Communism and Orthodoxy
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- Опубликовано: 4 июл 2024
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*Note from Fr. Paul: I mixed up Fr. Daniil's (Sando Tudor) Life with someone else's. He did not die in the prisons, but went to begin a monastic community when he was released.
Actually, fr. Paul was initially right about fr. Daniil Tudor: he died in prison from the beatings. We still weren't able to find his remains.
Regarding fr. Calciu's remains the story is a little more complicated. Some monks from the monastery where he was buried, open his grave without permission. Fr. Calciu's son said that he needed to be buried immediately. There was a period where at the Petru Vodă monastery, there were all these "mistical" monks who wouldn't practice obedience and believed in all these conspiracy theories. I read an article that even fr. Calciu said that if they find his body intact, to pray the prayers against curses because it is from the devil. Now people can claim that he said that out of humility but finding "miracles" by monks who are not obedient I find to be from the devil.
I'm a non-Eastern Orthodox Christian but I respect their capacity for suffering under persecution. The very fact that these churches somehow survived in places like Romania, Bulgaria and Russia is a miracle.
The horrors of the Judeo-Bolshevik oppression should not be forgotten. Communism is wretched.
Don’t forget the oppression that evil individuals facilitated, however don’t throw out an ideology that has uplifted millions all across the world out of poverty and empowered even more people to righteously fight back against evil forces that exploit others. Many communist Orthodox Christians exist and they are not wretched.
Just bolshevik. The jews were also persecuted under Stalin and communism.
“Judeo-Bolshevik” didn’t know we were still using Nazi propaganda terms for Bolshevism to demonize Judaism like hitler did
Judeo bolshevikism?
Judeo- Bolshevik is the correct term I like it
"If the only way for you to find peace is for the world around you to live the way that you want you might as well give up now. Your way is futile; it'll never happen." Fantastic quote, one of the many said by Father Paul in just 15 minutes
This is strength right here.
But North Korea is a thing
Thank you Father Paul for shedding light over the horrors of Communism, it is good for people to know, God bless! 🙏Our Romanian Saints helped us then to know what is important and what and how to fight for, and help us now, when there is such a cacophony of voices and vices, hidden under all sort of ideologies
Although Orthodoxy was not as persecuted in Yugoslavia as in Romania or the Soviet Union, the Yugoslavian government still unofficially repressed and blackmailed bishops, priests and monks of the Serbian Orthodox Church.
One common blackmailing tactic would be to invite a priest to bless a house and put cameras and microphones in the house. Then, the priest would open the door only to see a naked woman. The priest's interaction with the woman, whether sinful or not, would be recorded, and the video tapes would be used to blackmail the priest into doing dirty work for the Yugoslav government, under threat of the release of those tapes.
As hard as it is to say, may the Lord save and have mercy upon the Communists who persecuted the faithful and may God curse the efforts and plans of all Communist parties and governments in the world. Amen.
We were definitely more persecuted than in Romania. While Tito and his red thugs actively set about trying to dismember the Serbian Orthodox Church (especially through the so called Macedonian schism) Ceausescu enshrined Romanian Orthodoxy as the state religion of Romania, priests became state employees as in Greece etc. Because of this, Romania arguably glided over the threat of civil war with ease following the swift collapse of Ceausescu's rule there, while our communists were majority Serbian haters who clearly laid the foundation for an intra-ethnic war against us, decades in advance.
@@markeedeep I suppose it is matter of opinion, no? I hate how many Serbs still have nostalgia for Tito. He made our people, "народ небески", betray our holy faith for communism and atheism. How can one call himself a Serb if he is not Orthodox?! He is a traitor to his God and to his Serbian identity if he says he is an atheist! Saint Justin Popović made a excellent sermon in 1966 about this mass betrayal of the Orthodox faith by the Serbs.
@markeedeep It is a shame that the Serbs, the people of heaven, submitted to communism and atheism during those times. It is also a shame that today many Serbs revere Tito as if he is a national hero, when he caused the Serbs to betray their holy Orthodox faith for godlessness.
Saint Justin Popović made a brilliant sermon in 1966 about the mass apostasy of the Serbs. It's on RUclips.
Even now, godless democracy and capitalism allow for public degeneracy and blasphemy to go on with no consequences. May God have mercy on us Serbs.
How do you feel about the capitalist parties brother. There are many communist parties that exist today that embrace our Christian brethren around the world and I pray for their success and for God to guide them as they uplift millions more out of poverty.
@@MarxistNurse Equal but opposite evil. Communists have only persecuted our Church. Capitalists have made sure to make it stay irrelevant to modern society.
The phenomenon of returning to communism is due to the problems related to the loss of security that Romanians from approximately the same socio-professional categories had under communism, but who had the guarantee of a job guaranteed by the state and could afford to buy a house, which today it becomes more and more difficult. But if all these people lived in communism today, I guarantee that most of them would want democracy.
And during this period, many Saints were formed, because in such situations, not only do people become more united, but also pain and suffering brings people closer to God. The more freedom we have, the harder it is to remain an authentic Christian.
Depends what you mean by freedom. This varies wildly among the major civilisations of the world today.
@@markeedeep Freedom means having power and control over your life, not dictated by a small group of people or a single person. It's the power of being able to have an opinion and speak up without fear. To be able to practice your faith without being imprisoned and tortured. Which is good thing if people have moral and Christian values.
If you are an American, I understand that the word freedom would have a different meaning, but by my definition your country has known nothing but freedom and look where it ended up.
@@annca I'm in general agreement with you, I'm Serbian 🙂 My point is freedom as you described it, may not even be that which is popularly perceived. Just because one becomes lax and slothful, does not automatically mean it is because of having an abundance of personal freedom. Having freedom is really least about the ability to satiate one's instinctual bodily (or psychological) desires and needs.
The problem is even worse because there were caveats nostalgic people conveniently forget: you had a guaranteed job AS LONG AS you obeyed the party and didn't stray too much. There was the concept of "social parasitism" (i.e. being long term unemployed), it was a crime to be unemployed for too long, so people they targeted for repression wouldn't be given jobs or would be fired from their jobs and then punished for not having a job... the same job that only the government could provide. And this created a cycle: you don't get a job - why don't you have a job - go to prison - get out of prison - you don't get a job - why don't you have a job... etc. Then regarding homes, same story, you'd get a home BUT only 31% or something like that if I recall the statistic correctly OWNED their homes. Most lived on rent, they rented their homes from the state, they didn't own their homes. And again, you could lose that home if you displeased the party or the party could just move you as it saw fit (technically exiling you internally). The whole logic was: if you're a good boy, here's some scraps from the party that the party expects you to be grateful for.
@@octavianpopescu4776 Exactly!!!The people never ever truly learned what means communism in reality.
Same in Bulgaria, you were technically allowed to be Christian but anyone who was was not looked at with a good eye. If you were too pious, they would stop you from practicing or arrest you.
Father Arsenie Boca was the most influential but least talked, or rather negatively talked today because of his paintings !
Great books to read on this topic are: Elder Justin Parvu, Russias Catacomb Saints, Saints of the Prisons.
The true stories I read about were valiant examples of True Orthodoxy of the heart. Not for the faint hearted. The communists could not rip out their hearts or their nous!
Thank you.
Very profound video, thank you
Wow thank you
nice video
"And therefore anti-nationalist" - this has always been the issue. Communists come to power only when the nationalists are on board with it, and as soon as that support dries up, the system just comes crashing down immediately, without even any civil war.
Thankful for all who encourage us to exalt Christ rather than socialism or other failing world exalting models. Love the discovery of Grace filled aromas in bones of those who were faithful and grew in peace with Jesus Prayer in midst of political tortures. May we all have Burning Bush friends.☦️🕊🛐
ps I wonder if the book you mentioned is Unhumans: The Secret History of Communist Revolutions (And How to Crush Them) by
Jack Posobiec, et al? Pray for Jack. rc married to Orthodox Christian
Valeriu Gafencu another one
One thing I don't get is how these prison ordeals match up to Ceausescu's eventual promotion of Romanian Orthodoxy as the chosen state religion, even to the point of exclusion of all non-Orthodox denominations inside Romania. Apparently, uniates of Romania practically got wiped out under Ceausescu. By sheer contrast, the Serbian Orthodox Church was always persecuted under Tito in Yugoslavia. It was only several years after his death the church finally re-emerged in to strength and influence in public life, but then the whole country began the process of disintegration, as per (deliberate) Yugoslav communist party policy of state administrative decentralisation. In Romania, the state was wholly unitary, which certainly benefited the Romanian Orthodox Church in the long run and especially after the fall of communism there.
That's because Yugoslavia was a mix of ethnicities and religions. You didn't have a majority, you had Serbs, Croatians, Bosniaks, Albanians, Macedonians, Slovenes. You had Sunni Muslims, Catholics and Orthodox. You had a sort of "Unity in diversity" kind of ideology. Marginalizing any of these nations or faiths could lead to instability.
In Romania, in the 70s, Ceaușescu started adding influences of Nationalism to the Communist ideology of Romania. Orthodox Romanians were over 80% of the population. Communist Romania was heading towards an Ethno State, a Romanian country for Romanians. Because Orthodoxy was associated with the Romanian ethnicity, other minorities and minority faiths were marginalized and at a somewhat level persecuted.
@@segarcea4106 incorporating Romanian nationalism into party ideology is pretty much what I'm referring to when assessing the relative success of Romanian Orthodoxy, after communism. It's a big question mark whether Romania today would be such a homogeneous nation-state without the clear nationalising policies of Ceausescu. Before his ascendancy to power, Romania had the biggest Hungarian minority outside of Hungary, but in time it somewhat disappeared, as did the Galician/Ruthenians and others. I'm not saying I don't believe these horrible persecution accounts of Romanian saints in prison, but I do for one think there is a pre-Ceausescu context to them plus the fact the victims were largely legionnaires who espoused a wholly opposite world view to the communists, at a time when those ideological differences mattered the most. Paradoxically, Ceausescu eventually came to assume the national line of the legionnaires himself. Most importantly, believers were going to church as normal and mostly unharmed.
What you described in Yugoslavia is actually proof of my point of state administrative decentralisation, as the key to securing the party dictatorship over the entire country. Even at the outset of the last civil war, for example, there were no such people as "Bosniaks", they all called themselves *Muslims* and so purely on account of their religious identity (unheard of in probably the whole world at the time) they were accorded a "socialist republic" of their own in Bosnia, under Yugoslav socialism (when in truth, they are literally all Serbians whose ancestors for various reasons converted to the religion of the Turks, under Ottoman domination). So called Macedonians are a completely invented people under communism, Slovenes arguably wouldn't even exist today without their liberation from Austria-Hungary by Serbia, in 1918, and at least half of what are today's so called Croats are in fact Serbians converted to Roman Catholicism, from the period of Austrian domination right the way through the communist era (which is wholly ironic since the communists were avowed atheists, yet when it came to trying to dismember and weaken the Serbian Orthodox Church, anti-Orthodox policies in the form of promoting Croat Roman Catholicism, certainly applied!)
The explanation is fairily simple: communists realized that they could simply take over the Orthodox Church and place their people as bishops, etc. They didn't have to destroy it, just turn it into a useful tool for the regime and it was useful. What people confessed to priests would be turned into reports for the Securitate. Uniates and Catholics and others fared worse because of their loyalty to an outside power: the Pope, having appointments made by Rome, by an enemy government, it was harder to infiltrate these groups, so destruction was the way to go. To this day, old communists are still around hiding, pretending to be bishops. It's why I don't attend church and why I watch channels such as this one. I want Orthodoxy without the communist taint, I want the faith pure. I'd rather listen to an American Orthodox priest than an older Romanian one (younger ones are ok in my experience), because the American one wasn't a Securitate officer putting on a robe. It's someone who legit believes in God. And it's why I'd rather listen to Greeks and to the Ecumenical Patriarch than my own priests or worse Russians who are even more communistic. I don't want the faith to be a political tool. Politics taints faith.
@@octavianpopescu4776you know, it's always been the historical norm for the Church to be a pillar of whichever nation that has been baptized in to her. It's rather myopic to see the Church simply as an instrument of state authority, which simply isn't true. But as a Romanian, you have every reason to love your nation, with all its imperfections. That's how your holy ancestors raised it up to begin with. The nation loves the Church and the Church loves the nation in return.
@@markeedeep During the communist period, the authorities tried to make it an instrument of state power. Unlike previous governments, communists hated religion and the Church and so they didn't respect its traditions and autonomy. They would have wanted to completely destroy it, but they simply couldn't and so they sought to pervert it... And you're right about the traditional state-Church relationship, but this was something entirely different.
Can you talk about the corruption in the churches with the governments?
Greetings from Romania on the Feast of All Romanian Saints! Glory to God! Thank you for your sensitive reflection, but I feel the need to add to your reflection with some further points not addressed in this clip.
Firstly, it is not really part of the Orthodox phronema to name enemies, we know who our enemy is and we know that Christ through His death and resurrection has ultimately sealed his defeat. It is a very Western thing to name Communism as an enemy of the faith, but an 'ism' can not be our enemy, it is a means of our training. All we are asked to do is love, and we can't love any 'isms' we must love God's creation and our fellow bearers of His image. People become saints to the extent to which they love all their fellow humans. Pitești was a horror unparalleled in human history because it blurred the lines between prisoners and guards and basically the prisoners were forced to beat and humiliate each other. Only two of the inmates refused to take part in this and they remained laymen and remained in Romania all their lives. They received much comfort from the Mother of God but their beatings continued up to the very end. Fr Calciu remained to his death deeply shamed by his participation in the Pitești experiment and did not want ever to be seen as a saint. Of course he was treated like a hero in the States, but he never wanted this, he implored but you did not want to listen. Let his memory be Eternal but let us never forget his humility and the memory of those 2 men who went into obscurity and never once participated in the horrors.
Secondly, it is so very wearying the way Americans blame communism for everything. We were removed cold-turkey from a system which gave many of the most vulnerable in society support and care, which provided dignified incomes and meaningful work to all, which banned pornography and abortions, and which supported families. We were removed from this into a capitalist free-for all, where our industry was asset stripped to provide wealth for the West, where we were swamped with American pornography, and American evangelical churches, and we quickly became a major hub for the sexual exploitation of women and children. The birth-rate is plumetting, meaningful work is hard to find and people are leaving the country to find good work, alcoholism is rife (we drink more than our Slav neighbours!). Capitalism and its 'freedom' needs to take a good look at the evils it inflicts on the world.
Thirdly, the religious persecution needs to be seen through the lens of the persecutors, and if you do this you see that it was not religion per-se which was being persecuted. Persecution was caused by association with possible membership and sympathies towards organisations working against the regime (in the case of the Orthodox this would mainly be suspected membership of the Legion). To this end, in Romania the persecution of Catholics and especially Greek Catholics was off the scale as Rome was seen as the seat of the soft power of the West. The Orthodox bishops under Communism implored the Greek Catholics to convert to Orthodoxy to save them from the worst of the persecutions, the vast majority refused. Many Catholics over the age of 60 were baptised into Orthodoxy because a Catholic one was near impossible to obtain under Communism.
Finally, the post-war regime was a proving ground for the faith and produced many saints because they kept the faith. Now, visit a parish in the villages and you will hear priests saying the people don't need to keep the fasts anymore because they are poor. How will we produce another Elder Cleopa? Look at the amount of training and ecumenical work that happens with Protestants and Catholics. Look at wealth of many of the priests and their top of the range cars. Look how easy it is to find corruption scandals involving clergy. Our clergy are still infiltrated, this time by US 3 letter agency operatives who are out to cause havoc in Moldova for US interests, and out to try to soften up Romanian Orthodoxy to the rainbow agenda and drive a wedge between us and our Orthodox brothers in Russia.
Glory to God for all things! We live in the most difficult of times, may God help us be saints!
@@gillianc6514 you pretty much confirmed my own analysis, as an outsider. Look at my comments here from before you, and you'll find this exact same line of thinking. As a Serbian with a keenness for history, I recall being more and more amazed with each new thing I would learn about Nicolae Ceausescu, especially the extent to which he literally *supported* Romanian Orthodoxy. This is in total contrast to Serbia, where the party never once stopped to persecute the Serbian Church. I suppose in that sense, in our context, communism was the true menace it always was, but that does not automatically mean it was the exact same thing everywhere else, Romania being one notable example.
@@markeedeep Thanks for reading and commenting. I have read your post and agree with you. I visit Serbia often and it is glaringly obvious as you look around and talk to the people that Orthodoxy suffered much more under Tito than under Ceaușescu. And Tito was something of a darling to the Liberal West..... which opens up a whole new train of thought......
It's impossible to talk about this and not being up the legit arguments the True and Genuine Orthodox are making.
Are you talking about the "True" Orthodox movement that is cropping up? Because that's not Orthodoxy, that's people twisting Orthodoxy and making it into a cult.
@@laurahildebrand7023 no. I'm talking about a sect of Orthodox Christians that held to the old calendar during a massive geo political persecution. It all happened between the 1920s and 1970s. People died and where put in jail for refusing to go on the new calendar. A calendar that was pushed by a "council" of one EXTREMELY corrupt patriarch and a hand full of other people, if you can call 9 people a council. MANY of our modern Saints refused the new calendar, they saw it as being forced to "join with Rome".
@@laurahildebrand7023 please read about the old/new calendar issue that came up in the 1920s.
You say the Legionaries became political, that is incorrect. They were always anti Jewish, anti communist and nationalistic, with sympathies to the Third Reich and Mussolini
You say they were renounced by the Holy elders, priests and monks when they became violent and political. Which ones? Valeriu Gafencu, Elder Arsenie Papacioc and Father George Calciu were part of the Legionary Rebellion, and never denounced the Legion. What are you talking about Father? I don't want to be rude but it seems like you're dodging the more straightforward conclusions to draw from the spiritual history of 20th Century Romania.
May the Holy Prison Saints pray for us!
Just for some Context. The Legionaries going violent was an understatement. They committed many Violent Pogroms.
So yes they had good reason to Denounce it.
@@arnowisp6244 he didn't mention which Holy people renounced the Legion. I'm not aware of any, and commented asking him which ones he's talking about
This video is less helpful than people think it is.
How so?
You should elaborate 👍
How?
people are entitled to their own opinion and you should mind your own business
It is part of human history. Helpful or not helpful, it is fact.
Ленин жил, Ленин жив, Ленин будет жить! Пролетарии всех стран соединяйтесь!:)
God bless you and be with you.
Lenin is dead, always was, always will, even in the days to come...
@@kjpetrucci Да-да! Успокаивай себя:)
lenin is dead and always has been. and now is having one to one with his best friend, the devil. and so will you, apparently
IC XC NIKA