@@Grimmson2 I haven't played Warno, but isn't ECM calculated the same in Red Dragon, Multiplicative? So it's 20% of 55%, which is 11, so the round will have a 44% accuracy?
While frustrating, OSAs and Strelas are more for counter airplanes than rotorcraft. Your AA nets should also have some gun based AA mixed in, not only can they stun for the rockets but are also deadly effective against helis.
@@matushka__ EXACTLY, the fact that it’s not moving and at extremely close range are exactly why it can’t hit it. Notice how the only one that hit it was while it WAS moving and further away. Again they’re meant to hit mobile jets at extremely long ranges which means they move super fast and take awhile to lock on to it’s target. It does not have the time to lock on because of how close it is and it does not have the accuracy at that range either because of how fast it is especially against chaf and countermeasures
Based on my calculations the probability to hit within 5 missile launches with an accuracy of 44 % (ECM included here) is between 90 and 100 % so this is extremely unlucky. If they use pseudo random distribution it is even more than 95 %.
you should be asking how many of the 6 should hit not the % of the last 5, you should get 2.64 hits over 6 shots, he got 1 so he got 1.64 less hits then he should have. if he hit it on the 2nd shot (something that anyone who uses helis knows is painfully common) that would be 2 hits when .88 hits should have happened (1.12 hits too many) that is 1.64 vs 1.12. so its more likely that your heli will be two tapped then for this to happen.
The missile missing doesn't increase the chance of consequent missiles hitting the target. It doesn't change the probability over time, it only flattens the bell curve
@@kirillosipik8048 There seems to be a consecutive shot bonus of around 1 % capping at 3 %. It depends how things are coded. There are various probability distribution of which one is the bell curve or normal distribution... Not all probabilities are of a bell curve type.
For all you morons saying “this is why Warno sucks” you should very well know that the exact thing has the probability of happening in red dragon. Also remember this video is obviously unique and unfortunate, which is why someone posted it. This scenario does not happen most of the time. Think with your head before you go keyboard general in the comments.
I disagree. I have played Red Dragon for hundreds of hours and I know that even the first hit in a helicopter means that it is already lost, even if it is not shot down by the first shot. Shown here is just a disgrace to the industry, not an "accident". The helicopter should be immediately dead after entering the air defense range and there is no need to talk about "playability". Red Dragon was perfectly played even with such cruelty to the players.
the missile is very tired. he is eepy. the missile has had a very long day of splashing bandits and wants to take just a small sleep. he eeby and neebies to sleebie.
I mean, they are cold war heat-seeking missiles versus a lot of concentrated flares. It may be more realistic than you think. If anything, the "unrealistic" part is thr helo being operational after being hit by the first missile
It's not heat seeking. OSA launches Radio Frequency command missiles guided by the vehicle's fire control radar. All reports of it having any Infrared missile variants were not substantiated.
They did this because warno is ment to be more realistic combat wise and damage wise than wargame red dragon so you're not filling units with 10s of missiles or rounds to get a kill
lol u played recently? infantry can take multiple tank shells before losing a man and spamming manpads is meta right now. Wargame units tend to be squishy while Warno tends to be the opposite. i think they are ruining it trying to be realstic instead balanced like wargame.
It is not odd at all. It has been repeatedly proven tanks can traverse through thick vegetation. We saw this in the Ardennes, we seen this in Burma, we seen this in Philippines, in Guadalcanal etc. And you should see what some vets have to say even in more recent times. In training exercises, a tank assault easily knocked over moderately thick trees and routed light infantry. As is the forests already give infantry a advantage and more realistic. Visibility and speed is reduced for tanks such that they can be easily ambushed in their flanks up close if they lack infantry support. This is exactly what happens IRL but trees alone are not impassable. Terrain doesn't defend itself.
@@peterdurum434 yes it is, they fly real low under the rader net and lob Hellfires at the radar site from under the treeline literally the whole point of the longbow variant of the apache, they placed the sensors and targeting systems on top of the rotor so they can peek over treelines
@@FighterOperationsGroupFOG Brother, it's an RTS, and taking into account it is alt history of the Cold War going hot it never going to be fair or balanced, it about tactics, and working with the deck you made.
@@OneHouseofCards TBH, im tired of your "balance" shits, IRL NO FUCKIN AERIAL VEHICLE will ever enter on a SAM controlled area, no matter what, unless is a sead mission. Also SAMs are not on their own, usually is covered by 1 or 2 batallions on ground. Strategy cant be balanced, balanced strategy is boring as fuck.
The top attack TOW missile isn’t top-down attack it overfly’s the target and shoots a kinetic EFP down onto the target, it’s a horizontal path of flight all the way to the target
the OSA has optical tracking that lets it fire even if the radar is jammed or disabled, irl at this range it would be pretty much guaranteed hits for a hovering helicopter like this.
That is sad true. This game is just a joke and overpowered USA units against weak USSR army. In Warno USSR AA is just useless as many other units agains NATO.
I know right? >3 T-55 in a forest >AMX-10 comes in the open to engage them >takes down two T-55 because their aim is like a drunk monkey >3rd one manage to shoot the AMX but still dies from the last shot
That's realistic though: the Soviet armed forces were and are absolute rubbish compared to NATO. It is somewhat balanced out though: because the Soviets have access to huge numbers of tanks. Quantity has a quality all it's own.
@@rocketassistedgoat1079 army that won ww2 agains nazi germany just 30-40 years before was rubbish? Maybe you just learned history from disney cartoons?
@@LauftFafaWargame red dragon is what this game wants to be. Warno is absolute garbage compared to its predecessor. Cause in that game AA was deadly but fragile. SEAD was always a threat but AA could do its job.
@@kevincho1187 it doesnt mate . warno is superior than red dragon on everything except on scale but did you see the upcoming stuffs like the berlin map or are you just talking while having in mind the warno from 7 months ago ? you will be surprised soon . its better than steel division 2 even and is following the same path but with better bigger stuffs . warno is the closest we ever got to world in conflict in term of visuals and smooth gameplay and fun . if you have a negative opinion go post it on steam and lets see if its gonna matter or not between all other positive reviews
My AA: misses every shot
My opponents AA: aimed by the right hand of God as it righteously strikes down my SEAD aircraft
My experience has been watching my strellas go 0/8 against stationary helicopters that are meanwhile eviscerating all of my armor
But when the enemy aa sees your heli it goes brrrrrrrrt...
@@shelbycome8398fr fr
3-4 manpads or 1 gun based AA are a lot more effective and cheaper, strella vehicles are better for airplanes.
Skill issue
The skill issue is even using AA
Massive* skill issue
Cause your any better rip
I just given the 666th likes
Annoyingly though tbf it's not 55% accuracy if Apache has ECM
55%-20ecm= 35% CHANCE TO HIT.
@@Grimmson235% ≠ 1 out of 3 missiles will hit. That's an average.
You don't have this problem if your aa has guns and missiles
@@Grimmson2 I haven't played Warno, but isn't ECM calculated the same in Red Dragon, Multiplicative? So it's 20% of 55%, which is 11, so the round will have a 44% accuracy?
Funny thing is that ECM of Apache should only come in handy when fighting against IR AA, so the OSA line shouldn't be affected.
While frustrating, OSAs and Strelas are more for counter airplanes than rotorcraft. Your AA nets should also have some gun based AA mixed in, not only can they stun for the rockets but are also deadly effective against helis.
Gun AA also tear apart infantry and light vehicles
Takes out my jets like it's nothing, but can't hit a still heli.
Because they’re meant to hit jets not helis
Because that’s what they’re meant for
@@Justusuave313 I'd say ok if it was moving, but it's right there.
@@matushka__ EXACTLY, the fact that it’s not moving and at extremely close range are exactly why it can’t hit it. Notice how the only one that hit it was while it WAS moving and further away. Again they’re meant to hit mobile jets at extremely long ranges which means they move super fast and take awhile to lock on to it’s target. It does not have the time to lock on because of how close it is and it does not have the accuracy at that range either because of how fast it is especially against chaf and countermeasures
Apache: “delete this grid square”
I did not have relations with that OSA, anti air battery.
Best dub ever, the barrage of missiles with Ken Shiro simply killed me 😆
Based on my calculations the probability to hit within 5 missile launches with an accuracy of 44 % (ECM included here) is between 90 and 100 % so this is extremely unlucky. If they use pseudo random distribution it is even more than 95 %.
you should be asking how many of the 6 should hit not the % of the last 5, you should get 2.64 hits over 6 shots, he got 1 so he got 1.64 less hits then he should have. if he hit it on the 2nd shot (something that anyone who uses helis knows is painfully common) that would be 2 hits when .88 hits should have happened (1.12 hits too many) that is 1.64 vs 1.12. so its more likely that your heli will be two tapped then for this to happen.
@@thundercatld3719they weren’t explaining the average case. They were saying how unlikely it was to miss that many shots in a row.
You can however perform a hypothesis test and probably find out that while unlikely, it just happens sometimes, and it's not any other factors
The missile missing doesn't increase the chance of consequent missiles hitting the target. It doesn't change the probability over time, it only flattens the bell curve
@@kirillosipik8048 There seems to be a consecutive shot bonus of around 1 % capping at 3 %. It depends how things are coded. There are various probability distribution of which one is the bell curve or normal distribution... Not all probabilities are of a bell curve type.
I bring 2 cards of double vet OSAs when I play the 39th and always bring 2 together just because of those damn Apache's.
more like this!
AA missile went ricochet 😂
But these days AA is waaay too cost effective.
Curious why the jets especially the nighthawk don't fly higher to avoid IR based aa
Flares and ECM as well as general poor accuracy from the AA is probably what caused this.
*Insert quality joke here*
old video
For all you morons saying “this is why Warno sucks” you should very well know that the exact thing has the probability of happening in red dragon. Also remember this video is obviously unique and unfortunate, which is why someone posted it. This scenario does not happen most of the time. Think with your head before you go keyboard general in the comments.
Sometimes they never miss and take out your 240 point helicopter. You just feel helpless 😢
I disagree. I have played Red Dragon for hundreds of hours and I know that even the first hit in a helicopter means that it is already lost, even if it is not shot down by the first shot. Shown here is just a disgrace to the industry, not an "accident". The helicopter should be immediately dead after entering the air defense range and there is no need to talk about "playability". Red Dragon was perfectly played even with such cruelty to the players.
@@alexanderkharin7036 well not already losy but alot more of stage
You can say all u want but aa in warno is really not good right now. And this isnt ghat unique it happens aomewhat regularly
@alexanderkharin7036 yea I've got almost 700 hours in red dragon, never had this issue when playing, only in warno.
love from Japan
Osa akm is a beast in wargame in its own era
These longer range guided missiles are for jets, they suck at helis, for helis you need stingers/igla or pivad or some other AA gun
You gotta uprank the aa with the lower tier bgs it’s just a must.
This is why I mix and match pew pew AA with zoom soom AA. Can't flare bullets.
Osa are not infrared seekers
There should be a minimum engagement range like in steel division 2
the missile is very tired. he is eepy. the missile has had a very long day of splashing bandits and wants to take just a small sleep. he eeby and neebies to sleebie.
That's XCOM baby!
XCOM has made me rage more than CS:GO could and thats saying something
SD2 three AA guns shuts down the air space
WARNO a hundreds of AA guns in a well thought out AA system can’t take down a single Hind
Lmaooo nice edit
Hence hello rushes every 2nd game. Hence online below 1000.
Use a logi first of all, second of all the heli is flying amuck and using ECM
I wish my helicopters were capable of that
That's why I have 2, one fails all the time
Eugen wants to make helicopters' simulation.
ECM and Flares, this is 100% a skill issue
Im wondering if its the acc is wrong on aa or if counter measures are to strong.
AA is like a casino.
warthunder AA player belile:
This is why I bring Pivads
Gosh darn hilarious!
Like seriously 🙄 I love those aa vehicle because they love fast but oh man do they eat up rockets and miss a lot
missle AA is better for aircraft and gun AA is better for helis, maybe try using 1 gun AA for helis and 1-3 missle AAs for planes
Sas are best anti air I've seen on warno
Why I use continuous fire aa
This is how it should be
I mean, they are cold war heat-seeking missiles versus a lot of concentrated flares. It may be more realistic than you think.
If anything, the "unrealistic" part is thr helo being operational after being hit by the first missile
It's not heat seeking. OSA launches Radio Frequency command missiles guided by the vehicle's fire control radar. All reports of it having any Infrared missile variants were not substantiated.
Leave the game and goodbye 😂😂
They did this because warno is ment to be more realistic combat wise and damage wise than wargame red dragon so you're not filling units with 10s of missiles or rounds to get a kill
@@hkg207 I thinking about war thunder
Red dragon was more balanced, I still play that over warno
More realistic? It's exactly the same as Wargame.
lol u played recently? infantry can take multiple tank shells before losing a man and spamming manpads is meta right now. Wargame units tend to be squishy while Warno tends to be the opposite. i think they are ruining it trying to be realstic instead balanced like wargame.
Just like in Wargame lmao
Frist Rank unit
Why I could not play this game
CMR did the job
there is 1/32 chance of that happening. epic.
What skill
HATO bias )))))))))
My AA works
They should make tanks not able to enter thick forest like steel division, the fact it can shoot through the trees is odd
It is not odd at all. It has been repeatedly proven tanks can traverse through thick vegetation. We saw this in the Ardennes, we seen this in Burma, we seen this in Philippines, in Guadalcanal etc. And you should see what some vets have to say even in more recent times. In training exercises, a tank assault easily knocked over moderately thick trees and routed light infantry.
As is the forests already give infantry a advantage and more realistic. Visibility and speed is reduced for tanks such that they can be easily ambushed in their flanks up close if they lack infantry support. This is exactly what happens IRL but trees alone are not impassable. Terrain doesn't defend itself.
Well theyre called counter measures for a reason lol
From what game is this final audio in Japanese? It's quite familiar to me, just can't remember at all
fist of the nort sstar
@@foxshoot3138 thank you
That’s pretty accurate actually. One of the Apaches mission is to hunt down SAM sites
No, it's not.
@@peterdurum434 yes it is, they fly real low under the rader net and lob Hellfires at the radar site from under the treeline
literally the whole point of the longbow variant of the apache, they placed the sensors and targeting systems on top of the rotor so they can peek over treelines
tragic
Red dragon was balanced better in my opinion
Согласен wargame red dragon круче ❤
It's a shame of gamedevs. Thanks. i'll not waste my money on this game for sure.
Don’t buy any games, you won’t like them.
you are so right dude we should just delete all games that have RNG, no good games ever use that
😂😂😂
PACT AA*
Bahahahahaha 🤣
They ruined this game, Broken Arrow will kick its ass
Why? Because most Cold War era vehicles/aircraft has a form of countermeasures for SAMS?
@@OneHouseofCardsit's a game and should be balanced. Red dragon wasn't thus bad
@@FighterOperationsGroupFOG Brother, it's an RTS, and taking into account it is alt history of the Cold War going hot it never going to be fair or balanced, it about tactics, and working with the deck you made.
@@OneHouseofCards TBH, im tired of your "balance" shits, IRL NO FUCKIN AERIAL VEHICLE will ever enter on a SAM controlled area, no matter what, unless is a sead mission. Also SAMs are not on their own, usually is covered by 1 or 2 batallions on ground. Strategy cant be balanced, balanced strategy is boring as fuck.
@@OneHouseofCardslol helis arent that invincible tho.
Totally unluck
Wtf! 😂
Hamburgers won't buy a game if russians would be at least equals to Saint NATO
TBF it reflects real life Russian air defence capability as displayed in the Ukraine war.
so bad update mate cant belive. it is gone so bad. it was good game
The top attack TOW missile isn’t top-down attack it overfly’s the target and shoots a kinetic EFP down onto the target, it’s a horizontal path of flight all the way to the target
You know that soviet missiles are triggered by anti rocket flares as they are old tech
the OSA has optical tracking that lets it fire even if the radar is jammed or disabled, irl at this range it would be pretty much guaranteed hits for a hovering helicopter like this.
This why I hate Eugens ant quit playing their games. Try Muis Front game instead of this shit.
About right for a ruSSian SAM battery.
Thats why i switch on the guided aa guns on my tushunka to deal with helis. I save the rockets for jets.
That is sad true. This game is just a joke and overpowered USA units against weak USSR army. In Warno USSR AA is just useless as many other units agains NATO.
I know right?
>3 T-55 in a forest
>AMX-10 comes in the open to engage them
>takes down two T-55 because their aim is like a drunk monkey
>3rd one manage to shoot the AMX but still dies from the last shot
Just Play wargame
Because ussr sucks lol. Redfor is deservingly shit
That's realistic though: the Soviet armed forces were and are absolute rubbish compared to NATO. It is somewhat balanced out though: because the Soviets have access to huge numbers of tanks. Quantity has a quality all it's own.
@@rocketassistedgoat1079 army that won ww2 agains nazi germany just 30-40 years before was rubbish? Maybe you just learned history from disney cartoons?
Whoa a 1960 missile launcher cant take on an AH64 apache? Clearly the game is broken.
The OSA is better than 90% of modern American shorad sistems.
It is effectively impossible for a radar guided missile to hit a stationary target, so cant say this is unrealistic
OK great but... that's not how the game works
Fr?
@@alexvonrom7942 Yeah. You can see the heli spinning out and moving around while stunned and the AA still misses 😭😭
besides the fact it's spinning out of control
@@567jt It isnt moving up, down, left or right by any considerable amount, and so a Radar would not be able to determine the range to the target
Warno really sucks.
yeah lets judge on it based on the past experience of someone else . best wargame since world in conflict and its not even full release
@@LauftFafaWargame red dragon is what this game wants to be. Warno is absolute garbage compared to its predecessor. Cause in that game AA was deadly but fragile. SEAD was always a threat but AA could do its job.
@@kevincho1187 it doesnt mate . warno is superior than red dragon on everything except on scale but did you see the upcoming stuffs like the berlin map or are you just talking while having in mind the warno from 7 months ago ? you will be surprised soon . its better than steel division 2 even and is following the same path but with better bigger stuffs . warno is the closest we ever got to world in conflict in term of visuals and smooth gameplay and fun . if you have a negative opinion go post it on steam and lets see if its gonna matter or not between all other positive reviews
@@LauftFafa I dont see how any of its superior, warno is just red dragon without the content, your just braindead
Wait for broken arrow
It looks so fucking cool though.
Супер😂
Helicopter: *used flares to fend off missile lock*
Player: 🤯
(Great edit though thank you for the content)
Osa uses radar guidance so flares would be useless anyway.
Hella unrealistic, one shot would finish it off
Skill issue