yes thank you
Thank you so much for this video. We are under attack repeatedly from every corner. We need the proof that cements our faith and our devotion to the teachings of the Book of Mormon and Joseph Smith.
Thank you so much - when I had the impression to build this library of content defending the church, I decided I didn't just want to be on defense so I created these "evidences" videos to go on offense - so many incredible and beautiful things to talk about!
Love the "lad" example. My dad was 64 when I was born. His friend always called me kiddo. I'm 43 and when I meet this man he still calls me kiddo. See, it is relative, compared to him I will always be a kid.
I am more interested in these comparisons, than the critics who base their attacks on what they don't understand.
Why do they attack some speculative view of process, when we have the product... and it is obviously supernaturally accurate for the time?
Well said!
Another wonderful video!! I love reading about Enoch. His accounts are so powerful!💙
This was amazing. Great work!
Thank you!
Thank you for this video, and for all your videos. If I had to point to one tangible evidence that supports the prophetic gift of Joseph Smith more than anything else, it would be these Enoch literature comparisons. I find it very interesting that critics rarely if ever address this or go anywhere near it. They stick with the same tired tropes, such as horses in the Book of Mormon. They rarely try and combat positive evidences for the Church. This evidence is very persuasive. There is no way Joseph could have gotten so many details correct about the ancient world.
Great points - love it!
When Joseph said the people would never believe his story for truth, was he not told "the earth will reveal the truth in time"?
Great content
Always loved the Nibley book. A lot has been discovered or translated since then.
Agree 100% - glad I had all that additional research to include in the video, but Nibley was definitely the pioneer on the effort!
I am glad you point out the facts that the true reliant words of Enoch are only those given through the gift of revelation granted unto Joseph Smith.
Thank you
Thanks for your work; this video is very helpful. I have been reading the first Book of Enoch off and on for a while now. You showed two versions (The Books of Enoch and The Book of Giants by Joseph Lumpkin) and (The Three Books of Enoch and the Book of Giants by Robert H Charles, WB Henning), but is there one that you would recommend over another? I have saved both books in my Amazon account that you showed in your video, but really do not want to purchase both. Do you like Lumpkin's or Charles'?
I would go with the version from Lumpkin because he has an amazing section before getting into the text showing the impact of the Book of Enoch on the New Testament. He even shows the very specific quotes from Jesus himself that were quotes of the Book of Enoch! The amazing thing is it was always assumed after discoveries and dating of 1 Enoch, 2 Enoch & 3 Enoch, that the Book of Enoch came after Christ because of some of the material, but the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls flipped everything around - this showed the dating of Enoch material was over 500 years earlier than previously thought, so it was actually the New Testament quoting the Book of Enoch (including Jesus), not the other way around!!
@@latterdaysaintsqa Thank you! I've personally seen a reproduction of the Dead Sea Scrolls; they are very inspiring. I hope the scrolls that are being held back from translation will eventually be made available. I'm supposing they correlate to close to Mormon doctrine and this is why they have not been released. --Dan Bulkley
Just how many books did Joseph Smith read according to the ani-Mormonists in order for him to "write" the Book of Mormon?
It seems to me that Joseph Smith must have been an incredibly well-read subsistence farmer. His library must have been extensive.
If he was not a prophet he definitely was a time traveler.
Is there a list of all the books that Joseph Smith must have read?
Joseph Smith would not be considered a prophet by a Jew... because he has been wrong on one or more prophecies. But consider this... let’s appreciate Joseph Smith for who he was... a genius ahead of his time... that obviously had gross spiritual insight and possibly Devine inspiration... as we all can have on some level if we desire and ask the Father.
Keep in mind that Moses made many mistakes and was disciplined by G-d.
The Mormon videos on RUclips chronically describing part of Jesus’ ministry are excellent. Please watch them.
In the book of Thomas the Savior describes himself as part of the great undivided. Consider this... the Father took part of himself and separated it and placed it in the form of flesh. This form of flesh... free of programming corruption... would take on our corruption and clean it... in the form of his blood. After the death and resurrection... the spirit of this flesh would be prepared for complete integration with the undivided. The Father would experience (feel) everything the Savior felt throughout his time on earth.
Only G-d could separate part of himself... from himself... for a time and purpose.
I appreciate Joseph Smith for who he was and did. Blessings. Creekin
I think that's good to keep in mind, if you believe in the gospel of Thomas. Which I don't but I think it's cool you do.
Enoch Abraham and Moses viewed and talked about different things about god differently. But Jesus and god called them prophets non the less. And qouted them.
I think this is an onion layered thing.
And some people may or may not be closer to the core or have recieved further knowledge about god.
Kind of like how let's of people in the Bible thought the earth was flat. But now because of revelation and knowledge we now know it's not a flat planet. Or most Christians would agree.
@@TheDocNorman None of Joseph Smith's prophecies failed.
Great video. Thanks.
Thank you
Thank you leasing for second time it’s amazing
Thanks!
Wow how fascinating!!
Great video!
Thanks!
"Well, it's obvious Joseph Smith was a time traveler." -AntiMormons
😁
I love these videos, they are hidden gems of Latter-day Saint Scholarship. If I may offer my own constructive feedback, personally I’m not a huge fan of things like Wow! and Amazing evidences! And stuff like that in the video titles and thumbnails. If I were a skeptic or critic it would take away from my ability to take your content seriously and even make it less likely that I might click on your video in the first place. Which would be a shame because, although I’m not a trained academic (I’m a music major at BYUI), I absolutely love your content and your deliverance for the most part. It’s so uplifting and intellectually satisfying at the same time! Book of Mormon Central does this all the time, and it’s probably my only criticism of them. It kinda drives me crazy that they do stuff like that in every thumbnail with some cheesy neon font, because it takes away from some of the weight and depth of their material too.
Then again, what do I know. I play piano, I don’t study scholarly articles, do peer reviewed research or run a RUclips channel. Maybe I’m just wrong. You do you. Either way I’m sticking around.
Thanks for your input - the titles have always been a struggle and balancing act
I LOVE to find hidden gems of truth that you point out in your videos. I have the same feeling to exult & rejoice in making connections & following breadcrumbs to wider & deeper truths and affirmations of my faith. HOW CAN YOU HOLD BACK FROM SAYING WOW or AMAZING!!! please don't stop!
🙏❤️🎄 Merry Christmas
Is there anything on cross comparison between LDS theology and what’s in other DSS fragments in specific 11QMelch that you know of?
Here are some things you may find helpful:
www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/2006/02/the-dead-sea-scrolls-and-latter-day-truth?lang=eng
searchisaiah.org/top-questions/secrets-dead-sea-scrolls-reveal/
latterdaysaintmag.com/article-1-855/
www.ldsliving.com/5-ways-the-dead-sea-scrolls-support-lds-beliefs/s/87743
bookofmormoncentral.org/blog/how-the-dead-sea-scrolls-shed-light-on-similarities-between-hebrews-and-the-book-of-mormon
thirdhour.org/blog/faith/scripture/dead-sea-scrolls-joseph-smith-book-of-remembrance/
….and for a deeper dive:
www.jstor.org/stable/43040913
www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/1983558
Thanks a ton 🙏
Love this food for my spirit!
Could you put a link to the books you recommend reading here?
Thanks for asking this question because it made me realize I need to do a little work on the books section of the resources. If you look under the video description you can find the various resources. Here is the refreshed book section:
Books:
Hugh Nibley, Enoch the Prophet, The Collected Works of Hugh Nibley: Volume 2
Jeffrey Bradshaw & David Larsen, In God’s Image and Likeness Volume 2: Enoch, Noah & The Tower of Babel
Terryl & Fiona Givens, The God Who Weeps
Many translations are available of 1 Enoch, 2 Enoch, 3 Enoch and the Book of Giants (lost part of 1 Enoch found with the Dead Sea Scrolls). The two I held up near the start of the video - one was from Joseph Lumkin and the other from the trio of Paul Schnieders, Robert Charles & WB Henning.
Between the two, I would recommend the version from Lumpkin because he has an amazing section before getting into the text showing the impact of the Book of Enoch on the New Testament. He even shows the very specific quotes from Jesus himself that were quotes of the Book of Enoch! The amazing thing is it was always assumed after discoveries and dating of 1 Enoch, 2 Enoch & 3 Enoch, that the Book of Enoch came after Christ because of some of the material, but the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls flipped everything around - this showed the dating of Enoch material was over 500 years earlier than previously thought, so it was actually the New Testament quoting the Book of Enoch (including Jesus), not the other way around!!
@@latterdaysaintsqa Thanks for the sources.
I read a 12-part series in the Ensign from 1976 by Hugh Nibley called "A Strange Thing In The Land". It was all about the Book of Enoch and pretty much was making the same case you are here which is there's no way Joseph Smith could have written it. He even shows the Book of Abraham side by side with the other Enoch texts. Pretty interesting! Do you know if the Nibley book you mentioned may be a rehash of that? Or even the same text? I don't want to buy it if I already have it bookmarked in the scripture app on my phone.
Also, I failed to mention I wanted to thank you for the youtube vids. All very interesting stuff and most of it I haven't heard before.
I just compared the book to the 12-part series in the Ensign and it looks like the Ensign articles were taken straight out of the book, however it doesn't cover the book entirely - probably about 70% of it. What was published in the Ensign was Part 2 of the book, entitled "A Strange Thing in the Land", which goes from page 91 to the index at page 303. What didn't get published is Part 1: Enoch the Prophet and His World (there are 3 subsections labeled: Enoch the Prophet, The Enoch Figure and The Book of Enoch as a Theodicy).
Amen brother
Thank you it’s amazing 😮
Thanks!
This will be an exhaustive response to this excellent teaching... I don’t give-out to many compliments.
Joseph Smith would not be considered a prophet by a learned Jew. He was wrong with some of his predictions. Big deal... Moses was human too... and G-d disciplined him for his human errors... such as angry murder. We know the story. Still... Moses evidently (from the term evidence) had Devine inspiration. We all may at some level.
The same age-old argument about Joseph Smith I’ve been hearing for sixty years there about. I thought it as silly then as I do now. Appreciate Joseph Smith for who he was... a genius ahead of his time... a man with a mind for G-d. Evidence suggests that he had inspiration from somewhere. He confessed Jesus as the Savior and believed in the resurrection. This gives me enough reason to see what he had to say about things. He wasn’t always right... then again neither was Moses.
People who think outside of the box and are geniuses like Joseph Smith are often persecuted and fall into ruin. As Tesla was persecuted and destroyed by that fake scientist Edison and died poor... Smith was persecuted and destroyed by the mainstream people of his day.
Don’t sanitize Smith’s history please. Appreciate him for who he was... human like Moses... made allot of mistakes... but was a genius with a mind for G-d. David comes to mind too. Proverbs 25:2. He... like many with a mind for G-d... walked around with a target on his back.
I can explain some things regarding this so please ask any questions... you’ll get an honest answer. I see the Mormon church as the most Christ-like out there. Struggling to do good and follow the Father’s doctrine. Don’t sanitize history... this is one thing the Jews don’t do. We all belong to G-d. Everything and everybody. Appreciate Joseph Smith’s role in all of this. This is the bottom line.
I tell you the Truth... this decade we’ll deal with the alien issue... the technology issue... and the devil. The great falling away will begin to manifest. The Mormons are one of the few faiths... in my opinion... that is strong enough to handle (withstand) what will happen soon and described in the 2nd Chapter of 2nd Thessalonians.
We better be clear on the truth. What is truth Pilot asked? It’s the standard G-d set. Creekin
Thank you!
Well put Creekin!
Thank you.
Actual question, not trolling, I promise. What I’m interested in understanding about the Book of Mormon or this found book which you say is the book of Enoch, the Bible is the word of God, is that correct in your belief? I am a Christian and that is what I believe so I’m assuming that you do as well. My question ( questions probably!) is this....the Bible directly instructs us to neither add nor take away from the Bible, therefore, what God intended to be included into his word, in regards to Enoch is what God wanted us to know. No more. No less. We can not know that this book of Enoch that you’re saying was found scattered across the world is related to God’s Enoch as it was not in the Bible. How is it that you feel differently about this? Do you think that God is Fallible and therefore incapable of a complete Bible which needed to be added on to even though he specifically commands us not to? Or is it something else? I’m just curious and I get the impression by your enthusiasm that you are inclined to enjoy sharing and discussing your beliefs. It’s very hard to find people who are open to that as most feel as though they are being asked to defend rather than enlighten an I hope I haven’t made you feel defensive. That is absolutely not my intention.
Sorry in advance for the length of this response, but you do seem sincere in your request to understand where we are coming from on your questions.
I would like to answer your first question about scripture coming forth after the Bible by asking you to watch a segment from the video I produced entitled ‘Not Christian?! WHY?’; here is the link (please focus on the section from the 12:00 mark to the 17:00 mark, which specifically addresses some of your questions.
ruclips.net/video/NvMk-TGmqnI/видео.html
From that video clip, I discuss how John’s ending verses about not adding to ‘this book’ were in reference to his ‘Book of Revelation’ writings, since we actually didn’t have a ‘Bible’ at this point in any way shape or form (and you can see from the video the cannon development happened over many centuries, even the first ‘collection’ of a small subset of writings were many decades later after John, who himself even wrote scripture after his Book of Revelation).
So given our understanding of this Christian history, and the thought that God has spoken to prophets throughout time, and that there was never a time where God said he was done speaking to prophets or apostles, we believe it makes sense we would have prophets today. Which is why we are so open to the idea of Joseph Smith being called to restore the fullness of Christianity (I did a 2 part video entitled Evidences: ORIGINAL Christianity Restored that you might find interesting). Now ironically, that brings us full circle to your question about Enoch and about the Book of Mormon. First of all, because we don’t think God said he would never speak again, the Book of Mormon makes sense as a 2nd witness of Christ (which is becoming more critical in today’s world of tearing down belief in the New Testament because we don’t have a single original copy of any text and those copies of copies (numbering around 5,800) have many variations - which I will address in my next video). The production of the Book of Mormon itself was done in such a miraculous manner it is unmatched in religious history (Joseph had a 3rd grade level education, translated this in 65 days and did it without any notes in a single draft) - see this video I put together acknowledging the staggering statistics and comparisons to show how ‘unmatched’ this really was:
‘The Book of Mormon: Match It! Evidences
ruclips.net/video/pnkrQOEhuHA/видео.html
We believe this Book of Mormon is the tangible witness that this ‘restoration’ of Christianity in its fullness occurred.
Now lastly, with regard to your Enoch question, because we as Latter-day Saints view ongoing revelation to a prophet that can be canonized, we believe that Joseph Smith received an expansionary revelation on the verses about Enoch in the Bible. It is my belief that these are the ‘excerpts’ from Enoch writings that God wanted us to have. I don’t believe that the recent Book of Enoch discoveries that have been made would all constitute scripture (but may have some value, similar to the apocrypha) and they are all pseudepigraphic writings anyway - but the thought would be they all tie back to some earlier source, which is what Joseph Smith was associating with through revelation. Which is why it was so compelling to see all of the parallels that Joseph Smith included in his 1830 writings on Enoch that were discovered (for the first time) in the 1948 Dead Sea Scrolls discovery!
Hope this was helpful and thanks for your sincere desire to be more enlightened on our stance on these items.
Saints Unscripted has a series on Early Christian History that maybe helpful: ruclips.net/video/GizkGSTxhmk/видео.html
The Book of Enoch is quoted in the book of Jude, word for word, in the New Testament.. that means the book of Jude should be excluded from the Bible or the book of Enoch included.. I prefer the latter. God bless
Hello, I’m a year late responding, but I only just found this. I’m a convert to the Church of Jesus Chris of latter-day-Saints. I love the Bible & the Bk of Mormon as both teach & testify of our Savior. An 8 part article of how the Bible came to be taught me abt how much of a miracle it is that we have as much as we have of the writings of the earlier apostles & Saints... the letters & writings that were saved thru times of persecution & attempts to destroy anything relating to Christ, & brought together to become the Bible (translated “library”). The religious leaders of the time, in the council that decided which writings to keep, to make into the canonized scriptures, disagreed on which to keep & which to leave out ... there were compromises made. Until the late 1800s, the Apocrypha was part of the Bible - removed by the Protestant movement & still found in the Catholic Bible. Here is the link to the 1st short article on how the Bible came to be. I hope you get this & enjoy. If you’d like the other links, I can post them. Or I’m sure you can google the different parts too.
www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/1982/01/how-the-bible-came-to-be-part-1-a-testament-is-established
Where can i read all the books of enoch? I would love to see these similarities first hand
Many translations are available of 1 Enoch, 2 Enoch, 3 Enoch and the Book of Giants (lost part of 1 Enoch found with the Dead Sea Scrolls). The two I held up near the start of the video - one was from Joseph Lumkin and the other from the trio of Paul Schnieders, Robert Charles & WB Henning.
Between the two, I would recommend the version from Lumpkin because he has an amazing section before getting into the text showing the impact of the Book of Enoch on the New Testament. He even shows the very specific quotes from Jesus himself that were quotes of the Book of Enoch! The amazing thing is it was always assumed after discoveries and dating of 1 Enoch, 2 Enoch & 3 Enoch, that the Book of Enoch came after Christ because of some of the material, but the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls flipped everything around - this showed the dating of Enoch material was over 500 years earlier than previously thought, so it was actually the New Testament quoting the Book of Enoch (including Jesus), not the other way around!!
I was able to find a copy of The God Who Weeps on eBay today I can't wait to get it and read it
Awesome - you will love it! Definitely one of my all time favorites!
Nice.
Sunday - May 30, 2021.
Is there a book that does a side by side comparison of the Pearl of Great Price and the JST?
We often don’t think of it like this, but significant parts of the Pearl of Great Price were actually extracts of the JST itself -specifically the Book of Moses and Matthew 24. Moses 1 was actually the very first revelation Joseph received as he started the JST process with Genesis 1 and he designated it as an introduction to the Book of Genesis.
Here is an excellent article published by BYU Religious Studies Center authored by Kent Jackson in which it outlines How We Got the Book of Moses. It is a fascinating read to see the timeline and number of different scribes used during the JST as well as more details on the process and history of use of the JST. Here is a direct link to the article:
rsc.byu.edu/study-faith/how-we-got-book-moses
@@latterdaysaintsqa thank you.
We walk by faith and not by sight...
The Ehiopian Orthodox Book of Enoch also agrees with Joesph Smith's translation
I recently ordered and received Book of Enoch with Ethiopian Bible. I am looking forward to reading this publication and enjoy similarities as I have long been interested in Dead Sea scrolls. Thank you for sharing this message with us.
( However you MUST SPEAK MUCH SLOWER!!!)
Thank you. As far as the speed - I do agree it was a little too fast in this video. I have done that on a handful of videos when I had a lot to go over. One solution that works on RUclips is the ability to slow the pace of the video down by changing the playback settings. Here is how you do that on RUclips: click on the settings (the wheel icon in the bottom right corner of the video screen itself on a computer, or if on a phone its the top right corner 3 dots), you can select the playback speed and you slow things down in increments (the next step down from normal would be .75x or 25% slower). You can also choose the “custom” button and choose a precise speed desired rather than the pre-defined suggestions.
@@latterdaysaintsqa I guess Im a bit odd because I can understand you on 1.75x speed lol! Love watching these videos, they always help with my testimony
Thank you!
Holy moly
Very cool info, but can you slow down your reading a bit
Thanks for your comment. Sorry the pace of the video being a little too fast - I have done that on a handful of videos when I had a lot of material to cover and trying to keep the length of the video still attractive for a large audience (but probably should have just let the video go longer and slowed the speech).
One solution that works well on RUclips is to change the playback setting. If you click on the settings (the wheel icon in the bottom right corner of the video screen itself on a computer, or if on a phone its the top right corner 3 dots), you can select the playback speed and you slow things down in increments (the next step down from normal would be .75x or 25% slower). You can also choose the “custom” button and choose a precise speed desired rather than the pre-defined suggestions.
Interesting
S. Michael Wilcox in "Don't leap with the sheep" has a different interpretation of Enoch being a "Wild Man." He said he wasn't some man in the wilderness, but that he wasn't politically correct. He would state things as they really were regardless of the overton window, and that made him a wild man. Where did this idea that it was sarcastic come from?
Here is a detailed article from Pearl of Great Price Central on the topic - it goes into a lot of depth around the options and should be helpful in addressing your question:
www.pearlofgreatpricecentral.org/enochs-teaching-mission-enoch-and-the-other-wild-man/
@@latterdaysaintsqa There isn't too much evidence of one way or another. I still think that he was soft spoken in nature, but started talking nonpolitically correct and was then called a wild man. It would make sense the spirit would help me to counter his nature.
I hate to break it to you, but, the Book of Enoch has been available as literal scripture in the Ethiopian Bible since A.D. 494. It was also a part of Second Temple Judaism. Both the Ethiopian Bible and Second Temple Jewish Apocrypha have been available for study in the English language since the 16 century. Enoch wasn’t accepted as Canon by many mainstream religions during Joseph Smiths time, probably because of its supernatural take on the Genesis 6 story. Its discovery at Qumran accentuated its validity. It is an amazing book and every Christian should read it.
As I explain in the first 11 minutes or so of the video, the comparisons I make are of Enoch material discovered after Joseph Smith’s death: 2 Enoch, 3 Enoch and the Book of Giants (found in the Dead Sea Scrolls). 1 Enoch was virtually lost to the western world until the Scottish explorer James Bruce brought a manuscript from his adventures in Africa to Europe in 1777. It was not translated in Europe into English until Archbishop Richard Laurence in Ireland translated it in 1821. The likelihood of Joseph Smith having access to this translation is rather remote (as I elaborate in the video), but just to take the argument off the table, I focused only on the Enoch discoveries that came after Joseph Smith died. Here is a helpful article describing these discoveries written by the scholar Jeffrey Bradshaw, entitled “The Rediscovery of Enoch”: latterdaysaintmag.com/the-rediscovery-of-enoch/
The book of enoch was written before the bible and it was initially included in "the bible.".. So why is it such a surprise that joseph smith would be able to write about things from the book of enoch if it did definitely exist. Joseph smith obviously read it or heard the stories somewhere because it was available.
Sorry if I didn’t articulate this more clearly toward the beginning of the video - all of the things shared in this video are specific items found in Enoch literature discovered after Joseph Smith died - specifically those things found in 2 Enoch, 3 Enoch, and especially the Book of Giants (found in the Dead Sea Scrolls discovery). Here is a deep dive on the topic if you would like to explore in-depth:
“Could Joseph Smith Have Drawn on Ancient Manuscripts When He Translated the Story of Enoch?: Recent Updates on a Persistent Question - Jeffrey Bradshaw and Ryan Dahle - Interpreter: A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship 33 (2019): 305-374
journal.interpreterfoundation.org/could-joseph-smith-have-drawn-on-ancient-manuscripts-when-he-translated-the-story-of-enoch-recent-updates-on-a-persistent-question/#sdfootnote54sym
1st Timothy 1:16 Romans 11 chapter verse 13 and 14, 2nd Timothy 2:15.
In your opinion are we in the 6th seal or 7th seal? For me I think we could be in the 7th seal.
Not really sure - I haven't really studied it in depth enough to make an educated guess.
Oh, I am so upset! This video sounded as if you were talking through a tunnel and that made it difficult to hear well. So much I wanted to hear every word. The only way I have to watch and listen is on the phone.. I don't know why it sounds off like that but I couldn't catch allyousaid, actually not a lot of it. Would you consider a redo and work on the sound of it?!?!
If you are having trouble hearing, a few things that could help:
First, I have paid for custom subtitles/captions to be available for all of the videos (in English, Spanish & Portuguese), so those can help you see the words while they are spoken. To turn on these captions, while watching the video click on the CC button (top right on phone, bottom right on computer).
Second, you can also obtain a transcript of the video by visiting my website, latterdaysaintsqa.com and clicking on the link “read the blog” (then look for the video title).
Third, you could see if the audio comes through on your device any better by checking the same video on my Facebook page - here is a link to that specific video:
facebook.com/latterdaysaintsqa/videos/2233546220144299
Joseph Smith was a true prophet of Jesus christ my name is jesse Linkes the book of mormon is true and the doctrine and covenants is also true I am now a witness
Thank you for sharing your testimony
The Book of Enoch is what converted me. When I was searching the scriptures making correlations to the Book of Mormon with the sister missionaries teaching me. I was using my 6-7 years of scriptural knowledge on the Holy Bible to make correlations. And though I made several. I was still stumped. Then I decided to dig deeper and go into the Apocrypha, and found the evidence I needed and more. Even the Apocryphon of John covers other LDS deep doctrine like heavenly mother.
~ God appeared to John the Baptist and said, "I am the one who is with you always. I am the Father, I am the Mother, I am the Son. I am the undefiled and incorruptible one. ~
Thanks for sharing!
@@latterdaysaintsqa Yeah no problem! 😊
I enjoyed watching your videos but the thing i struggle with is why lds use other religious texts to bolster joseph smith texts ie the mandaean s do not believe in Jesus so why even mention their accounts it makes it harder when one is searching for truth
The correlation of Joseph Smith’s revelation on Enoch with these very ancient documents, which were found after Joseph’s death, is another evidence of a miracle showing divinity involved in the writings coming from Joesph Smith (I like to refer to it as “divine fingerprints”). To be clear, these types of things are bonus witnesses, as compared to the main witness of Joseph Smith’s prophetic calling, which is the coming forth of the Book of Mormon (see the video I did called Book of Mormon: Match It! for details: ruclips.net/video/pnkrQOEhuHA/видео.html ).
Let me elaborate on a few things about this Enoch topic that I also hope will be helpful in addressing your question. Enoch lived prior to 3,000BC and little is known about him from what we find in the Biblical account we have today. This is sad because it sounds like he was an amazing prophet and we have now learned that many New Testament quotes were quoting the Book of Enoch, even from Jesus Christ himself! This was a result of the huge discovery at the Dead Sea Scrolls, which dated the Enoch literature found to over a century before Christ. Prior to that, the Enoch literature was always assumed to have been written after Christ, because of the New Testament quotes that are there, but with the Dead Sea Scrolls find, it became clear that the Book of Enoch was so respected that many quotes came from that material. This Enoch material would have been written based on oral or written traditions of Enoch which are no longer in existence.
The Book of Giants, which was part of the Dead Sea Scroll discovery, was considered to be a part of the Enoch literature (focused on the giants discussed in Genesis 6). This was discovered in 1948 and was in fragments. An additional discovery in the same decade was found in Asia, and was the Manichean version. The Manichaeans appear to have copied the original Book of Giants (several centuries later) and modified it to correlate with Iranian myths. Both discovered versions are in fragments, but the Manachean version, since it was copying the original Aramaic (found in the Dead Sea Scrolls), can be helpful for scholars to piece together more clearly the original Book of Giants.
As I mentioned in the video, 1 Enoch was found several decades prior to Joseph Smith’s work, but the English translation would have had almost no chance to have reached Joseph. However, just to make a stronger case, all of the material in the video was focused on 2 Enoch (discovered in 1886), 3 Enoch (discovered in 1928), Book of Giants (considered a lost extension of 1 Enoch) - discovered in 2 places: Maniachean version discovered in western China in 1943 and the Aramaic version discovered in 1948 as part of the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Thought you might also like this excerpt from the book I held up in the video by the Enoch scholar Joseph Lumpkin (book title “The Books of Enoch and the Book of Giants; featuring 1, 2, and 3 Enoch, with the Aramaic and Manichean versions of The Book of Giants”; pages 40-42):
The Book of Enoch was once cherished by Jews and Christians alike. It is read in certain Coptic Christian Churches in Ethiopia. Three versions of the Book of Enoch exist today.
Most scholars date the Book of Enoch, also called 1 Enoch, to sometime during the second century BC. We do not know what earlier oral tradition, if any, the book contains. Enoch was considered inspired and authentic by certain Jewish sects of the first century BC [ala Dead Sea Scrolls] and remained popular for at least 500 hundred years. The earliest Ethiopian text was apparently derived from a Greek manuscript of the Book of Enoch, which itself was a copy of an earlier text. The original was apparently written in the Semitic language, now thought to be Aramaic.
The Book of Enoch (1 Enoch) was discovered in the 18th century. It was assumed to have been penned after beginning of the Christian Era. This theory was based on the fact that it had quotes and paraphrases as well as concepts found in the New Testament. Thus, it was assumed that it was heavily influenced by writers such as Jude and Peter.
However, recent discoveries of copies of the book among the Dead Sea Scrolls found at Qumran prove the book was in existence before the time of Jesus Christ. These scrolls forced a closer look and reconsideration. It became obvious that the New Testament did not influence the Book of Enoch; on the contrary, the Book of Enoch influenced the New Testament. The date of the original writing upon which the second century BC Qumran copies were based is shrouded in obscurity. Likewise lost are the sources of the oral traditions that came to be the Book of Enoch. Slowly, over the past 60 years, we have unraveled some of the mystery.
It has been largely the opinion of historians that the book does not really contain the authentic words of the ancient Enoch, since he would have lived several thousand years earlier than the first known appearance of the book attributed to him. However, the first century Christinas accepted the Book of Enoch as inspired, if not authentic. They relied on it to understand the origin and purpose of many things, from angels to wind, sun and stars. In fact, many of the key concepts used by Jesus Christ himself seem directly connected to terms and ideas in the Book of Enoch.
……It is hard to avoid the evidence that Jesus not only studied the book, but also respected it highly enough to allude to its doctrine and content. Enoch is replete with mentions of the coming kingdom and other holy themes. It was not only Jesus who used phrases or ideas from Enoch, there are over one hundred comments in the New Testament which find precedence in the Book of Enoch.
[the author then gives 3 pages of examples from the New Testament and their earlier corollaries in the Book of Enoch]
As we read and study the Book of Mormon and discover all of the many, many, many things that Joseph Smith planted in the Book of Mormon when he "wrote" the Book one has to or should ask what was his motive? Was it just to make money and pick up women? If so wouldn't of a less complex and impressive book worked to accomplished that goal in the early 19th century? As I read the Book I keep asking myself over and over, "Boy that Joe Smith sure was smart, how did he know that?"
At 19:10 I'd be interested in the parts that are missing, as shown by the ... punctuation. Polygamy was part of the immorality that was happening there, as seen in other Dead Sea Scroll records.
In this case, those ellipsis aren’t being used to save space, rather they represent missing sections from the Dead Sea Scroll fragments this is taken from.
👍
Bro… let’s talk and get you on the show man…
Hi Cardon - I am familiar with your show and have enjoyed some of the episodes I have seen. Btw, love the new name for your channel! Why don’t you reach out to me directly to correspond - go to my website latterdaysaintsqa.com and click on the contact me link.
Could you go just a bit faster, please?
Haha - I appreciate the humor 😁
hahaha
Joseph☺️
If someone other than Joseph wrote the Book of Moses, then Joseph's knowledge or access to other books is irrelevant. I'm playing devil's advocate btw.
Who would you propose to have written it?
You mention the dead sea scrolls. Sadly a large portion were proven to be fake in 2020 most likely after you made this video. Since I'm watching this video in 2021- were you referring to those or the ones that have been proven to be real?
The Book of Giants (a lost part of Enoch 1) was one of the original finds in the Dead Sea Scrolls discovery of 1948 - they were catalogued as found in Cave 2. The fragment or cave identifier was: 2QEnGiants; the fragment name was “Book of Giants” from “Enoch”; was written in Aramaic and dated to the Herodian time period (37 BC - 73 AD). Here is a link to Wikipedia article cataloguing all the verified pieces from the Dead Sea Scrolls (with explanations) - see the bottom of Cave 2 for the Book of Giants/Enoch.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Sea_Scrolls
Here is a helpful article discussing a lot of helpful details on the recent forgeries that were pulled on the Museum of the Bible in Washington D.C.
www.cnn.com/2020/03/15/us/bible-museum-dead-sea-scrolls/index.html
Here is another article you may find helpful:
news.artnet.com/art-world/all-the-museum-of-the-bibles-dead-sea-scrolls-are-fake-1804395
Here are 2 paragraphs from that article that I will copy/paste here:
The Dead Sea Scrolls are the oldest-known Biblical texts, and most of them belong to the Israel Museum in Jerusalem. There are some 100,000 authenticated fragments, but the Museum of the Bible’s holdings-reportedly acquired for millions of dollars-were all among a group of some 70 previously unknown Dead Sea Scroll fragments that came to market after 2002.
“As for who was responsible,” said Loll, “the scope of my research was confirm or refute authenticity. The next phase of the research will likely look into where and when and who. But there are a limited number of dealers whose hands have touched these post-2002 Dead Sea Scroll fragments.”
The fragments in the Museum of the Bible were proven to be forgeries. The original Dead Sea Scrolls found in 1948 and beyond are authentic. Only that portion in a private collection were proved to be frauds.
I testify this is all true and I am of the True Church.