Yelan is the WORST OFFENDER in this regard. Her story quest literally shows a cutscene about the backstory of A F****** RANDOM NPC while you learn nothing. Nada. Zilch. about Yelan's past or personal life. Excuse my language, it's been a year and I'm still mad.
@@AverageWagieI mean, Yelan’s whole thing is being secretive. I don’t get adding the backstory of a random character but not telling about her past is in character (I haven’t played her story quest yet though)
@@AverageWagie same for Nilou i'm tired of them focusing on random ass NPCs we will never see again. Nilou needs character development cuz all she got is she likes dancing and being happy and that's about it. Not everything has to be deep but damn can we have some more story and interactions with these characters cuz rn these characters are as stale as bread 😔.
One of the underrated females writing wise is.... dehya. Hear me out. Her story quest was actually somewhat about her. She showed emotions and most importantly she was herself. Yes, she appreciates the traveler's compliments, laughs it somewhat cutely. But she doesn't fall for the traveler. She sees the traveler as a friend, and she literally walked us off from sumeru to fontaine and didn't try to force us and say goodbye with EVERYONE.
Collei is definitely one of my favorites too, maybe cause i've read the manhwa but even without it she feels like a real character, i just love her character development and the way she cringes it feels so different but still cute
I loved her in the windblume festival. I wish Ayaka could receive a similar storyline in an event quest or something, to focus on her finding true friendships (outside of her clan) despite her being kinda reserved and isolated.
I loved her in manhwa, she had the edgy personality I liked lol. Then in game they just threw all that things to trash, she isnt a importanr character anymore. Same goes for Dottore, he WAS THE GOOFY VILLAIN I NEEDED😭😭
Personally, I wish Raiden Shogun stayed as more of an antagonist. It was refreshing after all the waifus and just made more sense given her position and beliefs
I agree that they did Kokomi terribly dirty. Her story is meant to be that of acceptance, accepting a life that she was thrust into for the sake of her people. That is a very good base material... but that is about all they gave her. They never showed us her true genius, her struggle, her acceptance- non of it is there. It is locked behind the readable story.
Right? Like, Sangonomiya does not strike me as a very martial civilization. Kokomi is well-read, but she's ultimately still a civilian leader thrust into this war. Her knowledge makes her situation all the worse: people trust her to get them through this alive, she knows that any mistake may cost who knows how many lives, she knows that she may have to send people on low-survival missions for the greater good and she probably also knows just how screwed the Watatsumi rebellion would be if the Shogun ever decided to take over the campaign personally. All of that must weigh heavy on her.
I think another big problem I have with her is her overall design. For someone thrust into the position of war general who has definitely seen people under her command die under her leadership, she is awfully clean wearing her beautiful flowing dress into a battlefield where the stakes are survival or the complete destruction of a revolution for the freedom of a nation. Gorou wears a crop top into the frontlines and he somehow feels more battle ready than her
@@brightb5339tbh, shes a strategist, she works behind the scenes, strategizing and stuff. Not to mention shes the head priestess of Sangonomiya. In culture ruled nations, dressing is considered a really important aspect for people eith authoritative or culture oriented roles. So i think kokomi's design actually suits her well.
another weird detail about Ganyu that I realized is that her struggles between a human and an adeptus identity is exactly what Shenhe's whole character is. But ofc, Shenhe is a full human raised by adepti, while Ganyu is part human and had long experiences living in society. So you'd think their character arcs would intersect and divide in unique ways
Shenhe’s story is actually the polar opposite of ganyu. She wants to reconnect with humanity , after being raised in isolation at the mountains by a bird with powers. Shenhe actually isn’t even an adeptus but a superhuman with murderous intrusive thoughts but is suppressed by her red ropes oh yeah she was also sacrificed by her dad to a demon to save their village.
@@dendenmushi9714 Ganyu's story is the first-generation immigrant who never really fit in with that society; there's just too much country bumpkin/war veteran baggage for her to ever become an integrated citizen. Contrasted against Yanfei who is a natural with city and human life.
@@riotangel4701exactly, that’s a perfect explanation. Ganyu is like a first generation immigrant, a half adeptus, but she was raised with adepti. While Yanfei also is a half adeptus, she was raised since the beginning among humans. Also Yanfei is much younger than Ganyu, she didn’t form a contract with Rex Lapis and didn’t witness the archon war.
HoYoverse just doesn’t know how to write ancient characters. 2k years old and is worried over “fitting in”, because “horns”, when the people of Liyue practically worship adepti. It’s ridiculous.
Jean is the only "workaholic waifu" who works to me because her character isn't sold as someone who shallowly loves work to the detriment of their health like Liyueans; in fact, the depth of her character comes from the ways Jean is incapable of being more than human. She needs to take care of her health and her social life, temper her self-perception and expectations, and she does this all while trying to deny herself the intimacy she deeply craves, but chose to sacrifice for duty. Jean feels human, and she's actually got a lot of the subtleties you seem to have overlooked that others pointed out, in the vein of Hu Tao and whatnot.
I was looking for this kind of comment since I consider Jean lore always gets overlooked when it's quite good, really human. Unfortunately its blocked for the players who only do the quests and not read the characters story, it's never really approached how Jean life has always been put to so much expectations and constant training (not just physical but also learning all the history of the city and such) from her mother to the point she never managed to form a intimate life with others, not even with her own sister, even if it's said she doesn't regret it, it's still quite bitter thinking in retrospective. I don't want to write an long ass essay so I just going to resume it with she's a whole kind of mess and I lover her a lot!
@@gabrielasalgado815 I hear what you're saying. I don't think Jean is as ok with it as it's "said," thankfully (from a writing perspective). Which makes sense, given that she would like someone she can be intimate with. Plus, there are all the ways in which Jean entertains her friends and appeals to their concerns; these are the behaviors of someone who cares about the connections in their lives enough to regard them instead of brush them off for her duty. Jean's duty is also to the people in her life. It'll be nice if we get something Jean-centric one of these days, though. Something character-driven
I also think Jean being overworked is what makes her feel human. She is Acting Grandmaster, not that herself. The expectations and reality of being in a role you're not totally prepared for is overwhelming. I does leave for things to be forgotten or overlap in what needs to get done/when it needs to get done. Plus, Jean is in a space of intense power both in terms of what she has and expectations of the role. Her struggling feels like it matches what the role she has is, and how as a person most of us would likely end up in if put in that spot. Other workaholic characters to me don't feel like they have the same weight/expectations on their roles. Keqing and Ganyu know their jobs and honestly should have time to do more with their characters and setting balance, while Kokomi is yes, thrust into the role she might not be prepared for but just overall poor writing makes it so nothing serious can be said. In the end Jeans workaholic and not knowing how or when to take breaks feels right, it feels natural to her role and benefits her writing more than harming it.
The character story quest quality difference between male and female characters is so massive, it’s actually insane. Like hu Tao was a more interesting character in her appearance in BAIZHU’S STORY QUEST than in her own! 💀
I left another comment about this but honestly the mens' story quests aren't really better on average. Like Ayato's quest was just as meaningless as most of the womens', which is kind of a shame for how much the story hyped him up.
@@rue1533 I only half-agree. Sumeru is probably overall the best archon quest so far but the writing definitely was improving before that. Like before that we had the Shenhe interlude, Ei's second story quest, and the Dainsleif and Xiao quests in the chasm, all of which are generally pretty great.
I think Faruzan feels like a unique female character. Her story, her personality, and her overall current predicament feels real to me. I think she belongs in that "four star waifus" that's not bland. Faruzan's just way more focused on getting her salary and having her work taken seriously so much that I don't feel the overwork waifu stereotype. Maybe it's just cause I really like playable "grandparents" type of characters, but Faruzan just hits right without the "fanservice" elements for me lol. Definitely "a *person* that exists" for me (*>∇
Totally, like she annoys me and she's not my fave character but I can't help but appreciate her writing. She is the perfect characterization of an "old professor", which adds so much novelty to her interactions with others and gives opportunity to funny moments.
i talked to her in the teapot and damn i didnt expect her to be that likable... they definitely did very well with some of the female sumeru characters, it gives me hope for the future
faruzan supremacy!!!!! i loved and still love faruzan’s design ever since i saw her :D i was going into her character writing blind and for some reason i wasnt expecting the attitude but i did end up liking it, it suits her and her personality isn’t overboard annoying for me
I think the 4-star women being generally better written than the 5-star women can be explained by the fact that Mihoyo doesn't have money riding on them and thus they can risk being more experimental with them.
Honestly, I can see that theory. Most of the 5 stars in Liyue except for Hu Tao, Xiao, and Zhongli (and maaaaybe Yelan) don't have much going for them outside of their job, but a 4 star like Beidou actually has power and personality outside of her vision/status, and properly lives up to her title as the Leader of the Crux Fleet, to the point where not only is she _integral to even GETTING you and Kazu into Inazuma,_ you can find former Crux Fleet captains/crew members in other countries who still speak highly of her. Honestly, we need more characters like Beidou and Dehya
13:33 Absolutely, the hype for Arlecchino and her potentially being playable has more than answered this question in my eyes. People absolutely want a morally ambiguous lady.
CC says that people don't like Yae cause she's morally ambiguous character but I don't like cause she just anoyed me.. on the other hand I'm really hyped for Arlecchino and really liked Ei at first (until rushed ending of Inazuma archon quest and her 1st story quest)
I do think that at the very least, the writing of the female characters (and in general) has improved a bit since Sumeru. I think characters like Nahida, Dehya, Faruzan and Collei are all great and some of my favourites in the game (though I'll never forgive Hoyoverse for sidelining Collei in the archon quest). Let's hope that the improvement continues with Fontaine.
Agreed. Sumeru characters feel better written to me than the others, and I think it really helps that they actually interact with each other frequently instead of just talking to the traveler one on one all the time
I think part of the problem is that female characters are not allowed to show negative emotions to the same extent as male characters. From the top of my head, the only instances I can remember of seeing a character being genuinely angry or in true despair it was always the males. And those scenes were important because those are the rare times when the story seems like it's actually getting serious. The female characters are just like "Eula is annoyed and looks like the grumpy emoji" and it's played for laughs, or "Nilou makes a little sad face, feel bad for her for 10 seconds and let's move on". Compare that to Alhaitham's rage in the archon quest when it looked like he wanted to kill Azar, or Scaramouche going through the 7 stages of grief in his story quest. No, female characters must always be composed and smile for the player. Because god forbid waifus are shown as real characters who have bad days too I guess. [Edit] Sure I love getting notifications from people calling me stupid because they didn't read my 2nd comment below or they didn't realize this thread is several months old, keep it classy guys.
Exactly, genshin thinks showing that these female characters are indeed human with flaws, struggles, and complexities isn’t all that sellable. Which is probably why(imo) any real complexity for them is hidden behind stuff nobody reads or pays attention to.
The only female I can recall who is capable of showing full-on rage as a natural reaction is Dehya. It's too bad this it's erased as a playable character.
nahida is the only character who we've seen actually cry i think update: navia, think it’s nice that they’re letting a character that’s supposed to be sentimental cry on screen so much. honestly it’s crazy how fleshed out she is already, possibly one of the most well written characters hoyo has made for this game
Especially since her entire existence has been a sudden and giant retcon. Before she showed up, all lore points to the Lawrences being exiled just like the entire nobility that isn't a Gunnhildr or a clan that isn't similar to them. Now with her appearance somehow changing everything by making that not only the Lawrences did not get exiled like the rest of their peers, every single member of the clan that isn't Eula and the other guy that turned a new leaf in the recent event is as rotten as their ancestors which begs the question why they didn't get exiled centuries ago if they were still so corrupt and morally terrible. So far Eula's story did little to expand and shine the line on the Aristocracy of old compared to the manga or what even happened to the Lawrences outside of the ones still in the city. Did they all die off? Did they settle somewhere and cleanse themselves of their past sins in a generational long quest? Did they all dance and hold hands while singing kumbaya with the mysterious Imunlaukr Clan and the rest with super depression at Dragonspine until an avalanche wipes all the exiles out? Who knows, the only thing for sure that the Lawrences of today are Saturday morning cartoon villains that twirl their mustache or redeem themselves before likely vanishing after a single event never to be seen again so that Eula can repeat the same thing with another member while foiling her Uncle's schemes.
Seeds of stories brought by the wind.. will sprout in due time. Im gonna let Hoyo cook for a very long time when it comes to Mondstadt characters because a huge part of them is just SET UP.. and theres alot of hints that near the end of the game these character will be on the spotlight again.. i just hope they dont miss because its gonna be a long ass time.
Eula's backstory could be great. And her relationship with Amber should be brought to the forefront (but we know that can't openly happen). She's a strong, stubborn character born into this social standing that makes her hated for just living, even though she actively fights for equality and defies her own family. How would that storyline not be interesting to explore?
it's even more apparent when you compare the overworked waifus to the 'overworked husbandos'. xiao is overworked, but it's handled so much more differently than how the women's arcs are. we actually see real consequences to his poor habits. xiao essentially views himself as nothing but a tool, so happiness and leisure are out of the question for him and that makes him an 'overworked husbando'. this translates into little self-worth and him cutting himself off from others to avoid being hurt or causing hurt. rather than running around and completing his errands for him or forcibly making him take a break, xiao's development comes in the form of a life-and-death scenario. it's his insistence that he sacrifice himself for the safety of everyone else in 'perilous trail' ("what if i told you this is my last will?"). yelan absolutely grilled him for making such a suggestion, but that's because xiao's lack of self worth is an actual flaw in his character. they don't try to coax him out of his poor tendencies like he's a cat or something the same way everyone does with kokomi, jean, ganyu, keqing, etc. he's a grown man, and he's very stubborn and in denial. that makes it all the more impactful and effective when he DOES finally recognize that yanfei and yelan's words held a lot of weight and they were right about him. that then leads to him actually reevaluating his perspective and developing as a character. with xiao's case, we get to the root of the problem, his trauma and self-esteem. with the women it's always a superficial "just stop overworking."
Yeah, it doesn’t matter thematically because the flaws the Keqing likes have is kind of just patronized to them rather than portrayed as an actual struggle that it’s important to avoid, the end of Ganyu’s quest basically says “she needs to be here overworking herself or liyue’s systems would collapse lol.”
Wtf xiao, my mindset is almost similar to him, and i never knew he was overworked. Basically in short i view myself as a slave to my parent, but i feel okay listening to their every command. Maybe its an asian thing lmao
@@naufalnoorizan1763 We aisians put social/family responsibility much higher than personal freedom/valve.I think it's a big cultural difference.Venti can't fit Liyue or Inazuma a bit.Qixing are already planning to take the power of Geo Archon even though Morax did rather more for its people compared to Venti.Apparently they believe Morax hadn't done enough.So the so-called overworking isn't really a thing for Asian people as they're supposed to do so.
Agree with everything, I just want to add Dehya as a major exception. People tend to dislike her for being "masculine" which???? She's not :D She just feels real and human
Honestly think ppl hate her cuz of her kit like I know so many ppl were excited for her and we’re gonna main her until hoyo did her kit so bad. I definitely was a fan of hers until she got added to the standard banner.
Disliking dehya for being masculine is so weird to me. Seems more to me like they don't like seeing women who are strong and don't play the damsel in distress. One of her idles literally shows her checking her make up, and during several important quests she's mentioned to be into feminine things. I think this is great bc women can be badass and strong and still like being feminine. She reminds me of the cool and badass women who raised me throughout my life, and I think that authenticity makes her a very fleshed out character.
"If you've been in the Genshin community long enough - first, I'm so sorry." Yeah, I feel that. Anyway, I think Noelle gets an honorable mention as a well-written character, at least in my view. She works so hard to be part of the "cool kids" club, but just makes a lot of bad choices with good intentions. As powerful as she is as a playable character, and despite her stoic and solid element of geo, she's an emotionally vulnerable character. Years of failing into becoming a knight has clearly affected her confidence and self-esteem. She often feels like she isn't doing enough, even though she's as hard-working as Jean is. Where she shines is in dedication. She represents her element a little too well, in that regard. But no matter how hard she tries, how hard she trains, and how much she helps others, she just can't reach her goal because the love others have for her is matched only by how much they fear her decision-making and lack of common sense. Being a knight is a team sport, but Noelle often carries the world on her shoulders. It's not a terrible trait, but she also needs to be careful about making decisions that would impact others, like aiding those who clearly have ill intentions for her country just because they look like they need help. She has the hero mentality of helping others, but she needs to learn that helping is not always a good thing. You can't help but root for her in the sidelines, but you also wish she's never admitted as a knight. She's so powerful that few would be able to stand up to her. And if she starts helping the wrong people, as she's already done more than once, she could place Monstadt in danger.
You forget the spy that was sent to them city RAN AWAY because she learned so much about him and his family in such a short amount of time. He didn't even get near his goal. She also has an unintentional creepy way of speaking: " Because this is your first meal in Mondstat...and your last." - Noelle to spy during hangout event
To me Noelle is kinda... She has a kinda cool backstory, and a "girl trying and failing to get in her dream college" vibe about her that makes her really grounded. Like she's learning how to be an adult, and i think that's endearing. But the way the game portrays it is kinda shallow. I wish it showed her actually putting herself at risk, like her lore tells us she does. Show, don't tell. Plus, idk why, hoyo always isolates her. Only time anyone ever talked to her was last time she showed up, when she was partnered with mika. her relationships are otherwise so shallow. AND she's kind of a mary sue :( Will still main her for as long as i play the game. I picked her out of my entire roster on the second week of my account back in 1.0, because her kit looked like it would have the most longevity out of the ones i had, and i thought it was the coolest looking one. and lol, i was right.
I dont know why the most interesting female charactsrs are four stars and the most badly written ones the 5 stars. Ningguang, Beidou, Kujou Sara are all my favorites because they're some of the most interesting. Meanwhile, Ganyu, a 5-star was so absent from the storyline of Liyue's archon quest I wondered if I've even met her before her story quest.
the worst part about this is that if you played impact 3rd then you know that hoyo can write very in depth female characters with great motivations and messed up personalities and the fans will still love them. they just choose not to here because genshin showed them you can be lazy with your characterization and still make a boatload of money.
About Ayaka: I think Xiao is the male "counterpart" to her since he simps too and they give a LOT of fanservice with him and the Traveler, but he also has a fully fledged character story and motivations that are completely unrelated to Traveler. He doesn't feel like he just sits around waiting for Traveler to show up when we're away, something Ayaka kinda does
I think part of the reason why Zhongli isn't an Overworked Waifu™ (besides the obvious) is that he chose to retire. He has agency and self awareness, unlike the female characters who always need to be convinced to take a break, like they don't know what's good for them.
what's especially tragic is how we go through this arc repeatedly, even within the same characters. like keqing had her whole realization that overworking isn't all good during moonchase in 2.1... then just 3 patches later she's learning the same exact lesson again in 2.4 during lantern rite. it's what made me especially irritated about that year's lantern rite, because we could've learnt about liyue's culture and history more again instead of just rehashing the same exact character arc but with a cute skin this time..
Nah bro, Jean literally HAS to be overworked because almost every Mondstadter is an idiot who needs Jean to be their mom constantly, and because the other Knights of Favonius just don't do their jobs (I think there's a reason why Diluc exclusively respects Jean out of all of the Knights). The theme of balancing work with physical and mental health doesn't work in this context, which is why I despise her story quest on so many levels (Jean is my favorite Genshin character). I'm praying that, when Varka returns with the main Knight force, Jean gets relieved of a lot of the workload and gets an opportunity to ACTUALLY be a character.
@@chickensky1121 Come to think of it, Mondstadt really has a bevy of awful npcs: whether its creepy stalkers, irreponsible alcoholics, pathological liars, racists, and morons who complain about the most trivial of matters.
@@aeso3555 Precisely, and most of the other Knights of Favonius (especially the NPCs) seem to be fairly incompetent, so Jean is almost on her own with regards to managing Mondstadt.
At this point, i don't know what to think anymore because there's so little discussion around Yanfei, who has Hu Tao's wit and strong connection to the adepti, but without Ganyu's duty. Yanfei is just so slept on, you know?
Agreed! She isn’t my favorite character but I like her a lot and she’s a so fun onscreen I think I like lawyer characters ig. She’s really chill yk like her life is pretty awesome and she’s content which makes alot of ppl not care abt her I think.
Feel like part of the reason she's slept on is because in the Chasm quest where she does get to shine a lot, she's overshadowed by Xiao, Yelan, and Itto all at once. This may be the same reason why Shinobu isn't as widely popular either
Yan Fei seems so mature and intelligent and happy with her life, a character doesn't necessarily need a tragic and edgy backstory to be a good character. I don't play many character based games but having a female character in the lawyer role felt pretty refreshing to me (as does that most leading roles in genshin are filled by women) and yet when Yan Fei came out people mostly talked about how she has a 'mommy voice' in the Japanese dub :/
Mostly agree, but I'm gonna have to say there are some 'selection bias' here to fit the thesis. The primary culprit is Yoimiya because she is one of the most solid and fleshed out characters and goes way beyond just your standard 'bubbly girl next door'. Her philosophy and outlook is also independently great without hinging upon simping for traveller. See her story quest 2 which is incredible and had me in tears as a grown-ass man. The primary issue with Genshin is that male or female, most characters are 70% miss and 30% great because the scheduling of new characters being released every 1-2 patches means that HYV set up new characters when they are first introduced and then has almost zero follow-ups on their story so they become half-baked arcs. Or they (Scara) have a huge lead-up but little no screen time once they are released and the new husbando / waifu is up for sale. This type of 'character dilution' is what's holding back the storywriting.
Her 1st quest was great cause it showed struggles of children and others because of the vision and Sakura degree.........but her 2nd one sucks because is just a date......sure has a child who can't walk boohoo but its just a date........and I get death threats........hoyos community.......so nice right
@@Accountthatexists Not gonna debate in comment section and obviously you have a right to your opinion. But Yoimiya's theme to me is the quiet rebuttal to the impermanence and suffering of life. She's not oblivious to suffering but accepts it and heals it. Because Ei latches onto eternity as a concept and repeats suffering as a result, Yoimiya's theme as a small, inconsequential mortal under her rule shows us a different path that can be taken by humanity that even surpasses that of archons. Both quests illustrate it, but obviously you can enjoy / reject the second as a simple children's date if you want. No shade intended, just sharing my thoughts.
@@sycamorewest Damn, you made me like Yoimiya even more now, and also see her second quest in a new light, I really like your explanation of her ideals and what she represents. Also hard agree on the second part of the first comment "Or they (Scara) have a huge lead-up but little no screen time once they are released and the new husbando / waifu is up for sale.", I was excited for so many arcs, like Collei (waiting since the manga), to know what's up with Cyno and that spirit in his body and his knowledge of magic, yet so far they only showed up to commemorate festivals and whatnot, their lore was mentioned very briefly (and in Cyno's case was missable). And in Scaramouche's case it's the hugest let down of them all for me, after wrapping up his past as fast as possible after 3 years of build up (the Interlude felt rushed to me, and didn't really let the player digest what was happening before everything was erased, so much that there are still people confused about what happened there), it felt like they just tried to give him an excuse to enter the rooster ASAP just so they could shove him in Parade of Providence. And then that event ends with a "Yeah, so now Scaramouche is Nahida's maid/pet/obedient dog, and it looks like he'll stay that way for an indeterminate amount of time, say goodbye to him, you might see him next year when we need to make him into a silly joke again for some event of something, don't expect any further character development, his role now is being an extension of Nahida, also to be her stooge and minion, he'll show up if she gives him an errand to do so." It really feels like his character was diluted, and like plenty of other characters before him, I won't be surprised if when he shows up again he retains only like 1 or 2 traits of the ones he had originally, or becomes static as this Nahida's pet laughingstock he became in his latest appearance.
Let’s not forget the mess that was Signora, she arguably has one of the best backstory and lore in the entire game, and instead of fleshing it out, they decided to hide it in artifact sets and weapons that few would read, Signora had such a great potential as a character, they threw that all out of the window to A-create shock value, B-show how great and powerful Shougn is in time for her banner and C-to divert the attention from the shit show that was Inazuma Act 3, Signora is one of if not the most mistreated character by the writers team which sucks even more giving how hard her design and art team went with her.
It really is disappointing that they took her out so soon because they seriously did barely anything with her. Didn't even explain her backstory and instead, like you said, hid it in an artifact.
Going on a tangent about the 4 star women, I happen to absolutely love Layla. And there are many people who specifically have DID (dissociative identity disorder) would say that they like her too because they feel that with her, DID is portrayed pretty accurately and not made light of. Another thing I would say in where she shines in terms of her writing is how human she feels. Once you unlock her story, you see how realistic her struggles are with mental health, episodes of depression and just never being confident in her abilities - essentially just having major imposter syndrome. There are times when she feels like she’s just keeping her head above water, doubting herself and not being able to see the good that she tries to do for others despite her lack of faith in herself. Another thing I would say is that she relates to is the immigrant child being the first in their family to attend college or a prestigious university. Think of ‘Breathe’ from the musical In The Heights. Many of her voice lines and in her hangout quest outline these feelings of having a childhood where she strive to do great things, but saw just how much other people were doing the same thing. So what made her different? There are others who are more intelligent, more gifted and much more productive than her, and there were people back home expecting so much from her. She doesn’t just want to let them down, but at the same time, it would be so much easier to just give it all up. That turmoil that she faces makes her incredibly human and I believe that she’s really well written but maybe that’s just because I’m a Layla lover.
I really enjoyed Layla’s hangout and I enjoyed the endings where she got to take a break from everything, it was sweet especially where she screams at the top of the mountain.
Kokomi is one of my favourite Inazuma characters and to cope with the lack of well-written development I just headcanon that she's a murdering mermaid at night or something like that
@@miyuuka so true, there's so much potential behind kokomi and her lore. I mean, every hint points that she's a reincarnation of the dragon heirs that lived in Enkanomiya and she's also a human being which can only mean she's to be the one that unites both races after millennia of battles against one another. But make her a cute introvert waifu uwu I guess....
Omg i agree with you so much. i remember one reddit post about a kokomi hc where she turned a blind eye to her soldiers using delusions bcs that would actually give them a chance of rebelling against a GOD (and not make her seem completely incompetent lol). Making kokomi morally ambiguous/seeing her make borderline immoral decisions for the greater good of inazuma would have made her a much more interesting character imo...T_T
I think that the worst part of genshins story quest’s is their focus on the NPC’s, it almost always starts revolving around random NPC #275 overcoming some struggle, rather than being about the person the story quest is named after. This is probably because most of genshins characters have flat character arcs, they have already had all their development off screen and are instead the “mentors” who aid those who haven’t developed (I.e. the random NPC’s who we couldn’t give less of a darn about most of the time), there are exceptions to this formula (Scaramouche being one of them). This issue probably exacerbates the monotony between the types of genshin women; -my job is my whole life -I wanna have fun - the rare “other”
Literally! Why are we just helping a random npc with their problem in quest specifically created to expand upon a character? Instead, all we really get is their professional, analytical reaction and solution to said problems, and a lil sprinkle of backstory. Meanwhile, actual lore is spread around limited-time events, long character details, etc. Lore just seems like secondary for these character quests, which so odd to me 😕 Bc of this, hangouts are actually waaay more enjoyable for me since you actually interact with the character, especially ones you rarely see 😅
Some characters quests actually should be about npc. What would we know about Ayato if we wouldn't see his work for npc? We could see exactly how he act's in situation like this. Yoimiya wouldn't also make sense if the quest was about her and not about how she treats people and think of them. Sometimes to know some people, you need to see them with others, how they act.
Exactly! I don't understand this problem. If you look at HSR, they have playable characters who are considered "bad people", they have characters that see their wrong thinking and change throughout the story. As in Belobog. Almost all of the characters there have arcs that change their worldviews and the way they live. Same in Lofu, Dan has an arc that changes him Why do they struggle to do the same for genshin?
I'd argue Beidou falls outside the typical waifu mold as well. She's loud, fun, brash, a heavy drinker and a tough mama, juxtaposed by the cuter more vulnerable side she shows during her hangout event.
Beidou as a character has had a huge influence on me. I believe she is the Genshin character who has the most impact on me. I got her way before the Inazuma quest. The moment after I pulled her and listened to her hello voice line, I said “I love her”. She has been an inspiration to me. I love her demeanour and her outlook on things. It got to the point where I now want to cosplay her and make the cosplay myself. I also named my cat after her. My cat is now two years old and her name definitely suits her. Beidou (the character, not my cat) has been on my main team for a while (alongside Kazuha) and I have her at friendship level 10. Needless to say, she is an incredible character who feels like a person.
When I think of the most well-written and interesting male characters in Genshin, the first that come to mind are Venti, Zhongli, Albedo, Itto, Gorou, Childe, Cyno and Alhaitham. Mostly 5-star characters who get a lot of screentime. When I think of the most well-written and interesting female characters in Genshin, the first that come to mind are Collei, Nahida, Lisa, Beidou, Ningguang, Fischl, Barbara, Shenhe and Dehya. Mostly 4-star characters who don't get as much focus in the main story and don't have character quests, with most of their character being hidden behind hangouts (which many don't play), lore text or limited-time events which aren't coming back. Hoyo are capable of writing great characters of any gender, but the best-written female characters typically aren't the ones they choose to market, whereas the best-written male ones are the ones they do try to market. I don't think the 5-star female characters are poorly written but it definitely feels like most of them don't get explored as in-depth as they should be, and meanwhile there are many great 4-star characters that they just kind of ignore and act like they don't exist.
Mostly agree with your points but also disagree with your thoughts on hu tao. Its true that her first story quest wasn't all that great (at least not in comparison to several other ones), but you can glimpse a great deal of nuance in her character through it. Her work ethic, personality and mysteriousness also pull through. I also never seem to understand people who call hu tao "normal". She works with the dead, she interacts with them and deals with their grievances. She's not the simple happy-go-lucky character people make her out to be. Her motivation and strong philosophy brought her where she is. Kind of feels like selection bias because you brushed over various aspects of her character to make your point. Furthermore, calling her "bland" is just strange because she's one of the rare cases of a striking female personality. She has drive, she's firm on her beliefs, she's mischievous and she's secretive. The reason why she behaves the way she does was also subtly explained, its more on the playerbase for not being smart enough to pick up on it. There are several lamentable aspects of the storytelling for female characters in genshin, but this part just felt like deliberate ignorance. Still, you made good points and I continue to hope for a lot more hu tao content that expands on "her" more than simple pass-time appearances.
Agree, hu tao has one of the most striking personalities in genshin. I feel like because she is a late teen/young girl, downplaying her personality as just a "random XD quirky gworl" seems misogynistic. Even then, Hu Tao is much different than any other positive/friendly genshin female. Her enigmatic traits aren't even related to femininity or girlhood. She is someone who grew up overseeing the boundary between life and death, so her surprising nature is to offset the often solemn nature of her job. You explained it really well. I really hard disagree with the author about Hu Tao's character.
Yeah when I saw this video I immediately had a feeling it would be full of bad arguments that practiced poor media literacy, and your comment saved me the time and headache. Look, the character quests in general are seldom amazing showcases of the characters, but they still SHOWCASE who they are in several different shades. Always. To somehow contrive a sexist argument out of Genshin's generally-OK writing is just lol. Everybody could be treated better, not just a couple of the girls.
@@jackreacher7495 Not mention saying thing as objective when it comes to things like these is a bit weird. what is bland is not the same for everyone, for exsample.
Ganyu's "character" story n°5: "...During the Archon War, she once choked a giant monster to death with ease after getting lodged in its throat when it tried to eat her, said monster having fatally underestimated quite how wide her waistline was." This shit is canon, and I'm so tired of dumb shit like that. Also, she is literally thousands of years old, why her story quest involves we helping her to learn how to interact with humans??? At least Beidou's story is about her killing a giant sea-monster BEFORE she had her vision, so one female character has an honest badass moment
the ganyu story quest was about her feeling isolated, similar to Xiao- it's not her "learning how to interact with humans" it was literally about her learning to interact with Adepti if anything. she has a lot of self image issues, both physical and mental (that character story was about that, she struggled with her weight in the past and is overly critical of what she eats now) but mainly she feels like she doesn't belong anywhere. she went back to the adepti to learn how to be one better, thinking she was unfit for human society but she still preferred it to being an adeptus.
I honestly think the "defeating a monster with the power of thiccness" is hilarious and I love that the game doesn't take itself too seriously outside of the main story, but to each their own I guess
@@Kat-qf7ov Same, I actually loved that part. A lot of chinese humor has that sort of whimsical, nonsensical/silly tone, like ganyu being a fat (cute!) baby lol. It's meant to be endearing.
Ganyu's story is the first-generation immigrant who never really fit in with that society; there's just too much country bumpkin/war veteran baggage for her to ever become an integrated citizen. Contrasted against Yanfei who is a natural with city and human life.
Seeing your section on Raiden and Yae is interesting because of the insane reception towards Kafka in Honkai Star Rail who is probably worse than them: she's unambiguously a villain, has no qualms killing, and doesn't have an uwu personality, yet everyone I know is going crazy for her. It might have also to do with just how Genshin, unintentionally or not, has a predominantly younger audience that can't deal with these characters as smoothly.
There's people that legitimately believe that Yae Miko is mean and a bully when she is literally a Kitsune, a trickster fox demigod being from Japanese mythology. She teases and is playful. Also, she doesn't necessarily want to help or be a hero, and that's a good thing. She only really gets out of bed if it really benefits or amuses her in some way. Apparently, being a little self centered is akin to committing a war crime lol.
Actually Genshin’s audience are mostly adults, according to polls. The difference is “mommy” Kafka, and better writing. And also Kafka is gray morally, and I don’t believe she’s a villain. If she was she wouldn’t have bothered luring the Express team to the Xiangshou. She is following a script and we have yet to see where that leads.
@@marcusaurelius4777what if I'm unfamiliar with japanese mythology and don't want to check external sources to have a good understanding of a character in the game?
@@kindlingking I agree and this is a big pet peeve of mine with HoYoverse and the writers of Genshin. Either they hide lore in limited time events, or they tell everything in bloated dialogue that people want to skip- or when they do try to show not tell, they are sloppy at it and it comes across half ass. Granted the writing for Fontaine is much better, and I hope they continue in that more mature direction.
I feel like Jean was fine, Kequing was a bit uncreative. By Ganyu, I was like, please come up with something else... and then Kokomi sounded like she wouldn't have the same problem, and then they just threw on the same old trope just because. Like, why?
something I noticed about many of the genshin females are that their characters are mostly based off of their relation to their job for ex: ganyu as ningguangs subordinate, hu tao as the 77th director of the wangsheng funeral parlor, jean as the acting grand master, the list goes on.. this is a VERY LARGE contrast to the male characters, who actually have unique personalities that aren’t just in relation to their work for ex: alhaitham, baizhu, diluc, itto, kaveh, and so on most of the women are defined by their JOBS first and then their actual PERSONALITIES
Some characters like Baizhu, or at least his combat lines, does center around his job as a doctor alot. Or Lyney which in the 4.0 livestream is literally showing magic tricks to the enemies.
Really hope Arlecchino passes my expectations, though I’m kinda doubtful. Sumeru archon quest was definitely the best written one so far, so I really hope Fontaine steps it up even further.
theres so much about her character that i want to see explored, really think shes very interesting but the fandom is really stretching it with the aether harem Arlecchino shit, but then again the fandom will always be weird ig i hope they dont do what they did with ei and make her "waifu material" immediately after setting up a morally ambiguous front for her
@@mangshu21 I don’t have an image of middle eastern people because they can look however they want. I’m just saying that in the past lots of “greedy” stereotypes have put on the Middle East which can be seen heavily in Dori’s design. I’m glad there are designs in the game that don’t rely so heavily on these stereotypes, but a lot of people are still frustrated about it. I don’t know if you can remember what happened when Dori art first released, but a lot of people were mad about it. The problem isn’t that she is morally ambiguous, it’s the fact that she is so heavily based on these harmful and a lot of the time, racist stereotypes. It’s worth looking into. I could be wrong about some things so please let me know if so, but this is my whole take on the character. I hope that clears it up a bit.
safe to say this isnt the case anymore. nearly every fontaine character, whether male or female, is exceptionally well written (at least by genshin standards). we'll have to wait and see how their story quests pan out but the archon quest itself has already done a ton of heavy lifting building each character
i still think they're not that great. I liked furina's characterization, but she was basically an spectator in her own story and that kinda sucked. I wish she had more agency and was more actively participating in the events. Navia... she just came out of nowhere already trusting the traveler and whatnot. that felt so jarring. Her design and personality doesn't seem to match at all with her role in the story either. i don't know, navia feels kinda hollow. I don't thinking the fact she cried a few times makes her any better than other characters. (thankfully as playable characters, their gameplay aspect makes them some of the best characters in the game so far imo)
It’s also that fontaine’s story is way more character driven. It feels like other nation’s quest didn’t really give a lot of tought for the character and focus solely on the main crisis. While in fontaine i feel like it’s the opposite and the crisis is used to highlight the characters
Reason why I’m so excited for Fontaine. I’m already in love with Furinas pathetic loser eccentric average dramatic French person personality, navia is amazing and passionate, driven and strong, Lynette is sassy and sarcastic and im living for it, and I’m already beyond excited for more clorinde!!!!
I'm an east asian guy and honestly, I don't like how the workaholic women were written. They were workaholic wiafus first and actual living, breathing being second. I have Ganyu, Keqing and Jean but I only actually aimed for Ganyu, the rest were lost from 50/50 or from standard banner. And one thing I didn't do when I pulled for Ganyu was do her story quest. In fact, it took me months before I actually got around to play it and I was very disappointed that I almost regretted pulling for Ganyu. It was bad. Real bad. I feel like the directors of these things are clearly men who doesn't understand women and more showcasing their waifu qualities for an easy buck.
People say it doesn't matter who you are when commenting(like saying i'm a man/woman/white/black etc) but I just wanted to say I appreciate this comment. I'm also east asian and it feels very validating to see my people acknowledge the waifu-bait.
Jean is the only one who works to me because her character isn't sold as someone who mindlessly loves work to the detriment of their health like Liyueans; in fact, the depth of her character comes from the ways Jean is incapable of being more than human. She needs to take care of her health, her social life, temper her self-perception and expectations, and she does this all while trying to deny herself the intimacy she deeply craves, but chose to sacrifice for duty.
@@thomasraines1396 Mondstadt isn't run by anyone, being the "nation of freedom." The church is its own body in which people worship Barbatos as they please - Rosaria, if you're wondering, is someone who acts alone to protect Mondstadt from the shadows. The Knights of Favonious are as-presented on the tin: they're valiant and willing citizens of Mondstadt, essentially volunteering to protect its people. It's essentially their military, but it doesn't run anything. It just protects the nation - and quite effectively, given how much more peaceful its countryside is compared to the other nations'
I've got problems to how they get genuinely interesting stories and then fumble the bag by locking it behind temporary events. Mona's best stories were locked behind timed events and the permanent content you get is just "Oh she has a master, she sees the truth, she's broke." GAA showed how she tells people about fate and how much it affects her. Why wasn't this writing in her story quest?
I feel like you’re missing a lot from Yoimiya and Nilou, they have incredibly important roles in the actual plots of their region and that provides a lot of characterization. Additionally, Yoimiya running the main fireworks company for Inazuma isn’t a normal job especially in a place that places a lot of importance on fireworks, she’s a huge leader. And Nilou is a huge driving force of a rebellion of arts in country that’s oppressing its people in all respects (literally they have things that can read peoples thoughts) she’s a person people follow
Nilou is very underrated and is one of the more important characters that get overshadowed by more fleshed out ones. Also I hope Aether harem dies. I know it won't but it's such a disease and Nilou is overlooked partly because of that trend.
@@f4llenleaves yes exactly, like she has such an interesting story, I want to know more there’s depth there, but people sideline her since it’s harder to learn you gotta really dig
The Npcs in Nilou mission have more dialogues, characterization, screentime than her. I don’t hate her, but she’s so flat and Hoyoverse do dirty to her…
I love yanfei tbh Her backstory feels so homely and wholesome, even the nuances about her least favorite cases in her job being divorce, I like those little details. And her giving nerdy blabbermouth while still being charming and confident is just overall really refreshing to me While there is a lot of things unexplored about her, what has already been presented is kind of enough to get me hooked
You can see how much better they got with Fontaine. Furina for instance, was designed by all women. Her clothing, her story. a woman created for women. she's the best written female character in this game. I will say at least with Kokomi, she's very much intended to be autistic. she even uses the spoons analogy in her story quest. But I agree she needs fleshed out better.
I think the best girls are Fischl and Mona, Unreconciled Stars + Golden Apple Archipelago gave them so much exposition, they feel like they have their personalities fleshed out and they respond differently depending on their moods and those around them witch allows their secondary "tropes" (for lack of a better word) to become more present and it makes them feel more like shifting characters that have opinions that change based on there knowledge in a way that feels like how they should given what we already know.
that event was one of the best events... i love how they actually had entire chapters and domains for each characters to flesh them out, show their backstory and motivations really made me love xinyan, fischl, mona and kazuha more as characters and made them feel human
Kokomi's design is so beautiful and I love Enkanomiya lore! I wish they could've showed (not told us) what a genius strategist she is! I would love if she could also do some morally grey things, and if she had a dangerous side, while having very clear and detailed motivations.
There was too much unclear with her and it makes me sad cause i wanted more depth on her. I remember the theories about her being one of those dragon creatures sorta because of her cons and stuff.
i think saying "this character doesnt show up a lot" is an unfair point; becuase there are ALOT of characters that dont show up a lot; like whens the last time we saw bennet? or xingqiu? i also think that there needs to be a distinction in this universes writing and the in game writing because some of these characters are fucking amazing... just not in game
I think there is some hit and miss here. I remember Yae doing initially quite well in sales but quickly dropped off. As far as I've understood its due to her play style, an aspect that I think cannot be understated and which I sympathize with. However, I agree that the execution of the female story quests are pretty sub par compared to their lore. Kokomi was the geatest disapppintment as I love the design, her lore and playstyle and so was really looking forward to a badass general that you shouldn't underestimate on solely looks and that rivaled the Shogun almost one-to-one. Her reputation preceded her and the hype was fun... until I experienced her story. Its like she didn't deserve that reputation cause yeah... they didn't show her being cool or a genius at all. Kokomi didn't originally do well because people assumed she was just a five star barbara and dendro hadn't come out yet. I think people would have really appreciated a more badass general type. RIP.
Same, I'm fairly new to the game so people were saying I should pull for her bc she'll save my ass in battles, so I was ready to pull for Kokomi. But then I'm a lore/story enthusiast so I went and did Kokomi's quest before her 3.8 rerun, and... let's just say I purposely pull on the Wanderer's banner (I need a Faruzan anyway) so that I will not have her in my character archive. That's how much her story disappoints.
Shes my favorite character and i really do love her lore. But yeah the execution makes her kinda pitiful. And it probably amplified the people arguing how awful her char is in both gameplay and story.
The only female characters I think they did their story quests right were Deyha, Yoimiya and Ayaka. Their quest really centered around them, especially Deyha with her father. Also I feel the hangout events does a better job showing their lives. Faruzan's hangout is by far my favorite. I think if Hoyo had showed how the characters go about their lives when the Traveler is not involved, I think that would have made it more interesting.
Dehya yes. Yoimiya and Ayaka ones of the most terrible quests. Ayaka's quest is personal but way too much fanservice than exploring her character. Yoimiya's quests aren't about her but more about people she helps.
@@amberxv4777yoimiya’s quest is one of my favorites though, true she helps others but the way she helps and the journey towards the conclusion is where she shines. I guess people just have a weird perspective that yoimiya is just idk an empty character.
Don't forget Ei's second story quest. Also, I'm one of those who think that her first story quest, while having some problems, is still good overall. The traveler is basically taking a hikikimori who resist change for a trip to the outside world, he needs to show Ei that changes are not always bad.
Honestly Hu Tao is one of my favorite characters, mostly because she brings up the theme of death in an accepting and beautiful way focused on sending them away gracefully and celebrating their life
About Ayaka: it pisses me off so much that people can't pass the impression of her being a "waifu" . I coudn't understand how could they pass her very heartfelt story quest as just being a date, she collects texts from her dead mom that help her realize she can both represent the Kamisato clan and have dreams, hobbies and be her own person!!! She dances for us because we're the only ones who aren't from Inazuma, therefore it doesn't matter if she's the Shirasagi Himegimi or not, she trusts us enough to show a side of herself no one else is really able to see. And yes she has a crush on the Traveler, but the fact that she refuses to be escorted back to the mansion is already telling that she doesn't need us and knows it's pretty unlikely to be able to have a relationship with someone who's travelling the whole world.
Ayaka AND Xiao are interestingly the character that already in beta but not released at the start AND ALSO THE MOST SIMP for traveler. But why Xiao fleshed out so much more yet Ayaka written so... uh.... fanservice-y? I think this is because the difference of waifu and husbando marketing. Xiao also gave a lot of fanservice but in a different way than Ayaka. I heard some say female likes a character more from their backstory and lore, that's why a lot of husbando are much lore relevant, while male demographic can be easily swayed with BOOBS, MOE, etc etc. Female prefer a slower approach, that's why Xiao is written distant at first, then slowly opened up to traveler because of "I can fix him" mentality that female demographic like to have. While male demographic likes harem, the waifu simps them for no reason, like Ayaka who's already interested in traveler from the start. Maybe because I'm female, Xiao's fanservice is much more nice because it's subtle and build up slowly, Ayaka's fanservice feels too forced
ikr, even female players can be easily swayed by cute or pretty female characters, bc of the "slay queen" and "look at her she's my daughter UWU" mentality (not saying yall wrong, it's perfectly cool). Xiao's fanservice is so nice that I don't even consider it fanservice, it's just who he is and how his and the traveller's relationship should be. I mean, the traveller has the ability to lighten the effects of Xiao's karmic debt so it's logical for Xiao to want to be around lol. Meanwhile Ayaka... she's cute and elegant so it's ok for me, but girl, we just met, we JUST met.
@@floofrules Agree, females can love female characters too, but some female characters are really marketed for male audiences only, and that's what I see from many female characters before Sumeru. Personally, I think Sumeru has the best cast so far. I'm a bit worried about Fontaine because the teaser gives Inazuma vibes, I hope I'm wrong
I think you have good point. I think it's about the difference in how they create character to try and appeal to each markets. It's probably why there's lots of fanfiction with relatively more depths catered to women compared to men. It's also probably why there's lots of adult material & art, all with shallow depth while focusing more on appearance, catered to men but none for women. Also, I don't think you need to worry about Fontaine despite the trailer. It may be similar arc but I believe they've learned a lot since game's released. I see quite a few development direction that seem to be a result of taking in feedback, like how main quests are longer to flesh it out more after Inazuma one was rushed,
Dehya’s story interested me quite a bit. There were some big flaws in the writing but I felt like most of those don’t come from her gender despite being a female mercenary being rather important to the subtext. But my favorite female characters scene - yes just a scene - for me will always be Collei talking with Sucrose. But just saying… Itto is best girl, prolly always will be.
The problem is not that these characters lack depth or complexity. It’s that said depth and complexity is tucked somewhere in a text most player never even read.
I’m glad someone is talking about this my own favorite female character is Sucrose due to many elements but when talking about other girls I like and their lore role I find many to be repetitive like Kokomi being my favorite Inazuma character but she barely did anything and is ultimately workaholic which is fine for her duty but not properly explored, then you have Ei who I liked only as playable character but never understood her story endgame due to travel forgiving her for all the crap she pulled on her own people which made her very unattractive antagonist.
i think with the male and female characters, hoyo is taking 2 different approaches. male characters are actually characters. hoyo wants male players to want to be them/roll for them because of baddassery. to do that, they have to actually write them good. for the female characters, they are fanservicey because they are male otome characters that are supposed to be coddled so their story quest is supposed to feel like a date and have a lot of traveller simpilng moments??? it's weird now the non-simpy female characters are more fleshed out, because hoyo knows not everyone wants them out of waifu reasons so they can't skimp on the character building. ie. you can't make nahida simp after traveller in a story quest and call it a day, like ew. so they had to actually write a story quest for her.
funny thing is that it makes it technically so bi since nothing changes when you choose lumine so my lil sapphic self is always happy for it but there IS such a bias. Lisa could def be the prime example of this
This could be it, and also female players tend to care A LOT about personality and all for male characters, and are generally more ok with female characters just be cute/pretty/badass/sexy in appearance. Which... I find kinda strange? It's just based on MY observation tho, so I could be misled to think this way.
@@floofrules it's because female players don't feel threatened by the existence of cute/sexy/flirty/fanservice female characters. At most they roll their eyes and move on, so devs know they won't get backslash by making fanservicey, semi-naked women flirt with the MC, because even women who don't care for it will simply just skip/not pay much attention and move on, knowing not everything has to appeal to them. However, certain male players start yelling and crying if a male character is even remotely flirty because they feel like their masculinity is being questioned if a guy flirts with their male MC lmao. Remember what happened when Thomas's hangout came out and a lot of CN male players got mad as HELL that he holds Aether's hand and teaches him to knit or whatever because it was too gay. Smh.
@@monemoriAh yes what a classic, fragile masculinity (aka insecure) and homophobia. Still, I love how they got angry for that yet they were not the target audience in the first place, man is Nice Guy™️ to fanservice the girls.
I remember cringing so hard with the whole wet socks thing... I'm still not crazy over Ayaka but I thought about it for a while and I think her crush on the mc being a main part of her character is totally valid. It's a crush that makes sense if you look at it through the lense of her character. It would get old and unrealistic if every playable character has a crush on the mc BUT it would be equally unrealistic if no one did. I mean most people out there have at least 1 Simp in their lives.
Glad to see someone talking about Ayaka's 'crush'!! I also think it wasn't all that out-of-character! Ayaka is unused to being this close with people outside her household (Ayato, Thoma etc) so it makes sense that she'd be extra dazzled by the normal friendship-concern that MC extends to nearly every playable character. I don't have a problem with that, but the main issue should be the fanservice *becoming* her character, not the fanservice itself... I mean, it's inevitable after all. As long as she has a personality outside of that, there isn't a big problem.
My personal hot take overall is tragic character backstory cannot be your only saving characterization; something reliant for majority of the men and women in the game. I studied writing and with a lot of media people end up trying to only write tragic pasts to make the characters interesting or seem more nuisance, often without the goals of exploring the topics further either with instantly resolving/absolving negative character traits or by using the past to make them seem cuter. Now, my point does lend itself to both male and female characters but I find the issues does feel much more intense with the female characters with some really great examples with Raiden, Furina, Scara, and Dori. To put in perspective it's one thing I like when trauma based characters and tragic pasts don't always make you better people; sad pasts can make people jadded, mean, rough, and hurt others. Raiden was such a great example of this-- someone who was hurt and it caused her to lock herself away and punish those around her even if she did so thinking it had good. Raiden was horrible and there is little to excuse what she put Inazuma though both from the land and the people, even if we understand why she did it. Really I find Raiden to be a great example of when this problem with characters became so apparent to me because so much of the resolution to Raiden's arc felt rushed and her abolement of her crimes lends no use to the future of the game which honestly really fucking sucks writing wise. It limited her character and to me rather than ever giving her a proper redemption for me to accept her from the Archon quest it became this stain to what could have been an arc of growth, healing, and showing how to be better from the damaged she caused. Even while I get aspects like she can't cook are meant to be a point of seeing how she locked herself away it feels like a chance for fandom to woobify her actions and lead to the easy forgetfulness of what was the tragedy of the Inazuma quest. I get the other ones have dark or sad elements, but Inazuma's lore in game is brutal and to have it feel forgotten by the quick saving of Raiden for her sales to do well feels cheap. It's not good. This issue is only constantly carried out in the rest of her writing. So when Scara 'redemption' came around I feel the same way. Wanderer's history being wiped and no one recalling is just as cheap. It's honestly something I find just lazy as it means so little of Wandered has to genuinely make amends and confront his past to grow from it-- the plot is missing honestly some of the most interesting arcs they could have done if they found a better way to show Scara's growth. Renaming the Wanderer could have been a genuine step forward of showing tragic pasts are apart of you; Scara does not just get to move on from who he was and where he came from but it only worked if others know that growth too. Where Wanderer differs though is he isn't a better person now-- he's brash, rude, and overall a negative person which makes him interesting. Whether you like Wanderer or not, there isn't some massive shift between who he was and is, despite how we got there and my distaste Wanderer still feels unique to the crowd. The edginess isn't like Xiao giving players a new feeling of a fresh air that despite Hoyo's team taking arguably a weak way into 'redemption' unlike Raiden we didn't fully lose the character people wanted. This leads me to my personal dislike of how they ended Fontaine, as I agree the writing and pacing has gotten better but not the handling of possible routes and topics. Furina much like Raiden was very split until the end having a bratty and honestly somewhat haughty in the godlike status; something that made her fun and unique. Our first active in society god and potentially highlighting what that type of status does to a person to be openly worshipped like a celebrity. The justice and prison system paired with weird laws and this tension of not only the rising water but rocky relationship between traveler and her truly felt engaging even if I felt she had unlikable aspects. The concepts of morality, justice, and being human in Fontaine were so strongly laid out and I think was super engaging but pulled out too much by dumping Furina into just a tragic backstory and overtly 'sweet/not a bad person' much like Raiden. All of her bad traits were instantly absolved by calling it her playing a character and whatever damage/lack of accountability she had for people/justice system felt pointless now to make her honestly feel no different than any other fem character as tragedy is all that overshadows anything else about her to make her fun. I even personally have my own take on how the story could have ended in a similar way while keeping a bratty, celebrity-godlike childish attitude that Furina has to grow from while redeeming her with the Fontaine citizens after the last quest and still bring up the morality of Fontaine's system/culture; hell it even could have included her breaks in characters and playing a role while still making her someone who has/responsible for bad things. Actively it sucks to me what I found made Furina an interesting character felt so lost because Genshin needs to make the fem characters likable and perfect enough to sell. See-- Genshin knows most of the men will sell because players want male characters; the lack of many means a big piece of the fanbase are desperate for any of them making it so they can play around with traits and emotions much more. And to me male characters are likely to gain a solid fanbase regardless of morality or being good/bad without needing to be saved because Scara was hugely popular before his redemption arc, i'd argue in my social circles even more so. But the split vote on fem characters means a chance of huge profit loss and keeping them all delegated into boxes saves any risk of losing out which in reality only damages characters. It's why I do think Dori is the perfect example. I don't like Dori and that's a good thing; she does actively shitty things while being playable and even with her tragic past she isn't played as if that makes her better. Much like the appeal I said it makes her worse and in the sea of characters that puts her in a memorable spot, and something fun for the writing. But her dislike and how people play/talk about her prove to me fem characters esp 5* won't get the same reception or treatment like male characters being acceptable in any form. Overall genshin writing team has a problem and a crutch in character arcs that I find just kinda is boring but it really sucks on how it's to me impacting how fem characters have to be presented.
Well said. The inequality between male character and female character writing (and visual design) is glaring, particularly in the 5-star money makers. I love Wanderer even though he's a shit because he started out a shit and he stayed a shit. Yae Miko starts out as a shit and stays a shit and she's quite an entertaining character. She's one of my husband's favorite characters in part because she's such a snot and doesn't automatically love the Traveler. That's also why Rosaria (personality-wise, not appearance-wise) feels refreshing because locking eyes with the main character wasn't love at first sight... and she's still *cold* towards us, pun fully intended.
@@qi2li2n_prance well and some other things that we can see with Yae is she has sad elements to her story but it’s not the defining feature. When I think of Yae, the few sad elements to her backstory are not what I inherently think of which makes her feel as if her past isn’t the only factor of her arcs that make her substantial. In fact Yae’s past is probably the last thing I think of with her character and the reality is for many of the characters it’s only because of knowing their past people care for them- because the little substance they have boils down to sad past = interesting character which isn’t true. Yae is fully realized as a character with someone how came from somewhere but isn’t locked into that history to tell us who she is, rather we see her actions upfront to give us the information we need even if that isn’t always good or kind or ‘right.’
Thank you for putting in words what I felt about Ei's and Wanderer's boring, lazy fixes to their respective story arcs. Instead of what could have been really cool and interesting true redemption arcs that could have given us probably years of content with developments, fallbacks, and maybe even reconciliation of both of them at the end of their journey. And I don't get it! They built that dual story of hurting others because they were hurt from so long back in Genshin's actual world story building. Scaramouche was the antagonist of the first major event ever, and they had multiple years to built up to that really nice climax in Sumeru. And then they did this. Really glad they kept his personality, though. I think I would have barfed at a nice and kind Wanderer.
How do you feel about The Knave? She’s going to be playable eventually and (unless they change her) she’s absolutely reprehensible as a person and is noted by several characters not to be trustworthy. Her entire schtick seems to be that of the Wolf in Sheep’s clothing.
@@UnhappytimeaperMiko is one of my favorite characters because she unapologetically screws with people, even her character quest has her ripping the traveler off as she uses their cut of the book they wrote to pay for a very expensive meal.
Yeah, hoyo's way of storytelling and delivery really is my biggest pet-peeve as someone who plays for the story and characters, a lot of it is hidden behind the wall of texts you mentioned, be it in the character's profile, or even worse, cryptically scattered around in artifact lore. I wouldn't have an issue about written stories/artifact description stuff if it wasn't hiding like, _essencial_ information about the character. I found out only recently that Yelan is technically a disabled character?? She specifies in one of her profile spoken lines that she has a genetic condition that runs in her family that gives her a lot of fatigue all the time; she says she has to manage her energy for a mission, so she won't exhaust herself. Like HOW is that not mentioned anyhwere else lol. I finally understood her idle line where she goes "This blinding sunlight is such a pain, I can't take a nap on this weather", it always felt a bit out of place (Yelan is not the "sleepy" type of character like Ganyu or Layla), but knowing she has some kind of chronic fatigue really gives another vibe to that. Not to mention, it is pretty cool to have a badass like Yelan to be a canonically disabled character! And like, this is only one example I can think of (I could go on a full rant about Raiden, who is my fave, and the amounts of disservice this type of "storytelling" does to her)
That small bit of context explains way too much about Yelan. I love her but I could never really get with her constant complaining about the weather. That knowledge transformed idle complaints into restless frustration Her frustration is chronic We had a whole ass story quest and an archon quest where she's front and center. The latter even had everyone feeling unique time dilation effects. They had the perfect opportunity to build her character. Actually have us build a connection and they just ... didn't. They just didn't
I feel they could rectify that if they had the character stories be something you could ask the characters about in the tea pot instead of having to awkwardly pause the game to read a wall of text.
@@Shogun_A.I. I know right?? I literally learned that info when I was all and about on Twitter and I saw someone discussing about that, and how they identified a lot with Yelan's chronic condition, they printed the actual line from the profile page. SO much made a lot of sense. Yelan also mentions she's actually pretty chill, lives outside the city and has a peaceful personal daily life when she isnt working, which is SUCH a contrast to her spy / femme fatale persona. I quite like how she can be both at the same time! But of course, we only see the "sexy dom" side of her bc of reasons we all know very well. Like the other person mentioned in the replies, we could have that kind of information with the character in the teapot, since the lines are already all recorded anyway with the VAs acting. Another idea - having these playable characters chilling in the map, maybe only during specific times of the day, in places they are supposed to be at (ex: Hu Tao in front of the funeral parlor, Yae Miko at the Narukami shrine, etc), or in places mentioned in birthday letters, when they tell us to "meet there later". A lot of potential great ideals to expand our bonds with all these characters! Even more when Hoyo definitely has favorites (Itto showing up for like the 3rd time in a row now), while so many other characters are banished to the shadow realm (like Raiden Shogun??? hello??? lol)
About Ayaka, Nilou and Kokomi having a crush on traveler is just an interpretation, in Nilou I personally never saw that, in Kokomi is a maybe and Ayaka is more obvious but stil interpretational, like people and their ships, and yandere Ayaka was the result of that infamous Ayaka eternal banner in 2.6, is a meme that's so good to ignore it. Also, people don't like workaholic waifus? Then why Noelle is the only character with 2 date sim quest? Also that is a real example of a character having a crush on traveler, and don't feel out of place because Noelle is not a character with high power (politically), is just a young girl who want to be a knight of favonious and found somebody kind enough to make her have a good time.
I kind of feel like they write male characters better because they still think guys won't naturally sell for some reason whilenthe girls, they almost exclusively go tropes and fan service because that's the expectation in games like this.
@@Parrotcat It isn't exclusive to female characters; Razor, Chongyun, Itto, Xingqui, Bennett, and Kazuha are examples of male characters who do not have a lot of character depth.
@@muai Id actually disagree on all of those, they all have unique and complex backstories. The only reason they may feel like they lack depth is bc they don't show up in the story too often/or haven't shown up in the story in a long while. Compare them to female characters with similar rarity and story relevance. That being said I saw your other comment and thought it was an astronomically bad take, that I cannot see myself agreeing to or being convinced of, therefore i do not wish to discuss this further with you.
I came from Fontaine and I believe we can all agree that Navia's the best written female character so far right?? Maybe Nahida or Shenhe reach her level
@@justanobunagafanboy799All other Fontaine characters aren't bad tho?? We just don't know as much about them yet since the act 1 archon quest focused on lyney's trial, while the 2nd one focused on Navia's story. Neuvillette is hinted to being an even more interesting character and its probably gonna be more highlighted later on. Furina as well.., and Lyney and Lynette are also great characters too. Clorinde is the only one that so far seems a bit generic.
I'd rate Nahida higher, but yeah, Navia is great. Shenhe's quest was rushed so much there was scarcely anything left of it, aside from a nice animation, so no contest there. It's an arc with only the start, the ending and some backstory recited to you.
@@justanobunagafanboy799Nope. You're alone there. Neuvilette, Lyney/Lynette, and even Furina have had great expositions, and really that's everything you can ask from the game this early on. You can't expect them to be fully fleshed out not having the full archon and their story quests.
There's a few things I'd like to say about this vid. 1. I'd personally say that what you mentioned is actually the exception and not the norm. The workaholic 'waifus' for example. I'd say that Jean, Keqing and Ganyu have great to fairly good character quest, that explore their character enough. Kokomi is the exception here, having a terrible story quest. I think Ganyu's story quest was good, because it discussed her troubles about being in the human world, and concludes with her wanting to stay in the city, despite her initial inner conflict. Other characters that I do agree have a bad story quest are Raiden and Nilou, although I think that Nilou as a character is a well written woman, it is indeed not shown in her story quest. Which is really unfortunate. 2. You mentioned how people didn't like Miko because she was mean, but I've researched this a bit and this just seems to be a very small, vocal minority. By far most people like her. (Although sometimes for the wrong reasons) Same thing goes for Ayaka. Most people actually do appreciate Ayaka for who she actually is. The yandere Ayaka is a terrible mischaracterisation indeed, but luckily this is something that's only coming from a horny and vocal minority. 3. A lot of things you said can also be said about male characters. Especially from the early game. Take Diluc and Kaeya for example. They both have extremely interesting characters and backstories, but this barely comes back in the game. Because of this both of them get terribly mischaracterised by the fandom, unless they've read the manga AND their lore. I think overall the problem stems from bad story quest writing in general, not bad character writing. Luckily this has been improving slightly, both for female and male characters. I think Aster made a great point using Ganyu as a example in her video about female character writing
The reason I dislike Yae is not because she's mean to traveler lol If this was the only reason, I would love her, cause I like her vibe overall The reason I personally dislike her is because she tends to bully people who are weaker/have less power then her + also provides terrible conditions for her workers
Ngl I would love to see more morally ambiguous female characters in genshin. I adore them and I also adore the badass queens in games, like holy shit I’m asexual but I’d be up to smash- 🥰 I also love and hate waifus depending on how their written since I write stories for fun. Some characters just aren’t written in a way that makes them good at being a waifu or such. Not every character is a cutesy UwU / help I’m overworked 🥺 / adorably bubbly and I’d love to see more unique female characters in genshin that aren’t perfect generic waifu material.
@@Javu7254 im ngl, dori is the ONLY character with the "female child" model that i can actually see as an adult and not, like, a child (in personality). she gives off weird wine aunt vibes
Overall I would say this a great video despite the dishonest title. That is not a criticism as I get how youtube works you have to be provoke people with your titles to get attention its sad as I think some will dismiss good points made in this video as they will dismiss it right away. With the points I agree with such as Ganyu and Kokomi its so hard to add anything further I think you did a fantastic summary here and I have nothing more to add. Negatives Sorry I will be writing more negative commentary but don't take that as me disliking the video but some criticism to help in the future. 1st: I think a lot of what has shaped your thoughts rather than the game's presentation of the character is the parts of the Genshin community you spend time in. I can tell you that my Genshin community loves Yae Miko and its a mix of men and women and not all men are into women that simp for the traveller after meeting them right away. Also in my community Scara is the most hated character not any female character because all of your critcisms aimed towards females in this video are amplified up to eleven in Scara. I try not to let my community influence how I see characters its not easy though so I don't blame you for it. 2nd: Unfortunately a lot of your criticism towards the female characters in this video which I agree with also applies to male characters as well. Also we have reached an age of entertainment where characters can only have so many variable archetypes before they become similar or tropes. I am old enough at my age where it is almost impossible to find a truly original character. Nearly every male character is a trope as well and despite the community's love for Zhong Li he too is also a trope. Some of his writing isn't well done either simply because we have met character too early into the story that knows too much so for the sake of the plot has to stay silent on some very crucial information. Also Zhong Li is very morally questionable as he had the power to stop the escalation with Childe and ultimately his inaction got many human Li Yue soldiers killed. I love Zhong Li he is one of my favorite characters but just pointing out he is not without his own flaws. 3rd: A very minor criticism but I guess this is because you didn't want the video to run too long but you never really got around to discussing Yomiya in depth and I feel you overlooked some serious flaws in characters like Yae and Kokomi. Such as when you do the world quests you realize that Kokomi is a truly terrible strategist that couldn't even stop her own side from being tricked into creating the thunder storm that ruined possibly hundreds to thousands of people's lives just so they could win the war. I think its clear none of the Hoyoverse writers know military strategy well and they should hire someone to fix that. As Kokomi really does need to be shown to be a great strategist not everyone telling us she is and no winning a card game doesn't count Hoyo lol. Also Yae neglecting her most important duty of keeping the Sakura tree purified it got so bad the tree nearly exploded. 4th: The biggest criticism which you yourself address in this video. Not all female characters are bad or in a terrible state its just some of them are a massive problem and you did a fantastic job summing this up. Sorry about the wall of text I will do a TLDR here if you don't have the time. I think the video is great overall and can't thank you enough for bringing attention to these issues. I do think your hyper focus on only females being bad is a result of most likely being a mostly female Genshin community I used to be as well and your perspective on things can really change when you get hear both male and female opinions. I would suggest exploring outside of your community to get a different perspective as can be very toxic in certain parts and they will influence how you feel as well. Male characters certainly have similar problems too. Would love to see a more in depth dive to certain characters if you have the time. Finally not all female characters have this problem so I think the title of the video is unfair but I understand why you did it because you need people to click on your video. Loved the video so thank you so much.
the part about the community you are apart of influencing your opinion on characters is certainly true. did you know wanderer is probably the most hated character in china and it isn't even close? i would love to see a follow up video like this with some male characters(although i don't think males reuse tropes as much as females do)
About the whole morally ambiguous part... i feel the need to note that people love them. Diluc kills people for the sake of Mondstadt , Kaeya constantly puts his allies lives in danger and has some really questionable loyalties.. Ningguang is a billionaire beurocrat that believes that zero sum games are the best. Ei and Sara were upholding a dictatorship and harming people so not exactly morally ambiguous.. And Child almost killed thousands if not millions of people because it was "his job?" , like for who is this ambiguous Cthulhu the Great Old One? People have reservations about playing with characters that have commited evil with Scara being the only exception since he is literarly non-human thus can be expected to be more grey.. and people love it. As for the female characters, we do get strong gals but it is true that they somewhat undermine their strength to make them cute like Beidou in her hangout quest... Like why would a 25+ year old pirate lady blush about being flirty.. The girls in genshin have A LOT of potential to be great my personal favorites : Jean,Lisa,Eula,Yelan,Beidou,Candace,Dehya all of them strong and confident with just hints of weakness to humanise them.
This. I would never like Childe for everything he does. Imagine saying that about a real life war criminal, " he was just doing his job" Other argument with Childe is that he loves his family. Okay so? That's not something would redeem anyone, more actually from his behavior in the story quest he's just enabling his brother to be a brat.
I think the reason for the hate with some of the morally ambiguous characters is not the characters themselves but how the traveller interacts with them.
Most of the reason why Ei was hated is because of the rush writing in Inazumas Archon Quest . Also what the fuck ?! "Ei is getting hated on by the community " Are you sure what you are talking about ! Ei is one of the most liked characters in thus game and has broken many banners records .
"People have reservations about playing with characters that have commited evil with Scara being the only exception since he is literarly non-human thus can be expected to be more grey.. and people love it." I feel like this is wrong. There's 2 reasons in my opinion why Scaramouche seems to be received better. 1) We are not gaslit in the game. We literally watched Childe try to drown a nation, we witness the war that Raiden was upholding to maintain her "right" to slaughter a minority... And then we get to the character story quest and we are basically told it wasn't so bad. It's brushed off, not addressed, and minimized, or blamed on someone else ("he was doing it for the fatui" "she was lied to" "she was sad her sister died!" etc) Scaramouche's interlude doesn't do this, in fact, it does the opposite. We are reminded VERY CLEARLY by Wanderer that what he did WAS evil, Nahida even SAYS literally "you were evil." 2) He wants/takes accountability. When he finds out that Dottore killed his family to get to him, he decides immediately that he wants to erase himself to save them. Of course, we know irminsul doesn't work like that, but he doesn't. He expected that the past would be changed, his found family would be saved from Dottore... But they weren't. He made the choice to get his evil memories back, and upon remembering what he did, he tells us to tell Kazuha that he was the one who ruined the Kaedehara clan. He even accepts that Kazuha may try to kill him. He ACCEPTS and EXPECTS consequences.... Unlike Childe and Raiden, who give nothing but excuses. it's not simply "Scaramouche is non-human, so evil is okay" Scaramouche was evil and took steps (albeit misguided steps) to rectify that.
Genshin is the definition of missed opportunity when it comes to stuff like this. Worst part is, Hoyo KNOWS how to write amazing, morally ambiguous, complex characters if you look at almost anyone in HI3, but they choose NOT to. And the reasons why they do that are apparent, which makes it even sadder.
Personally I love Yae Miko and her genius mean girl personality. Every time she shows up in an event and starts messing with other people it's very entertaining. I also think 'letting go' of Childe being war criminal scum just because he's a husbando character or whatever is hardcore simping, even if he 'was just doing his job.' If your job makes you perform heinous acts and you just kind of go along with it then you're obviously a heinous person. And it's fine to have villainous characters be playable but FFS just accept that they are bad people and stop trying to justify what they do just because you like them. Alhaitham is also a dick.
Tell me you haven't read his story without telling me you haven't read his story. Childe is not a ""war criminal scum"", he quite literally cannot quit this line of work and was traumatized beyond recognition when he fell into the abyss. This doesn't justify his actions in any way, shape or form, but the problem the person in the video points out is that the fandom is way too quick in demonizing characters while ignoring context. God forbid we have morally ambiguous people in this game.
@@rivergoeson5607 Committing war crimes makes you a war criminal. His actions are unjustifiable and he isn't 'morally gray' as he will quite literally kill innocent people to get what he wants. There is nothing wrong with having evil characters in the game but simping for him doesn't change that he is in fact a self-centered scumbag.
Fully agree with the person who replied before me. Plus what he tried to do didn't succeed anyways, ppl like you act like he actually sunked Liyue when he only tried to. Add to that, it was also part of Signora and Zhongli's plan lmao. Plus, he single handedly hard carried Fontaine, if it wasn't for him Fontaine was done for, since even pre power up Neuvillette couldn't do shit against that whale. Doesn't matter if he actually was trying to save Fontaine or not, what matters is it is true that he played an very important role in terms of saving Fontaine. Pretty sure that is more then enough to replenish his "mass murder attempt" or whatever you call it. And Alhaitham being a dick? Since when? Dude pulled out his massive braincells and played an fairly important role for saving Nahida and Sumeru. He is a part of the gang who saved a whole region, how is he a dick??? Heck he even saved 30+ppl in his story quest from "the Hive". If Alhaitham wasn't Alhaitham, those people were all done for. Dude saved so many people, it's obvious he is someone who will take action just to save and help other people. And you think he doesn't care about others and is a dick? HECK he is even letting Kaveh living in his own house, where does that goes, eh? He look like a dick in your eyes only because you're dumb and he's too big brain for you lmao. He does act like someone who don't give a fuck and is a self centered jerk, but in reality in the most important time he is the very few who will actually save the day. The well written characters will always be controversal, and is for the ones who have actual logical thinking. Take it or leave it.
I see Keqing as more than a workaholic waifu. Reading her lore and knowing she questions a lot about gods and religion and talks about adapting and moving on to a modern era speaks to me personally. I find it interesting and it makes me love the little things about her more like buying rex lapis figurines lol. (I am bias because i have the keqing keyboard and she is my first 5 star) Ganyu clearly feels like she's lonely despite having ties to both humans and adepti in her blood though I do wish we get more story quests for her in general because I feel like the memes surrounding her detract the fandom of who she really is. Kokomi was just wasted potential so i have nothing to add other than she's cute and her kit is underrated. I quite like Ayaka and Yoimiya's story quest because to me I get to know their character. Lots of people cried during Ayaka's story quest and Yoimiya's second quest was beautiful ( I liked her before the second quest). As for Miko, I personally haven't heard of anyone not liking her personality (maybe because I don't go on genshin social media often, lucky me) I find her mischievous side hot and she can degrade me anytime and I still will come back 👀 (fr tho I find miko really funny overall) I like this video overall and appreciate hearing different opinions even tho I personally didn't agree with some of the points
I think a problem is that the characters, nearly all of them are more. Keqing is more, Ganyu is more, Kokomi [kinda] is more, Yomiya, Nilou, Ayaka, Miko, etc. They all have more to them but the game does not allow it. They in fact rarely show it rather instead opt to tell us and play into troupes of them that will gain the most validation from fandom and troupes. Because even from Ganyu's soft spoken-ness to Miko playful teasing there is more to why and how they are written that feels denied by how Genshin chooses to present the information in the overall story in favor of sidelining them for better favored moments that would gain attention. The derailing of characters, yes, mainly comes from the fandom but Hoyo's writing does nothing to favor this or the characters that makes them feel meaningful to me in a lot of their scenes. Many characters have this problem too, such as Ayato it just feels like there is a specific reason as to why Hoyo does this heavy handedly to the women more than some of the male characters.
@@Unhappytimeaper besides Kokomi I don’t see it that way. I feel like there is everything we need to know about everyone but im not opposed to get more of them. Raiden, ayaka, yomiya and so on already gave me what i needed for the overall lore
Your talking about a game where the lead character says 3-4 words a year. I think the 'writing' in general needs work before you worry about individual characters xD.
Some Genshin ladies also have a bad case of being Mary Sue-ish, which is sad given that I feel like they all have potential to be just as compelling as, say, Kaeya, who has an interesting personality that’s caused by a complex backstory. Seems like the Genshin male charas in general have more thought get put into showcasing interesting character personalities :/
Of the first few, I like Jean the most. She's both likeable an relatable. She got a position way too early without any guidance. Kokomi would have a lot to offer from a narrative point of view, but she's badly written. It's just played for the jokes that she's got no clue and that she needs to recharge, but if you really think about it, it would be a nightmare for most: you have no clue, but everyone expects you to be the genius that saves them and you need to act accordingly, as moral is almost everything... Plus, what they really forgot about is the burden of her decisions. Most of us would really struggle to select who to fire, but she has to make decisions that keep getting people killed, be it in her favour or against her favour... My favourite characters are Hu Tao and Yae Miko. Both are probably bad waifus IRL as they're hard to read, morally ambiguous and manipulative... Hu Tao is an interesting case in that she cares about other people, but displays a level of Machiavellianism and an inability to emotionally connect to other people. The latter has two interpretations depending on the scenes involved, she may appear either somewhat on the ASSD or the ASPD. One moment she's socially awkward and in the next it appears more that she straight-up lacks empathy... This ambiguity about them makes them so interesting to watch and interact with. In the case of Yae, it's also that she can be scary at times. Still, the game The Witcher 3 did a much better job with morally ambiguous characters and also characters that are downright scary...
You know this game has a problem when Jeht (A recolored NPC) has more character to her... well... character than the great majority of playable characters
i appreciate Miko as a character so much she´s one of my favourite characters and my main. I like that she feels like her own person and and isn´t just for shits n giggles. She feels more "real" to reality especially with the "does only things she can benefit from" like that´s the most real shit. It´s almost scary how unnaturally "nice" some of the characters are. I also really like Xingyan as a character ...it is such a bummer everything is locked behind a limited-time events UUUUH I´m also REALLY looking forward to Alice. I hope they don´t screw her up bc if you look into her lore she is the biggest fucking troll of Teyvat and just overall a fun but also mysterious character
Maybe it’s just me, but I feel like characterization and writing is more of mixed a big. Especially in hangouts. Faruzan, Beidou, Layla, and even Noelle feel more engaging and dynamic than characters like Heizou, Ayato, Diluc, and Al Haitham. Yoimiya’s first and second quest rebuttals the theme of eternity into something that’s actually positive while showing off her personality. As for Ayaka, I always felt like really devalue her character and quest. Her fondness of the traveler is directly linked to the fact we live a life she always dreamed of and by the end she makes peace with how it will never truly be hers and that’s okay because she and the traveler live their lives resolved to help what’s important to them and would never choose differently. Personally I think it’s sweet because through the traveler, Ayaka has an avenue to somewhat be apart of that dream and gain a connection far removed from her daily life. Any young adult would cherish a connection like that.
Genuinely interested to hear you talk about Yelan's story quest because all i remember from playing it was veing bored and dissatisfied that i didnt learn much about her. As i played it i rmr feeling like it was another, lets help her do her job storyline.
Right? For me personally it was a kinda boring quest about some random npc. I agree that Yelan is a pretty interesting character with some nice lore (e.g. her story with Pantalone), but her story quest wasn’t that good for me.
I do agree, but hear me out. Nearly all genshin characters have very shallow and bad writing, they are mostly just gimmicks one thing and that's it. I get why but still kinda sad, also i've been playing since 1.0 so don't come here and tell me the whole they get story and better writing from the events. Which is somehwat true.
I think that people want a morally ambiguous female character to be more like Revi from Black Lagoon (rude, aggressive, arrogant, cocky with a flimsy moral code) rather than someone who just feels like an inconvenience in an every day life (Dori and Yae being good examples)
Wow. So apparently, this girls either don't exist or don't matter, or you just look at what you want to see: - Fischl is an insecure self aware chuuni, very tough on herself, we've seen her cry. - Keqing has no friends, she had to befriend an adepti (Ganyu) for heck's sake, literally the people she is sworn against kind of. - Shenhe is very possibly a murderous psycho that can barely contain herself. - Yelan is covert ops, she probably has killed or seen die many, in fact that's probably the reason she is that in the first place. - The hole Raiden arc. - Hu Tao is a mischeavous weirdo that noone wants to be around except for the literal oldest archon. The more you know of her the more you realize her sadness. - Ayaka is an isolated princess with practically no life outside her family responsabilities. - Yae is basically alone. No other youkai that we know of. Her only friend is a self-locked leader of a country. - Sara lives for her job and loyalty, she's a soldier. - Lumine is literally fighting for a doomed race and home, that being Khaenriah. (although this applies to any of the twins). - Faruzan lost her entire family, friends and life to time. - Collei was taken and experimented on by Dottore as a child, she is still afraid of herself and others. - Any of the Fatui women, now we also have Arlecchino. - Rosaria's entire story and personality. - Dori is a black market merchant. - Chevreuse's dad almost made her dead. She was a from a neighbourhood full of criminals and is now a high ranking police officer. Those are the ones that come to mind. I you don't see it, it's because you don't want to. But ultimately it's up to interpretation. You don't like it. Fine.
I think the huge problem isn't the lack of variety. It's that most of these females lack the screentime to actually show off these personalities and different traits. They all feel like one off gimmicks that we barely see ever again. ALL of them have interesting ideas to explore but they never get a chance to truly shine. It wasn't until Fontaine that the females characters (outside of Chlorinde) actually had a chance to fully shine. Most of the interesting stuff about them is either in character stories or limited time events, rarely ever in the archon quests. When was the last time Sara was ever significant or seen outside of her devotion to Raiden? Outside of her 1 archon quest, what role has Shenhe played? Most of the interesting parts of Collei's story is in the manga, which a lot of people don't even know exists. Her other major appearance was in the limited 3.5 and 3.8 events. Signora's entire lore is behind an artifact set and not in the overarching story at all. If you haven't read it, you would think she's just a typical evil bad guy. Ayaka had little presence in Inazuma despite being the face of the region after Raiden. Most people see Dori as an evil gremlin without understanding why she's obsessed with mora. It's because her sister died and they couldn't afford the medicine she needed. This is locked behind her character story, and like artifact sets, most don't bother to read it. She's an exception at the moment, but Chevreuse's entire interaction is locked behind a limited event. The biggest parts of the story that Keqing was in was with the Moonchase Festival and the 2.4 Lantern Rite, BOTH limited time events. Fischl's entire involvement in the story is also completely locked behind limited time events from Unreconciled Stars and GAA 2.8. Arlecchino is shaping to be an interesting character, but she still has little screentime thus far. Rosaria's only appearance in permanent content is in Albedo's story quest. Hu Tao hadn't even appeared in many events until 3.4 Lantern Rite, and all the interesting stuff about her is AGAIN in her character stories. How she was waiting to meet her grandfather after he passed? It sounds heartbreaking and genuinely shows a different side to the girl we know. But all we have is a few lines of text for it. Raiden's whole character arc was rushed. It's better than most females, but there are still glaring issues to it. Only some were fixed in her second story quest. And then the other side of the spectrum. Kazuha's lore is locked behind 2 limited time quests. But he also was one of the most iconic and important characters in the Inazuma arc, which somewhat makes up for it. His part in the interlude also made for a great opening to the Inazuma arc. Scaramouche is again locked behind Unreconciled Stars but not only was he teased in Inazuma, he was also a major antagonist in the entire Sumeru arc AND had an entire archon quest exploring his lore and story. He and Shenhe are both characters without story quests, but archon quests centered around him. But he has so much MORE compared to her. Xiao is a fan favorite for a reason, being one of the most iconic characters in the Liyue arc, but also the Perilous Trail Archon Quest basically being his second story quest. And once again, there is a reason why Tartaglia is known as Mr WorldWide. The man is basically everywhere at this point. Albedo is one of the biggest characters lorewise, but unfortunately all of the interesting stuff about him is once again...locked by limited event content. Kaeya is lacking in exposure as well, but I do hope he gets some more, especially with how intense his lore is. Diluc has the same issue. And Dainsleif's entire existence is jam packed with lore. Neuvillette is literally him. Up until act 5, he has overshadowed the archon of the region, and even then he still shares the spotlight with her. There are definitely male characters who can use more development, but they are in a better state than most of the females. Most of the stuff I've mentioned for the males is in content that you have to complete in order to progress the story.
8 месяцев назад+2
@cryophoenix6114 so in what exactly you see that the male characters are more developed? Because I personally find the females more interesting. Dainsleif, Kaeya and Gorou are the exceptions. I could use similar arguments for the males. Xiao is just an edgy suicidal teenage child soldier with daddy issues. Diluc is angry batman, pretty dumb. Kaeya is merely an adopted f*ckboy with family issues. Zhongli is a hypocritical magnet for girls with daddy issues. Neuvillette is a angry judge with a hot voice, well good for you if you like him, but that's pretty bland taste. Tartaglia is an even bigger f*ckboy, but this one is psychotic, but hey, he loves his little sisses and bros, awww how can you not love this cute redhead? Venti is just an overfeminine musician that lets others do his job. Ayato? Well have you never seen a not braindead politician before? Go touch some grass. Oh and he's a siscon, awww. The entire point of Alhaitham's existence is looking hot, and Kaveh is just his gay roommate with a crush on him. Cyno and Tighnari share idealistic stupidity. Albedo? Well, what a time to be into immortal cute hot robots, this even reminds me of the twilight days, how cool. Does he even ever do anything at all except having good looking hair? Itto is just an oversized child. I could continue. I kinda see the point but this reminds me of discussing the lack of decent lead female characters in shounen with a female friend of mine. It's not that I disagree, it's that you see what you want to see. Besides, this is ultimately a gacha game, and gacha games work on punctual intensity, not all that complicated character arcs. What character of a gacha game goes through actually a decent storyline that we can personally see and it's not locked in lore? I don't know, not that I've played all that many. And Genshin is mostly a game for children or young adults, it's not that complicated for a reason storywise. Probably the most developed character we have seen is Jeht, and she doesn't even have a vision, but her story is my personal favourite. But ultimately is up to interpretation and personal bias, in my opinion.
Shenhe *is* homicidal and has a punisher style mentality of dealing with criminals. Hell she’s uprooted trees with her strength alone, that’s what the red ropes are for, to keep her emotions in check more specifically her homicidal tendencies. Also Miko lives to fuck around and scheme which is entirely fitting as a Kitsune.
17:50 they're already pulling these with Arlecchino. in 4.0 they added Chitose NPC in Ritou harbor, who's OG Gendou Ringo and she investigated Fatui related to her quest and it turned out now that they acted without current Arlecchino's knowledge.
the female characters of fontaine have all been so good, I appreciate the variety genshin gives us in comparison to most other games I've played in the similar genre
The waifus of genshin impact are definitely good waifus That doesn’t make them good characters. Also I am definitely one of the few that actually likes morally ambiguous characters.
No one has stated that the appearence of a character means they're written well. Also it isn't rare to like morally gray chracters. In fact, there are a lot of popular morally ambiguous charcters in literature, movies, TV shows, and other forms of media.
I can't stand the word "waifu" anymore like dam this community massively overuses the word jesus christ. Why cant you peeps just refer to the characters normally? I'm sorry but hearing "waifu" or "husbando" every couple of seconds whenever these youtubers are talking about some of the characters is just mad annoying.
Kokomi felt like she had so much potential (at least when I first played genshin). When I first heard about her I was hyping her up and when she first appeared I was amazed and thought of her like the actual hydro god, but then they just didn't use that part of her at all. I don't mind her having struggles but I just wanted to see more of her being cool and having actual power (like how Lisa tortured that one abyss mage when trying to get her book back). She's kinda a case of "show don't tell."
Exactly. And that's what make it worse. If she changes her entire mindset over the course of one walk with the traveler, then what was the point of the last 500 years? Not to mention the puppet she left in her stead was just as dumb as her
Agreed with above ^^ I honestly just wish they went ahead and made her a badish guy instead of "haha oopsie... Omoshiroi smh Guess I'll stop murdering my own citizens." But that would affect sales sooo
Honestly Kokomis story quest really just struck me as "woah shes so autistic" shes so hyperfixated on every single little details, shes a perfectionist, and her needing to "recharge" is to me just spoon theory because she has autism. Maybe its because I am autistic but I really resonated with her, shes strong and smart and elegant but she does those things in such a logical way, like her every word and action is calculated. This just seems alot to me like an autistic person struggling with social norms and trying to make it into a formula of how to talk to people because she doesn't pick up on it naturally. I do get your critiques but I honestly really love her as a character and her being a workaholic just seems like a special interest. She just really loves strategy.
![FendiDa Rappa - Clock Dat ft. Shamar Marco [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/3NBU8KHdxYY/mqdefault.jpg)
updated video that includes sumeru & fontaine characters🥰:
ruclips.net/video/vMECFZV1wpU/видео.html
Furina best girl 🥰
@@abbikgg3992fr she’s a girl boss
Ganyu's story quest felt like it was more about Cloud Retainer comedy fanservice than about Ganyu herself.
Yelan is the WORST OFFENDER in this regard. Her story quest literally shows a cutscene about the backstory of A F****** RANDOM NPC while you learn nothing. Nada. Zilch. about Yelan's past or personal life. Excuse my language, it's been a year and I'm still mad.
@@AverageWagieI mean, Yelan’s whole thing is being secretive. I don’t get adding the backstory of a random character but not telling about her past is in character (I haven’t played her story quest yet though)
@@AverageWagie same for Nilou i'm tired of them focusing on random ass NPCs we will never see again. Nilou needs character development cuz all she got is she likes dancing and being happy and that's about it. Not everything has to be deep but damn can we have some more story and interactions with these characters cuz rn these characters are as stale as bread 😔.
@@AverageWagie Her story is part of 2.7 Interlude chapter Act II: Perilous Trail
That is good
-#1 Ganyu Hater
One of the underrated females writing wise is.... dehya. Hear me out. Her story quest was actually somewhat about her. She showed emotions and most importantly she was herself. Yes, she appreciates the traveler's compliments, laughs it somewhat cutely. But she doesn't fall for the traveler. She sees the traveler as a friend, and she literally walked us off from sumeru to fontaine and didn't try to force us and say goodbye with EVERYONE.
I dont think this youtuber likes Dehya or Candace
@@kyero8724 Probably because they're Bla-
@@breathair69420Chiinnnaa
THANK YOUU
LITERALLLYYYY she is the GOAT
Collei is definitely one of my favorites too, maybe cause i've read the manhwa but even without it she feels like a real character, i just love her character development and the way she cringes it feels so different but still cute
Agree
Yess, she's the only female character I really like beyond just design
Honestly the game kinda threw away all of her potential and story from the manwha and brought it up ever again
I loved her in the windblume festival. I wish Ayaka could receive a similar storyline in an event quest or something, to focus on her finding true friendships (outside of her clan) despite her being kinda reserved and isolated.
I loved her in manhwa, she had the edgy personality I liked lol. Then in game they just threw all that things to trash, she isnt a importanr character anymore. Same goes for Dottore, he WAS THE GOOFY VILLAIN I NEEDED😭😭
Personally, I wish Raiden Shogun stayed as more of an antagonist. It was refreshing after all the waifus and just made more sense given her position and beliefs
disagree.. i hate how hyv is always like “sure we’ll give u a female archon provided she sucks at it” 😐 get outta townnnn
Facts, it would be way more interesting to have a not as benevolent archon than just portraying her as being completely clueless
@@moremouche what about nahida? shes a pretty good archon imo
@@moremouche To be fair, all the archons suck at archoning. That said, it's not like they couldn't have made her a competent antagonist.
@@gilberthamilton9312 Did you forget that Zhongli exists?
I agree that they did Kokomi terribly dirty. Her story is meant to be that of acceptance, accepting a life that she was thrust into for the sake of her people. That is a very good base material... but that is about all they gave her. They never showed us her true genius, her struggle, her acceptance- non of it is there. It is locked behind the readable story.
Right? Like, Sangonomiya does not strike me as a very martial civilization. Kokomi is well-read, but she's ultimately still a civilian leader thrust into this war. Her knowledge makes her situation all the worse: people trust her to get them through this alive, she knows that any mistake may cost who knows how many lives, she knows that she may have to send people on low-survival missions for the greater good and she probably also knows just how screwed the Watatsumi rebellion would be if the Shogun ever decided to take over the campaign personally. All of that must weigh heavy on her.
I think another big problem I have with her is her overall design. For someone thrust into the position of war general who has definitely seen people under her command die under her leadership, she is awfully clean wearing her beautiful flowing dress into a battlefield where the stakes are survival or the complete destruction of a revolution for the freedom of a nation. Gorou wears a crop top into the frontlines and he somehow feels more battle ready than her
Why bother going that far? horny dudes can't relate to that 🤪 /s
@@brightb5339I think Genshin relies on “rule of cool” for most of their designs.
@@brightb5339tbh, shes a strategist, she works behind the scenes, strategizing and stuff. Not to mention shes the head priestess of Sangonomiya. In culture ruled nations, dressing is considered a really important aspect for people eith authoritative or culture oriented roles. So i think kokomi's design actually suits her well.
another weird detail about Ganyu that I realized is that her struggles between a human and an adeptus identity is exactly what Shenhe's whole character is. But ofc, Shenhe is a full human raised by adepti, while Ganyu is part human and had long experiences living in society. So you'd think their character arcs would intersect and divide in unique ways
Shenhe’s story is actually the polar opposite of ganyu. She wants to reconnect with humanity , after being raised in isolation at the mountains by a bird with powers. Shenhe actually isn’t even an adeptus but a superhuman with murderous intrusive thoughts but is suppressed by her red ropes oh yeah she was also sacrificed by her dad to a demon to save their village.
I thought the exact same thing with Ganyu and Yanfei, 2 years ago but Hoyo never elaborated further on it.
@@dendenmushi9714 Ganyu's story is the first-generation immigrant who never really fit in with that society; there's just too much country bumpkin/war veteran baggage for her to ever become an integrated citizen. Contrasted against Yanfei who is a natural with city and human life.
@@riotangel4701exactly, that’s a perfect explanation. Ganyu is like a first generation immigrant, a half adeptus, but she was raised with adepti. While Yanfei also is a half adeptus, she was raised since the beginning among humans. Also Yanfei is much younger than Ganyu, she didn’t form a contract with Rex Lapis and didn’t witness the archon war.
HoYoverse just doesn’t know how to write ancient characters. 2k years old and is worried over “fitting in”, because “horns”, when the people of Liyue practically worship adepti. It’s ridiculous.
Jean is the only "workaholic waifu" who works to me because her character isn't sold as someone who shallowly loves work to the detriment of their health like Liyueans; in fact, the depth of her character comes from the ways Jean is incapable of being more than human.
She needs to take care of her health and her social life, temper her self-perception and expectations, and she does this all while trying to deny herself the intimacy she deeply craves, but chose to sacrifice for duty. Jean feels human, and she's actually got a lot of the subtleties you seem to have overlooked that others pointed out, in the vein of Hu Tao and whatnot.
I was looking for this kind of comment since I consider Jean lore always gets overlooked when it's quite good, really human.
Unfortunately its blocked for the players who only do the quests and not read the characters story, it's never really approached how Jean life has always been put to so much expectations and constant training (not just physical but also learning all the history of the city and such) from her mother to the point she never managed to form a intimate life with others, not even with her own sister, even if it's said she doesn't regret it, it's still quite bitter thinking in retrospective.
I don't want to write an long ass essay so I just going to resume it with she's a whole kind of mess and I lover her a lot!
@@gabrielasalgado815 I hear what you're saying. I don't think Jean is as ok with it as it's "said," thankfully (from a writing perspective). Which makes sense, given that she would like someone she can be intimate with. Plus, there are all the ways in which Jean entertains her friends and appeals to their concerns; these are the behaviors of someone who cares about the connections in their lives enough to regard them instead of brush them off for her duty. Jean's duty is also to the people in her life.
It'll be nice if we get something Jean-centric one of these days, though. Something character-driven
Right?? I love jean
I also think Jean being overworked is what makes her feel human. She is Acting Grandmaster, not that herself. The expectations and reality of being in a role you're not totally prepared for is overwhelming. I does leave for things to be forgotten or overlap in what needs to get done/when it needs to get done. Plus, Jean is in a space of intense power both in terms of what she has and expectations of the role. Her struggling feels like it matches what the role she has is, and how as a person most of us would likely end up in if put in that spot. Other workaholic characters to me don't feel like they have the same weight/expectations on their roles. Keqing and Ganyu know their jobs and honestly should have time to do more with their characters and setting balance, while Kokomi is yes, thrust into the role she might not be prepared for but just overall poor writing makes it so nothing serious can be said. In the end Jeans workaholic and not knowing how or when to take breaks feels right, it feels natural to her role and benefits her writing more than harming it.
@@Unhappytimeaperdoesn’t Jean basically run Mondstadt?
The character story quest quality difference between male and female characters is so massive, it’s actually insane. Like hu Tao was a more interesting character in her appearance in BAIZHU’S STORY QUEST than in her own! 💀
Literally, her story quest is literally the NPCs story quest 😭😭
Id argue this is because recently they have just improved their writing, like just compare the quality of liyue archon quest to sumeru archon quest
@@rue1533 true tbh
I left another comment about this but honestly the mens' story quests aren't really better on average. Like Ayato's quest was just as meaningless as most of the womens', which is kind of a shame for how much the story hyped him up.
@@rue1533 I only half-agree. Sumeru is probably overall the best archon quest so far but the writing definitely was improving before that.
Like before that we had the Shenhe interlude, Ei's second story quest, and the Dainsleif and Xiao quests in the chasm, all of which are generally pretty great.
I think Faruzan feels like a unique female character. Her story, her personality, and her overall current predicament feels real to me. I think she belongs in that "four star waifus" that's not bland. Faruzan's just way more focused on getting her salary and having her work taken seriously so much that I don't feel the overwork waifu stereotype. Maybe it's just cause I really like playable "grandparents" type of characters, but Faruzan just hits right without the "fanservice" elements for me lol. Definitely "a *person* that exists" for me (*>∇
So true, c6 faruzan with 3 5 star bows here and im very biased.
Totally, like she annoys me and she's not my fave character but I can't help but appreciate her writing. She is the perfect characterization of an "old professor", which adds so much novelty to her interactions with others and gives opportunity to funny moments.
ong like shes a woman with an actual personalty in this game but everyone hates her for that exact reason
i talked to her in the teapot and damn i didnt expect her to be that likable... they definitely did very well with some of the female sumeru characters, it gives me hope for the future
faruzan supremacy!!!!! i loved and still love faruzan’s design ever since i saw her :D i was going into her character writing blind and for some reason i wasnt expecting the attitude but i did end up liking it, it suits her and her personality isn’t overboard annoying for me
I think the 4-star women being generally better written than the 5-star women can be explained by the fact that Mihoyo doesn't have money riding on them and thus they can risk being more experimental with them.
nice theory
Honestly, I can see that theory. Most of the 5 stars in Liyue except for Hu Tao, Xiao, and Zhongli (and maaaaybe Yelan) don't have much going for them outside of their job, but a 4 star like Beidou actually has power and personality outside of her vision/status, and properly lives up to her title as the Leader of the Crux Fleet, to the point where not only is she _integral to even GETTING you and Kazu into Inazuma,_ you can find former Crux Fleet captains/crew members in other countries who still speak highly of her.
Honestly, we need more characters like Beidou and Dehya
I was going to mention this! Amy, Beidou, Ning, are interesting & unique imo.
@@creatingpulsars9979they are yeah. Ningguang’s hangout was really fun to do.
Not just 4 or 5 stars. The best stories in Genshin are about NPCs since Hoyo writers can go full on out with them.
13:33 Absolutely, the hype for Arlecchino and her potentially being playable has more than answered this question in my eyes. People absolutely want a morally ambiguous lady.
im still mad two years later that signora will most likely not be playable. she's the only fatui character i liked and shes DEAD!
cue weird “redemption arc” #3…
The "think of the children" absolutely confirms that she will be lol
CC says that people don't like Yae cause she's morally ambiguous character but I don't like cause she just anoyed me.. on the other hand I'm really hyped for Arlecchino and really liked Ei at first (until rushed ending of Inazuma archon quest and her 1st story quest)
First, let's see how well it will sell
I do think that at the very least, the writing of the female characters (and in general) has improved a bit since Sumeru. I think characters like Nahida, Dehya, Faruzan and Collei are all great and some of my favourites in the game (though I'll never forgive Hoyoverse for sidelining Collei in the archon quest). Let's hope that the improvement continues with Fontaine.
Yeah sumeru had a lot of well written female characters, compared to like, inazuma (not counting raiden)
Agreed. Sumeru characters feel better written to me than the others, and I think it really helps that they actually interact with each other frequently instead of just talking to the traveler one on one all the time
I know righttt collei should have has the relevance that dunyarzad did with highlighting how big of an issue aleazar was
@@elkiza4did you just say Raiden was well written 💀💀💀💀
@@Majin_Xavierrasimo yes
I think part of the problem is that female characters are not allowed to show negative emotions to the same extent as male characters. From the top of my head, the only instances I can remember of seeing a character being genuinely angry or in true despair it was always the males. And those scenes were important because those are the rare times when the story seems like it's actually getting serious. The female characters are just like "Eula is annoyed and looks like the grumpy emoji" and it's played for laughs, or "Nilou makes a little sad face, feel bad for her for 10 seconds and let's move on". Compare that to Alhaitham's rage in the archon quest when it looked like he wanted to kill Azar, or Scaramouche going through the 7 stages of grief in his story quest. No, female characters must always be composed and smile for the player. Because god forbid waifus are shown as real characters who have bad days too I guess.
[Edit] Sure I love getting notifications from people calling me stupid because they didn't read my 2nd comment below or they didn't realize this thread is several months old, keep it classy guys.
Hopefully the hydro archon is actually a brat 😭💀
Exactly, genshin thinks showing that these female characters are indeed human with flaws, struggles, and complexities isn’t all that sellable. Which is probably why(imo) any real complexity for them is hidden behind stuff nobody reads or pays attention to.
The only female I can recall who is capable of showing full-on rage as a natural reaction is Dehya. It's too bad this it's erased as a playable character.
nahida is the only character who we've seen actually cry i think
update: navia, think it’s nice that they’re letting a character that’s supposed to be sentimental cry on screen so much. honestly it’s crazy how fleshed out she is already, possibly one of the most well written characters hoyo has made for this game
@@sussynanibaka69brat is still cute, not a real and serious aggression. All for stupid chinese coomers.
Eula's story has so much potential it infuriates me that it is never delved into deeper than just the surface.
Especially since her entire existence has been a sudden and giant retcon. Before she showed up, all lore points to the Lawrences being exiled just like the entire nobility that isn't a Gunnhildr or a clan that isn't similar to them. Now with her appearance somehow changing everything by making that not only the Lawrences did not get exiled like the rest of their peers, every single member of the clan that isn't Eula and the other guy that turned a new leaf in the recent event is as rotten as their ancestors which begs the question why they didn't get exiled centuries ago if they were still so corrupt and morally terrible. So far Eula's story did little to expand and shine the line on the Aristocracy of old compared to the manga or what even happened to the Lawrences outside of the ones still in the city.
Did they all die off? Did they settle somewhere and cleanse themselves of their past sins in a generational long quest? Did they all dance and hold hands while singing kumbaya with the mysterious Imunlaukr Clan and the rest with super depression at Dragonspine until an avalanche wipes all the exiles out? Who knows, the only thing for sure that the Lawrences of today are Saturday morning cartoon villains that twirl their mustache or redeem themselves before likely vanishing after a single event never to be seen again so that Eula can repeat the same thing with another member while foiling her Uncle's schemes.
Seeds of stories brought by the wind.. will sprout in due time.
Im gonna let Hoyo cook for a very long time when it comes to Mondstadt characters because a huge part of them is just SET UP.. and theres alot of hints that near the end of the game these character will be on the spotlight again.. i just hope they dont miss because its gonna be a long ass time.
These days, she's stuck to Amber 24/7 (Think they went a little overboard with the Eula Amber ship pandering). Only now is she unglued from Amber.
With how badly Twitter reacted even to "just the surface", I don't blame Mihoyo for treading lightly on the topic
Eula's backstory could be great. And her relationship with Amber should be brought to the forefront (but we know that can't openly happen). She's a strong, stubborn character born into this social standing that makes her hated for just living, even though she actively fights for equality and defies her own family. How would that storyline not be interesting to explore?
it's even more apparent when you compare the overworked waifus to the 'overworked husbandos'. xiao is overworked, but it's handled so much more differently than how the women's arcs are. we actually see real consequences to his poor habits. xiao essentially views himself as nothing but a tool, so happiness and leisure are out of the question for him and that makes him an 'overworked husbando'. this translates into little self-worth and him cutting himself off from others to avoid being hurt or causing hurt. rather than running around and completing his errands for him or forcibly making him take a break, xiao's development comes in the form of a life-and-death scenario.
it's his insistence that he sacrifice himself for the safety of everyone else in 'perilous trail' ("what if i told you this is my last will?"). yelan absolutely grilled him for making such a suggestion, but that's because xiao's lack of self worth is an actual flaw in his character. they don't try to coax him out of his poor tendencies like he's a cat or something the same way everyone does with kokomi, jean, ganyu, keqing, etc. he's a grown man, and he's very stubborn and in denial. that makes it all the more impactful and effective when he DOES finally recognize that yanfei and yelan's words held a lot of weight and they were right about him. that then leads to him actually reevaluating his perspective and developing as a character. with xiao's case, we get to the root of the problem, his trauma and self-esteem. with the women it's always a superficial "just stop overworking."
Yeah, it doesn’t matter thematically because the flaws the Keqing likes have is kind of just patronized to them rather than portrayed as an actual struggle that it’s important to avoid, the end of Ganyu’s quest basically says “she needs to be here overworking herself or liyue’s systems would collapse lol.”
Wtf xiao, my mindset is almost similar to him, and i never knew he was overworked.
Basically in short i view myself as a slave to my parent, but i feel okay listening to their every command. Maybe its an asian thing lmao
@@naufalnoorizan1763 We aisians put social/family responsibility much higher than personal freedom/valve.I think it's a big cultural difference.Venti can't fit Liyue or Inazuma a bit.Qixing are already planning to take the power of Geo Archon even though Morax did rather more for its people compared to Venti.Apparently they believe Morax hadn't done enough.So the so-called overworking isn't really a thing for Asian people as they're supposed to do so.
Agree with everything, I just want to add Dehya as a major exception. People tend to dislike her for being "masculine" which???? She's not :D She just feels real and human
Honestly think ppl hate her cuz of her kit like I know so many ppl were excited for her and we’re gonna main her until hoyo did her kit so bad. I definitely was a fan of hers until she got added to the standard banner.
@@2triedforthis830 oh yea for sure I meant the writing and design part!! It's a pain for me to main her and do 0 dmg :")
Disliking dehya for being masculine is so weird to me. Seems more to me like they don't like seeing women who are strong and don't play the damsel in distress. One of her idles literally shows her checking her make up, and during several important quests she's mentioned to be into feminine things.
I think this is great bc women can be badass and strong and still like being feminine. She reminds me of the cool and badass women who raised me throughout my life, and I think that authenticity makes her a very fleshed out character.
dehya's story quest is one of the best story quests we've ever gotten. she really is an amazing character!!
"masculine" the woman literally wears eyeshadow, has long hair, and is almost naked. I can't.
"If you've been in the Genshin community long enough - first, I'm so sorry."
Yeah, I feel that.
Anyway, I think Noelle gets an honorable mention as a well-written character, at least in my view. She works so hard to be part of the "cool kids" club, but just makes a lot of bad choices with good intentions. As powerful as she is as a playable character, and despite her stoic and solid element of geo, she's an emotionally vulnerable character. Years of failing into becoming a knight has clearly affected her confidence and self-esteem. She often feels like she isn't doing enough, even though she's as hard-working as Jean is. Where she shines is in dedication. She represents her element a little too well, in that regard. But no matter how hard she tries, how hard she trains, and how much she helps others, she just can't reach her goal because the love others have for her is matched only by how much they fear her decision-making and lack of common sense.
Being a knight is a team sport, but Noelle often carries the world on her shoulders. It's not a terrible trait, but she also needs to be careful about making decisions that would impact others, like aiding those who clearly have ill intentions for her country just because they look like they need help. She has the hero mentality of helping others, but she needs to learn that helping is not always a good thing. You can't help but root for her in the sidelines, but you also wish she's never admitted as a knight. She's so powerful that few would be able to stand up to her. And if she starts helping the wrong people, as she's already done more than once, she could place Monstadt in danger.
noelle is so underrated . THIS RIGHT HERE
Y'think after a while someone would take pity and tell her
You forget the spy that was sent to them city RAN AWAY because she learned so much about him and his family in such a short amount of time. He didn't even get near his goal.
She also has an unintentional creepy way of speaking:
" Because this is your first meal in Mondstat...and your last." - Noelle to spy during hangout event
@@JaneDoe-fo8yjJean has a note on her desk.... somewhere
To me Noelle is kinda... She has a kinda cool backstory, and a "girl trying and failing to get in her dream college" vibe about her that makes her really grounded. Like she's learning how to be an adult, and i think that's endearing. But the way the game portrays it is kinda shallow. I wish it showed her actually putting herself at risk, like her lore tells us she does. Show, don't tell.
Plus, idk why, hoyo always isolates her. Only time anyone ever talked to her was last time she showed up, when she was partnered with mika. her relationships are otherwise so shallow. AND she's kind of a mary sue :(
Will still main her for as long as i play the game. I picked her out of my entire roster on the second week of my account back in 1.0, because her kit looked like it would have the most longevity out of the ones i had, and i thought it was the coolest looking one. and lol, i was right.
I dont know why the most interesting female charactsrs are four stars and the most badly written ones the 5 stars. Ningguang, Beidou, Kujou Sara are all my favorites because they're some of the most interesting.
Meanwhile, Ganyu, a 5-star was so absent from the storyline of Liyue's archon quest I wondered if I've even met her before her story quest.
Ei , Nahida, Ayaka , Yoyimia , Dehya , Mona and Eula want to talk with you .
Low key this video is very biased .
@@Dojafish😬😬😬
@@Dojafisheula? Still surface level
@@DojafishAlso Kuki and Yanfei, they're actually really unique
@@DojafishAyaka? Lmfao.
LM Fucking AO.
the worst part about this is that if you played impact 3rd then you know that hoyo can write very in depth female characters with great motivations and messed up personalities and the fans will still love them. they just choose not to here because genshin showed them you can be lazy with your characterization and still make a boatload of money.
Exactly
Genshin is incredibly LAZY with a lot of things, not just characterization, and it's very sad and annoying
S tier comment, just what I wanted to deliver.
Some dead characters are also playable, yet you still feel hurt by how tragic the story is. They better not f up Murata.
Honkai star rail:"am i a joke to you?"
About Ayaka: I think Xiao is the male "counterpart" to her since he simps too and they give a LOT of fanservice with him and the Traveler, but he also has a fully fledged character story and motivations that are completely unrelated to Traveler. He doesn't feel like he just sits around waiting for Traveler to show up when we're away, something Ayaka kinda does
I think part of the reason why Zhongli isn't an Overworked Waifu™ (besides the obvious) is that he chose to retire. He has agency and self awareness, unlike the female characters who always need to be convinced to take a break, like they don't know what's good for them.
Imo fischl was a good example of character development where it's not another traveler senpai guides the waifu.
Shenhe also kind of counts.
what's especially tragic is how we go through this arc repeatedly, even within the same characters. like keqing had her whole realization that overworking isn't all good during moonchase in 2.1... then just 3 patches later she's learning the same exact lesson again in 2.4 during lantern rite. it's what made me especially irritated about that year's lantern rite, because we could've learnt about liyue's culture and history more again instead of just rehashing the same exact character arc but with a cute skin this time..
Nah bro, Jean literally HAS to be overworked because almost every Mondstadter is an idiot who needs Jean to be their mom constantly, and because the other Knights of Favonius just don't do their jobs (I think there's a reason why Diluc exclusively respects Jean out of all of the Knights). The theme of balancing work with physical and mental health doesn't work in this context, which is why I despise her story quest on so many levels (Jean is my favorite Genshin character). I'm praying that, when Varka returns with the main Knight force, Jean gets relieved of a lot of the workload and gets an opportunity to ACTUALLY be a character.
@@chickensky1121 Come to think of it, Mondstadt really has a bevy of awful npcs: whether its creepy stalkers, irreponsible alcoholics, pathological liars, racists, and morons who complain about the most trivial of matters.
@@aeso3555 Precisely, and most of the other Knights of Favonius (especially the NPCs) seem to be fairly incompetent, so Jean is almost on her own with regards to managing Mondstadt.
At this point, i don't know what to think anymore because there's so little discussion around Yanfei, who has Hu Tao's wit and strong connection to the adepti, but without Ganyu's duty.
Yanfei is just so slept on, you know?
Agreed! She isn’t my favorite character but I like her a lot and she’s a so fun onscreen I think I like lawyer characters ig. She’s really chill yk like her life is pretty awesome and she’s content which makes alot of ppl not care abt her I think.
Feel like part of the reason she's slept on is because in the Chasm quest where she does get to shine a lot, she's overshadowed by Xiao, Yelan, and Itto all at once. This may be the same reason why Shinobu isn't as widely popular either
OMG THIS, it makes me so sad bc yanfei's awesome and she's one of my favourite characters alongside shinobu and yoimiya
Yan Fei seems so mature and intelligent and happy with her life, a character doesn't necessarily need a tragic and edgy backstory to be a good character. I don't play many character based games but having a female character in the lawyer role felt pretty refreshing to me (as does that most leading roles in genshin are filled by women) and yet when Yan Fei came out people mostly talked about how she has a 'mommy voice' in the Japanese dub :/
@@jaded_tofu Yeah, and I honestly prefer the enthusiasm of the English VA to the measured control of the Japanese VA.
Mostly agree, but I'm gonna have to say there are some 'selection bias' here to fit the thesis. The primary culprit is Yoimiya because she is one of the most solid and fleshed out characters and goes way beyond just your standard 'bubbly girl next door'. Her philosophy and outlook is also independently great without hinging upon simping for traveller. See her story quest 2 which is incredible and had me in tears as a grown-ass man.
The primary issue with Genshin is that male or female, most characters are 70% miss and 30% great because the scheduling of new characters being released every 1-2 patches means that HYV set up new characters when they are first introduced and then has almost zero follow-ups on their story so they become half-baked arcs. Or they (Scara) have a huge lead-up but little no screen time once they are released and the new husbando / waifu is up for sale. This type of 'character dilution' is what's holding back the storywriting.
Her 1st quest was great cause it showed struggles of children and others because of the vision and Sakura degree.........but her 2nd one sucks because is just a date......sure has a child who can't walk boohoo but its just a date........and I get death threats........hoyos community.......so nice right
@@Accountthatexists Not gonna debate in comment section and obviously you have a right to your opinion. But Yoimiya's theme to me is the quiet rebuttal to the impermanence and suffering of life. She's not oblivious to suffering but accepts it and heals it. Because Ei latches onto eternity as a concept and repeats suffering as a result, Yoimiya's theme as a small, inconsequential mortal under her rule shows us a different path that can be taken by humanity that even surpasses that of archons.
Both quests illustrate it, but obviously you can enjoy / reject the second as a simple children's date if you want. No shade intended, just sharing my thoughts.
@@sycamorewest Damn, never thought of Yoimiya like that, Now I really gotta push her from C0 to C2, she's so fun to use
@@annaairahala9462 he first quest is the reason i'm such a big yoimiya fan. that and i relate to her a lot
@@sycamorewest Damn, you made me like Yoimiya even more now, and also see her second quest in a new light, I really like your explanation of her ideals and what she represents.
Also hard agree on the second part of the first comment "Or they (Scara) have a huge lead-up but little no screen time once they are released and the new husbando / waifu is up for sale.", I was excited for so many arcs, like Collei (waiting since the manga), to know what's up with Cyno and that spirit in his body and his knowledge of magic, yet so far they only showed up to commemorate festivals and whatnot, their lore was mentioned very briefly (and in Cyno's case was missable).
And in Scaramouche's case it's the hugest let down of them all for me, after wrapping up his past as fast as possible after 3 years of build up (the Interlude felt rushed to me, and didn't really let the player digest what was happening before everything was erased, so much that there are still people confused about what happened there), it felt like they just tried to give him an excuse to enter the rooster ASAP just so they could shove him in Parade of Providence.
And then that event ends with a "Yeah, so now Scaramouche is Nahida's maid/pet/obedient dog, and it looks like he'll stay that way for an indeterminate amount of time, say goodbye to him, you might see him next year when we need to make him into a silly joke again for some event of something, don't expect any further character development, his role now is being an extension of Nahida, also to be her stooge and minion, he'll show up if she gives him an errand to do so."
It really feels like his character was diluted, and like plenty of other characters before him, I won't be surprised if when he shows up again he retains only like 1 or 2 traits of the ones he had originally, or becomes static as this Nahida's pet laughingstock he became in his latest appearance.
Let’s not forget the mess that was Signora, she arguably has one of the best backstory and lore in the entire game, and instead of fleshing it out, they decided to hide it in artifact sets and weapons that few would read, Signora had such a great potential as a character, they threw that all out of the window to A-create shock value, B-show how great and powerful Shougn is in time for her banner and C-to divert the attention from the shit show that was Inazuma Act 3, Signora is one of if not the most mistreated character by the writers team which sucks even more giving how hard her design and art team went with her.
It really is disappointing that they took her out so soon because they seriously did barely anything with her. Didn't even explain her backstory and instead, like you said, hid it in an artifact.
@@idontchuckle6658 Ehh I think if she stayed longer she would of pissed MORE people off
Remember until then she just got away with everything
@@mk_gamíng0609would she be considered a villain sue?
Going on a tangent about the 4 star women, I happen to absolutely love Layla. And there are many people who specifically have DID (dissociative identity disorder) would say that they like her too because they feel that with her, DID is portrayed pretty accurately and not made light of. Another thing I would say in where she shines in terms of her writing is how human she feels. Once you unlock her story, you see how realistic her struggles are with mental health, episodes of depression and just never being confident in her abilities - essentially just having major imposter syndrome. There are times when she feels like she’s just keeping her head above water, doubting herself and not being able to see the good that she tries to do for others despite her lack of faith in herself.
Another thing I would say is that she relates to is the immigrant child being the first in their family to attend college or a prestigious university. Think of ‘Breathe’ from the musical In The Heights. Many of her voice lines and in her hangout quest outline these feelings of having a childhood where she strive to do great things, but saw just how much other people were doing the same thing. So what made her different? There are others who are more intelligent, more gifted and much more productive than her, and there were people back home expecting so much from her. She doesn’t just want to let them down, but at the same time, it would be so much easier to just give it all up. That turmoil that she faces makes her incredibly human and I believe that she’s really well written but maybe that’s just because I’m a Layla lover.
I really enjoyed Layla’s hangout and I enjoyed the endings where she got to take a break from everything, it was sweet especially where she screams at the top of the mountain.
Kokomi is one of my favourite Inazuma characters and to cope with the lack of well-written development I just headcanon that she's a murdering mermaid at night or something like that
why do I think that if she could, she would definitely drown every single men(or soldiers) that sara brings(or maybe sara herself)
@@miyuuka or maybe she's a cold blooded general that doesn't care about the amount of soldiers she looses if that guarantees the result she's after
@@tox1cya705 oh my god yes. hoyoverse if you dont make this canon I'm going to burn your building down
@@miyuuka so true, there's so much potential behind kokomi and her lore. I mean, every hint points that she's a reincarnation of the dragon heirs that lived in Enkanomiya and she's also a human being which can only mean she's to be the one that unites both races after millennia of battles against one another. But make her a cute introvert waifu uwu I guess....
Omg i agree with you so much. i remember one reddit post about a kokomi hc where she turned a blind eye to her soldiers using delusions bcs that would actually give them a chance of rebelling against a GOD (and not make her seem completely incompetent lol). Making kokomi morally ambiguous/seeing her make borderline immoral decisions for the greater good of inazuma would have made her a much more interesting character imo...T_T
I think that the worst part of genshins story quest’s is their focus on the NPC’s, it almost always starts revolving around random NPC #275 overcoming some struggle, rather than being about the person the story quest is named after. This is probably because most of genshins characters have flat character arcs, they have already had all their development off screen and are instead the “mentors” who aid those who haven’t developed (I.e. the random NPC’s who we couldn’t give less of a darn about most of the time), there are exceptions to this formula (Scaramouche being one of them). This issue probably exacerbates the monotony between the types of genshin women;
-my job is my whole life
-I wanna have fun
- the rare “other”
Fr💀 And it's always Teppei/katheryne hair 2.0 which shows they have nothing at all importabt or worth remembering
Literally! Why are we just helping a random npc with their problem in quest specifically created to expand upon a character? Instead, all we really get is their professional, analytical reaction and solution to said problems, and a lil sprinkle of backstory. Meanwhile, actual lore is spread around limited-time events, long character details, etc. Lore just seems like secondary for these character quests, which so odd to me 😕 Bc of this, hangouts are actually waaay more enjoyable for me since you actually interact with the character, especially ones you rarely see 😅
In Ayato’s story quest, I think it actually works. In others, not so much.
Some characters quests actually should be about npc. What would we know about Ayato if we wouldn't see his work for npc? We could see exactly how he act's in situation like this. Yoimiya wouldn't also make sense if the quest was about her and not about how she treats people and think of them. Sometimes to know some people, you need to see them with others, how they act.
Exactly!
I don't understand this problem. If you look at HSR, they have playable characters who are considered "bad people", they have characters that see their wrong thinking and change throughout the story. As in Belobog. Almost all of the characters there have arcs that change their worldviews and the way they live. Same in Lofu, Dan has an arc that changes him
Why do they struggle to do the same for genshin?
this video is why furina is a breath of fresh air
furina can't be overworked if she pushes all the work on neuvillette
This didn't age well
After 4.2 : 💀
@@B121AN1 the worst sging i,ve witnessed
This aged about as well as the Dream allegations
Aged like milk.
I'd argue Beidou falls outside the typical waifu mold as well. She's loud, fun, brash, a heavy drinker and a tough mama, juxtaposed by the cuter more vulnerable side she shows during her hangout event.
Beidou is personally one of my favorite characters because of her personality.
She’s so multifaceted it’s nice to see.
Beidou as a character has had a huge influence on me. I believe she is the Genshin character who has the most impact on me. I got her way before the Inazuma quest. The moment after I pulled her and listened to her hello voice line, I said “I love her”. She has been an inspiration to me. I love her demeanour and her outlook on things. It got to the point where I now want to cosplay her and make the cosplay myself. I also named my cat after her. My cat is now two years old and her name definitely suits her. Beidou (the character, not my cat) has been on my main team for a while (alongside Kazuha) and I have her at friendship level 10. Needless to say, she is an incredible character who feels like a person.
Beidou is personally one of my favorite characters.
When I think of the most well-written and interesting male characters in Genshin, the first that come to mind are Venti, Zhongli, Albedo, Itto, Gorou, Childe, Cyno and Alhaitham. Mostly 5-star characters who get a lot of screentime.
When I think of the most well-written and interesting female characters in Genshin, the first that come to mind are Collei, Nahida, Lisa, Beidou, Ningguang, Fischl, Barbara, Shenhe and Dehya. Mostly 4-star characters who don't get as much focus in the main story and don't have character quests, with most of their character being hidden behind hangouts (which many don't play), lore text or limited-time events which aren't coming back.
Hoyo are capable of writing great characters of any gender, but the best-written female characters typically aren't the ones they choose to market, whereas the best-written male ones are the ones they do try to market. I don't think the 5-star female characters are poorly written but it definitely feels like most of them don't get explored as in-depth as they should be, and meanwhile there are many great 4-star characters that they just kind of ignore and act like they don't exist.
I'm not mostly familiar with gorou's story and lore, can you explain it to me? I'm genuinely curious
Don't forget Yoimiya
Do people forget mona she is written as good as fischl are probably better and they both are
I think the best duo in the game
Eula has one of the most excellent backstory and characterization imho. Hu Tao too, though it wasn't shown in her story quest.
@@kevinclement1533 well her story wont be as bad as her rapping career... dies in pain
Mostly agree with your points but also disagree with your thoughts on hu tao. Its true that her first story quest wasn't all that great (at least not in comparison to several other ones), but you can glimpse a great deal of nuance in her character through it. Her work ethic, personality and mysteriousness also pull through. I also never seem to understand people who call hu tao "normal". She works with the dead, she interacts with them and deals with their grievances. She's not the simple happy-go-lucky character people make her out to be. Her motivation and strong philosophy brought her where she is. Kind of feels like selection bias because you brushed over various aspects of her character to make your point. Furthermore, calling her "bland" is just strange because she's one of the rare cases of a striking female personality. She has drive, she's firm on her beliefs, she's mischievous and she's secretive. The reason why she behaves the way she does was also subtly explained, its more on the playerbase for not being smart enough to pick up on it.
There are several lamentable aspects of the storytelling for female characters in genshin, but this part just felt like deliberate ignorance. Still, you made good points and I continue to hope for a lot more hu tao content that expands on "her" more than simple pass-time appearances.
Agree, hu tao has one of the most striking personalities in genshin. I feel like because she is a late teen/young girl, downplaying her personality as just a "random XD quirky gworl" seems misogynistic. Even then, Hu Tao is much different than any other positive/friendly genshin female. Her enigmatic traits aren't even related to femininity or girlhood. She is someone who grew up overseeing the boundary between life and death, so her surprising nature is to offset the often solemn nature of her job. You explained it really well. I really hard disagree with the author about Hu Tao's character.
yeah, calling someone who walks in and out of the afterlife for a living normal is quite the stretch
Yeah when I saw this video I immediately had a feeling it would be full of bad arguments that practiced poor media literacy, and your comment saved me the time and headache.
Look, the character quests in general are seldom amazing showcases of the characters, but they still SHOWCASE who they are in several different shades. Always. To somehow contrive a sexist argument out of Genshin's generally-OK writing is just lol. Everybody could be treated better, not just a couple of the girls.
@@jackreacher7495 Not mention saying thing as objective when it comes to things like these is a bit weird. what is bland is not the same for everyone, for exsample.
@@minecraftliker3 This isn't about what's interesting, this is about ignoring details to make an incomplete conclusion
Ganyu's "character" story n°5: "...During the Archon War, she once choked a giant monster to death with ease after getting lodged in its throat when it tried to eat her, said monster having fatally underestimated quite how wide her waistline was." This shit is canon, and I'm so tired of dumb shit like that. Also, she is literally thousands of years old, why her story quest involves we helping her to learn how to interact with humans??? At least Beidou's story is about her killing a giant sea-monster BEFORE she had her vision, so one female character has an honest badass moment
the ganyu story quest was about her feeling isolated, similar to Xiao- it's not her "learning how to interact with humans" it was literally about her learning to interact with Adepti if anything. she has a lot of self image issues, both physical and mental (that character story was about that, she struggled with her weight in the past and is overly critical of what she eats now) but mainly she feels like she doesn't belong anywhere. she went back to the adepti to learn how to be one better, thinking she was unfit for human society but she still preferred it to being an adeptus.
I honestly think the "defeating a monster with the power of thiccness" is hilarious and I love that the game doesn't take itself too seriously outside of the main story, but to each their own I guess
@@Kat-qf7ov Same, I actually loved that part. A lot of chinese humor has that sort of whimsical, nonsensical/silly tone, like ganyu being a fat (cute!) baby lol. It's meant to be endearing.
Ganyu's story is the first-generation immigrant who never really fit in with that society; there's just too much country bumpkin/war veteran baggage for her to ever become an integrated citizen. Contrasted against Yanfei who is a natural with city and human life.
Media literacy is dead if you thought Ganyu's story quest was about helping her learn how to socialize.
Seeing your section on Raiden and Yae is interesting because of the insane reception towards Kafka in Honkai Star Rail who is probably worse than them: she's unambiguously a villain, has no qualms killing, and doesn't have an uwu personality, yet everyone I know is going crazy for her. It might have also to do with just how Genshin, unintentionally or not, has a predominantly younger audience that can't deal with these characters as smoothly.
There's people that legitimately believe that Yae Miko is mean and a bully when she is literally a Kitsune, a trickster fox demigod being from Japanese mythology. She teases and is playful. Also, she doesn't necessarily want to help or be a hero, and that's a good thing. She only really gets out of bed if it really benefits or amuses her in some way. Apparently, being a little self centered is akin to committing a war crime lol.
Actually Genshin’s audience are mostly adults, according to polls. The difference is “mommy” Kafka, and better writing. And also Kafka is gray morally, and I don’t believe she’s a villain. If she was she wouldn’t have bothered luring the Express team to the Xiangshou. She is following a script and we have yet to see where that leads.
There is also the fact that both of these characters had horrible introductions in the Archon Quest, though.
@@marcusaurelius4777what if I'm unfamiliar with japanese mythology and don't want to check external sources to have a good understanding of a character in the game?
@@kindlingking I agree and this is a big pet peeve of mine with HoYoverse and the writers of Genshin. Either they hide lore in limited time events, or they tell everything in bloated dialogue that people want to skip- or when they do try to show not tell, they are sloppy at it and it comes across half ass. Granted the writing for Fontaine is much better, and I hope they continue in that more mature direction.
I feel like Jean was fine, Kequing was a bit uncreative. By Ganyu, I was like, please come up with something else... and then Kokomi sounded like she wouldn't have the same problem, and then they just threw on the same old trope just because. Like, why?
something I noticed about many of the genshin females are that their characters are mostly based off of their relation to their job
for ex: ganyu as ningguangs subordinate, hu tao as the 77th director of the wangsheng funeral parlor, jean as the acting grand master, the list goes on..
this is a VERY LARGE contrast to the male characters, who actually have unique personalities that aren’t just in relation to their work for ex: alhaitham, baizhu, diluc, itto, kaveh, and so on
most of the women are defined by their JOBS first and then their actual PERSONALITIES
Some characters like Baizhu, or at least his combat lines, does center around his job as a doctor alot. Or Lyney which in the 4.0 livestream is literally showing magic tricks to the enemies.
I don't know but I thought Hu Tao completely shatters what a funeral parlor boss should be doing.
This is pretty bias selective because Itto doesn't even have a job.
@@salcedshe is the ONE AND ONI arattaki itto lmao
And now we have two more women defined by their jobs: Kirara and Charlotte
Really hope Arlecchino passes my expectations, though I’m kinda doubtful. Sumeru archon quest was definitely the best written one so far, so I really hope Fontaine steps it up even further.
watch her about to become another "uwu traveler you are so cool and you are absolutely right. My actions are dumb and I should stop"
I honestly do not see a future with arlecchino making a breakthrough in the female character department, I’ve lost almost all hope
theres so much about her character that i want to see explored, really think shes very interesting
but the fandom is really stretching it with the aether harem Arlecchino shit, but then again the fandom will always be weird ig
i hope they dont do what they did with ei and make her "waifu material" immediately after setting up a morally ambiguous front for her
@@KuramenoFontaine and Arle stepped it up
@@Pissicist2394 THANK GOD THIS DIDN'T HAPPEN🙏
"we want more nasty and morally ambiguous characters" they can't even handle Dori 💀
Fr fr!!! I love dori so much.
YOU'VE JUST BEEN DORI'ED
Nah the reason we don’t like her is because she represents a really harmful stereotype about the Middle East
@@seashell3403or you have an image of middle eastern people and she dont fit so you are mad about it.. and who is this we??
@@mangshu21 I don’t have an image of middle eastern people because they can look however they want. I’m just saying that in the past lots of “greedy” stereotypes have put on the Middle East which can be seen heavily in Dori’s design. I’m glad there are designs in the game that don’t rely so heavily on these stereotypes, but a lot of people are still frustrated about it. I don’t know if you can remember what happened when Dori art first released, but a lot of people were mad about it. The problem isn’t that she is morally ambiguous, it’s the fact that she is so heavily based on these harmful and a lot of the time, racist stereotypes. It’s worth looking into. I could be wrong about some things so please let me know if so, but this is my whole take on the character. I hope that clears it up a bit.
safe to say this isnt the case anymore. nearly every fontaine character, whether male or female, is exceptionally well written (at least by genshin standards). we'll have to wait and see how their story quests pan out but the archon quest itself has already done a ton of heavy lifting building each character
Masquerade of the Guilty raised the bar for everyone. I hope to god that it becomes the floor.
Yeah. Furina, Navia, whoever was in the spotlight hit so much better.
i still think they're not that great. I liked furina's characterization, but she was basically an spectator in her own story and that kinda sucked. I wish she had more agency and was more actively participating in the events.
Navia... she just came out of nowhere already trusting the traveler and whatnot. that felt so jarring. Her design and personality doesn't seem to match at all with her role in the story either. i don't know, navia feels kinda hollow. I don't thinking the fact she cried a few times makes her any better than other characters.
(thankfully as playable characters, their gameplay aspect makes them some of the best characters in the game so far imo)
It’s also that fontaine’s story is way more character driven. It feels like other nation’s quest didn’t really give a lot of tought for the character and focus solely on the main crisis. While in fontaine i feel like it’s the opposite and the crisis is used to highlight the characters
Reason why I’m so excited for Fontaine. I’m already in love with Furinas pathetic loser eccentric average dramatic French person personality, navia is amazing and passionate, driven and strong, Lynette is sassy and sarcastic and im living for it, and I’m already beyond excited for more clorinde!!!!
I'm an east asian guy and honestly, I don't like how the workaholic women were written. They were workaholic wiafus first and actual living, breathing being second. I have Ganyu, Keqing and Jean but I only actually aimed for Ganyu, the rest were lost from 50/50 or from standard banner. And one thing I didn't do when I pulled for Ganyu was do her story quest. In fact, it took me months before I actually got around to play it and I was very disappointed that I almost regretted pulling for Ganyu. It was bad. Real bad. I feel like the directors of these things are clearly men who doesn't understand women and more showcasing their waifu qualities for an easy buck.
People say it doesn't matter who you are when commenting(like saying i'm a man/woman/white/black etc) but I just wanted to say I appreciate this comment. I'm also east asian and it feels very validating to see my people acknowledge the waifu-bait.
Jean is the only one who works to me because her character isn't sold as someone who mindlessly loves work to the detriment of their health like Liyueans; in fact, the depth of her character comes from the ways Jean is incapable of being more than human. She needs to take care of her health, her social life, temper her self-perception and expectations, and she does this all while trying to deny herself the intimacy she deeply craves, but chose to sacrifice for duty.
Same, I also don't like to be lumped into one thing just because I happen to be east asian as well...
@@jackreacher7495doesn’t Jean run a country? I’ve always been confused as to where the Knights stand in terms of government in Mondstadt.
@@thomasraines1396 Mondstadt isn't run by anyone, being the "nation of freedom." The church is its own body in which people worship Barbatos as they please - Rosaria, if you're wondering, is someone who acts alone to protect Mondstadt from the shadows.
The Knights of Favonious are as-presented on the tin: they're valiant and willing citizens of Mondstadt, essentially volunteering to protect its people. It's essentially their military, but it doesn't run anything. It just protects the nation - and quite effectively, given how much more peaceful its countryside is compared to the other nations'
I've got problems to how they get genuinely interesting stories and then fumble the bag by locking it behind temporary events. Mona's best stories were locked behind timed events and the permanent content you get is just "Oh she has a master, she sees the truth, she's broke."
GAA showed how she tells people about fate and how much it affects her. Why wasn't this writing in her story quest?
After Furina’s release I’m so happy that she’s such a good character and a FEMALE
why are you acting like there is zero females in genshin lol
this is why fischl clears, her story in golden apple archipelago had me in AWE. such a layered character
Like an onion.
"we need more female characters that are not perfect, that make mistakes and can unintencionally hurt people" then they shit on paimon all day
I feel like you’re missing a lot from Yoimiya and Nilou, they have incredibly important roles in the actual plots of their region and that provides a lot of characterization. Additionally, Yoimiya running the main fireworks company for Inazuma isn’t a normal job especially in a place that places a lot of importance on fireworks, she’s a huge leader. And Nilou is a huge driving force of a rebellion of arts in country that’s oppressing its people in all respects (literally they have things that can read peoples thoughts) she’s a person people follow
Nilou is very underrated and is one of the more important characters that get overshadowed by more fleshed out ones. Also I hope Aether harem dies. I know it won't but it's such a disease and Nilou is overlooked partly because of that trend.
@@f4llenleaves yes exactly, like she has such an interesting story, I want to know more there’s depth there, but people sideline her since it’s harder to learn you gotta really dig
I think Nilou's story quest would've really benefited from her switching roles with that NPC girl
@@GanyuSimpingDegenerateI love this take, if she was the one defending the arts to her parents, I do support this idea
The Npcs in Nilou mission have more dialogues, characterization, screentime than her.
I don’t hate her, but she’s so flat and Hoyoverse do dirty to her…
I love yanfei tbh
Her backstory feels so homely and wholesome, even the nuances about her least favorite cases in her job being divorce, I like those little details. And her giving nerdy blabbermouth while still being charming and confident is just overall really refreshing to me
While there is a lot of things unexplored about her, what has already been presented is kind of enough to get me hooked
You can see how much better they got with Fontaine. Furina for instance, was designed by all women. Her clothing, her story. a woman created for women. she's the best written female character in this game.
I will say at least with Kokomi, she's very much intended to be autistic. she even uses the spoons analogy in her story quest. But I agree she needs fleshed out better.
I think the best girls are Fischl and Mona, Unreconciled Stars + Golden Apple Archipelago gave them so much exposition, they feel like they have their personalities fleshed out and they respond differently depending on their moods and those around them witch allows their secondary "tropes" (for lack of a better word) to become more present and it makes them feel more like shifting characters that have opinions that change based on there knowledge in a way that feels like how they should given what we already know.
yes yes yes!!
that event was one of the best events... i love how they actually had entire chapters and domains for each characters to flesh them out, show their backstory and motivations
really made me love xinyan, fischl, mona and kazuha more as characters and made them feel human
As a fischl main, this warms my heart
You mean klee and Alice?
@@1mol831 No, I don't.
Kokomi's design is so beautiful and I love Enkanomiya lore! I wish they could've showed (not told us) what a genius strategist she is! I would love if she could also do some morally grey things, and if she had a dangerous side, while having very clear and detailed motivations.
There was too much unclear with her and it makes me sad cause i wanted more depth on her. I remember the theories about her being one of those dragon creatures sorta because of her cons and stuff.
I want to see Vishap Kokomi tbh@@I3lueberry
I want to see Vishap Kokomi tbh@@I3lueberry
i think saying "this character doesnt show up a lot" is an unfair point; becuase there are ALOT of characters that dont show up a lot; like whens the last time we saw bennet? or xingqiu?
i also think that there needs to be a distinction in this universes writing and the in game writing because some of these characters are fucking amazing... just not in game
When was the last time Amber or Eula did anything noteworthy?
I think there is some hit and miss here. I remember Yae doing initially quite well in sales but quickly dropped off. As far as I've understood its due to her play style, an aspect that I think cannot be understated and which I sympathize with. However, I agree that the execution of the female story quests are pretty sub par compared to their lore. Kokomi was the geatest disapppintment as I love the design, her lore and playstyle and so was really looking forward to a badass general that you shouldn't underestimate on solely looks and that rivaled the Shogun almost one-to-one. Her reputation preceded her and the hype was fun... until I experienced her story. Its like she didn't deserve that reputation cause yeah... they didn't show her being cool or a genius at all. Kokomi didn't originally do well because people assumed she was just a five star barbara and dendro hadn't come out yet. I think people would have really appreciated a more badass general type. RIP.
Same, I'm fairly new to the game so people were saying I should pull for her bc she'll save my ass in battles, so I was ready to pull for Kokomi. But then I'm a lore/story enthusiast so I went and did Kokomi's quest before her 3.8 rerun, and... let's just say I purposely pull on the Wanderer's banner (I need a Faruzan anyway) so that I will not have her in my character archive. That's how much her story disappoints.
Shes my favorite character and i really do love her lore. But yeah the execution makes her kinda pitiful. And it probably amplified the people arguing how awful her char is in both gameplay and story.
The only female characters I think they did their story quests right were Deyha, Yoimiya and Ayaka.
Their quest really centered around them, especially Deyha with her father.
Also I feel the hangout events does a better job showing their lives. Faruzan's hangout is by far my favorite.
I think if Hoyo had showed how the characters go about their lives when the Traveler is not involved, I think that would have made it more interesting.
Dehya yes. Yoimiya and Ayaka ones of the most terrible quests. Ayaka's quest is personal but way too much fanservice than exploring her character. Yoimiya's quests aren't about her but more about people she helps.
ayaka? nah thats fan service
Bro dislike Nahida…
@@amberxv4777yoimiya’s quest is one of my favorites though, true she helps others but the way she helps and the journey towards the conclusion is where she shines. I guess people just have a weird perspective that yoimiya is just idk an empty character.
Don't forget Ei's second story quest. Also, I'm one of those who think that her first story quest, while having some problems, is still good overall. The traveler is basically taking a hikikimori who resist change for a trip to the outside world, he needs to show Ei that changes are not always bad.
Honestly Hu Tao is one of my favorite characters, mostly because she brings up the theme of death in an accepting and beautiful way focused on sending them away gracefully and celebrating their life
About Ayaka: it pisses me off so much that people can't pass the impression of her being a "waifu" . I coudn't understand how could they pass her very heartfelt story quest as just being a date, she collects texts from her dead mom that help her realize she can both represent the Kamisato clan and have dreams, hobbies and be her own person!!! She dances for us because we're the only ones who aren't from Inazuma, therefore it doesn't matter if she's the Shirasagi Himegimi or not, she trusts us enough to show a side of herself no one else is really able to see. And yes she has a crush on the Traveler, but the fact that she refuses to be escorted back to the mansion is already telling that she doesn't need us and knows it's pretty unlikely to be able to have a relationship with someone who's travelling the whole world.
Ayaka AND Xiao are interestingly the character that already in beta but not released at the start AND ALSO THE MOST SIMP for traveler. But why Xiao fleshed out so much more yet Ayaka written so... uh.... fanservice-y? I think this is because the difference of waifu and husbando marketing. Xiao also gave a lot of fanservice but in a different way than Ayaka.
I heard some say female likes a character more from their backstory and lore, that's why a lot of husbando are much lore relevant, while male demographic can be easily swayed with BOOBS, MOE, etc etc.
Female prefer a slower approach, that's why Xiao is written distant at first, then slowly opened up to traveler because of "I can fix him" mentality that female demographic like to have. While male demographic likes harem, the waifu simps them for no reason, like Ayaka who's already interested in traveler from the start.
Maybe because I'm female, Xiao's fanservice is much more nice because it's subtle and build up slowly, Ayaka's fanservice feels too forced
ikr, even female players can be easily swayed by cute or pretty female characters, bc of the "slay queen" and "look at her she's my daughter UWU" mentality (not saying yall wrong, it's perfectly cool). Xiao's fanservice is so nice that I don't even consider it fanservice, it's just who he is and how his and the traveller's relationship should be. I mean, the traveller has the ability to lighten the effects of Xiao's karmic debt so it's logical for Xiao to want to be around lol. Meanwhile Ayaka... she's cute and elegant so it's ok for me, but girl, we just met, we JUST met.
@@floofrules Agree, females can love female characters too, but some female characters are really marketed for male audiences only, and that's what I see from many female characters before Sumeru. Personally, I think Sumeru has the best cast so far. I'm a bit worried about Fontaine because the teaser gives Inazuma vibes, I hope I'm wrong
I think you have good point. I think it's about the difference in how they create character to try and appeal to each markets.
It's probably why there's lots of fanfiction with relatively more depths catered to women compared to men.
It's also probably why there's lots of adult material & art, all with shallow depth while focusing more on appearance, catered to men but none for women.
Also, I don't think you need to worry about Fontaine despite the trailer. It may be similar arc but I believe they've learned a lot since game's released. I see quite a few development direction that seem to be a result of taking in feedback, like how main quests are longer to flesh it out more after Inazuma one was rushed,
This is why Xiao's fanservice was bad, and Ayaka's was good. Fan service should feel like fan service
LMFAO “I can fix him mentality”… you’re not wrong though
Dehya’s story interested me quite a bit. There were some big flaws in the writing but I felt like most of those don’t come from her gender despite being a female mercenary being rather important to the subtext.
But my favorite female characters scene - yes just a scene - for me will always be Collei talking with Sucrose.
But just saying… Itto is best girl, prolly always will be.
The problem is not that these characters lack depth or complexity. It’s that said depth and complexity is tucked somewhere in a text most player never even read.
Navia is here and she's written pretty well
Dehya is pretty well written I think.
The weakness of character writing in genshin makes me finally understand why people have headcanons
I’m glad someone is talking about this my own favorite female character is Sucrose due to many elements but when talking about other girls I like and their lore role I find many to be repetitive like Kokomi being my favorite Inazuma character but she barely did anything and is ultimately workaholic which is fine for her duty but not properly explored, then you have Ei who I liked only as playable character but never understood her story endgame due to travel forgiving her for all the crap she pulled on her own people which made her very unattractive antagonist.
i think with the male and female characters, hoyo is taking 2 different approaches. male characters are actually characters. hoyo wants male players to want to be them/roll for them because of baddassery. to do that, they have to actually write them good. for the female characters, they are fanservicey because they are male otome characters that are supposed to be coddled so their story quest is supposed to feel like a date and have a lot of traveller simpilng moments??? it's weird now the non-simpy female characters are more fleshed out, because hoyo knows not everyone wants them out of waifu reasons so they can't skimp on the character building. ie. you can't make nahida simp after traveller in a story quest and call it a day, like ew. so they had to actually write a story quest for her.
funny thing is that it makes it technically so bi since nothing changes when you choose lumine so my lil sapphic self is always happy for it but there IS such a bias. Lisa could def be the prime example of this
This could be it, and also female players tend to care A LOT about personality and all for male characters, and are generally more ok with female characters just be cute/pretty/badass/sexy in appearance. Which... I find kinda strange? It's just based on MY observation tho, so I could be misled to think this way.
Good point, I also felt that if the male characters aren't cool, people would pull them less.
@@floofrules it's because female players don't feel threatened by the existence of cute/sexy/flirty/fanservice female characters. At most they roll their eyes and move on, so devs know they won't get backslash by making fanservicey, semi-naked women flirt with the MC, because even women who don't care for it will simply just skip/not pay much attention and move on, knowing not everything has to appeal to them.
However, certain male players start yelling and crying if a male character is even remotely flirty because they feel like their masculinity is being questioned if a guy flirts with their male MC lmao. Remember what happened when Thomas's hangout came out and a lot of CN male players got mad as HELL that he holds Aether's hand and teaches him to knit or whatever because it was too gay. Smh.
@@monemoriAh yes what a classic, fragile masculinity (aka insecure) and homophobia.
Still, I love how they got angry for that yet they were not the target audience in the first place, man is Nice Guy™️ to fanservice the girls.
I remember cringing so hard with the whole wet socks thing...
I'm still not crazy over Ayaka but I thought about it for a while and I think her crush on the mc being a main part of her character is totally valid. It's a crush that makes sense if you look at it through the lense of her character.
It would get old and unrealistic if every playable character has a crush on the mc BUT it would be equally unrealistic if no one did. I mean most people out there have at least 1 Simp in their lives.
Glad to see someone talking about Ayaka's 'crush'!! I also think it wasn't all that out-of-character! Ayaka is unused to being this close with people outside her household (Ayato, Thoma etc) so it makes sense that she'd be extra dazzled by the normal friendship-concern that MC extends to nearly every playable character. I don't have a problem with that, but the main issue should be the fanservice *becoming* her character, not the fanservice itself... I mean, it's inevitable after all. As long as she has a personality outside of that, there isn't a big problem.
Yeah.. I hate the fact that people keep making her a literal yandere
My personal hot take overall is tragic character backstory cannot be your only saving characterization; something reliant for majority of the men and women in the game. I studied writing and with a lot of media people end up trying to only write tragic pasts to make the characters interesting or seem more nuisance, often without the goals of exploring the topics further either with instantly resolving/absolving negative character traits or by using the past to make them seem cuter. Now, my point does lend itself to both male and female characters but I find the issues does feel much more intense with the female characters with some really great examples with Raiden, Furina, Scara, and Dori.
To put in perspective it's one thing I like when trauma based characters and tragic pasts don't always make you better people; sad pasts can make people jadded, mean, rough, and hurt others. Raiden was such a great example of this-- someone who was hurt and it caused her to lock herself away and punish those around her even if she did so thinking it had good. Raiden was horrible and there is little to excuse what she put Inazuma though both from the land and the people, even if we understand why she did it. Really I find Raiden to be a great example of when this problem with characters became so apparent to me because so much of the resolution to Raiden's arc felt rushed and her abolement of her crimes lends no use to the future of the game which honestly really fucking sucks writing wise. It limited her character and to me rather than ever giving her a proper redemption for me to accept her from the Archon quest it became this stain to what could have been an arc of growth, healing, and showing how to be better from the damaged she caused. Even while I get aspects like she can't cook are meant to be a point of seeing how she locked herself away it feels like a chance for fandom to woobify her actions and lead to the easy forgetfulness of what was the tragedy of the Inazuma quest. I get the other ones have dark or sad elements, but Inazuma's lore in game is brutal and to have it feel forgotten by the quick saving of Raiden for her sales to do well feels cheap. It's not good. This issue is only constantly carried out in the rest of her writing.
So when Scara 'redemption' came around I feel the same way. Wanderer's history being wiped and no one recalling is just as cheap. It's honestly something I find just lazy as it means so little of Wandered has to genuinely make amends and confront his past to grow from it-- the plot is missing honestly some of the most interesting arcs they could have done if they found a better way to show Scara's growth. Renaming the Wanderer could have been a genuine step forward of showing tragic pasts are apart of you; Scara does not just get to move on from who he was and where he came from but it only worked if others know that growth too. Where Wanderer differs though is he isn't a better person now-- he's brash, rude, and overall a negative person which makes him interesting. Whether you like Wanderer or not, there isn't some massive shift between who he was and is, despite how we got there and my distaste Wanderer still feels unique to the crowd. The edginess isn't like Xiao giving players a new feeling of a fresh air that despite Hoyo's team taking arguably a weak way into 'redemption' unlike Raiden we didn't fully lose the character people wanted.
This leads me to my personal dislike of how they ended Fontaine, as I agree the writing and pacing has gotten better but not the handling of possible routes and topics. Furina much like Raiden was very split until the end having a bratty and honestly somewhat haughty in the godlike status; something that made her fun and unique. Our first active in society god and potentially highlighting what that type of status does to a person to be openly worshipped like a celebrity. The justice and prison system paired with weird laws and this tension of not only the rising water but rocky relationship between traveler and her truly felt engaging even if I felt she had unlikable aspects. The concepts of morality, justice, and being human in Fontaine were so strongly laid out and I think was super engaging but pulled out too much by dumping Furina into just a tragic backstory and overtly 'sweet/not a bad person' much like Raiden. All of her bad traits were instantly absolved by calling it her playing a character and whatever damage/lack of accountability she had for people/justice system felt pointless now to make her honestly feel no different than any other fem character as tragedy is all that overshadows anything else about her to make her fun. I even personally have my own take on how the story could have ended in a similar way while keeping a bratty, celebrity-godlike childish attitude that Furina has to grow from while redeeming her with the Fontaine citizens after the last quest and still bring up the morality of Fontaine's system/culture; hell it even could have included her breaks in characters and playing a role while still making her someone who has/responsible for bad things. Actively it sucks to me what I found made Furina an interesting character felt so lost because Genshin needs to make the fem characters likable and perfect enough to sell.
See-- Genshin knows most of the men will sell because players want male characters; the lack of many means a big piece of the fanbase are desperate for any of them making it so they can play around with traits and emotions much more. And to me male characters are likely to gain a solid fanbase regardless of morality or being good/bad without needing to be saved because Scara was hugely popular before his redemption arc, i'd argue in my social circles even more so. But the split vote on fem characters means a chance of huge profit loss and keeping them all delegated into boxes saves any risk of losing out which in reality only damages characters. It's why I do think Dori is the perfect example. I don't like Dori and that's a good thing; she does actively shitty things while being playable and even with her tragic past she isn't played as if that makes her better. Much like the appeal I said it makes her worse and in the sea of characters that puts her in a memorable spot, and something fun for the writing. But her dislike and how people play/talk about her prove to me fem characters esp 5* won't get the same reception or treatment like male characters being acceptable in any form. Overall genshin writing team has a problem and a crutch in character arcs that I find just kinda is boring but it really sucks on how it's to me impacting how fem characters have to be presented.
Well said. The inequality between male character and female character writing (and visual design) is glaring, particularly in the 5-star money makers. I love Wanderer even though he's a shit because he started out a shit and he stayed a shit. Yae Miko starts out as a shit and stays a shit and she's quite an entertaining character. She's one of my husband's favorite characters in part because she's such a snot and doesn't automatically love the Traveler. That's also why Rosaria (personality-wise, not appearance-wise) feels refreshing because locking eyes with the main character wasn't love at first sight... and she's still *cold* towards us, pun fully intended.
@@qi2li2n_prance well and some other things that we can see with Yae is she has sad elements to her story but it’s not the defining feature. When I think of Yae, the few sad elements to her backstory are not what I inherently think of which makes her feel as if her past isn’t the only factor of her arcs that make her substantial. In fact Yae’s past is probably the last thing I think of with her character and the reality is for many of the characters it’s only because of knowing their past people care for them- because the little substance they have boils down to sad past = interesting character which isn’t true. Yae is fully realized as a character with someone how came from somewhere but isn’t locked into that history to tell us who she is, rather we see her actions upfront to give us the information we need even if that isn’t always good or kind or ‘right.’
Thank you for putting in words what I felt about Ei's and Wanderer's boring, lazy fixes to their respective story arcs. Instead of what could have been really cool and interesting true redemption arcs that could have given us probably years of content with developments, fallbacks, and maybe even reconciliation of both of them at the end of their journey.
And I don't get it! They built that dual story of hurting others because they were hurt from so long back in Genshin's actual world story building. Scaramouche was the antagonist of the first major event ever, and they had multiple years to built up to that really nice climax in Sumeru. And then they did this.
Really glad they kept his personality, though. I think I would have barfed at a nice and kind Wanderer.
How do you feel about The Knave? She’s going to be playable eventually and (unless they change her) she’s absolutely reprehensible as a person and is noted by several characters not to be trustworthy. Her entire schtick seems to be that of the Wolf in Sheep’s clothing.
@@UnhappytimeaperMiko is one of my favorite characters because she unapologetically screws with people, even her character quest has her ripping the traveler off as she uses their cut of the book they wrote to pay for a very expensive meal.
Yeah, hoyo's way of storytelling and delivery really is my biggest pet-peeve as someone who plays for the story and characters, a lot of it is hidden behind the wall of texts you mentioned, be it in the character's profile, or even worse, cryptically scattered around in artifact lore. I wouldn't have an issue about written stories/artifact description stuff if it wasn't hiding like, _essencial_ information about the character. I found out only recently that Yelan is technically a disabled character?? She specifies in one of her profile spoken lines that she has a genetic condition that runs in her family that gives her a lot of fatigue all the time; she says she has to manage her energy for a mission, so she won't exhaust herself. Like HOW is that not mentioned anyhwere else lol.
I finally understood her idle line where she goes "This blinding sunlight is such a pain, I can't take a nap on this weather", it always felt a bit out of place (Yelan is not the "sleepy" type of character like Ganyu or Layla), but knowing she has some kind of chronic fatigue really gives another vibe to that. Not to mention, it is pretty cool to have a badass like Yelan to be a canonically disabled character! And like, this is only one example I can think of (I could go on a full rant about Raiden, who is my fave, and the amounts of disservice this type of "storytelling" does to her)
That small bit of context explains way too much about Yelan. I love her but I could never really get with her constant complaining about the weather. That knowledge transformed idle complaints into restless frustration
Her frustration is chronic
We had a whole ass story quest and an archon quest where she's front and center. The latter even had everyone feeling unique time dilation effects. They had the perfect opportunity to build her character. Actually have us build a connection and they just ... didn't. They just didn't
I feel they could rectify that if they had the character stories be something you could ask the characters about in the tea pot instead of having to awkwardly pause the game to read a wall of text.
@@Shogun_A.I. I know right?? I literally learned that info when I was all and about on Twitter and I saw someone discussing about that, and how they identified a lot with Yelan's chronic condition, they printed the actual line from the profile page. SO much made a lot of sense. Yelan also mentions she's actually pretty chill, lives outside the city and has a peaceful personal daily life when she isnt working, which is SUCH a contrast to her spy / femme fatale persona. I quite like how she can be both at the same time! But of course, we only see the "sexy dom" side of her bc of reasons we all know very well.
Like the other person mentioned in the replies, we could have that kind of information with the character in the teapot, since the lines are already all recorded anyway with the VAs acting. Another idea - having these playable characters chilling in the map, maybe only during specific times of the day, in places they are supposed to be at (ex: Hu Tao in front of the funeral parlor, Yae Miko at the Narukami shrine, etc), or in places mentioned in birthday letters, when they tell us to "meet there later". A lot of potential great ideals to expand our bonds with all these characters! Even more when Hoyo definitely has favorites (Itto showing up for like the 3rd time in a row now), while so many other characters are banished to the shadow realm (like Raiden Shogun??? hello??? lol)
About Ayaka, Nilou and Kokomi having a crush on traveler is just an interpretation, in Nilou I personally never saw that, in Kokomi is a maybe and Ayaka is more obvious but stil interpretational, like people and their ships, and yandere Ayaka was the result of that infamous Ayaka eternal banner in 2.6, is a meme that's so good to ignore it.
Also, people don't like workaholic waifus? Then why Noelle is the only character with 2 date sim quest? Also that is a real example of a character having a crush on traveler, and don't feel out of place because Noelle is not a character with high power (politically), is just a young girl who want to be a knight of favonious and found somebody kind enough to make her have a good time.
Read nilous voice lines
I kind of feel like they write male characters better because they still think guys won't naturally sell for some reason whilenthe girls, they almost exclusively go tropes and fan service because that's the expectation in games like this.
Exactly :(
The whole game is full of tropes, it isn't exclusive to the characters.
@@muai tropes are normal and unavoidable, i think op meant that they're a cardboard cutout clichee of a trope and little beyond it
@@Parrotcat It isn't exclusive to female characters; Razor, Chongyun, Itto, Xingqui, Bennett, and Kazuha are examples of male characters who do not have a lot of character depth.
@@muai Id actually disagree on all of those, they all have unique and complex backstories. The only reason they may feel like they lack depth is bc they don't show up in the story too often/or haven't shown up in the story in a long while. Compare them to female characters with similar rarity and story relevance.
That being said I saw your other comment and thought it was an astronomically bad take, that I cannot see myself agreeing to or being convinced of, therefore i do not wish to discuss this further with you.
I came from Fontaine and I believe we can all agree that Navia's the best written female character so far right?? Maybe Nahida or Shenhe reach her level
agreed fukky
Navia is the only good character in Fontaine so far, yes.
@@justanobunagafanboy799All other Fontaine characters aren't bad tho?? We just don't know as much about them yet since the act 1 archon quest focused on lyney's trial, while the 2nd one focused on Navia's story. Neuvillette is hinted to being an even more interesting character and its probably gonna be more highlighted later on. Furina as well.., and Lyney and Lynette are also great characters too. Clorinde is the only one that so far seems a bit generic.
I'd rate Nahida higher, but yeah, Navia is great. Shenhe's quest was rushed so much there was scarcely anything left of it, aside from a nice animation, so no contest there. It's an arc with only the start, the ending and some backstory recited to you.
@@justanobunagafanboy799Nope. You're alone there. Neuvilette, Lyney/Lynette, and even Furina have had great expositions, and really that's everything you can ask from the game this early on.
You can't expect them to be fully fleshed out not having the full archon and their story quests.
There's a few things I'd like to say about this vid.
1. I'd personally say that what you mentioned is actually the exception and not the norm.
The workaholic 'waifus' for example. I'd say that Jean, Keqing and Ganyu have great to fairly good character quest, that explore their character enough. Kokomi is the exception here, having a terrible story quest.
I think Ganyu's story quest was good, because it discussed her troubles about being in the human world, and concludes with her wanting to stay in the city, despite her initial inner conflict.
Other characters that I do agree have a bad story quest are Raiden and Nilou, although I think that Nilou as a character is a well written woman, it is indeed not shown in her story quest. Which is really unfortunate.
2. You mentioned how people didn't like Miko because she was mean, but I've researched this a bit and this just seems to be a very small, vocal minority. By far most people like her. (Although sometimes for the wrong reasons)
Same thing goes for Ayaka. Most people actually do appreciate Ayaka for who she actually is. The yandere Ayaka is a terrible mischaracterisation indeed, but luckily this is something that's only coming from a horny and vocal minority.
3. A lot of things you said can also be said about male characters. Especially from the early game.
Take Diluc and Kaeya for example. They both have extremely interesting characters and backstories, but this barely comes back in the game.
Because of this both of them get terribly mischaracterised by the fandom, unless they've read the manga AND their lore.
I think overall the problem stems from bad story quest writing in general, not bad character writing. Luckily this has been improving slightly, both for female and male characters.
I think Aster made a great point using Ganyu as a example in her video about female character writing
The reason I dislike Yae is not because she's mean to traveler lol
If this was the only reason, I would love her, cause I like her vibe overall
The reason I personally dislike her is because she tends to bully people who are weaker/have less power then her + also provides terrible conditions for her workers
Ngl I would love to see more morally ambiguous female characters in genshin. I adore them and I also adore the badass queens in games, like holy shit I’m asexual but I’d be up to smash- 🥰
I also love and hate waifus depending on how their written since I write stories for fun. Some characters just aren’t written in a way that makes them good at being a waifu or such. Not every character is a cutesy UwU / help I’m overworked 🥺 / adorably bubbly and I’d love to see more unique female characters in genshin that aren’t perfect generic waifu material.
Well... Ei, Yae Miko and Dori are amongst those morally ambiguous females and yet they're hated for it.
@@kevinclement1533let’s get dori out of here, she’s a (very annoying) kid, that doesn’t count as waifu
@@Javu7254 Isn't Dori an adult who's just short?
@@GummyDinosaursify im not sure, but if she was, then I think she would have the teen model
I think she’s like idk a kid, but definitely less than 12
@@Javu7254 im ngl, dori is the ONLY character with the "female child" model that i can actually see as an adult and not, like, a child (in personality). she gives off weird wine aunt vibes
Overall I would say this a great video despite the dishonest title. That is not a criticism as I get how youtube works you have to be provoke people with your titles to get attention its sad as I think some will dismiss good points made in this video as they will dismiss it right away.
With the points I agree with such as Ganyu and Kokomi its so hard to add anything further I think you did a fantastic summary here and I have nothing more to add.
Negatives
Sorry I will be writing more negative commentary but don't take that as me disliking the video but some criticism to help in the future.
1st: I think a lot of what has shaped your thoughts rather than the game's presentation of the character is the parts of the Genshin community you spend time in. I can tell you that my Genshin community loves Yae Miko and its a mix of men and women and not all men are into women that simp for the traveller after meeting them right away. Also in my community Scara is the most hated character not any female character because all of your critcisms aimed towards females in this video are amplified up to eleven in Scara. I try not to let my community influence how I see characters its not easy though so I don't blame you for it.
2nd: Unfortunately a lot of your criticism towards the female characters in this video which I agree with also applies to male characters as well. Also we have reached an age of entertainment where characters can only have so many variable archetypes before they become similar or tropes. I am old enough at my age where it is almost impossible to find a truly original character. Nearly every male character is a trope as well and despite the community's love for Zhong Li he too is also a trope. Some of his writing isn't well done either simply because we have met character too early into the story that knows too much so for the sake of the plot has to stay silent on some very crucial information. Also Zhong Li is very morally questionable as he had the power to stop the escalation with Childe and ultimately his inaction got many human Li Yue soldiers killed. I love Zhong Li he is one of my favorite characters but just pointing out he is not without his own flaws.
3rd: A very minor criticism but I guess this is because you didn't want the video to run too long but you never really got around to discussing Yomiya in depth and I feel you overlooked some serious flaws in characters like Yae and Kokomi. Such as when you do the world quests you realize that Kokomi is a truly terrible strategist that couldn't even stop her own side from being tricked into creating the thunder storm that ruined possibly hundreds to thousands of people's lives just so they could win the war. I think its clear none of the Hoyoverse writers know military strategy well and they should hire someone to fix that. As Kokomi really does need to be shown to be a great strategist not everyone telling us she is and no winning a card game doesn't count Hoyo lol. Also Yae neglecting her most important duty of keeping the Sakura tree purified it got so bad the tree nearly exploded.
4th: The biggest criticism which you yourself address in this video. Not all female characters are bad or in a terrible state its just some of them are a massive problem and you did a fantastic job summing this up.
Sorry about the wall of text I will do a TLDR here if you don't have the time. I think the video is great overall and can't thank you enough for bringing attention to these issues. I do think your hyper focus on only females being bad is a result of most likely being a mostly female Genshin community I used to be as well and your perspective on things can really change when you get hear both male and female opinions. I would suggest exploring outside of your community to get a different perspective as can be very toxic in certain parts and they will influence how you feel as well.
Male characters certainly have similar problems too. Would love to see a more in depth dive to certain characters if you have the time. Finally not all female characters have this problem so I think the title of the video is unfair but I understand why you did it because you need people to click on your video. Loved the video so thank you so much.
This was really insightful! Thanks for watching & for the detailed feedback, I appreciate it :)
the part about the community you are apart of influencing your opinion on characters is certainly true. did you know wanderer is probably the most hated character in china and it isn't even close? i would love to see a follow up video like this with some male characters(although i don't think males reuse tropes as much as females do)
damn this must be one the MOST respectful criticisms I've seen in internet
About the whole morally ambiguous part... i feel the need to note that people love them.
Diluc kills people for the sake of Mondstadt , Kaeya constantly puts his allies lives in danger and has some really questionable loyalties.. Ningguang is a billionaire beurocrat that believes that zero sum games are the best.
Ei and Sara were upholding a dictatorship and harming people so not exactly morally ambiguous..
And Child almost killed thousands if not millions of people because it was "his job?" , like for who is this ambiguous Cthulhu the Great Old One?
People have reservations about playing with characters that have commited evil with Scara being the only exception since he is literarly non-human thus can be expected to be more grey.. and people love it.
As for the female characters, we do get strong gals but it is true that they somewhat undermine their strength to make them cute like Beidou in her hangout quest... Like why would a 25+ year old pirate lady blush about being flirty..
The girls in genshin have A LOT of potential to be great my personal favorites : Jean,Lisa,Eula,Yelan,Beidou,Candace,Dehya all of them strong and confident with just hints of weakness to humanise them.
This.
I would never like Childe for everything he does. Imagine saying that about a real life war criminal, " he was just doing his job"
Other argument with Childe is that he loves his family. Okay so? That's not something would redeem anyone, more actually from his behavior in the story quest he's just enabling his brother to be a brat.
I think the reason for the hate with some of the morally ambiguous characters is not the characters themselves but how the traveller interacts with them.
If only there was a Hoyoverse game with feamle characters that don't base their personality about interacting with a good awful self insert *cof cof
Most of the reason why Ei was hated is because of the rush writing in Inazumas Archon Quest .
Also what the fuck ?! "Ei is getting hated on by the community "
Are you sure what you are talking about ! Ei is one of the most liked characters in thus game and has broken many banners records .
"People have reservations about playing with characters that have commited evil with Scara being the only exception since he is literarly non-human thus can be expected to be more grey.. and people love it."
I feel like this is wrong. There's 2 reasons in my opinion why Scaramouche seems to be received better.
1) We are not gaslit in the game. We literally watched Childe try to drown a nation, we witness the war that Raiden was upholding to maintain her "right" to slaughter a minority... And then we get to the character story quest and we are basically told it wasn't so bad. It's brushed off, not addressed, and minimized, or blamed on someone else ("he was doing it for the fatui" "she was lied to" "she was sad her sister died!" etc)
Scaramouche's interlude doesn't do this, in fact, it does the opposite. We are reminded VERY CLEARLY by Wanderer that what he did WAS evil, Nahida even SAYS literally "you were evil."
2) He wants/takes accountability. When he finds out that Dottore killed his family to get to him, he decides immediately that he wants to erase himself to save them. Of course, we know irminsul doesn't work like that, but he doesn't. He expected that the past would be changed, his found family would be saved from Dottore... But they weren't. He made the choice to get his evil memories back, and upon remembering what he did, he tells us to tell Kazuha that he was the one who ruined the Kaedehara clan. He even accepts that Kazuha may try to kill him. He ACCEPTS and EXPECTS consequences....
Unlike Childe and Raiden, who give nothing but excuses.
it's not simply "Scaramouche is non-human, so evil is okay" Scaramouche was evil and took steps (albeit misguided steps) to rectify that.
Genshin is the definition of missed opportunity when it comes to stuff like this. Worst part is, Hoyo KNOWS how to write amazing, morally ambiguous, complex characters if you look at almost anyone in HI3, but they choose NOT to. And the reasons why they do that are apparent, which makes it even sadder.
Personally I love Yae Miko and her genius mean girl personality. Every time she shows up in an event and starts messing with other people it's very entertaining.
I also think 'letting go' of Childe being war criminal scum just because he's a husbando character or whatever is hardcore simping, even if he 'was just doing his job.' If your job makes you perform heinous acts and you just kind of go along with it then you're obviously a heinous person. And it's fine to have villainous characters be playable but FFS just accept that they are bad people and stop trying to justify what they do just because you like them. Alhaitham is also a dick.
Tell me you haven't read his story without telling me you haven't read his story.
Childe is not a ""war criminal scum"", he quite literally cannot quit this line of work and was traumatized beyond recognition when he fell into the abyss. This doesn't justify his actions in any way, shape or form, but the problem the person in the video points out is that the fandom is way too quick in demonizing characters while ignoring context. God forbid we have morally ambiguous people in this game.
@@rivergoeson5607 Committing war crimes makes you a war criminal. His actions are unjustifiable and he isn't 'morally gray' as he will quite literally kill innocent people to get what he wants. There is nothing wrong with having evil characters in the game but simping for him doesn't change that he is in fact a self-centered scumbag.
Fully agree with the person who replied before me. Plus what he tried to do didn't succeed anyways, ppl like you act like he actually sunked Liyue when he only tried to. Add to that, it was also part of Signora and Zhongli's plan lmao. Plus, he single handedly hard carried Fontaine, if it wasn't for him Fontaine was done for, since even pre power up Neuvillette couldn't do shit against that whale. Doesn't matter if he actually was trying to save Fontaine or not, what matters is it is true that he played an very important role in terms of saving Fontaine. Pretty sure that is more then enough to replenish his "mass murder attempt" or whatever you call it. And Alhaitham being a dick? Since when? Dude pulled out his massive braincells and played an fairly important role for saving Nahida and Sumeru. He is a part of the gang who saved a whole region, how is he a dick??? Heck he even saved 30+ppl in his story quest from "the Hive". If Alhaitham wasn't Alhaitham, those people were all done for. Dude saved so many people, it's obvious he is someone who will take action just to save and help other people. And you think he doesn't care about others and is a dick? HECK he is even letting Kaveh living in his own house, where does that goes, eh? He look like a dick in your eyes only because you're dumb and he's too big brain for you lmao. He does act like someone who don't give a fuck and is a self centered jerk, but in reality in the most important time he is the very few who will actually save the day. The well written characters will always be controversal, and is for the ones who have actual logical thinking. Take it or leave it.
Hell nah, I hate Yae Miko and her female fans. Alhaitham and Childe are hot though, so they are excused.
Personally, I HATE Yae Miko, her personality is just too annoying for me. I hate such selfish people. Or in this case yokai.
Navia really was a middle finger to your video 💀
I see Keqing as more than a workaholic waifu. Reading her lore and knowing she questions a lot about gods and religion and talks about adapting and moving on to a modern era speaks to me personally. I find it interesting and it makes me love the little things about her more like buying rex lapis figurines lol. (I am bias because i have the keqing keyboard and she is my first 5 star) Ganyu clearly feels like she's lonely despite having ties to both humans and adepti in her blood though I do wish we get more story quests for her in general because I feel like the memes surrounding her detract the fandom of who she really is. Kokomi was just wasted potential so i have nothing to add other than she's cute and her kit is underrated. I quite like Ayaka and Yoimiya's story quest because to me I get to know their character. Lots of people cried during Ayaka's story quest and Yoimiya's second quest was beautiful ( I liked her before the second quest). As for Miko, I personally haven't heard of anyone not liking her personality (maybe because I don't go on genshin social media often, lucky me) I find her mischievous side hot and she can degrade me anytime and I still will come back 👀 (fr tho I find miko really funny overall) I like this video overall and appreciate hearing different opinions even tho I personally didn't agree with some of the points
I think a problem is that the characters, nearly all of them are more. Keqing is more, Ganyu is more, Kokomi [kinda] is more, Yomiya, Nilou, Ayaka, Miko, etc. They all have more to them but the game does not allow it. They in fact rarely show it rather instead opt to tell us and play into troupes of them that will gain the most validation from fandom and troupes. Because even from Ganyu's soft spoken-ness to Miko playful teasing there is more to why and how they are written that feels denied by how Genshin chooses to present the information in the overall story in favor of sidelining them for better favored moments that would gain attention. The derailing of characters, yes, mainly comes from the fandom but Hoyo's writing does nothing to favor this or the characters that makes them feel meaningful to me in a lot of their scenes. Many characters have this problem too, such as Ayato it just feels like there is a specific reason as to why Hoyo does this heavy handedly to the women more than some of the male characters.
@@Unhappytimeaper besides Kokomi I don’t see it that way. I feel like there is everything we need to know about everyone but im not opposed to get more of them. Raiden, ayaka, yomiya and so on already gave me what i needed for the overall lore
Your talking about a game where the lead character says 3-4 words a year. I think the 'writing' in general needs work before you worry about individual characters xD.
Some Genshin ladies also have a bad case of being Mary Sue-ish, which is sad given that I feel like they all have potential to be just as compelling as, say, Kaeya, who has an interesting personality that’s caused by a complex backstory. Seems like the Genshin male charas in general have more thought get put into showcasing interesting character personalities :/
Ayaka's costume event gave me so much psychic damage because of the fanservice like hoyo PLEASE STOP DOING MY GIRLIE DIRTY PLEASE
IKRRR😭😭
I thought it was pretty Ok.
If you don't count the obvious shipping they were doing with the Traveler.
There's litteraly 0 fanservice wtf
@@flyingorange2482 did you play the quest? the amount of traveller simping and stuff like that was crazy
@@SilverHime Traveler doesn't simpo for anyone, what do you mean 💀
Of the first few, I like Jean the most. She's both likeable an relatable. She got a position way too early without any guidance.
Kokomi would have a lot to offer from a narrative point of view, but she's badly written. It's just played for the jokes that she's got no clue and that she needs to recharge, but if you really think about it, it would be a nightmare for most: you have no clue, but everyone expects you to be the genius that saves them and you need to act accordingly, as moral is almost everything... Plus, what they really forgot about is the burden of her decisions. Most of us would really struggle to select who to fire, but she has to make decisions that keep getting people killed, be it in her favour or against her favour...
My favourite characters are Hu Tao and Yae Miko. Both are probably bad waifus IRL as they're hard to read, morally ambiguous and manipulative... Hu Tao is an interesting case in that she cares about other people, but displays a level of Machiavellianism and an inability to emotionally connect to other people. The latter has two interpretations depending on the scenes involved, she may appear either somewhat on the ASSD or the ASPD. One moment she's socially awkward and in the next it appears more that she straight-up lacks empathy... This ambiguity about them makes them so interesting to watch and interact with. In the case of Yae, it's also that she can be scary at times. Still, the game The Witcher 3 did a much better job with morally ambiguous characters and also characters that are downright scary...
You know this game has a problem when Jeht (A recolored NPC) has more character to her... well... character than the great majority of playable characters
what upsets me the most about kokomi is the amount of potential she had and they just WASTED it.
i appreciate Miko as a character so much she´s one of my favourite characters and my main. I like that she feels like her own person and and isn´t just for shits n giggles. She feels more "real" to reality especially with the "does only things she can benefit from" like that´s the most real shit. It´s almost scary how unnaturally "nice" some of the characters are.
I also really like Xingyan as a character ...it is such a bummer everything is locked behind a limited-time events
UUUUH I´m also REALLY looking forward to Alice. I hope they don´t screw her up bc if you look into her lore she is the biggest fucking troll of Teyvat and just overall a fun but also mysterious character
Maybe it’s just me, but I feel like characterization and writing is more of mixed a big. Especially in hangouts. Faruzan, Beidou, Layla, and even Noelle feel more engaging and dynamic than characters like Heizou, Ayato, Diluc, and Al Haitham.
Yoimiya’s first and second quest rebuttals the theme of eternity into something that’s actually positive while showing off her personality.
As for Ayaka, I always felt like really devalue her character and quest. Her fondness of the traveler is directly linked to the fact we live a life she always dreamed of and by the end she makes peace with how it will never truly be hers and that’s okay because she and the traveler live their lives resolved to help what’s important to them and would never choose differently. Personally I think it’s sweet because through the traveler, Ayaka has an avenue to somewhat be apart of that dream and gain a connection far removed from her daily life. Any young adult would cherish a connection like that.
Genuinely interested to hear you talk about Yelan's story quest because all i remember from playing it was veing bored and dissatisfied that i didnt learn much about her. As i played it i rmr feeling like it was another, lets help her do her job storyline.
Right? For me personally it was a kinda boring quest about some random npc. I agree that Yelan is a pretty interesting character with some nice lore (e.g. her story with Pantalone), but her story quest wasn’t that good for me.
I think yelans story quest is to know how mysterious she is
I do agree, but hear me out. Nearly all genshin characters have very shallow and bad writing, they are mostly just gimmicks one thing and that's it. I get why but still kinda sad, also i've been playing since 1.0 so don't come here and tell me the whole they get story and better writing from the events. Which is somehwat true.
I think that people want a morally ambiguous female character to be more like Revi from Black Lagoon (rude, aggressive, arrogant, cocky with a flimsy moral code) rather than someone who just feels like an inconvenience in an every day life (Dori and Yae being good examples)
Revy is also a sadist.
Wow.
So apparently, this girls either don't exist or don't matter, or you just look at what you want to see:
- Fischl is an insecure self aware chuuni, very tough on herself, we've seen her cry.
- Keqing has no friends, she had to befriend an adepti (Ganyu) for heck's sake, literally the people she is sworn against kind of.
- Shenhe is very possibly a murderous psycho that can barely contain herself.
- Yelan is covert ops, she probably has killed or seen die many, in fact that's probably the reason she is that in the first place.
- The hole Raiden arc.
- Hu Tao is a mischeavous weirdo that noone wants to be around except for the literal oldest archon. The more you know of her the more you realize her sadness.
- Ayaka is an isolated princess with practically no life outside her family responsabilities.
- Yae is basically alone. No other youkai that we know of. Her only friend is a self-locked leader of a country.
- Sara lives for her job and loyalty, she's a soldier.
- Lumine is literally fighting for a doomed race and home, that being Khaenriah. (although this applies to any of the twins).
- Faruzan lost her entire family, friends and life to time.
- Collei was taken and experimented on by Dottore as a child, she is still afraid of herself and others.
- Any of the Fatui women, now we also have Arlecchino.
- Rosaria's entire story and personality.
- Dori is a black market merchant.
- Chevreuse's dad almost made her dead. She was a from a neighbourhood full of criminals and is now a high ranking police officer.
Those are the ones that come to mind. I you don't see it, it's because you don't want to. But ultimately it's up to interpretation. You don't like it. Fine.
I think the huge problem isn't the lack of variety. It's that most of these females lack the screentime to actually show off these personalities and different traits. They all feel like one off gimmicks that we barely see ever again. ALL of them have interesting ideas to explore but they never get a chance to truly shine. It wasn't until Fontaine that the females characters (outside of Chlorinde) actually had a chance to fully shine. Most of the interesting stuff about them is either in character stories or limited time events, rarely ever in the archon quests.
When was the last time Sara was ever significant or seen outside of her devotion to Raiden? Outside of her 1 archon quest, what role has Shenhe played? Most of the interesting parts of Collei's story is in the manga, which a lot of people don't even know exists. Her other major appearance was in the limited 3.5 and 3.8 events. Signora's entire lore is behind an artifact set and not in the overarching story at all. If you haven't read it, you would think she's just a typical evil bad guy. Ayaka had little presence in Inazuma despite being the face of the region after Raiden. Most people see Dori as an evil gremlin without understanding why she's obsessed with mora. It's because her sister died and they couldn't afford the medicine she needed. This is locked behind her character story, and like artifact sets, most don't bother to read it. She's an exception at the moment, but Chevreuse's entire interaction is locked behind a limited event. The biggest parts of the story that Keqing was in was with the Moonchase Festival and the 2.4 Lantern Rite, BOTH limited time events. Fischl's entire involvement in the story is also completely locked behind limited time events from Unreconciled Stars and GAA 2.8. Arlecchino is shaping to be an interesting character, but she still has little screentime thus far. Rosaria's only appearance in permanent content is in Albedo's story quest. Hu Tao hadn't even appeared in many events until 3.4 Lantern Rite, and all the interesting stuff about her is AGAIN in her character stories. How she was waiting to meet her grandfather after he passed? It sounds heartbreaking and genuinely shows a different side to the girl we know. But all we have is a few lines of text for it. Raiden's whole character arc was rushed. It's better than most females, but there are still glaring issues to it. Only some were fixed in her second story quest.
And then the other side of the spectrum. Kazuha's lore is locked behind 2 limited time quests. But he also was one of the most iconic and important characters in the Inazuma arc, which somewhat makes up for it. His part in the interlude also made for a great opening to the Inazuma arc. Scaramouche is again locked behind Unreconciled Stars but not only was he teased in Inazuma, he was also a major antagonist in the entire Sumeru arc AND had an entire archon quest exploring his lore and story. He and Shenhe are both characters without story quests, but archon quests centered around him. But he has so much MORE compared to her. Xiao is a fan favorite for a reason, being one of the most iconic characters in the Liyue arc, but also the Perilous Trail Archon Quest basically being his second story quest. And once again, there is a reason why Tartaglia is known as Mr WorldWide. The man is basically everywhere at this point. Albedo is one of the biggest characters lorewise, but unfortunately all of the interesting stuff about him is once again...locked by limited event content. Kaeya is lacking in exposure as well, but I do hope he gets some more, especially with how intense his lore is. Diluc has the same issue. And Dainsleif's entire existence is jam packed with lore. Neuvillette is literally him. Up until act 5, he has overshadowed the archon of the region, and even then he still shares the spotlight with her. There are definitely male characters who can use more development, but they are in a better state than most of the females. Most of the stuff I've mentioned for the males is in content that you have to complete in order to progress the story.
@cryophoenix6114 so in what exactly you see that the male characters are more developed? Because I personally find the females more interesting. Dainsleif, Kaeya and Gorou are the exceptions.
I could use similar arguments for the males. Xiao is just an edgy suicidal teenage child soldier with daddy issues. Diluc is angry batman, pretty dumb. Kaeya is merely an adopted f*ckboy with family issues. Zhongli is a hypocritical magnet for girls with daddy issues. Neuvillette is a angry judge with a hot voice, well good for you if you like him, but that's pretty bland taste. Tartaglia is an even bigger f*ckboy, but this one is psychotic, but hey, he loves his little sisses and bros, awww how can you not love this cute redhead? Venti is just an overfeminine musician that lets others do his job. Ayato? Well have you never seen a not braindead politician before? Go touch some grass. Oh and he's a siscon, awww. The entire point of Alhaitham's existence is looking hot, and Kaveh is just his gay roommate with a crush on him. Cyno and Tighnari share idealistic stupidity. Albedo? Well, what a time to be into immortal cute hot robots, this even reminds me of the twilight days, how cool. Does he even ever do anything at all except having good looking hair? Itto is just an oversized child. I could continue.
I kinda see the point but this reminds me of discussing the lack of decent lead female characters in shounen with a female friend of mine. It's not that I disagree, it's that you see what you want to see.
Besides, this is ultimately a gacha game, and gacha games work on punctual intensity, not all that complicated character arcs. What character of a gacha game goes through actually a decent storyline that we can personally see and it's not locked in lore? I don't know, not that I've played all that many. And Genshin is mostly a game for children or young adults, it's not that complicated for a reason storywise. Probably the most developed character we have seen is Jeht, and she doesn't even have a vision, but her story is my personal favourite.
But ultimately is up to interpretation and personal bias, in my opinion.
Shenhe *is* homicidal and has a punisher style mentality of dealing with criminals. Hell she’s uprooted trees with her strength alone, that’s what the red ropes are for, to keep her emotions in check more specifically her homicidal tendencies.
Also Miko lives to fuck around and scheme which is entirely fitting as a Kitsune.
@@cryophoenix6114when was the last time Amber did anything even semi important?
What do you think about Noelle and Layla though? Shame you didn’t mention them.
Why do people hate yae cause she’s rude but then praise Scaramouche when he’s rude bruh double standards
Scara is hated in the Chinese community
I dont understand either 💀
17:50 they're already pulling these with Arlecchino. in 4.0 they added Chitose NPC in Ritou harbor, who's OG Gendou Ringo and she investigated Fatui related to her quest and it turned out now that they acted without current Arlecchino's knowledge.
the female characters of fontaine have all been so good, I appreciate the variety genshin gives us in comparison to most other games I've played in the similar genre
I agree, I’ve recently fallen in love with Furina and Fontaine in general recently after the archon quest. I cried which is unusual for me.
The waifus of genshin impact are definitely good waifus
That doesn’t make them good characters.
Also I am definitely one of the few that actually likes morally ambiguous characters.
Eula, Rosaria, Ningguang, Shenhe, Collei, Ei and some others have excellent backstories imho.
No one has stated that the appearence of a character means they're written well.
Also it isn't rare to like morally gray chracters. In fact, there are a lot of popular morally ambiguous charcters in literature, movies, TV shows, and other forms of media.
I can't stand the word "waifu" anymore like dam this community massively overuses the word jesus christ. Why cant you peeps just refer to the characters normally? I'm sorry but hearing "waifu" or "husbando" every couple of seconds whenever these youtubers are talking about some of the characters is just mad annoying.
You are an awesome human being.
Kokomi felt like she had so much potential (at least when I first played genshin). When I first heard about her I was hyping her up and when she first appeared I was amazed and thought of her like the actual hydro god, but then they just didn't use that part of her at all. I don't mind her having struggles but I just wanted to see more of her being cool and having actual power (like how Lisa tortured that one abyss mage when trying to get her book back). She's kinda a case of "show don't tell."
Raiden isnt morally ambiguous she is just VERY VERY VERY VERY DUMB and made the worst possible decision 90% of the time
Exactly. And that's what make it worse. If she changes her entire mindset over the course of one walk with the traveler, then what was the point of the last 500 years? Not to mention the puppet she left in her stead was just as dumb as her
Agreed with above ^^ I honestly just wish they went ahead and made her a badish guy instead of "haha oopsie... Omoshiroi smh Guess I'll stop murdering my own citizens." But that would affect sales sooo
Honestly Kokomis story quest really just struck me as "woah shes so autistic" shes so hyperfixated on every single little details, shes a perfectionist, and her needing to "recharge" is to me just spoon theory because she has autism. Maybe its because I am autistic but I really resonated with her, shes strong and smart and elegant but she does those things in such a logical way, like her every word and action is calculated. This just seems alot to me like an autistic person struggling with social norms and trying to make it into a formula of how to talk to people because she doesn't pick up on it naturally. I do get your critiques but I honestly really love her as a character and her being a workaholic just seems like a special interest. She just really loves strategy.