For reference: Book I - 0:35 Book II - 42:00 Book III - 1:16:27 Book IV - 1:32:30 Book V - 1:58:30 Book VI - 2:33:20 Book VII - 3:04:59 Book VIII - 3:22:21 Book IX - 3:42:30 Book X - 4:27:40
Step 1: ask a metric ton of questions until the opponent gets completely lost Step 2: completely demolish their point and make them look like a troglodyte
This is awesome. My father gave this book to me read. When I was a little girl. He would ask me questions about what I had read each day. I have come to love logic and philosophy since then. It brought me closer to him. I miss those talks and debates. ❤
his assumptions no longer work. The doctor, he asks, is he a businessman or a healer? He says a healer of the sick! And then he makes more and more false assumptions. And the whole construct on which he built his empire falls apart if you don't accept just one of its many premises. In the past, the doctor may only have been paid when the patient got better. Today the doctor gets his money regardless of how the patient is doing. And the more people are worse off, the more he earns. A doctor meets the criteria of a businessman. [36:19]
@@genki2705 You are conflating the industry with an individual doctor. A doctor that consistently fails to treat people will be fired eventually, or struggle to keep any patients, and not be nearly as successful as doctors that treat people with success.
“Declining interest in physical pleasures is exactly matched by increasing desire for and enjoyment of conversation.”~Cephalus, father of Polymarchus~ chapter 1 in Plato’s Republic
@@aon02bAbsolutely correct! Also, the sentiment isn't true for everyone. I find that my desire for both has declined significantly; I have much more interesting things to occupy my time and attention.
Imagine someone casually dismantling a religion in ancient times when the existence of gods was as obvious as the fact that sun comes up in the morning.
@@saltydecimator I mean the he says that in a perfect city, you need people who govern ,police, craftsman etc. at some point some generations may question the city it's laws etc, thus you need to give them reason why they do what they're supposed to, and a reason why they can't go above their standing, stop them from sharing and intermingling so that you can control them easier etc. so that they don't cause chaos, uprisings (you can't have people who can't govern governing you see, nor can you have people who were raised to be just warriors bake bread while bakers protect the city). It is stated that, for example one might excuse some's reason for living (I mean work they do) by 'telling' them that there are different kinds of human (meant for different jobs ergo what they're suited foe best) and so a whole belief system to keep people in control is created (all people are made with clay but some are made with bronze, some with silver and some with gold particles). Basically religion to excuse claims to different positions in society, you know like mandate of heaven in China. I hope I explained more or less. Generally this is a perspective of a convicted atheist so please read, listen, interpret and analyse for youself.
I wish EVERY American-- nay every HUMAN BEING read and/or listen to Plato at this time. Turns out, Plato knew the pitfalls that we as various societies from around the world are falling directly into, such as "democracy."
I don't know how to listen to this. Since society has changed so much over the centuries, his statements are no longer valid. The doctor, he asks, is he a businessman or a healer? He says a healer of the sick! And then he makes more and more false assumptions. And the whole construct on which he built his empire falls apart if you don't accept just one of its many premises. In the past, the doctor may only have been paid when the patient got better. Today the doctor gets his money regardless of how the patient is doing. And the more people are worse off, the more he earns. A doctor meets the criteria of a businessman. [36:19]
@@genki2705 philosophy: the love of wisdom, normally encapsulated within a formal academic discipline. Wisdom is the soundness of an action or decision with regard to the application of experience, knowledge, insight, and good judgment. Wisdom may also be described as the body of knowledge and principles that develops within a specified society or period. E.g. “The wisdom of the Tibetan lamas.” Unfortunately, in most cases in which this term is used, particularly outside India, it tacitly or implicitly refers to ideas and ideologies that are quite far-removed from genuine wisdom. For instance, the typical academic philosopher, especially in the Western tradition, is not a lover of actual wisdom, but a believer in, or at least a practitioner of, adharma, which is the ANTITHESIS of genuine wisdom. Many Western academic (so-called) “philosophers” are notorious for using laborious sophistry, abstruse semantics, gobbledygook, and pseudo-intellectual word-play, in an attempt to justify their blatantly-immoral ideologies and practices, and in many cases, fooling the ignorant layman into accepting the most horrendous crimes as not only normal and natural, but holy and righteous! An ideal philosopher, on the other hand, is one who is sufficiently intelligent to understand that morality is, of necessity, based on the law of non-violence (“ahiṃsā”, in Sanskrit), and sufficiently wise to live his or her life in such a harmless manner. Cf. “dharma”. One of the greatest misconceptions of modern times is the belief that philosophers (and psychologists, especially) are, effectively, the substitutes for the priesthood of old. It is perhaps understandable that this misconception has taken place, because the typical priest/monk/rabbi/mullah seems to be an uneducated buffoon compared with those highly-educated gentlemen who have attained doctorates in philosophy, psychology and psychiatry. However, as mentioned in more than a few places in this book, it is imperative to understand that only an infinitesimal percentage of all those who claim to be spiritual teachers are ACTUAL “brāhmaṇa” (as defined in Chapter 20). Therefore, the wisest philosophers of the present age are still those exceptionally rare members of the Holy Priesthood! At the very moment these words of mine are being typed on my laptop computer, there are probably hundreds of essay papers, as well as books and articles, being composed by professional philosophers and theologians, both within and without academia. None of these papers, and almost none of the papers written in the past, will have any noticeable impact on human society, at least not in the realm of morals and ethics, which is obviously the most vital component of civilization. And, as mentioned in a previous paragraph, since such “lovers-of-wisdom” are almost exclusively adharmic (irreligious and corrupt) it is indeed FORTUITOUS that this is the case. The only (so-called) philosophers who seem to have any perceptible influence in the public arena are “pop” or “armchair” philosophers, such as Mrs. Alisa “Alice” O’Connor (known more popularly by her pen name, Ayn Rand), almost definitely due to the fact that they have published well-liked books and/or promulgate their ideas in the mass media, especially on the World Wide Web.
Some missing - will amend after exams are over, no time right now. Book II starts at 42:00 Book III starts at 1:16:27 Book IV starts at 1:32:30 Book V starts at 1:58:30 Book VII starts at 3:04:59 Book VIII starts at 3:22:21
They are courteous, that is why they always reply when questioned. People put high standard in conversation. It was important to them because sitting around a fire and talking happened a lot😂😂
Diving into 'The Republic' by Plato through this audiobook is a captivating journey through timeless philosophical concepts. Highly recommend for anyone intrigued by deep discussions on justice, reality, and the ideal state.
I try to recommend this books to my friends/family as an intro to philosophy, but when they hear the word "philosophy" they automatically think its some overcomplicated outdated writings that don't interest them. When in reality its the most fluid and intriguing dialogues, as if you are sitting at a table conversing with friends. They'll rather watch TikTok or Netflix.
That’s really unfortunate, hopefully one day they’ll have a change of heart. I’ve recently gained interest in philosophy so this is my first philosophical text (well, audiobook lol). I’m likely to finish it by the end of this week so if you have any recommendations I’d be glad to try them out!
Pythagoras is my favorite so far. Abstract ideas he defined, definitions he made abstract, mathematical shapes he refined from chaos, and the way he saw the human spirit and willpower enacted in the world around him is just mesmerizing.
@@xariafrank9442 My life is dedicated to philosophy and I have read hundreds of philosophers and the very best one is William Walker Atkinson. Aside from him I can recommend many other depending on your goals and interests and how well-rounded you want to be but if you simply started with Atkinson and then branched out from there by studying anyone he namedrops (e.g. Schopenhauer) eventually you'll cover the whole western tradition and the eastern traditions too.
@@FringeWizard2 woah dont see Atkinson mentioned often. His work under his Ramacharaka pseudonym changed my life. His book on Raja Yoga is particularly good.
Notice that in the beginning, Socrates is forced to stay. His friends insist that he stay and converse with them; he did not force people to listen to him, nor did he write a political treatise claiming to be all-knowing and always correct in his pronouncements. He never wrote anything in his life; he mainly asked questions and followed a thought to its logical conclusions. His earlier dialogues all ended in failures to define what he sought to discover: the nature of friendship, temperance, courage, etc. His student, Plato, wrote Socrates' dialogues. At the end of the "Republic," Socrates says the type of city-state the discussion arrived at resides only in heaven; it will never be realized on earth. People will probably never elect a philosopher-king in the Platonic mode. A Platonic philosopher-king is an ideal, like Jesus. He is no more a dictator than is a wise and loving parent; he always wants what is best for his citizens, a Greek word, by the way. Like an excellent medical doctor: he diagnoses the problem, realizes the nature of his patient, and prescribes the proper medicine. He has only the patient's best interests in mind. He is not seeking money, power, or fame for himself. He acts wisely, appropriately, and lovingly. Socrates: "I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only make them think." [The first time I read the "Republic," I was disgusted. But after several college courses in Platonic philosophy, I realized that Plato writes in such a fashion that grabs the reader and forces him to wrestle with these problems. Plato shows the reader, among other things, that trying to institute a utopia leads to drastic measures, at least by modern standards, like group ownership of the Guardians' children, not everyone's children, just the Guardians'. Plato knew that if the generals had children, they would be sorely tempted to start a dynasty with his sons in charge, sons who may well be incompetent and vicious.]
you have , well the most logical coversation that I have read . My gut tells me that socrates was always searching for what he knew was true. WE...are WE.. YOU are YOU.. though he asks the question to the persons that it applies to them, in the way that the person given the queastion would understand, to get the question anserwed even though he knows the anwer. the lesson is to see if people can find the anwer in themselves without being told. So let me ask you ..WHAT is justice, and how do you come up with that point of view. ? whats it you r parents that taught you who you are? did they tell you what is right and wrong? Or perhaps church and science? did they tell you whats right and wrong? Or perhaps its in you ? in us? in all people.. questions was it given ? or is it born in us in our souls? You have a brilliant mind , better than most I read on this subject. So my question stands to you ?
Jason Gartner Aristotle gives the best answer: Justice is the proper order of events. Or, doing the right thing at the right time at to the right person to the right degree in the right way. Of course, then one asks: What exactly is right? I think that right means that which is appropriate, helpful, wise, useful, and loving, although Aristotle never mentions love, as far as I know. Truth or the ability to recognize truth seems to reside somehow in our minds. When truth appears, our minds grasp it and instantly and completely know it for what it is. Nonetheless, we can, and often are, fooled by half-truths, lies, and propaganda. I don't know why or how we can be fooled, often so easily. Maybe it's because we see the partial truth in the propaganda and naively and wrongly accept the whole false communication. But these conclusions are merely my shaky conclusions. I could be totally wrong. Truth can withstand intense examination, so if we keep looking for it, we will, I hope, find more and more of it. All the best!
Alexander T - no it says in the beginning that the whole society tangent is just to make analogies for inner harmony. They start having a hard time talking directly about inner harmony, so they decide that zooming out might make the analysis fresher.
None of that is correct. The Republic is the pursuit of justice, broken out to 10 books. It wasn't a societal tangent, it's the damn thesis of Plato's Republic. They don't have a hard time talking about inner harmony than zoom out. You didn't read, or listen, to it, obviously. The discussion moves from political to personal justice, in that order: you literally got what takes place in the book in the wrong order. It's not a metaphor either, it's social political philosophy, primarily, with some addressing of personal justice, the individual. That's not a metaphor. In no way at all is Plato's Republic about society going wrong by pursuing justice. That is, literally, almost the exact opposite of Socrates' famous conclusion. Pathetic.
@@expatphotographer8745 yes your right but your right in practise only if people do agree with you and saing they are wrong or stupid [directly or indirectly] will offend them and will make them want to disagree with you as they feel atacked.You should noticd how socrates analises and discuses with people he is just making a person see the mistake in argument- by not offending them but by respectful and logical way off thingking. I hope this will help you in any way posible. Edit- gramar
Imagine a world where parliaments and congresses had discussions like this. Imagine a world where the ruling class were like Greek philosophers instead of scumbags.
The greeks and philoshers had qestoins that have no answer. But to ask another to get that answer. And they care for the young and old. To teach the right and wrong of these scoictys we have grown up in?
Imagine a world where the people looked up laws and grew their knowledge and then used that knowledge to live completely free… Some of us are already there, come join us. TheBigSib channel
The book opens with a beautiful metaphor about "passing the torch" to the young, which is immediately followed by a dialogue on what wisdom the old have discovered for themselves after a long life. Remember this: every single detail in a Platonic dialogue has significance, especially the ones that seem merely contextual, in the setting external to the discussion.
What I understood from this, is the sharing of thoughts of delightful perfection that begins in the mind maybe as close as we will ever get to a Utopia but it’s in the sharing and realisation of theses thoughts that will ultimately lead to an ever great world harmony.
I bought this huge book "The Works Of Plato" years ago, I read every single Work, every single page. About 800 pages total. I read it Two or three times in a ten year period. Every once in awhile, still a few pages here and there. So this Audio hits home for me, lots of good memories, good stuff, thanks for sharing.
This book was recommended for us to read by a college professor nearly 10 years ago. Can't believe it took me this long to finally read (or should I say listen to?) it.
fuck him, he didnt write any books, and was bulshiting about physical health, when he him self not even once had picked up a weight. Where on fhe other hand Plato is the real goat, he wrote many books, and respected greek traditions of physical training.
What group are you associated with? I’m American and I know for a fact there is no Socrates type of person to tell us. We just live like fools who have zero self discipline. No we have the tyrants who rule us and promote vice so they can profit from our addictions. How is an excellent society going to exist without self discipline? So we are turning into that useless mob that hates their rulers. And if you think democracy is real you are part of the problem. We have hereditary rule by some really rich evil people. 🙏🏻pray for their souls 🙏🏻
This whole book is read in the exact same intonation as the scene from quest for the holy grail where Sir Bedevere teaches the peasants how to find witches
Simple arguments, profound discovery of human nature in this discussion. I encourage all who listen to this, imagine you are at a dinner table with this group listening to and exporting your ideas and arguments with them, actually take part in the discussion.
It's hard for me to fathom that people had such profound conversations over 2000 years ago. Like I've paused/highlighted so many parts and sat there in shock haha
@@jameseldridge3445 I definitely agree, and it's even weirder for me to comprehend how we DONT have such deep intellectual conversations as the normal philosophy anymore. But yea, the fact that these daddies were doing this thousands of years ago is a trip. The discipline to pursue debates daily, to understand oneself and the world he inhabits and that surrounds him. We've lost touch. Hit me up to reconnect.
@@Sprite_525 true! I use this to get to sleep. If I really want to grasp this, I need to read it. So I can read a sentence and think about it. Maybe read it again.
Amazing isn't it. Glad we are a Republic with a Constitution and have the means to stop what's happening. Funny how Socialists always want citizens disarmed. Heh.
Yes. Thats why in Greek version they had to be very educated and solid charactered people who decide. Otherwise it always has a danger of Slipping to tyranny of majority. Hence the need for shadow Governments to prevent it.
Aristotle had some great insights on the cycles of liberty and tyranny. The West is currently reaching the latter part of the cycle, where stuff gets bad real quick.
Yes they are. I sent this to my son's (Twins in thier 20s) I gave them 3 questions with no real correct answer and told them. Whomever finishes thai first while answering them gets $50. Second gets $40.
This is Masters work; it should be compulsory for every American student. One needs to listen to this at least five times to truly activate and release the brillance...
Beautiful, and inspiring. And to think that this work was created so, so long ago. It only shows of course how little our world has really advanced towards real Justice.
Lots of wonderful questions, however their solutions towards creating a more perfect human system by robbing the people of their humanity is less than beautiful to me. I have very little trouble recognizing just how dated the philosophies are in this reading.
Real Philosophy does not become dated, because it is based on true premises (2000 years ago or today) and that is what it makes it valuable. Looking back, what seems "politically incorrect" or "inhuman" today, it is simply the exposure of long-known human traits inherent to those humans and our societies (no matter the era), the difference now is that it is becoming a taboo exposing these traits. You are right; trying to create a perfect society is in obvious contradiction with our time, because our system gets farther and farther away from being fair, and this obviously happens when nobody looks for Perfection nor Justice anymore than profit. Anyways, who says that Plato's words weren't just symbolical? After all did Socrates even exist? ;)
You make some good points there G.K. I suppose "out of fashion" would be a better way of saying it than "dated". Putting everyone in their place and deciding their futures for them towards the exclusive benefit of the state is a great system if you want to say build pyramids or establish an empire. Rigid systems can be very effective when under external pressure, and there is great peace of mind in being sure that all your players are in their places trained and ready. It is the casting itself that is so unpalatable to me. In this day and age I would prefer every willing individual to experience the arts, philosophy, labor, and conception at the expense of their performance towards given task and the peak performance of the whole. Of course there are not currently any barbarians camped outside town burning our fields and building siege equipment. If that were the case I would have to count on Plato's playbook.
Well, in my opinion, perhaps there are always some kind of "barbarians" threatening to eradicate our "world view" somehow, and that's why I find this idea of a highly organized (and self-sufficient) community so appealing, regardless of the sacrifice of an individual "liberty" (Democracy's Goddess). Nevertheless, I know it is impossible outside the realm of Ideas, the same way you should consider your beautiful "dream" of Arts, Philosophy and meaningful labor for the masses, because it is as utopic as mine... I guess we are just but a bunch of dreamers ;)
I only request for the opportunity to pursue these things despite one's natural disposition. Not so utopic in the way that it allows for failure and unexpected success. Where again the pyramids have stood for thousands of years and will stay there long after we are all gone, we have the technology to stand ours on its end (er top) and give everyone a better view. Where people once toiled in the fields tractors cruise along. Where thousands and millions waged bloody personal war, drones and long range engagements buffer an increasingly growing nugget of people. Giving them each the opportunity in some measure to find their own way. With no shortage of human beings in the foreseeable future and a shrinking need for there physical effort to produce the resources they consume. Together with an increase in their ability to access and acquire a diverse set of skills that the simpler steady system would never had required or perhaps even deemed a distraction. Should and I believe does enhance the effectiveness of the individual in the tasks they take unto themselves. And this in turn strengthens and pushes the people as a whole to greater heights.
Lol! It is truly amazing what people were able to accomplish when they didn't have television, radio, movies, video games, porn,etc etc, to distract them from actually using the brain they were born with, isn't it? 🤔🤔🙂
I think most people don't realise just how fuckin advanced both the greeks and romans were when it came to philosophy and statecraft. While yes these people were the educated scholars and nobles of the time, they are still a far cry from the stereotypical barbaric ancient man. I'd say we are more barbaric than they.
I’ve read this book alone and then taken a class on it. It’s the ultimate insight. You, have done the world a service by making this video in this form. Thank you.
"The ultimate insight."- What???!!! You actually agree with Socrates and his vision of created Utopia? FYI... Socrates is describing not a free Utopian Republic, but a dystopia of an enslaved citizenship, controlled, euthanized, and aborted by selective breeding, and decreed by the rule of a chosen elite aristocratic oligarchy, demanding forced agrarian labor to serve the State, by militaristic Socialism. How can you not hear it in this audio book, or not comprehend it from reading the book and your class???!!!
@@bfc2155 The retorts of an idiot, (you) hold no weight. I'm never surprised by uneducated trolls like you, who toss insults to the educated, while simultaneously clasping so proudly to your ignorance. Your insecurity is a YOU problem. I challenged the poster's stance on Plato's The Republic and their (obvious) lack of understanding to it as a whole... you take issue with that, because you don't understand it, or simple maths for that matter. You're the troll, not I. You're an idiot.
I had to re-listen many times certain sections to get it.. and pergaps lucky to get half of it .. Socrates was definitely a mega-genius - father of western thought.
all of this was really good and interesting, especially the part at the end talking about the afterlife and reincarnation, I didn't know the Greeks had those ideas
Absolutely fantastic narration, great rhythm and really feels like a conversation is taking place, easy to comprehend and even without following the text. And to answer some questions: yes it's complete, and the start times for each book are going to be different depending on your specific translation of the book.
Um...are you freaking kidding??? This edition is HEAVILY abridged. On what do you base the claim that it's complete, a hasty assumption that other people must be confused because they aren't smart enough to have your insight that the exact times can be affected by the version of the translation and the narration speed? Did it even occur to you to, maybe, actually check the text before misleading people with false assurances that they're hearing the whole thing? I read this book 30 years ago and I could easily tell that much of it was missing before I even reached the one hour mark. It's not even close to complete -- about half of the original work is omitted!
Step one: Look at the total views the video has. Step two: Look at the upload date. Step three: Take the current year and subtract the upload year. Step four: Divide the total views by the result. Step five: Stop posting comments asking if anyone is watching it in your current year.
Step five is extrapolate based on years/views how many people will watch this current year. Step six is be thankful RUclips randomizes comments by date so more of a variety of comments is represented.
it's really hilarious that I've subscribed this channel for years just because of this Philosophy video with awesome cover. every other videos uploaded by this dude is something else.
I read this book many years ago and have quoted it throughout the years. It's the first time listening to an audio. Along with loving the audio it brought back happy my memories of sitting in the dark with my siblings as we listened to stories on the radio. I found that I had to adjust to audio and my childhood memory helped to adjust more quickly.that I probably would have.
The Law, not was but is fire. But who can say what fire is. Is it because we’ve been told it’s fire or is it truly fire?. Chained unable to see the truth. The man who thought he saw the sun. The sun is only fire from the torch blinding those who try to see past it, shielding the truth. Yo, what the frick freaking flip am I saying???
It has me fuming. Everything is so vague and unexplained that too not even define the definition of a friend, And the complicated mess that would be to explain what the next friend is. The person behind the Counter give me a nice hot piece of bread with a smile is considered a friend because they are doing good to me, No this is just wrong. And it's done on purpose that way that's what gets me so aggravated, Their morality is not my morality, To begin with they are happy to have slaves, In my morality that's not very virtuous
A few pieces of evidence that Socrates existed (there's more): -Three major independent descriptions of his life and character survive today that were written by authors who were his contemporaries: Xenophon, Aristophanes, and Plato himself. -Surviving references to Socrates from at least four comic playwrights: Eupolis, Emeipsias, Theopompus, and one who is anonymous. -Additional fragments about Socrates from the speeches of two Athenian orators: Isocrates and Aeschines. -Bonus: no evidence whatsoever has been found that refers to him as a fictional character. This includes both positive and negative accounts (folks hating on him).
~the 40 min mark... Plato describes a doctor as one who does what is good for the patient rather than what is good for himself. Is this the current definition as well? With such large salaries and countless medications in which they get subsidies?
The timing for me to find to find this,.... incredible. Thanks for making this available. What a gift. Thoroughly enjoyed , two days of,... deep contextual,... application... and insight... The Talent in the reading... pure pleasure. Thank you. Well Done. This a gift, so few, will share.... I’ll do my , best, to invite. Those ,in this category of option,.... to be able to absorb, let, alone adapt, then education....I am a elderly ,individual... without fear,... focus becomes,... sharing the deep worth of this reading. Depth. This,?.. incredible. I almost fancy,... just being....just to be there... and then,... they come to “faith “... in a n huge dump of love and clarity..... we are, this new world.... we are the love..... all this education and spiritual ....toss.... I get. Good work.... saving me, from myself...continue
This is amazing. Does anybody know who the narrator is? Or where this audiobook can be purchased from? He is fantastic. Reading the book was a great experience but this narrator really brought it to life. He makes things so clear and narrates the characters so well and at an excellent pace.
I've done as you suggested and there is 2 different audio recordings of the republic, both trans by Benjamin and narrated by other dudes. Who is the narrator and translator of the youtube video above?
I just listened first time. So magical. Will be back to this video many times. Love the music with it as well... So amazing that these guys were talking so in depth but in such a simple way at the same time. Socrates is cool. Now Im torn between Socrates and Nietzsche. For now Im going to continue reading Plato.
I just want to how, just how did the Ancient Greeks come up with so many complex ideas? Their mindset is incredible and I think maybe it was because the world was so quiet and so dark at night. We had a massive storm a few years ago and lost power for 5 days. At first it was stressful, and it was pitch black at night but by about day 3 I began to feel really calm and by day 5 I almost didn’t care.
It’s indiscernable whether I have the capability to believe I can take all possible meanings relating to me and rule them out, simply would be crazy to think the person who wrote it for me wouldn’t make it mean different things over time
Sounded a lot like Obama and the Dems to me. Always promising free stuff, redistribution of wealth, land reparations, valuing immigrants over citizens & constantly starting or continuing wars.
Am I the first person to point out that the title picture of the audiobook is from Plato's Symposium? (p.s. the Republic is an allegory for the governance of the human soul, not a treatise on civil politics. Socrates says this over and over again within the work, but nobody pays any attention.)
John Uebersax We used the Bloom translation of 'The Republic' in a political philosophy class I took. Perhaps political philosophy is just the study of the governance of the human soul writ large, but we studied the work as political philosophy sensu stricto. What is justice? Should justice be chosen on its merits or for its practical utility? Is it better to be a completely unjust person who is widely called just or better to be the completely just person who is widely called unjust? What is the perfect city in speech? [Indirectly asked: How should the city protect itself from ambitious, capable young men? Turn them toward philosophy?] So many great questions. Such a great book.
John Uebersax I am studying this in political theory at UofT but i do agree with you. From the begining you can tell he keeps mentioning the soul over and over again, even after making the CITY an impossibility, justice remains possible on the soul through moderation. ... wish this audiobook had chapters on the description, i need to re-listen to book 7 for a test
Hey, just trying to ask around because I'm trying to buy the book. Do you know which edition and who the translator was for this version of "The Republic"?
mj mclaugh - the written version is the Ferrari translation under Cambridge Publications. The audio version is nowhere to be found! I tried for 1-year plus and no luck.
Does anybody know which edition this is? There are multiple translations of the book available out there, but i like this one and would love to purchase the book.
For this conversation, it talks about how to live a happy life. For so much arguments, it just come down to self. Indeed an old story and so simply compare to our modern life but the message will send us to the reality, the real self.
Listening to Plato is something I wish I had in my country, such ways of reflection and philosophical thoughts that over come being in a 3rd world Country. 😇💖💖
I think it was the style to politely let someone lead you through a series of plausible questions, and then formulate your own countering set of questions that your convo partner would also politely say yes to. I guess that's the Greek version of political correctness or something.
Whilst listening to this Republic I also listen to Thus Spoke Zarathustra- Nietzsche. Socrates was a warrior before becoming a philosopher and was said to be well over 6 feet high. (A professor told me this.) I wonder what would have happened if Nietzsche and Socrates were locked in an elevator together?
I wish my family were virtuous like in the classical sense. Not this freedom-to-be-ignorant and individualistic-but-also-feliopietistic sense. I discovered Plato when I was 22 and got weird looks in my hometown for liking and talking about him. Their first thought was that I was regressing back to dabbling in Play-Doh.
we need to marry and have kids man, seriously, you just brightned up my day, that's exactly what i think, the people are indoctrinated in their selfishness, with no concern for what is good, this needs to end
I have heard alot about it and it is my first time to listen to the book. What can I say, astonishing, mesmerising, I did not want it to end. I learned a lot from this book. Thank you so much for posting this and thanks alot for the english reader who made it a fun to listen to.
Glad to have this to listen to. Quick question to those who know, what translation is this? And is it confirmed that this is abridged? It's definitely shorter than the other audio recordings of the republic.
I had to re-listen many times certain sections to get it.. and pergaps lucky to get half of this part of the republic.. Socrates was definitely a mega-genius - father of western thought
The operative phrase there is "justified" pertaining to belief. I teach that belief without evidence for proof is dangerous, fictional, and based in superstition. I distributed it for years as but bait to reel in potential intellectuals still heavily fettered in superstations and religious fears instilled on a modern plantation culture such as this USA.@@havenbastion
You'd suprised to know that two of the many Indian Scriptures..'The Rigveda and the Bhagavad Gita ' cover the topics of justice and rulers and rule (Dharma) in details....thousand of years ago.
For reference:
Book I - 0:35
Book II - 42:00
Book III - 1:16:27
Book IV - 1:32:30
Book V - 1:58:30
Book VI - 2:33:20
Book VII - 3:04:59
Book VIII - 3:22:21
Book IX - 3:42:30
Book X - 4:27:40
Amir Stewart thanks brothet
R*
Somebody needs to pin you
you're an angel
Thank you
Anyone: **has an opinion on anything**
Socrates: I’m about to end this mans whole argument
Step 1: ask a metric ton of questions until the opponent gets completely lost
Step 2: completely demolish their point and make them look like a troglodyte
BRILLIANT!!!
Oliver Wingate troglodytes....Excellent word choice:
@@goldfishyearbook but in truth and reality he is right anyway
Lol this reminds me of James and Tati
Nothing kills the momentum of a classical discussion on the mechanics of justice like an ad for Facebook messenger. Damn you Zuckerberg.
add block :)
the zuck strikes again
@@tonyeezi7315 What? How dare you deny my right to complain!! 😃
Use youtube vanced, it allows picture in picture display and no adds. U can use youtube in background
Add a . At the end of the html and it will get rid of the ads
This is awesome. My father gave this book to me read. When I was a little girl. He would ask me questions about what I had read each day. I have come to love logic and philosophy since then. It brought me closer to him. I miss those talks and debates. ❤
That's so nice, touching. Thanks for sharing. I want to purchase all the books.
Yes your dad was a good man
his assumptions no longer work.
The doctor, he asks, is he a businessman or a healer? He says a healer of the sick! And then he makes more and more false assumptions. And the whole construct on which he built his empire falls apart if you don't accept just one of its many premises. In the past, the doctor may only have been paid when the patient got better. Today the doctor gets his money regardless of how the patient is doing. And the more people are worse off, the more he earns. A doctor meets the criteria of a businessman. [36:19]
Perception of True Love , not just letting you to hope but giving you a Tool to prepare you for .
@@genki2705 You are conflating the industry with an individual doctor. A doctor that consistently fails to treat people will be fired eventually, or struggle to keep any patients, and not be nearly as successful as doctors that treat people with success.
"The more the pleasures of the body fade. The greater becomes one desire for conversation."
~ Socrates ~
The more the pleasure of the body fade away. The greater to me the pleasure and charm of conversation (plato)
“Declining interest in physical pleasures is exactly matched by increasing desire for and enjoyment of conversation.”~Cephalus, father of Polymarchus~ chapter 1 in Plato’s Republic
That quote is not by Socrates. The author of the story is Plato, and the character who says it is Cephalus
@@aon02bAbsolutely correct! Also, the sentiment isn't true for everyone. I find that my desire for both has declined significantly; I have much more interesting things to occupy my time and attention.
@@ShadowMind312 lemme guess what you’re into now…….cryptocurrency? Good luck with that crap. It sounds cryptic for sure
On one hand, Socrates was brilliant like none other.
On the other I can see why they poisoned him. Imagine arguing with a man like that.
😂😂 I agree
It would make a lesser intelligeable person feel very insecure about their thought processes
Imagine someone casually dismantling a religion in ancient times when the existence of gods was as obvious as the fact that sun comes up in the morning.
@@thillirrr6579what you mean? I haven’t read yet
@@saltydecimator I mean the he says that in a perfect city, you need people who govern ,police, craftsman etc. at some point some generations may question the city it's laws etc, thus you need to give them reason why they do what they're supposed to, and a reason why they can't go above their standing, stop them from sharing and intermingling so that you can control them easier etc. so that they don't cause chaos, uprisings (you can't have people who can't govern governing you see, nor can you have people who were raised to be just warriors bake bread while bakers protect the city). It is stated that, for example one might excuse some's reason for living (I mean work they do) by 'telling' them that there are different kinds of human (meant for different jobs ergo what they're suited foe best) and so a whole belief system to keep people in control is created (all people are made with clay but some are made with bronze, some with silver and some with gold particles). Basically religion to excuse claims to different positions in society, you know like mandate of heaven in China. I hope I explained more or less. Generally this is a perspective of a convicted atheist so please read, listen, interpret and analyse for youself.
Who here's listening to Plato in 2024!? 🔥
First time a comment like this actually applied to me.
I am!
Here ! 🙌
I wish EVERY American-- nay every HUMAN BEING read and/or listen to Plato at this time. Turns out, Plato knew the pitfalls that we as various societies from around the world are falling directly into, such as "democracy."
I was expecting a dense philosophy tome with complex jargon. I got a bunch of friends talking about politics.
To be fair , those things are very similar fields
This is the vibe im getting lmao.
I read 2 different translations of this masterpiece, I've listened to this book at least 4-5 times now. So well written! Perfect reader
I don't know how to listen to this. Since society has changed so much over the centuries, his statements are no longer valid.
The doctor, he asks, is he a businessman or a healer? He says a healer of the sick! And then he makes more and more false assumptions. And the whole construct on which he built his empire falls apart if you don't accept just one of its many premises. In the past, the doctor may only have been paid when the patient got better. Today the doctor gets his money regardless of how the patient is doing. And the more people are worse off, the more he earns. A doctor meets the criteria of a businessman. [36:19]
@@genki2705 You misunderstand the point, his goal is not to design a perfect society, but to explore the nature of justice and other such things.
@@genki2705
philosophy:
the love of wisdom, normally encapsulated within a formal academic discipline. Wisdom is the soundness of an action or decision with regard to the application of experience, knowledge, insight, and good judgment. Wisdom may also be described as the body of knowledge and principles that develops within a specified society or period. E.g. “The wisdom of the Tibetan lamas.”
Unfortunately, in most cases in which this term is used, particularly outside India, it tacitly or implicitly refers to ideas and ideologies that are quite far-removed from genuine wisdom. For instance, the typical academic philosopher, especially in the Western tradition, is not a lover of actual wisdom, but a believer in, or at least a practitioner of, adharma, which is the ANTITHESIS of genuine wisdom. Many Western academic (so-called) “philosophers” are notorious for using laborious sophistry, abstruse semantics, gobbledygook, and pseudo-intellectual word-play, in an attempt to justify their blatantly-immoral ideologies and practices, and in many cases, fooling the ignorant layman into accepting the most horrendous crimes as not only normal and natural, but holy and righteous!
An ideal philosopher, on the other hand, is one who is sufficiently intelligent to understand that morality is, of necessity, based on the law of non-violence (“ahiṃsā”, in Sanskrit), and sufficiently wise to live his or her life in such a harmless manner. Cf. “dharma”.
One of the greatest misconceptions of modern times is the belief that philosophers (and psychologists, especially) are, effectively, the substitutes for the priesthood of old. It is perhaps understandable that this misconception has taken place, because the typical priest/monk/rabbi/mullah seems to be an uneducated buffoon compared with those highly-educated gentlemen who have attained doctorates in philosophy, psychology and psychiatry. However, as mentioned in more than a few places in this book, it is imperative to understand that only an infinitesimal percentage of all those who claim to be spiritual teachers are ACTUAL “brāhmaṇa” (as defined in Chapter 20). Therefore, the wisest philosophers of the present age are still those exceptionally rare members of the Holy Priesthood!
At the very moment these words of mine are being typed on my laptop computer, there are probably hundreds of essay papers, as well as books and articles, being composed by professional philosophers and theologians, both within and without academia. None of these papers, and almost none of the papers written in the past, will have any noticeable impact on human society, at least not in the realm of morals and ethics, which is obviously the most vital component of civilization. And, as mentioned in a previous paragraph, since such “lovers-of-wisdom” are almost exclusively adharmic (irreligious and corrupt) it is indeed FORTUITOUS that this is the case. The only (so-called) philosophers who seem to have any perceptible influence in the public arena are “pop” or “armchair” philosophers, such as Mrs. Alisa “Alice” O’Connor (known more popularly by her pen name, Ayn Rand), almost definitely due to the fact that they have published well-liked books and/or promulgate their ideas in the mass media, especially on the World Wide Web.
@@genki2705 not all doctors are businessmen
@@nobalpreet4950 A Doctor by choice, a businessman by necessity maybe
Some missing - will amend after exams are over, no time right now.
Book II starts at 42:00
Book III starts at 1:16:27
Book IV starts at 1:32:30
Book V starts at 1:58:30
Book VII starts at 3:04:59
Book VIII starts at 3:22:21
fritzki1 Book VI starts at 2:33:20
well done sir
artificialplanet no book IX and X in this video?
@@mubinkarovalia2128 why so mean
Are you God?
"Yes"
"Yes of course"
"Of course"
"Yes"
"I agree"
"Yes, we are right to be sure of that"
"Yes"
"You may say, and be quite right"
"YES. OF COURSE"
"It surely seems so, yes"
"i agree, for i think what you say is right"
this made me laugh so much
apparently
They are courteous, that is why they always reply when questioned. People put high standard in conversation. It was important to them because sitting around a fire and talking happened a lot😂😂
This book changed my life in college. I need this more than ever. Thank you for posting.
Diving into 'The Republic' by Plato through this audiobook is a captivating journey through timeless philosophical concepts. Highly recommend for anyone intrigued by deep discussions on justice, reality, and the ideal state.
Glaucon just had to open his big damn mouth, this book would've been a pamphlet otherwise.
Ezra Dube 😂😂😂😂
LMAO
Love it. ROFL
😂😂😂
That comment made my day 🤣🤣
I try to recommend this books to my friends/family as an intro to philosophy, but when they hear the word "philosophy" they automatically think its some overcomplicated outdated writings that don't interest them. When in reality its the most fluid and intriguing dialogues, as if you are sitting at a table conversing with friends. They'll rather watch TikTok or Netflix.
That’s really unfortunate, hopefully one day they’ll have a change of heart. I’ve recently gained interest in philosophy so this is my first philosophical text (well, audiobook lol). I’m likely to finish it by the end of this week so if you have any recommendations I’d be glad to try them out!
Pythagoras is my favorite so far. Abstract ideas he defined, definitions he made abstract, mathematical shapes he refined from chaos, and the way he saw the human spirit and willpower enacted in the world around him is just mesmerizing.
You need new friends comrade. Maybe Pythagoras or Descartes next....
@@xariafrank9442 My life is dedicated to philosophy and I have read hundreds of philosophers and the very best one is William Walker Atkinson. Aside from him I can recommend many other depending on your goals and interests and how well-rounded you want to be but if you simply started with Atkinson and then branched out from there by studying anyone he namedrops (e.g. Schopenhauer) eventually you'll cover the whole western tradition and the eastern traditions too.
@@FringeWizard2 woah dont see Atkinson mentioned often. His work under his Ramacharaka pseudonym changed my life. His book on Raja Yoga is particularly good.
Notice that in the beginning, Socrates is forced to stay. His friends insist that he stay and converse with them; he did not force people to listen to him, nor did he write a political treatise claiming to be all-knowing and always correct in his pronouncements. He never wrote anything in his life; he mainly asked questions and followed a thought to its logical conclusions. His earlier dialogues all ended in failures to define what he sought to discover: the nature of friendship, temperance, courage, etc. His student, Plato, wrote Socrates' dialogues.
At the end of the "Republic," Socrates says the type of city-state the discussion arrived at resides only in heaven; it will never be realized on earth. People will probably never elect a philosopher-king in the Platonic mode.
A Platonic philosopher-king is an ideal, like Jesus. He is no more a dictator than is a wise and loving parent; he always wants what is best for his citizens, a Greek word, by the way. Like an excellent medical doctor: he diagnoses the problem, realizes the nature of his patient, and prescribes the proper medicine. He has only the patient's best interests in mind. He is not seeking money, power, or fame for himself. He acts wisely, appropriately, and lovingly.
Socrates: "I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only make them think."
[The first time I read the "Republic," I was disgusted. But after several college courses in Platonic philosophy, I realized that Plato writes in such a fashion that grabs the reader and forces him to wrestle with these problems. Plato shows the reader, among other things, that trying to institute a utopia leads to drastic measures, at least by modern standards, like group ownership of the Guardians' children, not everyone's children, just the Guardians'. Plato knew that if the generals had children, they would be sorely tempted to start a dynasty with his sons in charge, sons who may well be incompetent and vicious.]
It's best to reread it, and listen to this... it gets much more important in times like these.
And alas, Socrates was put to death by the people he wished to inspire. Really tragic. He's a lot like Jesus in that respect.
TheArchsage74 the difference is Jesus has a lot of people distorting his truths and adding to them. The Bible is full of them. It's a sham.
you have , well the most logical coversation that I have read . My gut tells me that socrates was always searching for what he knew was true. WE...are WE.. YOU are YOU.. though he asks the question to the persons that it applies to them, in the way that the person given the queastion would understand, to get the question anserwed even though he knows the anwer. the lesson is to see if people can find the anwer in themselves without being told. So let me ask you ..WHAT is justice, and how do you come up with that point of view. ? whats it you r parents that taught you who you are? did they tell you what is right and wrong? Or perhaps church and science? did they tell you whats right and wrong? Or perhaps its in you ? in us? in all people.. questions was it given ? or is it born in us in our souls? You have a brilliant mind , better than most I read on this subject. So my question stands to you ?
Jason Gartner
Aristotle gives the best answer: Justice is the proper order of events. Or, doing the right thing at the right time at to the right person to the right degree in the right way. Of course, then one asks: What exactly is right? I think that right means that which is appropriate, helpful, wise, useful, and loving, although Aristotle never mentions love, as far as I know.
Truth or the ability to recognize truth seems to reside somehow in our minds. When truth appears, our minds grasp it and instantly and completely know it for what it is. Nonetheless, we can, and often are, fooled by half-truths, lies, and propaganda. I don't know why or how we can be fooled, often so easily. Maybe it's because we see the partial truth in the propaganda and naively and wrongly accept the whole false communication.
But these conclusions are merely my shaky conclusions. I could be totally wrong. Truth can withstand intense examination, so if we keep looking for it, we will, I hope, find more and more of it.
All the best!
The republic isnt a blueprint of the perfect society but rather about how things go wrong in the pursue of it.
Alexander T - no it says in the beginning that the whole society tangent is just to make analogies for inner harmony. They start having a hard time talking directly about inner harmony, so they decide that zooming out might make the analysis fresher.
The city is a metaphor for the individual.
In the "pursuit of it". Yes, I agree.
None of that is correct. The Republic is the pursuit of justice, broken out to 10 books. It wasn't a societal tangent, it's the damn thesis of Plato's Republic. They don't have a hard time talking about inner harmony than zoom out. You didn't read, or listen, to it, obviously. The discussion moves from political to personal justice, in that order: you literally got what takes place in the book in the wrong order.
It's not a metaphor either, it's social political philosophy, primarily, with some addressing of personal justice, the individual. That's not a metaphor.
In no way at all is Plato's Republic about society going wrong by pursuing justice. That is, literally, almost the exact opposite of Socrates' famous conclusion.
Pathetic.
@@expatphotographer8745 yes your right but your right in practise only if people do agree with you and saing they are wrong or stupid [directly or indirectly] will offend them and will make them want to disagree with you as they feel atacked.You should noticd how socrates analises and discuses with people he is just making a person see the mistake in argument- by not offending them but by respectful and logical way off thingking.
I hope this will help you in any way posible.
Edit- gramar
Imagine a world where parliaments and congresses had discussions like this. Imagine a world where the ruling class were like Greek philosophers instead of scumbags.
The greeks and philoshers had qestoins that have no answer. But to ask another to get that answer. And they care for the young and old. To teach the right and wrong of these scoictys we have grown up in?
Their shouldn’t be a ruling class. As captain america once said “Agendas change”. We should defund politicians.
@@Marcusaurelius913 Those who remove the ruling class become the ruling class
Imagine a world where the people looked up laws and grew their knowledge and then used that knowledge to live completely free… Some of us are already there, come join us. TheBigSib channel
The irony is that all those scumbags no doubt read this in college.
“yessss”
- Socrates c. 375 BC
Of course
@@bangkokinc.4233 I wonder just how many Marcus's he had in him!
Garbage
I have to stop occasionally, think or replay, to really perceive the content. This book is amazing.
Ditto
narration is incredible... well done
Thanks for the find.
Look at danny. .haha
Danny Wilten - I have been enjoying your channel.
Thank you
Does anyone know who is narrating this? He really is fantastic.
The book opens with a beautiful metaphor about "passing the torch" to the young, which is immediately followed by a dialogue on what wisdom the old have discovered for themselves after a long life. Remember this: every single detail in a Platonic dialogue has significance, especially the ones that seem merely contextual, in the setting external to the discussion.
What I understood from this, is the sharing of thoughts of delightful perfection that begins in the mind maybe as close as we will ever get to a Utopia but it’s in the sharing and realisation of theses thoughts that will ultimately lead to an ever great world harmony.
I bought this huge book "The Works Of Plato" years ago, I read every single Work, every single page. About 800 pages total. I read it Two or three times in a ten year period. Every once in awhile, still a few pages here and there. So this Audio hits home for me, lots of good memories, good stuff, thanks for sharing.
What do you think of the loeb translations?
This book was recommended for us to read by a college professor nearly 10 years ago. Can't believe it took me this long to finally read (or should I say listen to?) it.
That awkward moment when an Iron Age nerd perfectly describes the nature of the ongoing crises of every major civilization of the Information Age…
Plato wasn't a nerd like modern intellectuals are, the name plato itself means "Broad-shouldered" in Ancient Greek, he for sure was a chad
@Rajarshi Chakraborty He was a wrestler to be specific. And Socrates if I remember correctly was a soldier...
Aquad. Terrtra. Squair. What is the element of fire with something of four in the name?
@@LexusWallgod'Fire'. The 'f' of four and the number of letters. And it sounds similar. Sorted.
I liked your remark. You were just speaking of the timelessness of Plato's questions and the seeming changelessness of human nature.
Socrates OWNS Greek aristocrats with FACTS and LOGIC
fuck him, he didnt write any books, and was bulshiting about physical health, when he him self not even once had picked up a weight. Where on fhe other hand Plato is the real goat, he wrote many books, and respected greek traditions of physical training.
What group are you associated with? I’m American and I know for a fact there is no Socrates type of person to tell us. We just live like fools who have zero self discipline. No we have the tyrants who rule us and promote vice so they can profit from our addictions. How is an excellent society going to exist without self discipline? So we are turning into that useless mob that hates their rulers. And if you think democracy is real you are part of the problem. We have hereditary rule by some really rich evil people. 🙏🏻pray for their souls 🙏🏻
Sings: “It ain’t necessarily so...” 🎤
And ads
so REAL
in this episode: Plato shits on every government ever
yer a fucking geek
Elliot King No need to be insecure about your perceived lack of intelligence sir carry on.
Oberlemonne Because governments are as in err as the men that drafted these charters.
Elliot King do you mean Greek?
Penguin RagE no need to live your whole life with a stick 5 feet up your ass sir, carry on.
The way the narration is done makes this so therapeutic to listen to, I could listen to this over and over, and never get bored of it.
This whole book is read in the exact same intonation as the scene from quest for the holy grail where Sir Bedevere teaches the peasants how to find witches
Monty python?
“And what else floats in water?”
It really does 😂 here’s the link
ruclips.net/video/_rMsgmaBV8g/видео.html
@@domdubz7037 An evil ship builder?
who are you that is so wise in the ways of philosophy
This is a very fine reading one of the greatest philosophical treatments of the soul. Thank you!
Wisdom, courage, and moderation in all things, those are the virtues by which the Golden rule; to pursue the good for its own sake not for its ends.
Simple arguments, profound discovery of human nature in this discussion. I encourage all who listen to this, imagine you are at a dinner table with this group listening to and exporting your ideas and arguments with them, actually take part in the discussion.
It's hard for me to fathom that people had such profound conversations over 2000 years ago. Like I've paused/highlighted so many parts and sat there in shock haha
@@jameseldridge3445 I definitely agree, and it's even weirder for me to comprehend how we DONT have such deep intellectual conversations as the normal philosophy anymore.
But yea, the fact that these daddies were doing this thousands of years ago is a trip. The discipline to pursue debates daily, to understand oneself and the world he inhabits and that surrounds him.
We've lost touch.
Hit me up to reconnect.
This is my first time listening to an audiobook. It's a very different kind of concentration I need haha. So used to just reading.
You started with a tough audiobook. This aint Harry Potter! Hope you enjoyed it
@@Sprite_525 true! I use this to get to sleep. If I really want to grasp this, I need to read it. So I can read a sentence and think about it. Maybe read it again.
With audiobooks you can get more lit in while emptying the dishwasher or folding clothes.... If I’m on a road trip... an audiobook is a must!
I find my understanding is greater if I read the book along with the narrator. Then I have read and seen what someone else thought important.
Audio book goes into your head via your ears, and if they are dirty, of course your understanding would not be as kin or complete I suppose.
The description of what happens to Democracy and its ride to tyranny, is like someone narrating the current years of our nation...
😅
Amazing isn't it. Glad we are a Republic with a Constitution and have the means to stop what's happening. Funny how Socialists always want citizens disarmed. Heh.
History repeats
Yes. Thats why in Greek version they had to be very educated and solid charactered people who decide. Otherwise it always has a danger of Slipping to tyranny of majority. Hence the need for shadow Governments to prevent it.
Aristotle had some great insights on the cycles of liberty and tyranny. The West is currently reaching the latter part of the cycle, where stuff gets bad real quick.
These conversations are mind blowing.
Remember this was removed by school. Like constitution and don’t lie commandments.
Yes they are. I sent this to my son's (Twins in thier 20s) I gave them 3 questions with no real correct answer and told them. Whomever finishes thai first while answering them gets $50. Second gets $40.
@@orcvsivstitia7608 r u broke?
@@Michael_______ Maybe not as broke as some but far less broken than many.
@@karamlevi very intriguing
It's actually so cool how ideas can transcend lifetimes to be taught still to us now.
Someone asked Sophocles, "How is your sex life now? Are you still able to have a woman?" That someone was Tommy Wiseau.
This is Masters work; it should be compulsory for every American student. One needs to listen to this at least five times to truly activate and release the brillance...
Americans can't even get their history books straight, they ain't ready for this.
@borninvincible what can't we get straight?
@@kirkcinnamon8467 your basic history for one 🤡
@@kirkcinnamon8467 he blatantly said it, haha can't you even read? Another thing is definetelly geography...
America will improve only when Americans are following the Bible of their own free will
Beautiful, and inspiring. And to think that this work was created so, so long ago. It only shows of course how little our world has really advanced towards real Justice.
Lots of wonderful questions, however their solutions towards creating a more perfect human system by robbing the people of their humanity is less than beautiful to me. I have very little trouble recognizing just how dated the philosophies are in this reading.
Real Philosophy does not become dated, because it is based on true premises (2000 years ago or today) and that is what it makes it valuable. Looking back, what seems "politically incorrect" or "inhuman" today, it is simply the exposure of long-known human traits inherent to those humans and our societies (no matter the era), the difference now is that it is becoming a taboo exposing these traits. You are right; trying to create a perfect society is in obvious contradiction with our time, because our system gets farther and farther away from being fair, and this obviously happens when nobody looks for Perfection nor Justice anymore than profit. Anyways, who says that Plato's words weren't just symbolical? After all did Socrates even exist? ;)
You make some good points there G.K. I suppose "out of fashion" would be a better way of saying it than "dated". Putting everyone in their place and deciding their futures for them towards the exclusive benefit of the state is a great system if you want to say build pyramids or establish an empire. Rigid systems can be very effective when under external pressure, and there is great peace of mind in being sure that all your players are in their places trained and ready. It is the casting itself that is so unpalatable to me. In this day and age I would prefer every willing individual to experience the arts, philosophy, labor, and conception at the expense of their performance towards given task and the peak performance of the whole. Of course there are not currently any barbarians camped outside town burning our fields and building siege equipment. If that were the case I would have to count on Plato's playbook.
Well, in my opinion, perhaps there are always some kind of "barbarians" threatening to eradicate our "world view" somehow, and that's why I find this idea of a highly organized (and self-sufficient) community so appealing, regardless of the sacrifice of an individual "liberty" (Democracy's Goddess). Nevertheless, I know it is impossible outside the realm of Ideas, the same way you should consider your beautiful "dream" of Arts, Philosophy and meaningful labor for the masses, because it is as utopic as mine...
I guess we are just but a bunch of dreamers ;)
I only request for the opportunity to pursue these things despite one's natural disposition. Not so utopic in the way that it allows for failure and unexpected success. Where again the pyramids have stood for thousands of years and will stay there long after we are all gone, we have the technology to stand ours on its end (er top) and give everyone a better view. Where people once toiled in the fields tractors cruise along. Where thousands and millions waged bloody personal war, drones and long range engagements buffer an increasingly growing nugget of people. Giving them each the opportunity in some measure to find their own way. With no shortage of human beings in the foreseeable future and a shrinking need for there physical effort to produce the resources they consume. Together with an increase in their ability to access and acquire a diverse set of skills that the simpler steady system would never had required or perhaps even deemed a distraction. Should and I believe does enhance the effectiveness of the individual in the tasks they take unto themselves. And this in turn strengthens and pushes the people as a whole to greater heights.
The lowkey "yes..." is me the whole time while listening
Just about to dive into this. Your comment made me smile. :D Hope to learn something foundational.
@@hlegler you definitely will! Its interesting
Try the exercise of prooving Sokrates after every "yes" wrong
....yes
Ahh
Thanks you for sharing anyone listening in 2019? 2020 now
Yes12/31/2019 onward to 2020 !!
1/1/2020 Here lol
2020 hehe
Yes, I am 2020
Right now !!!
Christ, people were this smart back then?
I've not read a single modern work with such deep insights.
Well then you don't associate with men who revere the honorable writers of our own time
Lol! It is truly amazing what people were able to accomplish when they didn't have television, radio, movies, video games, porn,etc etc, to distract them from actually using the brain they were born with, isn't it? 🤔🤔🙂
I think most people don't realise just how fuckin advanced both the greeks and romans were when it came to philosophy and statecraft. While yes these people were the educated scholars and nobles of the time, they are still a far cry from the stereotypical barbaric ancient man. I'd say we are more barbaric than they.
I’ve read this book alone and then taken a class on it. It’s the ultimate insight. You, have done the world a service by making this video in this form. Thank you.
"The ultimate insight."- What???!!! You actually agree with Socrates and his vision of created Utopia?
FYI... Socrates is describing not a free Utopian Republic, but a dystopia of an enslaved citizenship, controlled, euthanized, and aborted by selective breeding, and decreed by the rule of a chosen elite aristocratic oligarchy, demanding forced agrarian labor to serve the State, by militaristic Socialism.
How can you not hear it in this audio book, or not comprehend it from reading the book and your class???!!!
@@MarkLewis... chill out ya fruit
@@bfc2155 LOL... Wow... at least your stupidity brings me laughter.
@@MarkLewis... a person says they enjoyed the reading and explains why. You go on a rant.
You're a fruit
@@bfc2155 The retorts of an idiot, (you) hold no weight. I'm never surprised by uneducated trolls like you, who toss insults to the educated, while simultaneously clasping so proudly to your ignorance. Your insecurity is a YOU problem.
I challenged the poster's stance on Plato's The Republic and their (obvious) lack of understanding to it as a whole... you take issue with that, because you don't understand it, or simple maths for that matter. You're the troll, not I.
You're an idiot.
Wow. Such an easy, conversational writing style .. very palatable presentation of some very heavy topics
serendiptychild simplicity is the elegant quality of wisdom. Modern Nations have countless statutes and laws; Moses and Haberabbi had only handfuls
It's called dialogue
it's also a translation, they tend to be simpler
I love the way this was written. Quite clear and precise. Allows the listener to stay focused and in tune with everything as the story goes on
inquisitiveness
I had to re-listen many times certain sections to get it.. and pergaps lucky to get half of it ..
Socrates was definitely a mega-genius - father of western thought.
Book IV starts 1:32:30
Thanks haha
ruclips.net/video/1FaFtCSrRgw/видео.html
The Happy Prince And Other Stories by Oscar Wilde (Complete Audio Book)
all of this was really good and interesting, especially the part at the end talking about the afterlife and reincarnation, I didn't know the Greeks had those ideas
I love this audio, I feel as if I'm there seating near and listening with the people...
Absolutely fantastic narration, great rhythm and really feels like a conversation is taking place, easy to comprehend and even without following the text. And to answer some questions: yes it's complete, and the start times for each book are going to be different depending on your specific translation of the book.
Um...are you freaking kidding??? This edition is HEAVILY abridged. On what do you base the claim that it's complete, a hasty assumption that other people must be confused because they aren't smart enough to have your insight that the exact times can be affected by the version of the translation and the narration speed? Did it even occur to you to, maybe, actually check the text before misleading people with false assurances that they're hearing the whole thing?
I read this book 30 years ago and I could easily tell that much of it was missing before I even reached the one hour mark. It's not even close to complete -- about half of the original work is omitted!
@@adiinbar993 I wondered why other audio book versions of this online were a bit longer.
Step one: Look at the total views the video has.
Step two: Look at the upload date.
Step three: Take the current year and subtract the upload year.
Step four: Divide the total views by the result.
Step five: Stop posting comments asking if anyone is watching it in your current year.
Step five is extrapolate based on years/views how many people will watch this current year.
Step six is be thankful RUclips randomizes comments by date so more of a variety of comments is represented.
OmG wHo ElSe Is WaTcHiNg In 2020???
Or just simply change the comments to new comments instead of top comments and see when they were posted
The perennial wisdom of Plato is like an extremely sharp knife that never loses it's edge nor ever will. Just like Truth itself.
Narsil
It's not Plato's wisdom - he is recording Socrates.
it's really hilarious that I've subscribed this channel for years just because of this Philosophy video with awesome cover. every other videos uploaded by this dude is something else.
norman harrison you listen to Joe Rogan? He’s a rad dude, check him out.
I read this book many years ago and have quoted it throughout the years. It's the first time listening to an audio. Along with loving the audio it brought back happy my memories of sitting in the dark with my siblings as we listened to stories on the radio. I found that I had to adjust to audio and my childhood memory helped to adjust more quickly.that I probably would have.
I really enjoyed this audio book. I will take it's wisdom with me wherever life takes me.
8 years later..... no, you didn't.
@@lewisforsythe1403 How not?
@@bttstratosphere4927 duh .. dat man is no smart. Me know cuz me really smart.
@@lewisforsythe1403 k
Thr argument for justice was fire.
The Law, not was but is fire. But who can say what fire is. Is it because we’ve been told it’s fire or is it truly fire?. Chained unable to see the truth. The man who thought he saw the sun. The sun is only fire from the torch blinding those who try to see past it, shielding the truth.
Yo, what the frick freaking flip am I saying???
It has me fuming. Everything is so vague and unexplained that too not even define the definition of a friend, And the complicated mess that would be to explain what the next friend is.
The person behind the Counter give me a nice hot piece of bread with a smile is considered a friend because they are doing good to me, No this is just wrong.
And it's done on purpose that way that's what gets me so aggravated,
Their morality is not my morality, To begin with they are happy to have slaves, In my morality that's not very virtuous
2:42:50 Plato introduces his Theory of Forms here. The audiobook seems to have dwindled down some of the archaic dialogue, but it still follows.
Who’s here after book 👏🏽 review 👏🏽
Yeah and it was so hard to read and understand so i had to lol
A few pieces of evidence that Socrates existed (there's more):
-Three major independent descriptions of his life and character survive today that were written by authors who were his contemporaries: Xenophon, Aristophanes, and Plato himself.
-Surviving references to Socrates from at least four comic playwrights: Eupolis, Emeipsias, Theopompus, and one who is anonymous.
-Additional fragments about Socrates from the speeches of two Athenian orators: Isocrates and Aeschines.
-Bonus: no evidence whatsoever has been found that refers to him as a fictional character. This includes both positive and negative accounts (folks hating on him).
~the 40 min mark... Plato describes a doctor as one who does what is good for the patient rather than what is good for himself. Is this the current definition as well? With such large salaries and countless medications in which they get subsidies?
exceptionally well read!
Thanks for uploading this, best version of this Ive heard.
Some credit info in the description would be nice ;)
2020...Socrates is so important to me that I opened up a company and a school under his name
Very nice
Congratulations
What an amazing job the narrator did with this work.
The narrator has performed an outstanding job.
The timing for me to find to find this,.... incredible. Thanks for making this available. What a gift. Thoroughly enjoyed , two days of,... deep contextual,... application... and insight... The Talent in the reading... pure pleasure. Thank you. Well Done. This a gift, so few, will share.... I’ll do my , best, to invite. Those ,in this category of option,.... to be able to absorb, let, alone adapt, then education....I am a elderly ,individual... without fear,... focus becomes,... sharing the deep worth of this reading. Depth. This,?.. incredible. I almost fancy,... just being....just to be there... and then,... they come to “faith “... in a n huge dump of love and clarity..... we are, this new world.... we are the love..... all this education and spiritual ....toss.... I get. Good work.... saving me, from myself...continue
This is amazing. Does anybody know who the narrator is? Or where this audiobook can be purchased from? He is fantastic.
Reading the book was a great experience but this narrator really brought it to life. He makes things so clear and narrates the characters so well and at an excellent pace.
Jason Corderoy Did you find out the answers to your questions yet? If so, could you let me know as well? Regards, Jason
I've done as you suggested and there is 2 different audio recordings of the republic, both trans by Benjamin and narrated by other dudes. Who is the narrator and translator of the youtube video above?
Bruce Alexander I believe
@@johnd.5346 The Death of Socrates read correctly by Bruce Alexander
notta"perfect"translation
I just listened first time. So magical. Will be back to this video many times. Love the music with it as well... So amazing that these guys were talking so in depth but in such a simple way at the same time. Socrates is cool. Now Im torn between Socrates and Nietzsche. For now Im going to continue reading Plato.
.
I just want to how, just how did the Ancient Greeks come up with so many complex ideas? Their mindset is incredible and I think maybe it was because the world was so quiet and so dark at night. We had a massive storm a few years ago and lost power for 5 days. At first it was stressful, and it was pitch black at night but by about day 3 I began to feel really calm and by day 5 I almost didn’t care.
It’s indiscernable whether I have the capability to believe I can take all possible meanings relating to me and rule them out, simply would be crazy to think the person who wrote it for me wouldn’t make it mean different things over time
very well narrated.....
Wow... if you start listening at 3:30:30, it describes how our society is coming to a downfall right now.
If you start at 2:44:00 to about 3:20:00, Plato seems to explain the idea of Christ in all of us.
Sounded a lot like Obama and the Dems to me.
Always promising free stuff, redistribution of wealth, land reparations, valuing immigrants over citizens & constantly starting or continuing wars.
knightd00b valuing immigrants OVER citizens? Dude...
ruclips.net/video/1FaFtCSrRgw/видео.html
The Happy Prince And Other Stories by Oscar Wilde (Complete Audio Book)
@@knightd00b It's almost like you americans love to reinforce the stereotype of stupid and ignorant racists.
Am I the first person to point out that the title picture of the audiobook is from Plato's Symposium? (p.s. the Republic is an allegory for the governance of the human soul, not a treatise on civil politics. Socrates says this over and over again within the work, but nobody pays any attention.)
John Uebersax I never knew that John--thank you for sharing. I need to read it again.
John Uebersax We used the Bloom translation of 'The Republic' in a political philosophy class I took. Perhaps political philosophy is just the study of the governance of the human soul writ large, but we studied the work as political philosophy sensu stricto.
What is justice? Should justice be chosen on its merits or for its practical utility? Is it better to be a completely unjust person who is widely called just or better to be the completely just person who is widely called unjust? What is the perfect city in speech? [Indirectly asked: How should the city protect itself from ambitious, capable young men? Turn them toward philosophy?]
So many great questions. Such a great book.
John Uebersax I am studying this in political theory at UofT but i do agree with you. From the begining you can tell he keeps mentioning the soul over and over again, even after making the CITY an impossibility, justice remains possible on the soul through moderation. ... wish this audiobook had chapters on the description, i need to re-listen to book 7 for a test
***** You mad bro?
kalem Butt the kybalion :-)
I salute the person who translated this book and to one who audio recorded it and the one who uploaded. Conclusion: GREAT MINDS THINK ALIKE.
4:23:56 & 4:48:12 what amazing ideas. I return to this every month or so. So grateful this exists.
Hey, just trying to ask around because I'm trying to buy the book. Do you know which edition and who the translator was for this version of "The Republic"?
mj mclaugh - the written version is the Ferrari translation under Cambridge Publications. The audio version is nowhere to be found! I tried for 1-year plus and no luck.
Although abridged, this very much helped me understand the book as a whole whilst reading the unabridged version.
Abridged and a great translation. Wondering what the translated text/edition is.
Just wonderful, including the music.
Kinda funny listening to Plato's Republic and getting an ad for Little Caesars.
Does anybody know which edition this is? There are multiple translations of the book available out there, but i like this one and would love to purchase the book.
Wonderful narration. Thank you for posting this indispensable classic. Miss Jenny
For this conversation, it talks about how to live a happy life. For so much arguments, it just come down to self. Indeed an old story and so simply compare to our modern life but the message will send us to the reality, the real self.
"souls are immortal. We must aspire to send them the upper way. Always".
Sadly there is no proof that souls exist.
@@drwatsonca6945 Perhaps the DNA is the soul passing from one generation to the next
Listening to Plato is something I wish I had in my country, such ways of reflection and philosophical thoughts that over come being in a 3rd world
Country.
😇💖💖
These guys agree to bloody anything
@John lol
Why yes! Of course they do
I think it was the style to politely let someone lead you through a series of plausible questions, and then formulate your own countering set of questions that your convo partner would also politely say yes to. I guess that's the Greek version of political correctness or something.
@@pagetvido1850 boo
The power of the Socratic method
FYI this is an abridged version.
It's very strange the original video doesn't mention this at all. Unless I missed something. It's a very good condensation though.
Whilst listening to this Republic I also listen to Thus Spoke Zarathustra- Nietzsche. Socrates was a warrior before becoming a philosopher and was said to be well over 6 feet high. (A professor told me this.) I wonder what would have happened if Nietzsche and Socrates were locked in an elevator together?
buttsecks
I wish my family were virtuous like in the classical sense. Not this freedom-to-be-ignorant and individualistic-but-also-feliopietistic sense. I discovered Plato when I was 22 and got weird looks in my hometown for liking and talking about him. Their first thought was that I was regressing back to dabbling in Play-Doh.
we need to marry and have kids man, seriously, you just brightned up my day, that's exactly what i think, the people are indoctrinated in their selfishness, with no concern for what is good, this needs to end
I have heard alot about it and it is my first time to listen to the book. What can I say, astonishing, mesmerising, I did not want it to end. I learned a lot from this book. Thank you so much for posting this and thanks alot for the english reader who made it a fun to listen to.
Book 2 starts at 42:00
Thank you for that. I am so grateful to do my daily work and listen to you.
a wonderfully jovial reading which really captures the imagination
if anyone is interested in the background painting, its the 2nd version of The Symposium by Anselm Feuerbach
Um no
Well, that was certainly a very nice piece of literature. If only those of our time understood such things as well as they did back in those days.
+Treisiess for example?
Wufaka
Do you want a list?
Treisiess I would like that, although I don't want to be a burden.
+Wufaka Obama, Hillary, Bush Jr, Trudeau, Merkel, I'm sure there are others, but those were the main ones I could think of.
Treisiess Trump
Glad to have this to listen to. Quick question to those who know, what translation is this? And is it confirmed that this is abridged? It's definitely shorter than the other audio recordings of the republic.
Shaw Brothers' 36 Chambers or Plato's "The Republic"? Very tough to choose the better 😮
I had to re-listen many times certain sections to get it.. and pergaps lucky to get half of this part of the republic..
Socrates was definitely a mega-genius - father of western thought
what do you think of democracy and authoritarianism?
ill never understand his argument that a dog is like a philosopher. the dog doesnt love what he knows, he loves what he trusts....
Knowledge is justified belief and a dog, like many humans, has no such concepts.
Neitzsche would've agreed with your revision, everything hangs on the balance of personal arrogance, knowledge no different.
The operative phrase there is "justified" pertaining to belief. I teach that belief without evidence for proof is dangerous, fictional, and based in superstition. I distributed it for years as but bait to reel in potential intellectuals still heavily fettered in superstations and religious fears instilled on a modern plantation culture such as this USA.@@havenbastion
Chapter VIII starts at 3:22:21
I read this book a while back, it is good and very insightful
You'd suprised to know that two of the many Indian Scriptures..'The Rigveda and the Bhagavad Gita ' cover the topics of justice and rulers and rule (Dharma) in details....thousand of years ago.
The greatest work of all mankind... to date
That would be the Bible .
@@southsideman4891 the bible is simply "a work of mankind"