Are Inner Tubes Really THAT Bad For Mountain Biking?
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- Опубликовано: 15 янв 2022
- Tubeless mountain bike tires and rims have become very popular over the past 10 years or so and many people swear by them! However, there are people who choose to run inner tubes for mountain biking. - Doddy Investigates, are they really that bad?
Do you ride tubeless or inner tubes and why?
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As a newbie in biking, this is a pretty good explanation of the drawbacks tubes have against tubeless. Sadly, I'm one of those people who value cheapness and readyness over quality, tubeless-ready rims and sealant can get very expensive in my country, I'd rather patch up a tube a million times over having to buy sealant.
Also, life hack: you can use old tubes as snake bite patches. Just cut wide hoops, clean the insides, and cut them open when necessary. A quarter of a tube can be cut into 10 to 15 hoops, and you can use one of those as a rubber band to tie them together.
I personally never had any issues with tubes, I run tubeless now, but to be honest I’ve never noticed any difference. Never had a pinch puncture when I used tubes.
Me 2. Mostly just because i ride expensive and strong tyres full of technology to prevent punctures
Same here, but last summer I needed to change out the Stans so I just put tubes back in. IMO Tubes are fine if you don't ride in thorny areas or if you are not super aggressive on rocky terrain to the point you get pinch flats.
@@Rambleon444 completely agree. I ride in north louisiana south arkansas area and there’s not enough sharp rocks to give me pinch flats and thorns have never been a problem. Honestly I’ve had more flats riding around my campus than riding on the trail lol
At many trails, there are tons of thrones that will cause puncture. At other places, there are sharp rocks that will destroy tires and tubes.
Do you run lower pressure tubeless?
Got my first MTB in 1987, never been tempted by tubeless, never been plagued by punctures. There’s no mess when I do have to change them and it’s a two minute job - with the right tyre. And on the subject of right tyres, a few of your anti- tube comments are, in fact, tyre problems, not tube problems.
Most of the tyre problems are actually tubeless rim problems. Non tubeless tyres on non-tubeless rims were a complete pleasure to fit compared to anything where the bead has to pop into place. Just put 15 ish psi in, manually adjust the tyre so it runs straight and pump to the pressure you need. Tubeless has forced people to pump to a much higher pressure than they need to get the bead to seat and then bleed out the extra air - fine at home with a compressor, but doing it on a wide tyre with a small pump trailside is a complete nuisance. The tyre seating process can be sped up by standing on the sidewall of the tyre and leaning the wheel away to pull the bead out in the spots where it hasn't seated, but being able to adjust it manually at very low pressure is so much quicker and easier.
Totally agree. Mountain bikes have got better but not by getting bigger and heavier and definitely not by putting foam into tyres 😂
I use inner tubes with the muc off tube sealant in Minion DHRs on my hardtail. Run 28psi on rear and have not had a puncture in about 18 months. Probably cursed my next ride now 😁
Update us when you get your next flat!
still okay until now?
A tip when fitting an innertube is to slightly inflate it so when you use the tyre levers the chance of it being caught and pinched is highly reduced. The slime tubes are actually great, I have just replaced the tyres on my sons bike due to wear and as I was pulling the tubes out of the old tyres they seemed stuck and only then I realised the tyres were full of thorns and they were literally "nailed" down. I patched about 10 holes just to be on safe side and reused the innertubes still. Been going strong since 2016.
I have had both tubes and tubeless wheel bikes and I prefer the stiffness/extra support of innertubes.
Quite possibly the most objective, open & impartial comparison I’ve seen ref: tubes vs tubeless. Thorns are an issue for me in the Wye Valley & FoD & going tubeless for me was a game changer… 2nd only to the dropper post. I carry a Tubolitos as a “get out of jail free card” because it fits beautifully in my Camelback hip bag, weighing nothing and taking up very little space…. that said, I’ve yet to use it. Last summer I pulled 15 thorns out of my front & rear on a single ride, I didn’t notice until I got home and they all sealed when I removed them. I’ll never go back to tubes, but I’m not against them either… they have their place
Same here in southern California. I went from constant slow leaks and swapping tubes about once a months after patching a half dozen holes until you eventually can't find all the leaks. I went tubeless a few years ago and have not had one leak since. Game changer and never going back
He's completely biased against his what are you kidding me?
If thorns are a problem, you can always put sealant in inner tubes. It is the sealant that does the job anyway.
@@sepg5084 what's the benefit of adding back the tubes if the wheels work without them? I guess setup would be easier, anything else?
I too live and ride in the FOD & Wye valley been using Slime inner tubes for around a year with no problems what so ever. Covered over 1400 miles won’t go back to regular tubes now.
Only Doddy can make 18 minutes of old-technology fun to learn about.
only someone who got a pinch flat and didn't pump his tyres up to a higher pressure to avoid another pinch flat, is a total dick!
I don't know how he struggles so much fitting tubes!
Obviously struggles getting his (flawed) point across too.
@@thebrowns5337 Damn! This a more divisive issue than 29 vs. 27.5!
😃 👍 😂
Tubes are no hassle at all if you know what you're doing with them; use slime filled tubes and keep the pressures comfortably top side of 30psi. (Running them in the mid-20s is asking for snake-bites - as Doddy demonstrated.) Bit of background: I've been MTBing for over 30 years, lead rides for a living (sometimes) and I'm a trained bike mechanic. I tried tubeless for a few years, but for me... ...meh... ...it was OK... ...until you get a hole that won't seal itself, and ruins your jersey/baggies/sack by spraying latex all over it. OK, when we start talking marginal gains, maybe there's a benefit to going tubeless, and there's a definite advantage if you NEED to run low tyre pressures. But for me and the other 98% of the mere mortals who MTB, it's not really necessary. Not that that will stop people wanting to run tubeless because [insert name of favourite pro] does on their bike. But like most of the 'developments' in cycling, it's as often as not about convincing punters to part with their cash for things they don't really need.
Yeah it really irritates me when I see litter on the trails I'm a keen believer in leaving everything better than you find it n quite often end up picking up other peoples litter
I tried tubeless on my new bike last season. They felt squirmy, and went flat slowly during rides because of all the little thorns. Tubeless doesnt seal instantly all the time. I switched to downhill tubes. I got a more supportive feel from the added material on the sidewall, and no leakage at all. Basically bomb proof. Now i can run my too light weight casing tires until they wear out. I don't mind the weight, as i am 110+kg myself, and got the legs to go with that. I can't tell if I lost traction at all. And most important, i can switch my tires back and forth without the mess. No need to stockpile sealant. No need to top up sealant. No need to worry about the sealant drying in the hot shed in the summer. And also no slushing of sealant when going super slow uphill. I swear this causes friction. Just spin your tire slowly und see how fast it stops. It spins forever with tubes.
100% agreed
I don't top up the sealant. But take a 50ml dose with me all the time + one lightweight spare tube 😁
I switched to tubeless a couple of years ago and have never found the same feeling as when using tubes, to the point that i think im going to swap back to tubes. Agree about the added support with a tube. Obviously the pressures run with tubes wont be the same as tubeless but even when playing around with the pressures i have never been able to get the same feel. Been contemplating something like a cushcore but in all honesty i cant be bothered with the faffing about when fitting them. Touch wood i have very rarely had punctures with a tube and im similarly 115kg in riding gear running 25 and 28psi front and rear. I always run downhill casing tyres anyway, partly due to my weight, and partly to avoid punctures. The only thing i worry about with tubes is thorns causing punctures, or, pinching the tube when fitting the tyre as my rim/tyre combo is a very tight fit.
All in all though, i prefer the stiffer feel of tubes when you are on the side of the tyre, and find i can actually run lower pressures to get nice feel over roots etc without having a squirmy tyre.
I call bs on that. Either your sealant was really not good, your tubeless tape job was really bad or your tires were not tubeless compatible.
Most of the times, you wont even notice that you had a puncture with the tubeless. If your tape and tire are fine, sometimes you can get away to run it without any sealant (For about a day, untill you puncture)
@@RealMTBAddict hardly a gimmick if almost every professional racer is riding tubeless.
Absolutely loved this. So helpful, plus a cheeky vid showing how to change one. As a person fairly new to MTB and had 2 on my last 2 rides, I found this invaluable
I use little cut sections of inner tubes as a parking brake for my bike, it's nice when your bike is on a frame mount on your car to keep the wheels from spinning while you're driving
Use your old inertubs as a liner in your tire between tube and tire to help prevent more punctures.
Good vid keepemcoming
Yep, used to run that set-up too. Great trick!
@@RealMTBAddict yeah i use them (cevlar).
But bugget wise tubes will work in a pinch
Great video, thanks
Nice work as always.
Great video, well done. In conditions I ride in here in Utah I find tubeless is better because I can run lower psi and get more grip compared to tubes. Surprised you didn't do some quick comparisons on weight on the same tire with and without tubeless rating.
Love the message of this video! Though the dev of innertubes also goes on, the advantages of tubeless setups are hard to beat - I chose one of the lightest 2.4dissector/2.6dhf and threw cushcores in to stiffen the carcass for better cornering performance and overall controllability. Side effect is, that my tires seem to be bullet proof against snake bites now.
People can just put sealant on their inner tubes and not spend the money on converting their rims and tires to tubeless.
@@sepg5084 That does not work. And it's not a big deal to convert. You need valves and sealant, most rims made in the last 5 years are tubless ready. I even ran two non-tubeless rims (Nukeproof Generator TR275) tubeless with no issues.
@@sepg5084 setting up tubeless realy isnt expensive and if you dont flat tubes often you can probably get away with running verry little sealant.
I myself it just recently gotten used to the tubeless setup and it's something that I'll definitely find myself going back too far as tubes in my 29er but this video was really helpful in the sense of understanding how to really see the tube and recognizing when it isn't set correctly hence the wobble
snake bite= low pressure in tyre, just inflate to 2-2,5 bar and you avoid it permanently.
But how do you sell all this tubeless stuff and get commission out of it?
I'm using them for convenience. Here in Italy where i live we basically destroy rims without something like a cushcore, tannus armor or something like that. But those cost quite a bit of money. So innertube and 28 psi in the rear while 24 psi in the front. Only down side other than reduced grips it's the pinchflats you get sometimes
I went to tubeless because it was "all the rage". Honestly, don't like it. I used Stan's and what I found is when it's time to redo it is an absolute mess. I spent hours cleaning the rim getting the old dried up sealant off. My guess is I probably waited too long between applications. I'm going to try the lightweight tubes and see how that goes. Never had a pinch flat but then again I'm not an aggressive rider like Doddy.
@@explorenaked For me tubeless is great, I just didn't have much money to keep buying tubeless tires (for 26' wheels they cost like gold) and sealant, plus I didn't see any radical advantages in running tubeless here... It's just rocks...
But now that I bought a DH for racing I guess I need to try it again and see how it goes
surprised you run only 28 psi with tubes, especially if you live in a rocky area, id be hitting my rim often with tubeless at 28 psi so can imagine a lot of pinch flats, do you run heavier casing tyres?
@@Ben-tg1sn yes i run heavy tires on all my bikes. DH minis on my commencal Frs and on my enduro (canyon strive 2014) I run magic mary front and back, I have a some videos that show the kind of terrain I ride.
I prefer heavier tires with more grip than lighter ones with a cushcore. But as I said I'm on tubeless on my DH bike right now and loving it so far, 24 back and 22 front
Not a tube comment, but your color coordination was absolutely on point this video Doddy!
Never regretted going tubeless.
Where i live i have the same problem as you Doddy THORNS , regular punctures whilst out riding even with tubes with sealant in. Grrrrrr
Went tubeless and changed my tyres to Vittoria Barzo's and what a difference!
No flats , get home notice thorns in tyres.
not had a flat tyre in about 2 years now.
Great stuff Doody and GMBNTech
A very honest review on the use of tubes/tubelesss systems. I've been running tubeless for a few years now but recently swapped out my tires to put on some more aggressive treads for winter (Canada) riding. I decided to pop some tubes in since I'll be switching the tires back in a couple months. I have to say the simplicity of just popping in a couple tubes was really nice....and so simple. I'm a heavier rider and always run a couple extra pounds of pressure in my tires so pinch flats never were much of an issue for me anyway. I don't think I'm ready to abandon tubeless but I must say it sure was convenient and less of a mess putting tubes in.
I am also in canada and running tubes in the winter is a must. The only problems i have ever had with tubeless was in the winter colder than -20
Been running tubes since I started riding and don’t plan on switching. Has worked fine for me for 20 years.
bcoz American roads are butter
You can cut an old tube into elastic strips.
Also, you can add sealant to tubes with non-replacable valves with a syringe and a hose.
Also (again) some manufactors of sealant says its just fine for tubes, so you dont always need special stuff.
I got a Muc Off tubless kit for Christmas, I would’ve already had 3 flat tires by now, sealant is so great
That's great that you've gone tubeless, Jonah! The Muc-Off tubeless range is super reliable. 👍
You can also get inserts for use with inner tubes which help with pinch punctures and thorns. I use one on my rear wheel as the extra weight doesnt bother me. Tyre tech has come on so much too over the years.
Most modern tyres are actually quite hard to puncture with thorns as a result of better build quality, so thorns are nothing like the problem they once were. Almost every puncture I've had in the past 5 years was due to the tyre being sliced by glass or a sharp rock, and most of those were too big for tubeless sealant to have sealed them, or in the sidewall, where selaant is basically useless. Most tyre issues I have are due to sidewall failures rather than thorn/snakebite related issues, and I run nothing but tubes in my bikes. I went tubeless when the UST system first came out in the early 2000's and again a few years ago and found them to be a downgrade in terms of maintenance hours and time spent repairing punctures trailside when compared to tubes.
@GMBN Tech This is a great informative video. One of the best if not the best. Love the advise on reusing the inner tubes and keeping the environment clean. Doddy is a library of knowledge. I have a question though: Would a hardtail experience more punctures compared to full suspension bikes, especially on the rear tyre? #GMBNTech #GMBN #MountainBiking #MountainBike #MTB #BikeLife #Cycling
Honestly, I've always felt the real difference is the specific tread you go for. Personally, I run tubes as im a little accident prone and I find it much easier to fix on the go (maybe I'm just a bit of a dummy).
The real piece of golden advice I can give is that slime inner tubes exist. They're an inner tube with slime sealant in. Basically, I run these as they are a life saver in terms of thorns, I always get home and then normally realise the next day.
Or just run tubeless and then thorns aren't a problem unless you're buying cheap crap tyres.
@@flippy66 True in most cases. XC tyres are an exception though as they're designed to be as light and thin as possible so even with the best team issue and high tpi tyres you still get thorns. A slime inner tube is considerably less than the £50/$75 per tyre.
@@edwardrecord5305 That's very true, but rather specialist.
Sealant for innertubes also exist if you want those.
Great vid again Doddy! The key takeaway here is you need to run tubeless if you need to run tubeless ;). Where I am it’s not thorns its cactus. I also run Nukeproof tire inserts. Zero flats (and rim dings) since switching over (3 years running) and I can run any pressure I want for better grip. Tire inserts and tubeless sealant are the single best low cost improvements you can make to your bike. Forget all the endless expensive upgrades that make virtually no difference. If you ride sharp rocky terrain with cactus or thorns you should make the switch. But you don't need it if you don’t need it ;).
Same here in Arizona desert
Superb tech vid
Love my tubes! Don't seem to have any more trouble than my tubeless riding buddies, as long as I make sure my pressures are on point. Great video with some great tips and pointers.
What pressures do you use? I'm new to mountain biking and riding (due to the time of year) in very muddy but also rocky conditions and I weigh about 14 stone
I switched to tubeless a couple of years ago and have never found the same feeling as when using tubes, to the point that i think im going to swap back to tubes.
I also feel there so so much more support in a tyre when running a tube. I hate the feeling of a tyre folding, but with tubes i dont tend to get this anywhere near as much as with tubeless.
In terms of tyre pressures, Obviously the pressures run with tubes wont be the same as tubeless but even when playing around with the pressures i have never been able to get the same feel. The whole theory of "you can run lower pressures with tubeless" for me is counterintuitive because as soon as the pressure is reduced the tyre folds and squirms more, so then you have to add more pressure to stop this which then leads to the tyre feeling to hard. I find running a tube gives more stability even when running lower pressures so you get good compliance but none of that horrible collapsing feeling from the sidewall. I have been contemplating something like a cushcore to see if this gives that added feeling of support but in all honesty i cant be bothered with the faffing about when fitting them. Plus, if im putting a cushcore in then it defeats the weight-saving element of tubeless so i may as well just run a tube.
Touch wood i have very rarely had punctures with a tube, and in the last 5 years i dont think i have had a single pinch puncture, and im a heavy guy at around 115kg in riding gear. With tubes i was running 25 and 28psi front and rear on a hard tail and had no issues. I always run downhill casing tyres anyway, partly due to my weight, and partly to avoid punctures, but as im not doing any cross country racing im not so fussed about rolling resistance. I would prefer a supportive, strong, grippy tyre for the downhills, and have to work a bit harder on the climbs rather than the reverse. I often ride with a friend who is 66kg, also rides a hardtail but runs either cross country or trail casing tyres and he is forever getting punctures (yes this isnt selling tubes, but the point is, a thick tyre and a tube is generally more reliable than a lightweight fast folling tyre)
The only thing i worry about with tubes is thorns causing punctures, or, pinching the tube when fitting the tyre as my rim/tyre combo is a very tight fit.
All in all though, i prefer the more supportive feel of tubes when you are on the side of the tyre, and find i can actually run lower pressures to get nice feel over roots etc without having a squirmy tyre.
Just get a insert like cushcore it gives you insane amounts of sidewall support
@@ASAP2525 You're solving the wrong problem by adding inserts when using a tube gives the same support at a much lower weight. I also found when I ran tubeless that the sealant would dissolve while riding on really cold wet days, so any punctures that had sealed on warn dry spins were just being saved up for cold wet days rather than remaining fixed. Also with tubeless, pumping the tyres at least weekly was essential to keep the pressures right, while with tubes they get pumped every month or so, if even.
@@peglor Cush core XC weighs as much as tubes and use stans race sealant if you have any weird problems with sealing. Also yeah you have to pump up your tires up for every ride it is what A worthy sacrifice for bombproof reliability
@@ASAP2525 Depends what you consider reliability I suppose, since smashing rock gardens isn't my thing and I run enough pressure to stop the tyres folding under cornering, I don't have any of the issues tubeless is supposed to fix, but since I have several bikes, not having to deal with dried sealant in the tyres on the ones that don't get used regularly definitely means tubeless needs more labour time to maintain than tubes for about the same amount of trailside downtime.
@@peglor I go through tires every 6 months so I never have to deal with sealant drying up. So cal has lots of sharp rocks and thorns EVERYWHERE even when I did run tubes I had to run sealant in them to stop thorns and that was a messy hassle and just costed more money
I tried to reuse my old tubes as extra layer between tube and tyre for protection against glass / thorns on my commuter bike, didn't work so I shoved in old tyres (trimmed) and it's bulletproof, also heavier. Otherwise I run my MTB tubeless.
@@RealMTBAddict I know, it's DIY butchery satisfaction 😅
Love to see GMBN review the Tannus Armour Tire Inserts
I've never used tubeless, but looking at the amount of tyre sealant required for each tyre, seems to me that it would weigh nearly as much as an inner tube?
You’re right, those who say tubeless is lighter are missing the point. The gains are the lower pressure and self-sealing properties
Tubeless is heavier indeed
Tubeless was never about less weight! Its a bad misperception. Its
merely marketing bullshit started by Stan's.
Tubeless was originally invented by downhillers sick of having their buzz killed by flats!
Tubeless is ALL about no pinch flats, waaay less puncture flats, better handling and braking, ability to run lower pressure, more traction and more comfort. In other words, it's about performance and reliability.
To give up reliability in a non race, trail riding scenario is idiotic, ridiculous and stupid. Everyone I know who used tubeless for weight savings and weight weenyness with ultra light tires and rims, for general trail rides and training, CONSTANTLY SUFFERS
reliability problems, leakage issues and torn tires.
Ive used tubeless well before Stan's existed. I haven't had a flat in 20 years.
Weight weenies are such time wasters, so stupid and frustrating they get uninvited from our epic long distance rides. These sort of dummies seem to know it all, yet never learn from mistakes!
DONT RUIN
your riding buddy's epic rides! You might lose them!
@@rollinrat4850 I think its all about the terrain where you live. Out here it isnt rocky or extremely vegetated. My previous setup was tubeless, but often suffered from burping due to the low pressure. The grip was great though. On my new bike, the setup is still stock with tubes and honestly, i dont notice anything about it.
@@SidiNic Some folks don't want the extra hassle with tubeless and that's fine. If you ride to just get somewhere, reliability is probably the most important aspect. I get it. To each his own. Getting out there riding is what's most important.
I see a big disadvantage in using offroad tires with tubes, the way Im using my bikes. Tubed tires (excepting $$$ racing tubulars) are quite a bit slower and much less secure in cornering, not to mention they ride much stiffer and not so comfortable.
In cyclocross racing, tire set up is a huge deal because you need to corner hard and fast on these fairly skinny knobbies often with minimal tread.
If you're burping tubeless tires lots or pinch flatting often with tubeless or tubes, you're using too low a pressure for your riding style, weight etc. For smoother terrain you can use more pressure.
More pressure will give you faster rolling tires arguably, with less rolling resistance.....
A smaller contact patch on the ground, but I believe a larger contact patch has less pressure on the ground since the same weight is supported by more rubber contact. Less pressure means more traction, more security, more safety in a number of ways.
I ride pavement to get to trails right from my house most often, so I start with higher pressure and let some out when I get to the dirt.
If you hit things harder or get lots of air you'll also need to run more pressure to avoid burping, pinch flatting or damaging your rims.
I often ride pretty rocky terrain on rides exceeding 6 hrs. Softer tires ease the beating, but it's always a bit of a compromise because I don't want to burp my tires or bang my rims too often or really hard. Descending fast is pretty fun and addicting!
I really dig tubeless tires because I can get away with banging the rims a little bit without pinch flatting. I can also feel a huge improvement in traction, the way the tire conforms to the ground in corners and most importantly, comfort for my long rides.
Ive been messing around with tire set ups, high end tires and trying to ride fast through rough terrain since my racing days, long ago on pro quality tubular tires.
I remember the early ultra skinny road clincher tires pumped up over 110 psi. They were awful, beat you to death and scary on rough roads very common in my area.
Tires are our connection with the ground. If you want to go fast, corner hard yet also ride efficiently, proper tire set up is key. Many racers, especially in motor sports, are very secretive about tire set up, rubber compounds and suspension set up. Lots of engineering goes into performance tires and suspension.
The key to getting the most out of your tires is experimenting and testing set ups and various tires, even to the point of failure if you really want to 'push the envelope'.
I also do off-roading in 4wds. Most serious wheelers will have an air compressor. Mine is a custom industrial unit hard wired into my rig with a large storage capacity. I can run air tools as well.
First thing I've done when bought my 2nd hand bike with tubeless setup, wacked tubes in. Running 18psi front, 25 rear, der Baron/Kaiser setup wery happy with it, no punctures in 3 months yet with 92kg weight. I was using specialized, schwalbe and conti tubes, first two are really crappy, had punctures often, with conti tubes all hell ended.
I have used inner tubes for years and will continue to do so the pros outweigh the cons i manly ride park on my dh and run thick maxxis tubes and haven’t lost any pressure or had any reason to change to tubeless
But it was a interesting video it was awesome to hear the pros and cons on the subject
What pressures do you run?
I run 22.5 psi rear and 19.5 front and when I run anywhere near this with tubes I'd just get flats.
@@nebnollock5198
I run about 25 sometimes 30 in the front and rear
And on my dj I run 80
@@ideapap1 in fairness you can get away with higher pressures on dh bikes because of the extra travel giving you more grip which probably helps you with not getting flats.
My bike is 140mm front and rear so tyre pressures have a bigger impact.
@@nebnollock5198
I guess it would also do with riding style to
How do you ride
@@ideapap1 tbf I ride my trail bike down rough and rocky enduro trails and uplift bike parks so it takes quite a beating
I run tubeless … reluctantly. Tubeless has advantages but it still very primitive IMO. Biggest issue is seating of valve - at best it’s a hack. The wheel and valve guys need to get together and fix this. Name brand MTB sealant is ridiculously priced ( so I use automotive store Slime)..
I always ride innertubes. 2 punctures in 2 years time. 🤙 Tubeless is overrated. I biked 6000km so far.
When i run tubes, i had a puncture each 2 rides... Now, with tubeless, i have 1 puncture each 2 years.
Something I found that you can use for thorns is a Kevlar tire liner that fits between the tire the tube, it adds weight but adds some peace of mind.
Pro tip for repairing tubes, and tyres even. You can use an old tube as the patch and the vulcanising cement. That way you can fix a hole of any size, even in a tyre.
This is an interesting tip, thanks
good one. i`ve used the schwalbe tpu tubes for gravel road riding over the last few years, no problems
We use old inner tubes as bungie cords to hold bikes onto a basic towbar bike rack (the 2 arm no clips style). They don't scratch, don't slip, and have a ton of force when pulled tight. They can also be used to make slingshots for the kids.
I use tubeless in the front & a really thick tube in the rear...&it works well. I only weigh 165lbs now & less in my summer riding weight so really no problems at all. Well maybe just as much if I had tubeless in the rear. I live in Central Oregon so I don't have problems with thorns in this area at all. This is a great video GMBN & awesome MTB topic 👏🏿
Oh I love going downhill really fast.
I actually went tubeless on my road bike before my mountain bikes, but wouldn’t go back. I’m amazed at what they cope with. That said I remember a time riding at Whinlatter where I slashed the rear tyre in two places and the tube was bulging out of both and it still stayed up, and I only realised when I got back to the car!!
On a different note Doddy, I’m a tart for my colour coordination clothing to bike, but you’ve taken it to another level here! 🤣🤣
Tire tech improved so much over time it actually made using tubes more bearable. That being said, if the terrain is not aggressive enough, you won't have any kind of problems running tubes even today. I have an XC bike I ride it three times a week, and for pretty long hours (every Sunday I run 6 to 8 hours rides through natural trails) but the terrain is not aggressive enough, and even in this scenario I can count with the fingers of one hand the amount of punctures I get through a whole year.
I am currently saving to change my hubs and then I'll convert to tubeless just because I wanna see if rotational weight and the weight difference are noticeable for me (around 700g off the bike sound like it may be noticeable, specially where they are located) but I don't really have problems with tubes, and should the weight not be that noticeable, I'd probably run Tannus Armor + lightweight tube which solves most of the problems of running tubes: can be run with low pressure, virtually eliminates snake bites and thorn punctures, and adds support to the rim.
Hey Doddy. Been running tubes forever as my rims very entry level and can't set them up tubeless. I used to get punctures all the time so I changed to the specialized ground control with a trail casing and switched from a normal tube to one with sealant inside and haven't have a trailside puncture in almost 2 years, running 28 on the back and 25 in the front, - well there are not a lot of sharp rocks in the North of Portugal. Yeah torns are a pain got one the other day and had to change the tube before going on a ride. Thank you for this review and letting everyone know that tubes are not that bad. I am waiting on availability of new bikes and will definitely go tubeless.
When tubes are working perfectly well for you by your own admission, why on earth are you so anxious to go tubeless?
@@peglor all I am saying is that I will be switching to running a tubeless setup when I get a new bike. for now it is working fantastic for me and won't be spending money on new wheels and sealant for now.
I just got a new Trek Procaliber 9.5, it's tubeless, I have always ridden with tubes but also when they became available, I also installed Tuffy Liners and have never had a problem, I wore out my front tire and the tuffy liner kept the tube inside the tire until I got back to the car and replaced the tire, it seems all that is talked about is how light a bike is vs. How durable it is
I found them awful, was constantly getting flats. Literally haven't had a flat since switching to tubeless about two years ago. People make such a big deal out of how messy/faffy it is to do, but it's really, really not.
dunno, i had a few pinches on some hard riding, but tubes are realiable and easy to fix (patches rule). I blew up all my tubeless setups before, even though ran same pressures (~26/7R, 24/5F) as with tubes.
Also its annoying to retape when a spoke goes off (rare but happens) and sealant dries up.
That being said, running tubeless now after a year on tubes and do notice bit more grip and less weight.
@@laurynasjagelo5075 I do know that I have never had any issues running tubeless. There are only two instances that you're going to get a flat running tubeless - 1. you've torn the tyre (how often does that happen?) and if it's a small enough tear that a tube would have worked then your sealant is going to work too. 2. you've burped it/blown it off the rim. In which case all you need is a pump. If you puncture a tube you need to carry a pump AND a patch kit, and even then finding the puncture can take ages out on the trail.
You can just add more sealant, you don't need to re-tape if the old tape is still fine, and if you damage a spoke you're doing a wheel true anyway, so adding 30 seconds of taping to the job is hardly a bid deal.
Used to get flats regularly when using tubes, last four years only two riding tubeless but they only needed reinflated, I did once have a front tyre come off the rim running tubeless, put an end to my day and a few weeks off with broken ribs.
@@garygilbert1127 Lol bigger problems than a flat that day! Ouch
Inner tubes and inner tube sealant ✌️ costs €10 works flawlessly 27 psi on the rear 23 on the front on my hardtail never had a single problem! Instantly seals thorn punctures and obviously avoid hitting rocks head on.
could you give example of taht ? i think about trezado/stans to inner tube, like african bike travelers
@@YuhriZ Muc off has a special tyre sealant that goes inside the tubes, Doddy even mentioned it in the video. You simply remove the valve core, put sealant in, fill it up with air and you are good to go 👍
I would fully recommend the bike hut sealant inner tubes for anyone thinking about it. Tried going tubeless but always found there was a slow puncture. So gave up with tubeless and got the sealant inner tubes. Been riding twice weekly for a year with them now and not one puncture!
Inner tube material makes great first handlebar wrap if double wrapping bars, road bike or Jones type alt bars for bikepacking.
I love riding tubeless, I preferred the weight reduction and supplenesss as well as the thorn protection.
but I’ve not been able to ride my bike as much these days, I’d be changing my sealant for every 3 or 4 rides, so I’ve gone back to tubes and so far I’ve not punctured the tubes once, but I run pressures in the mid 30s so I’m less prone to pinch punctures.
Changing your sealant every 3 or 4 rides !? You are obviously doing something wrong. I've only added sealant 1 or twice in 6 months. I literally put on 2500 miles or more on Continental cross kings
Changing your sealant every 3 or 4 rides !? You are obviously doing something wrong. I've only added sealant 1 or twice in 6 months. I literally put on 2500 miles or more on Continental cross kings
30.5 psi rear 29 psi front with tubes, no insterts, i have flats almost never does not matter if XC or trail bike, even on a bike park with the trail bike. If I do have a flat I can just swap the tube in 5 minutes, and I do not have to worry about valves, sealant, installation, losing pressure, if you damage your rim you can still use it with tubes, you can change tyres without problems not having to replace the liquid etc....you can use a tube for years even if the bike was not used...I think if you want a care free solution tubes are the way to go, if you ride your bike every day, then tubeless is probably better.
I really enjoyed this video. My 2 cents. I've been riding hardtail for a long time. I ride with tires up in the 30-32 psi range and love hoping everything in sight. I have not had a pinch flat/snake bite in forever. (note that I usually ride roads to get to the TH so higher pressure keeps me going). I've probably had the same tubes for 6 years or more with a couple of thorn patches on each. I'm considering a new bike and it will probably come set up tubeless. I'll see how it goes. I only rode tubeless once on a friends bike. I took it from has garage and it was flat. He filled it with goop and pumped it up. I rode and returned it and it was flat. Same thing next day. goop everywhere. Probably a bad setup but I will see what happens. I still swear by tubes. I guess I am in the 85%.
Most likely a bad setup. I am quite convinced by tubeless, judging by the people who come into our shop and ask for it: they did their research. Their bikes are banged up visually, but close to perfect when it comes to technical condition. Very well maintained.
Meanwhile, as someone who just takes a little peak into mountainbiking, but someone who repairs bikes for a living: for the average Joe, tubes are where it's at. They're easy to fix and/or maintain, most entry bikes don't run folding tires, and in the worst case of an unfixable tube, that's about the easiest repair everyone can learn.
Oh, and just in case it comes down to "fixing is better than replacing"
Very much so, in terms of environment, I Support that. Our customers don't. Replacing a tube is much, much cheaper than fixing a puncture, just because of the time we work on it. I'll happily fix a tube for a friend or so. But at work, I have to weigh time vs cost in order to give the customer a fair deal.
I have run tubed for many years (and previously snot tubes, amazing how many 'wounds' a tube can sustain and still keep pressure! ) with fairly low pressures between 24 and 26 psi., and have never had many problems, perhaps 1 or 2 times a year at most. Just got another bike and this is already running tubeless so will be gauging what they are like over next few weeks/ months, but first impressions are very good! FYI I ride mostly rocky terrain here in Ostrichland, Maxxis tyres and my 'go-to' tube is a bright orange Tubolito as it's compact and light. BTW Doddy I could listen to your videos all day long as I like to consider myself a bit of a spanner monkey and always looking to improving my knowledge.
Last I have a hack for your viewers..... if you ever run out of threadlock/Loctite try Marmite! Every time I try to open the jar it feels like it's arc welded tight. Plus it tastes fantastic.
My issue with tubless is the 6 month refill on the sealant.
And i have to adjust pressure every week, because ir always looses pressure.
Still... I use it on both bikes.
The music everytime Doddy changes a tube 🤣
When I got my levo 29 x 2.6, I was determined to run tubes. I put sealant in them as well. Was running about 35 lbs pressure, but pinched them continuously in the rocks! My friends who run tubeless were annoyed. Now on tubeless at 25 lbs, but with a tire insert on the back.
Got a bad puncture mid trail a while back, put my inner tube in and pretty much forgot about it. Literally change it out just yesterday after picking up a new tire.
Try using a Tannus armour tire insert. An insert made for use with innertubes and lower pressures. Maybe with a Tubolito tube. Light and made for running lower pressures. I just moved away from tubeless. I also went from a DD Maxxis Aggressor tyre to an EXO. Same width, almost tha same weight with Tubolitos.
I've been tubeless for a couple of years now but I feel like trying the Tannus Armour inserts with tubes. Obviously there's a weight penalty but they seem a pretty good system.
I went from tubeless back to tubes with tannus armour and its much better. You can even ride on a flat, not that I've had one yet!
@@MR....T that sounds great. Once my current batch of sealant runs out I think I'll do the same. Or at the very least run tannus on my rear tyre.
that with those super light tires that are supposedly lighter than tubeless would be fun I guess, someone should try it!
I've been on tannus with tubes for nearly 2 years after having no luck with tubeless and the tannus has worked faultlessly.
@@MR....T tannus has airless tyres have you tried them
I like to repurpose tubes by making “dropper diapers”. I zip tie a cut tube to the seat rails (2x) and then around the seat post collar (1x). It keeps winter muck from going straight to the dropper. I also like this for manual seat posts!
I am riding tubeless for 2 years now but I can't say I find it a revelation. I don't care about the weight and I still don't like the hassle with latex. So there are times I really think about going back to using inner tubes. I used to adept to the wet season with my choice of tires but I don't do that anymore because of the latex and all the extra cleaning. On the other hand I can't recall the last time I needed to repair a puncture. Will I stay with tubeless? I will see the next time I need a new set.
I was all about tubes (with sealant due to goatheads) prior to getting a plus tire E-Bike. In our local mountains, just about dusk I got several flats due to rocks. It was sketchy trying to get out before dark (no lights) plus the annoyed looks from your riding friends as I am tearing my rear wheel off again! When I added more pressure to 35 lbs ( I used to use 45 lbs in my 26 in wheels) it became too stiff and would slide on any loose rock or soil. I washed out unexpectedly several times.
I couldn't take the torment anymore! I went tubeless. (I put a flat tire defender insert in after a bit.) I inflate to 25 lbs now. No thorns, sidewall burping or pinch flats since.
My one problem going tubeless really is tire sidewall thickness. If you damage a sidewall on tubeless, it's nearly impossible to seal. (friends have used dirt to rub on the cut) Sedona sandstone killed my regular Specialized Butcher 2.6. I was fighting slow leaks for 2 days. It would seal at night, then leak on the ride.
I recently tried the Butcher Trail version with T7 compound. It's been very durable
Also, I got a syringe tool and reuse all my sealant that is not dried. (Very Smurfy) You can use the included tube to inject the sealant into your tire through the valve hole itself. This is valuable, because you put the tire on the rim first, then the sealant. No mess. You can use the syringe to remove the sealant prior to tire removal as well. Lastly, the injector tube can be used as a dipstick to check the sealant level in the tire without removing the tire.
I use tubes with Tannus Armour inserts. So far so good and they absorb some roughness too
Used tubes with slime in before. Never again. Dont seal and make a mess everywhere. Always have a couple of spare tubes just in case
Damn, you don't leave your thrash inner tube(s) behind! Improper disposing of inner tubes is not a good mountainbiking etiquette.
Lots'a love, cheers, & Mabuhay, from tropical Philippines! #KeepBiking
I’ve been running a smaller/lighter tube along with the Tannus insert for the past 6 months with zero punctures. I’ve been to several bike parks with this setup as well and I honestly don’t see a reason to go back to tubeless.
What is the weight like compared to tubeless?
@@JonnyNorthmore Should be no weight difference at all. There was a video on this, search Tannas vs tubeless.
The tube is 140g and the Tannus insert is 300g. So the tubeless weight would depend on if you had an insert or not. The overall weight would also depend on the tire choice as well, you can get away with a lighter tire with the insert.
Sounds like you live in a thornless heaven
Used this set up too but I do sometimes still get pinch punctures.
Think I try running the pressure too low.
quick tip when using inner tubes: use one that's 25% bigger than your tire width. It results in the tube being initially the same width, so it doesn't stretch thin as you fill it up.
Some of our trails (as in GMBN viewers) don't get rough enough to make tubeless almost a necessity anyway, though there are still other attractive benefits like lower tyre pressure and weight shaving
I discovered tyre slime when I ran tubes and never had any flats 20 odd years ago and used it upto when I went tubeless around 5 years ago. Funny how everyone has sealant in their tubeless nowadays!
I still run slime in tubes on my 2 boys bikes. I have Stan's in my front tyre and a tube with slime on the back. We have goats head jacks out here (New South Wales far west outback), which have 3 very hard thorns on each jack. Even road bikes need some form of sealant. I took a short cut through a dry drainage ditch last summer and had to get 35 jacks out of my rear tyre. Summer temperatures range upto 38-45 dergrees Centigrade during daytime.
Only got back into riding less than a year ago and have only had two punctures and I go out about twice a week, I have 30+ psi in my tubes so pretty firm, and only really struggle for grip on very muddy steep hills and I don't hang about going down rough by-ways with lots of flint.
Tannus armour on the rear with a tube. Not fatted in a couple of years now. Good ride feel, and really low pressures
Are we gonna talk about the purple everything? :D
Tubeless only on my primary bike. It eliminated my frequent goat head leaks when tubed.
I never found self sealing tubes work well, always fail and no seal at some point, and then the mess…
Probably depends also on your use, I generally ride natural ish trails, and on the higher side as I don’t like the tire squirm so 30psi or so it’s very rare to puncture. The big draw is the simple tech can be fixed easily be that trail or at home. I’m lucky in that thorns are a big issue generally.
I used to use kenda tubes with sealant and when i had my first flat after getting them i thought they were junk but when i pulled the tube out it had actually sealed itself a couple times before it failed i just didnt realize at the time
The first fifteen seconds of this video is Doddy on a mission!! 😆
Fair video i use tubes with sealant cant see me go backwards or forward i have tried tubeless got flats burpee flats see them as a snake bike i did a great nugget which i will do is add spare tube in the triangle by the head never know some one on the trail may benefit from it
I had my girlfriend running tubes with slime tube sealant until very recently. It definitely worked. Two years ago we rode in Palm Springs with a lot of cactus on the trail. Her tubes had 2 inch long cactus thorns and about 10 small holes. Tubes never went flat. Great option for someone wanting to run tubes and having an extra piece of mind.
I do this on my roadie commuter. Works a treat!
@@mattdowney6540Awesome! Tubeless is great, but the mess and when you do get a puncture it's all over the bike.
I run with a tire and tube on the inside of my tubeless tire. I do this for two reasons. The first is it is much cheaper than running certain inserts. the inner tires are old and bald 700c so they didn't cost anything. The other reason for my setup is it makes it so much easier to get the tubeless tire to seat.
The down side is I had to drill a new hole in my rim to take a tube valve as well as the tubeless one (It isn't difficult to set up a tubed valve as tubeless). I run the inner tire between 20-30 psi and I run the outer tire as low as 10 psi to give me a large footprint but still maintain the support given by the inner tire.
I don`t have any worries with the weight as it is a ebike I use, the extra grip and comfort more than makes up for it.
Great video, and can't wait to get back to bike park, love wales! Tubeless all the way.
Buddy just went for new Mitch Endro race tires they are tube tires, have been watching a lot about tubless sysytems for winter coming in you reckons i could chance trying a tubeless set up with them
Still using them even after I upgraded my bike from an old beater to an entry level XC bike.
I'm a weekend trail rider so it's enough for my usage.
My backwheel has a small ding... Can i still put cushcore etc. in + Tubeless? Also only has a 24 mm inner diameter.
My first ride at Torridon hitting big rocks running tubeless. I gashed the tyre badly and had to put in a inner tube. Been running it since with no issues on rocks but my pressure is a little higher than it was.
My no1 reason for using tubes (which I don't anymore) would be that it's so easy, quick and not messy to change between different tires back and forth
Can we just have a moment of appreciation for Doddy's thumbnail efforts? 😀
It's a great pose! 😅
I used Slime tubes on my old bike before going fully tubeless and they were terrible at sealing after even minor punctures.
On my current xc hardtail, I had Hutchinson Race Lab Kraken tyres running tubeless with Cafe Latex sealant, but had a pretty bad fail on my rear tyre on my way to work (thankfully, it blew going up hill, so I was going slow).
After that, I changed to running tubes again with Tannus Tyre Armour inserts and a lighter set of tyres (Continental Race King and Cross King combo) and I've had no issues with punctures since, in spite of scummy people leaving broken beer bottles laying around.
Another benefit is that unless I get a puncture through the inserts or decide to change the tyres, I don't have to do anything like replacing sealant every six months or so.
Here in Bakersfield CA and around Southern California we got tons of thorns, what tubes and sealant do you guys recommend for 27.5 hardtail
i never had issues with tubes since i grew up using it and ive used it on some pretty rough trails and its holding up alot
I would be interested to see what the weight difference is between a cored tubless set up vs tube would actually be. I can't imagine it would be much different.
yeah it really isnt much difference especially once you throw tire inserts in the mix. tires and rims are the weight that really matters
I think it comes down to how much you're willing to do patch work on a tube, I personally carry two spare tubes and two patch kits for my tires in my backpack. I would rather repair the puncture(s) at the end of a run, or home whenever possible. At least if something goes awry I should be able to manage in the meantime
I used to have issues with thorns all the time. I don't have that no more easy remedy was a 2 pronged attack tube sealant (slime) and high pressure .
Always have a spare with me but in Arizona you need tubeless!
Btw dope bike Doddy!
I've never gone tubeless, was tempted once or twice but not now, with suspension, decent tyres and slime there ie no need for me to bother,
I can run high presure and have good enough grip still and thorns arent a problem with slime in the tyre.
Again excellent video
I have inner tubes I have always had a spare tube for just in case there has been a few extremely few I can count them on one hand in 35 years I've only had four snake bite punctures on the trail now on the other hand I've had more punctures you couldn't even count them on either hand feet toes your friends your friends friends and your friends friends hands feet and toes on how many punctures I've had on the road with tubes I have recently gone tubeless for one solid year so far I've had no problems road or off trail
off topic but what kind of handlebars are you running?
thanks
My first bike came with inner tubes, but some friends helped me make it tubeless the same day I got it so I never really got to test the difference between having inner tubes and tubeless. My new bike came already tubeless though.
A segment of inner tube is a good replacement for rubber shims in QR seat clamps.
im still running the factory tubes that came on my bike two years ago. Tho I've got a feeling the pressure gauge on my floor pump is reading low