Also SAE J2807 is not the only standard they are probably testing and adhering to, there are far more standards in question here. SAE J266, J684, J1491, J2638, J135, J134, J2664 which likely remain unmentioned? Perhaps even some ISO standards too?
@@sergiovazquez398 and it's a steeper test than what they are supposed to do anyway, but on a wet surface, might be a different story. That's a hell of a lot of weight to be held by the rear tires alone. Never forget your wheel chucks.
I would really like to see you guysmake "Payloads" as a regular part of yor reviews. Payload is much more important to me than towing. Be it a slide-in camper or hauling construction stuff around.
@@BeachJedi101 2000 lb payloads aren't unheard of in the half ton range. my dad loaded 2100 lbs of stone into his once. the truck won't enjoy it but it can absolutely be done
@Todd S Thank you Todd. I was thinking that even though towing at max capacities, due to the hitch/tongue distribution the vehicle is not at its max payload. Furthermore, in the video, the weight is centered over the rear axel. What about when your entire bed is taken up by cargo and you need to shift lanes? I would think that there will be a much more significant shift of weight from side to side make vehicle more unstable. Also, what about if you carry max payload even with the top of the cab? Then the center of gravity changes and leading to the vehicle behaving differently as well. Just a few thoughts.
I take it you never towed heavy on an incline. It's not brake torque as if you were getting ready to launch for a race, it's applying forward motion and torque to the wheels to prevent the entire rig from rolling backwards when releasing the brakes. What they did is quite normal for heavy towing since there is never enough torque at idle, no matter how powerful the engine is, to overcome the weight.
@@buckhorncortez was thinking the same thing... does that mean they stay there til something brakes and then hammer it? or hold the brakes, hammer down, and go. otherwise, no idea what Break Torquing is. ;)
I watch all of y’all’s videos and I have to say this was one of the best ones yet. This was awesome content to see how these manufacturers determine their numbers. Huge shoutout to FCA for all of these behind the scenes videos they have allowed y’all to do and for breaking down exactly how they do it.
William Mathew - Couldn’t agree more. It’s neat to see the manufacturers starting to integrate/interact with the well-known RUclips community for better sharing of information. Special thanks to FCA here for spending the time and money to do this for us.
That test going around the circle at 50 mph is a flawed test since they are using a low center of gravity flat bed with flat steel plates to keep the center of gravity unrealistically low, no one tows that trailer setup, do a big box trailer or a heavy 5th wheel camper and I guarantee that truck can't handle high sided trailers in those corners at that speed. They are really just wanting to keep pushing the tow ratings higher and higher aren't they?
In a truck-trailer combo, the truck doesn't prevent the trailer from a rollover. With a gooseneck, the trailer only exerts a single point of force (at the ball). The hitch and ball has total degree of freedom. With a tall gooseneck trailer, the truck would "feel" it the exact same way. Up to the point where the trailer actually flips.
I thought the same thing... Only thing that is that load is drill pipe... Other then that it's horse trailers. Campers or better yet equipment.... Put a tractor on it and do it... Although this is better then what it used to
Nice vid. I'm a ram guy, I own 5 different models for my company. But... It would be great if all the OEM's told consumers...oh yeah we can charge you $60-$80K for your new truck off the showroom floor BUT it's illegal as hell for you to actually tow the weight you just paid to tow. Any trailer over 10,0000 lbs requires a Class A CDL commercial drivers license. It would be really nice if there manufactures got together to lobby Congress to change the federal law that's over 30 years old and outdated. To make it legal for home owners and business people to legally pull the trailer and weight their brand new $80,000 truck can safely pull. And stop making lawbreakers out of millions and millions of people every day.
I want to know what the frontal area is of the trailers used to test on the Davis Dam heat grade test here in AZ. It is one thing to tow at max with a flatbed loaded with concrete blocks or steel, and that same weight with a big frontal area like a RV or cargo trailer. That frontal area was the Achilles heal of the LLY Duramax. The cooling stack was way undersized and that series of engines would overheat. Guess how I know.
I didn't realize how detailed this towing testing is, great video very interesting. That Cummins is such a great engine, why does it only come in a Ram truck :(
@@davidharris9259 Uhhh 68RFE, airbags, and a self-ejecting tailgate would all disagree 🤣The truck is garbage. The engine is fine. Ford has the 6.0 and 6.4 meaning only the Duramax/Allison is the only one without a terrible history plus the IFS rides so much better.
Scott L no the only truck that is garbage is gm trucks, every gm truck I have had had transmission problems. Ifs the best that's your opinion. Government motors will always be last of the big 3 get over it.
@@davidharris9259 Keep in mind though Allison transmissions are completely different than the rest of the transmissions GM use. they're made for heavier duty vehicles (even seeing class 8 semis with them now)
@@davidharris9259 get over what? How many 6.4 Ford's still out there? Have you bulletproof a 6.0 powerstoke? I have. And when you Google 68RFE the first post is a forum asking not if but when it goes bad... You're smoking crack if you think gm is the worst.
@Quinn Lemon Even if the brakes kept the tires from rotating at 12° and it slid, that would be a fail on the test. Holding the truck and trailer steady is a pass.
Anyone else notice on the test of the parking brake going down hill, yes the brakes held but the truck still slid a few inches. Power to weight is gonna become an issue if its pushed much further
On the downhill, the trailer is leveraging weight off the rear axle. At some point in the not-too-distant future, truck manufacturers are going to have to switch to a hydraulic parking brake and use all axles, not just the rear.
@@thomabb ahh that makes sense. Didn't fully think of that and yes that makes sense for the way trucks will have to be held in the near future. Thanks for the thoughts.
@@tortue71 wrong. Semis have parking brakes on the trl as well as the truck. The pick up in the video passed. A semi with only one axle parking brake would be placed out of service and heavily fined.
@@stoney2732 two axles on tractor and two on the trailer, in semis four axles holding parking weight. That was actually impressive for the truck to hold that amount of weight back with only one axle of parking brake.
I literally watch hours of RUclips a day, while working or before bed. This is one of the best videos ive watched in years. Ive always wondered.. but now i know!
TFL had really humble beginnings and I've been watching them for years now! I can't wait to see the 2020 Super Duty on the IKE! Ps you'll probably love my channel if you're into cars and trucks
Great episode. Nice to see someone doing more than driving this stuff up and down the road giving their opinion of the vehicle. I though I recognized the engineering explained dude in the back seat.
Dear RUclips, Thank you so much for the crap ad's throughout every single video on your site. I can't stress how much I look forward to multiple interruptions when trying to watch content, especially when there are multiple ad's in short duration videos. Big thumbs up to you all, keep up the fantastic work! Sincerely, Blake
For a $11.99 a month, you can get RUclips premium and it's completely ad free. It's definitely worth the cost to me. I watch RUclips daily and it's so nice not having ads:)
might want to look at PCmatic ... thats what i use and i never see the ads from youtube ... even when watching one of the movies that says free with ads
You should do a video on How Ford does it I’m curious to see how they stack up next to each other Ram vs Ford especially on the uphill stop and go test Curious to see Fords V8 Powerstroke again Rams in-line 6 Cummins ???🤔🤔🤔
So I would presume if it fails any of the tests, they either lower the weight or adjust the tow vehicle? This would explain why you can have more horsepower or torque than a competitor but a lower tow rating.
HEY TFL I don't know if you guys have checked but Ford has the configurator up & running for the 2020 F150 but it's kind of wonky because they haven't even revealed the truck yet and if you check out fords website you will see what I mean.
I love the interior of that ram .i have a 2012 ram 3500 manual transmission i love it tows anything i put at it. Had 3 f-3500 2 automatics and 1 manual . All 7.3s the only ones i bought.
I enjoyed the video, but REALLY wanted more from that "sway" test. That is not anywhere close to an "evasive" maneuver. I see NO place where someone would swerve 6 inches...Yank that thing over a full lane, simulating avoiding a vehicle, then tell me how it handles the weight.
So what would happen if you actually need to brake from a highway speed? Would the brakes melt and not work? But still get a pass because it was able to do the 20-0 test. No real obstacle avoidance test? I undestand you can tow 30,000, but it does not seem safe in any challenging situation with a tow vehicle like this.
Ohh just have to add this on, a combination of Exhaust Braking, Engine Braking, and using the Truck and Trailer brakes would most definitely slow it down safely and 100% no overheating would occur.
kunu98 dude I know from real experience I bought a 2013 6.7 powerstroke stock man it was slow slow went to China some stuff fell off and now she pulls like a runaway train
So it’s not another pass liar. The rear tire started sliding so he hit the brake pedal to apply all brakes. You can also see the brake light up from the front of the trailer it’s a reflection. when the rear brake did not work when he came from down the hill. 7:59-8:02. Ram is a respectable company and should not be liars like that. And shame on this RUclips channel for supporting liars...
Is there a minimum tow rating for the trucks they don't test? Because the new HD Suburban had several upgrades (3.73 to 4.10, larger axles, bigger brakes) yet the tow ratings are now less than the payload rating. Only full-size vehicle I know to have a payload rating higher than the tow rating.
I remember when the F350 and the other 1 ton trucks came out with a 10k gooseneck towing capacity (cant remember the year, late 80's early 90's maybe) and I thought that was pretty insane considering the trucks I grew up around (I'm 46). I can remember riding with my Dad as we pulled a camper with a C10 Chevy and it was dicey at times. Fast forward to today and my camper that's much heavier, my F150 doesn't really even work hard to pull it. Engineering is pretty cool.
jmurphy1973 I have a 97 F-350 my Dad ordered it in 96. I was with him and did the camper package, off road package, 7.3, standard, 4x4, and 4.11’s in a XLT trim. I was amazed then at 10,000 lbs for a trailer towing. Now it’s my truck and it’s slow by today’s standards it’s funny actually. I will keep it as long as I’m alive.
I know id love to see those old trucks put thru these tests, to see the real towing capacities of them. I own a old gmc 1 ton. It can pull a house, but the stopping and turning, and handling is another story
@@JAMESWUERTELE We bought a brand new '96 F250 PSD that we thought was the shizz, and for '96 it was. Pulled a 20' tandem axle trailer with it every day and it never gave us any trouble. Loved that thing.
Yup slapped some more leaf springs on my old dually 12 valve thing tows 20k like its nobody's business still using old tech from back in the day just with some engine mods.
Why dont you do a real test and put a backhoe on that trailer and go drive up on i80 with the wind blowing 50mph at you for miles and then go up and over the sisters or up fancy gap. Hell theres no wind drag on your trailer there bud
Hey there my friends at Tfl this May be unpopular but how about a comparison of American full size vans? ProMaster Transit, does Chevy still make the express? Come on Van people help out here!
Huh. Maybe this is the real reason the Chevy/GMC goose neck hitch is just a smidge behind the rear axle? That would reduce potential oversteer and turn it into understeer to comply with the test.....
The only problem with this test is the trailer it is towing. That is an absolute ideal load. They need to use a box trailer as well. Wind resistance on the front of the trailer and side winds are the real challenges when reaching maximum towing capacity. I bet with half that weight an a full 40ft 5th wheel the driver would feel way less comfortable towing.
you guys should add a real world braking test to go along with the Ike Gauntlet. something like 45 to zero without trailer brakes to get a pure result of the trucks ability. if you used standard weights on the trailer we could compare different brands. they all have the power to go uphill, but stopping is a lot more important.
Thanks for the info on how they do the SAE testing. But what is the power brake deal to load the turbo? Customers just put there trucks in gear and go.
So ok it's good to see that without trailer brakes the truck will stop that load BUT that was only from 20-0mph on flat ground. I wanna see if it can stop that load without trailer brakes going down a 7% grade going anywhere between 40-50mph within a reasonable distance.
Yo Dodge needs to seriously upgrade the number of gears in there Transmission, 6 just isn't cutting it anymore, not when the competition is moving onwards and upwards.
Ram has enough gears to get the same and better MPG as GM and Ford, better hill climbing ability, and better engine brake. Why do you need so many gears? Let me answer, sales gimmick
“A lot of weight on a really steep hill. How are we going to do that?” Well, 1000lb-ft of torque through a torque converter (torque multiplier) and a gearbox (more torque multiplication). No worries, mate.
Another awesome vid, thank you Inwould love to see tye Dam test in 110 degree weather.....I have towed in that kinda heat and its always a lil sketchy when pulling grades. At least in my truck.....I am seriously considering purchasing a 2020-21 Ram 3500 HO with the Aisin with 4:10 gears......I am currently towing a 16K 5th wheel with an 06 Ford F350 with the 6.0..Its at 140K miles on it.....I have been very lucky so far.....but its starting show her age.....SO, I am looking to go with dodge versus back to Ford I am really impressed with what Dodge has done.
the downhill parking brake test looked scary. did you notice the truck slide about an inch before it gripped. The 3500 could easily pull a 50k lb trailer but its the brakes that would never last. RAM has the best exhaust brake.
I’m glad the manufacturers use a standard test for towing ratings now. Years ago it was a crap shoot if the numbers were realistic. But I’m shocked to find out the braking test is done from 20 mph. I want to know that I can stop while going downhill at 65 mph. Is it possible for you to add a highway speed braking test to the Ike gauntlet? Thanks for these informative videos.
Robert Richardson -Wow what an intelligent response. My point is that these tests are standardized across manufacturers to provide customers with confidence that trucks will perform a certain way in certain conditions. Maybe the Ram 3500 will still meet the time standard with the load without brake torquing, but also it may not. Does Ram state in its towing guide for the driver to brake torque the engine while towing loads over X amount? I highly doubt it.
If you're going to take off hard, brake toque alittle so as not to shock the drive tran.you just jab the gas with that much weight you are likely to break something.
I'll always remember this guy in my hometown in Llano Texas that worked on diesels. He had his ram so suped up, he could burn tires while going 70mph down the road.
6:37 I see they're still putting absolute JUNK for tires on. Got a brand new 2015 ram 3500 mega cab only had 10KM's when i bought it..... came with those SHIT! Nexens, only lasted 25,000 KM's.... complete JUNK on a $90,000 dollar truck. My tire guy convinced me to put Toyo CT's on, they've been awesome!
Standardized tests that allow us to compare manufacturers’ “Tow Rating.” Okay, “Tow Rating” is still an irrelevant marketing tool and TFL is promoting this manufacturers’ BS number. Towing Rating is NEVER the limiting factor in what you can tow...”Payload Capacity” is. The payload capacity of an average 1/2 ton pickup is about 1500 lbs. Subtract the weight of the driver and three passenger, and you’re down to 700 lbs. Then subtract the tongue weight of a nominal, 6K lb boat (15% x 6K lbs = 900 lbs), and guess what, you’ve exceeded your max payload. You haven’t even included your skis, pull toy or vacation gear. And if you’re in an accident overweight, expect to be cited for it and forget about your insurance company covering any damage or injury claims. PAYLOAD is the critical number, not TOW RATING. And manufacturers do their best to hide that fact. They advertise Tow Rating, but there’s only one place you can find Payload...the door jam. It’s not on any literature, website or dealer data base. And every vehicle has a different Payload Capacity based on GVWR and equipment. Hey TFL, how about educating buyers, not just entertaining them. The high percentage of overloaded rigs on our highways should tell you an education is needed.
These SAE derived tests are PERFORMANCE tests. Not strength, nor yield or point of failure. Just keep that in mind. Its actually in the SAE towing spec TITLE which is precisely; Performance Requirements for Determining Tow-Vehicle Gross Combination Weight Rating and Trailer Weight Rating
Had a 2012 Dodge Ram dually. Cummins engine and at 73,000 miles it was complete garbage. Now before all you douche bags get loud let me explain to you what happened. First and foremost it was always dealer serviced right down to the oil changes, and always on time. I paid $52k for it brand new. Wasn’t taking any chances. I towed a 12,000lb trailer daily sometimes 300 miles in a day sometimes 50. But always had my trailer full of my tools with me at all times. Never and I mean never unhooked it. 2013 transmission went bad 21,xxx miles. Replaced by dodge dealer. 2013 starter went bad replaced by dealer. 2014 rear end needed to be replaced at 44,000. 2015 transmission was literally falling out of truck. Yes had to be towed was separating from motor. Dealer replaced everything that was damaged. 2015 computer went bad 48,000 miles. Truck had some minor stuff go wrong in 2016 headlights burned out 4x4 stopped working, transmission lines were leaking. U joints ect. 2017 transmission went bad again. Traded truck in and bought a Toyota Tundra. Still tow the same trailer everyday. Nothing different. Other than oil changes nothing has gone wrong with my new truck and it’s going on 70,000 miles now. Dodge Ram 3500 is junk. I’ve done the same job that the dodge diesel dually couldn’t do daily with a Toyota and with not a single issue. For all you haters I tow a 7x14 dual wheel enclosed trailer loaded with tools. Kx-08 mini excavator shovels pipe, d boxes pry bars. Everything you could think of to repair septics.
@1:10 I want to ask that man a question. Why is it that my 2008 Dodge ram 2500 SLT longhorn long bed four-door 8 foot bed 2wd can only two 8900 pounds! With my 6.7 L turbo diesel Cummins six speed manual transmission, G 56! But yet my 2017 ram 1500 SLT 4 door short bed 4x4 5.7 L hemi can tow the same weight!! It does not make any sense! Also why is it that people with the 2008 same everything that I have. They tow close to 18,000 pounds! That is double the weight that the truck is rated for. And they have no issues whatsoever!
I know there is a payload thread below, but I really want to know what the payload is on this trailer. This truck probably has a payload capacity of 5300 pounds. Conventional wisdom says that gooseneck payloads are calculated at 20 to 25% total trailer weight depending on how it is loaded. So if they are towing 31,000 X 20% that equals 6200 pounds payload. I hope I am proven wrong but aren't these guys overloaded during this test? Did I miss something obvious?
I own a Ram 3500. That chattering taking off from mid hill is the driveshaft. I can't believe they still haven't fixed it. Brought mine in several times for that. They just keep it for the day and give it back. Eventually, you just get tired of wasting your time and live with it. The cure is a one piece driveshaft that has no joint in it. You have to buy it from a custom supplier. The CEV joint binds under a large load and transmits a vibration to the truck. Piss poor design.
Nice, test by committee of computer jockeys who don't tow for a living. Test numbers are arbitrary and capricious. Trailer used has low center of gravity compared to cargo or horse trailer. Brake tests are important but acceleration tests are not realistic since they assume mega-HP. e.g. a Freightliner m-2 weighs a lot more than this truck and has less HP yet I would rather have the m-2. Let's be realistic here - manufacturers state tow ratings for liability and warranty purposes. On another note: the 3.0 duramax has a low tow rating compared to ford and ram because it is limited by cooling (an admission by GM) capacity, not physical ability to handle the weight - which means their truck is under cooled - a fatal flaw for any vehicle design - you would think they would have learned from experience over the years, but no.
Maybe posted already but too many comments. I'm looking for a 2020. Which trim models/options does it take to get the 31k towing capacity? Dually obviously. TIA
Nice lil 2” slide there at 08:00! 😎👍🏾 10:54 Those fronts sure deflected alot to be considered smooth tho man. Driver says smooth no prob in a few secs…🤦🏾♂️Look at the tires wobble
![NOSFERATU - Official Trailer [HD] - Only In Theaters December 25](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/nulvWqYUM8k/mqdefault.jpg)
That was very interesting. I totally enjoyed the video and much thanks to you Tommy, your cameraman an TFL.
I felt bad that he said a videographer rather than Richard
Who's the creep in the back seat?! Great work Tommy!
Engineering Explained CIA trailer division!!!
Engineering Explained oh it is EE lol
I came to the comments to see why both of you posted a similar video simultaneously. I know what I'm doing next. Best for last
Who’s that creep in the front passenger ;) Thanks for working on this with us Jason, pleasure as always!
Also SAE J2807 is not the only standard they are probably testing and adhering to, there are far more standards in question here. SAE J266, J684, J1491, J2638, J135, J134, J2664 which likely remain unmentioned? Perhaps even some ISO standards too?
this dodge ad is way better than those "real people" chevy ads.
They get it, doin what ford has done for almost ten years. They should all showcase testing.
Let’s be honest it isn’t hard to beat that when it comes to truth or believe ability
@@derekwood3189lol like the million pound towing capacity on an electric f 150.
A lol I'm die hard chevy but I'll take the Cummins over the durajunk any day of the week I guess that's the trucker in me
@@Dachamp2001 Especially since its a straight 6. The V8s have more top end but you want that low end torque and straight 6 reliability.
The rams engineers voice makes me wanna drive a truck 15x more
chad mode
The truck actually slid on the downhill when the emergency brake was on.
You caught that also
Big Injun just a little, stills very safety
@@sergiovazquez398 and it's a steeper test than what they are supposed to do anyway, but on a wet surface, might be a different story. That's a hell of a lot of weight to be held by the rear tires alone. Never forget your wheel chucks.
If you've got to park that much weight on a grade like that, you'd be remiss not to have wheel chocks for the trailer and truck.
Big Injun it slid but the brakes held. So the test passed
I would really like to see you guysmake "Payloads" as a regular part of yor reviews. Payload is much more important to me than towing. Be it a slide-in camper or hauling construction stuff around.
Agree. Now that you mention it, it seems payload isn't really tested much anywhere that I've seen.
Seriously my boss was trying to drop an 1800 pound crate in the back of my chevy 1500. I said no.
@@BeachJedi101 2000 lb payloads aren't unheard of in the half ton range. my dad loaded 2100 lbs of stone into his once. the truck won't enjoy it but it can absolutely be done
@Todd S Thank you Todd. I was thinking that even though towing at max capacities, due to the hitch/tongue distribution the vehicle is not at its max payload. Furthermore, in the video, the weight is centered over the rear axel. What about when your entire bed is taken up by cargo and you need to shift lanes? I would think that there will be a much more significant shift of weight from side to side make vehicle more unstable. Also, what about if you carry max payload even with the top of the cab? Then the center of gravity changes and leading to the vehicle behaving differently as well. Just a few thoughts.
That’s hard to do since payload varies so much depending on trim and equipment, it would be since for them to mention it though
“ we want this to be exactly as the customer would operate the vehicle”
Brake torques pulling 31,000 pounds.
Dane Pittman cause every time I tow 31,000 pounds I break torque it every time I stop and floor it
I take it you never towed heavy on an incline. It's not brake torque as if you were getting ready to launch for a race, it's applying forward motion and torque to the wheels to prevent the entire rig from rolling backwards when releasing the brakes. What they did is quite normal for heavy towing since there is never enough torque at idle, no matter how powerful the engine is, to overcome the weight.
Would be even better if you understood that vehicles have BRAKES and not BREAKS...nothing was broken in the test...
@@buckhorncortez was thinking the same thing... does that mean they stay there til something brakes and then hammer it? or hold the brakes, hammer down, and go. otherwise, no idea what Break Torquing is. ;)
@@buckhorncortez ha ha ha
Let’s talk about temps?
Longevity?
Can this happen 1,000 times?
I’d love to see an up/down torture test for 24 hours.
Duh it's a Ram. A Ford would have broke down just hooking a trailer to it.
I dont care what brand it is. The BS exhaust systems are the garbage leveling the playing field cause them all issues
@@muds17 the exhaust systems are steadily improving but still aren't where they need to be
@@sho942000 it's funny how half the new ram owners I know that tow heavy have had to replace their aisin transmission already
Chris Beatty cough* bullshit *cough!
I watch all of y’all’s videos and I have to say this was one of the best ones yet. This was awesome content to see how these manufacturers determine their numbers. Huge shoutout to FCA for all of these behind the scenes videos they have allowed y’all to do and for breaking down exactly how they do it.
William Mathew - Couldn’t agree more. It’s neat to see the manufacturers starting to integrate/interact with the well-known RUclips community for better sharing of information. Special thanks to FCA here for spending the time and money to do this for us.
When you drive past the Chelsea proving grounds, unless you read the signage you think it is a prison.
kinda like the Eaton proving grounds in Marshall 20 years ago
It kinda is Hell for those trucks being tested.
At 8:20 his “this” was equal to that of a Doug DeMuro 😂😂
Lmaoooo
I thought my video changed!!
Tim S me too 😩😂
thats too funny lmao
That test going around the circle at 50 mph is a flawed test since they are using a low center of gravity flat bed with flat steel plates to keep the center of gravity unrealistically low, no one tows that trailer setup, do a big box trailer or a heavy 5th wheel camper and I guarantee that truck can't handle high sided trailers in those corners at that speed. They are really just wanting to keep pushing the tow ratings higher and higher aren't they?
In a truck-trailer combo, the truck doesn't prevent the trailer from a rollover. With a gooseneck, the trailer only exerts a single point of force (at the ball). The hitch and ball has total degree of freedom.
With a tall gooseneck trailer, the truck would "feel" it the exact same way. Up to the point where the trailer actually flips.
I thought the same thing... Only thing that is that load is drill pipe... Other then that it's horse trailers. Campers or better yet equipment.... Put a tractor on it and do it... Although this is better then what it used to
Nice vid. I'm a ram guy, I own 5 different models for my company. But... It would be great if all the OEM's told consumers...oh yeah we can charge you $60-$80K for your new truck off the showroom floor BUT it's illegal as hell for you to actually tow the weight you just paid to tow. Any trailer over 10,0000 lbs requires a Class A CDL commercial drivers license. It would be really nice if there manufactures got together to lobby Congress to change the federal law that's over 30 years old and outdated. To make it legal for home owners and business people to legally pull the trailer and weight their brand new $80,000 truck can safely pull. And stop making lawbreakers out of millions and millions of people every day.
This☝🏻
Proudly Made in Mexico 🇲🇽
Sergio Vazquez a huevo
I want to know what the frontal area is of the trailers used to test on the Davis Dam heat grade test here in AZ. It is one thing to tow at max with a flatbed loaded with concrete blocks or steel, and that same weight with a big frontal area like a RV or cargo trailer. That frontal area was the Achilles heal of the LLY Duramax. The cooling stack was way undersized and that series of engines would overheat. Guess how I know.
Check out the video around 9:01 -- they put up a chart from the J2807 standard which has the minimal frontal area depending on weight of the trailer.
I didn't realize how detailed this towing testing is, great video very interesting.
That Cummins is such a great engine, why does it only come in a Ram truck :(
sfakach t because ram is the best truck out there. Best engine for the best truck ,Ram number 1.
@@davidharris9259 Uhhh 68RFE, airbags, and a self-ejecting tailgate would all disagree 🤣The truck is garbage. The engine is fine. Ford has the 6.0 and 6.4 meaning only the Duramax/Allison is the only one without a terrible history plus the IFS rides so much better.
Scott L no the only truck that is garbage is gm trucks, every gm truck I have had had transmission problems. Ifs the best that's your opinion. Government motors will always be last of the big 3 get over it.
@@davidharris9259 Keep in mind though Allison transmissions are completely different than the rest of the transmissions GM use. they're made for heavier duty vehicles (even seeing class 8 semis with them now)
@@davidharris9259 get over what? How many 6.4 Ford's still out there? Have you bulletproof a 6.0 powerstoke? I have. And when you Google 68RFE the first post is a forum asking not if but when it goes bad... You're smoking crack if you think gm is the worst.
The truck slides at 8:02
you can actually see the brake lights come on and the slide only stopping once the hydroboost brakes are applied.
starts sliding as soon as the brakes are released and stops once the hit them again. Although if the test is 12% grade it probably would have held.
@Quinn Lemon You dont say!
Just a little, but still very safety
@Quinn Lemon Even if the brakes kept the tires from rotating at 12° and it slid, that would be a fail on the test. Holding the truck and trailer steady is a pass.
Anyone else notice on the test of the parking brake going down hill, yes the brakes held but the truck still slid a few inches. Power to weight is gonna become an issue if its pushed much further
Semi's don't have much traction in this case either...
On the downhill, the trailer is leveraging weight off the rear axle. At some point in the not-too-distant future, truck manufacturers are going to have to switch to a hydraulic parking brake and use all axles, not just the rear.
@@thomabb ahh that makes sense. Didn't fully think of that and yes that makes sense for the way trucks will have to be held in the near future. Thanks for the thoughts.
@@tortue71 wrong. Semis have parking brakes on the trl as well as the truck.
The pick up in the video passed.
A semi with only one axle parking brake would be placed out of service and heavily fined.
@@stoney2732 two axles on tractor and two on the trailer, in semis four axles holding parking weight.
That was actually impressive for the truck to hold that amount of weight back with only one axle of parking brake.
I really like that TFL and Engineering Explained are doing videos together!
I literally watch hours of RUclips a day, while working or before bed. This is one of the best videos ive watched in years. Ive always wondered.. but now i know!
TFL had really humble beginnings and I've been watching them for years now! I can't wait to see the 2020 Super Duty on the IKE! Ps you'll probably love my channel if you're into cars and trucks
Great episode. Nice to see someone doing more than driving this stuff up and down the road giving their opinion of the vehicle. I though I recognized the engineering explained dude in the back seat.
Dear RUclips,
Thank you so much for the crap ad's throughout every single video on your site. I can't stress how much I look forward to multiple interruptions when trying to watch content, especially when there are multiple ad's in short duration videos. Big thumbs up to you all, keep up the fantastic work!
Sincerely,
Blake
For a $11.99 a month, you can get RUclips premium and it's completely ad free. It's definitely worth the cost to me. I watch RUclips daily and it's so nice not having ads:)
might want to look at PCmatic ... thats what i use and i never see the ads from youtube ... even when watching one of the movies that says free with ads
I just make a promise not to buy whatever product they advertise.
you do realize thats how the content creators get paid?
Blake Nivelt you’re literally getting this content for at no cost to you.
Thank you tfl for breaking this test down for us , very impressive !!!!!!
7:42. A LOT of people rewatched that to see that truck start to slide!!! i wouldnt say thats a pass but it is 3% more grade.
The lift on the front of the truck at 6:12 was amazing to see. I really thought the front end was gonna come off the ground.
You should do a video on How Ford does it I’m curious to see how they stack up next to each other Ram vs Ford especially on the uphill stop and go test Curious to see Fords V8 Powerstroke again Rams in-line 6 Cummins ???🤔🤔🤔
Must be the same since they all agreed on these standards.
So I would presume if it fails any of the tests, they either lower the weight or adjust the tow vehicle? This would explain why you can have more horsepower or torque than a competitor but a lower tow rating.
Killer B The Cummins it’s better than others
HEY TFL I don't know if you guys have checked but Ford has the configurator up & running for the 2020 F150 but it's kind of wonky because they haven't even revealed the truck yet and if you check out fords website you will see what I mean.
I love the interior of that ram .i have a 2012 ram 3500 manual transmission i love it tows anything i put at it. Had 3 f-3500 2 automatics and 1 manual . All 7.3s the only ones i bought.
I enjoyed the video, but REALLY wanted more from that "sway" test. That is not anywhere close to an "evasive" maneuver. I see NO place where someone would swerve 6 inches...Yank that thing over a full lane, simulating avoiding a vehicle, then tell me how it handles the weight.
So what would happen if you actually need to brake from a highway speed? Would the brakes melt and not work? But still get a pass because it was able to do the 20-0 test. No real obstacle avoidance test? I undestand you can tow 30,000, but it does not seem safe in any challenging situation with a tow vehicle like this.
Exhaust breaking would be taking some of the work from the brakes. These newer trucks have an automatic exhaust braking system.
Ohh just have to add this on, a combination of Exhaust Braking, Engine Braking, and using the Truck and Trailer brakes would most definitely slow it down safely and 100% no overheating would occur.
@@MurphysLawIsAGod i still won't feel safe letting any dumbass tow 30k with just a pickup going over
60 mphs
That amount of weight should have an air brake truck pulling that loaded
My thoughts exactly. Even a single screw freightshaker would be an improvement.
Imagine if the truck was deleted...🥰
Not sure how the delete would change the parking brake test.
ZEUS6.7 I was wondering how’d it preform if deleted. Engine could breath and prob be a breeze
Constable wow you’re smart. It wouldn’t but on the test that rely on power and exhaust breaking it makes a big difference.
kunu98 dude I know from real experience I bought a 2013 6.7 powerstroke stock man it was slow slow went to China some stuff fell off and now she pulls like a runaway train
@@Constabruity probably help because the dpf weighs so much...
So it’s not another pass liar. The rear tire started sliding so he hit the brake pedal to apply all brakes. You can also see the brake light up from the front of the trailer it’s a reflection. when the rear brake did not work when he came from down the hill. 7:59-8:02. Ram is a respectable company and should not be liars like that. And shame on this RUclips channel for supporting liars...
The new F250 with the 6.7L POWERSTROKE V8 450 HP AND 1,050 LB-FT can do that wayyy better then that shitty Ram
Hey man
Get a Better Trailer.
Get a Trailer with HYDRAULIC brakes.
Electric brakes are a Joke
Who is the video guy or girl? Give them a shoutout TFL. LOL
I noticed they didn’t have it in “tow/haul” mode. I find that interesting, why didn’t they talk about that?
Is there a minimum tow rating for the trucks they don't test? Because the new HD Suburban had several upgrades (3.73 to 4.10, larger axles, bigger brakes) yet the tow ratings are now less than the payload rating. Only full-size vehicle I know to have a payload rating higher than the tow rating.
Very cool nice to see that they’re testing
7:56 Brake holds, but tires loose grip
I remember when the F350 and the other 1 ton trucks came out with a 10k gooseneck towing capacity (cant remember the year, late 80's early 90's maybe) and I thought that was pretty insane considering the trucks I grew up around (I'm 46).
I can remember riding with my Dad as we pulled a camper with a C10 Chevy and it was dicey at times.
Fast forward to today and my camper that's much heavier, my F150 doesn't really even work hard to pull it. Engineering is pretty cool.
jmurphy1973 I have a 97 F-350 my Dad ordered it in 96. I was with him and did the camper package, off road package, 7.3, standard, 4x4, and 4.11’s in a XLT trim. I was amazed then at 10,000 lbs for a trailer towing. Now it’s my truck and it’s slow by today’s standards it’s funny actually. I will keep it as long as I’m alive.
I know id love to see those old trucks put thru these tests, to see the real towing capacities of them. I own a old gmc 1 ton. It can pull a house, but the stopping and turning, and handling is another story
@@JAMESWUERTELE We bought a brand new '96 F250 PSD that we thought was the shizz, and for '96 it was. Pulled a 20' tandem axle trailer with it every day and it never gave us any trouble. Loved that thing.
Yup slapped some more leaf springs on my old dually 12 valve thing tows 20k like its nobody's business still using old tech from back in the day just with some engine mods.
Hey Ram...get engineers that use MPH and you'll build better trucks.
Why dont you do a real test and put a backhoe on that trailer and go drive up on i80 with the wind blowing 50mph at you for miles and then go up and over the sisters or up fancy gap. Hell theres no wind drag on your trailer there bud
Because tommys babysitter won't allow it.
Hey there my friends at Tfl this May be unpopular but how about a comparison of American full size vans? ProMaster Transit, does Chevy still make the express? Come on Van people help out here!
Huh. Maybe this is the real reason the Chevy/GMC goose neck hitch is just a smidge behind the rear axle? That would reduce potential oversteer and turn it into understeer to comply with the test.....
8:00 it started sliding down the hill a bit, still held it though!
meters?? what country are we in?? i thought we were in the land of the free not communist china
wow
the parking brake skidded a little but held!
incredivle
I love to race with my gooseneck from a dig. Seems feasible lol
The only problem with this test is the trailer it is towing. That is an absolute ideal load. They need to use a box trailer as well. Wind resistance on the front of the trailer and side winds are the real challenges when reaching maximum towing capacity. I bet with half that weight an a full 40ft 5th wheel the driver would feel way less comfortable towing.
you guys should add a real world braking test to go along with the Ike Gauntlet. something like 45 to zero without trailer brakes to get a pure result of the trucks ability. if you used standard weights on the trailer we could compare different brands. they all have the power to go uphill, but stopping is a lot more important.
At 7:57 the truck slides for a couple seconds down the hill. Look closely.
Thanks for the info on how they do the SAE testing. But what is the power brake deal to load the turbo? Customers just put there trucks in gear and go.
So ok it's good to see that without trailer brakes the truck will stop that load BUT that was only from 20-0mph on flat ground. I wanna see if it can stop that load without trailer brakes going down a 7% grade going anywhere between 40-50mph within a reasonable distance.
It probably wouldn't be able to. That's a very unreasonable expectation.
Trailer axles that far apart, it will never sway.
the trl was 3 axle also
The ram engineer guy has got to be the one in the truck commercials
Great video, but I have never nor do I know anyone who brakes torques there trucks to get them moving???
Yo Dodge needs to seriously upgrade the number of gears in there Transmission, 6 just isn't cutting it anymore, not when the competition is moving onwards and upwards.
More gears doesn't mean a better outcome.
Ram has enough gears to get the same and better MPG as GM and Ford, better hill climbing ability, and better engine brake. Why do you need so many gears? Let me answer, sales gimmick
Want.more gears buy a semi.
12:31 Over-steer would result in a "jack-knife", correct?
Yes the trailer will want to keep moving forward, it will simply push the rear of the truck out of it's way and spin it around.
Ok cool but what about a #dirtroad with braking 15% grade or on-ramp exit with potholes in the rain?
How can J2807 guarantee 100f temps over a 11 nile course? EVer driven a racecar and expect the track to be the same lap after lap?
“A lot of weight on a really steep hill. How are we going to do that?” Well, 1000lb-ft of torque through a torque converter (torque multiplier) and a gearbox (more torque multiplication). No worries, mate.
Another awesome vid, thank you Inwould love to see tye Dam test in 110 degree weather.....I have towed in that kinda heat and its always a lil sketchy when pulling grades. At least in my truck.....I am seriously considering purchasing a 2020-21 Ram 3500 HO with the Aisin with 4:10 gears......I am currently towing a 16K 5th wheel with an 06 Ford F350 with the 6.0..Its at 140K miles on it.....I have been very lucky so far.....but its starting show her age.....SO, I am looking to go with dodge versus back to Ford I am really impressed with what Dodge has done.
How much is first gear (mph)
the downhill parking brake test looked scary. did you notice the truck slide about an inch before it gripped. The 3500 could easily pull a 50k lb trailer but its the brakes that would never last. RAM has the best exhaust brake.
Great VIDEO. This allowed me to see just how they test these trucks as far as towing the Gross weight. Thanks for putting this out there!
Am i the only one wondering why are the lights flickering? Annoying as hell
Riho Hommik camera
I love these technical videos. it adds consumer confidence that these trucks really can perform exactly how they have prescribed.
Guy at 1:02 sounds like the guy who has his voice changed and face blurred in any crime documentary.
I’m glad the manufacturers use a standard test for towing ratings now. Years ago it was a crap shoot if the numbers were realistic. But I’m shocked to find out the braking test is done from 20 mph. I want to know that I can stop while going downhill at 65 mph. Is it possible for you to add a highway speed braking test to the Ike gauntlet? Thanks for these informative videos.
For a newer quieter Cummins, it sure sounds good. 😍
All these manufacturers did the same tests then the best truck really comes down to reliability in the long run
Thanks for clearing things up! We all look at the numbers but never really go in debt.
What is even more awesome is deleting the emission BS and give her a tune and watch it work. Its amazing what these trucks can do.
Please test RAM5500HD 4X4 LIMITED LET'S SEE HER MAXXED OUT🙂
Great Video however I don’t agree with them brake torquing the truck to achieve better times. This is not something the consumer will be doing.
Well the consumers will if they need better performance
@@danielboatright6977 ssssshhhhh. He thinks he knows better. Lol
Robert Richardson -Wow what an intelligent response.
My point is that these tests are standardized across manufacturers to provide customers with confidence that trucks will perform a certain way in certain conditions. Maybe the Ram 3500 will still meet the time standard with the load without brake torquing, but also it may not. Does Ram state in its towing guide for the driver to brake torque the engine while towing loads over X amount? I highly doubt it.
If you're going to take off hard, brake toque alittle so as not to shock the drive tran.you just jab the gas with that much weight you are likely to break something.
Oldsmobile 350 cid diesel car…0 to 60 in 60ish seconds. Without any trailer.
Murder of lil bug from 7:55 to 8:10
Perfect weather perfect conditions.
It would be nice if they used paneled trailers for campers ratings. In order to account for wind drag
Wind drag is a very big element, cross winds as well xan be a nightmare
Not only wind drag but having a higher profile for the little swerve test.
yoterbois be like: “my tandra with 12” lift and 33” tires on 20” turdpro alum wheels can out tow any chevyforddodge and still get 30mpg”
Ur full of shit. It gets the worst mpg like 16mpg highway. Nd its ugly.
Sorry i missread that
Im not a toyota fan
I lost brain cells reading that. What did the Toyota Tundra do to you?
@@jackdaniels2657 I can tell. Toyota does make some good trucks, however.
I'll always remember this guy in my hometown in Llano Texas that worked on diesels. He had his ram so suped up, he could burn tires while going 70mph down the road.
6:37 I see they're still putting absolute JUNK for tires on. Got a brand new 2015 ram 3500 mega cab only had 10KM's when i bought it..... came with those SHIT! Nexens, only lasted 25,000 KM's.... complete JUNK on a $90,000 dollar truck. My tire guy convinced me to put Toyo CT's on, they've been awesome!
Standardized tests that allow us to compare manufacturers’ “Tow Rating.” Okay, “Tow Rating” is still an irrelevant marketing tool and TFL is promoting this manufacturers’ BS number. Towing Rating is NEVER the limiting factor in what you can tow...”Payload Capacity” is. The payload capacity of an average 1/2 ton pickup is about 1500 lbs. Subtract the weight of the driver and three passenger, and you’re down to 700 lbs. Then subtract the tongue weight of a nominal, 6K lb boat (15% x 6K lbs = 900 lbs), and guess what, you’ve exceeded your max payload. You haven’t even included your skis, pull toy or vacation gear. And if you’re in an accident overweight, expect to be cited for it and forget about your insurance company covering any damage or injury claims. PAYLOAD is the critical number, not TOW RATING. And manufacturers do their best to hide that fact. They advertise Tow Rating, but there’s only one place you can find Payload...the door jam. It’s not on any literature, website or dealer data base. And every vehicle has a different Payload Capacity based on GVWR and equipment. Hey TFL, how about educating buyers, not just entertaining them. The high percentage of overloaded rigs on our highways should tell you an education is needed.
These SAE derived tests are PERFORMANCE tests. Not strength, nor yield or point of failure. Just keep that in mind. Its actually in the SAE towing spec TITLE which is precisely;
Performance Requirements for Determining Tow-Vehicle
Gross Combination Weight Rating and Trailer Weight Rating
Had a 2012 Dodge Ram dually. Cummins engine and at 73,000 miles it was complete garbage. Now before all you douche bags get loud let me explain to you what happened. First and foremost it was always dealer serviced right down to the oil changes, and always on time. I paid $52k for it brand new. Wasn’t taking any chances. I towed a 12,000lb trailer daily sometimes 300 miles in a day sometimes 50. But always had my trailer full of my tools with me at all times. Never and I mean never unhooked it. 2013 transmission went bad 21,xxx miles. Replaced by dodge dealer. 2013 starter went bad replaced by dealer. 2014 rear end needed to be replaced at 44,000. 2015 transmission was literally falling out of truck. Yes had to be towed was separating from motor. Dealer replaced everything that was damaged. 2015 computer went bad 48,000 miles. Truck had some minor stuff go wrong in 2016 headlights burned out 4x4 stopped working, transmission lines were leaking. U joints ect. 2017 transmission went bad again. Traded truck in and bought a Toyota Tundra. Still tow the same trailer everyday. Nothing different. Other than oil changes nothing has gone wrong with my new truck and it’s going on 70,000 miles now.
Dodge Ram 3500 is junk. I’ve done the same job that the dodge diesel dually couldn’t do daily with a Toyota and with not a single issue. For all you haters I tow a 7x14 dual wheel enclosed trailer loaded with tools. Kx-08 mini excavator shovels pipe, d boxes pry bars. Everything you could think of to repair septics.
@1:10 I want to ask that man a question. Why is it that my 2008 Dodge ram 2500 SLT longhorn long bed four-door 8 foot bed 2wd can only two 8900 pounds! With my 6.7 L turbo diesel Cummins six speed manual transmission, G 56! But yet my 2017 ram 1500 SLT 4 door short bed 4x4 5.7 L hemi can tow the same weight!! It does not make any sense! Also why is it that people with the 2008 same everything that I have. They tow close to 18,000 pounds! That is double the weight that the truck is rated for. And they have no issues whatsoever!
Even RAM workers hates the tow mirrors up
This is dodge trying to show that the Cummins is still good after the 6.7
Raptor867 every cummins that has came out is “good” prove me wrong
@@ThyBlackNeck Come to think of it, you're right.
The Cummins is the ONLY thing good about a Ram.
You mean Ram... The best truck in the industry and Ford and GM are trying to catch it as we speak.
Kimo Jon I’m talking about the fact the new power stroke beat the rams towing by 2k pounds
I know there is a payload thread below, but I really want to know what the payload is on this trailer. This truck probably has a payload capacity of 5300 pounds. Conventional wisdom says that gooseneck payloads are calculated at 20 to 25% total trailer weight depending on how it is loaded. So if they are towing 31,000 X 20% that equals 6200 pounds payload. I hope I am proven wrong but aren't these guys overloaded during this test? Did I miss something obvious?
A lot of fairly weak vehicles like the Blazer 2.8 V6 were rated for 5,000 lbs back in the day. It’s not like it has excellent brakes either.
I can't wait to buy this truck next year will do my trade In and save bout 10k or 15k or to put down. I WILL HAVE THIS TRUCK!!!🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
Truck falling apart already 7:04. Cummins good ram no
Never heard of Cummings is that new for 2019 ram
@@andrewandrew9856 lol must be...its in my comment
That was wheel slide due to tires slipping on the pavement rear locking. Careful, your ignorance is showing.
My next new truck will be a Ram, lol. This was a very impressive and entertaining video. Fyi, I'm a Chevy guy.
I own a Ram 3500. That chattering taking off from mid hill is the driveshaft. I can't believe they still haven't fixed it. Brought mine in several times for that. They just keep it for the day and give it back. Eventually, you just get tired of wasting your time and live with it. The cure is a one piece driveshaft that has no joint in it. You have to buy it from a custom supplier. The CEV joint binds under a large load and transmits a vibration to the truck. Piss poor design.
Nice, test by committee of computer jockeys who don't tow for a living. Test numbers are arbitrary and capricious. Trailer used has low center of gravity compared to cargo or horse trailer. Brake tests are important but acceleration tests are not realistic since they assume mega-HP. e.g. a Freightliner m-2 weighs a lot more than this truck and has less HP yet I would rather have the m-2. Let's be realistic here - manufacturers state tow ratings for liability and warranty purposes. On another note: the 3.0 duramax has a low tow rating compared to ford and ram because it is limited by cooling (an admission by GM) capacity, not physical ability to handle the weight - which means their truck is under cooled - a fatal flaw for any vehicle design - you would think they would have learned from experience over the years, but no.
Maybe posted already but too many comments. I'm looking for a 2020. Which trim models/options does it take to get the 31k towing capacity? Dually obviously. TIA
Nice lil 2” slide there at 08:00! 😎👍🏾
10:54 Those fronts sure deflected alot to be considered smooth tho man. Driver says smooth no prob in a few secs…🤦🏾♂️Look at the tires wobble
Would love to see an EGT gauge on one of these tests....
I would not have liked that when I did 30 minutes flat out with my diesel 1.4 liter 😂😂
I love my 2020 1500 Ram