But then the next book RiverClan Leader Mistystar WHO DIDN'T GO TO THE CLANS FOR HELP after the Darktail thing, and you would think realize how bad not asking for help is, decides that RiverClan shouldn't ask for help. I think Reedwhisker is gonna go behind her back on this one. The fact that they point out he was clearly exasperated is amazing.
That wouldn’t undo the damage From previous series but if the events with Ashfur has taught them a lesson and they’re actively applying it then good for them
They should bring back the wolves as villains. They get a fleeting mention of howling in the mountains in Eclipse. Wolves existing in universe but not being plot relevant up until now would be a great opportunity to explore.
True, and we know the clans know what wolves are by name, at least from the old forest where there was a Wolfstep of ShadowClan and Wolfkit/heart of WindClan. There being wolves on the other side of the mountains by the lake shouldn't be a big leap in logic. but then again, they were surprised to discover stoats when there's a Stoatfur in ShadowClan who was listed in the allegiances of Crowfeather's Trial.
i do wonder if this method of Not Giving Us Significant Enough Details To Properly Theorize About What’s Going On was influenced by the last arc and how everyone and their mother immediately knew that the impostor was ashfur
I think if they hadn't given us the lightning strike vision, it might have been a better mystery. Just giving us the blue eyes would've been enough. BUUUT you could make the argument anyways, of Bramble being possessed of "it's Ashfur just to get with Squirrelflight." No matter what, I think having Bramblestar being the one possessed was a shot in the foot for a good mystery. If it were Harestar Leafstar or Tigerstar possessed THEN it shifts over to Bramblestar when Harestar dies or something it might have been a better mystery.
@@TheRibottoStudios ok but that sounds so much better than just bramble, plus even if people guessed ashfur it wouldnt be immediate what his canon motives were if he possessed another leader
it really pisses me off they made mosspelt against the code changes. she nursed graystripe's kittens when he was in riverclan and was generally supportive of him. yknow, the graystripe who was in a halfclan relationship and left his clan for riverclan bc of said halfclan relationship. that graystripe. i know theres no way Working Partners remembers this but I DO >:/ stop this mosspelt slander!
Icewing actually has a really interesting background- her son beetlewhisker died in the dark forest and she trained there as well, she got held captive and starved by darktail, she disagreed with Mistystar and got kicked out of riverclan (lived with shadowclan for a while.) Not like the books will ever treat her as a true character because she isn't important, but I really like her!
@@F1guRas what’s interesting is that the author of Wings of Fire(Tui T. Sutherland) wrote as an Erin for a bit before working on Wings of Fire. I know it’s not confirmed but I like to believe it’s an intentional reference of some kind.
I actually really like the idea of frostpaw unintentionally making up signs. It reminds me of stuff that happened to me as a kid when while attending a Catholic school and having an over active imagination I convinced myself I was seeing a sign from god of ghosts and stuff. Nope just me being young and paranoid/ imaginative. I think a lot of kids would react in a similar way and if the books play up frost paw's arrogance and have her learn some humility
I remember thinking something was wrong with me in Catholic School even in middle school because I couldn’t literally hear God speak to me and everyone talked so much about it… or trying to tell myself that my reflection in the window when my hair was all messy and static-y was my guardian angel… and that time one kid described her mom having what sounded like a stroke and both the kid and the religion teacher going “ah yes she’s speaking in tongues”… that was a… weird time
It would be hilarious for a dog attack to be a chihuahua. I know the size comparison of a house cat and a chihuahua because I have both at one, and they're about the same size. So it would be a funny one-time gag for a dog attack to built up, hearing barking in the distance, and then the dog finally gets there and is easily driven off by a single warrior.
@@abigailw7146 i mean, it’s hard to take a angsty book about kitty cats having super cool emo monologues serious at all times. And, chihuahuas do run off all the time. I think it would be something that could easily be done.
In regards to Lightleap, it's definitely a red herring. If Reedwhisker was murdered, I think she happened upon it and is keeping quiet about it. Most likely she crossed into RiverClan to steal prey as part of her newfound recklessness and she happened upon it without being seen by the RiverClan cats. Her issues with "cowardice" are going to come up whenever she finally reconciles with Sunbeam, so I can see her being afraid to intervene and being ashamed, so she pretends it never happened. When she finally makes up with Sunbeam she'll tell her what happened and Sunbeam will tell Frostpaw. That's my guess.
I don’t have any theories regarding the mystery in the truth comes from one of the videos that MoonKitti put out a couple weeks ago But she might be reckless now because she wants to prove that she is fearless or brave I have apparently she can go in the Dark Forest because of her heart
If they go in the direction of what you suggested this kind of justifies them forcing certain cats to be medicine cats. Swipe up all the shenanigans they did in night whispers and Long Shadows it makes them seem less like jerks And more like they’re committing a necessary evil especially if you these cats are rare
My absolute ideal turn out for this plotline, weirdly, is that its chaotic. I don't want it to be working perfectly. I actually love the idea that the dogs were called to kill Reedwhisker to make curlfeather deputy, then Mistystar died so them improvised the signs and manipulated Frostpaw's desire to be correct getting her to interpet normal dreams as prophecy (I love the idea that her dreams arent from starclan, its just her anxieties and need for validation). Then the dogs accidentally kill Curlfeather, and this throws another wrench in the spanner, I like the idea that this was a tragic accident and theyre making it up as they go along. I do also like the idea that this chaos spins off, with Sunbeam being blamed as a suspicious character for Reedwhiskers death which creates animosity among the clans via the xenophobic factions in each. Just chaos and scheming and tragedy and cats having to adapt and think and plan.
I've always wanted to see the Clans unfold into chaos. My personal "dream plot" is for the Clans to all just be ravaged by anarchy and death for a while until each one is "reset" to the size they were in TPB. I think it makes a lot of sense for them to eventually suffer so badly that the only way to survive is for the strongest to carry on and rebuild. (I keep trying to write fanfics that follow a story like this but I have no idea where to begin and just keep reinventing the allegiances instead)
With the Lightleap thing: I thought we were getting another Ravenpaw seeing Redtail's murder. I HIGHLY doubt Light's involved in any way other than being somewhat aware there's something strange going on. I hope we don't get another "are they evil?" Tigerstar clone story arc, and her hiding that she saw something happen to Reedwhisker like him being fed to dogs seems plausible. quick edit just to add on to myself: I say fed to dogs because if it was just Reedwhisker being attacked by another animal, Lightleap probably would have said something because she isn't stupid, if it's seemingly just the predator attacking him then she'd tell others "be careful by RiverClan's border, I saw a dog/badger/whatever on their side" since y'know, that animal likely doesn't care for borders and could easily attack ShadowClan if it wanted to and she does seem to care for her home and clanmates. It had to be a betrayal she witnessed for her to not say anything and the totally-not-badger wounds to add up, unless it was somehow not *Reedwhisker's* death she witnessed.
I also feel like that's the case And regarding her wound, she was either hurt into silence if there were still other cats, or of she ran from the scene and did get caught in a thorn
@imaginary living body or maybe she thought Reed crossed into their territory and attacked thinking "ohh look at me I'm so brave going after a deputy." And then that's when he got hurt; unable to properly defend himself from something else. He seemed to bemoan his death in StarClan.
I love that the mystery is more interesting with Riverclans complete lack of character development so we have no ideas, makes it harder to guess what’s going on unlike the last couple ‘mystery’ plots 😂
Honestly (having not read any of the books since the dawn of the clans series) I'm suspicious of Shimmerpelt. Based on the premise that Mistystar was not intended to die, her sucking up to Mistystar so much in the fight could've been a ploy to get in Mistystar's good graces and thereby increase her chances of being made deputy. The leader's son is a tough act to follow but it seems Misty isn't above nepotism soooo
Icewing should be leader! I know she’s old, but she’s had roles in OoTS, AVoS and TBC (Dark Forest trainee, Kin prisoner, Exilee for fighting with the rebels). While she’s likely the oldest warrior in RiverClan (Duskfur being her only competitor in age), but she still seems like a good leader. She was stated to be friendly by Ivypool, and seems to be brave and thoughtful (like when she warned a few of the Dark Forest trainees to keep quiet and do exactly as the df leaders say if they want to return to their clans, then lying to Mapleshade when she gets suspicious, or reassuring Shadowsight about his role with Ashfur and that Shadowsight was a good cat. She even warned him about dying in the Dark Forest, since she lost her son, Beetlewhisker there.) Icewing does seem to hold grudges sometimes (Rowanstar for letting Darktail take over ShadowClan, then RiverClan, and when Mistystar exiled her and Harelight, she seemed a bit bitter and declared herself ShadowClan.) Spoilers for Sky excerpt: Splashtail I believe states Icewing is the best cat at leading patrols in the clan, and was surprised when she didnt step up. It can be inferred she already has leadership experience, and is very good at it. Leading a patrol might not be leading a clan, but she already knows how to lead very well I dunno, I just really like Icewing lol, and I always imagined that she was best friends with Minnowtail Edit: Spelling
ohhhh you’re so right!!! I didn’t even remember she was one of the ones exiled from riverclan. now i’m really hoping the arc ends up with her being leader, that would really fit
@@injunghugh9617 According to Su Susan, yes, but it was never stated in canon. And that makes Jayclaw and Curlfeather related, but I guess everyone’s related anyways. Personally, unless it’s stated in a book or maybe an author, I dont see it as canon
IIRC, when being chased by the dogs Frostpaw mentions something like "smelling fresh-kill on their breath," so them being led to where she and Curlfeather were going to be a la Tigerstar seems to hold water.
That makes this whole concept really funny, the idea that just on the other end of the lake RiverClan had a weird conspiracy plot brewing that just went entirely under the radar from everyone else.
I would LOVE the idea of Frostpaw just struggling to be a normal medicine cat, with nobody to turn to because of Mothwing's lack of religious faith and being put under pressure to help the Clan during a horrendous time of need. Her also being used by cats, especially her mother, would also be amazing.
I’m still convinced Lightleap and Reedwhisker had a confrontation. The focus on twolegs near Riverclan territory makes me think Reedwhisker was chased by humans over the Shadowclan border, ran into Lightleap, and then ended up in a scuffle that gave him a small wound that was deep enough to make him vulnerable to whoever killed him. Either that or Lightleap actually fought Reedwhisker’s killer unintentionally, after they stepped over the Shadowclan border to keep their trail away from the crime scene.
my immediate thought was that she has a weird sort of goosefeather powers where she has visions/can predict things relating to death. having a "vision" of her father's death. being told where reedwhisker's body was. having a dream of _thousands of curled feathers_ at the moonpool, where her mother died... i think your interpretation of her family framing her to become a medicine cat is very probable, though! it'd be nice for mothwing to finally have someone to connect with in a way.
I think Frostpaw not having a special connection required to be a medicine cat would be the best way to take this route, cos like you said, we've already had sooo many extra-special med cat stories
God Splashtail is probably it. Like how perfect for Frostpaw to get a crush on him and then they can have some contrived plot about how she feels Betrayed, and then maybe that compels her to return to being a medicine cat or something.
I really don't think someone is out there CONTROLLING the dogs. I think it was more like Tigerclawstar; not DIRECTING the dogs, but leading the dogs. I think what the suspish cats did was like a relay race, leading the dogs RIGHT to Frost and Curl. They KNEW what was going on, they KNEW if they wanted to get rid of Curlfeather right away, before she got her nine lives. Curlstar sounds like such a pretty name tbh.
(SPOILERS FOR THUNDER) You were right Moon. Every word. It was Splashtail, it was Curlfeather, and you were right. You should be quite proud of yourself :)
I think that there’s a anti code change group in riverclan (wether or not they’re connected to shadowclan is unclear). Curlfeather and Podlight are two of them and they had come up with a plan to lure Reedwhisker into a pack of dogs, knowing there was a ravine nearby to hide the body. They then set a trap Tigerstar I style. Reedwhisker was attacked and fell in the ravine trying to escape of the dogs. The patrol returned to camp and pretended that he got lost. Mistystar’s death was unintentional, and they were planning to get someone in the group into the deputy position to wait until she dies. When finding Reedwhisker’s body, Curlfeather covers up the scratches as him falling to hide that it was dogs. The curled feather was planted by Splashtail, who they roped into the group. The curled feather dream seem by Frostpaw also wasn’t from StarClan, and was just a coincidence. The dogs on the way to the moonpool were the same that killed Reedwhisker, but this time they had just wandered there. Curlfeather thinking she was double-crossed tells Frostpaw to “trust no cat”. Lightleap also isn’t involved in this, and was just wrong place wrong time. She saw Reedwhisker be lurked into the dogs and was threatened to keep her quiet. I also feel like the Erin’s are setting up Splashtail as leader even though he’s really under qualified. The guy’s just everywhere. He was telling Frostpaw that the most obvious choice is the right one, which leads me to believe someone who isn’t super experienced is going to be leader.
Honestly I'd LOVE to see an underqualified cat chosen as leader. Just to see how they handle it. Splashtail seems to be the one best handling this situation for what it's worth. I didn't really like him in River, but in Sky he seems to be a bit better. This could completely be a ploy though; it reminds me of Mickey from Scream 2; constantly comforting Sidney, when SURPRISE MF he was a killer.
Sneezestar lets GOOOOO I do like the idea she senses death coming. Maybe a goosefeather type situation? idk though. I do like the thought the dogs are being controlled in some capacity. Also Shimmerpelt is one of my favorite characters. Theres zero good reason for this. So I'd be glad if she suddenly was wild big bad in some way lol
I hear that and I remember my old Dark Forest OC who was a med cat who could see how kits were gonna die, and if it were deemed too painful he'd just poison 'em. He felt remorse every part of it, and didn't even get a full name before he was killed by his mentor.
This is what sets Warriors and WoF apart in my mind. Warriors tries to do mysteries but they’re never satisfying, theres rarely enough evidence to come to a satisfying conclusion and even in retrospect it’s hard to connect the dots. (Spoilers for wings of fire the brightest night) While in Wings of Fire not only are the mysteries satisfying and interesting, they in many cases are solvable. For instance since I was a little art nerd back when I read the books I’d spend a lot of time looking at the covers and designs inside. And so by looking at the cover of the brightest night and comparing Sunny to the ordinary tribe designs I was able to figure out she was a nightwing sandwing hybrid before the book explained that. It rewards attentive readers and even if you don’t put much thought into it the answers are always deeply foreshadowed and connected to the story.
ok i know you drew up mitzi, the dogmonger as a joke but i legitimitly love that character concept?? it's so silly and ridiculous it becomes funny i want more Mitzi content out there
If they don’t reveal who is the culprit in Sky or Shadow, I am fairly certain that when it is revealed and if it’s not some random outsider that wasn’t mentioned in River, it’ll be a character that it would make absolutely no sense to be them because the plot team hadn’t actually figured out who the culprit was when they came up with the idea of someone being behind Reedwhisker and Curlfeather’s deaths and decided to go with a random character as a ‘surprise twist’.
I wonder if Frostpaw noting she is looking older and more frail then usual could be a clue that maybe Riverclan had been avoiding maintaining her or maybe subtly poisoning her for sometime. TBC and AVOS don’t really mention her looking terrible (AFAIK), so her suddenly doing terribly is a bit out of place
You'd be surprised how fast cats can go downhill, especially older cats. My cat is 20, and he's only just recently started to show his age and have health problems.
Mistystar is so old. (I assume were talking about mistystar) she was a warrior (maybe even senior?) BEFORE Firestar joined thunderclan, and he died forever ago. I'm sure it's just her age finally catching up to her.
@@Kaytoun Exactly, plus sometimes a cat will go from old but fine to a week later messy fur and about to croak as if they'd been in poor condition for years..when a cats time is up they often stop caring for themselves and just look really bad, there's even a small saying(ish) that I once heard about it something like "once a cat shows signs of something wrong it may be too late".
As much as I like the idea of a proper murder mystery in warriors, I don't have a lot of confidence in the planting and payoff to make it satisfying. I almost wonder if Lightleap is a double-fakeout (as in, she is not the killer, but a potential witness or unintentional accomplice to give the perpetrators plausible deniability). There's also a possibility the dogs were called in to cover up a different cause of death (even if it seems like a pointless extra step, it might open up other possibilities for involved parties with fewer resources/skills. Like poisoning and Reedwhisker recognizing his killer before succumbing, or fighting another cat and having the scratches obfuscated by a post-mortem dog attack or something. Probably not, but it would be cool to build a case that allows the writers to divulge contradictory information without spoiling the surprise. I ought to check the passages to see if there's significant reference to how bloody the wounds are, as if the wounds were inflicted after the crime they wouldn't bleed as much. Probably overthinking things. But Its Cool.)
I had a dream where Sunbeam's mom (Berryheart?) had a cult and since they were against the clan code changing, made a plan to eliminate the clan leaders and putting their cats at power lol
Berryheart is definitely suspicious, with her being against the code changes AND being xenophobic. It would be awesome for more clan leaders to die (like Tigerheart-star). But if they kill off the deputy as well that would mean Clovertail would be killed too, unless they're involved somehow.
I imagined the pack of dogs being Plott Hounds. hunting dogs with high prey drive, (almost) always brindle with roots in europe. it would make sense for a person living in a rural area who owns hunting dogs to own several of them edit: I forgot how common Cane Corsos are in Europe, it could easily be them too
I really think Splashtail is sus. When Frostpaw became a warrior apprentice he starts to act strange. Since we know that Splashtail is already meeting behind Icewing’s back (him meeting with Berryheart) it could be a possibility that he becomes evil. Also, I bet Frostpaw is going to become a medicne cat apprentice again, but I think that’s pretty obvious.
I think lightleap SAW something. And I think it's very possible that berryheart or someone has dirt on lightleap keeping her quiet. Maybe lightleap suspects sunbeam is involved which is adding to the relationship drama.
my current working hypothesis is that duskfur set this whole thing up with podlight, curlfeather, and splashtail involved in order to make curlfeather deputy but one of the people in the group (podlight? he seemed like he wanted to be leader) double crossed them. if duskfur knew about the dogs that killed curlfeather but was involved in reedwhisker's death she cant exactly go "oh it has to be one of the cats working with me that lead the dogs here, i know because i did that to kill reedwhisker" because that would. cause a whole host of issues. (also my bets are on icewing eventually becoming riverclans next leader because she's the only warrior aside from mallownose who had an established character before this arc and she has just been estbalished in the sky preview as good at leading patrols. flimsy evidence but i can dream)
SPOILERS!! Splashtail is hinted at being involved in the murder of Reedwhisker. He is afraid when Frostpaw has a vision about Reedwhisker being murdered. But he didn't do this alone. Berryheart and Duskfur are also involved. I can't think of a reason for Berryheart to be involved other than her wanting Tigerheartstar out of RiverClan. But I DO think that Duskfur wanted to be leader, asked Splashtail to kill Reedwhisker with the promise of being her deputy, but when her daughter dies she loses ambition, causing Splashtail to want to be leader instead. Maybe. Unless Icewing happens to be evil, I think that this (might?) be likely. So, Moonkitti, you asked for a comment with more info, I'm giving you one! (This is it)
I think this is a situation someone similar to the thing yellowfang had that was only ever mentioned in her super edition. She could feel other cats pain, which is both really good for a med cat and also the worst thing ever. She had no actual previously established relationship with starclan prior to figuring out she had that power. And yet, she became a med cat and got starclan dreams and visions. In Frostpaw's case tho, I'm pretty sure she's getting the death premonitions and also now starclan dreams. Her issue is she has no idea how to separate which dreams are which, or even what's a regular dream and what's a vision. I also think the curled feather she found was likely planted by the group in riverclan that's very against the code changes to get a leader in charge that agreed with them. That's why it's hard to figure out one cat that's responsible. I really think this was a group effort in a well thought out plan that hit the fan the second Mistystar died before they got the deputy they wanted lined up. Like Splashtail now taking a big interest in Frostpaw immediately after it's revealed that she has the whole clan in her paws. Frost's feather dream afterwards wasn't actually a confirmation, it was a death premonition. Curl dies on that trip to the moonpool (which technically means Frost got her killed, so maybe some angst in the future). Curlfeather probably thought it was a betrayal from her anti-code changing buddies that got Reedwhisker killed to get *her* then killed, hence her "trust no one" final words. I think the dreams she has that are incredibly cryptic are coming from wherever she's getting the death premonition stuff/her misinterpreting regular dreams . And the straight forward stuff is starclan communicating. I think the idea that Lighleap was hinted to being there when reed died is meant to be a red herring. She didn't kill him, but she definitely saw the cat that murdered him. It would play up her cowardice arc. She's doing stupid things to pretend she's brave only when it's herself that's in danger. This is something that could massively affect all of shadowclan if she made the accusation and is so so much more serious then climbing really high in a tree. Her second chance to possibly redeem herself to her clan, if she ever gets the courage to go through with it. (Man, why is Sunbeam a main character POV. Even having Blaze could have been so much better) Meanwhile, Flamepaw is angrily crying in the rain somewhere because no one loves him. edit: grammar
I have a fun theory that the Leopardstar that Frostpaw saw isn't actually Leopardstar, but *Frecklewish* (as in the Thunderclan one, not the Skyclan one). I feel like most morally grey cats are up in the air as to who got in to Starclan or not, but they were SO adamant about Frecklewish being in kitty cat hell. I don't think she's evil at all, I think it's actually the opposite. I think maybe Freckle saw what was going on in Riverclan and saw that the medcat apprentice was struggling, so she put herself in Frostpaw's dreams to try to help, perhaps in a desperate attempt for post-death redemption despite what was said in ALITM.
Maybe, but I feel like the only cat who's still kicking in the afterlife from the time frecklewish was alive (I bet you anything, even if dead cats remembering each other works, nobody remembers anybody from that time other than stories passed down, which after like 20+ years and countless generations aren't reliable) would be Mapleshade herself, maybe oakstar if we're feeling generous. I haven't read the new books since avos and I know this theory is just for fun, but there's definitely a chance you're right with the attention she's been getting lately.
This could be like the Bravelands mystery with the death of the crown leaf. And it turns out to be the most supportive character in the story. That's why I think Jayclaw did it.
i like River Clan its cool that we finally have an protagonist from there and the Chapters with Frostpaw were really interesting in my option i cant wait to read more about her in the next books
@@Leafy_ It's about this young tom named Tailchaser trying to find out what happened to his friend after she and a couple other cats disappear. He's joined by a kitten and much later another male and female cat and they eventually find the source of the disappearances. It kind of like a precursor to Warriors but also Watership Down in the sense that there are stories and a whole language to learn about the world. It can be a bit dense, but I think it's worth the read.
I honestly believe Lightleap could be involved in Reedwhisker's death. Ever since she decided not to go to The Dark Forest in the last arch, she's felt the need to prove to everyone, including herself, that she's not a coward. I think it would be really easy for someone in RiverClan to use that to their advantage to get Lightleap to do their dirty work of getting rid of Reedwhisker so if Reedwhisker's death did ever come out as foul play, Lightleap would be blamed and the RiverClan cat would get off scott-free and possibly obtain the level of power they were hoping for. This is just my headcannon but I think it would be interesting!
Unrelated to the murder mystery video but i’m glad podlight has become relevant again. Bit of reoccuring stuff from mistystar’s omen where podkit looked up to mistystar. Probably not intentional and just a coincidence but its nice to see. Glad podlight, my favourite background cat, finally is getting some attention.
I wonder if Curlfeather lead the dogs to her specifically to kill off evidence of her killing Reedwhisker In any way. (EDIT) Or maybe she knew that the dogs were in that specific place for some reason- and put the signs there in order to 1, make it seem more like her daughter was special, so people would keep listening to her, and 2, give her a reason to go to the moon pool, where the dogs were waiting for her.
I have this one theory that Mosspelt is the new oldest cat in Warriors. She might've even been older than Mistystar. But she definetly is the new oldest cat. I love how they're all RiVeRcLaN cAtS (the Erins forget RiverClan exist...)
When I started reading the book, I started out thinking it was just bad luck, started thinking it might be a mystery, but then realized I'd probably enjoy the book more if I just kept assuming it was just really bad luck until proven otherwise.
Very glad that the mystery isn't painfully obvious. The Broken Code was great but we knew it was Ashfur long before the reveal. This is interesting. Also that is a top tier Owlnose design!
Really good refresher on everything thats happened with RC! I like the idea that Lightleap witnessed the killing of Reedwhisker, but keeps quiet out of fear of threats from the murderer. (I imagine if lightleap were found out to have witnessed Reedwhisker, another clans deputy be attacked and killed by a treacherous clanmate and done nothing about it, she could be in big trouble) It could match up nicely with the character arc set up for her by TBC, that she's a bit of a coward and self-serving, but not a bad person. If this is the case, her deciding to put aside her cowardice and actually help the protagonists defeat the bad guy would be good pay off from the set up from ALitM!
speaking of that, i was just wondering what would happen if she was made leader. would she get nine lives or not? we know she believes in starclan which must mean that its a possibility, but she has no faith which means that getting no extra lives is also a possibility. AND we also know that starclan can show up to anyone, even those who have no connection to starclan like mothwing, as shown in the last hope and the broken code, but what about in dreams?? kinda confusing tbh
@@JustAcrylicArts Honestly, it’s a mystery to me as well, I feel it could go either way. They either just don’t give her extra lives cause she has no faith which leaves her vulnerable, maybe they have another cat in mind for leadership somehow or starclam do give her extra lives for their own intentions and just so she can help protect her clan. I love to think about how it would go if this was a possibility for Mothwing
That would be incredible actually. I've never been a massive Mothwing stan but I think that has some awesome potential and that Mothwing would be a really interesting leader. I feel like they'd go the Nightstar route though and not give her any lives...
Maybe Curlfeather and some other cats were involved in Reedwhisker’s death, and they were planning to take over Riverclan. But when Mistystar died Curlfeather took the opportunity to become leader via her daughter, and one of the other cats in the plan wanted to be leader instead, so they baited they baited the dogs to attack Curlfeather and Frostpaw. Perhaps they were hoping Frostpaw would die, as they knew Mothwing has no connection to StarClan and by eliminating Frostpaw, who they think has a connection with StarClan, they’re hoping to fake a sign to make themselves leader with no opposition. Or maybe StarClan killed Curlfeather themselves. If they didn’t give Curlfeather nine lives when she came to the Moonpool they would’ve looked like liars in Riverclan’s eyes and would have lost connection with them, so they had to kill her instead. Idk why they would put Frostpaw in so much danger thoug, perhaps they want her dead too? For some reason.
im very curious about what splash’s motivations are. it would be interesting to see a different incentive than just “i want power” and “i want to be leader” i saw someone else comment this so i just want to clarify the next thing im about to say isnt an original idea: i really like the idea that curlfeather is working with berryheart behind the scenes. it also seems very possible that curl or berry were instructing splash to do all the things he did. however, again, the motivations are confusing. (now to my own ideas!) going with the fact he’s a baby, since he’s so young that would make him pretty impressionable, especially if he holds a few of the same ideas as them. if he respects or agrees with the person giving him orders, he may do them without question. theres also a chance maybe berry is also only a pawn for a greater king. there could be someone even higher up that chain. im overall just very interested in what will happen in the next books :)
Definitely seems like a plot where Curlfeather was setting up some of the cats around her (and or maybe herself?) to be inducted in a position of power through the signs, claims of future visions Frostpaw had and the murder or Reedwhisker. Past that though it's really hard to say who else is definitely involved and we'll need to wait at least until the next book to have any solid guesses.
Considering Brambleclaw and Crookedstar were made deputy based off signs, I feel if it was a sign they thought mistystar would be pushed enough to make someone without an apprentice deputy, like Firestar did with Brambleclaw.
My theory for this series will be: We already know the books are gonna be like River, Sky, Thunder, Shadow (?), Wind (?), and Star, but my theory for the actual plot is that the groups of cats that don't like the changes to the code will split off and join together to try and revert the code. This group would 100% include Berryheart as the main proprietor of it all. Also it says that Tigerstar clone #2/Bramblestar is traumatized by his experience in the DF, so maybe he'll be the first leader to retire? Like maybe Squilf retires then he retires to be with her? (But we all know Bramble's doing it to be with the Patrol Guy Thornclaw.) Additionally, Curlfeather could have been part of the #BringBackTheCode gang and she and the others on that patrol planned to dispose of Reedwhisker and create a fake sign saying that Curlfeather would be the next deputy, basically automatically making her leader because Mistystar was so old, but Mistystar died before they were ready for her to. I think that Curlfeather genuinely cares about Frostpaw, and that the dog attack was unplanned. (Or maybe another member of the group baited them there)
This might also be wishful thinking, but I'm curious if the amount of medicine cats with no spiritual insight right now is intentional? I'm always curious how the writers respond to fan backlash, and there was so much spesifically against starclan after the last arc. I wonder if this is almost by design to slowly ease the amount of influence and presense starclan has in the regular stories, by removing cats with connections to them.
I’m a simple person. I see Moonkitti content, I ✨click✨ Idk but I imagine that Mistystar died from a stroke from high blood pressure. She’s an old cat, so like elderly people, she may be just as vulnerable to conditions that some middle aged people may not struggle with, despite living longer than others
Okay so I'm gonna start by saying I havent read this book yet. I havent read any Warriors book since New Prophecy. But after watching this video (because i like to keep up with Warriors news) here is my theory, which is 100% wrong because, again, im only going off this video: This was supposed to be a coup attempt. Cats who were against the code changes made a plan to instill a new deputy to take over after Mistystar eventually dies (and they did not plan for her to die so soon.) Curlfeather was in on it. Since she tried to redirect the badger claws comment. She was chosen by the group to become the new deputy in their plan. She instilled her daughter as medcat apprentice, thinking her visions may help Curlfeather into becoming chosen as deputy. Everyone on the patrol with Reedwhisker were in on it. Splashtail was in on it. He placed the feather as part of the plan. But! Curlfeather was double crossed. And someone else wants to be leader instead. Or plans changed or something. I dont know if they controlled the dogs specifically, or if they just lead dogs there and let whatever happens happen. And that's why Curlfeather said "dont trust anyone". She knows other cats were in on the Reedwisker murder. She knows other cats had planned that coup. And now she knows someone just betrayed her too. And she wants her daughter safe. I think Lightleap is a red herring and not involved at all or if she is, its very minimally. I think Duskfur could be involved. I wouldn't put it past the writers saying she's just a really good actor. Or maybe its complex! She killed Curlfeather but she was really sad to do it! And just a "sacrifices must be made for the good of the clan" type thing. I wouldnt put it past the writers to forget the deputy-apprentice rule. Especially since (I think?) its not a set in stone warrior code rule and is just a tradition thing.
To be perfectly honest, scourges cousins half-sister dads brothers uncle is a dog/cat hybrid that made the dark forest and wants to take over river clan because they like water….oh and fire star came back to life for 9+ books
I listened to these books as audiobooks, so I 100% thought Frostpaw's mom was also named Crowfeather. Took me until the curled feathers signs at the moon pool to realize for sure that it wasn't her name
going back to 10:46 it would be a cool idea if Shimmerpelt was the one who organized Reedwhisker and/or Curlfeather's deaths, in a plot to become deputy after Reedwhisker was gone, and the whole time leading to Mistystars death sucking up to her to get the position of deputy. It would be cool to see a manipulative, power hungry she-cat.
I’ve seen theories that the green eyed cat is Moth Flight trying to fuck shit up because of the code changes. I think that’d be really funny i think they should do that. I don’t think it’s entirely impossible that Mistystar was killed on purpose, myself. I think its not a stretch to say that they riled her up on purpose. I won’t really be surprised either way.
![100 Days - [Minecraft DESERT]](/img/1.gif)
The entirety of Starclan saw Frostpaw struggling to be spiritual and went ‘So no cryptic bullshit, we’re helping this one’ and honestly I love that?
I seriously love 💫RiverClan💫! They my fave
Starclan being useful for once… iconic riverclan behavior…
But then the next book RiverClan Leader Mistystar WHO DIDN'T GO TO THE CLANS FOR HELP after the Darktail thing, and you would think realize how bad not asking for help is, decides that RiverClan shouldn't ask for help. I think Reedwhisker is gonna go behind her back on this one. The fact that they point out he was clearly exasperated is amazing.
@@woofnoble That's a bit of a bad sign.
That wouldn’t undo the damage From previous series but if the events with Ashfur has taught them a lesson and they’re actively applying it then good for them
They should bring back the wolves as villains. They get a fleeting mention of howling in the mountains in Eclipse. Wolves existing in universe but not being plot relevant up until now would be a great opportunity to explore.
considering they vaguely set it in england, i feel like that was probably a dog? wolves would be cool though
True, and we know the clans know what wolves are by name, at least from the old forest where there was a Wolfstep of ShadowClan and Wolfkit/heart of WindClan. There being wolves on the other side of the mountains by the lake shouldn't be a big leap in logic.
but then again, they were surprised to discover stoats when there's a Stoatfur in ShadowClan who was listed in the allegiances of Crowfeather's Trial.
@@siionach it’s set in england yet they have proper mountains and at least one (1) cougar
@@siionach also there are snakes that bite and kill cats sooooo it's not REALISTIC England.
@@siionach Would be funny if a clan cat mistaken a husky for a wolf
i do wonder if this method of Not Giving Us Significant Enough Details To Properly Theorize About What’s Going On was influenced by the last arc and how everyone and their mother immediately knew that the impostor was ashfur
That makes a lot of sense
It definitely is.
I think if they hadn't given us the lightning strike vision, it might have been a better mystery. Just giving us the blue eyes would've been enough. BUUUT you could make the argument anyways, of Bramble being possessed of "it's Ashfur just to get with Squirrelflight." No matter what, I think having Bramblestar being the one possessed was a shot in the foot for a good mystery. If it were Harestar Leafstar or Tigerstar possessed THEN it shifts over to Bramblestar when Harestar dies or something it might have been a better mystery.
Probably lol
@@TheRibottoStudios ok but that sounds so much better than just bramble, plus even if people guessed ashfur it wouldnt be immediate what his canon motives were if he possessed another leader
I stand by the fact that mistystar’s death was iconic. What better way to escape losing an argument than to dramatically fall over and die?
Lol
None... there is none.... 😅
it really pisses me off they made mosspelt against the code changes. she nursed graystripe's kittens when he was in riverclan and was generally supportive of him. yknow, the graystripe who was in a halfclan relationship and left his clan for riverclan bc of said halfclan relationship. that graystripe.
i know theres no way Working Partners remembers this but I DO >:/ stop this mosspelt slander!
@imaginary living body i also think she'd be for that considering it was her leader that allowed her adoptive children to be nearly murdered
Icewing actually has a really interesting background- her son beetlewhisker died in the dark forest and she trained there as well, she got held captive and starved by darktail, she disagreed with Mistystar and got kicked out of riverclan (lived with shadowclan for a while.) Not like the books will ever treat her as a true character because she isn't important, but I really like her!
That name sounds like the Wings of Fire dragon species “Icewings”
@@F1guRas what’s interesting is that the author of Wings of Fire(Tui T. Sutherland) wrote as an Erin for a bit before working on Wings of Fire. I know it’s not confirmed but I like to believe it’s an intentional reference of some kind.
@@strawberryqueen0382 yeah thats what i have always thought lol i love WOF
she gets mentioned more in the excerpt of the new book :D!!!!
I actually really like the idea of frostpaw unintentionally making up signs. It reminds me of stuff that happened to me as a kid when while attending a Catholic school and having an over active imagination I convinced myself I was seeing a sign from god of ghosts and stuff. Nope just me being young and paranoid/ imaginative. I think a lot of kids would react in a similar way and if the books play up frost paw's arrogance and have her learn some humility
I remember thinking something was wrong with me in Catholic School even in middle school because I couldn’t literally hear God speak to me and everyone talked so much about it… or trying to tell myself that my reflection in the window when my hair was all messy and static-y was my guardian angel… and that time one kid described her mom having what sounded like a stroke and both the kid and the religion teacher going “ah yes she’s speaking in tongues”… that was a… weird time
It would be hilarious for a dog attack to be a chihuahua. I know the size comparison of a house cat and a chihuahua because I have both at one, and they're about the same size. So it would be a funny one-time gag for a dog attack to built up, hearing barking in the distance, and then the dog finally gets there and is easily driven off by a single warrior.
no you dont understand warrior cats cant have humor its a dark serious book about cats murdering each other
@@abigailw7146 Yeah man, but sometimes I think a little comic relief would be nice
@@abigailw7146 i mean, it’s hard to take a angsty book about kitty cats having super cool emo monologues serious at all times. And, chihuahuas do run off all the time. I think it would be something that could easily be done.
@@abigailw7146 xD
@@ZirconiaGacha i know lmao your comment just made me realized how absolutely humor less these books are and its funny
Wow, I've been out of the warriors loop for so long that the only name here I recognized is Mistystar. Damn.
No, even people who have read a ton of the books not including that arc only remember Mistystar, Mothwing, and *maybe* Reedwhisker from Riverclan
In regards to Lightleap, it's definitely a red herring.
If Reedwhisker was murdered, I think she happened upon it and is keeping quiet about it.
Most likely she crossed into RiverClan to steal prey as part of her newfound recklessness and she happened upon it without being seen by the RiverClan cats.
Her issues with "cowardice" are going to come up whenever she finally reconciles with Sunbeam, so I can see her being afraid to intervene and being ashamed, so she pretends it never happened. When she finally makes up with Sunbeam she'll tell her what happened and Sunbeam will tell Frostpaw.
That's my guess.
Ooh so true I love that theory
I don’t have any theories regarding the mystery in the truth comes from one of the videos that MoonKitti put out a couple weeks ago But she might be reckless now because she wants to prove that she is fearless or brave I have apparently she can go in the Dark Forest because of her heart
If they go in the direction of what you suggested this kind of justifies them forcing certain cats to be medicine cats. Swipe up all the shenanigans they did in night whispers and Long Shadows it makes them seem less like jerks And more like they’re committing a necessary evil especially if you these cats are rare
My absolute ideal turn out for this plotline, weirdly, is that its chaotic. I don't want it to be working perfectly. I actually love the idea that the dogs were called to kill Reedwhisker to make curlfeather deputy, then Mistystar died so them improvised the signs and manipulated Frostpaw's desire to be correct getting her to interpet normal dreams as prophecy (I love the idea that her dreams arent from starclan, its just her anxieties and need for validation). Then the dogs accidentally kill Curlfeather, and this throws another wrench in the spanner, I like the idea that this was a tragic accident and theyre making it up as they go along.
I do also like the idea that this chaos spins off, with Sunbeam being blamed as a suspicious character for Reedwhiskers death which creates animosity among the clans via the xenophobic factions in each. Just chaos and scheming and tragedy and cats having to adapt and think and plan.
I've always wanted to see the Clans unfold into chaos. My personal "dream plot" is for the Clans to all just be ravaged by anarchy and death for a while until each one is "reset" to the size they were in TPB. I think it makes a lot of sense for them to eventually suffer so badly that the only way to survive is for the strongest to carry on and rebuild. (I keep trying to write fanfics that follow a story like this but I have no idea where to begin and just keep reinventing the allegiances instead)
There’s only one option, Reedwhisker’s murderer is Firestar!
With the Lightleap thing: I thought we were getting another Ravenpaw seeing Redtail's murder. I HIGHLY doubt Light's involved in any way other than being somewhat aware there's something strange going on. I hope we don't get another "are they evil?" Tigerstar clone story arc, and her hiding that she saw something happen to Reedwhisker like him being fed to dogs seems plausible.
quick edit just to add on to myself: I say fed to dogs because if it was just Reedwhisker being attacked by another animal, Lightleap probably would have said something because she isn't stupid, if it's seemingly just the predator attacking him then she'd tell others "be careful by RiverClan's border, I saw a dog/badger/whatever on their side" since y'know, that animal likely doesn't care for borders and could easily attack ShadowClan if it wanted to and she does seem to care for her home and clanmates. It had to be a betrayal she witnessed for her to not say anything and the totally-not-badger wounds to add up, unless it was somehow not *Reedwhisker's* death she witnessed.
I also feel like that's the case
And regarding her wound, she was either hurt into silence if there were still other cats, or of she ran from the scene and did get caught in a thorn
@imaginary living body or maybe she thought Reed crossed into their territory and attacked thinking "ohh look at me I'm so brave going after a deputy." And then that's when he got hurt; unable to properly defend himself from something else. He seemed to bemoan his death in StarClan.
Frostpaw with StarClan is like the meme of the nerdy dude gesturing to a butterfly and she's saying "Is this Willowshine?"
I love that the mystery is more interesting with Riverclans complete lack of character development so we have no ideas, makes it harder to guess what’s going on unlike the last couple ‘mystery’ plots 😂
Honestly (having not read any of the books since the dawn of the clans series) I'm suspicious of Shimmerpelt. Based on the premise that Mistystar was not intended to die, her sucking up to Mistystar so much in the fight could've been a ploy to get in Mistystar's good graces and thereby increase her chances of being made deputy. The leader's son is a tough act to follow but it seems Misty isn't above nepotism soooo
shimmerpelt might not be the most likely option but it is the most funny
Icewing should be leader! I know she’s old, but she’s had roles in OoTS, AVoS and TBC (Dark Forest trainee, Kin prisoner, Exilee for fighting with the rebels). While she’s likely the oldest warrior in RiverClan (Duskfur being her only competitor in age), but she still seems like a good leader. She was stated to be friendly by Ivypool, and seems to be brave and thoughtful (like when she warned a few of the Dark Forest trainees to keep quiet and do exactly as the df leaders say if they want to return to their clans, then lying to Mapleshade when she gets suspicious, or reassuring Shadowsight about his role with Ashfur and that Shadowsight was a good cat. She even warned him about dying in the Dark Forest, since she lost her son, Beetlewhisker there.) Icewing does seem to hold grudges sometimes (Rowanstar for letting Darktail take over ShadowClan, then RiverClan, and when Mistystar exiled her and Harelight, she seemed a bit bitter and declared herself ShadowClan.)
Spoilers for Sky excerpt: Splashtail I believe states Icewing is the best cat at leading patrols in the clan, and was surprised when she didnt step up. It can be inferred she already has leadership experience, and is very good at it. Leading a patrol might not be leading a clan, but she already knows how to lead very well
I dunno, I just really like Icewing lol, and I always imagined that she was best friends with Minnowtail
Edit: Spelling
Icestar when?
ohhhh you’re so right!!! I didn’t even remember she was one of the ones exiled from riverclan. now i’m really hoping the arc ends up with her being leader, that would really fit
Icewing and Duskfur are sisters, their parents were Reedtail and Skyheart. Their other sister was Pinefur.
@@injunghugh9617 According to Su Susan, yes, but it was never stated in canon. And that makes Jayclaw and Curlfeather related, but I guess everyone’s related anyways. Personally, unless it’s stated in a book or maybe an author, I dont see it as canon
But hear me out- Sneezestar.
IIRC, when being chased by the dogs Frostpaw mentions something like "smelling fresh-kill on their breath," so them being led to where she and Curlfeather were going to be a la Tigerstar seems to hold water.
its so amazing how much riverclan just isnt involed
I blame it on the lake territory structure lol
That makes this whole concept really funny, the idea that just on the other end of the lake RiverClan had a weird conspiracy plot brewing that just went entirely under the radar from everyone else.
Omg when you said ‘Curlfeather’ I LEGIT THOUGHT YOU SAID CROWFEATHER- and I was HEAVILY concerned.
SAME LOL
does she not say crowfeather. I've listened to it multiple times and i keep hearing crowfeather.
Once in another video she said “breezepelt came out of crow feather”
Hmmmmmm
@@matsu8518 It’s Curlfeather- 🥲
I felt that when I was listening to audiobooks
I would LOVE the idea of Frostpaw just struggling to be a normal medicine cat, with nobody to turn to because of Mothwing's lack of religious faith and being put under pressure to help the Clan during a horrendous time of need. Her also being used by cats, especially her mother, would also be amazing.
I’m still convinced Lightleap and Reedwhisker had a confrontation. The focus on twolegs near Riverclan territory makes me think Reedwhisker was chased by humans over the Shadowclan border, ran into Lightleap, and then ended up in a scuffle that gave him a small wound that was deep enough to make him vulnerable to whoever killed him. Either that or Lightleap actually fought Reedwhisker’s killer unintentionally, after they stepped over the Shadowclan border to keep their trail away from the crime scene.
frostpaw trying to call starclan and the moment she mentions riverclan they hang up
My kit is having prophecies because he's thinking about fish.
Moonkitti:[mentions boxers likely killing Curlfeather]
Me:[looks at my two boxers]….so…you boys catch anything interesting today?
Lol
😹😹😹
the law and order “DUH DUH” played in my head after i read that 😂
ACTualLLY, Mistystar was murdered by the ghost of Firestar with a blow dart. Boom.
my immediate thought was that she has a weird sort of goosefeather powers where she has visions/can predict things relating to death. having a "vision" of her father's death. being told where reedwhisker's body was. having a dream of _thousands of curled feathers_ at the moonpool, where her mother died... i think your interpretation of her family framing her to become a medicine cat is very probable, though! it'd be nice for mothwing to finally have someone to connect with in a way.
Mistystar knows the best way to win an argument
L + ratio + pelt name + I'm leader + *dies*
I like how one of the auto generated chapters is titled, “ what is going on here “. Same youtube, same.
I think Frostpaw not having a special connection required to be a medicine cat would be the best way to take this route, cos like you said, we've already had sooo many extra-special med cat stories
God Splashtail is probably it. Like how perfect for Frostpaw to get a crush on him and then they can have some contrived plot about how she feels Betrayed, and then maybe that compels her to return to being a medicine cat or something.
This fandom would not be able to handle a cat named Sneezecloud being deputy.
Icewing - "not a dragon" made me laugh
I really don't think someone is out there CONTROLLING the dogs. I think it was more like Tigerclawstar; not DIRECTING the dogs, but leading the dogs. I think what the suspish cats did was like a relay race, leading the dogs RIGHT to Frost and Curl. They KNEW what was going on, they KNEW if they wanted to get rid of Curlfeather right away, before she got her nine lives. Curlstar sounds like such a pretty name tbh.
(SPOILERS FOR THUNDER)
You were right Moon. Every word. It was Splashtail, it was Curlfeather, and you were right. You should be quite proud of yourself :)
I think that there’s a anti code change group in riverclan (wether or not they’re connected to shadowclan is unclear). Curlfeather and Podlight are two of them and they had come up with a plan to lure Reedwhisker into a pack of dogs, knowing there was a ravine nearby to hide the body. They then set a trap Tigerstar I style. Reedwhisker was attacked and fell in the ravine trying to escape of the dogs. The patrol returned to camp and pretended that he got lost. Mistystar’s death was unintentional, and they were planning to get someone in the group into the deputy position to wait until she dies. When finding Reedwhisker’s body, Curlfeather covers up the scratches as him falling to hide that it was dogs. The curled feather was planted by Splashtail, who they roped into the group. The curled feather dream seem by Frostpaw also wasn’t from StarClan, and was just a coincidence. The dogs on the way to the moonpool were the same that killed Reedwhisker, but this time they had just wandered there. Curlfeather thinking she was double-crossed tells Frostpaw to “trust no cat”. Lightleap also isn’t involved in this, and was just wrong place wrong time. She saw Reedwhisker be lurked into the dogs and was threatened to keep her quiet.
I also feel like the Erin’s are setting up Splashtail as leader even though he’s really under qualified. The guy’s just everywhere. He was telling Frostpaw that the most obvious choice is the right one, which leads me to believe someone who isn’t super experienced is going to be leader.
Honestly I'd LOVE to see an underqualified cat chosen as leader. Just to see how they handle it. Splashtail seems to be the one best handling this situation for what it's worth. I didn't really like him in River, but in Sky he seems to be a bit better. This could completely be a ploy though; it reminds me of Mickey from Scream 2; constantly comforting Sidney, when SURPRISE MF he was a killer.
@@TheRibottoStudios how have you read Sky?? It’s not out for another month.
@@sinwolfe4868 The preview is up on the site. Splashtail seems to have done a total 180 personality wise.
@@TheRibottoStudios site?
Sneezestar lets GOOOOO
I do like the idea she senses death coming. Maybe a goosefeather type situation? idk though. I do like the thought the dogs are being controlled in some capacity. Also Shimmerpelt is one of my favorite characters. Theres zero good reason for this. So I'd be glad if she suddenly was wild big bad in some way lol
I hear that and I remember my old Dark Forest OC who was a med cat who could see how kits were gonna die, and if it were deemed too painful he'd just poison 'em. He felt remorse every part of it, and didn't even get a full name before he was killed by his mentor.
I'm personally rooting for Podstar myself (even if it isn't possible at all. funny name supremacy, ok)
Mistystar's cause of death: Spontaneous combustion
This is what sets Warriors and WoF apart in my mind. Warriors tries to do mysteries but they’re never satisfying, theres rarely enough evidence to come to a satisfying conclusion and even in retrospect it’s hard to connect the dots.
(Spoilers for wings of fire the brightest night)
While in Wings of Fire not only are the mysteries satisfying and interesting, they in many cases are solvable. For instance since I was a little art nerd back when I read the books I’d spend a lot of time looking at the covers and designs inside. And so by looking at the cover of the brightest night and comparing Sunny to the ordinary tribe designs I was able to figure out she was a nightwing sandwing hybrid before the book explained that. It rewards attentive readers and even if you don’t put much thought into it the answers are always deeply foreshadowed and connected to the story.
ok i know you drew up mitzi, the dogmonger as a joke but i legitimitly love that character concept?? it's so silly and ridiculous it becomes funny i want more Mitzi content out there
If they don’t reveal who is the culprit in Sky or Shadow, I am fairly certain that when it is revealed and if it’s not some random outsider that wasn’t mentioned in River, it’ll be a character that it would make absolutely no sense to be them because the plot team hadn’t actually figured out who the culprit was when they came up with the idea of someone being behind Reedwhisker and Curlfeather’s deaths and decided to go with a random character as a ‘surprise twist’.
River clan has the cutest cat names 🤭
I really *really* like the shape language you employed for each cat. They all look amazing
I wonder if Frostpaw noting she is looking older and more frail then usual could be a clue that maybe Riverclan had been avoiding maintaining her or maybe subtly poisoning her for sometime. TBC and AVOS don’t really mention her looking terrible (AFAIK), so her suddenly doing terribly is a bit out of place
I assumed it was just a Warrior Cats Writing moment.
You'd be surprised how fast cats can go downhill, especially older cats. My cat is 20, and he's only just recently started to show his age and have health problems.
Mistystar is so old. (I assume were talking about mistystar) she was a warrior (maybe even senior?) BEFORE Firestar joined thunderclan, and he died forever ago. I'm sure it's just her age finally catching up to her.
@@Kaytoun Exactly, plus sometimes a cat will go from old but fine to a week later messy fur and about to croak as if they'd been in poor condition for years..when a cats time is up they often stop caring for themselves and just look really bad, there's even a small saying(ish) that I once heard about it something like "once a cat shows signs of something wrong it may be too late".
She was around 30 years I think
As much as I like the idea of a proper murder mystery in warriors, I don't have a lot of confidence in the planting and payoff to make it satisfying. I almost wonder if Lightleap is a double-fakeout (as in, she is not the killer, but a potential witness or unintentional accomplice to give the perpetrators plausible deniability). There's also a possibility the dogs were called in to cover up a different cause of death (even if it seems like a pointless extra step, it might open up other possibilities for involved parties with fewer resources/skills. Like poisoning and Reedwhisker recognizing his killer before succumbing, or fighting another cat and having the scratches obfuscated by a post-mortem dog attack or something. Probably not, but it would be cool to build a case that allows the writers to divulge contradictory information without spoiling the surprise. I ought to check the passages to see if there's significant reference to how bloody the wounds are, as if the wounds were inflicted after the crime they wouldn't bleed as much. Probably overthinking things. But Its Cool.)
this aged so good dude
I had a dream where Sunbeam's mom (Berryheart?) had a cult and since they were against the clan code changing, made a plan to eliminate the clan leaders and putting their cats at power lol
Berryheart is definitely suspicious, with her being against the code changes AND being xenophobic. It would be awesome for more clan leaders to die (like Tigerheart-star). But if they kill off the deputy as well that would mean Clovertail would be killed too, unless they're involved somehow.
Watch this be the plot fr
I mean Tigerstar does have kits that she could threaten and have him give his lives…
Finding this comment after reading Sky is... certainly interesting. XD
I imagined the pack of dogs being Plott Hounds. hunting dogs with high prey drive, (almost) always brindle with roots in europe. it would make sense for a person living in a rural area who owns hunting dogs to own several of them
edit: I forgot how common Cane Corsos are in Europe, it could easily be them too
Also a good guess..!
This is warriors, doubt they even know those breeds, probably be something generic
"Plot" hounds, more like
@@EllesGhost13 well im pretty sure they should no that breed they made a seires about dogs after all
@@dearvalerie they made a series about cats that has a million flaws, i wouldn't bet on it
Mapleshade is finally taking revenge on the rest of Appledusk family
WAIT WAIT WAIT. FROSTPAW FINDS A LEAD STAR IN HER BEST. A LEAF STAR .LEAFSTAR. AND THE NEXT BOOK IS CALLED SKY
OMG that's so cool, I didn't notice that!
I really think Splashtail is sus. When Frostpaw became a warrior apprentice he starts to act strange. Since we know that Splashtail is already meeting behind Icewing’s back (him meeting with Berryheart) it could be a possibility that he becomes evil. Also, I bet Frostpaw is going to become a medicne cat apprentice again, but I think that’s pretty obvious.
I think lightleap SAW something. And I think it's very possible that berryheart or someone has dirt on lightleap keeping her quiet. Maybe lightleap suspects sunbeam is involved which is adding to the relationship drama.
my current working hypothesis is that duskfur set this whole thing up with podlight, curlfeather, and splashtail involved in order to make curlfeather deputy but one of the people in the group (podlight? he seemed like he wanted to be leader) double crossed them. if duskfur knew about the dogs that killed curlfeather but was involved in reedwhisker's death she cant exactly go "oh it has to be one of the cats working with me that lead the dogs here, i know because i did that to kill reedwhisker" because that would. cause a whole host of issues.
(also my bets are on icewing eventually becoming riverclans next leader because she's the only warrior aside from mallownose who had an established character before this arc and she has just been estbalished in the sky preview as good at leading patrols. flimsy evidence but i can dream)
Sneezestar for leader. I don’t care that there’s no evidence indicating it, I just desperately need a mention of ‘Sneezestar’ in canon.
SPOILERS!!
Splashtail is hinted at being involved in the murder of Reedwhisker. He is afraid when Frostpaw has a vision about Reedwhisker being murdered. But he didn't do this alone. Berryheart and Duskfur are also involved. I can't think of a reason for Berryheart to be involved other than her wanting Tigerheartstar out of RiverClan. But I DO think that Duskfur wanted to be leader, asked Splashtail to kill Reedwhisker with the promise of being her deputy, but when her daughter dies she loses ambition, causing Splashtail to want to be leader instead. Maybe. Unless Icewing happens to be evil, I think that this (might?) be likely.
So, Moonkitti, you asked for a comment with more info, I'm giving you one! (This is it)
I don't think Berryheart knows what they did.
I think this is a situation someone similar to the thing yellowfang had that was only ever mentioned in her super edition. She could feel other cats pain, which is both really good for a med cat and also the worst thing ever. She had no actual previously established relationship with starclan prior to figuring out she had that power. And yet, she became a med cat and got starclan dreams and visions. In Frostpaw's case tho, I'm pretty sure she's getting the death premonitions and also now starclan dreams. Her issue is she has no idea how to separate which dreams are which, or even what's a regular dream and what's a vision. I also think the curled feather she found was likely planted by the group in riverclan that's very against the code changes to get a leader in charge that agreed with them. That's why it's hard to figure out one cat that's responsible. I really think this was a group effort in a well thought out plan that hit the fan the second Mistystar died before they got the deputy they wanted lined up. Like Splashtail now taking a big interest in Frostpaw immediately after it's revealed that she has the whole clan in her paws. Frost's feather dream afterwards wasn't actually a confirmation, it was a death premonition. Curl dies on that trip to the moonpool (which technically means Frost got her killed, so maybe some angst in the future). Curlfeather probably thought it was a betrayal from her anti-code changing buddies that got Reedwhisker killed to get *her* then killed, hence her "trust no one" final words. I think the dreams she has that are incredibly cryptic are coming from wherever she's getting the death premonition stuff/her misinterpreting regular dreams . And the straight forward stuff is starclan communicating.
I think the idea that Lighleap was hinted to being there when reed died is meant to be a red herring. She didn't kill him, but she definitely saw the cat that murdered him. It would play up her cowardice arc. She's doing stupid things to pretend she's brave only when it's herself that's in danger. This is something that could massively affect all of shadowclan if she made the accusation and is so so much more serious then climbing really high in a tree. Her second chance to possibly redeem herself to her clan, if she ever gets the courage to go through with it. (Man, why is Sunbeam a main character POV. Even having Blaze could have been so much better)
Meanwhile, Flamepaw is angrily crying in the rain somewhere because no one loves him.
edit: grammar
I have a fun theory that the Leopardstar that Frostpaw saw isn't actually Leopardstar, but *Frecklewish* (as in the Thunderclan one, not the Skyclan one). I feel like most morally grey cats are up in the air as to who got in to Starclan or not, but they were SO adamant about Frecklewish being in kitty cat hell. I don't think she's evil at all, I think it's actually the opposite. I think maybe Freckle saw what was going on in Riverclan and saw that the medcat apprentice was struggling, so she put herself in Frostpaw's dreams to try to help, perhaps in a desperate attempt for post-death redemption despite what was said in ALITM.
Maybe, but I feel like the only cat who's still kicking in the afterlife from the time frecklewish was alive (I bet you anything, even if dead cats remembering each other works, nobody remembers anybody from that time other than stories passed down, which after like 20+ years and countless generations aren't reliable) would be Mapleshade herself, maybe oakstar if we're feeling generous. I haven't read the new books since avos and I know this theory is just for fun, but there's definitely a chance you're right with the attention she's been getting lately.
I'm really glad you mentioned how close Curl and Crow were because I haven't read the books in forever and was genuinely confused 😭❤
I haven't read the latest two arcs and trying to avoid spoilers is whatever the opposite of a needle in a haystack is.
A haystack in a needle?
I think the murderer is Splashtail
Loving the new art style! Keep up the good work, Moon!
"So if you have pelt in your name and you live in RiverClan, chances are you fought with Mistystar" I was DYING
This could be like the Bravelands mystery with the death of the crown leaf. And it turns out to be the most supportive character in the story. That's why I think Jayclaw did it.
Yea I read the book and I was surprised it was his friend (I forgot his name).
i like River Clan its cool that we finally have an protagonist from there and the Chapters with Frostpaw were really interesting in my option i cant wait to read more about her in the next books
wow i sure love the water cats they sure are unique and payed attention to
I love this whole video but honestly I'm just happy to hear someone else mention Tailchasher's Song!! I love that book so much!! Thanks Moonkitti!!
Whats it about? I’ve been considering reading it ^_^
@@Leafy_ It's about this young tom named Tailchaser trying to find out what happened to his friend after she and a couple other cats disappear. He's joined by a kitten and much later another male and female cat and they eventually find the source of the disappearances. It kind of like a precursor to Warriors but also Watership Down in the sense that there are stories and a whole language to learn about the world. It can be a bit dense, but I think it's worth the read.
I honestly believe Lightleap could be involved in Reedwhisker's death. Ever since she decided not to go to The Dark Forest in the last arch, she's felt the need to prove to everyone, including herself, that she's not a coward. I think it would be really easy for someone in RiverClan to use that to their advantage to get Lightleap to do their dirty work of getting rid of Reedwhisker so if Reedwhisker's death did ever come out as foul play, Lightleap would be blamed and the RiverClan cat would get off scott-free and possibly obtain the level of power they were hoping for. This is just my headcannon but I think it would be interesting!
Imagine it ends up as some sort of Final Destination situation where she sees visions of people before they’re gonna die
0:50 thank you for not drawing something that seems like it's from DDLC, I get anxious whenever I see that kind of stuff. 🧡:)
Mistystar is dead?!
Geez, now both immortal monarchs have died 😬
TRUEE
Unrelated to the murder mystery video but i’m glad podlight has become relevant again. Bit of reoccuring stuff from mistystar’s omen where podkit looked up to mistystar. Probably not intentional and just a coincidence but its nice to see.
Glad podlight, my favourite background cat, finally is getting some attention.
I wonder if Curlfeather lead the dogs to her specifically to kill off evidence of her killing Reedwhisker In any way. (EDIT) Or maybe she knew that the dogs were in that specific place for some reason- and put the signs there in order to 1, make it seem more like her daughter was special, so people would keep listening to her, and 2, give her a reason to go to the moon pool, where the dogs were waiting for her.
OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH murder SUICIDE?! That would be goooooooooooood. Dark for warriors, but goooooood.
I like the idea of a cat telling the dogs to attack Curlfeather, especially after we learn cats can talk to dogs from Millie.
I have this one theory that Mosspelt is the new oldest cat in Warriors. She might've even been older than Mistystar. But she definetly is the new oldest cat. I love how they're all RiVeRcLaN cAtS (the Erins forget RiverClan exist...)
When I started reading the book, I started out thinking it was just bad luck, started thinking it might be a mystery, but then realized I'd probably enjoy the book more if I just kept assuming it was just really bad luck until proven otherwise.
Very glad that the mystery isn't painfully obvious. The Broken Code was great but we knew it was Ashfur long before the reveal. This is interesting.
Also that is a top tier Owlnose design!
Really good refresher on everything thats happened with RC! I like the idea that Lightleap witnessed the killing of Reedwhisker, but keeps quiet out of fear of threats from the murderer. (I imagine if lightleap were found out to have witnessed Reedwhisker, another clans deputy be attacked and killed by a treacherous clanmate and done nothing about it, she could be in big trouble) It could match up nicely with the character arc set up for her by TBC, that she's a bit of a coward and self-serving, but not a bad person. If this is the case, her deciding to put aside her cowardice and actually help the protagonists defeat the bad guy would be good pay off from the set up from ALitM!
I’d love it SO MUCH if they mixed things up and made Mothwing leader
speaking of that, i was just wondering what would happen if she was made leader. would she get nine lives or not? we know she believes in starclan which must mean that its a possibility, but she has no faith which means that getting no extra lives is also a possibility. AND we also know that starclan can show up to anyone, even those who have no connection to starclan like mothwing, as shown in the last hope and the broken code, but what about in dreams?? kinda confusing tbh
@@JustAcrylicArts Honestly, it’s a mystery to me as well, I feel it could go either way. They either just don’t give her extra lives cause she has no faith which leaves her vulnerable, maybe they have another cat in mind for leadership somehow or starclam do give her extra lives for their own intentions and just so she can help protect her clan. I love to think about how it would go if this was a possibility for Mothwing
@@Tillnorth mhm.
That would be incredible actually. I've never been a massive Mothwing stan but I think that has some awesome potential and that Mothwing would be a really interesting leader. I feel like they'd go the Nightstar route though and not give her any lives...
@@yawninglion1677 yeah. but i also feel that they would give her lives and i realy hope they would
I like how the text varies from a paragraph to just “old”
Maybe Curlfeather and some other cats were involved in Reedwhisker’s death, and they were planning to take over Riverclan. But when Mistystar died Curlfeather took the opportunity to become leader via her daughter, and one of the other cats in the plan wanted to be leader instead, so they baited they baited the dogs to attack Curlfeather and Frostpaw. Perhaps they were hoping Frostpaw would die, as they knew Mothwing has no connection to StarClan and by eliminating Frostpaw, who they think has a connection with StarClan, they’re hoping to fake a sign to make themselves leader with no opposition.
Or maybe StarClan killed Curlfeather themselves. If they didn’t give Curlfeather nine lives when she came to the Moonpool they would’ve looked like liars in Riverclan’s eyes and would have lost connection with them, so they had to kill her instead. Idk why they would put Frostpaw in so much danger thoug, perhaps they want her dead too? For some reason.
im very curious about what splash’s motivations are. it would be interesting to see a different incentive than just “i want power” and “i want to be leader”
i saw someone else comment this so i just want to clarify the next thing im about to say isnt an original idea:
i really like the idea that curlfeather is working with berryheart behind the scenes. it also seems very possible that curl or berry were instructing splash to do all the things he did. however, again, the motivations are confusing.
(now to my own ideas!) going with the fact he’s a baby, since he’s so young that would make him pretty impressionable, especially if he holds a few of the same ideas as them. if he respects or agrees with the person giving him orders, he may do them without question.
theres also a chance maybe berry is also only a pawn for a greater king. there could be someone even higher up that chain.
im overall just very interested in what will happen in the next books :)
Definitely seems like a plot where Curlfeather was setting up some of the cats around her (and or maybe herself?) to be inducted in a position of power through the signs, claims of future visions Frostpaw had and the murder or Reedwhisker. Past that though it's really hard to say who else is definitely involved and we'll need to wait at least until the next book to have any solid guesses.
Considering Brambleclaw and Crookedstar were made deputy based off signs, I feel if it was a sign they thought mistystar would be pushed enough to make someone without an apprentice deputy, like Firestar did with Brambleclaw.
My theory for this series will be:
We already know the books are gonna be like River, Sky, Thunder, Shadow (?), Wind (?), and Star, but my theory for the actual plot is that the groups of cats that don't like the changes to the code will split off and join together to try and revert the code. This group would 100% include Berryheart as the main proprietor of it all. Also it says that Tigerstar clone #2/Bramblestar is traumatized by his experience in the DF, so maybe he'll be the first leader to retire? Like maybe Squilf retires then he retires to be with her? (But we all know Bramble's doing it to be with the Patrol Guy Thornclaw.)
Additionally, Curlfeather could have been part of the #BringBackTheCode gang and she and the others on that patrol planned to dispose of Reedwhisker and create a fake sign saying that Curlfeather would be the next deputy, basically automatically making her leader because Mistystar was so old, but Mistystar died before they were ready for her to. I think that Curlfeather genuinely cares about Frostpaw, and that the dog attack was unplanned. (Or maybe another member of the group baited them there)
I love how all these accusations are being thrown at StarClan, entirely because they aren't being insufferably vague like usual
This might also be wishful thinking, but I'm curious if the amount of medicine cats with no spiritual insight right now is intentional? I'm always curious how the writers respond to fan backlash, and there was so much spesifically against starclan after the last arc. I wonder if this is almost by design to slowly ease the amount of influence and presense starclan has in the regular stories, by removing cats with connections to them.
I’m a simple person. I see Moonkitti content, I ✨click✨
Idk but I imagine that Mistystar died from a stroke from high blood pressure. She’s an old cat, so like elderly people, she may be just as vulnerable to conditions that some middle aged people may not struggle with, despite living longer than others
Riverclan in nutshell: s u s .
Emergency meeting
SPOILERS! :)
Turns out it was Splashtail and Curlfeather 🫢 Tbh I didn’t actually expect Curlfeather-
I've suspected that forever
Okay so I'm gonna start by saying I havent read this book yet. I havent read any Warriors book since New Prophecy. But after watching this video (because i like to keep up with Warriors news) here is my theory, which is 100% wrong because, again, im only going off this video:
This was supposed to be a coup attempt. Cats who were against the code changes made a plan to instill a new deputy to take over after Mistystar eventually dies (and they did not plan for her to die so soon.)
Curlfeather was in on it. Since she tried to redirect the badger claws comment. She was chosen by the group to become the new deputy in their plan. She instilled her daughter as medcat apprentice, thinking her visions may help Curlfeather into becoming chosen as deputy. Everyone on the patrol with Reedwhisker were in on it. Splashtail was in on it. He placed the feather as part of the plan.
But! Curlfeather was double crossed. And someone else wants to be leader instead. Or plans changed or something. I dont know if they controlled the dogs specifically, or if they just lead dogs there and let whatever happens happen.
And that's why Curlfeather said "dont trust anyone". She knows other cats were in on the Reedwisker murder. She knows other cats had planned that coup. And now she knows someone just betrayed her too. And she wants her daughter safe.
I think Lightleap is a red herring and not involved at all or if she is, its very minimally. I think Duskfur could be involved. I wouldn't put it past the writers saying she's just a really good actor. Or maybe its complex! She killed Curlfeather but she was really sad to do it! And just a "sacrifices must be made for the good of the clan" type thing.
I wouldnt put it past the writers to forget the deputy-apprentice rule. Especially since (I think?) its not a set in stone warrior code rule and is just a tradition thing.
To be perfectly honest, scourges cousins half-sister dads brothers uncle is a dog/cat hybrid that made the dark forest and wants to take over river clan because they like water….oh and fire star came back to life for 9+ books
That thumbnail is hilarious
Your Art style is so cute I don't know any words to describe how cute it is 😭
Someone once said that all suspicious cats are related in this and it could be a Family-Murder-Plan, and honestly, I'm here for it.
I listened to these books as audiobooks, so I 100% thought Frostpaw's mom was also named Crowfeather.
Took me until the curled feathers signs at the moon pool to realize for sure that it wasn't her name
going back to 10:46 it would be a cool idea if Shimmerpelt was the one who organized Reedwhisker and/or Curlfeather's deaths, in a plot to become deputy after Reedwhisker was gone, and the whole time leading to Mistystars death sucking up to her to get the position of deputy. It would be cool to see a manipulative, power hungry she-cat.
Riverclan never made sense from the start. The other clans just hated them for eating fish or something.
i keep hearing Curlfeather as Crowfeather and getting confused
I’ve seen theories that the green eyed cat is Moth Flight trying to fuck shit up because of the code changes. I think that’d be really funny i think they should do that.
I don’t think it’s entirely impossible that Mistystar was killed on purpose, myself. I think its not a stretch to say that they riled her up on purpose. I won’t really be surprised either way.
Splashtail looking awfully suspicious in the books