Your right because I was naturally empathic person. Before I kept being disrespected by people. Now I am more aware of people's narcissistic behavioural traits . I have less empathy if people want my time or are disrespectful. I'm still nice and polite but I dont take it personally if people are inconsiderate or guilt trip me . I have less time for people and I have more time for myself. Before I would go out my way to be nice and understanding. Now I'm quick to see people's narcissistic behaviour. It's best to keep it polite with people these days and dont take it personally if people are inconsiderate. They are showing their true self. They want to boost their egos. If people show disrespect they lack respect. When people lack respect they become more inconsiderate and conceited. It's best parents teach their kids old fashioned politeness and respect people's feelings. And teach them to mind their own business and not try to be the centre of attention. To avoid their kids being too full of themselves.
@@rachelsimbhu4383 Taking long hikes, I find myself saying the Serenity prayer when thoughts of the narcissits come to mind. "God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things that I can, and the wisdom to know the difference."
My experience is it is always like walking on eggshells, their feelings take precedence over a room full of people and they are forever sitting in the wagon and being expected to be pulled along in life.
The selective amnesia is so irritating. There can be no real discussion about how they have hurt us. When an example is given to help explain our point, “I don’t remember saying or doing that” is the convenient reply. You can only make a point by pointing out the repeated lack of memory. It’s too much! Combine the amnesia with gaslighting and you have a true crazy making machine picking away at your mental and emotional health.
With these people they win each time. When they know you are on to them, they become understanding and sometimes seem real and caring, such as normal people like you and I. They are not like us at all. They can twist anything so quickly to feet victim mode or attack in hidden tactics, threats. Any reaction is brilliant as you are taking part in their dance. Stand back and act like nothing has been said or done. As anything you react back with, whether kindness or anger will work in their plan and games they play. Good luck, work on yourself and believe what you have been through and seen. Don't go back for more. 🙏👼🏻
The best part is some of them will even manufacture events that never happened or things you never said and insist consistently that it did happen. They’re beyond insane. And nothing can or will ever help them...tbh they don’t even deserve help, just to be cut off for good.
For sure.. I always say : HOW CONVENiENT FOR YOUR " BAD MEMORY".. BUT YET THEIR MEMORY. YET FOR THEIR DEFENCE, SUDDENLY THEIR MEMORY IS EXCELLENT FOR THEIR CONVENIENCE TO PROSPER THEM .THEY HAVE A LARGER THAN LIFE MEMORY FOR THEMSELVES.. BUT WHEN IT COMES TO US.. SUDDENLY THEIR MEMORY IS EXCELLENT !!!
Thankyou for this video! I suffered for 50 years and even though I am now a widow, I have been coping with guilt because I had begun to believe what I was fed over the many years. I cannot believe the clarity you have brought to my soul, I feel enlightened and grateful to you for making these so real and practical videos. My main grief was the Whats your problem? whenever my partner had caused chaos and left me to sort out the public flack. Also the selective memory, deliberately not remembering vital things we discussed, implying I was a liar, especially in the company of others. I thought I was going mad. The lack of enthusiasm for any achievements I reached, resenting awards I won, refusing to meet my friends and curbing my confidence. The person also deliberately looked shabby, drove old vehicles and cultivated a poor image which was all unnecessary, always the victim. I had to play down everything bright and good in my life to avoid displeasure. Now I know that I have been sane all along, successful in my career and a good mother. Its a bit late in life, but now have some hope back, what a hell of a lesson! If only someone had talked about this years ago.
I am still reeling after dealing with what I believe to be a covert narcissist. She had a very sad tale to tell about her life and of all the people that did her wrong. This extended to her daughter as well. I later learnt that behind my back she was scapegoating my daughter as being the reason why her daughter “didn’t have a voice”. She wanted my daughter to be punished and when she finally let some of her fury explode the angry person she truly is came forward. This woman speaks with the softest voice but she is the most aggressive angry person I have ever met. I am glad that I no longer have contact with her.
Beware of people who use baby voices. It is a manipulation ploy nothing else. I have seen female friends and relatives use breathy baby voices to convey that they are not a threat and that they are warm emotional people. They are anything but. They are cold and calculating and when no one else is around and they think you are vulnerable, you will hear the imperiously large and commanding voice boom out at you when they try to bully you. When you turn on them and call them out, the baby voice immediately comes back. Seen it happen. It's as though they are possessed by a dark entity that likes pretending it is a schoolgirl.
They sabotage and entrap, sabotage and entrap. All the while denying the fact. 17 yrs and my life is in ruins , only becoming apprised of this dynamic a year ago. Highly accurate. Thank you
A lot of empathetic people I know who have been hurt and have become bitter.. I have noticed also a lot of covert narcissistic people. Are snobs and their feelings are easily hurt . they might do big nice gestures and get their feelings hurt if people don't give them compliments. Or take what they say or do seriously especially if they make a joke and nobody laughs. Also they are conceited and unsympathetic and like to make snide remarks. And hate it when people fight back . Or they just say whatever. But wont let it go and seek the person as enemies. They also love to criticize people calling them arrogant or insensitive. They love making everything personal. And even talking about people's problems and like to analyse their problems and behaviour. Ive seen one call someone insecure and the other person said no I think that's you . And the covert narcissistic person had a big tantrum.
@s.hicks7213 I just don't get involved in his life and stay away from conversations about meaningful things. I just simply live as an individual who knows I am not in a marriage but a play that is in his head. So I keep my distance even though we live in the same house I have my own room. Don't get involved in their life. Period!
This is hands-down the best description of covert narcissism I've come across! You've hit the nail so squarely on the head and covered many aspects I've never heard explained at all, or explained so concisely. You've really helped me to better understand this person in my life. Particularly the part about them following all social norms, except when no-one's watching... when they can then show their true personality attributes, like aggression and other antisocial behaviours. This is so true!! Thank you for this confirmation :)
And also the part about playing the victim to get what they want! Spot on! I've been asked many times if someone I know to be covert is "a charmer" (overt), and they're not. This video explains how they charm through getting sympathy. It's sad how well it works...
Out the gate he played the victim: I was abused, I hate my mom, she's crazy (she is BPD) he has no real friends...now I see why! Out 2 years and finding my self worth again! Finding your self worth and self love is HUGE to healing and getting out and safe!
yes! i agree- another clue of the covert narc is they have no "real" friends- because they are NOT trustworthy- they have usually lost all of them! or if they have any, they are just superficial "facebook" friends or ones they see on a rare occasion. my ex BF never introduced me to any of his friends or family, and i now know why!!!! what a creep. good riddance, TC!
This is my ex husband. Very passive aggressive and negative, everyone is out to get him in some way, he’s jealous of others and puts others down in front of me but never publicly. I told him he is narcissistic and he says no that’s not me, I’m not that guy. I think he just thinks of the overt narcissist, which he is nothing like, so he can’t see it himself. I ended up with and eating disorder, depression and anxiety after 11 years together and I think he was feuling it. I’m so much better now since I left!
There is someone where I work now that is exactly like that. It's like you described her, most passive-aggressive, negative, insecure, jealous person I've ever met. Really glad I'll stop working there in a month.
This is spot on, based on my almost 50 years of personal experience with now 6 of the covert narcs in my immediate family, extended family and friends I’ve had in my younger adult years. I’ve been studying and researching cluster B personality disorders with a focus on NPD for over 15 years now and codependency for almost the same amount of time. The damage of narcissists passes from generation to generation and spreads out to create codependents, seek out codependents and destroy codependents. Love and respect yourself and your children and you can avoid getting entangled with these sad and abusive individuals. They seek and destroy.
My mother once left a plugged in hair dryer in the main sink in the bathroom . We had children of age 3 and 5 at the time. When i told her off for putting the children's life at risk she went ballistic. Half an hour of screaming rage at me. No sorry from her at all. No admission she did anything wrong.
I have noticed a lot of covert narcissistic people. Are either highly friendly people but get rejected and play the victim when people dont want to talk to them. Or they are either not very clever. Or they are over weight or they are not that attractive. And are jealous of people better then.
This is excellent. I have been observing my covert for years. Long before I knew it even had a name. These traits are precisely what I observed. Unfortunately it took me 20 years and numerous physical and mental health problems before I left.
Yes, my covert enjoyed my misfortunes. It took some time for me to realize that when I was sad or ill, he was happy as a lark. When I was feeling happy he would play head games etc. to bring me down so he could be happy.
Oh yes. That was my Narc husband, even more than my super selfish sister. My husband seems almost more than a Narc. I wonder at times if he’s a a psychopath. My sister lies and bad mouths everyone, has always put me down and been extremely envious and jealous of me, always. And it was harder for her, as I was the stronger, smarter sister. My Narc husband always seemed to want to compete with me. This became more obvious as the. years passed by.
The only time my covert narcissist ever smiled was when someone was in pain . Hé adored watching my newborn son Be circumcised . He came out beaming “ he screamed his Guts out !!! » truly horrible
I went from a more grandiose narc to a covert one because, at the time, I thought #2 was OPPOSITE from the first one. Not true!! Just a different manifestation of their issues. And #2 did not show his negative attributes until well into the relationship. At that time he revealed an evil side, telling me how he takes revenge on work associates he perceives as slighting him. It was chilling! Gone no contact!! Thankful to be free.
Exactly same thing happened to me. Carbon copy methodology that they use. So liberating when you realize that rather than being the only one to experience this abuse, that there are others with identical stories. Truly bizzare!
This was easily the best explained and revealing explanation of covert narcissism. Absolutely spot on. Answered so many questions I had. So much brought to light, giving amazing clarity into the disorder of my ex-spouse. It made me realize our relationship was doomed even before we met. There was no way on God's green earth it had a chance. None. Thank you so much for your contribution.
Having spent the last 5 years helping my wife to pick up the pieces after a 29 year marriage to a covert narcissist, I feel in a position to make some comments - especially as I had known the man in question for even longer as we were "friends" from about 20 years of age. He was a bully and a lier with a fabricated history, with a mean and cruel streak, but portrayed himself as nice, reasonable and wise and along with many others, despite the red flags, I was lulled into thinking he was ok and we hung out a lot together. He was (surprise) in middle management in a bureaucratic organisation. When he met this woman, he was Mr NiceGuy for 2 years - couldn't do enough for her, nothing was too much trouble - a classic case of love-bombing. The red flags appeared on their honeymoon but she, an empath with a history of abuse in childhood by her family, stuck with him, thinking she could help him. He demeaned her, ground her down with verbal cruelty, rages and gaslighting until she was so low, so physically ill, that she would have ended up dead. She did find the strength to divorce him and yet he still tries to control her and undermine me, behaving as if he is still married to her. We actually felt sorry for him, living on his own! After some quite astonishing things in emails from him, we have gone absolutely no contact and not a moment too soon. Where I strongly disagree with you is that I believe these people know exactly what they're doing. My wife has this admission from him in writing. They know good from evil and choose evil. They are Mr Nice to the world but quite different behind closed doors. They will use anything at all to get what they want and nothing you do can please them. They are parasites and vultures and having caused their tornado-like devastation, are very difficult to get rid of.
Niles Spindrift how did your wife manage to leave I’m at 17 years now w/ 1 teen child where did u meet I’m also so terrified it w/b hard to meet someone at this stage of life:(
Niles Spindrift Yes I’m 20 year married and yes they clearly know what they are doing .. i have him stating his cruelty and actions to to push me down to make him feel better .. that’s a quote BUT it’s the definition of wrong. They know what they are doing... But they don’t feel in their situation it is wrong . It is deserved . Read letters over closely and slowly.. we perceive them saying what that are doing is wrong but in my experience.. it is not 1 thought but 2 . 1 - What they are doing and 2- stating that action could be interpreted as wrong .. just my studying 2 years of recordings while I’m in my self imposed isolation and a masters from RUclips of course 😂.. 🤦🏼♀️
They are soooo aware of right from wrong...and soooo aware of what they are doing..Why would they behave nicely in front of outsiders but treat their partners with abuse.? Sly, deceitful and cowardly..
sunday clothes please dont cry on me, cant you see Im wearing my sunday clothes? what if you get tears on my shirt, or worse from your dripping nose Look your becoming a burden, at first this thing was kind of fun Now your expecting to much from me, and I feel the need to run You see this was never about you, no..theres things I just got to say That this friendship is all about me, and you have a part to play You make a pretty good supporting character, in my personal drama But make no mistake I dont want to hear anything about your pain or trauma I just dont have the ability, to feel this pesky thing called emapthy I look sad and nod, but in my heart I feel not one ounce of sympathy Ok good we got past that, and you are still standing there Now I need you to help me find something new to wear Church is coming up in a few days and its my turn to speak I think I have a great message about friendship, I hope its not to weak Do you think you can sit down there, but please wipe the tears from your face How am I supposed to recite it with you like that, how can I concentrate Do you think that I look better, if I hold my hands like like so Oh please call up all our friends...make that everyone that you know Tell them to be there on Sunday, and to wear their best set of clothes This is the way that our friendship will be and thats just the way that it goes. The Narcissism Chronicles...third piece in the collection Tammy Porter 9/27/18
Haha very accurate 😊 One time my Mother-in-law made me sit in the car for the entire church service because I didn't have a dress on. I just had a baby. She told me I wasn't able to go in because I was dirty. Some B.S. about having a girl baby made me dirty and I was not aloud by the church to go in for 30 days. I know she was just worry about how I looked and wanted to punish me as well! She didn't want me to have any attention. When I was in labor. My child coming into the world she asked the Dr to stop and take her blood pressure. When this didn't work she demand her son to take her home right this minute! Missing the birth only to than call and demand to be picked up and taken back to the hospital. Of course she drove everywhere she wants to go! 🤣 I asked her one time why she goes to so many funerals of people she never meet. She replied, "When I die I want everyone to come to my funeral and say look at how beautiful she looks. How amazing everything is! My God what an amazing person!" Haha and then she showed me her dress, her shoes every detail was planned out by her years ahead in her 30s. ("Just put me in the trash. When I am Dead my spirit is gone. It's just a body. Celebrate my life!" I was raised so different.) Now years later she is developing dementia, Alzheimer's and filled with so much angry. All alone in life. She has done horrible things to her son and the cause him a life time of issues! 🙏 This really is a cycle. It's spiritual! A life without living for God but for self and flesh! 🙏
I wonder if the reason why covert narcissists don't make it to the top in hierarchies is that they don't want the responsibilty which usually comes with the top job. Decision making and leading would demask them and nobody would believe their posing as a victim anymore. And it is hard work to be a leader. And you need at least sometimes to focus on the subject at hand and not solely on yourself and your needs. In a family they can be tyrannical and aggressive and still play the victim the next day. Covertly narcissistic mothers can set their family up perfectly as narcissistic supply. I think covert narcissists can be more dangerous because they can cause a lot more damage before - if ever - they are exposed.
quite often they are never exposed, because they are good at hiding their abuse behind closed doors and they are good at lying. This is very difficult for the victims who look crazy, over sensitive, and mentally unstable, because nobody believes them. It is especially bad for children who grow up with these mothers.
I'd say it's somewhat about not having "cover". When everyone is looking at you because you're calling the shots...there's very few people in the business setting to hide behind. It's a lot easier to deal with perception management when groups are small than to do it when groups are large. Also the level of scrutiny is high and constant. I think they would start to unravel because of their massive low self esteem. I also think your comment gets to the heart of it when you said basically that nobody would believe...in the position they attained...that life has left them as a helpless victim. Great observation.
Schlautropf G ...I’m pretty sure my husband had a passive aggressive covert narcissistic mother to learn from..He hinted at how she treated him...Since her death, he has unleashed this trait on me...And I fight back but get nowhere..
@Schlautropf - You've nailed it. Relinquishing the victim role would topple their entire personality structure. This explains why my (actual genius IQ) CN abruptly quit law school. It is the same reason they refused professional psychological, medical and dental help. Instead, they insisted that *I* be the caregiver in ways I could never fulfill. They refused professional help with controlling angry rages, controlling diabetes, preventing the loss of teeth. They lost four teeth in six months through lack of hygiene and lack of diabetes control. Can you imagine how deep the mental illness of one who pulls out their own teeth?? They were crying "Pity me! Pity me!" They passed away a few months ago from Covid - probably blaming me for that as well.
it became all about her needs...and yes, when I would question her ability to self reflect she would literally go blank...that ability to disconnect was so sad and yet I know it is a very effective self protection device. So so so effective. And yet her ability to feel nothing was so hard for me.
Thank you. You just described someone I used to know to the letter. He was a master of manipulation and gleaning sympathy. And boy, did I fall for it. What a wake up call.
The biggest fear for a covert narcissist is to be discovered. If they know you are aware of who they are they run as far away from you as possible hoping you don't expose them. They are broken!!
Nick Bargas I thought the same but still got the typical Christmas hoover. Ignored him completely and he ignored me as well and eventually left. Apparently he was ‘heat checking’ me to see how I would act in his presence and if anything was salvageable. I acted like he didn’t exist. Hopefully he will move on.
I was married to to a covert for 4 years. Made my escape in April and filed for divorce 10 days later including a restraining order. The mind games and silent treatment was unbelievable. He's my first and last narc. Thank you so much for this important information.
Christine Miller The mind games and silent treatment! Day’s and weeks on end. Not knowing what I said or didn’t say, did or didn’t do. Questioning my own memory, sanity, logical thinking and my feelings. Never getting a straight answer, words and questions turned around towards me EVERY time. My depression and anxiety is through the roof and I am trying to break free....
@@Mcfaddenclan000 I wish you luck with your escape. In the meantime try not giving the silent treatment any energy. Gray rock, do whatever you can to negate his negativity towards you. It's not easy but once you stop caring about how he reacts towards you It's easier on your anxiety and your overall health. Above all, get out asap! Much luck!!
Mine changed her style of clothing, got more tattoos and changed her style of music to completely mirror me. Then when she brought up a guy at the gym twice she ditched all that and became very sporty to mirror the next person on her way out of our relationship. Things to look out for!
Most of the time people leave a relationship and become attracted to someone new because they know in they're present relationship it's not going anywhere. Let's be honest if someone really is connected with you and wants to be with you you're together. And you don't want to take any risk to losing that that person. People leave relationships also when they find someone who has the same goals as they do. If someone likes to exercise and the other person, is a small example. Being equally yoked is important especially with values and goals. But primarily because you feel that person really cares about you, wants to see you be your best and wants to be with you on a regular basis. When you feel someone doesn't value you or need you or want you it is natural to look for someone else especially if you've had the conversation over and over and over again and nothing changes. This is in a dating relationship. Hopefully if you make the commitment to be married you have commonalities and feel loved and valued by the other person feeling has to be mutual or it doesn't work.
I've listened to so many posts about covert narcissists, but this one truly explained my mother. It was an extremely difficult childhood and also adulthood. I was my mothers chief scapegoat and I can never explain how tumultuous it was to have her there. Yet as you said others, even my siblings, never saw this. And not to my siblings, but to outsiders she played the victim card and they all believe her. But like you said she was/is hypersensitive to imagined slights and I was there for many of those events (I'm 59) and I know that in no way did these people act badly towards my mother, in fact it was the other way round. Thank you.
Useful insights in explaining the covert narcissist at a deeper level. This resonated with the NPD person I knew, whose persona was outward going and 'fun', and yet would portray themselves as a former victim and 'spiritually-orientated', self-effacing person. Only her partner and immediate family would be exposed to the outbursts, envy, and heightened sensitivity to criticism, or perceived slights (even if they were not intended, or didn't even exist)! The complete focus on self, victimhood, and struggle against feeling inferior in themselves can intensify the commitment of their unaware partner to 'try harder' and 'give more', which binds you closer as you try and support them and build/deepen the relationship - part of the parasitic tools that draw you in and drain your resources. I found if done well, can get the unaware non-narc victim to even excuse many things you wouldn't normally as your intuition is nudging, then shouting at you that 'things just aren't right'.
Disregard social norms only when no one is looking - nailed it! They will correct behavior if they think they have been spotted publicly but it's not because they necessarily have any remorse or upon self reflection realise that they did something bad and want to improve themselves. It's more that their public persona has been affected and they need to quickly tidy it up. I keep hearing that this kind of person cannot change but I am hopeful that I will find ways to encourage this to happen for them.
I’m glad where you left off on this video and wanted to add, which I suspect you will elaborate on in the next video, that one must be very careful about who one opens up to and tells their innermosst fears and woes to because these people present, ofttimes, as being very safe when, in fact, they are the opposite and revel in hearing your troubles. Or your insecurities. They love to store these up and try to trigger these insecurities if they have some ax to grind with you.And you’ll never see it coming.
I agree. It is uncanny how they have the ability to target your most vulnerable space so subtly. It is really quite debilitating and ties in with a deep need to possess what could be considered a potential threat to exposure and to harness the qualities and potentials of others, co-opting another's life to augment their own. Remaining hidden is not only a self protective mechanism for the covert, but is I feel also part of the hidden pleasure that is derived from causing continued suffering; a bit like a cat torturing a mouse and refusing to let it go. This is one of the reasons why covert narcissists are so very dangerous. It can be hard and take many years, to even begin to realise that one is caught in such a snare. Remaining hidden is the key to continued, successful operations. But, once seen a predator can no longer have the element of surprise. I do think there is a predatory element here rather than simply reactionary ... albeit perhaps unconsciously or subconsciously driven.
Bingo! I realized after a while it's like Lucy offering to hold the football for Charlie Brown - she always yanks it away at the last minute so she can enjoy seeing him fail and get the wind knocked out of him. When a covert narcissist acts like your friend and pretends sympathy, wants you to open up about your dreams, fears, and woes, do NOT fall for the bait. Many covert narcs have a sadistic streak. These forays into kindness are just ammunition-gathering expeditions into your private life. All this will be turned against you out of the blue later when their cruel side blares up. Amanda is right, predatory is the word, truly vicious, so don't give them ammo. Discuss as little as possible. Be as boring as possible. If you must talk, stick with the weather and what flowers are blooming.
Exactly... 6 years later they use something very sensitive against you. What? Wow. Why? It's sooooooo painful. My recommendation? NEVER have secrets... don't tell someone... WATCH OUT for your tendency to say, "OH, I've never told this to anyone before"... ALL NARCS LOVE THAT... their ears PERK UP... their eyes LIGHT up... watch for it. Tell them something you have told someone before. Make it innocuous. See if they use it against you later... often they'll do it in public. They'll make their comment seem so innocent. Tell you you're being too sensitive. There's your answer. NEVER trust them. Get out of that relationship as soon as possible OR decide NEVER to actually tell them things. Get a therapist. They've got client privilege and are so trained to stay non-emotional it's pathetic. They don't even bat an eye. What you've told them could tear you apart and they're like, uhhhhh... okay... whatever. How did it make you feel? Don't do it again, okay? Sooooo... either DIE with your secrets or tell them to a therapist... rarely tell a partner something that doesn't have a thing to do with them. Things you've worked on already. Learn to communicate your needs, your boundaries, your fears (being alone is a universal fear... and yes, the narc will tell you YOU'LL ALWAYS BE ALONE so just be ready for it now because it's not the end of the world to be alone than to be miserable with a narc), your hopes and dreams. They'll call you grandiose if you've got a dream. It's their negative nature. It is FINE for someone to caution you and ask you to consider all the angles. To be supportive. I have a tendency to 'get real' with friends that have business ideas. It's sort of funny but I've got a friend that always seems to come up with an idea that already exists. It's like they were in a bunker for 30 years and just discovered you can take a "party bus" to a concert or something. However, IF you want to start a business offering a TAME VERSION of a party bus to a vacation spot... go approach Senior Citizen homes... oh, wait. That ALREADY EXISTS. Old people are cute! Peace.
So spot on. Excellent. Covert narcissists using sarcasm, one liners, backhanded compliments, gosh so true. Very self referencing. Everything it seems is viewed through the lens of themselves. One thing you didn't mention is a complete inability to self analyse, they also seem to have a dissociation with their bodies, meaning an unwillingness to discuss anything other than on a superficial level. A complete lack of facing the truth about their own inner workings or physical workings of the body,. It's as if they go too deeply, they may discover something horrendous, therefore they never take responsibility for anything at all, It's always someone else's fault or problem. Highly sensitive to any perceived or real criticism. Rage is relegated to behind the scenes. Definitely a jeckle & hyde character. Quiet & humble to the outside world; introverted, introspective, spends large amounts of time in the head, moody, negative, angry in the inside world. Did they ever experience love from a parent? Were they put down all the time? Why so angry? Sad really. Can the covert narcissist be helped? Do they ever come to you for help? Or are they in total denial, believing they are always right & therefore don't need help? Your work doctor is much appreciated, thank you.
self analysing is actually a capability IF they can garner supply from it... that's why it's soooooo irritating once you're out and see it. Before... you just wanted to be there to support them through a difficult time. Poor you... living in a very small town... never get a chance to realize your potential... MOVE... oh, no... I couldn't do that. Okay. Whatever.
Narcissists all tell on themselves. We must endeavour as caring, empathetic humans to have healthy boundaries, to not ignore red flags, to not tolerate toxic behaviours from others and most importantly, to listen to what our inner voice and feelings tell us when we are around them.
I think they do tell on themselves. They accuse the victim of the things that they do and the personality traits they hold. My ex girlfriend was a narc and always called me manipulative, toxic and defensive. I had never been accused of that in my live before.
Regarding schadenfreude, I realized truly what I was up against in a prior relationship when once I finally took the provocative narcissist bait and set myself up for an insult and he said, "Phew, I feel better! I thought to myself "what kind of person feels better by insulting someone?" I knew it was time to get out.
The comments are highly significant - going even more in-depth. We are not alone in being hurt and into trouble dealing with those we have loved who have this condition. Thank you.
The most accurate and comprehensive analysis I’ve come across yet, you pull apart with exquisite accuracy the hidden layers that drive the covert narc’s behaviours, a huge help to those of us who have been exposed to and struggled to understand the neuroticisms and damage wrought by the CN. This exploration has helped many of us make sense of what happened. Thank you.
This is incredibly interesting. I can think of more than one person in my life who exhibits some of these traits. Because me insight into them in a way I’ve never had. Thanks for the video.
Your analysis of covert narcissists is spot on! Absolutely correct in every detail. The characteristics that separate them from the grandiose narcissist is important to understand.
Thank you for creating this video. I've watched it numerous times because it accurately describes a six-year relationship with a covert narcissist. This is so specific to his personality. A wolf in sheep's clothing for sure. I'm so glad I'm free.
Absolute best video on understanding a covert narcissist. Packed with content, while complicated, you do a wonderful job of communicating. Grateful I came upon this, look forward to more.
You're wonderful. As someone trying to make sense of my life (also with professional help), your clear and concise explanations are eye opening and mind boggling. You you have survived a covert narcissist (or 2) good on ya and congrats!!!! Another will never get past my boundries again!
🙏 Thank you Dr. Saad, excellent, highly informative introduction to Covert Narcissism, you described my Covert Narcissist Ex to a T, I was hooked by his victim stories, his soft spoken manner made irresistible by his striking blue eyes... But what was missing from your video for me was, from my own experience, their complete lack of empathy, which is actually a hallmark trait of all Narcissist, no doubt. My Covert Narcissist Ex simply did not have the Empathy chip installed. Worse, they don’t have the capacity to love! You did however explain about how they’re self-absorbed jerks and that it’s all about them, but the full impact of this egocentric trait is beyond destructive, it ultimately brought me down to my knees, I was diagnosed with CPTSD and had to to get therapy to heal. They have the emotional capacity of a petulant five-year old, rage outbursts and all, and masters of passive-aggression as you stated. They are dangerously toxic and I wish I’d know all this before walking away and staying away for good.... Greetings and love from Toronto 🇨🇦
So glad I found you on RUclips. I just learned that my boyfriend of 4 years, has had another woman for the past 7 years. We spoke on FB. Just so hard to swallow but with your help of explaining the narcissist, it made me feel like I wasn’t all to blame. He made me feel that way and took advantage of me at my weakest most vulnerable time of my life. (Was diagnosed with cancer). Since I busted him 3 days ago, he has managed to totally ignore me like I never even existed. I’m in your empathy state of Alarm right now. Thank you for everything that you do. You are amazing.
Thank you so much for talking about this in such detail. I don't want to be this way anymore. I don't want sympathy, I want to be kind and proud of myself. I didn't meant to be this way.
I wish I could give this video 1000 thumbs up. The Dr. describes my wife perfectly. It has taken me almost a decade to figure out why she does what she does. I always made excuses for her behavior. Please more covert Narc videos. Amazing information.
Hello. Yes spot on! I had always ended up making excuses and covering up for my ex narc wife's repeated poor behaviour during our 15 year relationship. Even after we split up I was still asking people not to judge her etc. Then I realised that she was still smearing me behind the scenes and lots of people came to me retelling their stories of horrible interactions they had had with her over the years. It was at this point that I truly discovered that she didn't deserve another second of my compassion or love. It was at this point I discovered she was a narc. And at this point I started telling the world about who she really was. She had me so well conned! Unbelievably tricked. The mind manipulation has been deep and very well constructed by her. I've lost so much of myself and my life to her. Everything has suffered. My heart, my relationships with other people, my work and my finances. I guess I'm very lucky to be here now at the very least. Kind regards Warren (Australia)
This is a great video. Explains why he was always looking at me and comparing himself. Narcs always want to compete. They are capable of charm and seduce by talking about how they were hurt or abused. They essentially mirror an empath but if you are paying attention you will see how often they break the rules.
This describes it so well and in detail. Every single thing applies to the one i knew. It's good to hear about it in this type of analysis, gives sense to things you knew weren't right but not exactly why.
It means instead of confronting someone one on one they will use another person to do it for them. They will spin a story to get that other person on side against the second person. My mum did this to her children against our father and she did it with her kids against each other. Until our bubbles burst we couldn't see what she was really doing. :(
Same here, older sister, we both inherited the same propriety, she never pays a dime for maintenance, and I'm forced to do all the work myself as it's too expensive for me to pay for it... she has her own a 1 million house, but wants to know every time I rent part of our propriety, and sabotages the deals ! I don't know what to do...
I have dealt with an overt narcissist, but it was like playing in an afternoon rain storm compared to when I later dealt with a covert narcissist, which was like trying to organize life in the middle of an evil tornado.
Thank you Dr Saad, I understand now and this gives me peace. You're doing a great service to people by posting these vids, once again thank you for the precious gift of freedom through understanding.
I truly feel like God sent me to your videos I never even heard the term empath but now that I've learned all about it I'm truly beginning to understand why I attract toxic relationships and I'm able to make the changes thank you so much God bless you
@s.hicks7213 Nah. Was right then and am right now. Not everything has to be a "sign" or a "godsend". Delusion will stop you before anyone else does. If you want to live in your blind spots? I won't stop ya. Peace.
This is the BEST video on covert narcissism, hands down. point blank, PERIOD. This perfectly describes a close family member I have been struggling with for years. Thank you so much for this video. It is saving my mind.
You nailed it. I've known a person in my life was narcissistic and psychopathic but the person never fit the grandiose narcissistic traits. It is a relief to understand the covert narcissist traits. Many thanks!
I was friends with a community worker who was highly narcissistic. My first clue of this was the way in which he spoke of the individuals he was meant to be mentoring. On speaking of some one with addiction issues he was "helping" he commented to myself."you have to understand Steph, these people are never going to amount to anything". As he was smirking. I was shocked. But moving on I quickly realised that the very reason he was in the job he was in was simply because he believed he was far better than them. on asking about other individuals he worked with it was apparent this was not about helping people in desperate need of help but he was in a position to feel grandiose next to them. The way he spoke of these service users was quite frankly shocking. Not just those with addiction issues but mental illness, those living in poverty etc. He had absolutely no respect for them, mocked them continuously and they always seemed to be a drag on His time. The way he spoke they were lucky to have him in their lives. He would consistently complain about the fact he wouldn't get a promotion with fact he was "working with such people" and in his view not gaining anything from it. It was nothing to do with assisting vulnerable individuals but putting him on a pedestal where he would be looked up to. He would even talk of them fancying him!!!!😂 Suffice to say, I'm no longer friends with him...because of this and fact he started to believe I fancied him also!!!!!!😂😂 Strange thing is there was a part of me that felt bad for him because I knew he in fact had very low self esteem. Treated badly by overly demanding parents. However not an excuse. That was certainly a bullet I dodged!!!
The knowledge in these videos are GOLD. Any type of narc seeks out people that will fall into or play their games. Being able to spot them completely takes away their power, that’s why I’m always going to study this!
This video is blowing my mind! Thank you for explaining this information in such a highly understandable way. You are helping SO many people with the work you are doing.
Thanks Abdul for posting this valuable information. I was a victim of a covert narcissus. It took me some time to discover him but I recognize many of the behavior patterns you mention in him. The best thing one victim can do to stop their abuse is to get away and establish zero contact with this kind of individuals.
Great insight. Covert behaviour operates out of the detached self and manifests in many forms, can be overt and covert in a split second. I'm my studies I've witnessed the detached protector as covert and the detached self soother as overt. The litigiousness behaviour you speak of is spot on, again a covered up version to argue and gain power over others and if done in a legal way this only reinforces the self as righteous in their behaviours. Covert is to me in simple terms, a cover of the real self however they are so far down the line and without professional guidance would find great difficulty in knowing who they really are. When we feel uneasy, when we think negatively on certain people's behaviours toward us, this is our healthy adult telling us to walk away. Keep posting, you are a breath of fresh air in an otherwise frightened world.
Your descriptions make me feel as though you know my experience personally. So very enlightening and healing for me. Thank you so much. I just was not familiar with this form of mental illness to give proper credit to what I experienced. Plus the lovebombing countered the initially subtle presentation of the covert behaviors that later over took everything good and has sustained as the primary behavior.
Eye opening and so appreciated. :) This helps so much to better understand them, to observe those “upward comparisons”. One of the narcissists who frustrated me most is almost the very person you describe to the letter. Middle manager, underestimates his talents and abilities, his fear of too much success disguised as acceptance that the hierarchy is designed to keep him from further promotion. Prides himself on his relationship with his employees who look up to him and do much of the grunt work he shouldn’t have to do. He has made statements that he subtly uses “public embarrassment” to keep the high conflict types in line. You tease about Schadenfreude but you must deliver more on the topic so that we don’t leave novellas in your comment section. :) Thank you so!
Thank you for bringing this information to a platform. I am the child of a covert narcissist who I didn't realize was such until years after I severed the relationship completely. This information is extremely valuable.
Spot on once again. The 'hidden tactics' you identify are poorly recognised and very harmful to those around them. Colleagues, partners and children of 'these' personality types are traumatised often longterm by their anger, lack of shame and total insensitivity, and their ability to disarm others by their 'victim' role without any remorse. Given you say they are aware of this how they operate how can these behaviours be mitigated? It would appear they thrive on conflict, as is evidenced through their HR departments at workplaces, legal and Court Systems keeping poorly educated mental and legal professionals, well paid for often poor results for victims.
This is exactly what I have been seeing in family members. We live in a region of the country in which there seems to be entire family structures that encourage this narcissism.
Your validation of my experience is deeply appreciated. Thank you for all the important education you share. I’d like to learn about the resulting hurt a covert narc can do to a person and how to overcome their toxicity. I know it’s been a painful downward spiral of my being. Again, I am so grateful for your videos.
Profound session thankyou: I feel the need as one listens to be careful for these insights can impact those who seek honesty and truth within themselves (old wisdom: when in doubt hold that doubt against yourself). My thoughts: We live in a world of aggravation and denial that tries to manipulate our perceptions by (covert) propaganda or that of direct force or control that impacts the freedom of individuality and how each of us uniquely thinks and feels thus threatens our inert perceptions of reality (cognitive dissonance). There are two options: 1. to speak one's thoughts: 2. to be silent: Self: Discomfort is where something is mirrored to you that you don’t like about yourself. Discomfort is where something is projected or deflected that is not your perception of self. Ego: Projection: I am right and you are wrong. I am good therefore you must be bad. Deflection: I am right and you are wrong. I am good therefore you must be bad. The concept of being perceived as good or bad provokes a stimulus response. It is the underlying motive of self and that of the other and those actions or reactions (motives) that are the true focus that need to be identified and observed. Empathy: Mirroring: You have a right to your opinion and I have a right to mine. e.g. 'I hear what you say that I'm too sensitive' Perhaps I am ... does that offend you? Children in dysfunctional families are conditioned that to have their basic needs of acceptance and feeling loved met then they must be ‘good’. It is a training of conformance and that of control for should they not meet expectations they face not being loved. Trying to heal those devastated is treating the symptom and not the cause. A singular standalone dysfunction or is it? Or is it reinforced by community action or non-action. Should we be good then the other must be bad and this leads to thinking or behaviour of ‘logical fallacies’, not respectful of others in debates or acceptance of those differences of opinions. This dysfunction of man occurs as a primal survival need to be accepted as one of a group for to become ostracised one is put out to survive alone and that often meant in early times the certainty of death. Therefore there is much pressure to be conformed with external stimuli responses to the thinking of the group. It is a human trait or dysfunction that’s recorded in history since the beginning of time. The one who deciphers this dysfunctional code will bring about world peace and harmony.
My family been damaged by narcissism neighbor and I discovered this symptoms just these three weeks through pop up RUclips. Also, I have been praying to God for helps to solve these problems. Thank you for enlightenment.
Yes Yes Yes Always the Victim So its crack for codependents and Empaths because they make you think you are one of them. Also because they are so accommodating and placid When they Privately of course explode on you they name All the things they pretended to enjoy with you . It is Scary stuff.. You’re work is Stellar as Always. Thanks Sooo Much 🤓🙏🏻🤩
How do you like this back handed compliment: "I'd forgotten that you could actually be quite articulate." It wasn't a joke! She entirely thought this way. Always put herself above everyone else. Not only me. Had to get rid of her.
Both narcissistic types are good at snide remarks and jokes at people's expense. They are so conceited and unsympathetic and snobby and judgemental. Their smugness even shows in their tone of voice and eyes.
I wish this was anonymous, but I’m going to go ahead and ask my question anyway. I believe I was raised by a covert narcissist and I believe I am an empath. But some of the ways you describe the covert narc remind me of me, too: painfully sensitive to criticism, feeling “special” one moment and inferior the next, making upward social comparisons... Perhaps much of this is what was “given” to me by my narc. And I’ve outright asked a therapist if I could be a narcissist myself, and they said no, because if I asked the question, it would indicate I am not. But what if I, too, was covert, even to me? I still worry: can an empath/sensitive become so harmed by a narcissist that they essentially become one? Is this what covert narcissism actually is - a sensitive person who has been so deeply hurt that they cannot stop self-referencing their pain and drag everyone else along with them? How do I avoid this when I have done years and years of therapy and still feel frustrated at not seeing the results I want or ever feeling “healed” or (G-d forbid) “normal.” Any thoughts on this? Thanks for the video. It’s a tricky topic.
I hear what you're saying. I would say I feel the same way. I think some of these symptoms of covert narcissism describe me too on some level. I've intentionally exposed my self to criticism and attempting to get to the root of my vulnerability and hurt and this is helpful. Its embarrassing to note the narcissism. Nonetheless, I think this is a by product of a faulty family system which isn't my fault, wounding from said system and unconscious habits that have me at odds internally and being split between feeling deep empathy for others, wanting to be of service and the grandiosity and self absorption. Its troubling to reconcile. I've noticed a big difference as I've progressively gotten into touch with my vulnerable side and felt the pain and anguish of essentially being used for others unmet emotional needs. In turn, I have been attempting to meet my own emotional needs and also cultivating humility through all of it. It's hard to acknowledge these things when the very thing that hurt you and was largely responsible for this incomplete personality structure out of no fault of your own is the very thing that is potentially hurtful, self sabotaging and dangerous to the world you feel so deeply for. I have told my therapist a decade ago I suspected this about my self. It's been my dirty little secret but what this video explains is that the biggest fear lies in the exposure of this hidden world. I'm going to expose this part of me to a group of trusted people and have it done with. Let them criticize me and just break down in my pain. It feels like the only way to the root and ultimately may lead to rebuilding a better way to relate to people.
Oh my god, yes! I even keep a diary on how to be better and how not to be a narcissist I cant stop thinking about this. The cycle of abuse needs to stop
From what I have read, if youve been by a narcissistic person, ( for a long long period of time, think of a family member or a partner ) chances you might emulates some of their behavior or thinking but it doesnt mean that youre one. Especially if it was a parent or anyone who raised you. but don’t worry haha the minute you’re aware of your bad behavior, the minute you start questioning yourself and want to be a better person, you’re far from narcissistic tendencies
This is my husband and my mother. My husband apologized to me before his death. He said, "I am sorry for the way I treated you." I am striving to have a healthy relationship with my elderly mother; that is, I am taking care of myself while I honor her as a parent.
Thank you for this. I wish we learned some of this growing up. It is so helpful in recognizing negative aspects in ourselves and preventing others from imposing theirs on us. Many of us are completely in the dark for much of our lives. I experienced a lot of hurt and confusion, from prolonged contact with this type of person. I'm certainly not perfect either, but the volumes of underhanded and at times outright cruelty that someone like this can hand out, continually.. I struggled so much to understand it, and no one I confided in about it, recognized it for what it was either and always suggested to just ignore it. I only began to recognize it, after learning about character development for creative writing. There's almost no awareness, protection and prevention, taught to the average person - we learn about this after most of the damage has been done. We all need our struggles in life, to learn and grow. But I think more understanding in this area should be provided for people growing into adulthood though. I really appreciate your channel.
I really appreciate your grounded empathetic approach to covert narcissism. It helps me to have compassion for someone who hurt me very deeply, which helps me let go of this hurt.
In my experience a narcissist can never forget criticism. They see anything that does fit into their plan as criticism you can jump through hoops but you will pay for it for the rest of your life.
Bravo! The social justice warriors comment is so spot on! Thank you for keeping this channel. So many interesting and well-thought out, non-cliche presentations. May God continue to give you health, success and return the good you do for others tenfold! With admiration, a viewer.
Your videos are so highly educational and your way of explaining these complex topics is excellent, I truly appreciate your kindness and the intellectual input. Thank you
I have been watching your videos for a few days and I am so very grateful for your work, Abdul. I am a relationship therapist and also on my own personal journey of healing. The quality of your work is a Godsend. Your information and delivery are stellar, crisp, clean, solid and masterful. So easy to digest and fold right into the batter of my learning and healing journey, and my work with clients. Your genuineness and humble service are palpable. What a gift. I'm already wiser and stronger from watching. Thank you so very much.
So spot on, Abdul. Thank you for your clear and objective analysis. I am slowly emerging/recovering from a 2-year relationship with a person with whom I had fallen deeply in love and with whom I was about to make a new life. He was someone who I trusted and to whom I gave my all. The relationship ended shockingly, abruptly and coldly when I was 'discarded' for simply being human. I realise now that I was his narcissistic supply. The moment I began to question different aspects of his behaviour, the dynamics changed between us. I could not process all this at the time. I kept on supplying. In the end, I had numerous meltdowns, the result of which was me being judiciously kicked to the kerb; total rejection and no opportunity to discuss. Recovery from all this continues and is a day-to-day process. I know so much more now and am still learning! Hallelujah.
Extremely accurate information video. Your videos help me bring closure to so many unanswered questions - thank you. My instincts were right, I will always trust myself more in future.
What is intriguing is to read the comments to these videos. It's so rewarding to pathologize others and view oneself as the healthy empath or the abused or not as bad, which in itself is a form of narcissism. I posit that we all have such flaws to varying degrees. But women are very susceptible to this lacuna, as the ratio of women to men's comments suggests.
This is the best explanation I have seen yet. The 4 domains are very helpful. I worked with one who was so hypersensitive to criticism that she twisted everything to become a criticism. This conditioned me to speak less in her presence, and she then viewed that as me hating or excluding her. So then I kept everything bland, and was labelled "boring". She was very manipulative, and I think that her hypersensitivity and resentfulness, and my need to get along for the sake of harmony, trapped me into this no-win situation. She did embed herself in the hierarchical structure (and saw herself as the power behind the throne). She acted as gatekeeper to control access to the supervisor, and to control the supervisor's perception of others. She enjoyed schadenfreude and also had a lot of freudenschade - presumably believing that the success was rightfully hers. She was a gaslighting gold medallist, and would (when no-one else was around) get very aggressive when her narrative was threatened. She had so many people fooled.
I have watched hundred of videos about narcissism and this one has been my best. Thank you for making such a informative video. You have a new subscriber.
This is spot on of my last serious relationship. I’ve been free from it for two years. Makes me not want to date anymore. I don’t want to run into anyone else like that. And I pray no one else experiences it. I would Not wish that kind of relationship on my Worst enemy! Anyone who deals with this type of person must get counseling. Hands down!
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They are truly wounded people who spend their lives trying to destroy others to make themselves feel better.
Yes they're indeed traumatized ppl ! I am truly fed up & sick of them !
Your right because I was naturally empathic person. Before I kept being disrespected by people. Now I am more aware of people's narcissistic behavioural traits . I have less empathy if people want my time or are disrespectful. I'm still nice and polite but I dont take it personally if people are inconsiderate or guilt trip me . I have less time for people and I have more time for myself. Before I would go out my way to be nice and understanding. Now I'm quick to see people's narcissistic behaviour. It's best to keep it polite with people these days and dont take it personally if people are inconsiderate. They are showing their true self. They want to boost their egos. If people show disrespect they lack respect. When people lack respect they become more inconsiderate and conceited. It's best parents teach their kids old fashioned politeness and respect people's feelings. And teach them to mind their own business and not try to be the centre of attention. To avoid their kids being too full of themselves.
Wounded hits the nails
@@rachelsimbhu4383 Taking long hikes, I find myself saying the Serenity prayer when thoughts of the narcissits come to mind. "God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things that I can, and the wisdom to know the difference."
@Snow Flakes whaaaaa@@@aaat????
U hear yourself talk?
My experience is it is always like walking on eggshells, their feelings take precedence over a room full of people and they are forever sitting in the wagon and being expected to be pulled along in life.
The selective amnesia is so irritating. There can be no real discussion about how they have hurt us. When an example is given to help explain our point, “I don’t remember saying or doing that” is the convenient reply. You can only make a point by pointing out the repeated lack of memory. It’s too much! Combine the amnesia with gaslighting and you have a true crazy making machine picking away at your mental and emotional health.
How about, “I’m sorry for everything I’ve ever done.” 🙄
With these people they win each time. When they know you are on to them, they become understanding and sometimes seem real and caring, such as normal people like you and I. They are not like us at all. They can twist anything so quickly to feet victim mode or attack
in hidden tactics, threats. Any reaction is brilliant as you are taking part in their dance. Stand back and act like nothing has been said or done. As anything you react back with, whether kindness or anger will work in their plan and games they play. Good luck, work on yourself and believe what you have been through and seen. Don't go back for more. 🙏👼🏻
The best part is some of them will even manufacture events that never happened or things you never said and insist consistently that it did happen. They’re beyond insane. And nothing can or will ever help them...tbh they don’t even deserve help, just to be cut off for good.
You have hit on how I am currently living.....emotionally exhausted
For sure.. I always say : HOW CONVENiENT FOR YOUR " BAD MEMORY".. BUT YET THEIR MEMORY. YET FOR THEIR DEFENCE, SUDDENLY THEIR MEMORY IS EXCELLENT FOR THEIR CONVENIENCE TO PROSPER THEM .THEY HAVE A LARGER THAN LIFE MEMORY FOR THEMSELVES.. BUT WHEN IT COMES TO US..
SUDDENLY THEIR MEMORY IS EXCELLENT !!!
At first you are attracted to how "meek", "caring" and "compassionate" they are. But you will soon discover how evil these people truly are.
EXACTLY this!
It's amazing how they can take the mask on and off so seamlessly
So true
Meek is a great word to describe her.
Totally agreed 👍
always said arguing with these people is like trying to nail down jello.
Marti Walsh is true ... unbelievable to make them even admit to one mistake.
WOW... that is exactly the way I describe it to other people... trying to nail Jello to the wall.
Great analogy
I get it, as an Aussie is like to see Aeroplane jelly stuck on a wall too, but I don't think it's going to happen somehow.
That's a great way to put it lol
Thankyou for this video! I suffered for 50 years and even though I am now a widow, I have been coping with guilt because I had begun to believe what I was fed over the many years. I cannot believe the clarity you have brought to my soul, I feel enlightened and grateful to you for making these so real and practical videos. My main grief was the Whats your problem? whenever my partner had caused chaos and left me to sort out the public flack. Also the selective memory, deliberately not remembering vital things we discussed, implying I was a liar, especially in the company of others. I thought I was going mad. The lack of enthusiasm for any achievements I reached, resenting awards I won, refusing to meet my friends and curbing my confidence. The person also deliberately looked shabby, drove old vehicles and cultivated a poor image which was all unnecessary, always the victim. I had to play down everything bright and good in my life to avoid displeasure. Now I know that I have been sane all along, successful in my career and a good mother. Its a bit late in life, but now have some hope back, what a hell of a lesson! If only someone had talked about this years ago.
I am still reeling after dealing with what I believe to be a covert narcissist. She had a very sad tale to tell about her life and of all the people that did her wrong. This extended to her daughter as well. I later learnt that behind my back she was scapegoating my daughter as being the reason why her daughter “didn’t have a voice”. She wanted my daughter to be punished and when she finally let some of her fury explode the angry person she truly is came forward.
This woman speaks with the softest voice but she is the most aggressive angry person I have ever met. I am glad that I no longer have contact with her.
They have such soft voices. I am sorry but when a person complains I distance myself
It’s so unbelievable to others
Beware of people who use baby voices. It is a manipulation ploy nothing else. I have seen female friends and relatives use breathy baby voices to convey that they are not a threat and that they are warm emotional people. They are anything but. They are cold and calculating and when no one else is around and they think you are vulnerable, you will hear the imperiously large and commanding voice boom out at you when they try to bully you. When you turn on them and call them out, the baby voice immediately comes back. Seen it happen. It's as though they are possessed by a dark entity that likes pretending it is a schoolgirl.
They sabotage and entrap, sabotage and entrap. All the while denying the fact. 17 yrs and my life is in ruins , only becoming apprised of this dynamic a year ago. Highly accurate. Thank you
Covet narcissists are Emotional vampires! Ugh. This video nailed it 🔨
Oscar, thank you. I'm no longer with him. Divorced close to a year.
Omg my husband drains every bit of the energy out of my son an I he is completely impossible, a true vampire, !!!!
A lot of empathetic people I know who have been hurt and have become bitter.. I have noticed also a lot of covert narcissistic people. Are snobs and their feelings are easily hurt . they might do big nice gestures and get their feelings hurt if people don't give them compliments. Or take what they say or do seriously especially if they make a joke and nobody laughs. Also they are conceited and unsympathetic and like to make snide remarks. And hate it when people fight back . Or they just say whatever. But wont let it go and seek the person as enemies. They also love to criticize people calling them arrogant or insensitive. They love making everything personal. And even talking about people's problems and like to analyse their problems and behaviour. Ive seen one call someone insecure and the other person said no I think that's you . And the covert narcissistic person had a big tantrum.
And true vampire..
They can't express their anger so they destroy something of yours.
That happened to me too. I’m sorry.
My heart
@@avanellehansen4525 Sweet thing ❤️ I'm sorry. I hope you feel better soon.
@s.hicks7213 I just don't get involved in his life and stay away from conversations about meaningful things. I just simply live as an individual who knows I am not in a marriage but a play that is in his head. So I keep my distance even though we live in the same house I have my own room. Don't get involved in their life. Period!
This is hands-down the best description of covert narcissism I've come across! You've hit the nail so squarely on the head and covered many aspects I've never heard explained at all, or explained so concisely. You've really helped me to better understand this person in my life. Particularly the part about them following all social norms, except when no-one's watching... when they can then show their true personality attributes, like aggression and other antisocial behaviours. This is so true!! Thank you for this confirmation :)
And also the part about playing the victim to get what they want! Spot on! I've been asked many times if someone I know to be covert is "a charmer" (overt), and they're not. This video explains how they charm through getting sympathy. It's sad how well it works...
Out the gate he played the victim: I was abused, I hate my mom, she's crazy (she is BPD) he has no real friends...now I see why! Out 2 years and finding my self worth again!
Finding your self worth and self love is HUGE to healing and getting out and safe!
yes! i agree- another clue of the covert narc is they have no "real" friends- because they are NOT trustworthy- they have usually lost all of them! or if they have any, they are just superficial "facebook" friends or ones they see on a rare occasion. my ex BF never introduced me to any of his friends or family, and i now know why!!!! what a creep. good riddance, TC!
This is my ex husband. Very passive aggressive and negative, everyone is out to get him in some way, he’s jealous of others and puts others down in front of me but never publicly. I told him he is narcissistic and he says no that’s not me, I’m not that guy. I think he just thinks of the overt narcissist, which he is nothing like, so he can’t see it himself. I ended up with and eating disorder, depression and anxiety after 11 years together and I think he was feuling it. I’m so much better now since I left!
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So happy for you!! 😄 Glad you escaped and hope you are well now and healing from the abuse you have suffered.
Good for you,you'll be much better for it!! 🙌🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾💯
He didbt leave you alone though right? They never do. I reportee mine but the case was closed.
There is someone where I work now that is exactly like that. It's like you described her, most passive-aggressive, negative, insecure, jealous person I've ever met. Really glad I'll stop working there in a month.
This is spot on, based on my almost 50 years of personal experience with now 6 of the covert narcs in my immediate family, extended family and friends I’ve had in my younger adult years.
I’ve been studying and researching cluster B personality disorders with a focus on NPD for over 15 years now and codependency for almost the same amount of time.
The damage of narcissists passes from generation to generation and spreads out to create codependents, seek out codependents and destroy codependents.
Love and respect yourself and your children and you can avoid getting entangled with these sad and abusive individuals. They seek and destroy.
Hypervillagent to criticism. You nailed it!
My mother once left a plugged in hair dryer in the main sink in the bathroom . We had children of age 3 and 5 at the time. When i told her off for putting the children's life at risk she went ballistic. Half an hour of screaming rage at me. No sorry from her at all. No admission she did anything wrong.
Hypersensitivity
Tab tabtab My husband almost drown our son in the pool and when I said we should watch out for signs of dry-drowning, he screamed at me. I can relate.
They seek to destroy anyone who has an opinion about them. Zero remorse
I have noticed a lot of covert narcissistic people. Are either highly friendly people but get rejected and play the victim when people dont want to talk to them. Or they are either not very clever. Or they are over weight or they are not that attractive. And are jealous of people better then.
This is excellent. I have been observing my covert for years. Long before I knew it even had a name. These traits are precisely what I observed. Unfortunately it took me 20 years and numerous physical and mental health problems before I left.
Yes, my covert enjoyed my misfortunes. It took some time for me to realize that when I was sad or ill, he was happy as a lark. When I was feeling happy he would play head games etc. to bring me down so he could be happy.
Oh yes. That was my Narc husband, even more than my super selfish sister. My husband seems almost more than a Narc. I wonder at times if he’s a a psychopath. My sister lies and bad mouths everyone, has always put me down and been extremely envious and jealous of me, always. And it was harder for her, as I was the stronger, smarter sister. My Narc husband always seemed to want to compete with me. This became more obvious as the. years passed by.
The only time my covert narcissist ever smiled was when someone was in pain . Hé adored watching my newborn son Be circumcised . He came out beaming “ he screamed his Guts out !!! » truly horrible
I so hear you. I would get kicked when I was down. He seemed to love it when I was in a bad place.
My narc is happiest when people are sick or financially dependent I guess bc they can't fight back
Same 😔
This is true ,we have to watch out ,be carefull,never undestimate how dangerous this people can be...
I went from a more grandiose narc to a covert one because, at the time, I thought #2 was OPPOSITE from the first one. Not true!! Just a different manifestation of their issues. And #2 did not show his negative attributes until well into the relationship. At that time he revealed an evil side, telling me how he takes revenge on work associates he perceives as slighting him. It was chilling! Gone no contact!! Thankful to be free.
hope46sf oh wow! I did *exactly* the same. The experience was horrific. Hope you're free and better now x
Same here, I've been making an exit plan.
hope46sf exact same here
Ditto
Exactly same thing happened to me. Carbon copy methodology that they use. So liberating when you realize that rather than being the only one to experience this abuse, that there are others with identical stories. Truly bizzare!
I can't believe it took me literally 36 years with this person to Discover what i've been dealing with.
Thank you.
This was easily the best explained and revealing explanation of covert narcissism. Absolutely spot on. Answered so many questions I had. So much brought to light, giving amazing clarity into the disorder of my ex-spouse. It made me realize our relationship was doomed even before we met. There was no way on God's green earth it had a chance. None. Thank you so much for your contribution.
I love your approach! The tone is intelligent calm and kind.
Having spent the last 5 years helping my wife to pick up the pieces after a 29 year marriage to a covert narcissist, I feel in a position to make some comments - especially as I had known the man in question for even longer as we were "friends" from about 20 years of age.
He was a bully and a lier with a fabricated history, with a mean and cruel streak, but portrayed himself as nice, reasonable and wise and along with many others, despite the red flags, I was lulled into thinking he was ok and we hung out a lot together. He was (surprise) in middle management in a bureaucratic organisation.
When he met this woman, he was Mr NiceGuy for 2 years - couldn't do enough for her, nothing was too much trouble - a classic case of love-bombing. The red flags appeared on their honeymoon but she, an empath with a history of abuse in childhood by her family, stuck with him, thinking she could help him. He demeaned her, ground her down with verbal cruelty, rages and gaslighting until she was so low, so physically ill, that she would have ended up dead. She did find the strength to divorce him and yet he still tries to control her and undermine me, behaving as if he is still married to her. We actually felt sorry for him, living on his own! After some quite astonishing things in emails from him, we have gone absolutely no contact and not a moment too soon.
Where I strongly disagree with you is that I believe these people know exactly what they're doing. My wife has this admission from him in writing. They know good from evil and choose evil. They are Mr Nice to the world but quite different behind closed doors. They will use anything at all to get what they want and nothing you do can please them. They are parasites and vultures and having caused their tornado-like devastation, are very difficult to get rid of.
Niles Spindrift how did your wife manage to leave I’m at 17 years now w/ 1 teen child where did u meet I’m also so terrified it w/b hard to meet someone at this stage of life:(
I also think that narcs are aware of what they are able to do to some people and since they chose destruction, I would call them evil also.
Niles Spindrift
Yes I’m 20 year married and yes they clearly know what they are doing .. i have him stating his cruelty and actions to to push me down to make him feel better .. that’s a quote BUT it’s the definition of wrong. They know what they are doing...
But they don’t feel in their situation it is wrong . It is deserved . Read letters over closely and slowly.. we perceive them saying what that are doing is wrong but in my experience.. it is not 1 thought but 2 . 1 - What they are doing and 2- stating that action could be interpreted as wrong .. just my studying 2 years of recordings while I’m in my self imposed isolation and a masters from RUclips of course 😂..
🤦🏼♀️
They are soooo aware of right from wrong...and soooo aware of what they are doing..Why would they behave nicely in front of outsiders but treat their partners with abuse.? Sly, deceitful and cowardly..
Thats not covert, thats overt
sunday clothes
please dont cry on me, cant you see Im wearing my sunday clothes?
what if you get tears on my shirt, or worse from your dripping nose
Look your becoming a burden, at first this thing was kind of fun
Now your expecting to much from me, and I feel the need to run
You see this was never about you, no..theres things I just got to say
That this friendship is all about me, and you have a part to play
You make a pretty good supporting character, in my personal drama
But make no mistake I dont want to hear anything about your pain or trauma
I just dont have the ability, to feel this pesky thing called emapthy
I look sad and nod, but in my heart I feel not one ounce of sympathy
Ok good we got past that, and you are still standing there
Now I need you to help me find something new to wear
Church is coming up in a few days and its my turn to speak
I think I have a great message about friendship, I hope its not to weak
Do you think you can sit down there, but please wipe the tears from your face
How am I supposed to recite it with you like that, how can I concentrate
Do you think that I look better, if I hold my hands like like so
Oh please call up all our friends...make that everyone that you know
Tell them to be there on Sunday, and to wear their best set of clothes
This is the way that our friendship will be and thats just the way that it goes.
The Narcissism Chronicles...third piece in the collection
Tammy Porter
9/27/18
Wow
Wow..
Haha very accurate 😊 One time my Mother-in-law made me sit in the car for the entire church service because I didn't have a dress on. I just had a baby. She told me I wasn't able to go in because I was dirty. Some B.S. about having a girl baby made me dirty and I was not aloud by the church to go in for 30 days. I know she was just worry about how I looked and wanted to punish me as well! She didn't want me to have any attention. When I was in labor. My child coming into the world she asked the Dr to stop and take her blood pressure. When this didn't work she demand her son to take her home right this minute! Missing the birth only to than call and demand to be picked up and taken back to the hospital. Of course she drove everywhere she wants to go! 🤣 I asked her one time why she goes to so many funerals of people she never meet. She replied, "When I die I want everyone to come to my funeral and say look at how beautiful she looks. How amazing everything is! My God what an amazing person!" Haha and then she showed me her dress, her shoes every detail was planned out by her years ahead in her 30s. ("Just put me in the trash. When I am Dead my spirit is gone. It's just a body. Celebrate my life!" I was raised so different.) Now years later she is developing dementia, Alzheimer's and filled with so much angry. All alone in life. She has done horrible things to her son and the cause him a life time of issues! 🙏 This really is a cycle. It's spiritual! A life without living for God but for self and flesh! 🙏
I want more from these Narcissism Chronicles!
I wonder if the reason why covert narcissists don't make it to the top in hierarchies is that they don't want the responsibilty which usually comes with the top job. Decision making and leading would demask them and nobody would believe their posing as a victim anymore. And it is hard work to be a leader. And you need at least sometimes to focus on the subject at hand and not solely on yourself and your needs. In a family they can be tyrannical and aggressive and still play the victim the next day. Covertly narcissistic mothers can set their family up perfectly as narcissistic supply. I think covert narcissists can be more dangerous because they can cause a lot more damage before - if ever - they are exposed.
quite often they are never exposed, because they are good at hiding their abuse behind closed doors and they are good at lying. This is very difficult for the victims who look crazy, over sensitive, and mentally unstable, because nobody believes them. It is especially bad for children who grow up with these mothers.
I'd say it's somewhat about not having "cover". When everyone is looking at you because you're calling the shots...there's very few people in the business setting to hide behind. It's a lot easier to deal with perception management when groups are small than to do it when groups are large. Also the level of scrutiny is high and constant. I think they would start to unravel because of their massive low self esteem.
I also think your comment gets to the heart of it when you said basically that nobody would believe...in the position they attained...that life has left them as a helpless victim. Great observation.
Schlautropf G ...I’m pretty sure my husband had a passive aggressive covert narcissistic mother to learn from..He hinted at how she treated him...Since her death, he has unleashed this trait on me...And I fight back but get nowhere..
@Schlautropf - You've nailed it. Relinquishing the victim role would topple their entire personality structure. This explains why my (actual genius IQ) CN abruptly quit law school. It is the same reason they refused professional psychological, medical and dental help. Instead, they insisted that *I* be the caregiver in ways I could never fulfill. They refused professional help with controlling angry rages, controlling diabetes, preventing the loss of teeth. They lost four teeth in six months through lack of hygiene and lack of diabetes control. Can you imagine how deep the mental illness of one who pulls out their own teeth?? They were crying "Pity me! Pity me!" They passed away a few months ago from Covid - probably blaming me for that as well.
it became all about her needs...and yes, when I would question her ability to self reflect she would literally go blank...that ability to disconnect was so sad and yet I know it is a very effective self protection device. So so so effective. And yet her ability to feel nothing was so hard for me.
She felt plenty but only for herself. These types wallow in self pity and martyrdom.
Thank you. You just described someone I used to know to the letter. He was a master of manipulation and gleaning sympathy. And boy, did I fall for it. What a wake up call.
The biggest fear for a covert narcissist is to be discovered. If they know you are aware of who they are they run as far away from you as possible hoping you don't expose them. They are broken!!
Nick Bargas I thought the same but still got the typical Christmas hoover. Ignored him completely and he ignored me as well and eventually left. Apparently he was ‘heat checking’ me to see how I would act in his presence and if anything was salvageable. I acted like he didn’t exist. Hopefully he will move on.
nick bargas how to expose them please explain
One did the breaking up before I did admitted that I would eventually leave them..
It's sad to find a perfect description of yourself in this video.
Nick, In my experience they attack. And continue to attack.
I was married to to a covert for 4 years. Made my escape in April and filed for divorce 10 days later including a restraining order.
The mind games and silent treatment was unbelievable.
He's my first and last narc.
Thank you so much for this important information.
Christine Miller The mind games and silent treatment! Day’s and weeks on end. Not knowing what I said or didn’t say, did or didn’t do. Questioning my own memory, sanity, logical thinking and my feelings. Never getting a straight answer, words and questions turned around towards me EVERY time. My depression and anxiety is through the roof and I am trying to break free....
@@Mcfaddenclan000 I wish you luck with your escape. In the meantime try not giving the silent treatment any energy. Gray rock, do whatever you can to negate his negativity towards you. It's not easy but once you stop caring about how he reacts towards you It's easier on your anxiety and your overall health. Above all, get out asap! Much luck!!
Bonnie Sterbinsky thank you for your encouragement 🌺
Christine Miller I hope you are enjoying your new found freedom!
Kate Moren Best of luck to you in getting out.
so thankful to be free of the narcissist and now understand the part I played as an empath.
Mine changed her style of clothing, got more tattoos and changed her style of music to completely mirror me. Then when she brought up a guy at the gym twice she ditched all that and became very sporty to mirror the next person on her way out of our relationship. Things to look out for!
Matthew Epstein check out BPD. Oftentimes, personality disorders overlap.
Matthew Epstein Bordeline Personality Disorder.
Most of the time people leave a relationship and become attracted to someone new because they know in they're present relationship it's not going anywhere. Let's be honest if someone really is connected with you and wants to be with you you're together. And you don't want to take any risk to losing that that person. People leave relationships also when they find someone who has the same goals as they do. If someone likes to exercise and the other person, is a small example. Being equally yoked is important especially with values and goals. But primarily because you feel that person really
cares about you, wants to see you be your best and wants to be with you on a regular basis. When you feel someone doesn't value you or need you or want you it is natural to look for someone else especially if you've had the conversation over and over and over again and nothing changes. This is in a dating relationship. Hopefully if you make the commitment to be married you have commonalities and feel loved and valued by the other person feeling has to be mutual or it doesn't work.
Matthew Epstein Has morning
I've listened to so many posts about covert narcissists, but this one truly explained my mother. It was an extremely difficult childhood and also adulthood. I was my mothers chief scapegoat and I can never explain how tumultuous it was to have her there. Yet as you said others, even my siblings, never saw this. And not to my siblings, but to outsiders she played the victim card and they all believe her. But like you said she was/is hypersensitive to imagined slights and I was there for many of those events (I'm 59) and I know that in no way did these people act badly towards my mother, in fact it was the other way round. Thank you.
Useful insights in explaining the covert narcissist at a deeper level. This resonated with the NPD person I knew, whose persona was outward going and 'fun', and yet would portray themselves as a former victim and 'spiritually-orientated', self-effacing person. Only her partner and immediate family would be exposed to the outbursts, envy, and heightened sensitivity to criticism, or perceived slights (even if they were not intended, or didn't even exist)!
The complete focus on self, victimhood, and struggle against feeling inferior in themselves can intensify the commitment of their unaware partner to 'try harder' and 'give more', which binds you closer as you try and support them and build/deepen the relationship - part of the parasitic tools that draw you in and drain your resources. I found if done well, can get the unaware non-narc victim to even excuse many things you wouldn't normally as your intuition is nudging, then shouting at you that 'things just aren't right'.
Disregard social norms only when no one is looking - nailed it! They will correct behavior if they think they have been spotted publicly but it's not because they necessarily have any remorse or upon self reflection realise that they did something bad and want to improve themselves. It's more that their public persona has been affected and they need to quickly tidy it up. I keep hearing that this kind of person cannot change but I am hopeful that I will find ways to encourage this to happen for them.
I’m glad where you left off on this video and wanted to add, which I suspect you will elaborate on in the next video, that one must be very careful about who one opens up to and tells their innermosst fears and woes to because these people present, ofttimes, as being very safe when, in fact, they are the opposite and revel in hearing your troubles. Or your insecurities. They love to store these up and try to trigger these insecurities if they have some ax to grind with you.And you’ll never see it coming.
I agree. It is uncanny how they have the ability to target your most vulnerable space so subtly. It is really quite debilitating and ties in with a deep need to possess what could be considered a potential threat to exposure and to harness the qualities and potentials of others, co-opting another's life to augment their own. Remaining hidden is not only a self protective mechanism for the covert, but is I feel also part of the hidden pleasure that is derived from causing continued suffering; a bit like a cat torturing a mouse and refusing to let it go. This is one of the reasons why covert narcissists are so very dangerous. It can be hard and take many years, to even begin to realise that one is caught in such a snare. Remaining hidden is the key to continued, successful operations. But, once seen a predator can no longer have the element of surprise. I do think there is a predatory element here rather than simply reactionary ... albeit perhaps unconsciously or subconsciously driven.
Bingo! I realized after a while it's like Lucy offering to hold the football for Charlie Brown - she always yanks it away at the last minute so she can enjoy seeing him fail and get the wind knocked out of him. When a covert narcissist acts like your friend and pretends sympathy, wants you to open up about your dreams, fears, and woes, do NOT fall for the bait. Many covert narcs have a sadistic streak. These forays into kindness are just ammunition-gathering expeditions into your private life. All this will be turned against you out of the blue later when their cruel side blares up. Amanda is right, predatory is the word, truly vicious, so don't give them ammo. Discuss as little as possible. Be as boring as possible. If you must talk, stick with the weather and what flowers are blooming.
Exactly... 6 years later they use something very sensitive against you. What? Wow. Why? It's sooooooo painful.
My recommendation? NEVER have secrets... don't tell someone... WATCH OUT for your tendency to say, "OH, I've never told this to anyone before"... ALL NARCS LOVE THAT... their ears PERK UP... their eyes LIGHT up... watch for it. Tell them something you have told someone before. Make it innocuous. See if they use it against you later... often they'll do it in public. They'll make their comment seem so innocent. Tell you you're being too sensitive.
There's your answer. NEVER trust them. Get out of that relationship as soon as possible OR decide NEVER to actually tell them things. Get a therapist. They've got client privilege and are so trained to stay non-emotional it's pathetic. They don't even bat an eye. What you've told them could tear you apart and they're like, uhhhhh... okay... whatever. How did it make you feel? Don't do it again, okay?
Sooooo... either DIE with your secrets or tell them to a therapist... rarely tell a partner something that doesn't have a thing to do with them. Things you've worked on already. Learn to communicate your needs, your boundaries, your fears (being alone is a universal fear... and yes, the narc will tell you YOU'LL ALWAYS BE ALONE so just be ready for it now because it's not the end of the world to be alone than to be miserable with a narc), your hopes and dreams. They'll call you grandiose if you've got a dream. It's their negative nature. It is FINE for someone to caution you and ask you to consider all the angles. To be supportive.
I have a tendency to 'get real' with friends that have business ideas. It's sort of funny but I've got a friend that always seems to come up with an idea that already exists. It's like they were in a bunker for 30 years and just discovered you can take a "party bus" to a concert or something. However, IF you want to start a business offering a TAME VERSION of a party bus to a vacation spot... go approach Senior Citizen homes... oh, wait. That ALREADY EXISTS. Old people are cute!
Peace.
wallymarcel1 isn't that the truth!
They also love to shame you about sensitive issues in front of other narcissists
This is the most thorough and well-articulated explanation of covert narcissism I have heard. Thank you for your time and your work.
Jessica Mariposa,hope you are not with a narcissist cause you are too precious!
So spot on. Excellent. Covert narcissists using sarcasm, one liners, backhanded compliments, gosh so true. Very self referencing. Everything it seems is viewed through the lens of themselves. One thing you didn't mention is a complete inability to self analyse, they also seem to have a dissociation with their bodies, meaning an unwillingness to discuss anything other than on a superficial level. A complete lack of facing the truth about their own inner workings or physical workings of the body,. It's as if they go too deeply, they may discover something horrendous, therefore they never take responsibility for anything at all, It's always someone else's fault or problem. Highly sensitive to any perceived or real criticism. Rage is relegated to behind the scenes. Definitely a jeckle & hyde character. Quiet & humble to the outside world; introverted, introspective, spends large amounts of time in the head, moody, negative, angry in the inside world. Did they ever experience love from a parent? Were they put down all the time? Why so angry? Sad really. Can the covert narcissist be helped? Do they ever come to you for help? Or are they in total denial, believing they are always right & therefore don't need help? Your work doctor is much appreciated, thank you.
bang on ...….esp.... "complete inability to self analyse"
They cannot be helped and yes, they never feel love for anyone, their children included, I know this first hand.
Great questions!!!
Sandra Bentley Excellent description👍
self analysing is actually a capability IF they can garner supply from it... that's why it's soooooo irritating once you're out and see it. Before... you just wanted to be there to support them through a difficult time. Poor you... living in a very small town... never get a chance to realize your potential... MOVE... oh, no... I couldn't do that. Okay. Whatever.
Narcissists all tell on themselves. We must endeavour as caring, empathetic humans to have healthy boundaries, to not ignore red flags, to not tolerate toxic behaviours from others and most importantly, to listen to what our inner voice and feelings tell us when we are around them.
I think they do tell on themselves. They accuse the victim of the things that they do and the personality traits they hold.
My ex girlfriend was a narc and always called me manipulative, toxic and defensive. I had never been accused of that in my live before.
Regarding schadenfreude, I realized truly what I was up against in a prior relationship when once I finally took the provocative narcissist bait and set myself up for an insult and he said, "Phew, I feel better! I thought to myself "what kind of person feels better by insulting someone?" I knew it was time to get out.
@@oscarwilliamson1264 that's very sweet of you thanks
You nailed it. Your description of the covert narcissist is spot on. Excellent.
Ann Brady,you are too pretty to be with a narcissist!
@@lioydwilliams1850 narc!
@@oscarwilliamson1264 Narc!
The comments are highly significant - going even more in-depth. We are not alone in being hurt and into trouble dealing with those we have loved who have this condition. Thank you.
The most accurate and comprehensive analysis I’ve come across yet, you pull apart with exquisite accuracy the hidden layers that drive the covert narc’s behaviours, a huge help to those of us who have been exposed to and struggled to understand the neuroticisms and damage wrought by the CN. This exploration has helped many of us make sense of what happened. Thank you.
Reminds me of Dr Jelkel Mr. Hyde. He is so nice in front of people but behind closed doors, he is abusive maniac.
Kathy zrinyi oooohhh yes! most definitely!
Oh heck ya! from deuchland,
Narcisists love the misfortune of others!!
This is incredibly interesting. I can think of more than one person in my life who exhibits some of these traits. Because me insight into them in a way I’ve never had. Thanks for the video.
A true Covert NPD that has "Nested with his/her Victim"
Kathy zrinyi. Dr. Jekyll Hides . . . until we see Dr. Saad's tutorials. Best wishes and prayers to my fellow empaths and survivors.
Your analysis of covert narcissists is spot on! Absolutely correct in every detail. The characteristics that separate them from the grandiose narcissist is important to understand.
Thank you for creating this video. I've watched it numerous times because it accurately describes a six-year relationship with a covert narcissist. This is so specific to his personality. A wolf in sheep's clothing for sure. I'm so glad I'm free.
Absolute best video on understanding a covert narcissist. Packed with content, while complicated, you do a wonderful job of communicating. Grateful I came upon this, look forward to more.
Stacy Prettyman,hope you are not with a narc 😈!
You're wonderful. As someone trying to make sense of my life (also with professional help), your clear and concise explanations are eye opening and mind boggling. You you have survived a covert narcissist (or 2) good on ya and congrats!!!! Another will never get past my boundries again!
Kaddy Feast, you got a smile that can make the news
Kaddy Feast,your pretty smile ☺️ can make the news
That despising of dominance hierarchy is exactly on point! Undercover rebellion and resentment!
🙏 Thank you Dr. Saad, excellent, highly informative introduction to Covert Narcissism, you described my Covert Narcissist Ex to a T, I was hooked by his victim stories, his soft spoken manner made irresistible by his striking blue eyes... But what was missing from your video for me was, from my own experience, their complete lack of empathy, which is actually a hallmark trait of all Narcissist, no doubt. My Covert Narcissist Ex simply did not have the Empathy chip installed. Worse, they don’t have the capacity to love! You did however explain about how they’re self-absorbed jerks and that it’s all about them, but the full impact of this egocentric trait is beyond destructive, it ultimately brought me down to my knees, I was diagnosed with CPTSD and had to to get therapy to heal. They have the emotional capacity of a petulant five-year old, rage outbursts and all, and masters of passive-aggression as you stated. They are dangerously toxic and I wish I’d know all this before walking away and staying away for good.... Greetings and love from Toronto 🇨🇦
Heidi Schweichler,hope you are not with a narcissist! cause you are too precious
So glad I found you on RUclips. I just learned that my boyfriend of 4 years, has had another woman for the past 7 years. We spoke on FB. Just so hard to swallow but with your help of explaining the narcissist, it made me feel like I wasn’t all to blame. He made me feel that way and took advantage of me at my weakest most vulnerable time of my life. (Was diagnosed with cancer). Since I busted him 3 days ago, he has managed to totally ignore me like I never even existed. I’m in your empathy state of Alarm right now. Thank you for everything that you do. You are amazing.
Hope you ok...
Loren Kershaw It's two years later now and I hope you're okay too! ❤
Thank you so much for talking about this in such detail. I don't want to be this way anymore. I don't want sympathy, I want to be kind and proud of myself. I didn't meant to be this way.
I wish I could give this video 1000 thumbs up. The Dr. describes my wife perfectly. It has taken me almost a decade to figure out why she does what she does. I always made excuses for her behavior. Please more covert Narc videos. Amazing information.
Hello. Yes spot on! I had always ended up making excuses and covering up for my ex narc wife's repeated poor behaviour during our 15 year relationship.
Even after we split up I was still asking people not to judge her etc.
Then I realised that she was still smearing me behind the scenes and lots of people came to me retelling their stories of horrible interactions they had had with her over the years.
It was at this point that I truly discovered that she didn't deserve another second of my compassion or love. It was at this point I discovered she was a narc. And at this point I started telling the world about who she really was.
She had me so well conned! Unbelievably tricked. The mind manipulation has been deep and very well constructed by her.
I've lost so much of myself and my life to her. Everything has suffered. My heart, my relationships with other people, my work and my finances.
I guess I'm very lucky to be here now at the very least.
Kind regards Warren (Australia)
This is a great video. Explains why he was always looking at me and comparing himself. Narcs always want to compete. They are capable of charm and seduce by talking about how they were hurt or abused. They essentially mirror an empath but if you are paying attention you will see how often they break the rules.
This describes it so well and in detail. Every single thing applies to the one i knew. It's good to hear about it in this type of analysis, gives sense to things you knew weren't right but not exactly why.
Coverts triangulate constantly.
mallory what does triangulate mean in this context? Thanks
It means instead of confronting someone one on one they will use another person to do it for them. They will spin a story to get that other person on side against the second person. My mum did this to her children against our father and she did it with her kids against each other. Until our bubbles burst we couldn't see what she was really doing. :(
Same here, older sister, we both inherited the same propriety, she never pays a dime for maintenance, and I'm forced to do all the work myself as it's too expensive for me to pay for it... she has her own a 1 million house, but wants to know every time I rent part of our propriety, and sabotages the deals ! I don't know what to do...
@@crystalcat1317 -
My MIL does this...constantly...
I have dealt with an overt narcissist, but it was like playing in an afternoon rain storm compared to when I later dealt with a covert narcissist, which was like trying to organize life in the middle of an evil tornado.
“was like trying to organize life in the middle of an evil tornado.” poetic and so true
I’ve met too many covert narcissists to detail any specifics, but I think this video is spot on.
Thank you Dr Saad, I understand now and this gives me peace. You're doing a great service to people by posting these vids, once again thank you for the precious gift of freedom through understanding.
I truly feel like God sent me to your videos I never even heard the term empath but now that I've learned all about it I'm truly beginning to understand why I attract toxic relationships and I'm able to make the changes thank you so much God bless you
Your god is just an algorithm, darling. 😉
@s.hicks7213 Nah. Was right then and am right now. Not everything has to be a "sign" or a "godsend". Delusion will stop you before anyone else does. If you want to live in your blind spots? I won't stop ya. Peace.
This is the BEST video on covert narcissism, hands down. point blank, PERIOD. This perfectly describes a close family member I have been struggling with for years. Thank you so much for this video. It is saving my mind.
You nailed it. I've known a person in my life was narcissistic and psychopathic but the person never fit the grandiose narcissistic traits. It is a relief to understand the covert narcissist traits. Many thanks!
Thank you! For not letting people vent. Venting is harmful as containing and transforming our anger is the pinnacle of personal growth
I was friends with a community worker who was highly narcissistic. My first clue of this was the way in which he spoke of the individuals he was meant to be mentoring. On speaking of some one with addiction issues he was "helping" he commented to myself."you have to understand Steph, these people are never going to amount to anything". As he was smirking. I was shocked. But moving on I quickly realised that the very reason he was in the job he was in was simply because he believed he was far better than them. on asking about other individuals he worked with it was apparent this was not about helping people in desperate need of help but he was in a position to feel grandiose next to them. The way he spoke of these service users was quite frankly shocking. Not just those with addiction issues but mental illness, those living in poverty etc. He had absolutely no respect for them, mocked them continuously and they always seemed to be a drag on His time. The way he spoke they were lucky to have him in their lives. He would consistently complain about the fact he wouldn't get a promotion with fact he was "working with such people" and in his view not gaining anything from it. It was nothing to do with assisting vulnerable individuals but putting him on a pedestal where he would be looked up to. He would even talk of them fancying him!!!!😂 Suffice to say, I'm no longer friends with him...because of this and fact he started to believe I fancied him also!!!!!!😂😂 Strange thing is there was a part of me that felt bad for him because I knew he in fact had very low self esteem. Treated badly by overly demanding parents. However not an excuse.
That was certainly a bullet I dodged!!!
The knowledge in these videos are GOLD. Any type of narc seeks out people that will fall into or play their games. Being able to spot them completely takes away their power, that’s why I’m always going to study this!
This video is blowing my mind! Thank you for explaining this information in such a highly understandable way. You are helping SO many people with the work you are doing.
Thanks Abdul for posting this valuable information. I was a victim of a covert narcissus. It took me some time to discover him but I recognize many of the behavior patterns you mention in him. The best thing one victim can do to stop their abuse is to get away and establish zero contact with this kind of individuals.
Great insight. Covert behaviour operates out of the detached self and manifests in many forms, can be overt and covert in a split second. I'm my studies I've witnessed the detached protector as covert and the detached self soother as overt.
The litigiousness behaviour you speak of is spot on, again a covered up version to argue and gain power over others and if done in a legal way this only reinforces the self as righteous in their behaviours. Covert is to me in simple terms, a cover of the real self however they are so far down the line and without professional guidance would find great difficulty in knowing who they really are.
When we feel uneasy, when we think negatively on certain people's behaviours toward us, this is our healthy adult telling us to walk away.
Keep posting, you are a breath of fresh air in an otherwise frightened world.
Your descriptions make me feel as though you know my experience personally. So very enlightening and healing for me. Thank you so much. I just was not familiar with this form of mental illness to give proper credit to what I experienced. Plus the lovebombing countered the initially subtle presentation of the covert behaviors that later over took everything good and has sustained as the primary behavior.
Eye opening and so appreciated. :) This helps so much to better understand them, to observe those “upward comparisons”. One of the narcissists who frustrated me most is almost the very person you describe to the letter. Middle manager, underestimates his talents and abilities, his fear of too much success disguised as acceptance that the hierarchy is designed to keep him from further promotion. Prides himself on his relationship with his employees who look up to him and do much of the grunt work he shouldn’t have to do. He has made statements that he subtly uses “public embarrassment” to keep the high conflict types in line. You tease about Schadenfreude but you must deliver more on the topic so that we don’t leave novellas in your comment section. :) Thank you so!
Thank you for bringing this information to a platform. I am the child of a covert narcissist who I didn't realize was such until years after I severed the relationship completely. This information is extremely valuable.
Keri Moreland, you look stunning
In other words, Snakes, Conniving, Manipulative, Betraying, insidious Demons...
I don’t think snakes are manipulative
Auhhh , truth to these words. Living through it now😥😢😓.
Hail jesus christ
This is the BEST video explaining the distinction between the two types of Narcs.
Spot on once again. The 'hidden tactics' you identify are poorly recognised and very harmful to those around them. Colleagues, partners and children of 'these' personality types are traumatised often longterm by their anger, lack of shame and total insensitivity, and their ability to disarm others by their 'victim' role without any remorse. Given you say they are aware of this how they operate how can these behaviours be mitigated? It would appear they thrive on conflict, as is evidenced through their HR departments at workplaces, legal and Court Systems keeping poorly educated mental and legal professionals, well paid for often poor results for victims.
This is exactly what I have been seeing in family members. We live in a region of the country in which there seems to be entire family structures that encourage this narcissism.
Your validation of my experience is deeply appreciated. Thank you for all the important education you share. I’d like to learn about the resulting hurt a covert narc can do to a person and how to overcome their toxicity. I know it’s been a painful downward spiral of my being. Again, I am so grateful for your videos.
Hi Dr Saad, how do you differentiate between an empath lashing out versus a covert narcissist? Some of the traits are very similar.
I realized this myself..it’s so frustrating
Very
@John Chlebek I don't relieve a covert narcissist could ever have any empathy towards anyone.
Profound session thankyou: I feel the need as one listens to be careful for these insights can impact those who seek honesty and truth within themselves (old wisdom: when in doubt hold that doubt against yourself).
My thoughts:
We live in a world of aggravation and denial that tries to manipulate our perceptions by (covert) propaganda or that of direct force or control that impacts the freedom of individuality and how each of us uniquely thinks and feels thus threatens our inert perceptions of reality (cognitive dissonance). There are two options: 1. to speak one's thoughts: 2. to be silent:
Self:
Discomfort is where something is mirrored to you that you don’t like about yourself.
Discomfort is where something is projected or deflected that is not your perception of self.
Ego:
Projection: I am right and you are wrong. I am good therefore you must be bad.
Deflection: I am right and you are wrong. I am good therefore you must be bad.
The concept of being perceived as good or bad provokes a stimulus response. It is the underlying motive of self and that of the other and those actions or reactions (motives) that are the true focus that need to be identified and observed.
Empathy:
Mirroring: You have a right to your opinion and I have a right to mine. e.g. 'I hear what you say that I'm too sensitive' Perhaps I am ... does that offend you?
Children in dysfunctional families are conditioned that to have their basic needs of acceptance and feeling loved met then they must be ‘good’. It is a training of conformance and that of control for should they not meet expectations they face not being loved.
Trying to heal those devastated is treating the symptom and not the cause.
A singular standalone dysfunction or is it? Or is it reinforced by community action or non-action. Should we be good then the other must be bad and this leads to thinking or behaviour of ‘logical fallacies’, not respectful of others in debates or acceptance of those differences of opinions.
This dysfunction of man occurs as a primal survival need to be accepted as one of a group for to become ostracised one is put out to survive alone and that often meant in early times the certainty of death. Therefore there is much pressure to be conformed with external stimuli responses to the thinking of the group.
It is a human trait or dysfunction that’s recorded in history since the beginning of time.
The one who deciphers this dysfunctional code will bring about world peace and harmony.
My family been damaged by narcissism neighbor and I discovered this symptoms just these three weeks through pop up RUclips. Also, I have been praying to God for helps to solve these problems. Thank you for enlightenment.
Yes Yes Yes Always the Victim So its crack for codependents and Empaths because they make you think you are one of them. Also because they are so accommodating and placid When they Privately of course explode on you they name All the things they pretended to enjoy with you . It is Scary stuff.. You’re work is Stellar as Always. Thanks Sooo Much 🤓🙏🏻🤩
How do you like this back handed compliment: "I'd forgotten that you could actually be quite articulate." It wasn't a joke! She entirely thought this way. Always put herself above everyone else. Not only me. Had to get rid of her.
Both narcissistic types are good at snide remarks and jokes at people's expense. They are so conceited and unsympathetic and snobby and judgemental. Their smugness even shows in their tone of voice and eyes.
I wish this was anonymous, but I’m going to go ahead and ask my question anyway. I believe I was raised by a covert narcissist and I believe I am an empath. But some of the ways you describe the covert narc remind me of me, too: painfully sensitive to criticism, feeling “special” one moment and inferior the next, making upward social comparisons... Perhaps much of this is what was “given” to me by my narc. And I’ve outright asked a therapist if I could be a narcissist myself, and they said no, because if I asked the question, it would indicate I am not. But what if I, too, was covert, even to me? I still worry: can an empath/sensitive become so harmed by a narcissist that they essentially become one? Is this what covert narcissism actually is - a sensitive person who has been so deeply hurt that they cannot stop self-referencing their pain and drag everyone else along with them? How do I avoid this when I have done years and years of therapy and still feel frustrated at not seeing the results I want or ever feeling “healed” or (G-d forbid) “normal.” Any thoughts on this? Thanks for the video. It’s a tricky topic.
I hear what you're saying. I would say I feel the same way. I think some of these symptoms of covert narcissism describe me too on some level. I've intentionally exposed my self to criticism and attempting to get to the root of my vulnerability and hurt and this is helpful. Its embarrassing to note the narcissism. Nonetheless, I think this is a by product of a faulty family system which isn't my fault, wounding from said system and unconscious habits that have me at odds internally and being split between feeling deep empathy for others, wanting to be of service and the grandiosity and self absorption. Its troubling to reconcile. I've noticed a big difference as I've progressively gotten into touch with my vulnerable side and felt the pain and anguish of essentially being used for others unmet emotional needs. In turn, I have been attempting to meet my own emotional needs and also cultivating humility through all of it. It's hard to acknowledge these things when the very thing that hurt you and was largely responsible for this incomplete personality structure out of no fault of your own is the very thing that is potentially hurtful, self sabotaging and dangerous to the world you feel so deeply for. I have told my therapist a decade ago I suspected this about my self. It's been my dirty little secret but what this video explains is that the biggest fear lies in the exposure of this hidden world. I'm going to expose this part of me to a group of trusted people and have it done with. Let them criticize me and just break down in my pain. It feels like the only way to the root and ultimately may lead to rebuilding a better way to relate to people.
Look into CPTSD. Reparenting techniques, and the holistic psychologist.
Oh my god, yes! I even keep a diary on how to be better and how not to be a narcissist I cant stop thinking about this. The cycle of abuse needs to stop
From what I have read, if youve been by a narcissistic person, ( for a long long period of time, think of a family member or a partner ) chances you might emulates some of their behavior or thinking but it doesnt mean that youre one. Especially if it was a parent or anyone who raised you. but don’t worry haha the minute you’re aware of your bad behavior, the minute you start questioning yourself and want to be a better person, you’re far from narcissistic tendencies
I relate to this so much.
Yes, gained a lot of understanding through this video. Looking forward to the next one!
Paula Hayes,hope you are not with a narcissist cause you are too beautiful!
Paula Hayes,your pretty smile ☺️ can make the news 😍😍😍🤙
This is my husband and my mother. My husband apologized to me before his death. He said, "I am sorry for the way I treated you." I am striving to have a healthy relationship with my elderly mother; that is, I am taking care of myself while I honor her as a parent.
Can’t wait to see the bonus videos. Thank you for all you do. I need this help.
Gina Heaton,hope you are not with a narcissist! cause you are too beautiful
Gina Heaton,I admire your lovely smile 😊😍🤙
Thank you for this. I wish we learned some of this growing up. It is so helpful in recognizing negative aspects in ourselves and preventing others from imposing theirs on us. Many of us are completely in the dark for much of our lives. I experienced a lot of hurt and confusion, from prolonged contact with this type of person. I'm certainly not perfect either, but the volumes of underhanded and at times outright cruelty that someone like this can hand out, continually.. I struggled so much to understand it, and no one I confided in about it, recognized it for what it was either and always suggested to just ignore it. I only began to recognize it, after learning about character development for creative writing. There's almost no awareness, protection and prevention, taught to the average person - we learn about this after most of the damage has been done.
We all need our struggles in life, to learn and grow. But I think more understanding in this area should be provided for people growing into adulthood though. I really appreciate your channel.
I really appreciate your grounded empathetic approach to covert narcissism. It helps me to have compassion for someone who hurt me very deeply, which helps me let go of this hurt.
A covert narcissist just got me fired at work this week. She resented me because I corrected her in a meeting. She never forgot that.
This happened to my husband too. They hate criticism, even well meant constructive criticism. They will put you on their target list.
That happened to me many many years ago!!!
That is what they do they get you fired. Hawkeye and Trapper pull out all the stops on PsyOps and Frank Burns (Duvall) goes Mad.
In so sorry to hear this.
It's hard to work with these types.
I pray it gets better for you. 🙄
In my experience a narcissist can never forget criticism. They see anything that does fit into their plan as criticism you can jump through hoops but you will pay for it for the rest of your life.
Bravo! The social justice warriors comment is so spot on! Thank you for keeping this channel. So many interesting and well-thought out, non-cliche presentations. May God continue to give you health, success and return the good you do for others tenfold! With admiration, a viewer.
When does he make the sjw comment? I'm looking 4 it. Thanks in advance
Your videos are so highly educational and your way of explaining these complex topics is excellent, I truly appreciate your kindness and the intellectual input. Thank you
Thank you, glad you are finding the content of value.
I have been watching your videos for a few days and I am so very grateful for your work, Abdul. I am a relationship therapist and also on my own personal journey of healing. The quality of your work is a Godsend. Your information and delivery are stellar, crisp, clean, solid and masterful. So easy to digest and fold right into the batter of my learning and healing journey, and my work with clients. Your genuineness and humble service are palpable. What a gift. I'm already wiser and stronger from watching. Thank you so very much.
So true...scary I didn't realise before, being Empath got myself into this...
So spot on, Abdul. Thank you for your clear and objective analysis. I am slowly emerging/recovering from a 2-year relationship with a person with whom I had fallen deeply in love and with whom I was about to make a new life. He was someone who I trusted and to whom I gave my all. The relationship ended shockingly, abruptly and coldly when I was 'discarded' for simply being human. I realise now that I was his narcissistic supply. The moment I began to question different aspects of his behaviour, the dynamics changed between us. I could not process all this at the time. I kept on supplying. In the end, I had numerous meltdowns, the result of which was me being judiciously kicked to the kerb; total rejection and no opportunity to discuss. Recovery from all this continues and is a day-to-day process. I know so much more now and am still learning! Hallelujah.
Extremely accurate information video. Your videos help me bring closure to so many unanswered questions - thank you.
My instincts were right, I will always trust myself more in future.
What is intriguing is to read the comments to these videos. It's so rewarding to pathologize others and view oneself as the healthy empath or the abused or not as bad, which in itself is a form of narcissism. I posit that we all have such flaws to varying degrees. But women are very susceptible to this lacuna, as the ratio of women to men's comments suggests.
This is an amazing amount of information!! please do the bonus video. Waiting for it :)
This is the best explanation I have seen yet. The 4 domains are very helpful.
I worked with one who was so hypersensitive to criticism that she twisted everything to become a criticism. This conditioned me to speak less in her presence, and she then viewed that as me hating or excluding her. So then I kept everything bland, and was labelled "boring". She was very manipulative, and I think that her hypersensitivity and resentfulness, and my need to get along for the sake of harmony, trapped me into this no-win situation.
She did embed herself in the hierarchical structure (and saw herself as the power behind the throne). She acted as gatekeeper to control access to the supervisor, and to control the supervisor's perception of others. She enjoyed schadenfreude and also had a lot of freudenschade - presumably believing that the success was rightfully hers. She was a gaslighting gold medallist, and would (when no-one else was around) get very aggressive when her narrative was threatened. She had so many people fooled.
Thanks for your time.
I have watched hundred of videos about narcissism and this one has been my best. Thank you for making such a informative video. You have a new subscriber.
Brilliant. I learnt a lot from this video.
Explains a lot about a narcissist who was in my life. Thankyou.
This is spot on of my last serious relationship. I’ve been free from it for two years. Makes me not want to date anymore. I don’t want to run into anyone else like that. And I pray no one else experiences it. I would Not wish that kind of relationship on my Worst enemy! Anyone who deals with this type of person must get counseling. Hands down!