20 Things You Didn’t Know About Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country (1991) Part 2
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- Опубликовано: 22 июл 2024
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The thing about David's death in Star Trek 3, the Klingons would have thought it honorable for Kirk to hold on to a revenge killing for his death.
Yes, but they'd also think that the way he went about it was without honor; using subterfuge.
Yes and no. If it served their purpose, they'd overlook it. People are like that.
They would likely only view it honorable from another Klingon, not a human, and especially not Kirk. Remember, at this point the Klingons and Federation were not at peace yet, they had been through multiple wars, and Kirk had multiple conflicts with them. They wouldn’t see this as honorable.
@@goodywin moreover, Kirk's revenge kill was technically accomplished in STIII Already, when he killed the Klingon captain.
Star Trek VI is my favourite Star Trek film.
The technique used during the trial to switch from Klingon to English was famously used by Stanley Kramer in Judgement at Nuremberg to glide from German to English. If you haven't seen Judgement at Nuremberg I highly recommend it. Even more than half a century on it is a powerful film -- plus a very early film for William Shatner.
That would have been an easter egg if the film were made today ;)
@@JohnnyWednesday Indeed so :)
@@JohnnyWednesday Can you imagine the Cetacean Observations list for this film? It would be a whole video unto itself.
@@StephenLeGresley Hey now, there's a great idea for a new video :)
@@StephenLeGresley Honestly, I would love to watch retro reactions to old Trek shows and movies. There's no reason why we wouldn't have a retrospective ups, downs, and Cetacean Observations. Plus, it gives them an excuse to wear all those vintage uniforms while filming.
I love Sulu's "Fly her apart, then!"
The Undiscovered Country also provides my all-time favorite Spock line.
"If I were human, I believe my response would be...'go to hell.'"
fascinating! 🖖🏻
"...If I were human."
A quick note the U2 is a Spy plane and not a rocket.
The rocket is the V-2.
Nah mate. U2 is a band.
@@michaelmcfarland1716 Named from the spy plane lol
@@andyleighton4970 I know. Just having fun with everyone saying U2 is this or that. Wanted to say it before someone else jumped in.
@@michaelmcfarland1716 I know you knew, that's why I put a lol after my comment
From what I've heard, Gene Rodenberry could be a difficult person to work with at times.
Sean, do as many episodes as you see fit about this movie! I don't think anyone will complain.
Do another 20! Enough cannot be said bout the best star trek movie
Such a good movie! And also a great counter to all those people who criticise ST that doesn’t follow “Gene’s vision.”
The outright racism displayed makes a good mirror to our world and delivers potential conflict to resolve, but is indeed at odds with the world Star Trek described till that day.
I tend to draw the line at the point when a Starfleet crew commits a war crime, ie the moment in Discovery when they plant a bomb in a Klingon’s corpse.
@@crankywriter1738 Thats certainly not the first time we see Starfleet commit warcrimes. And its not even the worst either.
So, weird focus on DSC at all times.
@@crankywriter1738 Have you watched Deep Space 9 episode "In The Pale Moonlight" ?
@@crankywriter1738
Does that happen in S4 (which I have yet to watch) or am I forgetting it from earlier in the series?
The Rura Penthe warden was the shortest adult Klingon to appear on screen, with William Morgan Sheppard being under six feet tall, hence his guards bringing him a box to stand on when addressing the new inmates.
A superb soundtrack and surround sound effects on this film. A real joy to listen to on a decent home cinema setup plus being a great movie overall.
Star Trek VI is easily my favorite Star Trek movie, period. Sean and Trek Culture, let’s do another list!
I would be happy to watch a Part 3, This is my favorite Star Trek Movie.
"Second star to the right, next to the oregano." I've mashed these Kirk quotes since Generations 🤣
Why is that so funny to me? 😅
The engine room warp drive shaft was a cross between the TNG shaft, and the TMP engine room walk around ramps.
Deforest Kelley cameo's in TNG Encounter At Farpoint.
Admiral Leonard H. "Bones" McCoy : Well, this is a new ship. But she's got the right name. Now, you remember that, you hear?
Lt. Commander Data : I will, sir.
Admiral Leonard H. "Bones" McCoy : You treat her like a lady. And she'll always bring you home.
Rest well, Admiral.
That scene aired in 1987, 4 years before ST:VI was released.
I’ve really enjoyed these two videos! I’m glad Undiscovered Country is getting its due.
Side note: please proceed with the next 20 things about this film that you mentioned. Thanks!
Seconded. The best trek film ever made deserves at least 40 things.
The way they edited the scene, it looks to me Kirk regretted saying "Let them die."
The scene wasn't meant to cut to Spock, it was meant to have Kirk say the line, then show regret for saying with his body language, but the cut to Spock raising his eyebrow removed that section to make Kirk look like a jerk... :\
I think it's a good thing that people reacted negatively to the anti-Klingon bigotry. But it was RIGHT for that story. It needed to come from that place for the story to get to where it needed to go. Man, I have to watch it again.
Which version do you guys prefer?
The Theatrical Cut or the extended cut? (The latter features the late Rene
Auberjonois as Col. West -spoiler - he's the 'klingon' assassin at khitomer treaty).
Another little tidbit is it's Michael Dorn as Worf who says this is not klingon blood
@@spike3082 worf's grandfather defense attorney for kirk
The Colonel West reveal was perfect, and a nice zinger at Colonel Ollie North.
Exteneded cut for sure/ It most certainly adds to film.
Please do part 3! Just things about General Chang alone can make an episode.
One edit:
Brock Peters Problem with his racist monolouge wasnt his character in "Mockingbird"
It was the fact, that Meyer wrote that scene to be hounting , just due to the fact, a black person saying these words. But Peters, who in his youth had been victim to the segregation himself couldnt bring himself to say it in one take.
Nachelle Nichols was supposed to have a line as well that was dripped in racism, buy she could not bring herself to say it.
@@MrThomasCWest She did. She said, she feels with Valaris.
I am glad a Black actor said something racists, his delivery was much stronger to show how all humans are not as innocent as you think they are.
@@MrThomasCWest ~ yes, i heard that nichelle was supposed to say the “guess whos coming to dinner” line.
As far as the Racism in this film, especially Kirk's hatred towards the Klingons goes, im glad it was made as serious as it was. David's death would mean less if it didnt REALLY affect Kirk to this extent. Kirk's hatred needed to be genuine IMO. I understand Cartwright though, after he did TKAM.
It's not racism as it's an alien
@@jplonsdale7242 I disagree, since the prejudice is directed against Klngons, an alien race, it is literally racism.
@@jplonsdale7242 its an alien.... race... so ya, its racism.
Captain Kirk's bigotry was well placed. Plus it gave way to Spock's line "Have we grown so old..."
What is TKAM?? I don't understand the need to abbreviate so much.
4:40 the U-2 is not a rocket. It is a plane.
The V-2 was a rocket; perhaps our boy Sean is confusing the two...😉🙃
Actually U2 is a band. They're Irish, so they have rockets
@@alakani Was gonna say U2 is a band, and they know how to rock it.
@@tetravega567 ~ good one! or rather two.
I'd love a part 3 please!
As far as I know, "Second star to the right" was indeed the final scene to be shot to capture these special emotions. Can anyone confirm?
I always thought this was a nod the the movie Hook that premiered the same year with second star…. being the directions to NeverNeverland.
With all the other literary references in ST:VI, it's safe to say it's a reference to the book, not the movie.
"Peter Pan. How appropriate."
"What are you talking about? Captain Kirk said that!"
I must point out an error in the commentary about the reused sets from TNG. The Observation Lounge set was reused for the Officer’s Mess, not the UFO President’s Office. The Ten-Forward set was redressed for the President’s Office
Do you know why they replaced the wall of ships on TNG? The explanation didn’t make sense to me. 🖖
Should have mentioned the theatrical cut verses the home video release. In the theater, the ending scene was different. The assassin was Klingon, Scotty shoots him, he falls dead. In the video release the "Klingon" was wearing a mask and was actually Human Colonel West.
It may be a Mandela effect, but I remember the assassin being human when I saw it in the theater... maybe they changed it while it was still in theaters?!?
@@freakctc I saw it in the theater and clearly remember Scotty shooting a Klingon. He falls and the threat is over. Then on DVD after he falls, they show his body laying on the floor, something is odd about his face. Then someone pulls at the Klingon's face and a mask peels off and you hear a voice over of someone saying..."It's Colonel West."
@@starbrand3726 I don't remember the mask part, but I do remember Worf saying 'that is not klingon blood.' Perhaps they added the 'de-masking' to make it more apparent to the audience.
@@freakctc Yes, yes, I forgot about that part. The movie established that Klingon blood was pink. So Worf's Grandfather touches the blood with his fingers and it's blood red in color. But that was only in the DVD or cable TV showings.
@@starbrand3726 Also, they only made Klingon blood a different color so that they could use it liberally. If all that blood had been red, the rating might’ve been harsher.
Thank you Sean and crew...
This film made me a Star Trek fan. It’s also why I enjoyed Generations so much more.
Star Trek VI is freakin' amazing! Live long and prosper!
A year late to the party, but I just now found and watched this very enjoyable video!
My understanding was that the actors signatures as a literal "sign-off" at the end of the film evolved from the idea of the bridge all co-signing the final USS Enterprise log entry by James T. Kirk - the signatures would have been their character names rather than the actors.
this is the only TOS movie I saw in the theater, I was 12 when it came out. Can't believe that was 30 years ago
It's my favourite classic Trek movie, please do another video! xx
I have to agree with you sir, this is my favorite Trek movie. I know the consensus pick is ST2 but there was something about ST6 that just makes me smile.
My favorite Star Trek film. These two vids were great.
Damn.. this was AWESOME!!! Well done!
Well done, Sean!
Another Easter Egg: The Warden of Rora Pante standing on the box to welcome the prisoners was an obvious homage to Sessue Hayakawa in "Bridge On The River Kwai".
Between both parts I learned so many new things! Thanks Shawn! Also my favourite movie, which I am working towards via TOS (haven't seen since I was a kid, and my perspective now is completely different)
Great stuff! I'd love to see more. Your series of "20 Things You Didn't Know About Star Trek Movies" has been informative and entertaining, including a fair bit of stuff I wasn't familiar with as a Star Trek for almost 50 years.
My favourite Star Trek movie by a long way 😊
Thanks for the video. I enjoyed it.
My favorite Star Trek film. Just....wonderful
loved the film! love this compilation! love to see another 20! 🖖🏻
Do another 20! My favorite Trek movie.
you should absolutely do another twenty, Sean.
Wasn't there something about Kim Catrell posing nude on the bridge and Nimoy finding out and destroying the photos or is that an urban legend?
I heard that, too. I've always wondered if it were true, and if it happened before or after they filmed the scene in sickbay. 🤔
Patiently waiting for part 3
My favorite Star Trek movie!! Cheers!
An odd thing happened if you viewed both this AND Hook then month they were released. Two references to that "second star to the right" in one month. Coincidental, but it was kinda cool for me.
Fun fact: Brock Peters is also Capt Siscos dad in DS9
Will always be my favorite TOS Trek film with TNG First Contact in close 2nd.
Ah Sean...a little disappointed in you. You missed that the translation scene, where the dialogue switches exclusively to English, is lifted, almost identically, from the film Judgement at Nuremberg. My faith is a little shaken.
Growing up I practically lived in my local comic shop. I loved this movie. I found the graphic novel. I think I may still have it. I'll let you know.
🖖😎👍Very cool and very well done again,and very informatively executed indeed 👌...
Please do another 20!!!
I am impressed by your Trek saavy. Love long and prosper my friend.
ii bow to the genius evident in ST2 and ST4, but this is my fave trek rewatch movie...
I'm in your documentary, 8:30 to 8:33, far left, that's me!
So this is why "Star Trek: The Next Generation Interactive Technical Manual" features this odd wall in the observation lounge.
Do another video, we need it 👍
My list, 6, 4, 1, 2, 3 then 5.
You forgot that Michael Dorn was the advocate for Kirk and McCoy in the trial
Only 12 minutes behind.. let's go, part 2!
Good stuff
I really enjoy hearing about the 20 things You Didn't Know Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country .
Please do another one on this movie!
"The sets were lifted wholesale from STTNG" They were the STTMP-STTVH before TNG took them over so...
Thanks LLAP 🖖
I love ST6. I thought they got back to basics and gave us one last good mission. Miss those guys.
IIRC, the line "Second star on the right, and then straight on til' morning", was supposed to be an ending line for either TMP or The Wrath of Khan (I think, the latter). I could be wrong....if anything, it was incorporated in one of the novelizations, I believe.
It is interesting how some actors will allow certain sensibilities in a fictional work affect their demeanor and ability on set. The apparent "racism" and "bigotry" in Star Trek VI....people seem to forget that, in the real world, some soldiers that survived WW II had very strong feelings toward those that were their former adversaries (Germans and Japanese). There were survivors who refused to buy Japanese or German products, even though we were long since at peace with West Germany and Japan. I had a friend whose mother was German, and she hated (current day at the time) Russians bitterly because some of her elder relatives were killed by Russians in WW II. It is not surprising at all that Kirk would harbor ill-will and mistrust toward the Klingons because one of them killed his son, David. Why Shatner would allow that to affect him the way it did during shooting is, honestly, quite the mystery to me. Kirk has never liked the Klingons, even during the original series. To Shatner's credit, the way he portrayed the line "Let them die!", and his walk-back reaction afterward, was played beautifully. As for Brock Peters' aversion to the "alien trash of the galaxy" line....the Klingons are a fictional race, and thuggish at that (when they weren't being all honorable and such). It's one thing to have an aversion to say that, say, in a modern-day (or even period piece) crime-drama movie during a court scene. This is sci-fi with ficitional alien races, whose predilections are put down on paper, not known about through actual history.
Young Linda Blair helps put this in perspective when she starred in The Exorcist (1973). Regan MacNeil (possessed by Pazuzu) would of course spew a lot of vulgarities....vulgarities that had to be spoken by young Blair during the shoots, and then revoiced by Mercedes McCambridge in post. Apparently, during a break between shots, the late, great Max Von Sydow (Father Lankester Merrin) had asked Linda Blair how she felt about saying these things. Blair responded that she was simply citing lines for a movie. IMV, a very mature and professional response for someone so young.
Something I’ve always wondered. The Klingon mastiff: is that a dog in a costume?
BEST send off for the original cast 👏👏👏👏
I'm so glad they left in all the bigotry, racism and hate. It just shows that you can never sit back and let things slide. Every progress must be defended, always. I was much more irritated by the militaristic tone and outright racism in Enterprise, especially season 3. And there was no distancing from it like in ST VI.
Interesting. Could you be more specific? I recall that the Xindi were made into a complex race, with heroes and villains and such, who would one day join the federation, so I would’ve thought it was anti-racist. I’d like to know what you recall.
@@joshuacalkins Hi, thanks for the reply. I had to think about this one for a bit. I'm not sure about the Xindy being complex. They're sort of all-encompassing, with the insectoids and the aquatoids and humanoids and reptilians etc. Actually not much of a defined species at all. The Klingons are complex, they have a society that makes sense as a society. I guess Enterprise always felt strange to me, with the 50s swagger, the whole John Wayne style kick-em in the nuts attitude, which was exemplified in part by Archer and more so by his two leading human officers. I'm not going into representation here, but it felt weirdly out of place to me in a Trek context. I know it was meant to depict an optimistic, also naive and over-confident humanity that needs to learn and grow up. But do they have to look, talk and think like it's 1955? Then the blandly obvious 9/11 reference came along and Enterprie fell into an all-out celebration of military precision and heroism with the MACOS. That was at a time when in real life it was all too clear that the War on Terror wasn't going too well, and it wasn't the clean affair the US government sold it for. It was in large parts a racist war on Muslims with incredibale human cost. The Undiscovered Country really did a great job of showing nuances, light and shadow. The Xindi though, they looked like insects, and we know what that means: you can, nay, you have to crush them without remorse. They are lowly and inhuman, have no soul, no dignity. You can't even relate to them. Okay, so later we learn that there are others, aquatoids, arboreals etc, who are not so evil. So ... good Injuns / bad Injuns (good Muslims / bad Muslims) I guess. The ones that are good are good because they look and talk like us. That redeems them. I know that's not what the show says literally, but that's the way it came across to me, I found it obvious. I mean, as soon as you start depicting an enemy that is clearly recognizable as a reference to a real-life enemy (islamist terrorist), as fucking INSECTS, you know you got some stuff going on.
@@antonnurwald5700 Interesting outlook! I can appreciate lots of it. I love Klingons, but I wouldn’t call them complex. They are rather narrow, even when they are great, like Gowron and Martok. As for the Xindi, I see it both ways. By making them a fragmented species with different cultures and biology, they are in some ways the most varied creatures in ST. (The barely mentioned, now-extinct flying ones were a nice touch too). Very true that they did some 2 dimensional stuff with them, and it was unfortunate that the “bad” ones were basically defined by their sub-species. And yet the fact that they were all Xindi was a nice way to say that Xindi is not synonymous with evil at all, and the statement that there were Xindi in Starfleet in the future is not followed up with “not the reptilians or the bug ones, though!” I think they tried something exciting with them, but your observations make me think they only halfway succeeded. (I also liked the MACOS, and the uncomfortable realism of needing them aboard rather than just pretending we don’t need soldiers in a war).
The show was rather stuffy at first, yeah, but I actually like the Xindi arc a lot, and don’t find the similarities to real world events troubling, but appropriate. It was often a thoughtful exploration of what happens when there are big consequences and new priorities abruptly present themselves. I don’t think it was veiled racism, (despite the bugs and reptiles issue), because it was intrinsically Star Trek in its exploration of values. It was not the tale of winning war or exterminating lesser species, but of finding common ground, respecting adversaries, and making them allies. BSG did something similar, hinging in a way on Adama’s repetition of the pledge of solidarity: “so say we all.” Both shows we’re trying to find a way to engage the challenges of the era they were made in with some degree of complexity and relevance, and I think they both had some success. Thanks for the thoughts, Anton!🖖
@@joshuacalkins thank you too, maybe I'll give this season another go. 🖖
@@antonnurwald5700 I hope you can dig it. And if you never saw the 4th/final season, it’s arguably the best. Rather than a single arc (or no arc at all), it’s many arcs and individual eps that have relevance to the show as well as the whole franchise. They hired a few great writers and (mostly) made a great season. If only the show hadn’t been so directionless and irrelevant for the first few years, we might’ve gotten more of it at its best!
Star Trek 6 is great but 5 had its moments and remains wonderfully quotable. “Useless…Unwise”
My only complaint is that the U-2 is very definitely an air-breathing airplane, not a rocket. :-)
6:30 that’s the enterprise’s bridge, not the Excelsior.
Plummer saw the Klingon words he was supposed to say and flatly refused, sending the linguists back to come up with something else. This was partly a problem because the language was structured around NOT using the verb “to be”, and so “to be or not to be” was a challenging translation. They considered the intent of the words, and adapted the language to suit.
Please do another 20.
You asked for things I (we) wish were included in another 20 things list.
I'm not allowed to answer. The lists you present are things I (we) don't know about Star Trek.
I can't offer anything I don't know about Star Trak. No-one can. So Nerr.
Nerr nerr na nerr nerr.
I LOVE this movie
Looks like Pfaltzgraff is still in business in the 23 century. The kitchen ware company’s logo is visible when Sulu’s cup and saucer falls and breaks.
First my favorite film besides khan
YES!
I heard that the dining table at which Kirk's crew and the Klingons had the dinner before the Chancellor was assassinated was the conference table from the Enterprise-D.
This is clearly the best written, nigh on perfect film from the entire franchise.
Just commenting to say hello to my favorite Trek presenter! Hello, Seán! 🖖🏻👨🏻🦲👍🏻
Hi 😅
I would be in the front row for an academy movie.
You know, looking back, I could see Valeris being Zhat Vash or a romulan infultrator
Section 31
The U2 was a plane, not a rocket as stated.
is a plane-- it still flies regularly for NASA and the Air Force.
Was Kim Cattrall’s on set photos shoot mentioned in part 1?
This list had more in it I didn't know about than did. Not sure those photos fit the list.
You can’t fault Star Trek VI for borrowing TNG sets. The corridors, transporter room, engineering, and quarters were all originally built for The Motion Picture and were adapted to use on TNG. The TOS movie series are simply reclaiming what was theirs.
Fascinating facts!!! 🖖🖖
Fact-scinating!
There’s no such thing as a U-two rocket, it’s an airplane and it’s still in service!
Star Trek 6 is my favorite and feel it is the best. Dont really understand why 2 is considered the best.
"... from a U2 rocket flying overhead ..." What?!!! U2's are aircraft.
Eh, that wasn’t Nichelle’s last appearance in a Star Trek movie, although it was her last appearance in a canon film. Let’s not forget Star Trek: Of Gods and Men from around 2008, when she reprised her role for the last time. Say what you want about that indie film but I loved it, in spite of its flaws. Godspeed Nichelle!❤
I'm shocked that this and Star Trek 5 had the same budget. This movie seemed superior in every single fashion, especially visually.
This has been bothering me for years. I saw STTUC in the theater when it was released. As Spock and McCoy alter the torpedo (by the way, the Excelsior was investigating gaseous anomalies, not the Enterprise) Majel Barrett's computer voice is in the background with a countdown or damage report. McCoy's line "I'd give real money if she'd shut up" refers to the computer, not Kang. Does anyone (a) remember this and (b) know why it was removed from DVD's etc?
The line was "I'd give real money if he'd shut up." referring to Chang.
I do remember it... didn't realize it was removed
The line was "I'd give real money if he'd shut up". An obvious reference to Chang.
My favorite Star Trek film. Period!
Odd that it says for Gene Rodenberry at the very beginning and he hated it..
How could you leave out how Christian Slater got his role? His mother, Mary Jo Slater, was the casting director for the movie and got him the cameo since he was a fan.
that is a well known fact. Slater has told that story many times.
Only getting left channel audio on this one.