The Bible and Epistemology | Matt - MI | Atheist Experience 24.02
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 15 янв 2020
- New episode of The Non-Prophets at 6:15: • The Non-Prophets 19.01...
The Atheist Experience 24.02 for January 12, 2020 with Matt Dillahunty & Don Baker.
Call the show on Sundays 4:30-6:00pm CDT: 1-512-686-0279
► Don't like commercials? Become a patron for ad-free content & more: / theatheistexperience
► Podcast versions of the show may be found at:
www.spreaker.com/show/theathe...
► Join our discord:
tinyurl.com/TheACAdiscord
► Chat room rules:
atheist-experience.org/chat-ru...
► The most up to date Atheist Experience videos can be found by visiting
atheist-experience.com/archive/
-------
WHAT IS THE ATHEIST EXPERIENCE?
The Atheist Experience is a weekly call-in television show in Austin, Texas geared at a non-atheist audience. The Atheist Experience is produced by the Atheist Community of Austin.
The Atheist Community of Austin is organized as a nonprofit educational corporation to develop and support the atheist community, to provide opportunities for socializing and friendship, to promote secular viewpoints, to encourage positive atheist culture, to defend the first amendment principle of state-church separation, to oppose discrimination against atheists and to work with other organizations in pursuit of common goals.
We define atheism as the lack of belief in gods. This definition also encompasses what most people call agnosticism.
VISIT THE ACA'S OFFICIAL WEB SITES
www.atheist-community.org (The Atheist Community of Austin)
www.atheist-experience.com (The Atheist Experience TV Show)
► More shows and video clips can be found in the archive:
www.atheist-experience.com/arc...
► DVDs of the Atheist Experience can be purchased via:
www.atheist-community.com/prod...
NOTES
TheAtheistExperience is the official channel of The Atheist Experience. "The Atheist Experience" is a trademark of the ACA.
The views and opinions expressed by hosts, guests, or callers are their own and not necessarily representative of the Atheist Community of Austin.
Opening Theme:
Shelley Segal "Saved" www.shelleysegal.com/
Limited use license by Shelley Segal
Copyright © 2011 Shelley Segal
Copyright © 1997 Atheist Community of Austin. All rights reserved.
"Well you can't prove it wrong!" When will theists learn this is not an argument.
Matt has it nailed, a no true Scotsman fallacy in a petticoat, high heels and sun glasses but not fooling anyone.
there may be no true scotsman but my headache says scotch is very real
@@jimcarlson6157 no, that's just... everything the OP tacked onto that picture...
Shit, my fucking eyes!
I want to like this more than once
The huge point that Matt geniusly illustrated here to everyone watching, with the 'resurrection' of his uncle example, is just how low and insufficient the caller's standards of evidence are.
Let's say he could, 5 min after the resurrection of Matt's uncle, go in and investigate the event by speaking with the people who witnessed it. AT BEST what you can conclude is that you have an unexplained event. What if the brain monitoring equipment was faulty and a rare case of autorescusitation occurred? What if the doctors got a coma patient and a dead person's paperwork mixed up? What if they made any number of mistakes? Freak occurrences happen.
Now, the caller goes to investigate by interviewing witnesses ONLY! How could you ever come to a conclusion based on that alone? Now compound that to a story of it, no historical method could ever get you there if interviewing direct witnesses can't. Now the story of a story. Now the story of a story passed down 50 years after the event took place, 2000 years before modern medicine when we can't even concretely prove the person EVEN EXISTED!
When you dig in at all, with proper skepticism applied... Historical methods are wholly irrelevant. This caller and everyone claiming the resurrection of Jesus is scientifically verifiable, let alone verifiable at all, are fractally wrong at every turn.
Can they just freakin admit they believe it cuz it makes them feel good? The song and dance about evidence and all this bs is just embarrassing.
Caller went away and studied the bible since his recent last call and now he is ready to challenge the host with 25 years+ in the field. Self proclaimed geniuses rarely get it.
Maybe he should try a different translation, that could be why he has no understanding of logic or reason whatsoever.😂😂
Why the criticism, does anyone close to you believe in God, do you run them down every chance you get. Accept other views without the criticism of another human being.
I find most comments come from those whom love to knock people down. What does this say about your belief?
Atheists don't have the type of belief that I assume you are suggesting. And it was the theist who phoned it with their belief that they could argue for the existence of their god. It is apparent that the theist's god didn't step in to help him prove god's existence. Why? Because the theist even here couldn't bring his god to help him, because it apparently does not exist.
@@Brucepaj This comment knocks people ..... (my comment knocks you) Hell, yeah, you are correct
I think lying is part of Christian MO. Like when apologists want to keep making money, or when priests are talking to the police
You can't shake my faith in Elvis.
🎶 There's a whole lotta shakin goin on..
Long live the king!
I'm all shook up
uNstructured U.ndersTanding a little less conversation, a little more action please
What fun is that the only evidence that Paul was a “known” persecutor of Christians is from himself. Paul claims to have been this way but there is no other evidence supporting this claim.
@Urrcreavesh The liars, you mean.
@@mikaoh4617
Matt D. in this vid says he hesitates to call people liars because he can't read minds.
I can give weak reasons to suspect that some Christians, when proselytizing, will falsely claim they were once atheists. If it mattered, I might cautiously explore the possibility with them as obliquely as possible, never confronting or accusing. What we learn of epistemology should be employed to refine our own thinking as well as that of opponents.
Yeah well, once again, the claim is proof of the claim.
Go by that standard, apply it evenly and consistently, and you'll have to be a Muslim, Mormon, Scientologist, Hindu, and of course a Christian, ALL at the same time.
"But this old document said so!" is never a good reason to believe anything.
"I understand that you believe that..." wow. this guy is NOT honest.
This dude has the mind of a child .
The vast majority of religious people do.
What do you even think religious belief is? Its just an attempt to put a band-aid over ignorance and irrationality, call it faith, and then pretend you're no longer ignorant or irrational.
Religiosity is essentially putting yourself in a place where you're intellectually forever a child, unwilling to move any further or do any mental heavy lifting.
And this kind of heavy lifting is actually required, whenever we do any honest investigation, when we try to discover how things are in reality.
But alas, religion doesnt deal with reality, but rather some fantasy land where your every wish comes true, everything is better, and you dont have to think, reason, or suffer anymore.
Its the ultimate fairy tale, the highest fantasy land, where the oldest adults can be children and never have to think or reason.
Ed
Because most are indoctrinated as a young child and that remains even with age almost regardless of future earthing, as evidence clearly w/ Matt, as he retains the scars in how he unnecessarily argues minutia of the entire god-thing.
He also has the Bosuns Mate syndrome, gotta OWN everything he touches.
Combined a lot of unnecessary unattractive displays, making everything the Matt Dillahunty Show.
Children are quite straightforward and sceptical - they want to see before they believe.
They will believe you have candy in your shopping bag only when you show it to them.
Their heads are filled with non-sense by adults.
And this people vote and serve in the jury duty system, no wonder we have such garbage government
Religion means never having to grow up.😉
The mental circus that happens in in a theist's mind is sometimes astounding
Bizarre and like totally dishonest .
It’s incredible when you realize that this guy has clearly studied some apologetics and the stuff they teach at seminary. This is literally the best they have, a weak historical secondhand account of somebodies half brother.
truly astounding lol
Really puts Barnum and Bailey to shame.
It's why I listen honestly.
Matt(the caller) sounds like a lawyer when he starts throwing in clauses, qualifiers and anything else to avoid facing reality.😂
By Michigan Matt's logic , every religious artifact must be genuine
Still waiting to hear from Massachusetts Mitch, tbh... I'd _love_ to hear a Salem Apologist squirm against these guys.
"Matt wants me to study epistemology? No problem. I've got five minutes to spare. That should be enough time"
Callers really make the show entertaining.
It hard to believe how some people function
on day to day decisions. With the rationale they use. Some really crazy bat crap ideas.
It's not like there's much to know about epistemology, right?
@@tommymiller8825 😆😅🤣
As Matt Dillahunty points out falacies, he caller, Matt, is retreating further, and further into the outer edge of his "reality".
Wow 23 minutes of special pleading. Matt literally said oh your story is implausible but mine isn't.
Someone needs to tell this guy that story writers DON'T believe what they write. It's other people later on that do.
I know a lot of "sincere" believers who lie, steal and talk behind other peoples backs.
I don't know any that don't. All seem to do what they feel is comfortable no matter what their book says, while proselytizing, preaching and guilting others for doing what they feel as comfortable. Hypocrites, beacuse they are human. Humans are not perfect and cannot live to a "perfect" standard. One that is impossible to live up to.
How many Catholic priests lied and hid the truth about fellow priests corrupt behavior in an attempt to protect the church?
Given such behavior was most likely forgiven by those higher in the chain, they faced no moral dilemma with regards to their ultimate destination.
Similarly anyone who is given "last rites" is absolved of sin before death. It doesn't matter which lies are told, or for what purpose. I'm sure believers wishing to convince someone of something or protect their church from embarrassment will lie rather than tell the truth. Knowing full well that any mistake they make is forgivable.
Surely this is true for all Christians, as they believe they are forgiven regardless of their sins.
The originators of Christianity could well have been people who saw the enlightened interpretation of Judaism as a necessary successor to their original faith. Casting the teacher as something more than human makes it a story worthy of repetition and following. As long as people followed the teachings of their Jesus, the stories were simply vehicles for delivering a potent message. I'm even sure they could believe an actual deity would sort the mess out in the wash. Lying for the faith is a basic principle for cultists, although the kinds of lie vary from leaders to followers.
Double 🤦♂️. I also know bunch of dumb atheists who think they’re smart
@@felixchien1664
By the laws of probability over a population, you'd expect some would be dumb. Unless you can provide some actual data however, your proposition is unsupported. It may well be there is a bias towards higher intellect and/or more extensive education if you are also an atheist. If I remember rightly, there is a stark difference between scientists versus the general population towards them being atheist. That might not be due to intellect or education but rather their day to day operating epistemology, for instance.
Given this is unlikely to be a intellectual comment but rather the desperate ravings of a theist of some kind, are you attempting to imply if you were smarter you'd be an atheist?
Or that you have to be dumber to be a theist?
Or is this really that you can't argue with skeptics who don't accept beliefs in deities, or the supernatural, if they use smart reasoning bounded by examined reality?
A lot of cults use the idea that you are special for having mundane or unattractive traits. It's no surprise then that those who aspire to be intelligent but don't feel they are, find solace in the idea that a deity approves of them independent of that trait and may even favor the down trodden and stupid over those with more fertile minds.
If that's a comment on a real deity and that deity designed humans, it's a rather contradictory position for the deity to take.
It's would, of course, be simpler if the deity simply demonstrated itself in a manner that was unequivocal. If you think on all the deities you don't think exist but had thousands if not tens of thousands of followers over centuries, then belief is not a good standard of assessment to use to determine if a particular deity is real or not, or worth following or not.
So why would simplistic believers be more accurate than intelligent and educated skeptics? If your deity gave us a brain why is using it doomed to fail us?
As a rule, those who oversimplify a set of claims and then invoke a belief about them can no longer logically process claims involving those ideas. The oversimplification then dooms them to the intellectual darkness with a belief that locks them in.
Just for a moment rather than think your own propaganda is correct and think stupidity a boon, consider what the nature of intellect is? What makes you more complex than another ape? It's a special heritage you have, you'd do well to make the most of it.
sigmata0 tl;dr but I’ll get to this tomorrow.
Let me simplify things here. I’m specifically talking about the OP comment and those atheists who agree with it (ie those who thumbs up the OP comment). Although I do know self proclaimed atheists who are low IQ irl.
Ironically, what is said in the OP comment was never the caller’s point. I hope that gives you some hint as to why I have a facepalm smiley. And my comment also parallels the OP comment for better satiric effect.
Matt is great when he gets cranky. He used to be somewhat polite. Now he's just like "shut up". Epic!
harshbarj “Shut the fuck up!” Even better. I prefer when he gets aggressive with the more smarmy theists.
And that makes his cool because he was rude and disrespectful to someone
Fredrick Crawford respect is earned. This caller brought nothing warranting respect
@300096586 that’s just, like....your opinion, man.
@300096586 respect actually is earned.
Holy shit i think i know this caller! We used to be decent friends then he became religious and became very different. We’ve had numerous debates in person over text and every single one of his points here he was talking about 2 years ago. Lol thats wild. Last we spoke i told him to call into the show. Evens sounds like him lmao thats awesome.
What I don't get is that you don't base the ressurection on the personality and motivation of the Characters who told about it in a book but the evidence of such event being possible.
Cause otherwise Captain Kirk actually met God at the center of the Galaxy because Gene Roddenberry wouldn't lie about it
Fuck, considering the type of guy Roddenberry was, that one actually fits _too_ well.
Matt is just soooo good at this.
And Matt, on the other hand, isn't really good at this.
If you mean Matt interupting people, talking over them, condescending to them, not letting them finish their thought, bombastically saying *"Shut up!,"* yet demanding total silence as _he_ leisurely speaks and until _he feels_ he is completely finished with _his thoughts_ , then *yes!* ... he is soooo good at this! In fact, world class!
At least, that's my atheistic point of view.
@@StripperLicker I don't believe for a second that you're an atheist if you actually believe the horseshit you just wrote.
@Ender Ragnarok
I'm certain by your comment that you are likely young, realtively inexperienced with _real_ interpersonal and communications skills, probably devoid of any higher education in human psychology or sociology, certainly devoid of any insight into either and and also likely have problems with your E.I. The fact that you would (a) ascribe a comment such as mine to only a theist, and (b) effectively call me a liar, speaks volumes about you personally.
If what I have written is incorrect, then you are probably just a moronic sycophant in the Dullahunty Cult, replying from your gaming computer, in your room, in your parent's home.
But then again, maybe both are true.
@@StripperLicker You've made so many mistakes in your reply that I won't bother to correct them all. You clearly have no idea why Matt interrupts the fools who call into the show to spew their horseshit despite the fact that he has explained his reason for doing so on numerous occasions. You are starting to sound like a troll at this point.
The unfortunate part of Matt from MI's theory that no religious person would lie intentionally for fear of forfeiting their chance at eternal life is that this theory is universally accepted. There are individuals who sit on parole boards who because of their own religious beliefs have granted parole to inmates simply because said inmate has professed to have found God , and based on the Matt's theory no inmate who is actually religious would lie to gain his freedom here on earth if his place in Heaven could be forfeited. There are religious individuals who have committed crimes and have sworn on the Bible as to their innocence , however based on Matt's theory no real religious person would lie simply to remain free from doing time in prison while here on earth if it meant they were forfeiting their chance at an eternal life in Heaven. The callers theory is monumentally flawed but widely accepted.
@The Mandalorian now that's "Separation of Church and State" at its absolute finest possible right there.
Matt is by FAR the most persuasive speaker I have ever heard on any subject. Had I heard someone else the first time I listened in several years ago, I'd have never listened again. He has a unique ability to dissect any argument, stay exactly on point, and offer intelligent explanations. He knows what the theist is thinking ahead of time and goes right to the heart of the topic and does his best to keep them on that topic as they bob and weave.
That said, the little laugh after virtually everything Don says is beyond annoying. Tracy does it, too, and it's distracting to the point of making it untenable to keep listening.
Matt: "If we toss out the Gospel accounts, what's left?"
Caller: "Ummmm....hem.....haw.....pontificate......obfuscate.......refuse to answer.....shift topics......dodge.....bob & weave......babble............regurgitate "sciencey" sounding words".........and completely fail.
When gospels are tossed out we are left with God ALMIGHTY. Ha ha. Some how atheists are confused about the concept that existence exist. Maybe they want to start all over again and make the foundation of reality out of nothing or something more ignorant like a squishy substance. Yes that's it, a squishy substance holds existence together. Hey let's call it "dark squishy substance", that will make it sound scientific. What a pile of horse shit atheist have to swallow.
@@constructivecritique5191 Let me tell you... it's damn good horse shit! Stuff tastes like candy.
@@constructivecritique5191 Annnd you still haven't given us a reason to believe a god exists.
@@aeroprime3322 that's dumb, why would anyone do that? It's called free will for a reason. Amazing that atheist don't get it, but that's fine.
Constructive Critique you’re ignorance is showing.
True Believers will never lie, eh? What say you, Apostle Peter?
Speaking of the Peter.
The "Resurrection," is an erection of the Phallus who opens the womb, of the virgin, on March 25. This is a yearly event, just like Genesis one, where day one begins at the spring equinox. This is the "snake," in the Garden of Eden (spring - summer).
@@harveywabbit9541 Okay? That's a weird take on wanting to reproduce.
@@Sergei_kv82
God was depicted as the Phallus in many ancient societies. He was often depicted as a phallus with wings. The words strong and upright, in the bible, always relates to the penis. Ham, the son that made Noah so angry, is the same as the Hindu Siva (symboled by a phallus). Noah got drunk and slept while naked and Ham (the penis) really made him angry. Get the picture????
Not to mention Abraham, who lied to the Egyptians about his wife being his sister, was apparently supremely blessed by God for doing this.
@@kevinlitton1399
Abraham is a copy of Zeus and his wife Sarah is a copy of Hera. The biblical Caleb was copied from the Egyptian Anubis. Anubis/Anpu became the Christian Saint Christopher. Check out the Egyptian story of Anpu and Bata and you'll see more pilferage.
My mother, being raised catholic, forced me to go to catholic high school. However, fortunately I managed to sleep through all the religious indoctrination classes. I then found my way to atheism and have lived a happy life for it. No guilt, no fear of hell, no fear of sexual desires, that's what I call heaven on earth.
Wasn't the fictional House M D who said: "Everybody lies"? No one ever said a truer statement .
He also said "Rational arguments don't usually work on religious people. Otherwise, there would be no religious people."
He also said that Lisa Cuddy has a nice rack. The man speaks the truth.
@@TrettinR . Amen to that , brother. Also Cuddy's( or the actor's) rack is testable, unlike God's ass.
Devout religious people would never lie to simlpy benefit their beliefs? Has Matt from MI ever heard of Peter Popoff?
🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️ wasn’t Matt from MI’s point. He directly stated that he’s not talking about devout religious people lying generally. If Matt allowed him (the caller, Matt from MI) to continue speaking, he would have been more clear. Instead the caller had to interject rather politely while Matt went on a tirade against the caller.
Matt from MI was responding to his reason in believing the evidence for Jesus’s resurrection. IF a person’s eternal stake was on the truth of that event, then one cannot lie about it otherwise their eternity is jeopardized. Jeopardizing one’s eternity does not make sense therefore lying about the resurrection would not make sense. I’m almost certain that’s what Matt from MI was getting at. Matt Dilla. Did later address this point but Matt kept acting like the caller committed a No True Scotmans fallacy. Matt was only trying to make himself look right the whole time...which he does in every single show
@@felixchien1664 if that line of thinking is correct, and a devout religious person would not lie about their experiences for fear of possible damnation, then it would make sense for every Christian to join the LDS church.
Chris Leaver the discussion was specifically about the truth of the resurrection and who the caller deems as a “good” witness. The caller wasn’t providing a general proposition on what a “true” or “sincere” believer is. A core tenet in Christianity is the resurrection of Christ. Then by definition a “sincere” believer must believe that to be true. If they believed the resurrection of Christ was false, then they would be a false believer lying about the resurrection. Again, by definition.
Seems like Matt duped his audience into thinking he is right and the callers are idiots. No, not always you bandwagon of hypocrites...smh
Oh and in response to the LDS church...I don’t know their doctrine but I’m sure there are myriads of doctrine speaking about eternal salvation which oppose one another. Any devout and sincere believer in whatever doctrine would adhere to that doctrine. If they believed it was false then they wouldn’t be a devout and sincere believer would they?
@@felixchien1664 The same believers who makes claims about resurrections are the people who claim that belief is necessary for salvation. What if the latter ALSO was a lie? (Then your logic does not follow)
St. Paul say's that if Jesus did not resurrect, then "your faith is in vain", but the believer tend to forget that THE SAME PAUL was the one who claimed faith is what God is looking for and that God is basing SALVATION on the same story Paul is telling! …
In other words:
Paul tells a story and makes doubting this story "an eternal offence" and so he is making you FEAR what happens to you if you do not believe him
It's mafia tactics!
busylivingnotdying I agree this would be a valid argument that could have been explored.
Apparently both theist and atheist alike find Matt’s arrogance and hypocrisy Distasteful. I’m more so pointing out how Matt interrupted and strawmanned the caller and how the idiots on RUclips always jeer against the caller as if Matt was correct. Nope, Matt and Don were completely talking over the caller and were initially wrong about his position which is what I have explained. Matt and Don didn’t let the caller fully explain his position. Only through constant interruption, heckling and insult did the caller’s point come out. By that time however, Matt already accomplished what he wanted: make the caller look bad.
If thats what it takes to believe god I don't understand outside of trusting your parents why anyone would believe. But then you have to prove santa, the tooth fairy and the easter bunny too...
The "Resurrection," is an erection of the Phallus who opens the womb, of the virgin, on March 25. This is the "snake," in the Garden of Eden (spring - summer).
“Why do “Atheists” think they’re human beings”. - Chris Massey on different account
Holy shit, you do exist. So why does cancer exist, birth defects occur, incurable disease, pain and suffering?
Matt clearly dominated this debate.
"What harm would it do, if a man told a good strong lie for the sake of the good and for the Christian church ... a lie out of necessity, a useful lie, a helpful lie, such lies would not be against God, he would accept them." - Martin Luther (Cited by his secretary, in a letter in Max Lenz, ed., Briefwechsel Landgraf Phillips des Grossmüthigen von Hessen mit Bucer, vol. I.)
I really enjoyed this episode
Religous person not lie? Ken Ham? Kent Hovind?
Hours, months, years, centuries of debate & argument, lies & wars.
IF you got a god-thing, produce it.
NO?
End of story.
The caller is entrenched in his concrete thinking.
I just got an ad after this video for Christian faith healing including a testimony from a man supposedly cured by prayer.
It's like RPGs: We're just taking turns.
I can reasonably put forth that an invisible unicorn cannot be pink.
It is obvious that the caller is not listening to Matt, he is just waiting for his turn to talk.
Hard to believe that over 2,000 years has passed and we are still arguing about the Bible crap.
Another possibility you might not consider about Paul is that he could have had a bigger understanding about power and politics, saw a movement he would try to eradicate, until he saw how he could use this movement to gain much more power. Maybe the encounter was witnessing how devoted the followers were and what he could do with them. Just a possibility.
Boils down to “every religious person is telling the truth because they wouldn’t want to offend the god they’ve made up”.
It’s never about the truth of a religion. It’s always about their personal validation.
You guys ever watch that Friends episode where Phoebe tries to teach Joey French(or really any TV show. They all seem to have a similar scene i.e. The Family Guy Cool Whip exchange). In the episode she says a French phrase, Joey says Gibberish. This happens a couple of times. Then she takes him through it bit by bit.
Phoebe: "Je"
Joey: "Je"
Phoebe: "M'appel"
Joey: "M'appel"
Phoebe: "Joey"
Joey: "Joey"
Phoebe: "Je m'appel Joey
Joey: " da zsa bleep joop"
That's what this call sounded like.
Matt led hkm through it all. He followed along, got all the right answers , then when asked for a conclusion, he was Joey speaking " French"
An oldie, but a goodie ! Fry for Jesus !
Whenever Michigan Matt says "My point is..." immediately after Rational Matt destroys his point, take a shot.
TLDR: “As long as I keep talking & talking & talking, I’m right”
Alternate story... there was someone who wanted to gain power and control over people so invented a story about a god that could provide them with a wonderful life here on earth and an eternity in bliss afterwards only if they believed and worshiped him or, give them a very hard life here on earth and an eternity of unbelievable torture and pain if they didn't. And this someone inserted himself into this story as the only one who knows the mind of this god and everyone must come to him to know what to do and how to live their lives.
This guy really likes to hear himself talk.
Crazy prayingmantis Sweeping statement
This is the guy who talks for 3 minutes when asked a simple yer-or-no question.
School is in session !!
There were NO reports on what happened, from contemporaries of that time. Yet, There are writings and artifacts, dated WAY before the bible was written ( in 1611) about the lives of Kings, Queens, all the way to regular people.
"No true believer would knowingly lie" - so many issues with this.
A) What level of devotion qualifies as a true believer and how can it be objectively quantified as to whether one starts telling the truth or not?
B) Don't most devotees believe to be "true" believers? even if they potentially aren't? and are even counted as such?
C) How can you tell that the witnesses to Jesus were true believers and/or recounted accurately what they saw. If they weren't true believers then they might have lied, so now we end up with another thing to prove. And perhaps they were true believers but knowingly recounted what they thought to be true but was actually false. Couldn't the lie of some false believers influence the thinking of other true believers by building belief on a false foundation?
D) Which version of Christianity qualifies you as a true believer? Loads of Calvinists would completely disagree with everything said by this guy.
E) By this guy's logic anything said by any religious person is true.
The standard Biblical scholarship is that the Pauline Epistles were written in the 50’s a couple of decades after Jesus was suppose to have died and that “The Acts of the Apostles” was written no earlier than the 80s. The only reference to Paul is a couple of paragraphs in Acts. None of the earlier historians mention this amazing apostle converting giant crowds of people wherever he went. Somewhere around the middle of the 2nd century Polycarp goes “Hey, look what I have a collection of, writings of Paul!”
Where did he get them from? Are they anything more than fan fiction where somebody wrote a backstory to the character described in Acts?
So you would be skeptical and have to investigate Matt's uncle's reserection story... gotcha.
Jon cracks me up 😂😅😅🤣
Matt did assert that Aziz was a liar in a past call, however, he was justified in doing so.
Say that no devout religious person will lie to Elron Hubbard.
to tell the truth I sometimes lie
It is an imperative part of staying married!
When woo woo and booga booga make endorphins take flight.
OMG, this guy is like a living Darwin award. The concepts of hell and the devil - created by Catholic Church in the 2nd century - historically prove him a liar. And that's just one example.
This guy has more "tricks" to avoid answering questions than anyone I have ever heard. BTW - Caller says that religious people would never knowingly lie. Then he says he is trying to listen, which is clearly a lie.
Wow, he went straight up dishonest when Matt asked about his dying uncle.
No, he wouldn't do all of that, nobody in their right mind would believe that at all.
Matt destroys Matt.
matt matted matt
nah, it's obvious that Matt won
I think you got that the wrong round. Actually Matt destroyed Matt
WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG!
I would lie about my religion if I thought I could save someone from Hell Fire.
aye, but before that, you have to prove that hell exists, otherwise, its just fear mongering...
This show must really annoy the christians, there is an unending line of morons Calling in.
@Truth Matters why don't you call, here's a simple challenge, use your god's miraculous magic to convert matt dillahunty and aaron ra... go on... prove you can walk the walk and not all talk...
either you can use god's magic or you are a liar and a coward...
@Truth Matters *Smart people know better*
Trollololololololollolololololololololololololololololololololololololol
@Truth Matters translation: you can't back up your claims so you run away like a coward, and lie to others that you faced these challenges and won. gotcha.
Truth Matters you don't call in because you can't back up the God existence claim. Matt does have many positions on many things. Like me, he is unconvinced that a God existence. Why should he make a claim that no God existence if he doesn't have the evidence to back it up.
@Truth Matters
"Matt is playing a charade where the atheist refuses to take a position"
When we don't know things we shouldn't be taking a position.
"exempting the athiest belief position"
So when I say I don't know if there is a god or not, what burden of proof do I have?
Isn't the whole thing about lying if their salvation on the line directly relevant to the pretty popular idea of temptation? Like if the lie was beneficial to them, it would be tempting, and wasn't temptation difficult even for Jesus?
A friendly reminder:
Matt (the caller)... votes
Can something be invisible and pink?
Antiholy shit, Matt! Greatest smackdown I've seen in a while, and still totally respectful and on point. Boom.
And we "know" that the apostles did actually die rather than recant?
...from the gospels. The stories, told by believers to believers...and eventually written down.
And even MORE eventually, had the apostle names slapped on the different manuscripts.
But "would later believers possibly embellish the story, to show apostles nobly martyring themselves?" As a candidate explanation, it is less of a stretch.
22:37 new testament and mythology in general.
How does this guy know that those who invented the resurrection story were pious in the first place.
Matt ( the caller) never heard of Peter the disciple that denied Jesus. Isn't that lying?
Peter is derived from iU Piter the sacred peter and Jupiter who was always looking for a hole to enter.
The "Resurrection," is an erection of the Phallus who opens the womb, of the virgin, on March 25. This is a yearly event, just like Genesis one, where day one begins at the spring equinox. This is also the "snake," in the Garden of Eden (spring - summer). The words, strong, upright, and happy, in the bible, always refers to the penis. An example is the word Asher which means penis and not a particular person. See how Asher the penis is described by his mother. Asher is assigned the constellation of the twins (Gemini). His dangling dainties are the twins.
The story of the "Resurrection", claims that it was a "Blood Sacrifice as payment for the sins of Adam.". But it says in Like 24, that this "Blood Sacrifice" was restored in the FLESH. This fact, belies the purpose of the "Payment of Flesh", because the Jesus figure was restored to his physical state.
Andrea Yates is better than Jesus. Jesus's sacrifice was temporary. In fact, it wasn't really a sacrifice; it was an investment. He went into it knowing that in a day and a half he would be resurrected and would be a god from then on for eternity. Not a bad deal.
Andrea Yates, on the other hand, killed her children knowing that, even though they would go to heaven, she was damned to hell forever. That's a REAL sacrifice. Not like Jesus's temporary inconvenience for a huge reward couple of days later.
Matt i love love you , i Can not understand people who believe that there is a papa watching us.
theric66 Papa? Are you projecting?
@@joesmoke9624thats exactly what believers want and need
Why the assumption that religious believers would think a false story in favor of their god(s) would make them lose salvation and not earn them reward from their god(s)?
Yay
Matt from MI says _anything_ that makes his case just like his friends "who would *never* lie in case they don't get into heaven".
I don't think that when it comes to it, when it means their liberty or having to go to that dinner with the in-laws, most religious people _really_ believe their lies count, they make up their own criteria for making it into heaven when it suits them.
Oh yeah totally I believe some random weirdo 2000 years ago said you can't drink alcohol and can't eat bacon... I'm going to live by that coz that makes a lot of sense.
I would like the home address of Matt from Michigan to let my money making scam succeed. I wish to send him a letter setting out the simple 'facts' that he parked a car in a prohibited area of my street three years ago and owes me £1000 in unpaid fines.
I know he parked the car there, because a woman that lives in the next street told someone in the Pub that she had seen a man walking down the road near to the car three days after it was parked there. That man in the pub wrote it down a week later in his diary in French, the diary has since been examined by a Greek scholar who affirms that it is probably correct, and sent the results to me.
With cast iron evidence like that I expect that Matt will send me a cheque by turn of post, even though I write from England .
Epistemology:
The theory of knowledge, especially with regard to its methods, validity, and scope.
Epistemology is the investigation of what distinguishes justified belief from opinion. (Wikipedia)
The Bible does not meet the requirements for justified belief.
The irrational becoming more irrational in defense of their beliefs.
...and they all vote.
I don't know how you guys do it lol. I would just be hanging up on dudes after 30 seconds.
"Christians can't lie"?!?!?!?! WHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
His main claim seems to be that if a Christian knew that Christianity was false, they wouldn’t lies about that because they wouldn’t want to put their afterlife on the line.
The issue here is that in that scenario, they know that their afterlife doesn’t exist, and so that motivation cannot exist!
Gaslighting a conspiracy theory is apologetics in a nutshell
"And there appeared another wonder in Heaven and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns upon his heads" (Revelation 12:3)
I'm having trouble believing there are dragons in Heaven.
I'm surprised the hosts didn't ask if it's possible that after translating the translation of the translation, etc., not one embellished something? We don't have the NT originals. I do understand the caller had the unreasonable position that "no sincerely religious person would lie" and they destroyed that.
There are multiple documented accounts of 'resurrection' - but for some reason we call them 'buried alive'. What's the difference ?
Doesn't quite have the same ring about it, does it? Resurrection sounds soooooooo superior!! Oohh la de da ...
@Joe Horn Exactly!
@Joe Horn Misdiagnosing is a bit much for the bronze age, but the chance of getting it wrong is more likely than someone actually coming back to life, and we have multiple cases of professional diagnosis of death being wrong, right up to modern times. I think it unlikely that a bunch of untrained goat herders could be trusted to get the diagnosis correct. And that's with the massive assumption that Jesus did in fact exist.
They always want a Yes or No answer.
They don't seem to understand, that it's all about assigning degrees of probability. Simples..
That caller was a damn liar
that's interesting because ALL religions are invented! LMAO
To any converts to Atheism out there.
Were you Angry after your realisation/coming into Reality?
If so what was your main hatred directed towards.
Yes, for a good few years.
My anger was primarily aimed at my primary school teachers who had tricked me into believing it, and my non-believer parents who paid no attention to what I was being 'taught'.
But the anger gradually faded away as I realised that they were already tricked in the first place, and I was lucky enough to have fought/thought my way out. :)
@@ricardovonkrypton8908 I'm glad that you woke up. Welcome to Reality. My name is Dan. If I can help you, I will. If you have any questions or need reassurance, the Atheist Community is here for you.
@@danhemming6624
Thank you mate. :)
That was a while ago, and my beliefs have grown in some way since then.
But yeah, the anger was hard to deal with and hard to direct.
Wow this guy must spend alot of time analysing claims
It's frustrating when someone refuses to be put into the corner that Socratic questioning ought to put them when they don't play bullshit games. The caller suddenly finds it incredibly easy to answer 'I don't know' to a question that doesn't support his annoying theological beliefs if he does answer with 'yes' or 'no'. Because if he answers 'yes' to Matt's question "If Paul knew Jesus, you don't think he would've mentioned it?", then Matt would continue to pull that thread and the caller would end up having to claim more bullshit to support that already bullshit answer just because he doesn't want to or can't admit the truth to himself. And if he said "no" then it's an immediate admission that it is ridiculous to think Paul met Jesus. He's trying to avoid admitting to that which he should, and if he's just going to avoid it in order to protect his stupid beliefs, then hanging up on him and telling him to go fuck himself is what he earned.
Lying for religion is the basis of most religions.
“Shut up, Matt”