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CRASHX500 Asks: Have Awakening & Fates Ruined Fire Emblem?
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- Опубликовано: 1 авг 2016
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Welcome to this brand new segment ‘CRASHX500 asks’, where I discuss topics relating to the subject or videos games and or anime. For this first episode I ask the question of whether or not Fire Emblem: Awakening and Fire Emblem: Fates have ruined the series?
All content of this video is copyright of their respectful owners & no copyright infringement is intended.
##FireEmblem #Nintendo #IntelligentSystems #jrpg #tactical #anime #videogames #japan #ranking #best #review #character #videoessay #essay #fireemblemawakening #nintendo3ds #discussion #rant #gameplay #cutscene #walkthrough #breakdown #analysis #ruined #dead #fireemblemfates #fireemblempathofradiance #fireemblemradiantdawn #fireemblembindingblade #retro #old #new
The writing is pretty bad, but it's bearable. The gameplay is absolutely awesome, though. Especially in Fates.
i do agree that the story of awakening is better than birthright and conquest but revelation is good i always play casual and hard mode
Haha, did you see Ghast Nation's video about conquest? It's gold, friend.
+FingerlessJames Gas station*
+Chikin **Ghast Station. XD
+FingerlessJames Hack Delaying FE Meme Lord*
Someone with common sense. It great to see someone who doesn't whine about how localization is somehow ruining fire emblem and instead crtigeung and using logic to present an opinion.
Also people seem to leave out that fates brought back status effects and debuffs.
+Bark Tree What status effects?
HeroG9000 Silence and freeze. (sure poision ins't back but I don't miss it.)
I agree completely. Sure, some things get changed, but it's hardly "butchered" like people would have you think. Most of the supports and dialogue are translated verbatim, or at least extremely close. I see it as a similar case the to attack of the "Genwunners", people who swear that Red, Blue, and Yellow are the only Pokemon games that exist and the rest are shite for some reason or the other. They complain about lazy Pokemon designs, too many Pokemon, the games getting too easy, shockingly similar complaints that are raised against Fire Emblem Awakening and Fates. Of course, they fail to recognize that many of the first gen Pokemon designs were equally lazy, and that the game has not gotten "easier" but has replaced mindless grinding and broken, glitchy gameplay with more strategic depth and monster diversity. For FE, I can absolutely see some of the complaints - there is some cringeworthy fanservice, Awakening was breakable in many aspects, and the stories from the recent two games are average at best (not that FE has ever had truly stellar story telling). However, series evolve over time to adapt to new audiences, it's simply how media works.
ShiningDialga Yeah like the Fire Emblem being to too mainstream video
How to fix Fire Emblem:
1-Tone that waifu/fanservice shit down
2-Make a compelling story/villains.
3-Have your Avatar as support character instead of the main character or give them different personalities options.
And keep Phoenix mode. Its optional it shouldn't change your overall experience of the game
Exactly. If Fates did all this, well it would still have a lot of other problems like supports and some shitty maps, but it would be a lot better.
4-Bring back weapon durability, or at least, fix the currently broken unbreakable weapon system.
5-DO NOT EVER do split games like Fates again.
6-Don't let avatar have support conversations with all units unless the quantity won't affect the quality.
7-Make staffs cheaper than weapons.
Yeah, have the villains have something redeeming about them in a sense that they are bad, but show they weren't always just that. Humanize them, show *why* they're bad and not have them bad just so we can have a villain that could easily be replaced nad hardly change anything!
They had that kinda going with Garon, but...*sigh*...
YAS SO RIGHT.
ruined? pffft, no. does it need to refocus on some things? oh most definitely. But the people saying fire emblem is ruined I'd say are being overdramatic.
Yeah
thank you ! that's what I don't get either when they say it's "ruined"
when you think fates and awakening ruined fire emblem, remember this: at least the core gameplay is still relatively the same......fuck paper mario color splash, recent mario parties and federation force.....
"If it ain't broke, don't fix it"
It's ok to experiment, but you still need to listen to the fans and go back to the basics when things aren't working(at least SEGA kinda got that with Sonic Mania)!
It isn't being "not creative", it's being smart and using what worked before and improving it!
To be fair, Federation Force is a spin-off game, lol. Though they probably shouldn't have put "Metroid *Prime*" in front of it.
But Paper Mario... yeck... They butchered that game, for sure. (Sticker Star got 75/100 on metacritic, but I think that's too generous lol. The gameplay is the most boring thing ever. RIP the rpg elements)
Steelglitcher98 fed force is a spin off game, but when you havent had a metroid game in 6 years iirc, you shouldn't release a spin off and expect people to enjoy it....i dont even care if it isnt prime....just an actual metroid game that feels and plays like an actual metroid game.......
regirockrocks123 AKA BF | iamresh Yeah. Prime 1-3 were amazing, I guess thinking like that it's more understandable. :/
Maybe they'll make a Prime 4 or any other Metroid game on the NX? Hopefully.
Steelglitcher98 honestly, im hoping for another 2d metroid game to happen even if it is just a 3ds remake of super metroid.
Your points are good. Awakening and Fates have their flaws but they are important as games. They saved the series and people should be happy. I would personally like the Avatar to stay in the game just so there is a customization option but if it leaves I will be alright. Also I like casual mode because I am suck a reckless player. All my favorite characters would die.... Anyway, I will probably keep playing the games as long as they are fun.
Emerald Mimic Yours as well, but just because the games saved the series doesn't mean that people have to like them as games.
Finn True, very true. Just respect others opinions.
Emerald Mimic I don't think I haven't.
Why Yillise is the stupidest kingdom ever:
Their entire fighting force...
Consists of units...
Who are weak to arrows, wind magic, and beast killers.
Soldiers are shown fighting for Ylisse at the end of Chapter 13 in the cutscene set in the future. Pegasus knights are not the entire army.
But in return, they have the most broken skill in all of FE. Even better than FE4 Prayer and FE10 Renewal.
Otter Hero That's not necessarily the Ylissean army. Lucina says that the remnants of humanity all joined forces, so they could be of any halidom. Even if they had others, the most often deployed ones are Pegasus Knights, and we see how well that worked out at the end of Chapter 9.
+Otter Hero I think he means the Shepards, not the entire Ylissean Army, even so it still doesn't apply because without reclassing you have 3 Pegasus Knights, 9 units (including default Troubadour Maribelle) weak to Beast Killers....
And 5 units weak to wind magic, if my memory serves correctly, that's a lot less than half of your Army, since the Pegasus Knights appeal to all 3 of those points, so even then it's not that many in total
Actually, I think Kagero’s design actually fits her as a character, as a kunoich (female shinobi (ninja to everyone else)), as a kunoich she has to, at times seduce targets and kill them when they aren’t expecting it, so when you think about it, Kagero’s fanservice has purpose.
Keeping in mind Charlotte does pretty much the same thing, as well as to get money from men (which there are women who do this) to give to her family, since being a border guard doesn't pay much. In addition to that, generic fighters in fates (which are male) wear the same slutty outfit, so it fits (especially statwise, since they hit hard and quickly, but rely entirely on health to tank hits).
I agree with what you said about the avatars.
Robin was good because they had more of a personality to them, strangely enough since they are avatars. And the game focuses on Robin's relationship with the other main character Chrom, which could either be a really genuine bromance or a truly romantic relationship (I ship FemRobin and Chrom so hard you wouldn't believe).
I did have high hopes for Corrin, when I watched the Nintendo Direct they were announced in I was genuinely excited to have an avatar main character. Corrin certainly didn't live up to my expectations, but it was an interesting idea.
Thanks for another well thought out video :)
No problem glad you liked it, and I can believe how hard you ship FemRobin & Chrom, you probably know how hard I ship MaleRobin and Sumia!
CRASHX500
Ah yes, the allure of pie ;P
Sumia gets a lot of flack from FemRobin x Chrom fangirls but I think she's a good unit. My best friend is in love with her and marries her in every playthrough.
But when I do my male avatar playthrough, no one can beat my wife Tharja XD
To be honest I can't stand the support between chrom and sumia (plus the fact that it's cannon), but every other one sumia's supports is great, which makes the fact that chrom and her are officially married all the more annoying. The hilarious is that I marry Sumia in every male robin play-through, but the only time I didn't was when I married Tharja, what are the odds! XD
CRASHX500
Yeah, not many people like the Chrom x Sumia support. It just seems like Chrom has no other interest in Sumia other then she can make the world's greatest pies.
I think any of the other supports he has with any of his other romantic prospects are better than Sumia's.
It wouldn't be as bad if Intelligent Systems didn't make it canon. Especially when I feel he develops more of a connection with FemRobin and Olivia.
Tharja is the best for male me! :D
"Oh look. She's asleep. Asleep....... and helpless." 8)
Read the original Japanese version of it. They are leagues above their piefest- I mean S-support. For some reason, the localization team worshiped pies. They're everywhere in the localization, especially where they weren't before (other, more subtle examples are Robin/Sully S and one of M!Morgan/Nah's, I forget which one.
Ruined? I would say that's taking it too far, but they have taken the series down a path I'm not liking overall. Conquest was fine, but birthright and revelation are among my least favorite in the series. Awakening is somewhere in the middle. Also, just to clarify, I've played every game except gaiden and thracia 776. The best all around in the series for me in terms of characters, chapters, difficulty, music, etc is path of radiance with blazing sword right behind it
Yeah I liked path of radience and blazing sword a lot as well
I liked the gameplay, just the writing and child mechanic are absolute shit for fates. Awakening was bad, but not horrible. Fates is a bad omen for fire emblem's future. If Intelligent Systems listens to their fans (not likely) they will fix the shittiest stuff, like pheonix mode and the child system. If they do not listen, they might even get rid of classic mode....
Also my favorite game is FE 6, or Binding Blade.
Path of Radiance is easy as fuck tho and the story doesn't seem to know where it wants to go half the time.
+Epicguys 101 I think the looming "threat" of IS taking out classic mode is very overblown. Yes, they are trying to broaden the fan base (hence the inclusion of "Baby's First Fire Emblem" mode), but it is because of that reason that they won't remove classic mode. IS knows that a significant portion of their fan base loves the permadeath aspect of the series. Removing it would obviously be counterintuitive to their goals, since they already cornered the hardcore and casual fire emblem market as is. As for Phoenix mode... I personally don't like it and can say for a fact that I will never touch it. But so long as it remains optional, I don't see why it needs to be removed. How other people enjoy their games is none of my concern.
What I find more troublesome is the fact that they shoehorned in the children mechanic from Awakening. The story reason for its existence was clearly bs, which makes it clear that they only included it because it was popular in the previous installment. As much as I love the child characters, they need to go, at least for now. Not only because they clearly aren't part of any artistic vision on the creators part, but also because their inclusion turns pairing units into a damn breeding mini-game. Think Elise and Benny are cute together? Sorry, but you can't pass those shitty HP and defense growths to their kid. Go with Beruka. Think that the universe is practically BEGGING to put Arthur and Felicia together? Tough. Felicia tanks Percy's bulk and physical offense. Pair him with Effie and shut up...
phoenix modes doesn't even make sense only a child would use it and they can't even play the games
Awakening ruined Fire Emblem because they took out feet and I'm surprised any of the characters can walk in that game (good thing Fates fixed that lol)
I don't even know what I'm talking about
I like you, mate
But their feet are stubby, so they're just simply growing back.
DankMudkip
instead of "fire emblem awakening" they should've called it "fire emblem pegleg" cause they look like they got peglegs instead of feet
Camilla and Effie have much worse design a then Charlotte imo. As a berserker, you don't need armor and comparing her to characters like largo and Hawkeye they don't wear shirts either (yeah Charlotte doesn't wear pants but w/e). Camilla must be Fucking cold as hell riding on top of a Wyvern and her thighs must be torn the fuck up because Wyvern scales. With Effie having boob armor was just so bad. If you're gonna have armor why have a part of it more easily pierced. Also when comparing her armor to Wendy Amelia Meg etc they don't have their breasts outlined. Don't get me wrong though Camilla is my favorite Wyvern unit and Effie is my favorite General. That's just me though
Effie's design was Ok by my books, largely because it's not clear fanservice, like Charloette or Camilla.
And I mean, those characters you mentioned have a flatter chest than Lucina.
General Effie's butt is uncovered as well, forget the boob armour get some butt armour, that's a fairly weak point since you can't see any attacks coming from your back so yeah XD
+Ryan Keenan Orochi is CLEAR fan service
+Ryan Keenan Meg doesn't, and in her battle model her boobs aren't DIRECTLY outlined (at least as a knight I never promoted her)
+Deez Nutz lmao yeah, but to be fair Effie is really short so I can't imagine any opponent would fucking crawl across the battlefield just to attack Effie's ass.
If you think that Fire Emblem has changed, check out Paper Mario and Zelda. They're hardly the same genres anymore.
Paper Mario's new direction is so shit I don't even consider them Paper Mario games anymore, but Breath of the Wild looks really promising to me.
I feel like Nintendo in general has changed for the worst. They are just doing anything at this point to make money! I went to a game stop when then amiibos first came out and I was talking to one of the workers there and we talked about how stupid they are and why Nintendo is doing anything for money now. I don't like Nintendo as much as I did back in the day.
brandon murray
While I don't particularly like a lot of what Nintendo has done recently, I can kind of see why they would look for any way to make money. Nintendo is just a game maker. Microsoft and Sony have a lot of other stuff to fall back on if their game department fails, but Nintendo does not. Console sales, with the exception of the Wii, have decreased with each successive generation, with the Wii U being their worst selling console. Sure their handhelds are doing good, but that's not enough to sustain them. Why have they abandoned the traditional Paper Mario style? Most likely because Sticker Star sold more than Super Paper Mario, so they went with the option of following a formula that made them more money. Why is the only recent Metroid game some generic looking co-op shooter? Probably because of the poor reception of Metroid Other M, they don't feel confident in the Metroid license. Why all the weird stuff with the NX? Because they probably realized that they could never compete in terms of power that the Xbox One and PS4 are capable of, and are going with something unique to make it look appealing, and the use of cartridges because much more information can be stored on a cartridge than a disc, and from what websites have reported other developers are quite pleased with the NX.
While Nintendo as of late has made me remove them as my favorite video game company (and coming from someone who once unironically defended Other M as a good game, that is quite the accomplishment), I can also understand that they are a business that needs to make money in order to live.
However, I don't see how alienating part of your fanbase is going to help you earn more profit. By doing things like "Screw Paper Mario, Mario & Luigi is our only RPG, even though that is suffering bland Mario Formula syndrome" to "You guys have been waiting years for a new Metroid Prime game? Well have this game that basically abandons everything that made Metroid Prime great, and we won't tell you whether or not the fate of the series rest on this game (announcing something like there is a Metroid game in development would have been a godsend) because 'Fuck You'" to some of their bullshit localization in regards to games like FE Fates and Tokyo Mirage Sessions #FE, how could they possibly want more money when they seem to keep digging their own grave? The only upcoming Nintendo first party games that I have a even remote interest in besides Zelda are Pokémon Sun and Moon, and whenever the next Fire Emblem game comes out (one with I hope an actually good plot and an actually good villain). I've had more fun with third party games like Shovel Knight, Bayonetta, The Wonderful 101, Ace Attorney, etc., than with most of their first party IPs. They need to get their shit together, otherwise they will become the next SEGA.
XIII Hearts Nintendo has very little to worry about in terms of money. Sales of amiibo alone have done quite a bit for the company. Within just nine months of release, 40 million amiibo have been sold.
That being said, amiibo are not consoles or games, which have been Nintendo's focus for a few decades now. Sales figures have decreased with almost every console they released recently, in some territories. You see, what many fail to realize is that Sales are different in certain regions. The Wii U, in North America, seems to be another nail in Nintendo's coffin with its sales there. Howecer, the Wii U is selling (relatively) okay in Japan. The XBoxONE , while very successful in North America, has almost nonexistent sales figures in Europe or Japan. That being said, however, the Wii U is still not exactly a commercial success. However, Nintendo is not doomed as a company if their consoles don't do well. They've had a few failures, far worse than Wii U (Virtual Boy, N64DD, et cetera), and they've still managed to be financially stable. These failures occurred BEFORE the Wii and DS, two of their best selling consoles. If those couldn’t even kill the company, surely Nintendo is in no danger now.
Another thing that Nintendo seems to be doing wrong as of late is their games. Well, that is, in their games' respective fan bases. If we speak of Metroid, Zelda, or Paper Mario; franchises that have had past games and have established "loyal" fan bases prior to their release (not games like Splatoon). New players may still buy a new game, no matter how poorly received by their fan bases. Take Paper Mario: Sticker Star. Its sales outdid Super Paper Mario's, and so they made Color Splash with mechanics closer to that game, as opposed to fan-favorites. Fans didn't like Sticker Star. So why did it have good sales? Simple: The franchise is still popular, and still attracts players, new and old.
Hard to argue with that one :p Doug A but I don't feel like Nintendo is in financial trouble, I just feel like they are trying to do anything they can for money. Which, obviously they kind of are buy not sticking with what past fans like. It is always good to try to make new fans but there is a right and a wrong way to do it. I feel as if Nintendo is taking the wrong route and that is why loyal fans are getting angry/agitated. It is because Nintendo is not TRYING to stick to their roots.
At least the series isn't dead -
Yea, F-Zero and Metroid.
Moment of silence for these poor dead series. *weeps at Metroid's grave*
+Lady Kikaichu I'll miss you Ridley
Hey, at least you have AM2R and Federation Force. Kinda
I know how you feel. Megaman has had 4 games cancelled to the point azure striker gunvolt and mighty number 9 got released by another company. If only the same could be done with metroid or F-Zero...
Oh yeah, azure striker gunvolt 2 just got released today!! Someone has GOT TO make a successor to those Nintendo IPs and keep making sequels like this!
Samus's Return and Prime 4 is happening
An old Fire Emblem fan that's a huge fan of both the old and new series? A video that points out the flaws but how the new ones still make a great game? WHERE WERE YOU ALL THIS TIME?! D:
In all seriousness I completely agree with your opinion, it is pretty much what I feel to towards the series. Great video 👍
Where was I all this time? Asleep on the ground until chrom found me XD, but in all series i'm glad you the enjoyed the video :)
@@BLAZINGKNIGHT50 hi check this out ruclips.net/video/7OPzys58QTw/видео.html
On the subject of Garon, I have an idea regarding what they could have done. You remember that, after receiving a near-fatal blow from Dragon Garon/Possessed Takumi in both Birthright and Conquest, Corrin is taken into a dream sequence where he is encouraged by his fallen friends. In the case of Birthright, he is cheered on by Flora, Lilith, Elise, and Xander, while it’s really only Mikoto and Ryoma in Conquest. My thought was that, maybe... they could have included the real Garon in Conquest’s version of that scene?
A good follow up would be to remake FE4. Due to skills and children (actually USEFULL in here). But the story is gonna get axed in the west...if it even happens, one day.
A avatar in Jugdral? Sure thing, but as a deuteragonist, not as a Lord. Even though I liked Conquest Corrin, who seems troubled by the choice...Hoshido Corrin is meh. Blank messiah.
That game is so boring tho and the story isn't that compelling.
+Tommy Zarate the trolling is real
aside from +Tommy Zarate I actually said this idea on a comment section a while back and I thought the same thing. Story would get butchered so hard
+Tommy Zarate LOL did you give up on Chapter 1?
+TheHDEpics I stopped at chapter 3 because the gameplay as you know is really fucking slow. Why do you think I was trolling?
There's parts I like, such as the music and character design, but it's not worth it when the game is too boring.
As someone who has only played awakening and Fates but knows the stories of most of the other Fire Emblem games so feel free to take my opinion with a grain of salt, I wouldn't say Awakening and Fates ruined Fire Emblem but I do feel that the level of Fan service in Fates was too much for my taste and the writing could definitely have been better, but gameplay wise the games are fine
That's honestly the main feeling people are having. The gameplay is great, but the story and fanservice is a bit...eeehhhh...
I'm a veteran(since FE7), so it kinda worrys me when they bring in certain or do certain things that kinda...lessen the FE experience I love so much(and no, I don't hate casual mode, it's for the newbies and I'm ok with that......just wanted to mention...although I probably had no good reason too......herp derp)! ;P
+Busterman64. I think awakening has better gameplay. Dates was just fucking confusing with the stat changes and was way to easy with the unbreakable weapons.
+Luckyshot I disagree, Awakening was far too easy to exploit with the second seal and pair up mechanics,
+Magnus the Red. Well I haven started using the second seal system until recently. And I'm going off classic mode.
Yup, and I think they realized this afterwards. The game became way too easy to min max and they realized that that style doesn't really fly with a narrative based game like FE. Now if only they would find a fix for the current issues...
I appreciate what Awakening and Fates have done for the series, and I like them both a lot, but I do have a sense that they are straying too far from the roots that made FE so much fun as a strategy game. One change I'd love is for them to get rid of children, as, in my mind, it causes there to be too many pairings that are illogical, and sometimes ruin a good support between two "Friends," plus the children can only support other children, so it loses the opportunity for stuff like Ophelia and Laslow, and Lucina and Lissa to name a few. I dislike how it's come to every male can support every female support option and vise versa, and the Opposite Sex to Same Sex support ratio is so wack. This is my biggest problem with the franchise so far, but I still love FE and the newer games to death.
What worked in Awakening won't work all the time. I don't mind children units, but at least let their inclusion make sense like FE4 and Awakening and not just because random reasons.
Marriages aren't super important until children units are in the equation.
I wish they would just go back to how it was previously and have some characters have limited/specific supports because while some characters can work having a lot of supports(Like Robin and Morgan), some don't work as well and may come off a bit annoying when they do have some good supports( like Camilla, Peri, etc.).
That's what I think anyway...
Lets be honest here the REAL reason for children is for more units. I for one LOVE more units. Do it fight and I have no problem here. FE4 did it amazingly, but fates and awakening not so much. Also most supports in fates for marriage are pointless and stupid. It does not develop the character AT ALL and the Rinkah one is so retarded, like wtf she hates you for 3 supports convos and than she loves you, why? cuause fuck it thats why. Have a kid!
I don't mind the universal supports too much- also considering how importantly it ties into the re-classing and pair-up system. And it while completely incompatible characters naturally get cheesy and bad supports- this doesn't seem to impact the quality of supports of characters whom would do well together- they are often just as expertly done, one of my favorites being Saizo and Beruka (Ignoring the international version's C support for the two.) The stats the game offers from pair-ups are very helpful and supports make this important in order to maximize benefits- but you are by no means required to marry two characters and supports won't advamce without you specifically selecting the conversation to trigger. However you do bring a good point about the imbalance of supports.
I agree ONE HUNDRED percent that if they're going to have child units, it should make sense. I thought it was handled excellently in Awakening since time travel was actually key to the story, but in Fates....yeah, it definitely felt 'tacked on.' Unfortunately, it's an issue of how high they raised a bar with a new system. The new system of Supporting everyone and child units was VERY WELL received by a significant amount of people, and only a few vets truly 'disliked it.' Many other vets liked it or felt it was 'meh,' but it played a key role in bringing in a shit load of new people and revenue >< As a result, they probably feel reluctant to....exclude this new system from new FE games where these systems, especially the child system, makes far less sense >_> I don't personally see anything wrong or out of place with the supporting of everyone, but I guess some hardcore fans do though. But to simply drop these well received systems from future games would turn off a LOOOOOOT of people unfortunately :/ And while some vets may say "Well, my opinion and the opinions of a few other vets should mean infinitely more than the new masses!" It....doesn't work that way :/ Money is what matters, and these two systems are keeping Fire Emblem alive. Heck, it's even what made Fire Emblem huge again XD
Please note that despite what I said here about how it would be nearly impossible, or even a bad move in a way to drop them, I do agree completely that tacked on child units feels extremely....poor for the story :/ I'd personally either want them to make future games where the child units actually make sense to be there, like Awakening, or if they DID remove them.....replace the feature with a brand new amazing system so that people wont just feel like a system was removed and we have a lesser game for it but...that it was replaced with something better ^_^
Aizen2468 I am more annoyed all the Hoshido kids are clones of the Awakening cast.
If you're gonna have characters that are tied into the story in this way, at least make them unique.
If was fine for the returning cast from Nohr, as it wasn't a dumbed down duplicate- but anadvancement in development on the actual awakening characters.
But Hoshido... God damnit.
I completely agree with your opinion on Robin over Corrin, I am a huge fan of Robins character, it was such a pleasant surprise when I was first realising that Robin wasn't a blank slate and because of that he fitted in more naturally into awakenings story. His character really did well when playing of other members of the shepherds since he would usually try and show them a new point of view or if not then he debates over a view point of an ally. It got to the point where now when I play awakening I usually leave Robins design exactly as he is which for a game that I would usually want to play as me is rather impressive. Corrin on the other hand is.... as you say bland, he is so stupid and never grows that you think he was dropped on his head as a baby. It doesn't help again like you said that the story focuses around him, I think that that choice is what ruined the story more than anything since because of this any potentially interesting characters don't get enough screen time as they all get shafted for Corrin. Imagine if instead of the avatar being Corrin he was in-fact Corrins childhood friend like Siles how would follow him on whatever path he choses, this way giving the writers the chance to give Corrin a more realistic struggling personality whilst allowing the avatar to see what your troops thoughts on the situation is when Corrin is not around. Well I went on longer than planned, good job if you read all that.
Oh my god, I didn't realize until this video WHY I hated Corrin so much: he is freaken Kirito! How did I not see this before?!?!?
I basically agree with every point of this video, except for one: being that I actually liked the Grima twist and it did something interesting with Robin as character. In that move they made Robin the special character with a grand destiny... which instead of most stories that do this, those things a purely bad for him and the other characters. Plus I am okay with the third arc being about Robin, as it was something new and different that really none of the previous games have done. I just would rather they not make that the trend where the Avatar is the center stage in every damn game from here on.
If they are going to do the Avatar again I would prefer it to be more like Awakening, where at most Robin shared the main character role with Chrom and Lucina. That to me was fine. But seriously, I do not want another Corrin
that is the problem.
he has ZERO flaws to the other characters, he can not be bad and no matter how dumb he is being he is never "stupid" to other characters
Ike was Strong and Heroic, but he admitted he was no tactical mind and could not deal with nobility or politics
Lyn was Swift and Kind, but she had a massive hatred to bandits and would kill them in cold blood, and her heritage made it harder to be accepted by the likes of Lundgren
CYЯEO
Exactly. Even Robin had some minor flaws, having an incredibly low sense of self worth/esteem and being rather passive (he gets talked over or pushed around in his supports fairly often).
also story wise Corrin is an incredibly weak character, strength wise.
every character is saying that he should leave it to them, is even worse in revelations where every chapter starts and ends with someone saying "dont worry corrin, you can leave this to us". there was one decision he made by himself and his trusting nature brought him into a trap- which nobody was hurt by
CYЯEO
And there are multiple characters whose entire existance revolves around Corrin. Even characters like Ryoma who should be their own person, but instead have half his supports and action in Conquest be entirely focused on Corrin.
It is this, being a "Black Hole Sue" (see TV Tropes tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BlackHoleSue) that makes him like Kirito. Every character treats him like he is special and loves him right off the bat, that the few that don't end up liking him in the long run. He can do no wrong, as every poor decision is immeditally excused by the game, which makes it clear Corrin did nothing wrong.
Desmond Hollins His decision to invade Hoshdio in Conquest rather than do the dozen less stupid plans I can think of for dealing with Garon says hi.
Seriously, that stupid, stupid, stupid plan is enough for me to forever consider Corrin and idiot.
Or perhaps lets look the the fact he nearly triggers the curse in Revelation like half a dozen times, and only is saved from being killed by it like a dumbass by Azura stopping him. He literally does this the chapter after he finds out about it!
...
Even discounting stupidity, my main issue with Corrin in the end of the day that he is a Blackhole Sue. Any mistakes he makes are completely invalidated by the narrative making it so Corrin can do no wrong. All the deaths his invasion of Hoshido caused? Eh, its okay, everyone forgives him, even the people who were on the other side and had family members die because of his actions.
Every character either loves Corrin and is completely and wholly devoted to him for no good reason, or they dislike him in such a way where the fact that they dislike him is portrayed at being wrong.
We even have a villain in the form of Iago who seems to have a personal vendetta against Corrin for literally no reason. Seriously, I challenge you to come up with one reason Iago has for in particular wanting to screw Corrin over (something he does far beyond simply what Garon orders him to do) besides just being a dick. Corrin's blackholeness is so strong he even bends the narrative to cause villains to have it personally out for him when they literally have no reason to.
Fates has a lot going for it. Conquest has struck a balance between rewarding RPG numbers and manageable stats for strats. Plus it has the best ensemble of maps in the series besides Thracia I suppose.
The music and animations and music are amazing, but the support writing can rather miss and formulaic (especially in Fates). I can't say the supports in the earlier games were too intriguing tho.
The story is a shit show and children either need a better excuse for existing or leave. The fan service in forms of characters like Camilla also paint a bad picture for the series. I would say the Awakening trio too, but I love them so much.
In short, the games are flawed but they absolutely hold their own compared to games of the past.
Stats for Strats is one of my favourite phrases ever XDXDXD
You could probably chalk a lot of the problems with writing up to the baby's first localisation job done to the game.
awakening trio = lissa chrom robin ?
Tommy Zarate the RNG sucked on Fates.
Micahl Taylor The FE 4 RNG was worse. I had to restart 'cause Sigurd got hit by 2 14% hits IN A ROW.
I'm ashamed to say I began playing because I saw a cutscene of Awakening on the Internet, so I was just curious about the game it came from.
I immediately looked at the story on Wikipedia: I thought it was cliche for RPGs as the player character was an amnesiac, but not cliche when I saw it was also a secondary protagonist (plus Chrom sounded like Chrono and I love Chrono Trigger). I then saw the time gap after a seemingly peace victory, and that this mysterious sword fighter from the future was Chrom's daughter: that's a well written story! But then I learned about the marriage mechanic and Robin could be Lucina's mother - so I immediately bought the game from EBay and borrowed my brother's 3DS (which I never used before) just to know what that feels like!
As I started the game, I realised it was a tactical RPG like Pokemon and I could roam around about what to do like an open world game. And each of the characters had personality and depth, different from Pokemon. The story was also better than most war stories I read about. Course I played with casual mode, but I was wondering how long it would be before I was experienced enough to play classic. But, I was worried after learning mechanics I liked, such as partner support, open world exploration and children were unique to Awakening and entries these mechanics came from. Shortly afterwards, Fates was released and I quickly bought it for the feels of choosing adoptive or birth family.
Once I was done, I looked at reviews on RUclips to see what veteran FE fans think of these two radical different entries. THEY HATED THEM! Of course they knew it was because the series had the threat of discontinuing and they needed to attract newcomers, but I agreed with them that it was no excuse for the lack of story and characters. I then bought the remaster of Valkyria Chronicles on PS4, and I got used to reverting to previous save files and being extremely careful with my tactics. I have now ordered Fire Emblem Shadow Dragon, and I think I'm now truly gonna experience Fire Emblem as it truly was made to be.
Spike Spiegel Nice, its good to see other fans play older games. However, I think shadow dragon is a poor choice lol, the game is underdeveloped and kinda bland. I recommend buying or emulating GBA games, then playing SNES games, imo the best.
Fire Emblem Awakening and Fates were my first games and introduced me to the series but I already knew about it. After that I began playing the other older games and I like them but I'm still a novice and I'm not and never have been into the whole super strategy thing. Either way I think the games were pretty good, although I do understand lots of the things your saying.
In story, yes. In gameplay, no. In characters, I'm still asking myself that. In children, yes.
For me, if you're gonna have children, just do what FE4 did and have there be one big story that start out with the parents, but end years later with their children!
(Let the parents have a saga where there is war, then have them end the war, and let them have their families afterward. Then years later, have the children grow up and have their own saga where they face a conflict that they're parents had to deal with and have them end it once and for all......something along those lines)!
+Busterman64 I like this idea.
FingerlessJames If you do, play FE4 if you haven't already. It isn't perfect, but it has arguably the best story of any FE.
+Busterman64 isn't that like wave 2 dlc for fates🤔
The Goddess' Mirror Sorta, but it's dlc. And it's still very different in that we don't choose the other parent.
Having played all 3 GBA games I'd say the Fire Emblem 3DS games have improved. Loved the characters, soundtrack, graphics and gameplay.
The avatar is much more relevant to the story, unlike in The Blazing Sword where he was just "their tactician" and was more of a witness to the events than a participant, which makes the player feel more involved in the game. The avatar customization was a nice touch and being able to bang, I mean S rank whoever you want in the game was something one could never dream of in the GBA games [Lyn].
I wouldn't say the villains were the worst, either. Grima was evil cause evil, but they've managed to make it more complex by linking him with Robin. In the case of Fates, they didn't portray King Garon as someone like Lyon from FE8 who was fighting against his possession, but I don't think it's fair to judge the game on what it didn't do. Instead, it has managed to humanize King Garon decently through support conversations from his children. Many people complain that Fire Emblem Fates has a lack of moral gray, but the moral gray already comes from the choice you have to make. Neither path is truly "right". I also liked Takumi as the Conquest villain and Anankos as the revelations villain. Anankos could've done with more development in the actual game, instead of the DLC.
In terms of story, I liked Awakening's but Fate's was not as good. I didn't mind it at first but on closer inspection there are a lot of plot devices inserted suddenly [insert your plot devices at the start of the game] such as the crystal ball that revealed King Garon's slime form and the curse which prevents people from speaking about Valla. These could've been introduced at the start of the game or should've been changed.
Things the next FE game could improve on:
-Villain development
-Story [Actions the characters take, better plot devices or total removal of them]
Things the next FE game should keep doing:
-Nearly everything about the gameplay [Pair up, weapon triangle, great map design]
-Avatar [Customization, relevance to story]
-Support system/conversations
-Having an amazing soundtrack + graphics [Cutscenes, combat animation, anime art style]
-Children [If the story requires them]
-Split paths or implementation of a choice [Provided what comes after is well written]
-Making players cry on harder difficulties
Well, one thing to note about Garon is that he wasn't possessed, the real Garon was outright assassinated by Anankos and then replaced with goo/slime wearing his form. That's why there's so much difference from what the Nohr royals remember about their father, and the Garon we actually see in the game....because it's not really Garon at all, merely one of Anankos' many puppets wearing his form.
No. Just no. Don't defend Awakening's gameplay. Shit was so broken there's only a slight challenge on Lunatic. Fates's gameplay was better, but Birthright is to date my least favorite game in the series. Also, moral grey goes out the window in Conquest thanks to the ending, which is even worse than Awakening's (which was WAAY to wholesome)
-The map design in Awakening and BIrthright was shit, and okay in Revelations and Conquest. Play Blazing Sword again, since it has hands down the best level design. Specifically, the Endgame.
-The Avatar is a shit concept, since (s)he has to have a blank slate personality to be relatable, and the characters for the most part are VERY one note. (Btw, there's an option to turn off the Avatar in BS, it makes the game so much better
-The support system of the new games is flawed, too, since you could support most characters together, but I saw quantity over quality.Support conversations themselves weren't that deep for the most part. (Btw, old games had supports as well).
-I guess, but don't make them so essential to the plot like Awakening, or bullshit like Fates
-That's not something the new games did first (See Sacred Stones). Both the SS pathways were well-written, and had effects such as going with Ephraim lost development for Cormag and Joshua, but Lyon was better, and vice versa.
-DO YOU EVEN RADIANT DAWN BRUH?
I would love to hear you discuss how you think Fates could've been improved. I know you covered your 5 favorite and worse changes, but hearing you say you could talk about what YOU would change to make it better has me curious.
I hope this becomes a video in the near future.
My opinion about the Corrin is similar to how you feel about King Garon. He had a nice foundation, and I was really excited about how he was going to grow after chapter 5, seeing how this affected him and changed him, along with other things that happens through both paths. Unfortunately, they added nothing to that base foundation and just left him empty, especially compared to all the other characters. I saw a bit more potential character come out right at the start of the battle with xander after Elise died, however I knew that anything that could be built from it was to late in the game and way to rare for it to happen. In the end, I though having a main character protag could have worked and been great, they just needed his actions/your choices to make him grow and be more deep of a character. Right now he is like this:
Mom died? Really mad, stays the exact same and I even forgot that happend for a large chunk of the story.
Sister you knew while growing up died in a fight? Revenge kill, then feel really bad and act the same.....
Honestly it was a neat idea but the fact protag could not develop as a character was one of the only problems with fates.
In general, fates was a game with great gameplay and a pretty good cast of controllable characters, but the lack of depth in Garon and Corrin really muddled down what I thought was a great idea for a story.
You, sir, have brought in a very solid point. As for my stance on Awakening and Fates? Well, honestly... like you, I don't think these games have ruined the series and thanks to these installments, the series is doing better! And personally... while I had a decent time with both Awakening and Conquest and are fairly good games, they are kinda easy (Mainly Awakening) and I feel they should improve the story and the difficulty to put in on par with previous games like Blazing Sword, bring back the weapon limit, Remove Phoenix Mode entirely (COMPLETELY POINTLESS, OKAY?!), Forget the multiple version thing (That was iffy too) and take more time to do these things. As of now, they are good games, but will NEVER beat Blazing Sword and Sacred Stones as my personal favourites... In fact, the game creators should REPLAY Blazing Sword, Sacred Stones and the Tellius games to take notes about improving the story properly. And they better not eat crayons and Lighter fluid like when they made Sticker Star! (I will not live this down, really. That game was mediocre.)
I don't need a fantastic story, just a good one. If its fantastic, great! Just make it feel competent!
Also, I feel like the difficultly is a bit unbalanced in thes games more than the older games. They weren't perfect, but it felt more like it scaled more properly because in Awakening and Fates...some chapters were easy, some were challenging, and some were a load of bull!
Lastly, while I haven't played it, but...Sticker Star...why......what the heck happened?!
sticker star happened because the developers were planning to make the game like thousand year door with the partners and everything, but when they showed it to myamoto he said he wanted minimal story elements, and more simplistic mechanics. When they did that, he asked them to remake it again because he felt it was too much like thousand year door... Myamoto really screwed up.
In my opinion, less is more. Get rid of pair up's, they just complicate the game more (even though it's not complicated but you get my point). The unlimited weapon use was stupid because they had to completely redo every weapon to make it more balanced. Stick with the basics and I feel you will keep a lot of fans. That being said though, the old didn't bring in many new fans. I feel finding equilibrium will be near impossible. If you try to make it appeal to new players you need to continue on the path they are taking (which I dislike) but if you want to keep a lot of fans stick with the old. Finding middle ground on that issue would be the key but like I said it will be near impossible. What I think is if you love the old games than look into the hacking community that fire emblem has. If you like the new way than stick with how Nintendo is doing things.
I agree with you on most things but I don't mind the Phoenix mode at all. It's optional after all and it's a good thing for casual players who aren't the best at strategy games and just want to enjoy the story and characters more (like me lmao I suck at these games)
Conquest was/is NOT easy. It and Radiant Dawn are the two hardest western FE Games and are probably in the discussion with Thracia 776 for the hardest FE game of all time.
Personally I don't know why everyone hates corrin, but loves Marth. Corrin seems to have almost the exact same personality as Marth, (besides being more naive) but he's more fleshed out.
Yeah, maybe I have to play more Fire Emblem games but I really like Corrin yet I can't really defend him because he is the optimist, he IS a bit of an idiot, he DOES seem callous to hurting his family when he joins the opposite side. But I still really like him, although I would love to get another Lord character because I love Marth and Chrom. I like the MU but changing isn't a bad idea. Also if they could be, y'know, not a Mary Sue.
How can he have all of the problems you've listed, and be a marry sue character?
Because no character in the game points it out. The only character that hates Corrin who has spent more than five minutes talking to him is Takumi in Conquest, and the only reason he dislikes Corrin is because he is literally being possessed by a demon. Robin in Awakening was brought back to life literally only because of "the power of friendship." If there was anymore riding on the MU's dick it would be rated M. Still like them though. :D
Xander constantly points out that Corrin is Naive and needs to be less trustworthy. As for characters that don't like him, Hana and azama seem to only deal with him in their supports, and never really consider him a friend. There may be other characters who're like this, but I don't have all of the supports
I think it's because Corrin is *your* character, and Corrin, being real here, is pretty stupid at times and does things that the player wouldn't do and that annoys them because again, Corrin is your character that you made. Marth, on the other hand, isn't. It makes more sense for him to be the way that he is. Also, I just think Marth has more charm in terms of character and design.
thanks for the shout-out crash, you really didn't have to do that. this was overall a great video and I'm enjoying this style of discussion based content (hell, it's the style that I myself personally use) and I'm looking forward to seeing more stuff like this.
great job on this man.
Of course I did dude your video brought up a lot of good point and was pretty much as basis for this one, as they "I couldn't have done it without you'. So far the feedbacks been really good so I think 'CRASHX500 asks' is gonna be another new series of videos for this channel, and i'm glad you're looking forward to seeing more stuff like this.
My problem with the new games is the story, they're trying way too hard to make it close to the past storylines, and it doesn't work at all. I don't understand the Casual and Phoenix mode argument though. Is it bad having choices available to new fans? We're just extremely close minded that the only way to play Fire Emblem is perma-death? No. Hell, the reason why Awakening and Fates were able to bring a good chunk of new fans, was the option of casual mode. I,ll admit that the route their taking is worrying, but Fates was like Gaiden: They didn't know how to capitalize on the success of the last game, and ultimately backfired. I'm sure that IS will make the next game incredible. Maybe even remakes of the older games...
Dat profile pic tho...
CRASH did defend Casual Mode though, he just doesn't use it personally; it's Phoenix Mode he had a problem with, since it takes any real risk and challenge out and makes the game BEYOND broken. At least in Casual, you don't get the units back until you finished the battle, so you CAN fail if you're not careful, but only TRULY so if you're completely incapable of keeping anyone alive. It's fine for getting through the story, in both his opinion and mine, even if we don't use it.
Meanwhile Phoenix... literally makes Game Over impossible.
I mean it could still be somewhat possible, if you were stupid to put corrin in a position where he/she was going to die a horrible death.
gameplay has improved greatly it's fantastic but the writing is horrible the older games had better written stories and characters but overall there alright not the best in the series not the worst but still enjoyable games
Writing yes it's horrible, characters not so much in my eyes, but I agree that neither of them are the best or worst fire emblem games.
BLAZINGKNIGHT I get that and while it sound like I'm more negative then positive I had fun playing both awakening and fates and some characters were enjoyable I'll give you that but as you said the stories of both games are rough and the future installments must make creating a good story it's priority over anything else that's where they really dropped the ball this time
Gianni Gameplay hasn't improved at all...
Should I play Shadow Dragon? I hear so many mixed things about it but I also want to get to know Marth's Character so I can get a feel for older fire emblems.
It is the weakest game in the series, but it's still a great game in it's own right so yeah go for it.
BLAZINGKNIGHT i have a bone to pick with you
What seems to be the matter?
BLAZINGKNIGHT ots not anything hostile but I feel you need to atleast expose yourself to the other FE games to get a good grasp. Not to say play these now but in one of your videos you explaimed games you wanted to see for FE and one thing I noticed was how close number 5 was to FE4 like very close. Not a major issue and I understand if that was never meant to be. thx for the reply :D
- your subscriber
Not a problem and I see where your coming from. You'll be glad to know that i'm currently playing FE4 and I plan to play 12 and 5 afterwards, so i'm getting more involved with the series and seeing it in it's earlier days.
I really want an Fe2 or Fe4 remake, those games were pretty good and have many elements that Awakening and Fates had, like grinding and children. Plus, every new Fire Emblem player can't be accepted as one until they experience the greatness that is Sigurd. Like, that dude so awesome, he was practically on Fire. ;)
I just want to be able to get a copy of the fe1 remake, or put it on the eshop
I even heard that Sigurd and Flora (Birthright) became best friends. It was truly a smokin relationship :D
I would love to play a remake of Genealogy of the Holy War. It is my all time favorite of the series.
Borjan Kosarac Lol that's perfect.
Sigurd was in flames in my substitute run of FE4
+Saul Reyes Well if we're talking about substitute runs, than everyone in generation 1 stayed at Alvis' BBQ party, it was that good. Too bad Quan and Ethlyn couldn't come, because Tabrant put sticks in their wheels.
I feel the same about avatars. I *LOVE* Robin and how he's portrayed, but Corrin makes me want to throw my DS across the room.
Corrin could've been better, but he's not that bad. We've had WORSE characters. In Conquest, it would have been amazing if we saw a broken, more insane Corrin, especially near the endgame, killing some characters.
Desmond Hollins Corrin?
Desmond Hollins CRASHX500 said he was. Did you watch the video? And besides, re-read my comment. I said I don't think he's that bad.
Desmond Hollins Wow, I think we can tone down the verbal violence. I don't think he's bad. In fact, ever since this top comment my opinion of Corrin has changed. He's a good character. Everyone who bitches about Corrin are just complaining that Tellius and the GBA games are the end-all-be-all of Fire Emblem. They designed Corrin right. So, you don't have to hate me.
+Desmond Hollins You could probably get more people to agree with you if you didn't g off the chain everytime you reply to a comment
Desmond Hollins It makes you look like child with no capacity for reasonable argument
The biggest disappointment of fates for me was the music. One good song with several remixes. Awakening had Don't Speak Her Name, and Radiant Dawn is easily the best soundtrack-wise
Radiant Dawn had a phenomenal soundtrack! Personally, I think Binding Blade had the best soundtrack. Either way, those two have the strongest soundtracks out of the entire FE series IMO.
radiant dawn and awakening had such good soundtracks, especially "What if I can't? what if I'm not worthy of her ideals?". that one is my favorite.
Beauty is a Mad Mistress automaticaly puts Radiant Dawn as the best soundtrack ;)
I love fates music
Really? I thought Fates had the best music in the series...
Hmm... as a whole, you make a strong argument in regards to your opinion. While I still feel like your hatred of Corrin is a bit extreme - even with your valid reasons, seeming to completely despise the character feels overblown - but at least you explain WHY you dislike him/her while liking Robin. I would actually echo or refute some of your claims, because both characters would have shared them... but maybe it's about context, too: Corrin's failings (like saving the enemy siblings) are somewhat conveyed in a manner that could makes him/her feel indecisive and hesitant, which reflects your problems with the character not "growing and evolving"; Robin's failure to save Emmeryn though, along with Grima and Validar CONSTANTLY moving the goalposts in the last arc, isn't a fault of character at all and can't be treated as such - and the gambit with Basilio to keep the Fire Emblem out of Validar's hands and prevent the resurrection ritual (even if Grima then cheated afterwards) was perhaps one of the best FE moments period, even I'll admit to that.
For me, while Robin does arguably change more and develop better, s/he is too bland for me to really invest in outside the Supports; on the other hand, for all Corrin's naivete and the fact that s/he does not change heavily from the different stories, I felt that Corrin DOES have changes between the versions based on idealism (BR), cynicism (CQ) and realism (REV) based to some extent on their different experiences between routes - like Azura's slow degradation, the Nohrian army's brutality, or the Wolfskin/Kitsune/Cyrkensia massacre (and the contexts of each event in the latter example). I suppose I also found Corrin more endearing just within the story as a whole, and even more in many Supports, which makes me more forgiving of his/her more disappointing characteristics/role. Meanwhile, Robin just didn't interest me personally within the main story, feeling unnecessary outside of the connection to Grima, and while I liked him/her much more in the Supports (except the female Robin and Chrom Supports - UUUAAARGH!) which better demonstrated their quirks, like with Corrin not all these were the best ever either.
... And funnily enough, when you comment on stuff like Corrin having a conflict with the side s/he chooses, some of the moral grey you praised is actually localisation-only. While yes, Takumi was untrusting and Oboro's backstory and attitude are consistent, the Hoshidans as a whole (especially Ryoma and Hinoka) were less prejudiced towards Nohr in general ("Nohrian scum" was a localisation creation) and less venomous towards the other family; the Nohrian siblings were also a bit different, with Camilla being more obsessed with her love for Corrin in the Japanese version, rather than being violently overprotective of them in the localisation (guess which I prefer), and I think that Xander and Leo's sorrow for you opposing them was also made more pronounced... I say this to suggest that some of those things you suggested for Corrin's character wouldn't have even meshed with some of the original Japanese version's writing (to my knowledge), and unfortunately the localisation couldn't go all-out like they might have wanted with some of these aspects due to the limitations of mere localisation (same with the complaints that Soleil had no S-Supports with girls, for example).
I guess that... it really comes down to what you like in a character, or what you read as better development. For you, that's Robin, and the ball was dropped much worse for Corrin; for me, it's somewhat the other way around - and though I see that the ball for Corrin WAS dropped harder, I don't have as much issue with it as you do.
Moving on from Corrin... I don't have much else to comment on right now, no matter how I'd like to; though I will say that, regarding the villains, you aren't wrong overall. The "Awakening" villains were mostly two-dimensional at best, with Yen'fay and Mustafa being about the only enemies with real depth to them; Gangrel, Walhart and Aversa's motives and backstories are more detailed if you recruit them, but THAT'S THE PROBLEM. We shouldn't NEED the SpotPass chapters where we RECRUIT them (which I call rubbish on, how did Chrom NOT cut Gangrel's head off?!) to get context for them, not just because it weakens the impact of their deaths, but because the main story alone should have carried their respective roles and personalities... For me, I do consider what we learn about them through SpotPass and Supports - specifically Gangrel's past and decline into a power-mad, vengeful tyrant for one, Aversa's brainwashing by Validar (as it explains her special Ability, as well as her personality), and Walhart's motives of peace - to be canon, BUT I also consider their surviving at ALL to be "Optional Canon" (same with Emmeryn); same with Priam only existing if you want him to, in SOME timelines where he didn't marry Soren or Ranulf but some unnamed woman (or hell, one of his comrades), and even the alternate Yen'fay... if you don't want these as canon, then they aren't canon at all, especially since SpotPass needs to be unlocked first. And of course... they were rather bland in execution of the main story: Gangrel just didn't have the charisma of Ashnard, the latter who you can freely despise both in spite of and BECAUSE he's irredeemable, and yet Ashnard for his madness DOES even have a developed philosophy besides "bwahaha!" in his Social Darwinism and stuff; Walhart had potential, but his character is too stoic to really be on display, so he feels more like a plot device meant to contrast Chrom's ideals and philosophy than his own unique character...
But yep... Iago and Hans are pretty flat - a fact not helped by the fact they're among the only enemies you face regardless of route, besides Zola and Kotaro (who have a bit more personality, but neither are given enough screentime to really develop). And I'm feeling you on Garon, oh boy... it's such a pity instead of making him a still-living human, they had the real Garon long-dead so we never see him, only hear of what he was like (unless it was still him at Cheve, it's vague about when Anankos killed and replaced him); or they could've still killed him, but had more of his original personality intact while he (secretly) served Anankos' purpose for his own reasons. Both cases would have worked, even (or especially) with Anankos as his puppet-master: not only does Anankos' putting people like Iago and Hans in charge of Nohr's higher command structure actually make sense given his hatred of humanity (due to his past), as he's essentially destroying one country from within, but with Garon's children to somewhat counter it also keeps Nohr JUST stable enough to make using them to crush Hoshido a feasible task. Also, we could've had Garon willingly serve Anankos with him thinking that it's better for his surviving children, or them both sharing a hate for the world or something, but Garon might also have not realised HOW in the Silent Dragon's thrall he was or how much danger his children were in; he could've been willing to sacrifice them BECAUSE he loves them too much; or some other combination. There was so much potential, it's a real pity they squandered it... As for Anankos, while the DLC actually goes well into his personality and motives, that's the POINT. We should not NEED that to get a good reading on Anankos' character and motives, it should be part of the main game as a whole (or at least "Revelation"), because it's a key part of why the plot is even happening; and considering that, both with and without all that he's a better main villain than Grima, that just makes this even more disappointing there.
I think that ultimately, "Fates" may be the most controversial game precisely BECAUSE, along with continuing from what "Awakening" already did but-more, it was so hyped that it was nearly impossible to not disappoint someone... Disappointing those who wanted a more complex Avatar; disappointing those who wanted an excellent main antagonist; disappointing those who wanted both countries to be on the same moral ground (or closer than we got); disappointing those who loved the Child mechanic due to the Deeprealms garbage; etc. With so much hype blazing its trail, there was no chance the game had to be universally-pleasing even for the NEW fans that the "Awakening" boom won over...
Kageros design makes a lot of sense seeing that she is a female ninja or a konich seeing that they used there sexapeall to get close to there targets and assassinate or get information.
Off course, NO Fire emblem game is perfect. I Loved every moment of the games! Even as a series veteran, I still enjoyed Awakening and Fates, with Fates being my favorite FE game. I enjoyed the Tellius series the least.
Nope, 'Lifegamer Let's Play's' has every right to stay.
I never said I didn't enjoy those games. but I just like other FE games better
It's my favorite out of them all. I really dislike Archanea. Seems so bland for me. And Fates too.
I do agree they should go back to original roots on stories the Avatar is perfectly fine addition plus being the main character was fine Corrin was fine and not bland...
yeah their great don't agree there Robin feels too perfect to me better character sure but Corrin is fine too. less in your face fanservice, actual intimidating villains that don't result into memes, plus better story and world building.
I dislike Corrin because he's the standard Fire emblem lord that trust every enemy that turns coat just because their pallet swapped; at least Robin is is the one that airs on the side of caution when Chrom does something stupid. Corrin on the other hand is just like
Corrin: "YO YA WANNA JOIN MAH GRUP?!"
Rest of his family: "You shouldn't trust an assasin from the opposing army >.>"
Corrin: Turns his/her back to the assassin he's/she's trying to recruit "What are you talking about?"
I mean how dense can you get? I know that he/she lived a sheltered life but how sheltered can you really get? and how long does it take to realize that not everyone is a friend?
Vali I blame the writing for that since naive and brash lords exist before Corrin and you can tell they didn't care for the develop the Lord in Fates for other things. Also the whole join the army stranger isn't new for main characters though.
My Boy CRASHX500 has been taking those philosophy classes. I like this video the best to date !
I would say my biggest issue with Awakening and Fates, is the class changing system. Now it's true the shadow dragon remake did that first, but with Awakening and Fates, more so in fates I feel forced to class change. And I'm not talking the old level to 20 and use master seal, I mean change an archer into something else like a mage. With some of the characters they are defined by their weapon, so when you switch them it comes off as odd to me.
Yes, can switch them back when you get the skills and stats you want, but that leads into my next point the grind.
I know we have DLC for this both for xp and money, but it still doesn't stop the grind. Yes, it's rpg, yes you did grind somewhat in the older Fire Emblem games, but not to level these games allow, or possibly require.
Going though Fire Emblem Conquest and Revelations, the same way I did with say Fire Emblem blazing sword, or even the sword of seals, did not work too well here.
I felt that even my units that where 20/20 with good gear and an A and S supports I was still punished for playing using an older style.
However once I gave into the class change system did the grind for the extra skills and xp I found the old style worked. Great, right? Yes and no.
Once I was done with the grind I was overpowered, sure I could die if I got really reckless, but the game became too easy.
Every unit felt like Ike, Hector, or Roy with the sword of seals. This is great having a strong units and it's really fun at the endgame.
So it was fun for while, but I would liked to have gotten there by the final chapter like the old games. With these games I have to class change just have a chance of lasting the final chapters, 20/20 just don't cut it anymore, sadly.
If everyone unit can be god like, why even restrict class, why not make everyone be able to everything?
On the subject of the Avatar Robin is written better the Corrin by a landslide. The Avatar has always had a supportive role. In fates they take center stage. And every other character just lives to forgive and love Corrin if they support with him/her.
Between these two games I think Fates has overall better supports while its main cast suffers, where as with Awakening it's switched. Stronger main cast weaker supports.
While the supports are really good I would much rather feel strongly about the overall plot, how I want to stop war and you know take in the themes of fire emblem. Not spend hours deciding who my Robin or Corrin will marry.-_- It under mines the seriousness of the series.
If they have to do children again I hope they do it like Fire emblem 5 or 4, I don't recall which one. Where the parents went though part one of the plot and kids took over for part two based on your supports.
Great video by the way you said a lot of what I was thinking.
So let me get this straight, a game literally takes a series off the brink of dying, yet the fanbase complains about said game? You have to be fucking kidding me. You should be glad the series still exist to continue on. Some people are just ungrateful. I could only wish that with some of my favorite games!
I feel the same way, it's just the because these games were dumbed down in certain areas and somewhat pandering, some of the more hardcore fans were less than kind to these games.
Welcome to the Nintendo fanbase, the most whiny, ungrateful lot you could ever meet... >_> Honestly it seems like nothing ever satisfies Nintendo's supposed fans and they always find some molehill to make a mountain out of and scream about...
awakening had a very shaky story and most of the characters were uninspired. the gameplay was fine, but dumbed down
fates is the worst game in the entire series
all 3 stories are terrible
the map design is atrociously bad and half the characters are annoying as fuck
and corrin is a mary sue and the god of this world all praise corrin
i think awakening was a lot better than fates. the tellius games are the best Imo.
Nick Frost i think fe4 is the best game
Short answer: No.
Long answer: I loved the older games about as much as anyone else, but a good chunk of this fandom needs to stop being so fucking salty over the series making changes and becoming more accessible for new comers. Awakening and Fates were the success' this series needed to survive and for the most part said changes improved the experience, expanded the fanbase and added a level of replay-ability the series rarely had before. This backlash is pretty much equivalent to how Star Wars fan boys threw a tantrum over Lucas selling the franchise to Disney.
That Star Wars comparison is literally the best way I've heard someone describe the divide between the Fire Emblem fanbase right now. Hell in both cases, despite having flaws and not being perfect, the new material is actually pretty good for the most part
Q: Have these two games ruined a franchise?
A: Kinda, but not entirely.
So Crash, what FE game would you recommend for those who only played Fates/Awakening?(And yes that includes me...but I still think your video was pretty accurate :P)
Personally I feel the best FE games for anyone to start with or in your case play after fates and awakening are blazing sword (GBA) and/or path or radiance (GC), because they're the most focused, complete, well thought out and balanced games in the series.
hey crash i think this video was very informative and very well thought out, i have never played past fire emblem games and only have experience with awakening and fates. I feel the story is these games are good and when im playing fates and play the before awakening dlc it always gives me a warm feeling i am truly greatful for these games and look forward to more. I enjoyed this video i really hope you make more of these types of videos.
FE7 and FE8. Best beginner games.
Masumi Nishino Thanks very much i'm glad you enjoyed it, and i'm glad you're also grateful for these games as well, also based on the feedback it seems I will be making more of these videos.
CRASHX500 Thx for the recommendations.
I guess it's time to install an emulator or two ^.^
to everyone who hates the fan service in the recent games and prefer the old ones, two phrases for you... tellius saga, yaoi
How about this for an FE game:The game would be divided into two arcs with the first starting off with your avatar as just some guy who just travels around (i know this is generic as fuck, but please bare with me here) and meets the lord of the game and after some shit you become his retainer and try to help his country win a war (cause its not an FE game without a war :D) and throughout the story you help the lord try to come to terms with what is right and what is wrong and that there are no real "winners" in a war, then once the war reaches a conclusion the first arc ends and a time skip occurs. the second arc will begin after the time skip but however, the thing is the time skip will roughly be 20~25 years or so making it so the main cast will become mature adults around this time, and all S supports will become unavailable, making it so S supports will only be able to happen in the first arc of the story but the supports will still be there with a minor difference here and there. the reason for this giant time skip and no S supports is simple, TO MAKE THE CHILDREN ACTUALLY APPLICABLE WITHOUT POCKET DIMENSION BS!!! basically since by this point the kids will be teenagers and their paralouges will be unlocked after the second arc starts and we can have kid units with legit parents! and the second arc would probably be something like "an ally from the first arc betrays the avatar and friends and tries to cause the end of the world, blah blah blah blah blah" and completing this would be the true ending of the game. there are probably waaaay better idea's for the next FE game but i think it should look something like this :P
So, Genealogy of the Holy War with an avatar character?
yeah... FE4 beat you to it...
The lord character sounds like corrin! Super naive. Corrin makes me wanna vomit character wise. but other than that it is pretty much FE4 so hey you had an amazing idea and its now a game. so go play your idea!
FE4 did a very similar thing.
lookslikedekulink more like it stablished
Very compelling video that finally gives me better arguments for both sides, thanks!
Though the unsolicited Severa hatred is a bummer, especially since she's so popular and has such a compelling backstory and chemistry with her family and other characters like Inigo and Robin... But oh well, still an amazing video!
I agree with what you say. Though Fates was my first game, I do know it's not perfect. The story had its flaws and the villains have not personality s aside from hurting Corrin, it was still fun. Also I would love to see some remakes of the GBA games.
Gotta say not a fan of Corrin at all myself, blank slate characters in general have never been my cup of tea so I agree someone like Robin is much better
Also, while I may be alone on this I say child units should not be in the next game. That whole DeepRealms nonsense just felt completely unnecessary and should not return
hes not blank, hes just boring.
literally every support with Corrin: "HI! Wanna be Friends! I like your Hobby! I like You!"
or in the case of the Royals "Hi! We are Family, we should help Eachother!"
dont forget the fact Azura is Waifu bait at its finest. one kidnapped by nohr and raised there, the other same story but hoshido.
I thought fates story was an mishmash of plot holes and shameless plug ins to BUY THE OTHER GAME. But awakening had an alright story, despite the bland villains, and I much prefer Robin to Corrin, personality wise and bearing on plot...wise... Corrin was honestly just a Mary Sue for you to feel cool about you since the entire cast except for like five characters kiss your butt the whole game.
I still prefer fates gameplay and characters to awakening, since both had more depth and intrigue to them. (Besides Corrin, of course) Literally all you had to do to beat awakening was to use magic, and most of the characters I don't think had as much depth as they could've had.
As a whole, I think I like both games a lot, and they did get me into one of my new favoritist (if that's a word) series. but if I had to choose which one I'd probably go with fates since my only real problems with it were plot related.
Oh, and the copious amounts of fan service.
I don't know what the point of this was.
I like Saizo because he is a huge dick to The avatar in revelation
+The Goddess' Mirror Saizo is the best
The point of fan service is to make money, Nintendo is not doing great money wise hence the whole Amiibo crap and fan service. I agree with you on most things here. Fates plot was crap, I can't say much about awakening cause I didn't think it had ANY replayabilty so I forgot everything with that game. Corrin has crap character development because they want to make the player feel good? so maybe that's why they made him a huge Mary Sue? I have no clue honestly and there really is no excuse for that. Both games have fun game play but personally I think less is more. Get rid of pair ups, bring back weapon limit and just make it like the older games in terms of game play. Awakening was mad easy and so was birthright but other than that I think that the other two games challenged players really well. However if I had to choose one I would throw them both out the window, bring up my emulator and play some good old FE 7 or FE 8, or I would go play FE 9 and FE 10 on my Wii again for about the 15th time. I kid you not I have replayed every fire emblem game from 7 to 10 about 8 times each. The replayability it CRAZY. I love them all. And with randomizers for FE 7 and FE 8 you can have even more fun!! But other than that I agree with you good sir!!
IN the 1st week Pokemon go came out they increased their stock my 50% and are now worth more network than sony
THANK YOU man. It had to be said. Even though I am a huge fan of the older games and I think Awakening an Fates are pretty lack-luster compared to the older ones, I think the critique the newer games get is undeserved. Just like you said, we should be grateful that they saved the series. The franchise is blooming, with Echoes having potential to bridge the gap between the older and newer fans.
how do you even unlock phoenixmode? i'm not sure i've seen them in either fates or awakening. although never played something else then classic i don't think the casual mode is that bad. it's just optinal who like the kind of game but don't want the die hard difficulty
Gameplay wise - No
Story wise - Yes
Awakening was a bit more consistent and competent in its story. Fates was better in gameplay, but story......missed potential and......Corrin(don't hate the guy, he is kinda eeehhh...)
Happy I'm not the only one that thinks that. Naive Corrin may be, but at least show he's growing for goodness sake!
+Busterman64. In my opinion awakened had better gameplay. I didn't like Fates gameplay because they had weird stat changes with weapons and COMPLETELY took out weapon durability.
Luckyshot Honestly...while it worked for Fates...I want Weapon durability back. I can understand why it was an issue for some, but...I liked it. (It was micromanagement!)
Also, your reasons for using money(and it's value) dropped.
Even in Conquest, while your funds are limited, I still have a good amount of money because I don't need to spend much of it(without DLC).
(Also, you can get weapons randomly anyway, and possibly good ones too and multiple of it!) But that's just me.
There is also the forge, but I'd rather have the one from Path of Radiance or Radiant Dawn where you take one weapon and make it as powerful as you want(in certain limits for each weapon).
+Busterman64. I also liked weapons durability! But I HATES it for legendary weapons. In my 3 play through of FE7 I was always afraid of using up Lyns mani Katti, Hectors wolf Neil, and Eliwooda rapier. Because if they broke i was afraid I wouldn't do as much damage as I could.
Ok overall I don't think Nintendo is ruining fire emblem they are just changing it so it's different and can attract new fans which I don't think is a bad thing I think it's great that it's finally getting the love the series deserves but I wish they didn't have to change the series to make it possible I think in all honesty that a lot of the things the series got its quirks from are slowly starting to fade away. But I disagree when I played fe fates I enjoyed being the main lord but I think it would have been much cooler if it was more interactive like what's your weapon preference and the yato turned into that and one last think if they could've actually made the game about choice and given us actual choice like the game was supposed to be about that would've put the game i my top 5 but because they didn't do anything to really change it from awakening it fell sho. FYI I've been playing since FE 6 (Yes I got a JP version still have it) and I've loved every game except Shadow Dragon
I think that's why Conquest was made, to appeal to long term fans, while Birthright appeals to new players and Revelation is supposed to appeal to both. I didn't read the full comment so I don't know if you said this but yeah
What if, at the start when you're making your Avatar (in the case of "Fates", Corrin), you got a weapon preference? Say you could pick sword, axe, lance or bow at the start - then your default class (Nohr Prince/Princess in this case) is the same, but (along with the Dragonstone) you have one other weapon you can use, based on what you pick... And then when you get your legendary weapon, it's actually whatever your preferred weapon is (sword/axe/lance/bow) because it was made for YOU (in the case of "Fates", the Yato blade was forged by the Rainbow Sage). That would certainly emphasise customisation to some degree, no?
Yes, that'd be better and is much like FE12's (New Mystery of the Emblem) character creator, as you actually choose your starting class in that game. Oh, also your portrait changes depending on the class chosen, and they have some fun hairstyles and such to choose from.
ANYWAYS Nintendo is changing Fire Emblem too much at this point. Obviously they want new fans to let the games stay afloat, but to me, Fates almost felt like a different game due to how different it was. It just feels pretty off compared to other FE games. Not to mention the dialogue is a lot worse, especially since NoA handled the localization. I mean, "super dupity dangerous"? Really NoA? Sophie does *not* say that in the JP version.
Oh, one more thing. the JP versions, being honest here, have better writing and aren't filled with weird unfitting dialogue unlike what NoA wrote. They're usually more serious.
I'd be here all day if I went through my opinions. Instead, I'll just say that I really like this idea for videos! You keep reminding me why I'm subscribed in the first place! Anyways, when you're done with fates, I REALLY wanna see a top 10/15 blazing sword characters, or maybe a list like the tellius one, a top 20 Elibe series characters.
I don't like phoenix mode but i'm fine with casual mode. If your going to reset after a character dies in classic mode, what is the point of playing classic mode?
the games have they're pros and cons just like all the others I wouldn't say they're the best the franchise has ever done but definitely not the worst by any means these games I can enjoy just as much or even more so in some cases more than other fire emblem games I don't understand how people treat these games as the Sonic 06 of fire emblem but meh I enjoy them these games are always welcomed in my game collection as great games
also might I add,well fucking said my friend while I'm not going to type out all my feelings about this subject I can say u touched upon most of what I think of this topic and I personally can't wait for the future of FE
Corrin Kirito? not even close...
yeah wouldn't say that at all.
I always thought the Awakening and Fates stories felt weaker because of one aspect: the lack of narrator introduction for each chapter. In Genealogy of the Holy War, the Gameboy games, and Tellius series, a narrator would always elaborate on the conflicts in the world at the beginning of each chapter. This made the countries feel big and real. Whereas the worlds and conflicts of Fates and Awakening felt smaller because they didn't get as much focus.
I'd be totally in favor of a 15- minute video on how to improve Fate's plot, even though I liked it overall. Also, did you play Hidden Truths? Because I *REALLY* think stuff that story-relevant shouldn't be DLC, probably a bonus episode you can unlock after beating Revelations, sorta like in Pokemon Conquest where you unlocked bonus episodes for a bunch of the characters after beating the game
Have the new games ruined Fire emblem? I say Yes and no: It definetley saved the francise and it did improve on the gameplay as a whole (at least fates did) but I have the feeling that now that it sells so well they might get lazy (you can see this in the depiction of the villains and the much shorter and less interesting support conversation). And yes, I think the story in Fates is kinda weak (not terrible but also not as good as it could be) and I really don't like Conquest Corrin.
What I think Nintendo should do is remaster the older games (from FE1 to the GBA series) for mobile since mobile has a huge casual audience so they might know if the older style can sell the more casual audience (and yes, add in casual mode for all those games), then, if they do well, make a new mobile FE game similar to the GBA-style games. At the same time they can continue the new FE style on handheld/console/whatever the NX will be to continue reaching the audience who mainly played the new games.
I would love remakes of the older games, but...with their original mechanics intact and with casual mode added(and maybe have the Avatar in that game have a little bit more presense...and character). People like the older games for a reason! ;3
Busterman64
Is there an avatar in a decent number of older games? I can only think of FE7 (and there I am not sure if you can really count this as an avatar since Mark is only there so your characters can break the fourth wall and it's explained why) and I think the FE3 remake (but I never played this so I don't know anything about the avatar there).
But yes, I want good remakes of the old games with casual mode so the new players can enjoy it.
Oops...sorry, was talking about the Avatar Mark in FE7. I guess I didn't type that and didn't notice( herp derp)! ;3
Haven't played the remake for FE3 either!
(And only FE3, FE7, FE12, and FE13(Fates) have avatars...but only FE7's is there for the player's sake and nothing too important...hope I didn't miscount Awakening And Fates...)
Personally I don't think these games have ruined the series. I give Awakening a 7/10, and I liked Birthright more than that. On an unrelated note, Mikoto is seriously wasted potential. She dies BEFORE THE ROUTE SPLIT and in the SECOND CHAPTER YOU SEE HER IN! As for Conquest, play the game, skip the story. Chapter 15 REALLY drives this point home (I would explain, but I'd be here all day). Fates has what the fanbase has dubbed "Corrinsexual characters". These characters can only support w/your Avatar. This screws a good number of characters out of potential development (more on that later). Awakening did this first, but at least there, most of the characters in question got screentime in the main story, such as Say'ri. On the topic of multiple routes, these routes seem really intent on either killing off characters or making them unplayable. Take Yukimura for example: he joins you on Birthright and Birthright only. That's 1 out of 3 routes. He doesn't even join you in Revelations, even though he should (in Birthright, he says he left automatons behind to defend Hoshido so he can help you, so why doesn't he do that here?). Sure, you can get him via online modes, but he'll have no voice clips or his (sole) support. But that's NOTHING compared to the treatment Intelligent Systems gave to one of, if not, my favorite character, Scarlet.
SPOILERS
She dies in Conquest AND Revelations. In Conquest, she could've joined you after the suppressing the rebellion (the writers could've found some way to make this work). In Revelations, she takes a hit for Corrin and is reanimated by Anankos as an enemy. What makes this worse than Yukimura's treatment is how she could've joined. Unlike Scarlet, Yukimura had absolutely NO REASON to join you in Conquest, seeing as he's with the enemy. Even worse, Revelations gives her to you only to cruelly take her away from you w/o having any means of saving her (unlike a certain someone in Birthright). This would be null and void if she joined you in Conquest, so she could live in 2 routes. Unlike Azura, who dies in 2 routes as well, Scarlet dies IN THE MIDDLE OF REVELATIONS instead of after the final boss. This means even though Azura dies, you still get to play as her to the end. This wouldn't be too much of a problem if this was a visual novel, but this is a video game; don't take away my playable characters.
In short, Fates is good, gameplay-wise. The story, on the other hand, could use some work, starting w/villains who are ACTUALLY likeable (lookin' at you, Iago, Hans, and especially Garon). Oh, and the way children were handled sucked, too. I only got children in Conquest for the EXP.
I love Awakening because it was my first FE game which is a little biased but what're you gonna do? It had some really solid ideas, especially in Anna. I mean what's not awesome about a merchant with full knowledge of the infinite multimeter and control over the Dragon gate?
Hey +CrashX500. Mind doing a discussion on those Fire Emblem successor ideas? As a new fire emblem fan who got in with Awakening, I wanna know more from a veteran.
Actually I seen plenty of people online who'd rather have the series dead than have it saved by the likes of Awakening and Fates, saying they preferred it if Fire Emblem died with dignity rather than appeal to the lowest common dominator just to increase the sales. They kind of would rather have the series dead today than being filled with dating sim waifu shit which they say is pushed to the point where they focus on that more than the actual real time strategy stuff.
Sounds like a couple of cynical, elitist shit heads, if you ask me.
+The #1 Yoshi
I think I'd agree with them.
BlackBeWhite2k7 Call me an elitist, but I'd rather the series die than be filled to the brim with fanservice and pointless gameplay mechanics
Look at these elitists aren't they just selfish. No wonder the game was niche till awakening
I agree but Awakening was fine. Fates ruined it though 😰😰😰. #BringBackMyrmidons
I don't care which person likes which game, but I fucking despise those people who don't care for the older games, or the "veterans" who don't accept the new ones as real FE games.
What do I think? I think that we need an HD remake of the Tellius games for the NX. I also think that a lot of people will agree.
Though you've done your research, it feels like you haven't really talked with anybody who dislikes these games.
_Your usage of "it saved the series" argument falls flat, due to some preferring the series to have ended over continuing as it is now.
_You say "several" characters are too over the top and just plain silly, when I (and many others) would argue that the vast majority fall into this- being largely bereft of depth and just being walking gimmicks. You act like Camilla was meant to have actual depth, when we have the games' creators joking that she looks like a cow in an interview. Considering comments like this and one look at the support system, it becomes largely obvious that the characters are meant to be fetishes first and foremost, with any actual character or depth coming secondary.
_Why did you enjoy Fates' story? It's massively carved up over the three routes and DLC, on top of having massive plot-holes.
_TMS itself has caught a lot of flack, for being... too Japanese, in all the wrong ways- on top of making things Akaneia only.
Overall, though we largely disagree on things, it's nice to see words of criticism leveled at the newer games that aren't related to the localization.
I agree completely. It genuinely seems as if he hadn't asked the fandom what the majority actually thinks about the newer games...which overall is a "good but could be much better" score.
I'd argue that the "save the series" point holds water. The new games in no way impede enjoyment of the older titles, as they take place in completely different times/worlds with little to no relation to past games. There's no downside to having the new games as a result, so it's a positive for people who enjoy the newer titles (or, at the very least, prefer them to no FE at all), and a net neutral for anyone who hates the games so much that they are utterly indifferent as to whether they exist.
+MT Zehvor Well, my problem with "saved the series" is that it's arguable whether another game in the style of old FE couldn't do the same. As far as I'm aware Awakening needed 250000 copies to save the series. It surpassed that by very much, however FE12 sold 230000 copies in Japan ONLY with shit marketing to add to the insult. Not to mention almost all of the previous games had the same amount of marketing as a puddle. It's arguable if an old style FE would have become such a bestseller as Awakening, but considering it came out on a relatively new platform and had lots of marketing by Nintendo (whom I think were the ones to screw the sales in the first place) I think any FE would sell well under those circumstances.
I agree that marketing was influential in Awakening's success, but keep in mind that marketing is successful only if you have something to market in the first place. Fire Emblem had pretty much reached its maximum capacity for sales because there wasn't much done inbetween games to attract newcomers to the series. You could advertise brutally difficult gameplay like PoR or deep strategy, but that's only going to appeal to the people that were already on board with older FE in the first place, so marketing that won't help your game sell any better. FE needed to appeal to a broader audience, and Awakening did that. There were new features to market for Awakening that could appeal to a new crowd, which older FE games just didn't have.
Is it possible that an older style FE could have reached 250K? Perhaps. I will say this, though; if FE hadn't changed, it most certainly would not have taken off like it has today, and Nintendo would likely be paying it a lot less attention than it is now. They might even have ignored it altogether; not shutting the series down for good, but putting it on hold while they went for more lucrative ventures. In other words, FE might have become what Metroid is today...and I don't think anyone wants that.
Yeah, I'm not denying that Awakening made the series as popular as it is now, but... brutally difficult? I don't think PoR was that, especially since the western version got an even easier mode and cut out the most difficult one. And about appealing to the newcomers, FE12 did that. It had a wide range of difficuties and a casual mode, so they were already going in that direction (making it easier for newcomers). FE12 overall is bacically a better version of Awakening, because it's FE3 (though I still hate FE12's avatar). About differences between games... Yeah, they made a good use of pair up and children as "brand new features" in their marketing, but those are used to bring in the old fans to try out something new. I really doubt newcomers would've cared, if the game had them at all. People REALLY underistimate the power of novelty (3DS) and especially marketing. Honestly, you don't need anyting of substance at all to market it. Marketing can drive old funs into the hype and newcomers will like it anyway, despite how different or simmilar it is to the previous titles (*ahem* Fallot 4 *ahem*). So yeah, you could argue how the series would be now, if Awakening was different, the series would probably be less popular, but I really doubt that FE would end up like Metroid, even if that was the case. Though maybe I'm too naive or whatever.
Fire Emblem is a videogame, not porn. This fanservice trash needs to go.
Of all the FE games I've played, Valter and Caellach were one of the most memorable bad guys. I agree with Awakening's villains not being that good. It's like Corypheus from Dragon Age:Inquisition--You'll forget him if not for your allies constantly reminding you he's the antagonist. I've never played Fates. Any suggestion on which I should play first? Birthright or Conquest?
The only thing I disagree with is your opinion of Corrin/Kamui. I feel like the character's traits actually make a lot of sense. He/she is naive because they were kept hidden from the world for most of their life and when you think about age, it seems that he/she is in their teens. The issue with the avatar and the reason no one really likes them is because the story doesn't fit for this type of character. This type of character would much better fit into a story where the decision isn't as black and white: for example if every time they had seen Garon, he had seemed to be a good guy and had been trying to drive corruption out of the military. If the story had been more gray, it would have actually made sense for the character to pick a side, and they would have actually been able to learn and grow throughout. Just look at the end of the chapter in conquest where Ryoma is captured: Corrin is trapped in a constant "oh god, what do I do?" loop and it's one of the few touching moments.
corrin is so awful that makes micaiah a better character
Desmond Hollins HE IS! :D
Desmond Hollins yes he is
Desmond Hollins yes he is
Desmond Hollins Yes he is! You just too stupid to say something good
Desmond Hollins Yes he's is! He is super bland, he is stupid, he is THE worst lord! You f***ing potato headed poophead!
ok i just wanna say two things cause im not really good at voicing my opinions and ive only been an FE fan for a little over a year now:
in terms of the avatar while i agree robin was more personable, I feel corrin's personality makes sense. To me i feel like they had a lot of pressure put on their shoulders to end this huge war that had been going on for god knows how long...It just seems they dont know how to properly convey their feelings due to fear
the only thing i didnt like in terms of story was in revelations where its found out that corrin is actually of vallite blood. it just seemed so convoluted and confusing that oh you were born in hoshido and the captured and grew up in nohr but youre actually a prince(ss) of a whole different kingdom? I know they had to make 3 seperate storylines but I was kinda miffed at that and felt it wasnt consistent. Other than that I liked the story of fates a lot
I cant really say if Awakening and Fates ruined FE cause I've only played those 2 games but i dont think it has at all like you said, with out them I wouldnt be as big as a fan as I am now....so I'm seriously glad theyre around
I think the idea of an avatar would work better if they were to adapt more of an RPG aspect to dialog. Giving dialog choices would allow the player to get more invested in their avatar while avoiding the plank slate personality. However this would require the writing team to really up their game.
Echoes most likely won't have the avatar. Just Alm and Celica. Maybe you can edit their hairstyles or something as far as the customization may go...
You know...I would actually love to here your ideas of how to improve Fates' story. Why don't you make a video about that?
Oh I will considering tons of people have asked me to do it, but I just need make sure I get my facts straight and really think this through before making it.
so here's a question I never seen anyone talk about. which version of the yato is better out of the 3 paths. both appearance and stats wise
Omega Yato stat-wise and Blazing Yato appearance-wise IMO.
I'd say Omega Yato in both, with Blazing Yato close behind for appearance and the Blazing Yato / Shadow Yato for stats separately, considering the Omega Yato gives the Blazing and Shadow Yato's buffs when carrying it.
I'd honestly love to see you talk about how to fix fates story, because I have my own ideas, but I'd like to see yours too.
What is that music in the background you played at the end with the flute.
Don't speak her name from fire emblem awakening
One of the things I felt was missing from the Fates franchise was that feeling of getting a new character added to your party, one not necessarily associated with the main storyline at the time of joining but had their own background and such. Someone that comes to mind is Joshua from Sacred stones. While he's just an example, I miss that part of just picking up people who are suffering in their own sense or originally from the opposing team to join your party. It was present in a couple characters, but not well done n the slightest. There were too many Royal characters and retainers, which really took up space for more interesting characters that could have really expanded the storyline. Just my two cents and opinion, though.
So can we still get a video in which you discuss how you would improve the story of Fates?
Well considering the demand for it based on the feedback, I guess so.
I personally disagree with your thoughts on Corrin, though your video was honestly really good.
I personally kinda wanna see some sort of mix between original and modern FE. Like maybe choosing do you want permadeath, pair up, ect.. Maybe choosing different routes like do you want to play as avatar or insert lord here. I know that's a bit much but eh. Wishful thinking.
No matter what, the Tellius series still reins supreme in my book. So much basassery, from the plot, to the characters to the new 3D style. It was truly amazing. Also, the Black Knight is the BEST villain in any fire emblem game. He is just absolutely amazing. Too bad these two games where also the worst selling. I would have loved to see more fans flocking to these games but sadly they never did. Also another thing, does anyone else hate when people talk so amazingly about awakening/fates and talk as if they are the only games in the series. Like I don't blame them for not knowing but seriously, compared to any other fire emblem game (not including FE11 and 12) fates/awakening is just plain crap. It isn't harsh, it's just true. I am so glad that the hacking community is a thing for fire emblem because it's the only thing in my opinion that will hold a true resemblance to the older games. However that being said I will still continue to buy any other new fire emblem games because fuck it, its fire emblem but truth be told, the new games are pretty much the same thing as watching the old games die. R.I.P Old FE games, you will never be forgotten
There is a difference between ending a series and ruining a series. Granted, I feel that Awakening and Fates both are good games with their flaws. And, what game in the series is without their flaws, absolutely none of them. With Awakening and Fates, Nintendo has made changes to appeal to the new player while staying true to the "system" as much as possible to make the old players happy. I myself, love all of the games that I've played (6-11, 13, 14) and I love different parts of each game and am glad that Nintendo has made them all. And, the old players should at least be happy that they got another Fire Emblem (2 technically). So, solid job on the video and really good points made. Earned my subscription.
I think u need to play the Kaga games (maybe just 4 and 5) before you can really understand what this series lost. The Kaga games had a unique way of utilizing the mechanics of the game to put you in scenarios that made u have to think outside the box, and often make real sacrifices in order to follow through with a strategy (the last chapter of the original fire emblem and chapter 2 of FE4 come to mind). Also, i feel like the new fire emblem's are geared towards an audience who play with guides and want to 100% everything their first play-through. The best part about fire emblem is playing the game for the first time blind. obviously you won't recruit everyone and you wont get all the hidden items, but your experience is going to be incredibly unique and memorable.
Personally Ive only played Awakening and Fates and I love them as they were fun. I would actually like to play the other games but I dont want to buy old systems and some of the games are pricy. That is my issue and I dont think Im the only one. If they start to remake games like they did recently it could work. Honestly though some only want the newer games,others older,and there are those who accept them all. Some will be biased and have a preference,but I think if Echos has taught anyone anything,with the right tweaks there can be ways for them to meet in the middle.
6:41 and we found where the budget went
BLAZINGKNIGHT In regards to Awakening's story, I have a few ideas to improve it.
-Make Gangrel more tragic. I liked his support with Emmeryn in the Hot Spring DLC, where he wanted what was best for his kingdom, but upon becoming King feeling no accomplishment whatsoever. In the first arc, Gangrel could have been someone who tried to change Plegia, but failed and became a simple puppet of his people's hatred: those whose hatred stem from Chrom's Father's actions against Plegia.
-Make the player understand why people rallied behind Walhart. The reason could be that the people in the country of Valm saw the gruesome side of peace through negotiations and wanted a man like Walhart to lead.
-Make Validar and Aversa more tragic and human. Validar for example could have come from the remnants of a royal family that worshipped a dark dragon in the past, and after losing most of his family to war and public persecution, he falls to despair and feels like he has no one to turn to but the Cult of Grima, who he sees as a God of Retribution on those who have wronged him.
-Make Plegia more interesting and humane. The history of Plegia could have played out like this: Plegia is a country that has a history of doing atrocities or being hostile towards other kingdoms because these other kingdoms have not treated Plegia equally, seeing them as an insignificant nation. Plegia's past outbursts are now its bane, as other kingdoms now take Plegia seriously, but now as a threat, and not an equal. A good example of a kingdom seeing Plegia as nothing but a threat was Chrom's father, who tried to eradicate the Plegians, but ended hurting his own kingdom more.
-Make the Avatar less important in Act 3. Instead of being Grima, he could simply be one of many of the main sacrifices to Grima to awaken him. Robin can still have Fell Blood, and be at Validar's mercy because of this, but its mainly used to power Grima himself onced sacrificed, and not because he is Grima. One other main sacrifice to Grima was going to be Nowi, and another main sacrifice to Grima could have been Aversa. Makes me wish there was a support between Aversa and Nowi, with Aversa's role of simply being a sacrifice and nothing more stripped from her crushing her while Nowi, a main sacrifice herself, trying to cheer her up and trying to remind her that she's more than a simple sacrifice.
- Give Grima an actual backstory. I get irritated as he seemingly came out of nowhere, so I headcanon that he came from the sealed earth dragons who were unsealed by a powerful dark mage and brought under his control since they no longer have what can be called minds or an ounce of sentience. He was about to be stopped, but he fused with the unsealed earth dragons, becoming their one conciousness using all if his power, and became Grima. This new threshold of power he attained is why the Fire Emblem and Falchion unsealed can no longer actually stop him, and can only place him under a 1,000 year sleep. What can stop him is his own power, which is the Power to Consume, and this power culminated into its own stemming from The Powerful Dark Mage's Power and the Earth Dragons, culminating into the Fell Blood. (This myth of a powerful dark mage using the earth dragons to become Grima can also be a good reason why dark mages are ostricized.)
-Get rid of the choices in Awakening since they didn't make much of a difference.
-In the end after striking Grima, who is finally killed with both Chrom and the Avatar striking him, has some last words for both of them before perishing.
So, in your opinion, are these game bad overall? Quite frankly, I loved them. But I am very biased since these were my first games, and quite frankly, I haven't completed any game other than Awakening. But still, What do you think?
Oh hell no I think Both Awakening and Fates (more specifically conquest) are fantastic games and are some of the best in the series despite their flaws.
Well that's good to hear! I love them too and I agree that conquest was probably the strongest of the bunch regarding fates.
Being one of those newbs who started with Awakening and is yet to complete Fates, I like where Fire Emblem is now, though I would like a game with Conquest level of challenge and a story equal or better than Ike's games next
I want them to make a game more like the older ones as a side project. Would take way less time to make than the newer 3d games while expanding upon a previous world/lore or making a new one to be expanded upon later.
I'd totally stay 15 more minutes to hear your ideas to make the story of Fates better, I'd love to see that as its own video!
I like to believe that there are 3 current eras in the FE series.
The first era (the exclusive era) goes from the original Shadow Dragon to Blade, which were exclusive to Japan.
The second era (the localized era) goes from Blazing Sword to the DS remakes which were (mostly) released throughout the world.
The third era (the rebirth era) started with Awakening and is still in progress with Fates.
Amazing video! All your points were really well though out. Especially points like the characters, villains, the avatar, story, etc. Also thanks for the points on fan service! You perfectly summed up how I thought about it! Thank you!!!
No problem and thank you i'm glad you enjoyed it. I'm also happy someone else feels the same way that I do about fan-service, it's not the worst thing in the world... provide they don't go overboard (depending on the tone of course).