BLADES VS FORGIVENESS // Can oversize irons hurt your game more than they will help?
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- Опубликовано: 3 июн 2024
- Today Ian is in the bay to demonstrate why it is so important when getting fit to make sure you are testing the right clubs for your unique golf swing. It is all too easy to immediately reach for whatever style of club has the most forgiveness or technology that often accentuates distance over consistency. Ian gives a visual demonstration of why longer is not always better when picking the perfect iron.
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Would like to see a do-over with an 18 handicap
Yes, I think this would make total sense
Came to say this. That’s the person who gets pushed into the larger irons. Would like to see this player get potentially more out of a bladish iron. Or showcase the trade off
Fine, I’ll do it 😅
Yes and the 180 club vs the 180 club
Agree completely
I think a better test would be to compare shots from the same distances rather than comparing the same numbered iron. Basically, you should be comparing the bladed 4i to the distance 7i or the bladed 7i to the distance 9i (or whatever the distance equivalents would be). The relevant question, for how golf is actually played, is: are you better from 205 with a bladed 4i or with a "more forgiving" 7i?
Looked like Ian hit the ball much better with the blades - of course. However, put anyone 25 yards closer to the green and their consistency will likely improve. The number on the bottom of the club is not as relevant a comparison when loft and club head design are so different. A better test for how real golf is played would be to put the (e.g.) 200yd club against the 200yd club, regardless of the number on it. Just a thought.
I thought the same, but once you standardize the results (standard deviation / distance) you can see that the ratio is much higher with the cobra iron. In other words, relative dispersion with cobra iron still higher than that with the cobra iron.
@@dabdias You can't standardize the results because he didn't hit a bladed 4i. You can in theory say per yard here are the numbers, but a 4i is harder to hit than a 6i. I bet if you extrapolate it out the blade 4i and blade 6i numbers per yard would be different.
Yeah exactly.
@@kakimotoK20 of course you can standardize! There may still be some caveats in the comparison, but the standardized numbers will be much more comparable. Note that a 4i is harder to hit than a 6i because of loft and shaft length, but the added difficulty that comes from the longer shaft in this case does not apply.
exactly what i was thinking
I'm an older PGA professional and used to be a good competitive player a few years back. I fell into the trap of thinking I need a more forgiving iron as I don't play as much as I used to, I don't have the same speed I used to, etc. I tested nearly every iron head in the store and you would think that some type of cb would fit the bill. Literally hit the blades straighter, more consistent, and just overall way better. If you are a reasonably consistent striker of the ball don't be afraid to test them out, you might be surprised.
yes but can you still hit them out of the rough from 180/ yards in the rain? would be the arguement, MB's are a perfect middleground, if you dont shape/move the ball theres no need for blades whatsoever.
Couldn’t agree more.
What you might be looking for is help from a lighter and possibly whippier shaft.
I have tried every forgiving iron and went back to my old MacGregor VIP blades. Same is true for “woods.”
THIS
I think what this needs to normalize is the dispersion based on the distance you’re hitting. Obviously any 200 yd shot will have more dispersion than a 180yd shot so I think you need to have a yardage goal and THEN pick the tool to test. That might mean using a 4i blade vs a 6i cavity back and seeing which offers the best results.
Great point; I’ve always thought the same thing - comparing a bit of apples & oranges given your targeting different yardages. Well-said.
That's only a 10% difference in distance. The difference in dispersion was much greater than 10%. I think the distance standard deviation went from 1 yard to 3 yards. That is a big difference. At 3 sigma, that's 3 yards vs. 9 yards and the are no external environmental effects that may impact the ball flight over longer distances.
@@MrHasenfefferif that’s the case (maybe it is), then TXG should demonstrate that with testing rather than having the audience guess. That’s kind of the whole point of the channel.
This is spot on.
hitting a 6i cavity back is so much easier hitting a 4i blade. For sure.
Going to p790’s as a scratch handicap was the worst decision I’ve made in my golf career. If you have speed, hotter irons are absolutely not the right move. I became terrified of flying greens and went up to a 2 handicap. Moved back to Ping Blueprint S irons and went back to a +2. The distance control is 100x better.
See I’m a weirdo and have a lot of speed but I’m a mid handicap. I was tired of airmailing greens so I switched to a forged players combo set. I definitely lost yardage going from strong lofts to traditional loft, but yardages are so much more consistent now. Plus, feel is crazy
What made you switch to p790’s? Did you want the extra juice?
I could not agree more! I swing a 7 iron at 100+ mph and I would never play a hollow body again, especially because they are loft jacked. Only shallow cavity backs and muscle backs from here on out.
I’m actually really looking at picking up a set of the AVODAs as my first venture into one-length irons. I’m interested to see how I would play if everything was my 7 iron length
@@BigDawgCAM I think cobra also makes some of their more player oriented sets in one lengths as well! Not sure about the lofts though
Lol this is the case for everyone. I went straight to blades and love them
Try being a 10 HC with the iron play of a 4, and trying to get fitted for blades in Scotland. First you get the patter that even the tour pros don't use them. Confidence comes with consistency of direction and flight for a golfer. Honestly sick fed up with gatekeeping in golf by those low guys or club pros who scoff and people playing blades. First bad shot you hit, and it's "That's cause you're playing those daft blades mate" - piss off.
So true ….
where do you get fitted? Ive been to sggt before and they are great
@@patrickhalliday8220 I went to SGGT when the T100 came out. Cost me £1700 for 4-PW. Granted I was off 17 then, but recently, I have only asked fitters before committing to the session.
@@TenPester wow titleist isnt cheap. T100 probably closest thing to a blade. Not bad for a 17 handicap. I went 4 years ago off 19 and ended up with the jpx hot metals - I had no idea... just saw the distance numbers! Now im back booked in next week off 8 and looking for more feel. I think the lesson here is try and get the club you can grow into. Im gonna try get as bladey as possible. maybe 9-5 miuras lol
@@TenPester where else have u gone to get fitted?
Would like to see a comparison of the club from each set that goes the same distance, instead of the same “number” club from each set. How can you compare dispersion from a club going 200 yards to a club going 180 yards. Of course it will be bigger dispersion (left/right and front/back) the longer the ball is traveling.
Beat me to it!😂
Yup - would love to see this comparison tested. I believe there is still an advantage to be had from the blade but the gap would certainly tighten. I played blades for a while, but ended up shifting to a players CB to better handle my tendency to hit low in the face.
Several years back I tinkered with a big old set of Ping G xxx irons. Ironically I hit one of the best shots of my life with that 6 iron, clearing a very ominous tree and settling in next to the pin at 203 yds. That same shot convinced me I needed to get rid of those irons. 203 was way longer than I could routinely expect from that club. It just happened to work in my favor for that particular shot, but I couldn't rely on getting a consistent carry with it.
No doubt that they could have done a better job at comparing results, but even when you standardize dispersion relative to distance, the dispersion with the cobra iron is significantly larger.
I was wondering about that myself
so u want to compare different length shafts? or bend the blade to the same loft as the GI iron? the ideal thing to do would have been to get an 18 hcp to test both clubs, i think the point was to say maybe hitting it shorter but more consistent is better
Dudes, what you said in the first minute of the video is EXACTLY what I experienced in a fitting over the weekend. I hit the Blueprint S with waaay less dispersion than the i530s. I really didn't understand why until now. I spun the Blueprints waay more.
I got fit for some Ping G400s when i got back in to playing in 2020, fitting went fine but i quickly felt that they weren’t right for me, i struggled on with them for about 18 months, i replaced them with some Wilson Staff Model CB’s and have been playing a lot better golf ever since.
I so enjoyed this video. I'm in my early 60's and still play blades. I also have the Mizuno JPX 900 Hot Metals and they are just like you said, one shot is pin high and the next from the same distance flies the green. I'll be a blade man til I can no longer play. So I give up some distance. Big whoop. I bet higher handicaps once they get over the phobia that the masses have beat into their brains and embrace blades they'll actually improve by the club making them more consistent strikers. PS I still play persimmons too.
So funny you mention this. People always ask me why I play player's cbs instead of GI clubs. For some reason when the sole gets thicker I start hitting the ball thin. Might be all in my mind but I swear its happened for my whole life.
Same for me - ball striking is still weak after moving to CBs, but highly improved relative to when I was using players irons with a much wider and flat sole.
Same here. Everybody said why are you hitting it so bad. Went back to forged cbs and my strikes were better. So interesting
Sole width is often overlooked but it's sooo important
I like this topic lads....I'll add this - Your route of higher cap players not having to shy away from players clubs, can also work the opposite way with better players being able to see success with improvement irons. Its all about the fit no matter the handicap. I hover in the 6hcp range and feel that ever going away from a players iron and into a Ping G series iron, my iron play has been a real highlight of my game. Even my regular playing partner has noticed the improvement in my iron strikes and accuracy after moving into Ping G series irons. G410 BTW....before the G430 lofts went all nuclear.
I’ve always thought this. Thanks for proving it.
Went from TM790 to ping430 lob wedge to 4 iron. Love the easy work ability, mostly hit a draw. At 84 and playing white tees now I’m able to maintain my 5 handicap easier. Traded my Calloway epic driver for the Ping 439 and forgiveness was not a problem, but my distance actually increased about 12-15 yards. Love your videos, never miss any.
Excellent Informative Video!! As a 15-18 Handicap testing clubs for a new set this year, this will definitely help me! Thanks!!
Awesome stuff guys!!!
So well said ! I’m of an age when I remember everyone played blades and guess what, we all enjoyed our golf and hit fairways and greens. Strong lofted clubs are fine if you have the club speed to generate the spin needed. If you don’t, just use loft to help.
This is great. I've played both blades and game improvement irons in recent years. Consistency with the blades is a game-changer for me.
For me, the big variable in getting dialed into irons is the sole width which has a big impact on turf interaction. The larger heads with wide soles just do not work for me. Any help in distance is gained by accidentally catching one like a fairway wood vs. how I normally strike an iron. Getting the Titleist T150s finally gave me the narrow sole and some help as I certainly don't have enough speed to really consider using true blades. Like many of the videos, this one points out some interesting insights on a few of the tradeoffs in club fitting, but clearly there are more to consider as some of the other posters have noted.
Exactly the same for me. My fitter put me into Apex Pro and Srixon ZX7 over the regular Apex. He said the thick sole of the regular Apex was causing poor turf interaction for me, which is why my Apex Pro numbers were significantly more consistent with much less dispersion.
I decided at the end of last year I was going to ditch my Cobra Forged Tec and only play blades. I started with some 1971 Wilsons and fell in love with them. I have gradually lowered my handicap from 13 to 9 and attribute it mostly to playing the blades. The Game Improvement irons definitely went farther but I struggled to hold greens and struggled with consistent distance making it very hard to score. I have upgraded to newer Cobra blades S3 Pro Forged.
Absolutely.
24 handicap, the (Cobra) club fitter was flabbergasted that the fitting matrix he was using was putting me into the Forged TEC rather than the SGIs.
Was a 19 handicap last February when I went to CC for an iron fit. I have some speed (92 mph 6i) knew I didn't need a distance iron, was surprised though when I got fit into the Cobra CB/MBs. Was expecting something like an I230 cavity back, but the wide sole made it really difficult to find the center of the face, whereas the middle of the face was all I found with the MB. Great video lads
Ian I hope this video gets the attention it deserves. It's not talked about much but this is dead on.
Love this video! I play blades as a weekend warrior, but nothing can compare to the consistency and feel you get with a blade.
Another useful thought-provoking video guys, thank you. Buddy of mine only who only recently started playing has decent clubhead speed, plays GI irons, 7i can fly anything from 155-170 (but then again he hasn't yet learned the concept of a 'stock' swing)
me, a 18 handicapper, bought the new mizuno blades 241. blades are the best teacher a golfer can have.
Thank you for validating what I have felt for so long. I have always played better with a players club than a more game improvement iron. Strikes are so much better and more consistent.
So good guys thanks
Hey guys great content as always.
Can you do a video on testing a mizuno 245 or 225 bent to standard lofts like 7iron 30 degree set to 33 or 34 what happens to the distance,spin and peak height. Would you still have the forgiveness?
eye opening....thank you !!
I didn't play golf for 33 years, and all I had when I was a boy were so-called blades. That's all there was until the Ping Eye2's came out in the late '80s. After trying 3 different sets of irons over a year, I've now been playing my Miura 101's for the last 7 months, and if I want to go longer, I get the next club up! It's simple. If I'm not striking well, the 6-4i's can be a real pain as you absolutely have to find the middle; but when you're in the zone, and you need to get the target, there's nothing like them! Love my blades!
Good one and couldn’t agree more
I was an 18 when I moved from GI’s (an old set of TM R7’s) to blades (Haywood Golf MB PW-7, CB 6-4). That was less two years ago and I’m now a 14. More importantly, the sound and feel of a forged blade is something I’m not willing to compromise on, there’s just nothing better. Play what gives you confidence when you look down
I really like the message here. Have been working hard on my approach game. Felt like my Paradyms were holding me back. Ordered T100's last week. I don't need to hit my 7 iron 205 with 5k rpms. I'd much rather have the consistency you showed here.
I definitely agree with this. I'm an 18 handicap golfer with high swing speeds 110ish driver 94ish 7 iron....I was dead set on getting the new Callaway Apex DCBs when they came out and i went to go try them and i was carrying the 7 iron 200+ yards which was ridiculous, but everything was dead left. I tried the regular Apex and my dispersion was so much better and carrying about 185ish. I don't know what it is but when i try Super game improvement clubs I hit them way left no matter what brand I've tried. Right now, I play the 2021 Cobra King MIM Tours with KBS Tour 120 shafts and i absolutely love them. 7iron is about 178ish carry and its perfect. I don't need distance at all and i hit these irons way better than any other club I've ever used. Never been fitted yet but my next set of clubs will be a full fit.
This reminds me Contact is King! Inspiration for any golfer looking to improve above all else.
This test result makes me lean to a players club over game improvement in future
Great video: fit the game of the player, and each player is different . I’ve seen high handicaps benefit from blades or players cavities when the stop hitting ‘flyers,’ and improve ball striking capability. I’ve also seen scratch players improve by addition of distance, and forgiveness. A great video for fitters for sure
This is why I like something like the PXG 0317T. They have some forgiveness built in but with lofts closer to traditional. Seems like the best of both worlds
This video was very good. I agree with you my Pro that I work with at my club has also said to me that I should get a few blades in the bag because learning how to hit a proper blade actually can make me a better golfer something to be said about that T150’s in my bag now. Eyeing up either MB or even cobra or miura or even Mizuno blades in 7-pw
Had a recent Club Champion fitting and although I have always tended to play blades, it wasn't until I got fit that I understood why they suit me better. The narrower sole is something that works better for me, the wider the sole the bigger the miss. YMMV
Great video, when I finally get new clubs I will not tell them my handicap but but j want in an iron set. Which is consistency and a properly gapped set through the bag.
Great video guys. I have found much the same thing in my game as well. I'm a high single digit index player but always gravitate and play better with the "blade like" CB player type of irons. Something like the MP-60 or P7-MC. I struggle a bit with the chunky stuff but gain some confidence with a slight CB as opposed to a true blade.
I was playing Srixon ZX5's and switched to TaylorMade P7MC 5-Pw and P770 4 iron. It has made a big difference. My Miss hits aren't in the woods they actually are a good Miss. Think you get the idea😅
This feels like it should be the first part of the test, and you're missing a whole bunch of data to come to a proper conclusion.
You've determined that the blade is shorter distance but has way more consistency and control in a driving range setting only and that doesn't really make anything conclusive.
Next step is to pick multiple distances of say 125, 165, and 200 yards and hit to the pin with each type of club and look at the differences in a scoring club, mid iron, and long iron. Now you have a clearer picture for a low handicap player.
Now run the same tests with a 12 handicap and a 24 handicap and a 36 handicap.
Now you have a complete set of data to really determine if oversized clubs are going to help or hurt your game based on handicap level.
Great video don't get me wrong, but I think more data is needed to complete the test. This could be the start of a really good series.
These dudes r just there to sell club fittings at their fancy store in Canada 🇨🇦. The average 20 handicap just need a set of wedges a nine iron and a 5&7 hybrid off Amazon for $50. They will be far better ahead, and there bag won’t weigh a ton
I've 100% had this happen! I got fit into T100 and irons was a rougher part of my game but my miss and angle of attack made the T100 better than any of the irons I hit and I haven't regretted it once. Shout out to the mississauga location 🎉
Until recently there was a missing club type is the forgiving iron with traditional lofts. I have had 92 mph 7 iron (110+ mph driver) since I started playing a few years ago. I had a massive problem with finding clubs that fit me. Game improvement irons would go way too far, 190-200 yard 7 irons, but blades were way too hard to hit for my inconsistent strike. I think the Mizuno Hot Metal HL, and more traditional lofted (31* 7 iron) game improvement irons like them, are a better fit for most golfers than the super strong lofted GIs.
For myself, I recently got a set of Mizuno 245s got them bent weak (9-GW 2* week, 6-8 1* weak, 5 no change) and learned to embrace my fade.
Great video! Really eye opening. I play GI off a 5 index but never tried anything else. Is there a certain tech that causes the dispersion. Or more specifically, is it blade vs everything else? If you go p790 or p770 would you have the same wider dispersion?
Interesting video. At what skill level and/or handicap would you suggest a customer to try a blade during a fitting?
I watched an older video you did on blades the other day and you mentioned that the weight in the head ie PTW has an effect. I would love to hear more on this as my miss with my PTW is always just 5 to 10 yards to the right. Is this what causes this?
I'm a 24 handicap. I went from Ping G's, that I hit good, but could not control as well to Takomo 101T's. Almost immediately my dispersion went from 80 yards wide and 25 yards deep on my mid irons to 50 yards wide and 10 yards deep. It's a game changer. If you work on your consistency a little bit you'll hit the smaller higher spin irons better than game improvement irons. I did not lose a yard either. Since the switch I broke 90 for the first time in 20 years.
Would love to see blade vs game improvement at the same loft. Always enjoy your content.
Talked about this a lot. Firstly, I agree with this general assessment - been fit multiple times at CC Calgary and they are amazing. (If) Ian is hitting the 241 pro here, there is 6 degrees difference and that is 1.5 clubs. Does anyone have a smaller dispersion on their 4 iron in comparison to their 6? Maybe a few. This is why I think there should be standard lofts on clubs and/or being fit should be with clubs that are within 1-2 degrees. Jacked up lofts serve ego only (yes I know, decent angle, height, spin etc) but if you test a same degree loft club then you can see which one goes farther, tighter dispersion, decent angle etc. 2nd swing did a video on this with the Ping i59 vs g710. Same exact distance (i59 by 0.4 yds, but lets not split hairs), better dispersion with the 710 tho. So for that person 710 is good. If the i59 had a better dispersion, go for it. Totally agree with Ian here, if you are delivering the club more consistently with one, that is probably the one for you. BUT very hard to tell with a 6 degree difference.
I just got fit at PXG. Went in for the Gen 6 irons. The fitter put me into the 0317T blade like irons due to the narrower sole. Struck them much better than the Gen 6 counterpart and I’m a 17 handicap
Would also be nice to see comparison on same flag distance
Good test. I've found that more game improvement style irons work best for me when my attack angle is pretty small. That lead me to too shallow of a swing. Moving to more player style irons forced me to get a steeper angle of attach which lead to a more stable club face at impact.
Completely agree with the video from personal experience BUT like many others have said it would be more fair to test clubs at same distance and highlight if more forgiving clubs are actually more forgiving and not just longer. Love that this is getting brought up though!!
I think your assessment on these types of distance irons is correct. I am a 12 handicap and been playing Mizuno JPX 923 HM Pro. I decided to go in to get fit for the Mizuno 243. Love the feel. However, I hit the Callaway Smoke AI and kept saying wow that distance and solid feel is amazing but no way! I have to get the 243's. My swing speed is only 82 mph with 7 iron. Well after another 20 hits I ordered the Smoke AI's. I also was surprised the head length seems smaller than my 923's. I don't think these Smoke AI's would be good for fast swingers but they work for me.
Great Video. I (hdcp 9) played for several years the honma blades tw17m (great irons) and changed two years ago to the mizuno 225 because I wanted more distance. Now after two years I am not that happy with the mizunos as I was with the honma‘s because of greater dispersion in with and lenght. And if I compare the lofts of these irons, the mizunos are much stronger.
Now I am think of going back to blades and am interested in the miura MB 101, but a little bit afraid of how hard they are to play and how much distance I would loose.
Question 1: What do you think about customize/harden the loft of blades like miura MB 101 about 1-2 degrees? Will this give more distance without changing the other functions/attributes, feel and dispersion of the irons?
Question 2: Is it possible/sensefull to compensate the distance-loss of a blade by a good shaft, e.g. Fukijura Axiom 105S?
Kind Regards
Michael
I sacked off the stealth’s and went to Titleist t100s irons, game changing
I have spent years looking for what works best for me. I get a few eye rolls bcuz I'm a 24 hcp and I use Titleist 714mb. I've been through plenty of GI and SGI with different shaft weights and flexes, and these strike best for me. A fat toe miss is the worst distance killer, but I don't see much difference between being maybe 10 yd short with SGi/GI vs 10/20 yd short with a blade, I'm still short and my next shot seems to have the same chance of getting on. I finally went for an iron fitting in 2022 and they reccomended that I stick with what I have, mostly bcuz of spin and angle of descent.
I fell into this trap getting the standard Apex irons, lost the strike with the wide sole. Now have a combo set of Srixons and the 4/5iron are chunky but the V sole saves it in my mind. Would be cool to see if V sole actually makes a difference to your strike with the same width sole
I do completely agree, I am a 3 handicap, I don’t play « real » blades but distance iron are not good for my game, also harder to control off the wind due to their high trajectory. I also have issues with bulky driving irons, I play a t200 utility build 3 iron better than the U505.
Mid handicap here. Started playing with srixon zx4s and switched to mizuno jpx tours. Night and day difference. Feel more confident and concentrate more on my shots with the tours. Play with what works best for YOU.
Hi, could you do a test to compare irons thar go the same distance I.e. a game improvement 6 iron vs a blade 4 iron fly 200 yards. I'd love to know how the dispersion and landing conditions stack up when comparing irons that fly the same distance.
This is great! We really need to get away from making a direct correlation between handicap and ability. An 18 handicap can be a poor ball striker but an 18 handicap can also be a solid ball striker. Handicap is a better determinant of course management-so getting fit and finding the equipment best for your swing is prudent.
I am glad this video has been made, if you need forgiveness, go for a hybrid, maybe a set of elevens. So called forgiving irons are rocket ships, distance in the extreme.
I just switched from PXG 0311p gen 3 into titelist t100 irons. Due to weather, I haven’t been able to get them to the course yet. I play off of 8-10 handicap. Here’s to hoping I can hit them
Very interested. I am about to my video out. The Cobra irons LOOK like a players iron from looking down on it. The Ping looks big and clanky. Taylormade are HOT as usual. Great vod boys.
I wish you guys would've included the 4 iron blade, to see how that disperson compares to the 6 iron cavity back. Very interesting video.
So if 6iron to 6iron the blade is more consistent but less distance I'd be curious if the 6iron blade vs 8iron "modern club" where distance hit should be about the same would yield a much tighter dispersion and nearer the blade dispersion given the shorter shaft and more face angle in the modern iron? Could also do 4 iron blade vs 6 iron modern club.
If you set the test so that delivered loft and turf interaction / impact location was the same, what does the difference look like then??
I haven’t hit a golf-ball in 10 yesrs when I used blade/forged irons back in the 2000s: *Titlest 690, Titlest 695.mb, Nike Forged, TaylorMade RAC TP MB:*
• all quality clubs
• all require practice and correct swing to use properly
• all gave me great distance control and feel
• all continued to remind me never to use CB/GI's
Just acquired a set of *Titleist 681s* for practice and looking at the *620s* as my go-to set.
_It's so back on, baby....back on like Donkey Kong!!_
I went from a game improvement to a titlesit blade and my game actually improved dramatically. They were used clubs but I’m due for a full proper fitting the head and impact area of a blade is so small that it forces me to rely on my swing not the forgiveness of a club. I don’t need distance I was dispersion accuracy and distance control. I’m hoping to get fitted for some Muiras soon.
You exactly described the problem I had hitting my set of GI irons. I’ve gone to a players CB set and am hitting them so much better
Cool video...
It would be interesting to see the same lofts? Like an 8 in the cobra? Compared to the 6 in the blade?
I went from mizuno hot metals to the new mizuno pro 243’s and I’m scoring better than ever. My irons are probably the strongest part of my game because I really know the distances. My driving is now what really needs the work.
Great video, love your thought process, the physics of ball flight as you touched on are inarguable.
I agree that dispersion ie distance control is of major importance. I play P770's with a low single digit index. But in am 69 and my swing speed is reduced because of this. Would love to play P7MC but I am afraid my swing speed is not enough. Would love to see this comparison what lower swing speeds.
I would like to see Ian's 4 iron vs the strong 6
i am like a 25 handicap and i have ping i210s and recently ive been thinking about switching to takoma 101s. since i hear the forgiveness is nice for new golfers. do you think 101s are the right move? or just keep learning how to hit the i210s? if anyone has any input? thanks
I am buying the dark speed one length irons tomorrow wish me luck!
I used to play a 'players' CB with the usual bit of tech and 'modern' lofts (32 deg 7i). Theoretically, skill-wise (12 hc) , that's what I 'should' be playing. But I found I needed more spin and more consistency (in spin and carry). So I'm playing a combo set of Wilson Staff Model CBs and blades. Sure, I lost a club's worth of distance, but I gained better control and predictability. Two months into using them and I'm off a 10 hc heading to single digits. Apart from the obvious performance and scoring benefits, the feel is simply glorious. When you really centre it, you don't even realise you've hit the ball. The old clubs never, ever got close to that feeling.
Anyone else feel like it takes more work to square the larger iron heads up? Maybe just in my head, but with the weight further away from in line with the shaft it’s just like the toe wants to lag behind and droop. But then if you release it the toe just wants to flip over. This added with large wide soles that don’t like to actually get down to the ball make the GI irons so tough for me to play and control. Also agree with other comments probably should have thrown in a compare with equal loft and shaft lengths between the 2 types..
Sorry for the novel but this vid is what I needed to hear so bad...
I got seriously into golf August 2023. I am a data guy and went to 2 local shops (one being Club Champion) to get fitted. I had some extra money saved up and decided I would play better with new clubs. I had been gaming the same clubs since maybe 2005 which were my grandfathers Wilson Deep Red II with regular shaft and standard length. I am probably an easy 6" taller than my grandfather. A lot of fat and thin shots and was just frustrated.
I went in to club champion with a budget of $1500 for a whole new bag (I didn't know any better). The fitter was honest with me and said I would only be able to get into irons (maybe depending on shaft etc.). To be honest it scared me off and I was like CC is way too advanced for me. I went to a second shop (I won't share where because it may not be the location as much as it was the fitter) and told them my budget and they said I would be able to get into a bag for a little more than that, but it would be close. I explained my current issues and said I just want to hit far. Keep in mind I could never strike the ball well with my gamers so my 7i was probably my 130 club. Well, short story long, I walked out of there with Paradym X irons stiff flex stock shaft +1" standard lie and loft. I hit that 7i in fitting 175 and thought daaaaamn! For reference, driver swing speed is 110-120MPH and 7i is about 90-95mph. Almost every other week my distances with new irons go up a few yards. how do I even practice course management with dispersions like this.
Fast forward to June 2024. I play almost 2x/week and I broke 90 FINALLY!!! My issue was partially driver, but mainly I couldn't get my brand new hella expensive "custom" fitted irons to go where I wanted them to go. 50y dispersion front to back and left to right with my 9i-5i (that dispersion was for each club). My 7i is now my 185 club. I have hit it 170 and I have hit it 206. Everyone I talk to tell me its lessons I need not equipment (which I am not saying that is fully the case), but I am nervous about getting lessons to learn how to hit these clubs. I told myself I would keep the clubs for 1 year and revisit a fitting to see how things have changed. I am tired of being 175 yards out grabbing my 170 club and hitting it 190 and 25 right.
I think my fade is from lie angle being standard too. I take a deep toe divot. When I over correct and shallow swing and don't early extend the ball does fly better but still goes right and the deep toe divot is just a toey divot.
All this being said I know now what to ask for when I get fitted next time. I am going to ask for an MB/CB/PI/DI and hit them all then hit different brands from that category. I had a great putting fitting at Club Champion and now that I know what I know today I should have gotten fitted there to begin with. Great experience and prices weren't any higher than the other shop or online prices.
As a guy who fluctuates between a low 5 to a mid 7. Due to inconsistent amount of play. I went from an mp-18sc and saw a huge drop on bad strikes. Loss of distance and missed green.
To gaming the pro 225. My miss makes the green. Maybe barely on but there.
I do miss a cavity back feel and wish I went with the zx5. As the 225s have to much of the same feel across the face.
Were the two irons the same lofts? I didnt catch that in the vid. I'm a 15 handicapper, and play JPX-EZ Forged irons, I love them but when i tried out a blade, i could not get those shots in. and even when i tried the newer style of the hot metal/pro/forged of the 919's (back when i first tried) Those clubs felt, and shot the same as the JPX-EZ forged haha.
Certainly an interesting concept that I've seen playout in my own bag throughout the years. Always tend to shoot better with less forgiving clubs vs big chunky monkeys. One test I would love for a channel to do though is compare blade vs cavity back from a given yardage. Say you have a green 180 yards out, pick the club you need and how more accurate are you instead of the loft for loft or 6 iron vs 6 iron.
Finally. If I need more distance, I am not embarrassed to go up a club (or 2). I need improvement in heel/toe strikes. I'm 70 with a bad back. I'm not hitting for hours at the driving range several times a week. I am playing twice a week with an hour at the driving range. Forgiveness in dispersion is what I need.
Live in the gta and curious to know how to work in getting fitted… currently an 18-19 hand. And losing some distance lately. Currently play ping G15 irons 5-9 iron …
Can you build a blade set with the shaft lengths adjusted to match a GI set? So instead of 6i to 6i, its 6i GI vs 4i Blade with 6i length shaft. I think that would be the true test for comparison.
For me the wider the sole the fatter I hit it eliminating any distance gain from GI irons. Just hit Blueprint S and liked them. But being cautious I only got the 9 iron to try so far hitting off grass liking it even better than off the mat
Other than the distance cost of a mis hit with a blade, I agree my eye will never like the big giant iron they make me wonder if I can swing it or aim it.
So could you adjust what iron you compare from each set by comparing , ball speed, dynamic loft ,dispersion , with a Blade, Hollow , Cavity back? would that tell you more about the engineering?
This is one of the more interesting videos posted recently to provide insight into the modern iron trajectory. I wonder, would you get the same results from the new generation of High Launch game improvement irons? Are your findings now being recognised in iron evolution? Well done guys.
I’m in my first year at 51 years old playing a set of PXG gen 2 0311 P’s my uncle gave me. I really want to get into another set of irons. However, at a 23 handicap currently averaging around 96-100 score, I feel it’d be best for me to get a consistent swing and consistent contact before getting into forgiving or blade irons. But if I were to get irons I sure wish I could do it with these dudes. Cause I’d much rather hit it consistently with low dispersion than hit long distance any day.
As a fitter, all I get from the high handicap Is how far did I hit that last one? You are 100% right that players should get something that they can hit the same but they never do. They're too caught up in distance. This is the nature of golfers and their the marketing by the manufacturers this video and the results are more for somebody that hits it like the ians of the world But really which out there is distance distance distance unfortunately
For me going to t-350 has been game changer. I went to more forgiving and the dispersion is so much better. The mishits are so much less penalizing. I would like to see this test with a mid handicapper. Even 10 handicap. IMO
I’ve been saying this!! I’m not saying that GI clubs aren’t more forgiving but it’s not like most would have you believe. I play around an 8-10 index and I’ve played back to back rounds with cavities and blades and there’s no real difference in scoring. Play with what you like. I’ve seen video after video of Ian striping blades and telling us he’s not good enough to play. It’s a head shaker
I'm a 20 handicap ( 90-95) and this is perfect for me to see this. I tried 4 irons today from same company. Most forgiving I was going further with more roll out and the blades I was having higher spin and maybe 5 yards of roll out. I feel I hit the players irons better which is true but makes no sense.