Hearing God's Voice: This Changed my Perspective of the Holy Spirit.
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- Опубликовано: 18 окт 2024
- The Holy Spirit is one of the most misunderstood (and sometimes neglected) members of the Trinity. There's one aspect of the Holy Spirit that Costi Hinn wrote about that I found fascinating and healing, and I had a burning question about how people tested experiences from God in times when there wasn't a Bible handy.
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I actually heard the voice of God (or an angel He sent) and it saved my life 3x. I bless the Lord
I heard God speak audibly once. He saved me from bad decisions
Amen. The Precious Holy Spirit is the PROMISED Comforter, and reminds me of Scripture and opens my eyes to understand The Word, and quickens and convicts..... may He never leave me, or fall silent, or never may I grieve or resist or quench him. To God be the Glory forever and ever AMEN.
This conversation is very helpful. I'm coming out of the hyper charismatic deliverance movement. I was very mindful that i did not want to swing to another extreme. So I'm appreciative of this convo.
Good for you. I went from one extreme to the other and it messed with me for a while. I even doubted my salvation at one point. Praise God for His Word and His Holy Spirit who teaches us the truth.
That was a great conversation, thank you for sharing it and I agree that balance is important. I always remember Hannah's story, she prayed so fervently that Eli thought she was drunk, so I keep my fervent prayers in private.
God most clearly spoke to me a month before I got saved, asking me "What are you going to do with Me, accept Me or reject Me? Didn't take long to realize this was The Lord speaking and it was very disturbing that He's asking me this. I knew everyone has to get right with Him at some point and I fully intended to do that, just not at 20 yrs old. It then changed to "Until you accept Me, you are rejecting Me". Surrendered and saved sitting in the pew before the awaited alter call. 40 yrs later still amazed about that moment. He spoke to me not audible but like an echo in my head that played again and again at that time. I likened it to the same way the music is stuck in your head after an awesome, loud concert.
I remember hearing about a Baptist missionary sent out to another country and came back to America and lifted his arms up in worship. The American Baptist congregation was like uhh ohh did he go Pentecostal on us while he was out of the country. LOL Not that I hatin on my Baptist brothers and sisters lol but we so use to American Churchianty that we overthink things in fear of going to one extreme or the other that Christians outside of America just don't give much thought to overthinking the Holy Spirit and just goes with what the Spirit is doing in the lives of believers. A Dry Lifeless Spirit can be just as deadly as the craziness that happens in some Pentecostal circles.
Thank you!!! Stiff churches are just as much of a turn off as overactive-hyper churches to me 😭 I go to a Baptist church and trying to get people just to clap along to a song is so difficult!!!
Lol churchianity...I'm gonna use that. Oh I'm "born and raised baptist" but I was given a "Pentecostal" spirit lol. It is definitely different. I jump, raise and wave my arms, clap....and I keep threatening my parents that I'm gonna bring my tambourine LOL ...
@@honeybun3492I wholeheartedly agree 💯
I went from extreme NAR to the polar opposite where I had a new set of ridged rules to follow. Praise God I'm now in a quiet older (congregation) church where the Word gets preached. I'm the only one raising my hands in worship and at first I was a bit unsure as my last church had no raising of hands among other things. My current church doesn't raise their hands, not because someone told them not to, they just don't do it.
I feel that I have the freedom to worship God the way that we are called to. I read my Bible and pray and praise Jesus for all that He has done.
Love Costi's faithfulness to the Gospel
“ I will lift up my heart with my hands unto God in the
Heavens”. I praise your Holy
name, Jesus. 🕊️🪽
I first heard Gods Voice when I was six years old. He helped understand and correct a commandment I had disobeyed. He has been the One my whole life Who Has Talked to me and keep me Safe…except when I didn’t Obey! I learned some serious lessons. Church was not a lot of help..mostly it just confused me 😊❤
Not scary, just do what the Bible says. “Let everything
that has breath, praise the
Lord”.🙏🏻🕊️✝️
It is sad to see how much we complicate and tack on things or set limitations to the Gospel and the Lord's Spirit.
"And he said: “Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven."
Jesus meant it in more ways than we understand.
There is an innocent simplicity in children that we lose and forget somewhere along the way.
Seeing these dichotomy about how to "behave" with the Spirit has always been silly and a bit sad to me.
I came to faith in Christ sort of like a feral stray dog scooped up by Him and introduced to the family.
Seeing both of these camps of charismatic or reformed, and I look at them and I look at Jesus and I look back at them and I know what Jesus has taught me to be but these camps... I don't see what Jesus taught me, in them.
The charismatic and reformed tradition enslaved churches come to the Spirit and ask: "Which one of us is right? Are we supposed to be stuffy, civilized, boring city dwellers?
Or do you want us to be unhinged, wild, barbarians?
And the Holy Spirit with a look of amazed disappointment responds: "What? . . . Just . . . Be yourself . . . 😑"
The Lord's end vision for us;
Is for us to shed the baggage and traditions and traumas and silly inherited problems and hindrances of our age and growing up, and return to a childlike heart, but with the wisdom, discernment, experience, prudence, self-control, and understanding in the mind of Christ that has matured in the Lord.
Innocent as doves, but wise as serpents.
Very well put
I've always said it's NOT. TRUE. that the Holy Spirit is jumping on people and tossing them around the church. You can be joyous, but all that running around and falling out on the floor? That's NOT the Holy Spirit, that's either YOU or _another_ spirit. *One of the fruits of the Holy Spirit is self-control!*
You are right. That jumping and flopping around IS NOT THE HOLY SPIRIT. It's just people that are IGNORANT OF SCRIPTURES acting IGNORANT.
Yeahh that's how I always felt too, starting from a little kid :c like it's nice to see new people feel the Holy Spirit for the first time for example, but that, that felt off..
When the possessed boy and the man in the tombs came to Jesus, they were tossed around by the demons.
When the Holy Spirit freed them, they were "clothed and of their right mind, and sat upright..."
This slain in the spirit and flailing in the spirit nonsense, may be of a spirit, but it sure ain't the Holy kind.
One of the fruits of the spirit is self control. These crazy people are not self controlled.
Its a human reaction. The Holy Spirit doesn't make you do those things.
Why in newage you get so much spiritual experiences, you see lights, you get filled with amazing energy etc. but when in christianity you could go 30 years without EVER hearing from God? Whats that all about? I would want Melissas opinion on this?
I'm with this fella...who on earth are we to tell God 'you don't/can't do that'
Yes, as a former ultra-charismatic I can say balance is key here imo.
Yes!!!! I am right there with you. I have been in word faith, came to to reformed, and now I am balancing it out.
Same!!
Always a blessing to hear that!
For me, Reformed then Charismatic then balance. Charismatics have the tendency to minimize God's sovereignty and neglect the guardrails which God established with His Word, and Reformed tend to act as if the Holy Spirit's role ceased with the establishment of the canon. There definitely needs to be a Biblical balance!
I think we do have balance. The Assembly of God Churchs is suppose to be Pentecost but in the Bronx here I don’t hear any tongues. And they say we Pentecostals are extreme and they say the Assembly of God Churches are extreme. I don’t think so. They should visit them and decide for yourself.
@edwardcersosimo1905 I go a Pentecostal church also. Nothing is going on there either.
This conversation had me thinking about how King David danced in worship and how his wife, Saul’s daughter Michael, was ashamed .
Isn't that the truth. Great reference.
Wasn’t he part naked? If not totally 😅
He was nearly naked... I can see why she reacted as such.
There is freedom in Christ and legalism in humanity Jesus spent most of his ministry trying to teach us that and here we are in 2024 still not getting the point of "It Is Finished".
Raising your hands is an act of surrender.
It’s an act of FREEDOM, especially having been told that it is not acceptable here, in this Church.
Balance is key. Years ago, a friend shared a word with me, that has been helpful through my now 71 years. "There are two extremes to any position. If you can only see one, you're sitting on the other." I was involved in the early (and sometimes crazy) Jesus people, charismatic years. I'm not sorry about that, but I have unlearned lots of things as the Lord had graciously led me. I love the Bible and chuckled a little as the conversation traveled the "holding up hands" road. Of course, I hold up my hands to the Lord in worship! It's in the Bible and is a natural expression of reaching out to the One who loves me and I love! I attend a small church now where clapping is not the norm and I miss that. The Psalms are filled with clapping hands! So, I've arrived at a place where I see both extremes to some of these practices and, while shaking off a number of old charismatic ways, I'm happy for the Bible things I experienced and, as best as I can, still unashamedly cling to the ones found in Scripture. They remain life-giving to me!
Who is anyone to tell another what “the correct balance” even is?! Sounds like Pharisiacal judges to me. It’s nobody’s business how I worship my God!!!🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼
I flow in the sperit and will never put God in a box again. Opening the box is the best thing I have ever done.
Oh gosh, my last video was all about this.. Praise GOD we are coming to a balanced perspective in the body of Christ.
Thank you for this video. A great perspective regarding worship. I can so relate to both sides Reformed Charismatic
The simple truth is that the Holy Spirit would never say anything that goes against God's Word, so becoming grounded in the Bible and allowing Him to lead us is the obvious solution.
That's why self-study rightly dividing the Word of God is so important
If pentecostals get truly sound in theology and doctrine, there is no better church than them.
Loved this ❤
Ya, thanks folks, I needed to hear that. Keep catching myself, correcting myself if I accidently speak in tongues, or use certain terms or prayers. Make me flinch. Even being skeptical about praying for healing after coming out a "non denominational" Charismatic/Prosperity/Evangelical etc/etc...
It's tragic that you think you need to "correct yourself" when you "accidentally" speak in tongues. Don't quench the Spirit.
With the purpose of the Holy Spirit from John 14 and 16, I am thinking, that praying to the Holy Spirit, asking for help with understanding and wisdom when we study the scriptures makes complete sense to me. The Word of Truth and the Spirit of Truth work together. When we neglect the Word of Truth and over-focus on the spirit, we get strange spirits. We get strange doctrines when we neglect the Spirit of Truth and over-focus on the word.
Became born again in 1995 ,got carried away by different kinds of teachings like you can lose your salvation, lived in anxiety and depression for many years, out of 100% how much did Jesus Christ alone pay on the cross to reconcile sinners back to the Father?, 100% ,therefore you cannot even add 1% to the finished work of the cross, obviously good works follow believing Jesus Christ alone for salvation. Glory to God.
Just a friendly reminder that Ephesians 4:30 does say not to neglect God's Holy Spirit. That said, I agree 1. God speaks to us sometimes when scripture is not necessary, and 2. I've learned over time being aware of God's Holy Spirit opens scripture to me. But, hey, that's just me. Good episode. Be a blessing.
Respectfully sir, Ephesians 4:30 says “do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God”. The original Greek word means “to grieve, offend”. This is different from neglect
So refreshing!!! I grew up in crazy Pentecostalism so it’s been tricky but yes there is extremism on both sides. Awesome truth here!
One thing is for certain, the holy spirit isnt a separate entity with His own agenda.
The holy spirits agenda is doing the will of the father, just as Jesus had an agenda to do the will of the father.
All three are in agreement with what is written in scripture.
Helpful discussion .
We always swing to far then back. I personally call it the "pendulum effect" but that's just my word for the preceived phenomenon. My2Cents
I’ve used the same term for decades. Things usually come back into balance with time and careful study.
I’ve heard a few pastors say that we only hear God’s voice in the Bible. But that comes across to me as, “Don’t listen to God!” How weird. It takes some discernment and common sense. Unfortunately extremes are much easier to understand.
I completely agree with the spirit of what is being said here. However, I would assert that the word 'worship' is being used far too loosely. Do a little research into how this word has begun to be used so much differently in the last several decades (re: Tom Wadsworth). It is eye-opening. Let's not forget that 'worship' is primarily rendered from 'proskuneo' / 'shachach' in Greek and Hebrew. Peace.
I’ve never been an expressive person, so even when I attended a charismatic church, I didn’t raise my hands or speak in tongues, but I respect people who worship that way. It doesn’t need to be extreme in church to either suppress emotional expression, or roll around on the floor shouting gibberish. We can find a comfortable middle ground with flexibility for a variety of people, within orderly boundaries.
How can anyone, including this man, say what The Holy Spirit will do through a Believer today?
Why is he saying, if it is NOT written in The Set-Apart Scriptures/Holy Bible,
then it is not to be done today?
The Renewed Covenant/New Testament was being written back then,
but it did not end with the book of John,
when Apostle Paul came,
then it is clearly True that The Bible is still being "written" with all of the Saints
throughout the years and events manifested throughout the years,
through All Believers and our experiences,
that no Book could hold or contain
just as we are told in Scripture that no book can hold the Teachings and Miracles of Yahushua Mashiach/Jesus Christ.
Those new ways of Worship and Manifestaions were not received by many,
when Jesus was in Earth,
nor when The Apostles were experiencing Life in Earth.
The Word of The Almighty and Miracles through The Saints are still happening
in new and different ways,
but not recorded in a or The Book.
The Bible says The Light is becoming Brighter,
as The Darkness is becoming Darker.
Therefore, more and diverse Miracles and Revelation would be coming down through The Years,
just as more ways of Evil have happened and are happening,
since The physical writing of "The Holy Bible".
Why is this man limiting or picking and choosing what someone should or shouldn't do,
by The Holy Spirit,
according to a Book that has not fully been written?
Until Jesus Returns, The Holy Bible is still being Written.
And, according to The Book of Revelations...it will continue to Be "Written" and has no End.
And this is why we need to memorize the Bible. A body Is more than the skeleton, and a skeleton alone cannot live. But a body without a skeleton cannot stand upright. When in doubt, refer to the manual....
You don’t memorize the bible! You need to understand it! You search the scriptures for in them you think you have eternal life, but they testify of me ( John, 5.39).. in other words the book is speaking of your awareness… I AM! It’s all you
Amen! The Spirit is primary.
Yes!!!!!!❤
Yes, avoid the other extreme. Balanced and biblical reforms
Impossible to know G.. without scripture, Scripture is the voice of G..
But do remember that "the letter kills but the Spirit gives life."
Melissa Dougherty what's the name of the book your referring to?
Take away the Scriptures, what do we lose? Take away the Holy Spirit, what do we lose? For the first couple of hundred years of the Church's existence, regular contact with the Scriptures was a rarity for most Christians. Yet they grew strong, multiplied in number, and spread throughout the known world.
You both are outstanding servants, thank you, thank you so much for the work you do
This may sound strange but I’ve used the Wordle puzzle to help me recognize the Holy Spirit and strengthen my ability to feel him.
The times I’ve tried to solve it on my own pale in comparison to when I’ve prayed for Him to join me in this exercise. It’s absolutely improved my relationship with Him on a daily basis, helping to feel when he’s leading me. God
Bless you Sister !! 🙏🏻✝️❤️
Remeber when he was a chubby kid at his Dads church I attended in Vancouver
It's very scary I don't know either
This is awesome but you still can't put God in a box. Gods true plan is a mystery to us!
The scriptures plainly tell you WHAT the Holy Spirits job is. When you find the scripture that says we should pray to the Holy Spirit please just post it. I enjoy Charles Spurgeons preaching but there is NO SCRIPTURES that tells us to pray to the Holy Spirit. May be the catholics might be able to help, they pray to mary and THATS NOT IN SCRIPTURE EITHER.
We pray to the Father in the name of Jesus, the Son.
The risen Son is sitting at the right hand of the Father on high. The Holy Spirit is with us and in us (believers)to lead us and guide us into all truth as we read the Word.
🙏🏻🕊️✝️
I have always understood that we can ask the Holy Spirit, who is interceding for us, just like we pray to Jesus and God the Father.
Romans 8:26 English Standard Version -26 Likewise the Spirit helps us in our weakness. For we do not know what to pray for as we ought, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words.
Well, the scriptures teach men to lift up holy hands before God so I guess you can lift your hands😊
Melissa I’d be careful about all this. There’s something about it, that doesn’t seem right.
What's the name of the book?
Oh, it is an advertisement for a book...
Seems Jesus actually does a bit of witnessing himself. So many ex-Muslims have claimed that He approached them as they searched for truth. So, it doesn't make sense that we *must* have a Bible or a foreign preacher.
I do not think the Pentecostals or the (Assembly of God Churches who are Pentecostals ) are extreme. You have to visit them and decide on your own. Here in the Bronx you don’t even hear tongues in these Assembly of God Churches.
It depends on the individual congregation. Some (like the one I used to attend) will embrace all kinds of nonsense.
Yeah, no one’s is running around, doing donuts on the floor, or speaking in tongues at my church. I get why people think this though because I have been to some Assembly of God churches that embrace some weird stuff.
@@FallingMoonXoffical Are you saying speaking in tongues isn't in the Bible or isn't of God?
I must know, what house is Jalen in?!
You can’t just be a fan and not be in a house.
Delightful day!
In Romans chapter 1, Even the creation of God's speaks of his glory even in human consciousness tells us right from wrong. Yes, are nature is in the image of God so the other side can leads us like the tower of baal were they try to reach God in a human matter depends on our afford instead of God provision through Christ. So The spirit of God is affirm bybthebwordnof God. Even in the epistle of 1 Jn were he ssys, "test the spirit cause not ever spirit is not from God".
,
.
The Holy Spirit HRLPS US in our weaknesses but the ONLY JESUS INTERCEDES FOR US.
Both, Jesus and the Holy Spirit intercede for us, according to the Bible
Romans 8:26-27 English Standard Version
26 Likewise the Spirit helps us in our weakness. For we do not know what to pray for as we ought, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words. 27 And he who searches hearts knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because[a] the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God.
Romans 8:34
English Standard Version
34 Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died-more than that, who was raised-who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us.[
Hebrews 7:25
English Standard Version
25 Consequently, he is able to save to the uttermost[a] those who draw near to God through him, since he always lives to make intercession for them.
1 John 2:1
English Standard Version
Christ Our Advocate
2 My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.
@@cactusbutterfly2939
And then Paul who wrote both Romans and Timothy, wrote this:
1 Timothy 2:5
For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
Meanings of mediate and intercede:
As verbs the difference between mediate and intercede is that mediate is to resolve differences, or to bring about a settlement, between conflicting parties while intercede is to plead on someone else's behalf.
I would love your take on pre-millennial view vs post millennial view and have someone like Jeff Durbin come on your show with his post view. Pre-millennial is the dominant view in the US, but after I have done a deep dive much like you do, read the books, heard hundreds of sermons I am
100 percent post millennial. But my pastor is pre, and he makes much of his view, calling other views apostasy. 😮😢
Have you ever been to a church where someone had Holy Ghost laughter? I’d love someone’s opinion on it. I found it rather disconcerting.
Holy laughter, to me, is very wrong. It seems creepy really.
the holy laughter stuff is definitely unbiblical, it makes people seem crazy and out of their minds while Scripture tells us that one of the fruit of the Spirit is self control. Praised God that you were able to discern that it did not seem right because it isn't. Blessings to you, I hope this helps!
Scripture neither advocates nor opposes it. The late Gordon Fee cautiously affirmed it. Craig Keener testifies positively of having experienced it several times.
I have left Pentecostalism. Charismatics never really did it for me. Both camps seem to confuse too much bass and too much volume with a moving of the Holy Spirit. Their depth of understanding has all the credence of a young guy with a ball cap on backwards and a pack of smokes rolled up in his shirt sleeve saying "ooh neat!" You cannot be a disciple if you are not disciplined. It is the same root word. Say this to some people (especially charismatics) and they invariably respond "You are just being legalistic". Alright, just say a simple prayer, sing some happy songs, and maybe just maybe memorize two or three verses. In the end we will see how you do.
What is the book you are referring to that he wrote ?
"Knowing the Spirit"
Who is this man Melissa is interviewing?
I don't yet know what these two are talking about
Good thoughts about the “pendulum” swinging too far one way or the other.
Christian mysticism? Often thought about it
Self control is a fruit of the spirit, and the Holy Ghost is not your emotions, sadly Reformed/Calvinists, Charismatics/Evangelicals, and Baptists/Non-Denominationals don't get that.
Unless a minister is reading Scripture, what he says is not the word of God.
GLORY!!!'m favoured, $140K every 3weeks! And I am retired i can now give back to the locals in my community and also support God's work and the church. God bless America 🇺🇸 ❤️
Excuse me for real?, how is that possible I have struggling financially, how was that possible?
Thanks to my co-worker whom God used to give a great opportunity of crossing paths with 'Mrs KATE ELIZABETH BECHERER'.
YES!!! That's exactly her name (Kate Elizabeth Becherer) so many people have recommended highly about her and am just starting with her Brisbane Australia🇭🇲
Same here, with my current portfolio made from my investments with my personal financial advisor (Kate Elizabeth Becherer) I totally agree with you.
This sounds so good and I would like to be a party to this, is there any way I can speak with her?
Jesus named the Father as the Holy Spirit.
Luke 10:21 MEV
At that time *_Jesus rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, "I thank You, O Father,_* …
Apostle Paul named the Lord as the Spirit
2 Corinthians 3:17 MEV
Now *_the Lord is the Spirit._* …
There is the Lord God and there is the Lord Jesus Christ, but there is NO Lord Holy Spirit anywhere in Scripture. I can give you dozens of verses that name Jesus as the Holy Spirit, many from Himself (John 14:18,30,21,23), and none indicating an anonymous third person.
Jesus spoke "in the third person" throughout the Gospels (read John 3:16-17 for example), never about a third person.
Praise the Lord!
We’re told in the Word that God is a Spirit and them that worship Him must worship Him in Spirit and in Truth. Nobody knows where another person has been brought from/out of, or what one another is feeling. We’re to judge prophecy and to inspect fruit of the Spirit and to discern spirits but we’re not told to judge how others worship. This whole conversation is a waste. Sorry Melissa. Normally I get you but this one’s way out of line imho.
I was raised in Cairo Egypt and Muslims did NOT read the Bible. We were forbidden to share the gospel with them under threat of imprisonment and death.
BUT Yeshua Jesus our God in His mercy would appear and speak to them and they gave their life to Him. They read the Bible in secret after that as their families tried to poison them, shoot them, k-l them and they survived.
This incredible idea that u have to go to other countries to preach when our home is burning and baal reigns in cities is appalling to me.
calvinism is not biblical, any unbiblical doctrine taints every other doctrine, a little leaven leavens the whole lump
Ga1 5:
9 A little leaven leavens the whole lump.
If Melissa likes this comment. I promise to quit alcohol.
Why not rely on the power of God to break addiction instead? Don’t put humans on a pedestal it becomes idolatry
Do you drink too much?
Why don't you just promise for yourself. It'll last longer
🤦🏼♂️
If you don't quit for yourself, it won't last.
So MEN mentioned praying to the Holy Spirit. It is important to realize this. The Word tells us to pray in the name of Jesus Christ. Not a human like Mary. Not a pope. Not a so-called saint. Not a priest or preacher. Not a man or any other manifestation of anything, but Jesus Christ, the Intercessor. I completely disagree with the perspective brought forth in the first few lines of this video. Man altering the Word of God to his wishes and wants is the biggest problem with religion. Organized religion makes this further problematic.
Maybe we don't pray directly to the Spirit but we pray in the Spirit (Jude 1:20) and we can ask the Father to give us His Spirit (Luke 11:13) or we can ask Him to strengthen us (Ps. 143:10, Eph 3:16)
Strengthen us through His Spirit (didn't finish my sentence 😅)
@@Anne-ie8fw Right, but that's not the same as praying to the Holy Spirit. There is no instruction or command to pray to the Holy Spirit. There is instruction, therefore a command to pray in the name of Jesus Christ.
Costi Hinn is a calvinist... calvinist are not Christian.. they belittle what Jesus did on the cross (limited atonement) and blaspheme the character (God is responsible for all evil and man is not free) of God. Please Melissa do a deep dive on calvinism. Start with Leighton Flowers or read his book "the potters promise".
I would NOT call Calvanists non-Christian. Be careful. I have No Doubt that Costi is my brother in Christ even if I don't agree with his Calvanism.
Take your filth elsewhere.
@@alannahquiniones3695 there is just one Christian church and this is the Catholic Church. There is just ONE WAY. Everybody is calling himself a Christian nowadays and this is problematic especially for people who are searching for god, because they think they are following Christ
@@SchnuppenSchnappeif you are referring to the catholic church from the Niceness Creed, I agree with you. This refers to the Church that Christ established. This is much bigger than the Catholic Church
@@chuckb5625 ?
It’s all just imagination. At some point one needs to grow up and realise there are no gods or spirits, just us. No one is coming to help, we need to look after each other.