Christine Emba and Richard Reeves on the crisis in American masculinity (Full Stream 7/12)
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- Опубликовано: 17 июн 2024
- In the book “Of Boys and Men,” Brookings fellow Richard Reeves argues there is a crisis in masculinity that has been magnified by economic and societal shifts. On Wednesday, July 12 at 9:30 a.m. ET, join Washington Post Live for a conversation with Reeves and Christine Emba, Post opinions columnist and author of "Rethinking Sex: A Provocation," about the evolution of American masculinity and social identity.
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As an old man, I think young men should spend more time in the mountains. Seriously.
I'm assuming that this statement is somewhat metaphorical, or at least the mountains can be substituted for a lake, the woods, a walk through the park, and so on. Lots of people live in places that are hundreds of miles away from mountainous regions. If you meant it literally, I guess that young men who don't have easy access to mountains are doomed.
Men AND women (from a woman who's spent a lot of time in the mountains, forests and fields!)
Mass confusion among Boys and Men is a serious issue of concern that needs to be addressed truthfully now.
Christine Emba's implied equation of Jordan Peterson with Andrew Tate is so intellectually dishonest that I am inclined to take anything she says with profound suspicion.
It's because they both say men should be strong and dangerous. She compares strong hyper masculine men to cavemen and advocates for a softer, nicer toned down version of masculinity. She believes men should be more like women.
@@zinknot she is educated yet seems unaware that many women find dangerous or “hyper masculine” men to be very attractive .. that is hilarious that we can’t admit basic truths that we’ve known for centuries
The problem begins in elementary school because we keep trying to get them to behave nicely “like the girls.”
Maybe they should behave nicely
Maybe they shouldn't because girls are being taught to fight
@@rebeccajaron Exactly!
@@rebeccajaronMaybe women should understand that their own notion of pro-social behavior is not the only notion of pro-social behavior. Your attitude is emblematic of exactly the problem at hand.
You are describing "toxic teaching". This fixation on diminishing the actual disctinction between men and women that is ground in inate attributes and convincing girls your are only successful if you become more like a man as you grow up.
This was a waste of time...men know what to do & are not falling for the propoganda hit piece.
It’s funny to me that a gay man, a feminist and an apologist are here to lead men to the promise land. They are a joke.
The left is like here is a better version of masculinity, be a wimp that we have been conditioning you to be for years now. 😂
This discussion being had is within the context of a false premise. Reeves and Emba are feminist missionaries. Talk to Dr. Warren Farrell for an informed take on this issue.
🎯
Thank you for having this conversation
Serious question from a 54 yr old mom with a 28 yr old son and 3 daughters:
What is both your problem with Jordan Peterson? I find his messages helpful NOT only to my son but also for me.
Equating Jordan Peterson with Andrew Tate is ridiculous!
I am a man and I appreciate the work of Emba and other feminist writers.
In a different video which does not allow comments, Emba said that among her respondants, women are more likely to say that dating is harder now than it was ten years ago. She also quotes a woman who said, "She ordered a man from Tinder." Yes, for most women, dating apps can be similar to ordering a specific kind of man from Amazon. Few men have it that way. I understand that that might sound ideal for men, but not for women, but it is strange that more women think dating is harder now.
I think that women are just so accustomed to thinking that their lives are worse than men's, and men have learned not to complain.
It's the same thing from different perspectives. The woman wants a date, but can only get a hookup. The man wants a woman, but only a few men among many are chosen.
Glad I found a wife before Tinder. (On eHarmony! Is that still a thing?)
@@NathanPKI’d add this that women want the man, they’ve been told that sky is your limit. In reality we all should strive for sky, but be appreciative of the fact that in for example ‘dating market’ it would not be the case.
@@amirdm8235 Very true. This is something I hope to impress upon my kids: figure out what really matters and what is nice but not needed. Much of the online advice seems to focus on the superficial--looks, earning power--and maximizing those. But one should do is maximize character--trustworthiness, emotional stability, compatibility, etc--over a baseline of looks and economics. After all, looks fade (both both of you), and earnings can be subject to external factors (luck, illness, economy), but character will see you through the years. Especially honesty and integrity.
A man invented Tinder.
@@Missmarymac012 So? I don't understand your point.
"The left doesn't care about men." It couldn't have been summarized more succinctly and on point. That realization, as well as watching feminism destroy marriage and the family in the West, has pushed me and many of my peers to the middle politically.
Are you kidding me? It's left-leaning researchers who have elevated the problem of boys and men being rudderless in the age of women having claimed their rights, whose work has inspired the many efforts to ALSO focus on boys especially to help them find their place in the world that doesn't fall into the old constrictive framework.
They are reaping what they sow. 😂
@ronh: The idea that feminism doesn't care about men is a cuck-servative sentiment that has a nanoscopic basis in reality. And they literally said as much in this discussion. The idea that it is true, however, that feminism as a whole doesn't care about men is pushing some men to _`the middle`,_ is a pretty intense and excruciating lie! Because, it's not _`the middle`,_ politically or otherwise, that they are being pushed to. What we have seen with the social media influencers of Jordan Peterson, Andrew _`Taint`_ and, many years, in fact, before both of those two...with people like Rush Limbaugh and Lyndon LaRouche, is that men are being pushed to(wards) and fully into the arms of white supremacy, such as that of the alt-right.
So, intentionally or unintentionally, you are lying.
The left pretends there is no such thing as “male or female nature”.. they think everything is a social construct thus men and women can just be molded into any type of behavior we want .. this is complete nonsense and it has really warped modern dating . Good luck trying to fix this
Masculine standards were never bad. It's just that most of us can't or don't want to reach them, anymore, so we want to think they're bad.
You hit the nail on the head.
WA Post please just make sure Amazon drivers don't pee in bottles. Thank you
Jordan Peterson has been an excellent mentor for many men!
key word there "has been". Nowadays, he's just another loon, ranting and raving on Twitter.
I wish she hadn’t used Jordan Peterson and Andrew Tate in the same sentence.
@@erinc9672
Exactly !
@@charlesmiv3842 Not!
@@erinc9672this was Totally intentional and they will never learn or care why young men listen to Peterson. They just paint him as this alt right boogeyman because he helped bring young men back to a classic healthy version of masculinity by identifying a problem that the left refused to talk about and then giving them solid advise on how to conduct themselves. He’s effective because he speaks the truth and it drives them nuts.
Blend..Qualities..of Men & Women. .Together..!..
Impossible to Abandon masculinity..!!..Watch Roofers...Construction workers..No complaints in Horrble conditions..!!.Amazing Strengths in Men..!!..ok for both sexes to be Strong.& sensative..!
Oh good. "How to fix men 2.0". Spoiler alert. They need to be lead by a desire for sex and women because they are incapable of caring and deciding for themselves. News flash. Men spend time alone because it makes them happy. Not being criticized and judged constantly is just a bonus. They are social when they want and not when they don't - and they do not have to have a woman sign off their decision. For the first time in generations men have finally prioritized themselves first and the result is more societal labels that they are "lost". Shocking. The "Man problem" would go away if woman treated men the way women want to be treated, LIKE HUMAN BEINGS. But, please excuse men because they aren't waiting for that to happen.
Exactly! Men need to be relegated to manual, low level tasks women won't do.
@@magaman911 lol 🤣
I wish she hadn’t used Jordan Peterson and Andrew Tate in the same sentence.
They both suck
Exactly!
@@LK_Irelandit was totally intentional because anyone with a brain can tell Tate is a grifter douche. They want him guilty by just being mentioned in the same sentence with Tate
Powerful discussion START!@
To whom it may concern please purchase new equipment inside your newsroom that can work well for long distance thank you .
Listening to the joint interview with Christine Emba and Richard V Reeves kept losing sound is great because they have clear minded views.
To whom it may concern will you have them back again in the future Christine Emba and Richard V Reeves ?
And all you do is ask the same gen of women that did it! Duuuuumbbbb
I keep listening to these videos hoping to hear their solution. They just keep listing the problems. The closest I've heard to defining a good masculinity is "reliable and nice". And kinda suggesting that we don't need the old hyper competitive masculinity anymore and that it needs to be replaced with something. What exactly do you want to replace it with?! And whats wrong with men being competitive?!
I’m a guy and I can’t imagine growing up and not being hyper competitive with other men. That gave me a very strong incentive to improve many areas of my life
Jordan Peterson is a bad role model? Please explain given the confusion greatly undermines your credability. You often like to lump him together with Andrew Tait. Really? Peterson is toxic? What happened to Joe Rogan, he was another popular target? Peterson seems to have a completely functional relationship with his spouse, something of a model to emulate. He reinforces responsibility, family and a pro-social view which looks beyond selfish narcasim. Shouldn't this be admired and serve as aspirational? While you might not like aspects of his message, given he remains very hetronormative. Dont confuse this, Peterson isn't anti-LBG. He accepts it. Except, he isn't keen on the transgender fixation on children and the associated message which seems to diminish the role for parents and their responsibility for raising children. It seems the state education system knows better??? He has certainly been warning of the pending crisis of masculinity and both the toxic hostility and perverted fallacies which shape the feminist agenda.
Thank you 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
Anyone who talks about masculinity will be considered toxic including Jordan Peterson. This is why men support Tate.
Well for one he believes in going back to traditional gender roles which for women basically meant slavery and oppression... He wants to turn back the clock, says career women should turn themselves towards motherhood as if it has to be one or the other, and that the patriarchy is natural and necessary because men are the true leaders in this world. You know... that kind of sexist stuff.
I am so gratified by the article Christine has written and this conversation that comes out of it, not to mention Richard Reeves' exemplary recent book ... Thank you for having this conversation ... One suggestion: please do not paint the fence with one brush when considering the so-called 'manosphere' -- there are a range of voices and the sexier copy (i.e. mysoginist), while certainly in evidence, is actually not the norm
Excellent, in every way. Thank you Mr Capehart for hosting this discussion. Must run out now and get Emba's and Reeves's books.
They are missing the real problem, most men lost social status not because women gained power, but because of the hyper competitive and unequal capitalism system we live in. Men are put down by other powerful men, not women. Women don’t mind men being the provider, it’s just harder for most people to make enough money to support the family. Most corporate executives decide to lay off workers and move factories overseas are men.
I'm sorry I read the comments 😅
There are fewer male teachers because education is becoming a less viable profession. The numbers for social workers and therapists are about the same. In my state alone there is a shortage of 1700 teachers. Start paying the HEAL professions and men might actually want those jobs.
Having worked in HR which is totally dominated by women. HR, Nursing, and teaching are dominated by women. Women as a group are very resistant and hostile to men working in “their space”. Let’s start there.
@@patrickmoran687 Yes, and why is that? My kid's preschool had ONE male teacher? Guess who was caught molesting a kid? I really tried not to show this guy any prejudice. Everyone did. In addition to the very real threat, let's also discuss male flight. As soon as women dominated these careers the pay dipped in comparison to other jobs at those companies. HR is now paid the same as secretarial work, despite needing a degree to do the work in most offices. I won't get into teacher pay and benefits-we all know. Nursing is probably the only decently paid career you've listed. I don't know how it is in your area, but in my area they are pushing for more men to be nurses. With the population aging as it is they literally need stronger bodies to move the patients around and do the work.
I'm shocked by the lack of clarity when using and comparing terms.
For example, feminist and masculine are not comparable (it would be feminine and masculine).
Also, putting toxic in front of masculinity does not imply that masculinity is bad/toxic. Toxic is a modifier/adjective and when put in front of another word describes a kind of that word. So toxic masculinity is a kind of masculinity that is toxic. Pretty clear.
Let's not render the conversation harder than it needs to be by mixing up words.
Also, feminine and masculine traits belong to everyone, male, female and non-binary. Period.
Androgyny became a big thing when women were trying to gain equal rights, so they dressed like men and adopted more masculine traits to succeed in the workplace. Lots of us women would be delighted that we could be fully embraced us women in all our femininity.
While I agree that we have a problem that we need to address for boys and men, framing it in this kind of confusion do nothing to advance finding solutions.
I completely agree with you! And I am a man. I came out of this interview feeling more confused than before. None of the panelists mind you who wrote a book about the topics can't single out what the issues are. You would think for this a big societal debate, men grievances would be everywhere to see, and the solutions easy to recommend. I think I might be missing something!
This is all (mostly) irrelevant. Human inputs in the economy will probably be very minimal in the future. Artificial wombs would probably make all this traditional dating nonsesne a relic of the past.
When the artificial wombs come along, future people can worry about it. Meanwhile, let's deal with the here and now.
And she is single because......
Christine Elba is just a robot with no real opinions and just regurgitates her article
I Think Androgeny...has been missed..Where Men can raise kids /
women run a business..!.
.Men can be more sensative..& women can be empowered..!!
Oh good. "How to fix men 2.0". Spoiler alert. They need to be lead by a desire for sex and women because they are incapable of caring and deciding for themselves. News flash. Men spend time alone because it makes them happy. Not being criticized and judged constantly is just a bonus. They are social when they want and not when they don't - and they do not have to have a woman sign off their decision. For the first time in generations men have finally prioritized themselves first and the result is more societal labels that they are "lost". Shocking. The "Man problem" would go away if woman treated men the way women want to be treated, LIKE HUMAN BEINGS. But, please excuse men because they aren't waiting for that to happen.
Yes you are correct. The challenge is as women become career centric and focused on being in the C-suite how much they realise they ultimately lead a greatly diminished life by missing out on the greatest thing they can achieve. Specifically, bringing a child into the world and the greater sense of achievement that comes with raising a child. There is no greater achievement!
Lol you are not learning anything 😂
There's a lot of mention here about women doing better in college than men. A college degree however is just a means to an end, which is hopefully getting a fulfilling and well paid job. The reality is that men still monopolize the vast majority of executive, senior executive, and C-suite roles. Furthermore, even if women are able to obtain these roles they're still paid significantly less than a male in the same role. A college degree shouldn't be the sole benchmark for performance and opportunities between men and women.
I'm curious about this statistic as well. Perhaps more women are getting degrees, but the men who remain are getting the more lucrative degrees (e.g. engineering, finance, law). But also, it could be that, in general, a few men achieve the top, the women fill out the middle, and the rest of men are at the bottom, and that's not good for anyone but those few.
Young men should not pursue woman during early adulthood. Instead pursue physical fitness, career, education, wealth, land acquisition and a home. Learn to be self sufficient on your land. Society is in slow collapse When women see a successful man with means, the women will pursue that man…and that man must be very picky. Never let a women cohabitate with you and never get married. If you choose children and marriage ensure the woman brings as much or more to the table. Divorce courts favor women.
you're nuts. "not pursue women during early adulthood"?! that's a joke, right?
Men just need to get over the stigma of letting a woman provide for you. Really it's better, it frees up your time and energy to persue your true purpose. We are no longer reduced to only being a provider and cannon fodder. Women really are better at it. The only problem is women haven't fully embraced their true strength to the point of taking over the construction and oil rig jobs, but I'm sure it's just a matter of time. I'm fully rooting for them to achieve this.
All men really have to do is just go to therapy. Sure, that's only a start and not a complete solution. But many men refuse to even BEGIN the process of emotional growth, and for those guys, I just can't empathize. At a certain point, you're just electing to remain emotionally stunted of your own volition.
I've been, but I'm not sure it's the solution. It was helpful, but not nearly as much as finding a men's group.
if it was that simple, the problem would have been solved by now, don't you think?
Let me replace just a couple of words in your sentence...
"All women really have to do is just go to assertiveness training. Sure, that's only a start and not a complete solution. But many women refuse to even BEGIN the process of emotional growth, and for those women I just can't empathize. At a certain point, you're just electing to remain repressed of your own volition."
If I said that to you in 1950, you'd be quite rightly outraged. But your comment is as fair and reasonable in 2023 (or not) as I would have been if i had, indeed said that you in 1950.
Blah blah blah
Another hair-dyed woman with too many tattoos thinking therapy is the solution to everything.
Therapy doesn't work for men
Mr. Capehart does come across as masculine in a subtle yet clear way. It's about the quality of energy.
He is GAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Blaming Girls..programs..?..HUH..?...
Women &:Girls discriminated in Math & Science..100's of Years..
.Education..Needs to offer...equal oppertunities..for all..!!
Looks like you could use some more schooling. 😂 Your grasp on the English language is tenuous at best. Lol
I love it. Point and case... feminist can't acknowledge men's issues without trying to gaslight and play bullshit victim card leveraging bullshit anecdotes. f off.
Why not just stay in the kitchen, barefoot and pregnant?
I mean, you cant even beat a man in swimming.
Stay home and learn from your man.
Simple.
Sounds like slavery. Guess that is how weak some men are that they must resort to that. Their way of feeling strong and masculine.