I’ve been using muc-off for almost 2 years, with Panaracer Gravelking SS tires, it’s been a dream, not only has it sealed everything that has punctured my tires, but also a pretty massive burp that I didn’t even notice at the time but when I realized my pressure was a bit low and went to air up I saw where the sealant had exploded out of the bead and resealed while I rode along happily. I didn’t have to add air for months when I first set them up.
I've been running Stan's "regular" since 2015 in mountain bike and since 2020 in road tires (32mm, 55 psi). The only punctures that didn't seal were sidewall cuts. Be sure to check the level and condition of your sealant every month or so using a zip tie as a dip stick through the valve. If the sealant is clear, you've had a puncture at some point and all the latex has been consumed. I draw the old clear sealant out through the valve with a straw on a syringe and replace with fresh sealant.
I have been using tubeless on mountain bikes almost since the beginning and have had very good luck with Stans. It even sealed a small snakebite on the sidewall with a little help by taking the wheel off and putting the bite down so the sealant could get to it. I have also tried Orange seal. It worked but no better than Stans and cost more. There is some maintenance with sealant but I find it better than tubes which snakebite and go flat with thorns. I’ll never go back to tubes.
Great tip. I was not aware of this. I’ve never had a puncture that I’m aware of, not even with tubes. I’m sure I’ll find out soon enough though. I’m new to tubeless so I will keep an eye on this.
Same here. I been on stans for a few years also. I have puncture a few times and it has seal. I run about 75 PSI in my road bike. When I puncture I lose about 10 psi before it seals it completely. When I get home after the ride I fine the seal and plug it. On my gravel bike I have only punction once it was not able to seal it completely but enough to slow the leak to finish the ride. Plugged it once I got home. I also use a syringe to suck up the old sealant and add new sealant every 3 month
Stan's has worked super well for me for MTB, fatbike (in winter), Gravel, and road. Even at 50 psi, it's fine. The worst that can happen at 50-60psi is that you'll need a plug. I'd rather use Stan's normal compared to race/MucOff/Silca so I can still inject through the valve stem. To me, being able to inject through the valve and being able to seal around a plug is much better than the headache with putting in the sealant as you setup the tires. And, fixing punctures with a plug is still better than changing an inner tube.
I have been using Silca for a while now and have not had any issues with pouring. As you mention, I always seat the tire empty and then pop one side open, pour the Silca sealant in and then use a tire tool to pop the tire back on, but I inflate it (without a canister, just a regular pump) before I slush it around it so only tiny amounts of sealant show up in a few places - easy to wipe at that point. Silca also sells this 'replenisher' which will go through th valve but I have found popping the tire (with a tool, not by hand) and pouring sealant easier than removing the valve core and adding the replenisher.
I've been using Muc-off sealant on my gravel bike for the last year and a half and it's worked wonders for me. Small cuts to the tire which have sealed itself during rides. I definitely think it's up to tire/rim combo as well as sealant. Currently using Specialized Pathfinder Pro tires with Roval Terra CL wheels.
same with me, on the gravel bike it works fine. Have had some trouble on road tires, maybe related to the higher pressure. I slice a tire recently and found 6 or 7 holes clotted - I never really noticed I had that many holes, but it explaines the odd low pressure. So fine with me.
Run muck off on both gravel and road for 4 years, gravel it is fine. Road I think the higher tyre pressures don’t help, I have had punctures seal, and I have had them intermittently open and spray me but seal again. Switched to Schwalbe blue on road bike and no problems since, but muck off in the gravel
I’ve been using tubeless for over a year now. It’s a life changer. I’ve been out on rides and not realise I had a puncture until I get home. Also I have always used Muc-Off sealant and it’s never let me down. Everyone has their own unique story. I’m not here to convince anyone. Just wanted to mention that there are success stories out there!
I was a little bit excited when I finally purchased a bicycle that cost more than $1k. It came with tubeless tires. “New technology” for me concerning bicycles. I purchased a plug kit so I would be ready for flats. Seemed a convenient upgrade compared to fiddling with tubes on the trail. I discovered it was actually “tubeless ready”. From what I’ve learned about tubeless bicycle tires since my purchase, I am so glad that it actually has tubes installed. I want to have the knowledge about tubeless in case I need to assist someone else, but I have no intention of installing tubeless tires on any of my bicycles. Great video 👍😎
Thank you for sharing your real life experience. I wondered why people would run tubeless and after seeing this i'll prefer the once in a year walk home.
I've been tubeless for a few years on my mountain bike and it's really not any drama once you understand the maintenance required and you have the appropriate tools. Stans Sealant works well for me. I've finally made my road bike tubeless which was the easiest job. The only time the sealant failed was when I didn't change it often enough. I'm running the latest PZERO 4S Race TLR tires in 28mm size on my road bike.
Been using Stans for years,, got 2 puncture on the weekend,, the sealant sprayed alot on both but also sealed both up within seconds and continued riding without stopping.
I’ve using Stans sealant on my commuter road bike with 30mm tyres for 4 years but I’ve decided to give up on Stans and maybe try Orange seal. The very first tubeless pin prick puncture on the road a few years back sealed with Stans right up but that’s the last time Stans has ever sealed a hole for me without intervention. Even small holes (like a small piece of wire) doesn’t seal or does but only keeps running with low pressure. As soon as you pump it up to 70psi (which is about correct for 30mm tyres) the sealant just blows out and pressure comes right down. With Stans I find I have to plug the hole with a slug of some sort. Had to do 3 like that on the road in the last month. Stan’s seems more suited to the lower pressures of MTB. I’m hoping Orange seal will be more suitable for road.
I have been running normal Stans, Conti and Milkit over the last 3 years and all worked very well. It's more a trade off between dry-out and sealing properties. Also some tyre manufacturers (e.g. Veloflex) specify natural or synthetic based sealants. All in all you are right that it can be pretty messy when changing tyres but at least for me the performance and puncture protection is just so much better. (I never run anything smaller than 28 on 22c rims which is more like 30mm real size, so below 5 bar for max pressure)
I’ve been tubeless for two years. I run 28’s and have used Stan’s exclusively. I’ve punctured multiple times that I’ve confirmed and have always gotten home with minimal pressure loss. Once you dial in your technique life is much easier, and the lower pressures and better grip are amazing.
I use muc-off sealant and have had great success with both road and gravel. I ride road up to about 70 psi and it's no problem at all. I would easily recommend it to others, especially because it's one of very few that is compatible with CO2 inflation. It is more vicious than others like Stans so I use a bit more volume of sealant. It also doesn't dry out much, smells good, eco friendly, and washes easily as long as you don't let it dry. I believe it doesn't use ammonia so it doesn't smell bad.
Interesting, I think you might be the first person I know who has had a good experience with using Muc Off. Glad to hear it's worked for someone at least
@@SpinAnGrin I’ve used multiple sealants and muc off has always been the one I’ve returned to. I use it in mtb and gravel, I would say it’s sealed all punctures and even to the point where I’ve got home and noticed a few spots on the frame and not affected the ride. It’s been great. I trust it 100% Are you using enough?
Just glad it's worked for someone. Oh yes, I have more than enough In there. I forgot to include it in the video but I have a photo from when the muc off didn't work for me. The pink sealant everywhere up the back of the bike and a flat tire 😅
Been on tubeless about a year. Had my first puncture just last week. Didnt even know while riding I had punctured. Got home saw a bit of sealant spray on back of seat tube wiped right up. Using Stans. Seemed to work great for me. Barely lost any air at all from tire. And when putting in sealant it's much easier to remove the valve core after the tire was seated and with a syringe insert the sealant. Put valve core back in and pump up. No mess, no drips of sealant no need to clean wheels. No mess period.
Top tip. For holes that are created by flints and bigger than thorns I use one of the petals from a stans Dart plug pushed into the hole with a sharp prodder. The stans Darts work on bigger holes but the puncture protection layer is too tough to put the dart through for the small holes. I've been using Stans sealant for 10 years and it works for me.
This just happenned to me last weekend at a gravel race. Got some sealant spray and stopped to inspect. This was likely my first mistake. Propably should have just continued riding and waited for the sealant to do its magic with the pressure getting lower. Anyway as I stopped I found a hole and proceeded to put in a Stans dark. First try I got the dart head in, but the rest did not penerate the hole. Same with the second one. Tried to push it in with what was left the dart (the small plastic stick). No success. So I decided to inflate with co2. The tyre started to hold air. Maybe the sealant worked in the end. Maybe poking the puncture cleaned the hole helping the sealant do its thing. Anyway: For a hole of this size the darts were useless. I hear Stans has changed the design. Mine has a clear tip. The previous (dark one) may be better. In this case something smaller would have been needed. Petal pushed with a prodder sounds just about right.
Sounds like you are eventually going to be like me and just give up with the whole idea of tubeless one day. I spent years trying road tubeless, many tire brands and all the sealants on the market and still when I got a puncture I was not able to continue riding my bike until I put a tube in to get me home. I spent an unimaginable amount of money, I'm sure the industry thanks me for that, but I won't spend another dime on it ever again. I now use TPU tubes which have been great. I can carry 3 tubes which take up the same space as one rubber tube so that really makes me feel better about finishing a ride and not getting stuck out on the road somewhere. No more messes for me thank you, and if you use sealant I won't ride with you because you are not getting your mess on me when you puncture.
I think for my road setup, I will end up back with TPU tubes like you mention. For gravel though, I need to stick with tubeless as I feel more confident with the lower pressure and grip.
Thank you for a good video. I do not quite share the experience you have 🙂 After using innertubes all my life, I just went tubeless this very weekend, with my Bontrager wheels. I had absolutely no problem using a normal floor pump... and I also just added the sealant (Silca) through the valve with no issues. I for sure hope it works when I get my first hole!
Stans worked great in my MTB for ten years. Started running Orange Seal in my gravel bike last year and have not had a single issue (6000 miles). Recently set up the road bike tubeless, (Orange Seal ) and it has been great so far. In over 10K miles of riding I have only had to use plugs twice (on MTB), and only had one hole that was too large for a plug.
Wow this made me re-think going tubeless on my all-road bike. Got a flat during a ride this weekend, but I was back on the road in under 5 minutes. All this mess looks far worse than that! Thanks for your candor.
Tubeless tires don’t have to be removed from the rim tubeless patch kit plugs the hole with rubber strip! Way faster then taking the tube out and patching it!
@@triggword7648I always carry a spare inner, just swap it and do the patching at home. Only had 2 flats in 12 years on 2 different bikes, and I bike daily (commuting with my normal Dutch bike). Patching at home takes less then 10 minutes including reinstalling the “old” inner.
@@triggword7648 as a deliveroo rider who was getting a lot of punctures even with marathon plus tyres and a tube with sealant inside I switched to tubeless and never looked back. I've had a few punctures that couldn't self seal but a quick flip of the bike and a stab with bacon strip means I could be on my way.
I have been using Stan's standard sealant without any issues. All punctures have self sealed. I also carry some tyre plugs, just in case the hole is too large. I also top up through the valve.
Me and my mates all use muc-off never had a problem. I had my front tyre go down after sending it on a down hill on rocky terrain. i inflated it and its been up ever since. We are using mountain bikes .It makes me wonder if the high pressures of road bike tyres can cause the sealant not to seal and then fail with the high psi.
This season I tried Muc-off; the puncture was a pinhole on the tread, not the side wall. Long story short, I carried the wrong size valve/ spare tube and had to walk 5 miles home. I will not repurchase Muc-off. I didn't realize this, but I was an early adopter of Tubeless; for awhile, I've been looking left and right to see if others were experiencing the maintenance downside -- well, it appears we are at peak "tired of the maintenance." I had a blowout b/c I didn't add fresh sealant, no severe injuries, but you can imagine how spectacular that crash was. Thanks for sounding the alarm.
Glad I stumbled upon this! I'm using the same wheels, tires and valves you are but I've been having trouble losing pressure non stop. I noticed you are using the square shaped rubber piece on the valve (inside the wheel) and I've been using the cone shaped one. Wondering if that makes a huge difference?
You can use sealant in the inner tubes too, mine is Slime and there are also protection tapes that go between the inner tube and the tyre for extra resistance.
Thank you for your brutial honesty. As a weight weenie and a clean freak, I have been considering going tubeless because I have the wheels, tires and Muck-off to do so on my road bike. I wanted to go lighter by removing my inner tubes but the slightly less weight doesn't seem to overcome the potential mess (even with gloves) and bi-yearly maintence needed to go tubeless. I'll stick with butyl rubber inner tubes for now. I am considering going TPU but I still consider them to be in the R&D phase of development plus are currently not compatable with my old school side pull rim brakes. As for my MTB, for now, I will still stick with inner tubes filled with Slime. If I replace my wheels with tubeless ones, I might consider running with sealant AKA "glue".
I have been on a similar journey but went back to muc off. I've tried Silca, Joe's, Stans and muc off. Milage seems to vary depending on humidity, discipline and pressure. My biggest tips are: 1. Once you put sealant in a tire, that sealant and tire are married until death do they part. Relatively small holes plugged with one sealant tend to never really seal after replacement of one to another, especially true if you have a plug in it. 2. Use dynaplugs. Their applicator works even when you still have 80psi inside, if you don't disturb them, they survive the life of the tire. 3. Taking the tire off has a tendency to mess up the nicely dried holes, and once disturbed never seem to really seal again. The best way to manage sealant is to mess with it as little as possible. Silca is the best "race day sealant" as they say, it works better than anything else once fresh but after a few months it starts to ball up. Once you have balls its not much better than Stans, which is my worst experience. You have to do a full clean out and replacement. It is also the hardest sealant to maintain at home due to the base product not being added through the valve. I've even had a case of a relatively small hole that wouldn't seal without a plug after just a couple of weeks. Once you have reached that full year and need to change the sealant you're pretty much up for replacing the tires which have been plugged. It also gums up your valve... So back to muc off, which to me is 95% as good, can be topped up at any time, and seems to function more consistently between top ups.
Pardon my ignorance, but what occurs when you attempt to inflate the tire after a couple of days? As tires tend to lose pressure over time, would the sealant seal the valve when you use a pump, considering pumps typically release a small amount of air when connecting it?
I don't have the need to actually pump the tires up all the often. They hold the pressure for weeks. I've also never had a issue with the valves getting blocked 🤞
Probably 8 yrs now tubeless, was a bit of a hassle in the early days when the tyres were thin & the beads weren’t the most precisely manufactured but I swear it’s simply fit & forget now & thats on an MTB with rim impacts & sidewalk holes all sealing. Literally too it up through the removable valve every couple months or when I need to change tyres. Sooooo much better than tubes!
I have used Muc Off for a couple of years with 42mm gravel tyres and it has always sealed well. Its just a pain to get off your frame once it has dried on. I have just moved over to Silca, so too early to tell, but I'm confident it will be very good.
Hey SpinAnGrin, love your video. I started using tubeless for about a year now since I bought a Gravel bike. Never used tubeless before and since run clinchers on my road bikes. I had no idea what I was doing with tubeless and spoke to a local bike shop, they recommended Muc-Off and I haven't had a problem with the stuff. I find tubeless tires themselves more a pain in the arse then the sealant. For example tubeless tires are a pain to seat for some reason. I was out the local NP and hit a small rock at speed. It didn't puncture or pierce the tire, but rather pushed the air out. I checked and double checked the tire it was good. I put more air in and the tire slowly went down. I had to do this all the way home where I put more sealant in the tire. I little sealant came out from the bead and then sealed. Its fine since.
I wasn’t a fan of tubeless but have been using it on my gravel and mountain bike as they both come set up tubeless. From what I’ve gathered sealant works best at lower pressures. So I’m my gravel bike I’m running between 35-40 psi on my mtb between 20-28. I’ve used bontrager and stand sealant. Both plugged up small holes, found the stand worked better. I’ve now switched to silca in my mtb which I think is overkill but will try it in a road set as I’ll be running higher pressures and due to silca having those carbon flecks will help. It’s definitely designed more for road tires. Another one in stans race day sealant, spoke to a pro racer and he said he uses that in his tires and works very well.
I'm running the muc-off valve stems and silica sealant and my front tire specifically clogs the valve core with sealant that I end up changing it out every 5 rides or so, just completely gunked up no matter what I try position wise when storing it. I'm about to give up
Totally agree on the mess created, even when one is being extra careful not to create any in the first place. I recently had to chuck two perfectly good tyres, because I just couldn't remove the dried on, crusty old sealant inside them. I've gone back to inner tubes for the foreseeable future.
I'm not familiar with roadie tyres but tubeless setup works wonders on MTB's. Not a single puncture in 5 years - just check and to up sealant every 3 months. Simples
I use the Sealant from muc-off. I ran over a pretty big nail just yesterday, and it sealed perfectly. pulled it out, and squirted out some sealant, but in a matter of milliseconds, it sealed everything just fine. I probably rode 3-5k Kilometers on their sealant. I always recommend their sealent, and never heard of a friend, to whom I recommended it, that they had a problem. all say it works like a charm on their bikes.
I've used road tubeless and orange seal for a few years now and not had any issues, or this much drama or around my tires. I can mount my tires using a floor pump as well.
I definitely have had Muc-Off seal punctures. But I have also had punctures that did not look too big that it did not seal. So I am also going to experiment with other sealants.
I bought a new Continental Grand Prix 5000 S tubeless on 5/15/23 (rear). My front tire is a Mavic tubeless which are no longer available. I had 1 or 2 punctures in each tire that sealed up fine (orange sealant). I rode about 2400 miles during this time, and 8/3/23 the Conti lost air pressure but didn't go flat. Took it in to my LBS and they said the sealant had almost dried up due to the hot summer weather. I replaced the Conti with a new tire and had them top off the sealant in both tires. I run 78 psi in the front tire and 80 psi in the rear. I like how the tubeless tires feel on the road. I rode for 3 months and never had to fix a flat and the roads are pretty bad here in San Diego county. That said, running tubes is less expensive and it's easier to fix your own flats.
I use Muc-Off and replace it, at most, once a year. I can now see a few spots where it has fixed punctures I never knew were there. Mounting tyres tubeless is real easy too if you get the right tyres. I can recommend Schwalbe for super easy installation.
Running Stan´s in my 47mm Gravel tires, and had no issue whatsoever. >Was also surprised at the ease with which I have completed the setup using just a floor pump. Been riding pavement, gravel, doubletrack, light singletrack and also some pretty chunky and sharp stuff. If there were any punctures, they were of the kind that I haven´t even noticed. Checking and topping up the sealant 3-6 months. Best decision I´ve ever made.
Tubeless has been a godsend for me. The lower pressure is a noticeably more comfortable ride and I can rail corners with more confidence. The road I ride on often has little glass shards and debris littered throughout. I used to get punctures often with clinchers, and I didn't mind changing the tubes out. But it's been over 2 years since I've had to stop during a ride since switching to tubeless. ~5k miles per yr. I have had several cuts that sealed instantly and I was able to get home. Additionally, I notice my tires gather less nicks and cuts in them with the lower pressure as well. I'm using Stan's regular. I'm never going back to clinchers.
I have used Orange Seal Endurance with no issues at all for my road bike, with Schwalbe pro one, GP5000 STR and Challenge Strada Pro and Challenge Criterium RS). Yet, a week ago I purchased a Silca tubeless sealant (to try it) but after watching your video I think I will not ever use it. Especially due to the fact that the Challenge tyres are quite difficult to install on my tight rims (not to seat them after you install, but just to install them). For me, the only way to setup them tubeless is to inject the sealant through the valve, but this is impossible as you stated. Is there any other option? Thank you !
Not for the Silca no. The bits of carbon fibre will clock any Injector took or valve. I've now switched back to orange seal and Dyna plugs and it's working a treat
I had issues with the Vittoria Corsa tires 28mm and also my panaracer 38mm slicks :/ Both had issues especially with Muc off but also Stans and orange seal. Since putting in Silca, I haven't even had to pump them up once!
Stan's makes a specific sealant for road use, much chunkier and viscous than the standard one as standard won't coagulate fast enough at pressures over 2bars
Interesting. A few people are saying Stans has worked for them but it never did for me. It's the only one that people have said works other than Silca.
I let my bike shop set it up for me! No problem! If I get a flat I use a dynaplug which is WAY easier than changing a tube on a tight gp5000 which is impossible to get off…. Tubeless is easy and requires nothing of me at all.
Happy Muc-Off user here, no issues for me so far. I've actually switched from a different brand (latex based sealant) which was also OK in terms of sealing the punctures, but I was tired of cleaning the inside of the tires from the sticky residues. Muc-Off is leaving some "chalky" residue instead (which is very easy to remove). So, now I'm using Muc-Off in two bikes. One is a gravel bike with Panaracer GravelKings SK 43 mm. These tyres are not a perfect combination with the rims, slightly loose on the rim bed and hard to seal without the compressor, but it is regardless of which sealant is used. In my MTB it's a completely different story, the tight fit of the Schwalbe Nobby Nics 2.6" on the rim results as sealing on the rim (and holding air) even without any sealant. Anyway, as for the effectiveness of Muc-Off: just 2 or 3 weeks ago I had a puncture from a big thorn in my front tyre (that Schwalbe NN in my MTB) and the pressure dropped from 1.2 I normally use to 0.6 bars (checked with Topeak digital gauge that I always have with me). Pumped up to a little higher pressure, turned the wheel few times and it has sealed after 15 seconds (the pressure dropped a little bit of course). Pumped up again to the usual pressure and Bob's your uncle. Most of the time I don't even notice that there was some puncture, only after getting back home (and doing some inspection or cleaning the bikes) I can see some wet spots on the tyres as the evidence of the fact that there was some puncture.
Wow, you're genuinely the first person that I know of that has successfully used muc off. I'm not sure what it is but I genuinely can't get it to work with road tyres. Maybe it needs the larger volume of air to help seal? That's the only thing I can think of at this point 🤷
28mm tires I run around 55 PSI. My 38mm panaracer slicks I ran around 35 PSI. These have been over 2 different wheel set combinations. Not sure what I would be doing wrong. The Silca being latex based is a pain, but it just works I find.
@SpinAnGrin Some sealants only work at MTB-ish pressures. Muc-Off is probably one of them, like Stan's is. Stan's will seal up nicely below about 45 psi, but at road bike pressures, you might as well use actual milk. Orange is the only sealant that can seal at ~70+ psi, in my experience (have not tried "glue" ).
Like you I've tried all the brands of Sealant in the last 5 years and like you I've now settled on Silca and I'll never use anything else going forward! I also find that the tires hold pressure for weeks.
Orange seal on my road bike worked fantastically well (80 psi), no real issues with installation or otherwise - 6 years and never been on the side of the road, 4 punctures sealed perfectly. Most of the people who whinge about tubeless have either never tried it or didn’t bother to do their homework first and then want to blame the technology as flawed….
Late to the party but here is my experiences with tubeless on road and gravel so far. Road w/ muc-off: On a zipp 404 / michelin power cup combo. Tire seated perfectly, sealed many smaller holes with no issue - bigger holes sealed easily using Dynaplugs, still works after 8 months of heavy use. Had to change rear tire once due to wear, but sealant was easy to cleanup and reapply on new tire. Gravel w/ silca: On zipp 404 / schwalbe G-one rs combo. Tire searted after a couple of attempts with booster pump. Appears to seal almost every hole regardless of size. After 3 months of use the valves clogged up completely - had to remove, clean and reapply, which was very messy and time-consuming since everything seem to have dried up. Has not been able to hold air very well ever since. Would take Muc-off over Silca mainly due to ability to syringe it through the valve and avoid a huge mess. The glue comparison on Silca is very accurate.
Running Orange Seal and I have a substantial hole in my gravel tires that it has sealed, twice. I got a nail in an ENVE SES tire and it sealed quite nicely and a metal fastening screw in a GP5000TL tire that was replaced as removing the screw destroyed the tire.
I've got 25mm wide tyres on a road bike, running at high pressure (9 BAR) - I looked into going tubeless so I could drop the pressure a little. Especially after picking up many punctures in a week (double digits) with P-Zero tyres and featherweight tubes, I was very keen to try tubeless. I never have tried it, but switched to a slightly thicker tyre with standard inner tubes and I don't think I've had a puncture since
I am useing Stans for like 3 1/2 years on my Gravel, i haven't had it fail me yet in around 19000Km, it always sealed the puncture. After getting a ton of flats last year, i allso started goin tubeless on my roadbike, with no problems till yesterday...i got a big cut in the sidewall, stans tryed too seal it, but that "hole" was just too big ;-) Toping off like all 3 months is not a big deal, and im staying tubeless. Got like 6000Km this year, on both bikes, with no issues other than the cut yesterday.
I started out with Stan’s 3-4 years on my X bike and quickly changed to Muc Off and liked it so much I went tubeless on my road bike and have had no real problems since. I did try Silca on my X bike and while it seals better than Muc off it’s just so much trouble ergo clogging up my valve stem . So I went back to Muc off as it’s sealed almost everything. And Dyna Plugs always bail me out if I’ve lost too much psi
I use FlatOut Sportsman inside of a tube. It works with tubeless too. It has kevlar fibers that physically plug the puncture. It stays liquid and is easy to wash off. I've hit big construction screws and nails, had them sticking out the tire and i'm still riding. its crazy. Its saved me an unbelievable amount of time and hastle , so many flats. The FlatOut product itself does have a bit of weight to it though, but i bet the dosage would be low for a road tire. Works great with fat tires, ive had a few times with 29er / 700C tires where it didnt work. OH and for products that DON'T work, slime tubes!! I'm like 0 for 5 on slime tubes. never again
I keep going back to Stans race sealant, it just seems to work for me. Best purchases I made was an Airshot tyre inflator because I already had a decent track pump so didn't need a new one with built in high pressure tank, the other one was a Dyna plug 'race' version for larger cuts. The biggest mistake people make when getting a puncture is constantly trying to inflate the tyre to 80+ psi! You have to ride with a softer tyre till the sealant has sealed, you also need to rotate the wheel so the hole is at the bottom to get some sealant to it then rotate it back round so you don't keep leaking sealant, give it a couple of minutes, then set off riding and top up with air as needed but DON'T inflate too hard or you'll just undo the 'glue' before it's fully dried. Hope this helps people.
You speak to me from the soul I will get myself Silca too. For the moment I messed around with Schwalbe Doc Blue and got 50:50 results. Well on a ride far away from home 50:50 ain't good enough though. So thanks a bunch for sharing your experiences. Ride on!
@@Temporalplace Sealant is for tubeless only. I use Silca only now and try to buy the most puncture resistant tires in order not to use the sealant in the first place.
What a marvelous description of TUBELESS Tyres and the use of sealant. A A PAIN in THE A$$ . You just helped me decide -- make up my mind. OLD SCHOOL still best
I've went back to tubes with much off inner tube sealant and it's been the best thing ever, Think your the only one who's not had a much off sealant work it's one the best! But if you are using carbon wheels you'll need about double or tripple the recommended amount to seal the carbon fibre as it all seaps into the raw innner carbon fibres! This is what I had to do to seal the inside of the rim first then add more sealant once the skin wall for the carbon has dried to create a smooth sealed wall! That silca could be used for just sealing the carbon rim walls as tape doesn't cover this then you could use the much off or slime
5 years tubeless so far and not one fail. Average set up time for 2 wheels 12 minutes. I've punctured several times but the sealant does its job. I set up a set of P-Zero on Lun Hyper 60 and got distracted. The next day 100 mile into a 164 mile event i suddenly remembered I'd forgot to put the sealant in! Not a problem, lost about 4 psi over both tyre's. I cant understand people struggle with these.
I use Muc Off sealant and it has worked for me, although I also generally use a plug also if a puncture doesn't seal within a few revolutions. It is a major pain to get off the frame when you get home. Also noticed you didn't seem to clean out the Muc Off sealant before adding the Silca...mixing products is generally a bad idea in case they react.
Being a full time mechanic I can say that road bikes are not suitable for running tubeless unless you have a support crew with you. There is simply too much pressure and not enough volume for the sealant to do its job. What the sealant needs, in order to work properly is a low pressure high volume tire. I have been using Orange Seal since 2015 with no issues at all.
I actually ride without sealant now in my road bike and carry 2 latex tube with me, if i get a flat I type it. I wont bother to go tubeless on road anymore, MTB is a real good experience
It's a hassle when you start, but now that I've been using it for some time it's pretty easy. I do it now almost for the quietness of the drivetrain. It's silent and just peaceful
Sorry mate, I thought this comment was under another video. With the tubeless, when you get the right combination of sealant and tires it does work. Plus you can run lower pressure so it's comfier and faster. It's just a bit of trial and error getting the right combination
After thinking for years I just decided to go tubeless on my MTB, and already started feeling the pain. Both my road bikes are with tubeless ready wheels, but I use good old fashioned tire-tube combination, and if I remember I had only two punctures in last ten years that is away from home. I did have some small leaks by nails etc with a slow pressure loss, and eventually I repaired the tubes at home. I have way too many CO2 cartridges that I never use. Just for trial I made tubeless set up on my MTB last week, cleaned up the floor three times, still not comfortable with Stans fluids on my floor; not to mention the added expense for the setting up. Let’s see how things work for this 2024, maybe, maybe I will be back with tubes in 2025. ✌🏾
I have also used a bunch of these sealants (not Silca though as it was not around then) with little success. I found the Effeto Mariposa Caffelattex the only one to work and it works wonders! I haven't had a flat that did not seal since I started using it 4 or 5 years ago. Also, getting a floor pump with canister and good tubeless tires (now on Conti GP5000 TLR) after trying the couple of brands that were available for road bikes back then.
Orange has sealed multiple punctures for me on two different bikes- Silca is great, have some in my mtb tires currently, but it’s harder to work with, and more expensive. Always best to shake up the bottle really good before pouring.
I had a first tubeless puncture two day ago with muc off and it not sealed the hole (road, 28mm tire, 80psi), I had to put a plug (only one and it was not really enough) and I was only able to inflate not more than 25psi otherwise the air come out with scealant. But by experience, it seal correctly very small air leak. sealant are liquid, they cant just turn out solid in a matter of 1 secondes with high pressure. To me, scealant are only for very small air leak or puncture, after that, plug are made for filling larger puncture holes. Thank you to share your experience with us.
I've been running Muc off in my 30mm Pirelli pzero on my road bike with zipp firecrest 303 wheels for the last 2yrs, no problem as yet.. I had a problem on 45mm Pirelli gravel M tyre the other week and had to use a mega dynaplug to stop the leak... Muc off didn't seal the split but I'm not sure if any sealant would??? Interesting views in the comments from all products...
Wondering if you've had any more success or failures for your road bike with muc-off sealant. I do wonder if the higher pressures with road compared to gravel/MTB makes it harder to seal, though it probably also depends on the brand. Cheers
@@SpinAnGrin I'm glad to hear that, especially with the challenges you've had with sealant thus far! Would you happen to know if air pressure matters in terms of the sealant working to seal a puncture? For example, does it seal the same size hole just as well if there's 65 psi compared to 35 psi? I'm also wondering if the seal isn't as durable at higher road pressures (I had a sealed puncture let go after 20 mins on road)
This is good to know. I recently paid a local bike shop to set up a new set of carbon wheels and Pirelli tires as a tubeless system and they used Muckoff sealant. The front tire was low on air the next day so when I went to take the valve cap off to add some air to the tire all the sealant blew out of the valve because they never tightened down the valve core when they installed it. Now I have to have a tube in that tire because I refuse to pay them over $100 to screw it up again.
I am on my plan to go tubless on my MTB. I have been running with inner tubes but had no punctures ever since. After watching your video, I think I'm going to stick with the inner tube call it old fashion in MTB but I think I am fine with it. :)
I didn't get on with Muc Off. Now using Peatys. I think tubeless on road tyres is far more challenging due to the increased pressures that you naturally need to use.
I’ve use both Muc-Off and Stans Race on both road and MTB without issues at all. My riding group also uses Muc-off and share a 5L jug and none have had issues either. Not sure what you may doing wrong as both Muc-off and Stan’s race has been effective with our experience. I can’t comment in Silca as I have not tired, but no doubts it will work well as I’ve had great success with their other products
Tubeless on all 3 bikes for 4 years, would never dream of using tubes again. Muc-off and stans sealant, both excellent. Tyre seals in 200-400 metres, if I get to 500m I put a dyna-plug in. Top sealant up very 3 months, use 20% more than manufacturer suggest, change completely every autumn & spring and for every tyre change (obviously). 30 seconds roadside if I need to put a plug in, no faffing about removing wheels and changing tubes. Your experiences are not typical amongst the riders I know with tubeless set ups. I really encourage you to try Muc-off again, put 20% more in and I am confident it will seal the next time you have a puncture < 5mm.
I've ridden a new gravel bike 1800 kms from new with tubeless tyres running bontrager tlr sealant. 1000 kms of that was on a trail called the munda bidi. In Western Australia and I've had no flat tyres or any problems at all.
I use stans with no issues. Never tried muc off although my mate swears by on his mtb. Great video. Like you say its not for everyone. Something else to add if you have to put tube in out on ride there is likely to be thorns/ glass etc stuck to inside of tyre from previous pictures that will just pop tube straight away. Another thing is depending on wheel and tyre combo you may not get tyre to seat out on ride . Sometimes you need a chamber of high volume of air . So your ride is over in this case.
I’ve been using muc-off for almost 2 years, with Panaracer Gravelking SS tires, it’s been a dream, not only has it sealed everything that has punctured my tires, but also a pretty massive burp that I didn’t even notice at the time but when I realized my pressure was a bit low and went to air up I saw where the sealant had exploded out of the bead and resealed while I rode along happily. I didn’t have to add air for months when I first set them up.
I've been running Stan's "regular" since 2015 in mountain bike and since 2020 in road tires (32mm, 55 psi). The only punctures that didn't seal were sidewall cuts. Be sure to check the level and condition of your sealant every month or so using a zip tie as a dip stick through the valve. If the sealant is clear, you've had a puncture at some point and all the latex has been consumed. I draw the old clear sealant out through the valve with a straw on a syringe and replace with fresh sealant.
Interesting to hear that you pull out the old sealant like that.
After all the comments, I will definitely give Stans another go soon
I have been using tubeless on mountain bikes almost since the beginning and have had very good luck with Stans. It even sealed a small snakebite on the sidewall with a little help by taking the wheel off and putting the bite down so the sealant could get to it. I have also tried Orange seal. It worked but no better than Stans and cost more. There is some maintenance with sealant but I find it better than tubes which snakebite and go flat with thorns. I’ll never go back to tubes.
This 100% The clear stuff needs to be removed otherwise the newly added sealant is too diluted, then of course it's not going to work.
Great tip. I was not aware of this. I’ve never had a puncture that I’m aware of, not even with tubes. I’m sure I’ll find out soon enough though. I’m new to tubeless so I will keep an eye on this.
Same here. I been on stans for a few years also. I have puncture a few times and it has seal. I run about 75 PSI in my road bike. When I puncture I lose about 10 psi before it seals it completely. When I get home after the ride I fine the seal and plug it. On my gravel bike I have only punction once it was not able to seal it completely but enough to slow the leak to finish the ride. Plugged it once I got home. I also use a syringe to suck up the old sealant and add new sealant every 3 month
Stan’s has worked wonders on my carbon 27.5”x4.5” fat-unicycle. No issues, top off every 6 months.
That’s because you’re not running 70+ psi. Lower pressure tiers work great setup tubless always have done.
@@gaza4543 I think my stan bottle got 40PSI as recommended max to use, which is fine for my 40mm gravel tyre.. ;)
Stan's has worked super well for me for MTB, fatbike (in winter), Gravel, and road. Even at 50 psi, it's fine. The worst that can happen at 50-60psi is that you'll need a plug. I'd rather use Stan's normal compared to race/MucOff/Silca so I can still inject through the valve stem. To me, being able to inject through the valve and being able to seal around a plug is much better than the headache with putting in the sealant as you setup the tires.
And, fixing punctures with a plug is still better than changing an inner tube.
I have been using Silca for a while now and have not had any issues with pouring. As you mention, I always seat the tire empty and then pop one side open, pour the Silca sealant in and then use a tire tool to pop the tire back on, but I inflate it (without a canister, just a regular pump) before I slush it around it so only tiny amounts of sealant show up in a few places - easy to wipe at that point. Silca also sells this 'replenisher' which will go through th valve but I have found popping the tire (with a tool, not by hand) and pouring sealant easier than removing the valve core and adding the replenisher.
If you take your time, you can certainly do it without spilling any. I think at this point, I just get it in there and deal with the mess 😅
I've been using Muc-off sealant on my gravel bike for the last year and a half and it's worked wonders for me. Small cuts to the tire which have sealed itself during rides. I definitely think it's up to tire/rim combo as well as sealant. Currently using Specialized Pathfinder Pro tires with Roval Terra CL wheels.
I'm all about tubeless but your tire and rim combo will have little affect on flats unless you're burping.
same with me, on the gravel bike it works fine. Have had some trouble on road tires, maybe related to the higher pressure. I slice a tire recently and found 6 or 7 holes clotted - I never really noticed I had that many holes, but it explaines the odd low pressure. So fine with me.
Run muck off on both gravel and road for 4 years, gravel it is fine. Road I think the higher tyre pressures don’t help, I have had punctures seal, and I have had them intermittently open and spray me but seal again. Switched to Schwalbe blue on road bike and no problems since, but muck off in the gravel
Stans race sealant
Why can’t we use a common Presta valve stem and inject the Silca sealant?
I’ve been using tubeless for over a year now. It’s a life changer. I’ve been out on rides and not realise I had a puncture until I get home. Also I have always used Muc-Off sealant and it’s never let me down. Everyone has their own unique story. I’m not here to convince anyone. Just wanted to mention that there are success stories out there!
I'm calling bullshit
I was a little bit excited when I finally purchased a bicycle that cost more than $1k.
It came with tubeless tires.
“New technology” for me concerning bicycles.
I purchased a plug kit so I would be ready for flats.
Seemed a convenient upgrade compared to fiddling with tubes on the trail.
I discovered it was actually “tubeless ready”.
From what I’ve learned about tubeless bicycle tires since my purchase, I am so glad that it actually has tubes installed.
I want to have the knowledge about tubeless in case I need to assist someone else, but I have no intention of installing tubeless tires on any of my bicycles.
Great video
👍😎
Thank you for sharing your real life experience. I wondered why people would run tubeless and after seeing this i'll prefer the once in a year walk home.
What a great video! Good valuable information and presented in a funny way, that I had to laugh a dozen times 😂
I've been tubeless for a few years on my mountain bike and it's really not any drama once you understand the maintenance required and you have the appropriate tools. Stans Sealant works well for me. I've finally made my road bike tubeless which was the easiest job. The only time the sealant failed was when I didn't change it often enough. I'm running the latest PZERO 4S Race TLR tires in 28mm size on my road bike.
That's the road tyres I had previously. I found because they're so light weight, it was prone to punctures which is why I tested so many sealants 😅
Been using Stans for years,, got 2 puncture on the weekend,, the sealant sprayed alot on both but also sealed both up within seconds and continued riding without stopping.
Stans is definitely the only other sealant that people appear to be recommending ah
I’ve using Stans sealant on my commuter road bike with 30mm tyres for 4 years but I’ve decided to give up on Stans and maybe try Orange seal. The very first tubeless pin prick puncture on the road a few years back sealed with Stans right up but that’s the last time Stans has ever sealed a hole for me without intervention. Even small holes (like a small piece of wire) doesn’t seal or does but only keeps running with low pressure. As soon as you pump it up to 70psi (which is about correct for 30mm tyres) the sealant just blows out and pressure comes right down. With Stans I find I have to plug the hole with a slug of some sort. Had to do 3 like that on the road in the last month. Stan’s seems more suited to the lower pressures of MTB. I’m hoping Orange seal will be more suitable for road.
I have been running normal Stans, Conti and Milkit over the last 3 years and all worked very well. It's more a trade off between dry-out and sealing properties. Also some tyre manufacturers (e.g. Veloflex) specify natural or synthetic based sealants. All in all you are right that it can be pretty messy when changing tyres but at least for me the performance and puncture protection is just so much better. (I never run anything smaller than 28 on 22c rims which is more like 30mm real size, so below 5 bar for max pressure)
Finding that balance over time is key I guess. Once you've found a solution that works for you, it's set and forget really I find
I’ve been tubeless for two years. I run 28’s and have used Stan’s exclusively. I’ve punctured multiple times that I’ve confirmed and have always gotten home with minimal pressure loss. Once you dial in your technique life is much easier, and the lower pressures and better grip are amazing.
I use muc-off sealant and have had great success with both road and gravel. I ride road up to about 70 psi and it's no problem at all. I would easily recommend it to others, especially because it's one of very few that is compatible with CO2 inflation. It is more vicious than others like Stans so I use a bit more volume of sealant. It also doesn't dry out much, smells good, eco friendly, and washes easily as long as you don't let it dry. I believe it doesn't use ammonia so it doesn't smell bad.
Interesting, I think you might be the first person I know who has had a good experience with using Muc Off. Glad to hear it's worked for someone at least
@SpinAnGrin user of Muc Off as well and it's worked great. I've only ever had clean up problems with it but that goes for any sealant.
@@SpinAnGrin I’ve used multiple sealants and muc off has always been the one I’ve returned to.
I use it in mtb and gravel, I would say it’s sealed all punctures and even to the point where I’ve got home and noticed a few spots on the frame and not affected the ride. It’s been great.
I trust it 100%
Are you using enough?
Just glad it's worked for someone.
Oh yes, I have more than enough In there. I forgot to include it in the video but I have a photo from when the muc off didn't work for me. The pink sealant everywhere up the back of the bike and a flat tire 😅
Been on tubeless about a year. Had my first puncture just last week. Didnt even know while riding I had punctured. Got home saw a bit of sealant spray on back of seat tube wiped right up. Using Stans. Seemed to work great for me. Barely lost any air at all from tire.
And when putting in sealant it's much easier to remove the valve core after the tire was seated and with a syringe insert the sealant. Put valve core back in and pump up. No mess, no drips of sealant no need to clean wheels. No mess period.
Lots of people are vouching for Stans, will be giving it a try on the merit that you can Inject it versus pouring it in
@@SpinAnGrin injection is absolutely the way to go. Very easy to measure how much to put in and literally zero mess.
Top tip. For holes that are created by flints and bigger than thorns I use one of the petals from a stans Dart plug pushed into the hole with a sharp prodder. The stans Darts
work on bigger holes but the puncture protection layer is too tough to put the dart through for the small holes. I've been using Stans sealant for 10 years and it works for me.
This just happenned to me last weekend at a gravel race. Got some sealant spray and stopped to inspect. This was likely my first mistake. Propably should have just continued riding and waited for the sealant to do its magic with the pressure getting lower. Anyway as I stopped I found a hole and proceeded to put in a Stans dark. First try I got the dart head in, but the rest did not penerate the hole. Same with the second one. Tried to push it in with what was left the dart (the small plastic stick). No success. So I decided to inflate with co2. The tyre started to hold air. Maybe the sealant worked in the end. Maybe poking the puncture cleaned the hole helping the sealant do its thing. Anyway: For a hole of this size the darts were useless. I hear Stans has changed the design. Mine has a clear tip. The previous (dark one) may be better. In this case something smaller would have been needed. Petal pushed with a prodder sounds just about right.
@TubePlanet Dyna plugs I find these days are the way to go
Sounds like you are eventually going to be like me and just give up with the whole idea of tubeless one day. I spent years trying road tubeless, many tire brands and all the sealants on the market and still when I got a puncture I was not able to continue riding my bike until I put a tube in to get me home. I spent an unimaginable amount of money, I'm sure the industry thanks me for that, but I won't spend another dime on it ever again. I now use TPU tubes which have been great. I can carry 3 tubes which take up the same space as one rubber tube so that really makes me feel better about finishing a ride and not getting stuck out on the road somewhere. No more messes for me thank you, and if you use sealant I won't ride with you because you are not getting your mess on me when you puncture.
I think for my road setup, I will end up back with TPU tubes like you mention. For gravel though, I need to stick with tubeless as I feel more confident with the lower pressure and grip.
How do you like the TPU tubes?….I’ve never tried them but am interested
Everyone else on tubeless, while I am content on my TUBULARS with sealant in its inner tube. 😂😂
based, gonna do that myself soon
Thank you for a good video. I do not quite share the experience you have 🙂
After using innertubes all my life, I just went tubeless this very weekend, with my Bontrager wheels. I had absolutely no problem using a normal floor pump... and I also just added the sealant (Silca) through the valve with no issues.
I for sure hope it works when I get my first hole!
How did you get it through the valves? Did the fibres not block it up?
@@SpinAnGrin I did not experience any blocking at all - Maybe because I did not know that I should not use a syringe 🙂
That stand looks nice and stable. What is it and how do you like it?
Stans worked great in my MTB for ten years. Started running Orange Seal in my gravel bike last year and have not had a single issue (6000 miles). Recently set up the road bike tubeless, (Orange Seal ) and it has been great so far. In over 10K miles of riding I have only had to use plugs twice (on MTB), and only had one hole that was too large for a plug.
Wow this made me re-think going tubeless on my all-road bike. Got a flat during a ride this weekend, but I was back on the road in under 5 minutes. All this mess looks far worse than that! Thanks for your candor.
Something to be said for the ease of tubes
Tubeless tires don’t have to be removed from the rim tubeless patch kit plugs the hole with rubber strip! Way faster then taking the tube out and patching it!
@@triggword7648I always carry a spare inner, just swap it and do the patching at home. Only had 2 flats in 12 years on 2 different bikes, and I bike daily (commuting with my normal Dutch bike). Patching at home takes less then 10 minutes including reinstalling the “old” inner.
@@triggword7648 as a deliveroo rider who was getting a lot of punctures even with marathon plus tyres and a tube with sealant inside I switched to tubeless and never looked back. I've had a few punctures that couldn't self seal but a quick flip of the bike and a stab with bacon strip means I could be on my way.
I have been using Stan's standard sealant without any issues. All punctures have self sealed. I also carry some tyre plugs, just in case the hole is too large. I also top up through the valve.
I have a trek farley ex8 I put it tubeless with muc off and I had no problems with it I will have to try your one on my mountain bike see how it goes.
This video is so darn accurate and honest....I cried. TY😢
Learner the hard way that's for sure
Me and my mates all use muc-off never had a problem. I had my front tyre go down after sending it on a down hill on rocky terrain. i inflated it and its been up ever since. We are using mountain bikes .It makes me wonder if the high pressures of road bike tyres can cause the sealant not to seal and then fail with the high psi.
This season I tried Muc-off; the puncture was a pinhole on the tread, not the side wall. Long story short, I carried the wrong size valve/ spare tube and had to walk 5 miles home. I will not repurchase Muc-off. I didn't realize this, but I was an early adopter of Tubeless; for awhile, I've been looking left and right to see if others were experiencing the maintenance downside -- well, it appears we are at peak "tired of the maintenance." I had a blowout b/c I didn't add fresh sealant, no severe injuries, but you can imagine how spectacular that crash was. Thanks for sounding the alarm.
Jeez, I bet that was scary to actually have a blow out. The stuff just doesn't appear to work, I'll be staying away from it for good
Glad I stumbled upon this! I'm using the same wheels, tires and valves you are but I've been having trouble losing pressure non stop. I noticed you are using the square shaped rubber piece on the valve (inside the wheel) and I've been using the cone shaped one. Wondering if that makes a huge difference?
It might a little. The square one sits into the grove of the tyre much tighter I find
You can use sealant in the inner tubes too, mine is Slime and there are also protection tapes that go between the inner tube and the tyre for extra resistance.
Thank you for your brutial honesty. As a weight weenie and a clean freak, I have been considering going tubeless because I have the wheels, tires and Muck-off to do so on my road bike. I wanted to go lighter by removing my inner tubes but the slightly less weight doesn't seem to overcome the potential mess (even with gloves) and bi-yearly maintence needed to go tubeless. I'll stick with butyl rubber inner tubes for now. I am considering going TPU but I still consider them to be in the R&D phase of development plus are currently not compatable with my old school side pull rim brakes.
As for my MTB, for now, I will still stick with inner tubes filled with Slime. If I replace my wheels with tubeless ones, I might consider running with sealant AKA "glue".
I have been on a similar journey but went back to muc off. I've tried Silca, Joe's, Stans and muc off. Milage seems to vary depending on humidity, discipline and pressure.
My biggest tips are:
1. Once you put sealant in a tire, that sealant and tire are married until death do they part. Relatively small holes plugged with one sealant tend to never really seal after replacement of one to another, especially true if you have a plug in it.
2. Use dynaplugs. Their applicator works even when you still have 80psi inside, if you don't disturb them, they survive the life of the tire.
3. Taking the tire off has a tendency to mess up the nicely dried holes, and once disturbed never seem to really seal again. The best way to manage sealant is to mess with it as little as possible.
Silca is the best "race day sealant" as they say, it works better than anything else once fresh but after a few months it starts to ball up. Once you have balls its not much better than Stans, which is my worst experience. You have to do a full clean out and replacement. It is also the hardest sealant to maintain at home due to the base product not being added through the valve. I've even had a case of a relatively small hole that wouldn't seal without a plug after just a couple of weeks. Once you have reached that full year and need to change the sealant you're pretty much up for replacing the tires which have been plugged. It also gums up your valve... So back to muc off, which to me is 95% as good, can be topped up at any time, and seems to function more consistently between top ups.
How does that sealent work if you have to let som air out?
It can clog the valves but I normally find as long as you do it when the bike is upright, and the valve is at 12 o'clock then you'll be fine
Pardon my ignorance, but what occurs when you attempt to inflate the tire after a couple of days? As tires tend to lose pressure over time, would the sealant seal the valve when you use a pump, considering pumps typically release a small amount of air when connecting it?
I don't have the need to actually pump the tires up all the often. They hold the pressure for weeks. I've also never had a issue with the valves getting blocked 🤞
Probably 8 yrs now tubeless, was a bit of a hassle in the early days when the tyres were thin & the beads weren’t the most precisely manufactured but I swear it’s simply fit & forget now & thats on an MTB with rim impacts & sidewalk holes all sealing.
Literally too it up through the removable valve every couple months or when I need to change tyres.
Sooooo much better than tubes!
What pump is that from Topeak? Great video.
It's the Joe blow one. Not really needed for road tires but great big tank for larger tires
You don’t need to wash the tire from the previous muc off sealant before installing the new sealant ?
Never had any issues with leaving the old sealant in there. Plus it acts as a lubricant to help seat the tires on
I have used Muc Off for a couple of years with 42mm gravel tyres and it has always sealed well. Its just a pain to get off your frame once it has dried on. I have just moved over to Silca, so too early to tell, but I'm confident it will be very good.
I think that you're safe with Silca
I put ceramic coating on the frame often and if sealant gets on it wipes off easily
Is it easy to put on?
yes it is spray on and wipe then buff a little@@SpinAnGrin
Going to look into that 👍
Hey SpinAnGrin, love your video. I started using tubeless for about a year now since I bought a Gravel bike. Never used tubeless before and since run clinchers on my road bikes. I had no idea what I was doing with tubeless and spoke to a local bike shop, they recommended Muc-Off and I haven't had a problem with the stuff. I find tubeless tires themselves more a pain in the arse then the sealant. For example tubeless tires are a pain to seat for some reason. I was out the local NP and hit a small rock at speed. It didn't puncture or pierce the tire, but rather pushed the air out. I checked and double checked the tire it was good. I put more air in and the tire slowly went down. I had to do this all the way home where I put more sealant in the tire. I little sealant came out from the bead and then sealed. Its fine since.
Ye they can be pain. They definitely aren't as supple as the none TLR tyres to get on and off the rim I've found
I wasn’t a fan of tubeless but have been using it on my gravel and mountain bike as they both come set up tubeless. From what I’ve gathered sealant works best at lower pressures. So I’m my gravel bike I’m running between 35-40 psi on my mtb between 20-28. I’ve used bontrager and stand sealant. Both plugged up small holes, found the stand worked better. I’ve now switched to silca in my mtb which I think is overkill but will try it in a road set as I’ll be running higher pressures and due to silca having those carbon flecks will help. It’s definitely designed more for road tires. Another one in stans race day sealant, spoke to a pro racer and he said he uses that in his tires and works very well.
I've not tried the Stans race day yet but lots of people vouched for it. Not sure I will swap back from Silca again but we will see
I'm running the muc-off valve stems and silica sealant and my front tire specifically clogs the valve core with sealant that I end up changing it out every 5 rides or so, just completely gunked up no matter what I try position wise when storing it. I'm about to give up
I've had that happen also. When inflating the tyre it pushed the sealant into the valve. I also, have found a solution for the glue
Totally agree on the mess created, even when one is being extra careful not to create any in the first place. I recently had to chuck two perfectly good tyres, because I just couldn't remove the dried on, crusty old sealant inside them. I've gone back to inner tubes for the foreseeable future.
apparently those old school heavy duty rubbers/erasers do a pretty good job but still a lot of elbow grease needed!
Rubber gardening gloves also work but it's a real hassle
I'm not familiar with roadie tyres but tubeless setup works wonders on MTB's. Not a single puncture in 5 years - just check and to up sealant every 3 months. Simples
I use the Sealant from muc-off. I ran over a pretty big nail just yesterday, and it sealed perfectly. pulled it out, and squirted out some sealant, but in a matter of milliseconds, it sealed everything just fine. I probably rode 3-5k Kilometers on their sealant. I always recommend their sealent, and never heard of a friend, to whom I recommended it, that they had a problem. all say it works like a charm on their bikes.
Just glad to hear that it's work for someone
I've used road tubeless and orange seal for a few years now and not had any issues, or this much drama or around my tires. I can mount my tires using a floor pump as well.
I definitely have had Muc-Off seal punctures. But I have also had punctures that did not look too big that it did not seal. So I am also going to experiment with other sealants.
I bought a new Continental Grand Prix 5000 S tubeless on 5/15/23 (rear). My front tire is a Mavic tubeless which are no longer available. I had 1 or 2 punctures in each tire that sealed up fine (orange sealant). I rode about 2400 miles during this time, and 8/3/23 the Conti lost air pressure but didn't go flat. Took it in to my LBS and they said the sealant had almost dried up due to the hot summer weather. I replaced the Conti with a new tire and had them top off the sealant in both tires. I run 78 psi in the front tire and 80 psi in the rear. I like how the tubeless tires feel on the road. I rode for 3 months and never had to fix a flat and the roads are pretty bad here in San Diego county. That said, running tubes is less expensive and it's easier to fix your own flats.
That's some good distance on that setup
I use Muc-Off and replace it, at most, once a year. I can now see a few spots where it has fixed punctures I never knew were there. Mounting tyres tubeless is real easy too if you get the right tyres. I can recommend Schwalbe for super easy installation.
Running Stan´s in my 47mm Gravel tires, and had no issue whatsoever. >Was also surprised at the ease with which I have completed the setup using just a floor pump. Been riding pavement, gravel, doubletrack, light singletrack and also some pretty chunky and sharp stuff. If there were any punctures, they were of the kind that I haven´t even noticed. Checking and topping up the sealant 3-6 months. Best decision I´ve ever made.
When it works, it really is great stuff
I’ve been using Silca for 2 years now. I only had 3 punctures since then. All of them sealed effectively. I usually top up the sealant every 4 months.
Question, your Zipp 303 hookless? Can you use latex tube and not use sealant at all? And call it a day!
You can if you want yes. But I prefer running the lower pressure of tubeless as the roads around me are a little rubbish
Tubeless has been a godsend for me. The lower pressure is a noticeably more comfortable ride and I can rail corners with more confidence. The road I ride on often has little glass shards and debris littered throughout. I used to get punctures often with clinchers, and I didn't mind changing the tubes out. But it's been over 2 years since I've had to stop during a ride since switching to tubeless. ~5k miles per yr. I have had several cuts that sealed instantly and I was able to get home. Additionally, I notice my tires gather less nicks and cuts in them with the lower pressure as well. I'm using Stan's regular. I'm never going back to clinchers.
Interesting. I do also wonder if the tubeless tires help vs the normal tires before as they're sturdier tires 🤷
I have used Orange Seal Endurance with no issues at all for my road bike, with Schwalbe pro one, GP5000 STR and Challenge Strada Pro and Challenge Criterium RS).
Yet, a week ago I purchased a Silca tubeless sealant (to try it) but after watching your video I think I will not ever use it. Especially due to the fact that the Challenge tyres are quite difficult to install on my tight rims (not to seat them after you install, but just to install them).
For me, the only way to setup them tubeless is to inject the sealant through the valve, but this is impossible as you stated.
Is there any other option? Thank you !
Not for the Silca no. The bits of carbon fibre will clock any Injector took or valve. I've now switched back to orange seal and Dyna plugs and it's working a treat
What tyres and what size and pressure were failing to seal with the various sealants?
I had issues with the Vittoria Corsa tires 28mm and also my panaracer 38mm slicks :/
Both had issues especially with Muc off but also Stans and orange seal. Since putting in Silca, I haven't even had to pump them up once!
Stan's makes a specific sealant for road use, much chunkier and viscous than the standard one as standard won't coagulate fast enough at pressures over 2bars
Interesting. A few people are saying Stans has worked for them but it never did for me.
It's the only one that people have said works other than Silca.
Went back to clinchers on my Road bike... much happier. Run tubeless on my cross bike, gravel and mtb bike.
I've been using Stans for about 2years had no problems, 🤘👍
I let my bike shop set it up for me! No problem! If I get a flat I use a dynaplug which is WAY easier than changing a tube on a tight gp5000 which is impossible to get off…. Tubeless is easy and requires nothing of me at all.
Happy Muc-Off user here, no issues for me so far. I've actually switched from a different brand (latex based sealant) which was also OK in terms of sealing the punctures, but I was tired of cleaning the inside of the tires from the sticky residues. Muc-Off is leaving some "chalky" residue instead (which is very easy to remove). So, now I'm using Muc-Off in two bikes. One is a gravel bike with Panaracer GravelKings SK 43 mm. These tyres are not a perfect combination with the rims, slightly loose on the rim bed and hard to seal without the compressor, but it is regardless of which sealant is used. In my MTB it's a completely different story, the tight fit of the Schwalbe Nobby Nics 2.6" on the rim results as sealing on the rim (and holding air) even without any sealant. Anyway, as for the effectiveness of Muc-Off: just 2 or 3 weeks ago I had a puncture from a big thorn in my front tyre (that Schwalbe NN in my MTB) and the pressure dropped from 1.2 I normally use to 0.6 bars (checked with Topeak digital gauge that I always have with me). Pumped up to a little higher pressure, turned the wheel few times and it has sealed after 15 seconds (the pressure dropped a little bit of course). Pumped up again to the usual pressure and Bob's your uncle. Most of the time I don't even notice that there was some puncture, only after getting back home (and doing some inspection or cleaning the bikes) I can see some wet spots on the tyres as the evidence of the fact that there was some puncture.
Wow, you're genuinely the first person that I know of that has successfully used muc off. I'm not sure what it is but I genuinely can't get it to work with road tyres.
Maybe it needs the larger volume of air to help seal? That's the only thing I can think of at this point 🤷
@@SpinAnGrinwhat pressure do you use on your tires ?
28mm tires I run around 55 PSI. My 38mm panaracer slicks I ran around 35 PSI. These have been over 2 different wheel set combinations. Not sure what I would be doing wrong.
The Silca being latex based is a pain, but it just works I find.
@@SpinAnGrin thank you for your answer 🙏
@SpinAnGrin Some sealants only work at MTB-ish pressures. Muc-Off is probably one of them, like Stan's is. Stan's will seal up nicely below about 45 psi, but at road bike pressures, you might as well use actual milk.
Orange is the only sealant that can seal at ~70+ psi, in my experience (have not tried "glue" ).
Like you I've tried all the brands of Sealant in the last 5 years and like you I've now settled on Silca and I'll never use anything else going forward! I also find that the tires hold pressure for weeks.
awesome video brother thank you!
Orange seal on my road bike worked fantastically well (80 psi), no real issues with installation or otherwise - 6 years and never been on the side of the road, 4 punctures sealed perfectly. Most of the people who whinge about tubeless have either never tried it or didn’t bother to do their homework first and then want to blame the technology as flawed….
I actually have now been using orange seal for about 6 months. No punctures yet but installation is so much easier
Late to the party but here is my experiences with tubeless on road and gravel so far.
Road w/ muc-off: On a zipp 404 / michelin power cup combo. Tire seated perfectly, sealed many smaller holes with no issue - bigger holes sealed easily using Dynaplugs, still works after 8 months of heavy use. Had to change rear tire once due to wear, but sealant was easy to cleanup and reapply on new tire.
Gravel w/ silca: On zipp 404 / schwalbe G-one rs combo. Tire searted after a couple of attempts with booster pump. Appears to seal almost every hole regardless of size. After 3 months of use the valves clogged up completely - had to remove, clean and reapply, which was very messy and time-consuming since everything seem to have dried up. Has not been able to hold air very well ever since.
Would take Muc-off over Silca mainly due to ability to syringe it through the valve and avoid a huge mess. The glue comparison on Silca is very accurate.
I always use Schwalbe Doc Blue, in both road and MTB tyres, never had a problem, amazed at what it has sealed, and you can pour it through the valve.
Not a brand I've heard of before, will check it out
@@SpinAnGrin it’s from Schwalbe, the tyre manufacturer.
@@SpinAnGrin It's the same as stans, the normal one, not the race.
Running Orange Seal and I have a substantial hole in my gravel tires that it has sealed, twice. I got a nail in an ENVE SES tire and it sealed quite nicely and a metal fastening screw in a GP5000TL tire that was replaced as removing the screw destroyed the tire.
Way too messy for me 😂. GP5000 with latex inner tubes any day of the week.
I've got 25mm wide tyres on a road bike, running at high pressure (9 BAR) - I looked into going tubeless so I could drop the pressure a little. Especially after picking up many punctures in a week (double digits) with P-Zero tyres and featherweight tubes, I was very keen to try tubeless. I never have tried it, but switched to a slightly thicker tyre with standard inner tubes and I don't think I've had a puncture since
I've ran p zeros before, fast tire but sooo thin!
I have run the Muc-Off sealant with Gravel Kings Slick 38s for the last 4 months and it has sealed without issue.
I am useing Stans for like 3 1/2 years on my Gravel, i haven't had it fail me yet in around 19000Km, it always sealed the puncture. After getting a ton of flats last year, i allso started goin tubeless on my roadbike, with no problems till yesterday...i got a big cut in the sidewall, stans tryed too seal it, but that "hole" was just too big ;-)
Toping off like all 3 months is not a big deal, and im staying tubeless. Got like 6000Km this year, on both bikes, with no issues other than the cut yesterday.
Tubeless is great, used Stans race sealent for 3 years, 8000 miles, always got home.
I started out with Stan’s 3-4 years on my X bike and quickly changed to Muc Off and liked it so much I went tubeless on my road bike and have had no real problems since.
I did try Silca on my X bike and while it seals better than Muc off it’s just so much trouble ergo clogging up my valve stem . So I went back to Muc off as it’s sealed almost everything. And Dyna Plugs always bail me out if I’ve lost too much psi
I've got some Dyna plugs coming in the post based on everyone's recommendations
@@SpinAnGrin they are bulletproof! I tried Stan’s Darts but I had a couple snap as I was trying to insert them .
My marippossa effect doesnt seal low pressures either , i need to insert a plug
Great review - thank you for reminding me that I do not employ a full time bicycle mechanic.
I did consider tubless, but not any more.
It definitely comes with a learning curve
I switch from Stans Race to WTB Sealant and i love it. Much more easy to use, its very cheap compare to Orange or Silca and it works great...
I feel Muc off sealant is best for lower pressure tires like MTB or Gravel. I tried Muc off before for my road bike and couldn't seal small cuts.
Very helpful tips and advice. I could have made a few messy mistakes. Thanks
Glad it helps, good luck
I use FlatOut Sportsman inside of a tube. It works with tubeless too. It has kevlar fibers that physically plug the puncture. It stays liquid and is easy to wash off. I've hit big construction screws and nails, had them sticking out the tire and i'm still riding. its crazy. Its saved me an unbelievable amount of time and hastle , so many flats. The FlatOut product itself does have a bit of weight to it though, but i bet the dosage would be low for a road tire. Works great with fat tires, ive had a few times with 29er / 700C tires where it didnt work. OH and for products that DON'T work, slime tubes!! I'm like 0 for 5 on slime tubes. never again
Which country are you based out of? Can't say I've heard of those brands in Australia at all before but always keen to try something if I can find it
I keep going back to Stans race sealant, it just seems to work for me. Best purchases I made was an Airshot tyre inflator because I already had a decent track pump so didn't need a new one with built in high pressure tank, the other one was a Dyna plug 'race' version for larger cuts. The biggest mistake people make when getting a puncture is constantly trying to inflate the tyre to 80+ psi! You have to ride with a softer tyre till the sealant has sealed, you also need to rotate the wheel so the hole is at the bottom to get some sealant to it then rotate it back round so you don't keep leaking sealant, give it a couple of minutes, then set off riding and top up with air as needed but DON'T inflate too hard or you'll just undo the 'glue' before it's fully dried. Hope this helps people.
Very guilty before of getting a hole and keeping it at the top of the wheel for too long to look at it and wonder why it's not sealing 🤣
You speak to me from the soul I will get myself Silca too. For the moment I messed around with Schwalbe Doc Blue and got 50:50 results. Well on a ride far away from home 50:50 ain't good enough though. So thanks a bunch for sharing your experiences. Ride on!
Fingers crossed for you on the next ride then
Was you using it inside of tube ? Was you able to repair the tube with patch kit while using Schwalbe Doc Blue in it ?
@@Temporalplace Sealant is for tubeless only. I use Silca only now and try to buy the most puncture resistant tires in order not to use the sealant in the first place.
@@WattsUpLegs Not all sealants are for tubeless, doc blues are for tubes not for tires, google it.
What a marvelous description of TUBELESS Tyres and the use of sealant. A A PAIN in THE A$$ . You just helped me decide -- make up my mind. OLD SCHOOL still best
I've went back to tubes with much off inner tube sealant and it's been the best thing ever,
Think your the only one who's not had a much off sealant work it's one the best!
But if you are using carbon wheels you'll need about double or tripple the recommended amount to seal the carbon fibre as it all seaps into the raw innner carbon fibres! This is what I had to do to seal the inside of the rim first then add more sealant once the skin wall for the carbon has dried to create a smooth sealed wall! That silca could be used for just sealing the carbon rim walls as tape doesn't cover this then you could use the much off or slime
5 years tubeless so far and not one fail. Average set up time for 2 wheels 12 minutes. I've punctured several times but the sealant does its job. I set up a set of P-Zero on Lun Hyper 60 and got distracted. The next day 100 mile into a 164 mile event i suddenly remembered I'd forgot to put the sealant in! Not a problem, lost about 4 psi over both tyre's. I cant understand people struggle with these.
I use Muc Off sealant and it has worked for me, although I also generally use a plug also if a puncture doesn't seal within a few revolutions. It is a major pain to get off the frame when you get home.
Also noticed you didn't seem to clean out the Muc Off sealant before adding the Silca...mixing products is generally a bad idea in case they react.
Being a full time mechanic I can say that road bikes are not suitable for running tubeless unless you have a support crew with you. There is simply too much pressure and not enough volume for the sealant to do its job. What the sealant needs, in order to work properly is a low pressure high volume tire. I have been using Orange Seal since 2015 with no issues at all.
Sorry, can I ask - you say it doesn’t work for road bikes but you’ve been using it since 2015? Or do you mean on MTB’s?
@@dh7314 I have been tubeless on my MTB's, fat bikes and gravel bikes since 2015.
I actually ride without sealant now in my road bike and carry 2 latex tube with me, if i get a flat I type it. I wont bother to go tubeless on road anymore, MTB is a real good experience
I would say a 32mm is minimum for this to make sense on a road bike.
Absolute bullshit, Orange Seal in 28mm road at 80psi, sealed every time for me - you’re a mechanic with no idea…
so...any advantages on all this trouble? what about the PU foams? i see its quite expensive, but it seems to be the ultimate solution.cheers
It's a hassle when you start, but now that I've been using it for some time it's pretty easy. I do it now almost for the quietness of the drivetrain. It's silent and just peaceful
@@SpinAnGrin what do you mean by silent drive train? How does the tube Vs non tive affect that?
Sorry mate, I thought this comment was under another video.
With the tubeless, when you get the right combination of sealant and tires it does work. Plus you can run lower pressure so it's comfier and faster.
It's just a bit of trial and error getting the right combination
Only Stan's & Orange Seal here - both work great through the valves. Only flat I've had in 5 years was from not topping up the sealant. Tubes drool.
After thinking for years I just decided to go tubeless on my MTB, and already started feeling the pain. Both my road bikes are with tubeless ready wheels, but I use good old fashioned tire-tube combination, and if I remember I had only two punctures in last ten years that is away from home. I did have some small leaks by nails etc with a slow pressure loss, and eventually I repaired the tubes at home. I have way too many CO2 cartridges that I never use.
Just for trial I made tubeless set up on my MTB last week, cleaned up the floor three times, still not comfortable with Stans fluids on my floor; not to mention the added expense for the setting up. Let’s see how things work for this 2024, maybe, maybe I will be back with tubes in 2025. ✌🏾
Good on you for giving it a try at least though
I have also used a bunch of these sealants (not Silca though as it was not around then) with little success. I found the Effeto Mariposa Caffelattex the only one to work and it works wonders! I haven't had a flat that did not seal since I started using it 4 or 5 years ago.
Also, getting a floor pump with canister and good tubeless tires (now on Conti GP5000 TLR) after trying the couple of brands that were available for road bikes back then.
Orange has sealed multiple punctures for me on two different bikes- Silca is great, have some in my mtb tires currently, but it’s harder to work with, and more expensive. Always best to shake up the bottle really good before pouring.
I had a first tubeless puncture two day ago with muc off and it not sealed the hole (road, 28mm tire, 80psi), I had to put a plug (only one and it was not really enough) and I was only able to inflate not more than 25psi otherwise the air come out with scealant. But by experience, it seal correctly very small air leak. sealant are liquid, they cant just turn out solid in a matter of 1 secondes with high pressure. To me, scealant are only for very small air leak or puncture, after that, plug are made for filling larger puncture holes. Thank you to share your experience with us.
I've been running Muc off in my 30mm Pirelli pzero on my road bike with zipp firecrest 303 wheels for the last 2yrs, no problem as yet..
I had a problem on 45mm Pirelli gravel M tyre the other week and had to use a mega dynaplug to stop the leak... Muc off didn't seal the split but I'm not sure if any sealant would???
Interesting views in the comments from all products...
Yes for sure, I'm learning a lot from the comments provided it's great
Wondering if you've had any more success or failures for your road bike with muc-off sealant. I do wonder if the higher pressures with road compared to gravel/MTB makes it harder to seal, though it probably also depends on the brand. Cheers
Ive moved onto orange seal for both road and gravel and so far it's been excellent. Ive even had it seal road tyres with pretty decent cuts in it
@@SpinAnGrin I'm glad to hear that, especially with the challenges you've had with sealant thus far! Would you happen to know if air pressure matters in terms of the sealant working to seal a puncture? For example, does it seal the same size hole just as well if there's 65 psi compared to 35 psi? I'm also wondering if the seal isn't as durable at higher road pressures (I had a sealed puncture let go after 20 mins on road)
I run ~55psi on 28mm tires and it works fine. On my 38mm gravel tires I run ~30psi
This is good to know. I recently paid a local bike shop to set up a new set of carbon wheels and Pirelli tires as a tubeless system and they used Muckoff sealant. The front tire was low on air the next day so when I went to take the valve cap off to add some air to the tire all the sealant blew out of the valve because they never tightened down the valve core when they installed it. Now I have to have a tube in that tire because I refuse to pay them over $100 to screw it up again.
Ye that doesn't sound good. It's definitely a love hate relationship with tubeless that's for sure. Best of luck with the setup
Thanks for the video warning, I'm thinking still about tubeless and I found a type of sringe Milkit maybe it can help the maintenance.
The syringe is the way to go if the sealant is compatible. Makes it much easier
Seating the tires is a pain. Stans has worked very well for my tubeless setup and no unseating/ seating my tires.
I am on my plan to go tubless on my MTB. I have been running with inner tubes but had no punctures ever since. After watching your video, I think I'm going to stick with the inner tube call it old fashion in MTB but I think I am fine with it. :)
I didn't get on with Muc Off. Now using Peatys. I think tubeless on road tyres is far more challenging due to the increased pressures that you naturally need to use.
I’ve use both Muc-Off and Stans Race on both road and MTB without issues at all.
My riding group also uses Muc-off and share a 5L jug and none have had issues either.
Not sure what you may doing wrong as both Muc-off and Stan’s race has been effective with our experience.
I can’t comment in Silca as I have not tired, but no doubts it will work well as I’ve had great success with their other products
Maybe I'm just unlucky at this point
Tubeless on all 3 bikes for 4 years, would never dream of using tubes again. Muc-off and stans sealant, both excellent. Tyre seals in 200-400 metres, if I get to 500m I put a dyna-plug in. Top sealant up very 3 months, use 20% more than manufacturer suggest, change completely every autumn & spring and for every tyre change (obviously). 30 seconds roadside if I need to put a plug in, no faffing about removing wheels and changing tubes. Your experiences are not typical amongst the riders I know with tubeless set ups. I really encourage you to try Muc-off again, put 20% more in and I am confident it will seal the next time you have a puncture < 5mm.
Interesting, good to know it's worked for people at least
I use Orange Seal Endurance for MTB.
I’ve had bad experience with Stan’s. Stan’s race seemed to be a bit better.
I've ridden a new gravel bike 1800 kms from new with tubeless tyres running bontrager tlr sealant. 1000 kms of that was on a trail called the munda bidi. In Western Australia and I've had no flat tyres or any problems at all.
WTB sealant have worked fine with my gravel tires.
I use stans with no issues. Never tried muc off although my mate swears by on his mtb. Great video. Like you say its not for everyone. Something else to add if you have to put tube in out on ride there is likely to be thorns/ glass etc stuck to inside of tyre from previous pictures that will just pop tube straight away. Another thing is depending on wheel and tyre combo you may not get tyre to seat out on ride . Sometimes you need a chamber of high volume of air . So your ride is over in this case.
Yes, great points
I've been running Stans since 2000. No problems.