Richard King Metal Scraping Class!
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- Опубликовано: 27 янв 2017
- Taking a Scraping Class at Keith Rucker's shop with Richard King! I hand scraped a 24" parallel flat and parallel within a few tenths!
Filmed with amzn.to/2jh8oh0 !
Richard King: www.handscraping.com/
Other RUclips Folks in the Class!
Keith Rucker: bit.ly/2kFcvE7
Adam Booth ABOM79: bit.ly/23ryj0Q
James Kilroy: bit.ly/2jq4Tjw
Tom Utley: bit.ly/2jqRBn5
Jeff From "The Vintage Workshop" bit.ly/2ke5Hfv
Music copyrighted by John Saunders 5 Reasons to Use a Fixture Plate on Your CNC Machine: bit.ly/3sNA4uH 
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Great video John! I didn't get to involved with the other projects going on so it's nice to get it now from you and the other videos. Nice job on the parallel!! Something to be proud of!
Scraping is easy, the "Read" and "Blending" is the skill that after 20 years I'm still trying to master. Before I bought my power scraper and flaker i used a hand scraper with the blade profiled for flaking. after damaging my hand from hitting it for so long an old scraper hand showed me how to tape a rubber ball to the side of the scraper. hitting the ball is so much better and it even helps with the motion of cutting the half moon pockets for the flake pattern. What i like about scraping is everybody has their own tricks and tips to achieve the same results. for me it's all about how fast i can achieve the results that are required to put the ways back into some kind of working order to get the customer back up and running. Did Richard go over the profiling and compound radius of the blades? Sharpening them with a diamond wheel was a steep learning curve for me. You were lucky to have been instructed by one of the best scraping instructors in the country. I have found Connelly's book to be very valuable in setting center lines and keeping the whole big picture in check Book is expensive and was written in 1954 but is by far the best resource out there for guys that like to wear persian blue on their fingers. Good job on the video.
I have been binge watching scraping videos for days! Thanks for sharing!
It's pretty cool to see on this scale. One of the things I do, is build Kirksite tools for stretch forming aluminum and steel, and we use forming blocks we call joggle blocks to form the joggles in the material. They've got to be real close, so we will blue them in. We get it down to the point to where pieces of fluff for a hair from the brush or even a hair off of your head if it falls onto the surface of the jungle block while you are bluing it in, you will be able to see a perfect imprint of that hair and it'll completely ruin your spot.
It really is an art. We would smaller scrapers and scrape on either aluminum (we usually used 6061, but at times we used 7075 and that crap was hard to scrape) as well as Kirksite, which for those that don't know, is a zinc alloy. we use a grinder and flatten dull files and such, squaring up the edges on them. Then we would use just a bench grinder to put the edge on the tip of the scraper. We could then take those scrapers and shape them for different sizes etc. From big wide flat ones that we actually made from old high carbon fully hardened hemsaw blades, to little tiny thin ones that we made from reshaping drill bits and key files. Cool to see it done on a large scale.
I bought a cheap Asian machine 20 years ago. All the mating surfaces one of each are scraped it took me a long time to learn that scraped surfaces are a good thing. Thanks for sharing.
John- First and foremost, it was great to meet you at the class, and I'm soooo glad to see you doing much better, physically, after your terrible accident. 2nd, great video. You did a great job of covering the highs of the class from start to finish. I enjoyed the entire video. Hope to see you again soon.
Yep. Just long, but trouble free.
so cool to see all the different youtube guys in one spot all learning together. ive been watching everyone's take, just super rad to experiance
im very happy youre ok. listened dto podcast with Jody before seeing this video....2 subscriptions i value deeply and wouldnt want to lose. more importantly youre wife and kids get you home again. youre a good dude.
After visiting family in Atlanta over the years I know how crazy traffic can be. Glad to hear the accident wasn't any worse than it was and that you are okay. As always enjoyed the video and keep them coming. It's one way I have been trying to educate myself on the aspects of machining. Thanks
Having flipped and crashed (race cars) more than a few times, the injuries can be extensive. And that's with the best safety gear on the planet. Take some time to get properly checked out and physical therapy in case you have some internal bruising. Physical therapy helps insure that no scar tissue builds up over time. You'll be glad you did 20 years down the road.
Great class and presentation of everybody's projects and how everybody learned the techniques at their own pace. The different projects looked pretty cool !
I know this is three years old, but I know my wreck bothers me 8 years later. I didn't hurt untill a week after the accident and basically from then on I've hurt do to not taking proper care of my body. Yoga has been the best, yoga and diet. Healthy food consistently with continual yoga solves it.
Leaving comment just in case you still in pain 3 years later and maybe hearing others stories may help. Glad to see you walking and thank you for your perseverance in creating great content.
Thanks for posting this video John! Scraping is definitely an art that many don't take the time to learn. We have watched/own Richards videos and learn something new every time we view them. We're all big fans of your channel here at the shop.
glad your ok John, I'll be praying for a fast recovery and nice video John. love the scraping
Hye John :)
Hand is the most precice and powerfull tool in a shop, it is why it's so important to be carreful whit machines coz there no hope inf repairs.
Today, every one use ballsRail, forgetting scraping is a fantating méthod of finishing, even for mounting those rails
it takes time to learn, but it's so important when building sliding pieces
Regards
;)
Scraping parts is a learned skill. Scrapping parts is more natural to machinists.
NYC CNC my best one was when i had a photocopy of a fax of a hand written drawing that I could barely read and i machined a keyway to the price quote instead of a dimension. 1,350 sure looked like 1.350"
Glad to see you made it to the class! I-75 and Atlanta traffic is the worst!
Thanks for showing this. Great shots too. Glad you're ok.
Great video, John! I've always wondered how scraping was done. I've always seen the evidence on the machines I've run and been told by other machinists that it is an art (which it is). I also never knew what flaking was and/or why. Your comparison to gage blocks ringing really was a perfect explanation. The amount of education you pack into your videos is great. Explaining the WHY instead of just the HOW. Keep up the great work. I hope to come down for the open house in May.
Excellent overview of the class!!
That looks like an awesome class.
It is neat seeing a few of my favorite youtubers in 1 video doing what they love. Take care and have a quick recovery.
Glad you're ok. This is great stuff. Looked almost as fun as it was to come out to your classes. What a great leap forward that was for me, thanks again! This stuff is great perspective on what it takes to build machines with such tight tolerance using human interaction vs. another machine to get results.
love the videos. always informative and encouraging the viewers to explore! Keep up the great work.
Happy to know you're still alive. Keep up the good work. I'm learning here. Please stay alive. Love.
Great job covering the class and I especially like how you engaged the other folks there in your video. Glad your accident wasn't worse!
Hi mate. Good to see you are ok. Bloody character doing the class anyway. I hope you'll have yourself checked out with a full scan when you get home. It will be mutch harder proofing any injury later in life if it's not recorded on paper. Take care!
Hey John, Just wanted to say that I'm glad you're alright. I'm a relatively new subscriber but your videos are absolutely fantastic, your enthusiasm and communication skills make for wonderful educational videos and I would be heartbroken were we to lose you. Your videos sparked my interest in machining, I had no idea about the sheer complexity of your job and how much knowledge is required to effectively do what you do. I love the idea of being handed a set of parameters for a part and then having to figure out the rest, each project has it's own unique set of challenges that must be overcome. I just recently graduated high school last summer and have been working, holding off on school while looking for something that genuinely interests me, the last thing I want to do is get stuck with a job I hate. I guess what I'm trying to say is that you opened my mind up to a completely different world and for that I am grateful. Just thought I'd let you know that I greatly appreciate what you do and I'm really happy that you're ok. Keep up the amazing work. - Matt
Good to see all the boys working together. Richard is a local Minnesotian. Some of the machinist courses teach scraping to students here in Minnesota. But up here we are a lot like New York in that in spring time we all come out to see who made it through the winter. Good to see these very simplistic and very informative videos from you folks. Man thinking back I remember Dick Horbals Bridgeport rebuilding business.
A lucky escape from a car crash. really glad you are ok. scraping metal is something I had never heard of so was really interesting thanks for sharing.
Hey buddy glad your feeling OK but if I can make a suggestion, you should certainly get an MRI done. I was in a much less eventful accident and thought I was fine but family urged me to get an MRI and it showed 5 herniated discs! I still felt fine for about 3 days and then it hit ... Terrible pain and now I have 12-15% mobility loss that's degenerative. I pray that you will not have any injuries but please consider a thorough checkup, an x ray is not sufficient!
I am SO glad you are okay after the car accident. Take it easy - your body will lock up in a week as the scar tissue tightens. You are one of the most positive humble persons I've ever come across and enjoy your contribution to RUclips.
Great insight into hand scraping, glad to hear your not seriously hurt in the accident.
Awesome video, I always been interested in scrapping. I really appreciate the time you took to make this video. Get well soon!!
John glad to hear you are OK, take care of yourself. Great video on the class. Looks like it was a great experience.
So glad you're OK John !! I've done a lot of dangerous stuff in my life & it always amazes me that just driving down the highway or crossing the street can be one of the most dangerous things of all !!
Looks like all of you had fun and learned a lot.
John, So glad you are OK after the accident. Also thanks for the run down on the scraping class. I took Richard King's class in a super condensed 2-1/2 day format a few years back. The longer format seems to be a better experience. For instance I learned some techniques from watching this that weren't in the class I took. And I was reminded of techniques I'd forgotten.
just to mention, when I scrape I run the yellow, then the blue, them I rub the part on a dry portion of plate to make the high spots dull/shine, tip from Richard on the PM forum, love it man thanks for the video
Thanks for this video -it has helped me get to grips with my scraping project - alas handscraping only - but great information and tips your are passing on. All the best Mat
Glad you're OK. BTDT on large wrecks. Take it easy and don't overdo it.
Thanks for spreading info like this. Im learning a crap ton about things out side of my primary wheelhouse but I'm now doing a lot because of the current job.
i haven't machined in yrs. this is incredibly skilled. amazing
really awesome stuff
First and foremost I am truely delighted that your alive and you appear to be OK following a heavy serious traffic accident although I guess you have a huge collection of colourful collections of bruises to show for it!
I have enjoyed watching your two videos on this subject as well as the others from this class, many thanks for recording, editing and putting it up on RUclips
Thank You, Thank You, I have always wondered how that was done. Not only do I know how it's done, but why. I would love to take that class, however, realistically, I'm a hobbyist and could never afford or justify it.
Great video, and so glad you not seriously hurt in your crash.
I wish classes like these were held in my area. I'd so love to attend one to learn new skills.
NYC CNC Don't be sorry for broken equipment after a crash like that. I'd rather have to tip my head for a video, than bow it. Thank goodness you are still alive to have another day!
glad you enjoyed it....Richard is a character....
and on to my third set of camera angles on this.. thanks for posting looks like fun was had by all and im betting a trip to no snow was a bonus lol greetings from ottawa
love the video. Anytime two of my favorite machinists ( John and Adam) are on the same video it's a good one.
Nice video John, enjoyed.
do you feel different being under all those lathe guys? Nice seeing you all there =), and it was also funny seeing all those "youtubers" from another perspective, like adam just walking by.
Excellent video!....thanks
Glad you are OK! People just need to pay attention on the roads. Most accidents are from not paying attention.
Keep up the good videos!
just remember me for the time in the mechanic class. When You are young, You don't feel the value of teaching and knowledges. When You get older, You even ready to pay for it. I did this same for 2 month in east Hungary with great old teachers when I'am student. I even can feel the smel of the blue paint from this video :) Thx! Anyway, glad to see You in one piece after the accident. Maybe just a gimbal hurt from that :) what gimbal is that?
Glad to hear you're okay! Great video as usual.
NYC CNC glad your doing ok after your accident hope you make a full recovery thanks for the videos
Ok so, first I am thankful your ok John, dude, last time I went to GA, I saw a Dodge 2500 or 3500 towing a box trailer, about 30 foot, a long trailer, and I was in the middle lane on 95s. I belive I was south of South Carolina and he was cruising about 80 maybe 85 in the high speed lane. I was in my e150 about 70 or 75, in the middle lane and when he passed I had a bad feeling. I decided to slow down a bit, down to 65 and give him room. when he started to fish tail he was about 6 or 7 car lengths ahead and went from driving to spinning and perpendicular to the highway in the breakdown lane, his box broke free and did quite a few flips. No one was hurt, and some how he missed every one on the highway. I try to take it a little easier now, and I was coming from Rhode Island.
Ok second, the small view in to the world of scraping has given me such a better understanding of just how important it is in the world. I am a electrician by trade, but basement hobbiest as far as machining and this was a fantastic video. I really want to take the class now my self. thank you for the view in to this.
sorry to hear about the accident, glad you are OK
ahhhh 2 videos at once!
Good to see abom there
John, really happy to hear you're okay after that accident. I wish I had gotten to meet you before you left the city. We had exchanged messages years ago just as you were going through with the move. I've been trying to do a get together of the local machinists. Not too many of us, but Corey (capocoreyollo on instagram) from NJ and another friend of mine are planning on having a scraping get together within the next month. I'll be sure to post some videos of what we learn. Your videos (as well as Keith's, Adam's, James', and the rest of them) are always a huge inspiration. Rest well, and be sure to visit a neurologist to check you don't have any internal swelling or anything of the sort.
-David Xerri
Sorry to hear about the accident. Glad you walked away with minimal injury.
If you haven't already, go get checked out. If you took a hard enough hit to lose memory of the accident, a few x-rays of your neck and back are probably not a bad idea.
Hey John! Wow, I watched your video after watching Abom's video - I thought at the time you didn't seem quite your usual self. Takes a while to get over shock like that - glad you're OK!
soz to hear about the crash
hope u recover soon
from down under
I have a vague memory of my father-in-law talking about scraping parts for the Saturn rockets. I'll ask him next time I see him.
I glad you are ok
I'm glad you're safe. It's a very interesting video and thank you! One question about the video, where do you get soundtracks for your videos? Are they free or you pay for them?
Glad you're OK.
Really cool classes!
All of you got there not only the knowledge and skills, but also a friendly atmosphere to work in groups.
If You think that electro scraper is too expensive, You can use alternative technic.For rough "scraping" You can use an angle grinder with thin cut disk (0.8 - 1.0 mm). For fine work Dremel-like tool.
It needs some experience to do, but that a very effective and MUCH faster in result.
If have you a question, I try to help :)
Wow! Sorry to hear you got into an accident I hope your okay as sometimes you get those delayed reactions on injuries sustained. Thanks for the video.
Glad you're ok...
Question: What is the bluing/yellowing compound being used? Didn't look like Dykem's to me? Is it just regular layout fluid?
how did you get the parallel castings and how much did they cost each ?
Super glad you pushed on and made the class....having the wreck sucked but to miss the class also would've really been a disappointment.
You're like a big full-metal family! :D
Glad you were not hurt too bad! Great vid still!
Glad you're doing fine!
Hi John I need a small suggestion for my b-tech project based on machining
and at last I am great fan of your videos
I now have some idea what it is and how it is done good video glad you are sort of ok
In order to get an engineering degree metal scraping used to be a requisite. Not anymore.🤦♂️
I would have loved to learn how during my engineering degree. A lot of the practical information I needed to know to be an engineer I had to learn on my own. Some more hands-on and practical, on-the-job training really should be required for engineers. A lot of engineers come out of school not knowing GD&T, how to read or create a print, or how to measure or indicate, or how to actually make things. Engineering apprenticeships really should be reinforced
my goodness, its like a tao/zen/yoga/magik alloy fot tool makers
I've was handedly given spare scrape tools
Knowing year's later what did I do that deserved such accomplishments. 🎉.next auto adjustable tierod.😅
Glad you were not severely hurt in that car wreck!
I wonder how much the blue builds up on the surfaceplate
How much does one stroke removes typically?
You can call it, scraping party!!
glad you were not hurt
Adam is the man but great video👍👍
For amateur use, I wonder if a power scraper can be improvised out of a sawsall or similar reciprocating tool, with a diy blade? Obviously for professional use I'd spend the $$$ on the Biax, but...
Great job John. I heard the class was good and you had a pretty nasty mishap on the way. Good you're ok.
Seems it went pretty much as I expected on the parallel straight edge. A couple of suggestions if I can offer them.
If hand scraping I lay my scraper down in the direction I'm scraping, that way when I come back to it I know which way I was going last cycle. Especially when the blue is getting thin, rotate the part end for end, even in good lighting situations it will tend to favour one direction more than another, and will cause you to see points more easily in some areas, while missing others.
As I mentioned previously, bluing a ground surface is pretty much a waste of time, it will just smear everywhere. You should do a couple of passes in different directions so the whole surface is scraped, that way it picks up the blue properly.
Probably one of the biggest mistake people new to the field do is chase PPI before ensuring their geometry is correct and then the flatness is correct. That wastes a lot of time. Get the geometry right (or with experience you will do that as you scrape down), then flatness, finally PPI. Don't worry we all tend to go for PPI too early ;)
Finally ALWAYS handle that straight edge with thick gloves. If you have some blue there an interesting exercise is to blue your plate, leave the straight edge on the plate for 30 minutes and then get a rub. Hopefully it will be straight and you'll have even bearing ;) Now take your gloves off, lift it up by the centre and carry it over to a bench and clean it off, ie simulate a scraping cycle, carry it back to the plate and give it another rub. A casting like that will be quite high at the ends just from the few seconds of carrying it. The same applies when you're now using it, ALWAYS wear gloves or you'll have a kind sorta not really straight edge.
Great job on the scraping and as always another enjoyable video.
I rarely know what I'm doing mate, but bumble along regardless!
I scrape Babbitt bearings same principle but physically easier on the body. We do this on large electric motors for power plants and steel mills
hi mate I'm just a beginner and finding this cnc desktop a little bit daunting
the intro songs first 1/2 second reminded me of "i dont know" by ozzy
I wonder if it would be possible to repurpose something like a DeWalt reciprocating saw, to a power scraper? They are both pushing in the same forward axis I think?
MLTomson throw a rheostat on it in place of the trigger to control the speed. Make a scraper blade by braising some carbide and Bob's your uncle. Only problem I see is a sawsall has a long stroke compared with the power scrapers. But give it a try.
With that being said, I looked at the parts diagram on my cordless sawzall as to how to control stroke length. Its only 1 part that would have to be swapped out for a shorter shaft. You'd still have to make a new shaft on the lathe, but yeah its definitely do-able. So you would save about $1500 if you made your own, rather than purchasing a new legit Dapra Biax power scraper.
What happend to the card to Abom's video @ 13:15
too soon to leave us not done setting up shop!! Take care
So after the car crash, did you drive the last 3-4 hours? I don't think I could have done that. Glad to hear your ok
Glad to hear you didn't put yourself through that
Out of curiosity - wouldn't one of Oscillating Multi-Tools work as substitute for those expensive power scrapers?
@3rdHalf, I have a Makita variable speed cordless LXT unit, (model DTM50, 6000-20000 opm), that might work well on the slowest speed if you made a carbide blade for it or ground a carbide tipped saw blade smooth and sharp but you'd have to use fast strokes to get the kind of pattern the slower purpose built units produce. You could use a standard floor scraping blade with the curved edge ground square in section and either harden it fully or braze a carbide or HSS tip to it? I think it's a great idea and very doable, though I personally don't see why hand scraping is even necessary these days with EZ Lap or DMT diamond plates/stones available. Scraping might look nice and in skilled hands will remove serious material fast but you're actually creating a very bumpy surface which won't allow the oil to keep the faces apart unless you stone it down to the low spots and good luck with that. I'm sure if you need to recondition a machine, scraping is actually a faster process than using stones and files alone but diamond plates can cut super fast and if you have a good flat one it should be way easier and you're not depositing abrasive particles in the metal, (once the diamond plate is worn in to remove loose grit and flatten it properly). Also, you can feel the high spots with a plate and they will naturally be removed first if you have one long and flat enough. Ultimately what you want are two perfectly flat mating surfaces with an intact oil boundary layer which won't allow any metal to metal contact and adding a pattern will only disrupt the oil film integrity further and trap the worn off high spots and grit etc. after bedding in which is why machine ways wear out in the first place, poor lubrication notwithstanding, of course. Ideally, if you have a can of elbow grease handy, after final scraping in and/or stoning, the two mating surfaces should be hand lapped together with only WD40 to lubricate them if they're small enough to handle, cleaning the grey sludge off frequently. You'll find that with some effort it produces a truly superior oil film separation of the parts and no more wear if maintained properly with frequent lubrication shots with Mobil Vactra 2 or similar way oil.
Here is even better idea:
I just found out, that there attachments to reciprocating saws, that make it possible to attach all kinds of scrapers...
...if you catch my drift. :D
Glad your ok John, that is some tough luck jezzz. Always look at the up side tho.... Your walking ..... and it wasn't your car 😉
Sorry about your accident. ATL traffic is the worst. Bet the lawyers are after you. But, there is a lesson here, which is there is a need for caution with lane speed differentials. UPS actually talked about it in their driver training course I took years ago.
But how do they flat a surface plate? Because that is where your precision comes from right?
They lap it with a cast iron lap charged with diamond abrasive grit.
Three plates method. If you don't have a known flat surface you can take three flattish surfaces and scrape them down to make them flatter than they were before. It's the same process as they're doing above pretty much but after you've made two surfaces flat against each other you then throw another surface into the mix and do it a few more times.
No price of this class on their website... If you have to ask...
love it! Hope you are feeling god after your roolover