I’ve always thought performance goes before resolution. Too bad everyone and everything is so set on taking it to 4K. Without performance, the gaming experience is out the window.
@@PanzerVII-df8hg I don’t have the data to disagree or concur with your statement if consumers wanted 4K consoles or not. Progress is ever ongoing, in all areas. 4K is better resolution, it’s a fact, but regardless if it's 4K, 8K or 28K, the performance, and experience should always be prioritized.
I couldn’t agree more, they should’ve prioritized framerate and frame time even before worrying about moving anywhere past 1080p, maybe 1440 at very most (which in my opinion is usually fine for resolution, 1440 is a perfect sweet spot.
@@fullauto86 1440p is totally fine. 4k is luxury and maybe even overkill for most games. The cost of 4k monitors alone is outrageous, let alone a graphics card that can actually run native 4k without DLSS and FSR at 120fps. 60 fps is the bare MINIMUM but 100-120 fps is the sweet spot for smooth gameplay. Why does everyone NEED the graphics to be better, they've been more than good enough for the past ten years and now all the new games run like crap and have more bugs than we've seen since New Vegas.
@MEanME who the hell gonna use a monitor for the PS4? Plus there are 4K monitors 1080p TVs wont be in the market in the future dude and thats why you gonna have to focus in resolution than 60fps
Exactly! I finally chipped into the Pro because it was on black friday sale for $299 US. DREAMS for PS4 runs better on it and as far as I understand, so does VR (also a black friday acquisition). And I believe exceptional quality 1080P TV's plasma, LCD, OLED, QLED QDOT...will be around long after we're all dead. Just like you can find endless supplies of flatscreen CRT picture tube TV's for 1st and second gen gaming, for free damn near anywhere. Those TV's were several thousand new. Like the Sony and Advents. I won't be heading into 4k gaming any time soon unless it's on a PC. And that's only because of future upgradeability which consoles inherently lack. Just my .02
DF 2017-2018: Glorious 4K With This PS4 Pro (mostly Upscaled):)) DF 2019: Is PlayStation 4 Pro Worth Buying For 1080p Gaming? DF 2020: Is PlayStation 4 Pro Worth Buying For 720p Gaming? No no no, when you advert. as a 4K console. Do not try so hard to sell PS4 pro. People are waiting for PS5 to come out. By the way, I have a ps4 pro. I bought it when it was first released (CUH7000) and I like it very much.
@bejais well that what happen for being a cheap ass gamer Remember when people complained about the price of PS3?: -If PS4 wasnt underpowered, it would held back Sony´s profits like the PS3 but way better -Now that the PS4 is underpowered, it had to held back gaming its a hard decision to make, specially after the miskates they did with the PS3
kader mami DF 2017: Nintendo NX uses Tegra!!!!! DF 2018: The switch manages to pull good enough graphics though many games drop below 1080p DF 2018: While the Switch is vastly Underpowered it manages 720P hopefully DF 2020: Why the switch is gooood at 480P DF 2021: To run the switch at 360P is optimal
Not really 1080p with better framerates is all i care about i use a 1080p monitor and i like it better then what i seen on a 4ktv console aint ment for it they shouldv worried about framerates not checkerboarding wannabe 4k
Because they're mean. But seriously I know the pain. The unfortunate truth is that monitors are a smaller market share for ps4 users and 1440p is even smaller. It doesn't seem hard to do, most games already run at 1440p on Pro anyway. The only solution really is to a newer monitor; most modern 1440p monitors will accept and downsample a 4k signal.
@Hallison Michel Exactly. Played on base PS4 and PS4 Pro, and I really don't see a difference. At least not enough to justify getting a pro over the OG PS4.
SteelSkin667 does anyone know if the pro is just as quite as the slim when running in 1080p instead of 4k. Surely if the pro is not pushing 4k it’s working less so there’s less stress on the hardware therefore it should be cooler and quieter than if it was attached to a 4k tv. I really don’t want a noisy machine at the foot of my bed!
the original ps4 is a great machine, and still the leader of the un-enhanced consoles. I think that phrase works better for Xbox since the x1 was subpar, and the X is such a competent improvement. But I never felt a generation behind on og PS4 like I did on my Xbone early to mid gen.
@@viniciuscoxoba3842 the ps4 pro has an extra gb of ddr3 hs but its cpu caps out at 2.8 tflops of computing power in 64 bit. And the cpus from 2013 that had such power often costed more than 400 bucks
You know, i subbed to you guys for DFR. The series was so good and there was a point where a new video was out every week. John clearly has an incredible passion for this stuff and as nice as his perspective is on newer games he provides an essential, high quality documentation and historical preservation. I'd love to see him give more forgotten ambitious classics and landmark games the attention they deserve
@Transistor Jump wow, you destroyed me, if I would care about that. The kid here, seems to be you, defending a plastic box, like it's important. Get a life, go outside, might help, might.
@Cat Man actually most games are 60fps. But almost every openworld game is 30fps. Almost every indie game is 60fps, every fighter, most racers, sports and shooters are 60fps. The majority is 60fps by far. Still too many 30fps games though.
For some reason, multiplayer in Bloodborne is waaay less laggy on a PS4 Pro running boost mode, than on a standard PS4. We already know the differences in loading times and the slight stabilizing of Bloodborne's frame pacing issues, but you can feel the biggest difference in performance when playing coop for example. Some time ago, I was running through forbidden woods with two friends, playing on standard PS4s. And they were both complaining about huge lags. And I could see that later in a recording of one of them. But my own game ran really smooth, almost as good as it would in offline mode.
John, take care of your health please. You just went to open the door for the postman and you got out of breath. An improved diet + 2-3 days of exercise will help you a lot!
Remember when the PS3 and Xbox 360 were announced with Sony and Microsoft toting the possibility of 1080p gaming? It only took until 2018 for the XboneX and PS4 Pro to let people do it reliably on console. Wew lads.
Day 1 adopter to the Ps4 pro, this system has been a godsend for 1080p gaming on a plasma. Nioh, Nier, FFXV, RE:2, Battlefield 1, KH3, just to name a few
@@xeraliZe that's so true, I'm saving for a ps4 pro rn. I'll enjoy as much as I can the ps4 until i played every single game that i like with an stable performance. The ps5 doesn't let you play every game you had on the ps4 and there's not that much games in there so I'll be waiting a couple years I think.
@@jsr6579 Preach. Exactly what I'm talking about. There's so many good games or hidden gems on the PS4. Plus, you'll have a smoother experience too. Don't regret getting a PS4 Pro one bit.
In regard of 1080p and checkerboard rendering, the image is reconstructed and then downscaled. It doesn't loose sharpness from being upscaled and then downscaled. If the process is concatenated then it should far exceed a native 1080p image. I bought my PS4 Pro solely for the anti-aliasing properties on a downscaling to 1080p. I could not be happier.
Back in the day I also bought PS4 Pro, at first , I thought it is overrated , but it turns out , those benchmark video on RUclips prove the PS4 Slim is just Way too weak , barely hit 1080P
Consoles could have 32 cores 64 threads CPU at 12GHz , 128 Tflops GPU , 2TB GDDR8 ram , SSD 50000 MB/s read/write speeds and developers will still be like "naah man , not enough horsepower , we make our games 30fps with drops at 20s"
I'd love to see a similar topic, but revisiting the base Xbox One (not the S model) and see how it handles some of the most demanding titles that have come out recently.
@ 7:03, so, changing your resolution changes the rendering mode. Right, so what happens to performance if you select 720p? Does that just render at 1080p and downscale to 720p? Or is there additional performance increases to be had with lowering the resolution even more? Or, is it a separate option to the resolution option, and instead the supersampling option?
Ah, thank you for that! That's what I thought would happen, but I don't have a PS4 to try it on. It's kind of a bummer, to be completely honest.... being able to run it on a tiny screen, at the best framerate would be a pretty neat novelty.
I think the Pro is more of a 1440p machine as most pro enhanced games render at that resolution, but I do agree that performance should be the priority. So games that are at resolutions higher than 1080p but have framerate dips below 30 fps (Fallout 4 & Skyrim for example) would benefit much more if they’re rendering at 1080p locked 30 or 60
The PS4 Pro is marketed as a 4K machine eventhough it is not. Yes it is an upgrade, but it does not nearly match the quality of the Xbox One X. If Microsoft did a Pro upgrade, they would have been slaughtered by the media. I'm glad DF provides facts on the lack of the Pro eing a 4K machine. Still not a bad machine!
it supports native 4k/uhd so yeah it's a 4k machine. it had native 4k games running at 60 fps many months before xbox one x even launched and one x is too weak for proper 4k anyway which is why all games are 30 fps or upscaling. the first true 4k console will be the ps5 in a year.
@@Dr.WhetFarts actually it is you who is mis Informed. Plenty of games run native 4k 60fps on the x plus the x is capable of using 4k assest which is usually only found on pc the pro gets 4k artifacts and jaggies edges with up scaling. If you really think about it the x would smoke alot of high end pc had it just had a proper cpu because it's gpu is pretty insane for a lil console. At best the pro is a 1080p up scale to 1440p very rare does it hit 4k and even more rare native 4k. Take shadow of war as an example the x is using assest the ps4 don't even get which you find on pc trust me the gap is much bigger between the x and pro not so such between Base to pro so I would just get a Base ps4 it's what I did.
@@stolenname94 I agree with most of that apart from the X beating a lot of high end machines even with a decent CPU. The X would being a decent Mid-range PC if it had a capable CPU.
I think, the PS4's system-wide down sampling from 4K to 2K/Full HD is something that's transparent to the game/software. It's something behind the scene. Basically PS4 declared that it's plugged to a 4K screen (and allocate 2160p framebuffer) to the software. The game render to the framebuffer with that resolution, then OS then downscale it to 1080p resolution. Maybe exposing a flag showing that the output will be finally down-scaled would lose that transparency. I don't know if it's a good idea though :-/.
The super sampling mode is more than likely doing what you are describing. I'm not sure whether the scaling to the output resolution is handled by the software or by the system, but since developers can manually set the rendering resolution depending on the front-end settings, there's a chance that it is the former, whereas Xbox probably handles scaling from whatever arbitrarily sized framebuffer it is given to the output resolution. There's a chance that exposing a flag would either require to change the way the console handles scaling, or require developers to plan for a third 'downscale to 1080p' setting in their game.
If your PS4 Pro is loud, get a vertical stand on eBay for like $15. They install with one screw and my ps4 pro I bought the week it released has never been very loud. The additional surface area of the console standing vertically I think helps keep it cooler and really keep air moving through the console better than if you sit it horizontally
This was super fun to watch! Especially the last third with John's postman. Thank you guys! I wonder if John actually speaks German - you can at least hear him say "Dankeschön" and "Tschüss!".
Kind of awkward to begin with, so for some people it's funny and make the other person laugh. These aren't the kind of guys that are used to being on TV or camera, but that's just the kind of age we live in right now where these types of people who has expertise in this area can actually find an audience and following.
@Digital Foundry, would you guys be able to test if lowering the resolution for 720 would increase framerate? Monster Hunter World struggles to go over 50fps, and I wonder if it can reach 60fps on 720p.
@@Solegor he's right. Other than 4K and 1080p, and even that is on a game by game basis, the PS4 settings are for display output only and don't affect rendering. Only options you get are up to the developers, if there's performance mode and resolution mode, etc.
Don't use facts here. 😁 I was just going to say the same thing. It's nice switching the display option to 1080p 120hz sometimes. Especially with online shooters. 🤪
I think it all comes down to price. PS4 Pro has very good discounts depending on where you live. Microsoft is just not doing justice with their marketing to compete, I really want to try Xbox one X, but there is no deals like 300 dollar brand new PS4 Pro from Sony I am having right now. And it seems like Xbox is NA and EU thing. I would be like playing single player in online games if I play Xbox one in Japan.
Not everyone can and want multiple consoles hooked up, if they have to pick one it has to be the Pro surely as you can play all them cross platform games anyway plus much more.
I still own a 1080p screen but you conviced me to get a PS4 Pro. Now I am wondering how to decide which type of HDMI cable you need for your gaming needs. Perhaps it's interesting to share your thoughts on this in a video? Anyway thanks for the PS4 Pro tip!
@@theroyalmemes8611 I've been on pc since 2012 and I regret it the lack of quality 3rd person games is unbearable PC has a lot of which I don't give a shit about simulators strategic games and fps (which is just reskinned trash) nothing unique So I'm thinking but ps4 pro or wait for PS5?
@@Bcap222 It seems to me that Sony first party titles clearly benefits for the supersampling without any performance issues. I have a pro setup for a 40inch 1080p led tv and all their first party titles run smoothly with supersampling enabled but there's a few issue in 3rd party triple A titles like the Wither 3 with supersampling enabled but when turning off the ss mode, it runs smooth again. Here's my final though: The PS4 Pro is worth every penny for a 1080P Led TV (every games are now rendered in a native 1080P plus a huge improvement in performance) rather than a fake 4k renederd with a dip in performance.
One of the main benefits from the pro is the vr, and as they stated better 1080p . I have a pro since launch and love it. The upscale is not bad and I've enjoyed better looking vr titles but if I was to buy a pro now would not be worth it with the 5 looming around the corner.
If switching to 1080p will make my Pro less noisy I'm all for it, thing sounds like a rocket blasting off into space. I have my One X for 4K anyway lol
The segment of John talking about his Twin Famicom is once again reminding me of passing up a JVC X'Eye back in 2002. I was on a mission to own every Sega console variant ever, and I desperately wanted an X'Eye not just for its two in one aspect, but mainly for its S-Video output. I had a chance to get one for $20, and it worked and ran PERFECTLY!!! But it was absolutely destroyed cosmetically. I turned it down due to the cosmetics, and I still hate myself to this day for not buying it. Ugh.....
18:04 I'm one of those people. But I watch DF because you guys show a lot of side by side comparisons. That's a lot easier than figuring out the settings yourself. So hurray for DF ! :)
Ps4 pro was the first console purchase since 3do that I actually regretted. The Xbox one x was a massive upgrade. The ps4p isn’t even necessarily an upgrade at all for me. Graphics are negligibly improved, I can hear the system running from the other room, I guess it saves me money on running the heater during winter? If you own a ps4, do not upgrade. If you do not own a ps4, get the slim instead.
I agree I had the pro I was disappointed from day one so I sold it after several months of playing games that looked just about the same way they do on ps4 base the pro was pointless I got the X now and difference is real
Eko Permana are you talking about the 40ish fps sometimes 50 reaching for 60 frames per second performance mode option because thats not big not even consistent you will see when ps5 comes out and run those ps4 games the way they were meant with a solid 60
@@alecatttheman896 yes it is, as someone who already fit with 60fps, there is a big difference between 40fps and 30fps. 40fps on the pro is very consistent, unlike PC
@@alecatttheman896 you said you felt dissapointed by the pro, is it because the pro and the base version difference only 10-20fps? But, you said there is a big difference between the pro and the X, when the fact is, The X just slighly better than the pro. The X vs PS4 pro, is just same as PS4 Pro vs base version, there is a contradiction in your statement
I don't want to sound like an asshole but: had 1080p 240hz gsync monitor and to say the truth, framerate is something I quickly forget about. The fact that I am running a game almost 240fps is something You get used to and stop noticing. Few hours with 60 or even 30 fps and I am used to those again. Ofcourse 30fps only with gamepad and 60 with mouse or gamepad. 30 is unplayable with mouse. Good motion blur does a lot of work to make 30 or 60fps look great. 24fps video looks smooth because each frame is a capture of time frame and posed static frame. And since Ive got 4k 27" freesync ips monitor... I am always in awe of 4k detail and antialiasing. Freesync with rtss locked to 58fps is doing amazing work too. No tearing, low input lag, no microstutter...Going back to 1080p ps4 games is ok but its more jarring than going back to 30 or 60fps from high refresh rate. Tldr: I quickly get used to framerates as long as they are stable but 4k is always nice.
Hey John, couldn't help but notice the panzer dragoon titles missing from that backlog of games.... If you think I'll forget you're mistaken, and if you think I'll forgive you give me far too much credit.
shouldn't even be a question. it's the definitive PS4 and if you like anything more than 1080p it's worth it as well. while not as strong as the xbox one x, the exclusives library is GI-FUCKING-GANTIC. It amazes me how people are still stuck on 720 and 1080p when we've been blessed with 4k years ago. 4k HDR 10 televisions are so cheap compared to even 2 years ago it's ridiculous. you owe it to yourself to upgrade from 1080p to 4k and get the PS4 Pro. When it's on sale it's literally only $50 more than the crappy slim...
NEW RULE: Whenever a DF Direct gets hijacked Richard must do fast rhythmic hand gestures (or voguing) to German house music. If music is unavailable Stewie Griffin style "oonce tss oonce tss oonce tss" mouth noises made by a crew member will work too.
Does DF have a podcast that i could get the audio version of these sort of chats? Would definitely give it more of a listen on my daily commute to work. Great video again guys. Insightful as always.
@@tommybull6578 Yeah, i obviously know that. Have you watched the video? PS4 Pro has supersampling, so 1080P with Pro still looks better than 1080P with base model and at some games keep steadier fps or higher fps.
Should we have super sampling turned on for the Ps4 pro? What's the recommendation? It's annoying we have to go into the settings to change this system wide, I want to set it and play my games.
@@CaveyMoth That doesn't make sense, nearest neighbor is for when there is a "mismatched" resolution, say 720 to 1080 or 1080 to 1440. For 1080 to 4K it's just make one pixel 4 pixels, a simple integer scale that shouldn't require any processing.
Team Xbox is terrible about marketing, no doubt about it. However, PlayStation is terrible about hardware, no doubt about it. When you make a 4K console and it doesn't do 4K, but makes 1080p better, there are serious problems there. Sony and Microsoft should just work together. Microsoft should make the console hardware and the network and Sony should just make some games and do marketing.
Actual video starts at 5:28
THANK YOU
Yooo i was so confused i thought i clicked the wrong video.
I’ve been waiting for this , thank you
👍
I really appreciate the people that do this. Thank you
Richards hands actually control what his face and brain do, not the other way around.
Agreed. Looks awkward as hell. Like Edgar the Bug from Men In Black.
he has 2 core per hands
Richard is the type of man who would prefer a hand-crank Maxim over an M60.
I’ve always thought performance goes before resolution. Too bad everyone and everything is so set on taking it to 4K. Without performance, the gaming experience is out the window.
@@PanzerVII-df8hg I don’t have the data to disagree or concur with your statement if consumers wanted 4K consoles or not. Progress is ever ongoing, in all areas. 4K is better resolution, it’s a fact, but regardless if it's 4K, 8K or 28K, the performance, and experience should always be prioritized.
@@jericoba exactly.
I couldn’t agree more, they should’ve prioritized framerate and frame time even before worrying about moving anywhere past 1080p, maybe 1440 at very most (which in my opinion is usually fine for resolution, 1440 is a perfect sweet spot.
@@fullauto86 1440p is totally fine. 4k is luxury and maybe even overkill for most games. The cost of 4k monitors alone is outrageous, let alone a graphics card that can actually run native 4k without DLSS and FSR at 120fps. 60 fps is the bare MINIMUM but 100-120 fps is the sweet spot for smooth gameplay. Why does everyone NEED the graphics to be better, they've been more than good enough for the past ten years and now all the new games run like crap and have more bugs than we've seen since New Vegas.
I only ever wanted my ps4 pro for 1080p gaming with a stable framerate.
what if they stop selling 1080p TVs?
its not ideal to use a 1080p machine on a 4k TV
@MEanME who the hell gonna use a monitor for the PS4? Plus there are 4K monitors
1080p TVs wont be in the market in the future dude and thats why you gonna have to focus in resolution than 60fps
Exactly! I finally chipped into the Pro because it was on black friday sale for $299 US. DREAMS for PS4 runs better on it and as far as I understand, so does VR (also a black friday acquisition). And I believe exceptional quality 1080P TV's plasma, LCD, OLED, QLED QDOT...will be around long after we're all dead. Just like you can find endless supplies of flatscreen CRT picture tube TV's for 1st and second gen gaming, for free damn near anywhere. Those TV's were several thousand new. Like the Sony and Advents. I won't be heading into 4k gaming any time soon unless it's on a PC. And that's only because of future upgradeability which consoles inherently lack. Just my .02
Graphics in 4K is what they selling these consoles on - but 1080p in 60fps is perfect on FullHD sets.
@Marko L Good idea 😀
Especially if they are still selling for sub £280 😝
Sorry about that! Weird glitch on our side - it's the same video!
Im telling your mom
Reuploaded because Alfred Chicken put a copyright claim on the video.
haha it was alfreds fault
Oof, the Alfred Chicken jokes were awesome haha
It was also getting a bunch of dislikes 🤔
Alfred and the Fettuc?
Digital Foundry showed their true colors of being Sony's fanbots
Remember when PS4 was the "1080p" console, not PS4 Pro? Pepperidge Farm remembers.
DF 2017-2018: Glorious 4K With This PS4 Pro (mostly Upscaled):))
DF 2019: Is PlayStation 4 Pro Worth Buying For 1080p Gaming?
DF 2020: Is PlayStation 4 Pro Worth Buying For 720p Gaming?
No no no, when you advert. as a 4K console. Do not try so hard to sell PS4 pro. People are waiting for PS5 to come out. By the way, I have a ps4 pro. I bought it when it was first released (CUH7000) and I like it very much.
it was mostly
so the PS3 wasn't neither a 720p console because most of the multiplats run at 640p?
@bejais well that what happen for being a cheap ass gamer
Remember when people complained about the price of PS3?:
-If PS4 wasnt underpowered, it would held back Sony´s profits like the PS3 but way better
-Now that the PS4 is underpowered, it had to held back gaming
its a hard decision to make, specially after the miskates they did with the PS3
kader mami DF 2017: Nintendo NX uses Tegra!!!!!
DF 2018: The switch manages to pull good enough graphics though many games drop below 1080p
DF 2018: While the Switch is vastly Underpowered it manages 720P hopefully
DF 2020: Why the switch is gooood at 480P
DF 2021: To run the switch at 360P is optimal
If Regular PS4 Have No problem stay in 1080P, PS4 Pro won’t exits, Regular PS4 Is just a 720P Machine
To be honest I've benefited most from the Pro with a 4K TV despite it not being native 4K, 1440p checkerboard rendering still looks really good.
Ironworks1990 yeah and if you google ps4 pro games resolution you'll see most fall between 1620p and 1800p with some checkerboarded to 2160p
Not really 1080p with better framerates is all i care about i use a 1080p monitor and i like it better then what i seen on a 4ktv console aint ment for it they shouldv worried about framerates not checkerboarding wannabe 4k
@@vexthegreat9453 i agree. Performance is king.
Why doesn't Sony allow an option to select 1440p on monitors?!?!
Because they're mean. But seriously I know the pain. The unfortunate truth is that monitors are a smaller market share for ps4 users and 1440p is even smaller. It doesn't seem hard to do, most games already run at 1440p on Pro anyway. The only solution really is to a newer monitor; most modern 1440p monitors will accept and downsample a 4k signal.
Same reason Nintendo doesn't. These are meant for TVs in a living room.
Because they are closed platform. Options are for open platform like PC.
Microsoft allows it, don't know why Sony still doesn't allow it.
@@terryyee4271 the Xbox supports 1440p and VRR, Sony are anti consumer
I have my PS4pro running on an internal 500G Samsung 860 SSD
That's pretty awesome, but how is 500G treating you? I can't imagine you'd be able to put more than 5AAA games . . .
@@jheref lol what?
@Transistor Jump more recent ones are around 60-70 though no?
I was just asking a question and now people are making fun of me 🤷🏽♂️ so much for open conversation
I'm using a 2Tb Firecuda SSHD. Just as good, but cheaper.
The first 5:25 minutes had nothing to do with the title of the video... Come on guys.
Fully agree, it's a bit annoying.
If you already have base PS4 - better off saving $$ for PS5. Slim is also quieter than Pro, if that matters to you.
A lot of people are not poor and can buy one right now and not need to save for anything. You have broke logic my friend
@Hallison Michel Exactly. Played on base PS4 and PS4 Pro, and I really don't see a difference. At least not enough to justify getting a pro over the OG PS4.
That's the best approach, even when it was new Pro was already a more attractive offering for people who didn't own a PS4.
SteelSkin667 does anyone know if the pro is just as quite as the slim when running in 1080p instead of 4k. Surely if the pro is not pushing 4k it’s working less so there’s less stress on the hardware therefore it should be cooler and quieter than if it was attached to a 4k tv. I really don’t want a noisy machine at the foot of my bed!
@@thebossman80s In theory that should be the case, although in practice it probably depends a lot on the game.
The ps4pro is what the og ps4 was supposed to be
True 👍
the original ps4 is a great machine, and still the leader of the un-enhanced consoles. I think that phrase works better for Xbox since the x1 was subpar, and the X is such a competent improvement. But I never felt a generation behind on og PS4 like I did on my Xbone early to mid gen.
In 2013 a 4.2 tf gpu with a 2.8 tf cpu and 9gb of gddr5 wouldve costed a arm and a leg.
@@tymo8708 ps4 pro has 8GB of GDDR5, and a 2,1Ghz Cpu, and would cost an arm a leg and a eye 🤣
@@viniciuscoxoba3842 the ps4 pro has an extra gb of ddr3 hs but its cpu caps out at 2.8 tflops of computing power in 64 bit. And the cpus from 2013 that had such power often costed more than 400 bucks
Love the little chat at the beginning and the postman guest + unboxing !! New DF style of content, loving the low key vibe of it !
You know, i subbed to you guys for DFR. The series was so good and there was a point where a new video was out every week. John clearly has an incredible passion for this stuff and as nice as his perspective is on newer games he provides an essential, high quality documentation and historical preservation. I'd love to see him give more forgotten ambitious classics and landmark games the attention they deserve
Xbox One X and PS4 Pro are the first consoles in history trully optimized for 1080p
Xbox one X optimized for 4K...what are u talking about?????
@@TyJosh Xbox one x and ps4 pro are a fake k consoles
@@mohamadnasmeer6311 Red Dead Redemption 2, Forza Horizon 4 and other games are in native 4k on Xbox One X
So Sony still heavily advertise it as a 4K gaming console, yet it can only really manage 1080P.. says it all really.
It.csn do 4k depend on game. Same.with PC.
Michael Mayers Their are only 10 that can manage it... at 60FPS and even then I do believe the performance isn’t smooth.
@@marksapollo there are more than 10
most the games i have on pro run at 1080p 60fps, for me thats how the generation should have been all along.
Almost no PS4 game runs with 60fps.
@Transistor Jump no, fact. This very same RUclips channel here has videos here that prove that.
@Transistor Jump wow, you destroyed me, if I would care about that. The kid here, seems to be you, defending a plastic box, like it's important. Get a life, go outside, might help, might.
@Cat Man yeah, this channel shows it, and yet these idiots lie. Not understanding the internet in a nutshell.
@Cat Man actually most games are 60fps. But almost every openworld game is 30fps.
Almost every indie game is 60fps, every fighter, most racers, sports and shooters are 60fps. The majority is 60fps by far.
Still too many 30fps games though.
For some reason, multiplayer in Bloodborne is waaay less laggy on a PS4 Pro running boost mode, than on a standard PS4. We already know the differences in loading times and the slight stabilizing of Bloodborne's frame pacing issues, but you can feel the biggest difference in performance when playing coop for example. Some time ago, I was running through forbidden woods with two friends, playing on standard PS4s. And they were both complaining about huge lags. And I could see that later in a recording of one of them. But my own game ran really smooth, almost as good as it would in offline mode.
John, take care of your health please. You just went to open the door for the postman and you got out of breath. An improved diet + 2-3 days of exercise will help you a lot!
Background music:
Bjørn Lynne - Over Distant Shores
Remember when the PS3 and Xbox 360 were announced with Sony and Microsoft toting the possibility of 1080p gaming? It only took until 2018 for the XboneX and PS4 Pro to let people do it reliably on console. Wew lads.
PS3 did have 1080p games though. No one ever said everything would be that.
got a pro on 1080p, play all the game a can in performance and I love it! God of war on performance mode was a game changer for me.
Richard's laugh at around 2:20 is the best part of the video.
Day 1 adopter to the Ps4 pro, this system has been a godsend for 1080p gaming on a plasma. Nioh, Nier, FFXV, RE:2, Battlefield 1, KH3, just to name a few
Oh yes, playing the pro on a plasma tv is the best way.
plasma ew. even the best ones are bad today, because of gas leaving (huge issue with plasma). oled for me. hdr gaming is amazing.
Love the PS3 music visuals behind John!
I'm getting one just for the higher and stable framerate. Especially for the fact dark souls 3 got a patch for it.
Did the same today. No fucks given. PS5 can wait until next year.
@Aputsiaq Lennert YEAH, BUT FOR HIM IT CAN WAIT FOR MORE ONE YEAR.
@@xeraliZe that's so true, I'm saving for a ps4 pro rn. I'll enjoy as much as I can the ps4 until i played every single game that i like with an stable performance. The ps5 doesn't let you play every game you had on the ps4 and there's not that much games in there so I'll be waiting a couple years I think.
@@jsr6579 Preach. Exactly what I'm talking about. There's so many good games or hidden gems on the PS4. Plus, you'll have a smoother experience too. Don't regret getting a PS4 Pro one bit.
In regard of 1080p and checkerboard rendering, the image is reconstructed and then downscaled. It doesn't loose sharpness from being upscaled and then downscaled. If the process is concatenated then it should far exceed a native 1080p image. I bought my PS4 Pro solely for the anti-aliasing properties on a downscaling to 1080p. I could not be happier.
Back in the day I also bought PS4 Pro, at first , I thought it is overrated , but it turns out , those benchmark video on RUclips prove the PS4 Slim is just Way too weak , barely hit 1080P
Consoles could have 32 cores 64 threads CPU at 12GHz , 128 Tflops GPU , 2TB GDDR8 ram , SSD 50000 MB/s read/write speeds
and developers will still be like "naah man , not enough horsepower , we make our games 30fps with drops at 20s"
Devs makeing their games on pcs to run on consoles basically. So not optimizing lol
We need a PS4 Pro Slim.
Every paycheck take about $50 out and put away until you got about $600 saved for PS5
fredcrewneck that’s what I do , be ready for it also I need to save for a 4K tv
@@TheBrightjay 4k TVs are cheap now too
@@TheBrightjay TCL
I’d love to see more of what John gets delivered and added to his collection 😆👍
"You know Alfred Chicken?.....Yeah I know Alfred Chicken" XD best part of the video
Wow! Richard actually found a use for the Radeon VII!
Shots fired :)
I know you guys could have edited out the post-man bit, but I am glad you guys kept it haha. :)
I'd love to see a similar topic, but revisiting the base Xbox One (not the S model) and see how it handles some of the most demanding titles that have come out recently.
@ 7:03, so, changing your resolution changes the rendering mode. Right, so what happens to performance if you select 720p? Does that just render at 1080p and downscale to 720p? Or is there additional performance increases to be had with lowering the resolution even more? Or, is it a separate option to the resolution option, and instead the supersampling option?
game is rendered at 1080p still and scaled down. this has been tested before but don't have the link to hand. basically nothing happens
Ah, thank you for that! That's what I thought would happen, but I don't have a PS4 to try it on.
It's kind of a bummer, to be completely honest.... being able to run it on a tiny screen, at the best framerate would be a pretty neat novelty.
Play God of War on Pro in Performance Mode is an amazing experience! 🎮
Is it 60?
@@someonesomewhere8658 Most of the time yes with a dip around the bifrost temple area
@@someonesomewhere8658 It's unlocked, much smoother. And the Supersampling make the visuals polished.
It'll play better on the ps5 I'd wait.
I prefer locked 30fps to unstable 45fps.
I switched up and paid the difference. Totally worth it if you want good FPS on heavier games. I actually enjoy the games now.
I think the Pro is more of a 1440p machine as most pro enhanced games render at that resolution, but I do agree that performance should be the priority. So games that are at resolutions higher than 1080p but have framerate dips below 30 fps (Fallout 4 & Skyrim for example) would benefit much more if they’re rendering at 1080p locked 30 or 60
Loving these regular chat episodes.
Interesting. So PSVR is 1080P. Does this also mean that setting your PS4 Pro to 720P while using VR will improve your VR performance?
I really loved the stuff at the end with the mail man. What a fun little aspect to include. Thank you for not editing it out!!!
The PS4 Pro is marketed as a 4K machine eventhough it is not. Yes it is an upgrade, but it does not nearly match the quality of the Xbox One X.
If Microsoft did a Pro upgrade, they would have been slaughtered by the media. I'm glad DF provides facts on the lack of the Pro eing a 4K machine. Still not a bad machine!
it supports native 4k/uhd so yeah it's a 4k machine. it had native 4k games running at 60 fps many months before xbox one x even launched and one x is too weak for proper 4k anyway which is why all games are 30 fps or upscaling. the first true 4k console will be the ps5 in a year.
@@Dr.WhetFarts actually it is you who is mis Informed. Plenty of games run native 4k 60fps on the x plus the x is capable of using 4k assest which is usually only found on pc the pro gets 4k artifacts and jaggies edges with up scaling. If you really think about it the x would smoke alot of high end pc had it just had a proper cpu because it's gpu is pretty insane for a lil console. At best the pro is a 1080p up scale to 1440p very rare does it hit 4k and even more rare native 4k. Take shadow of war as an example the x is using assest the ps4 don't even get which you find on pc trust me the gap is much bigger between the x and pro not so such between Base to pro so I would just get a Base ps4 it's what I did.
@@stolenname94 I agree with most of that apart from the X beating a lot of high end machines even with a decent CPU. The X would being a decent Mid-range PC if it had a capable CPU.
Ps4 pro is so bad lol
Been sitting on the idea of getting a Pro since release and never went for it. The next generation is too close to make a purchase now.
ngu0061 agreed
I'm just hoping that PS5 has PS4 backwards compatibility.
@@CaveyMoth It does, it's already been confirmed.
Hearing John speak german genuinely warmed my heart 😊
Dankeschöön, tschüüss :)
Isn’t he American?
Ikr? I always thought he was American. Didn't know that he could speak German as well.
@@KeyToAnime I think he is American, but living in Germany
@@theFrizzleFry I'm fairly sure he's German.
Waited for about 5,5 minutes for you to get to the main subject. Thank you...
The Surge was also a great 1080p60 game on pro. Loved it, also because of the fluidity compared to the Souls games.
That and Surge 2 are fun to play!
I was on a budget and got the fifa 18 extra controller bundle for the slim, I don't regret my purchase tbh.
Still better than my old 4y/o laptop that now that can't even running new games xD
I think, the PS4's system-wide down sampling from 4K to 2K/Full HD is something that's transparent to the game/software. It's something behind the scene. Basically PS4 declared that it's plugged to a 4K screen (and allocate 2160p framebuffer) to the software. The game render to the framebuffer with that resolution, then OS then downscale it to 1080p resolution.
Maybe exposing a flag showing that the output will be finally down-scaled would lose that transparency. I don't know if it's a good idea though :-/.
The super sampling mode is more than likely doing what you are describing. I'm not sure whether the scaling to the output resolution is handled by the software or by the system, but since developers can manually set the rendering resolution depending on the front-end settings, there's a chance that it is the former, whereas Xbox probably handles scaling from whatever arbitrarily sized framebuffer it is given to the output resolution. There's a chance that exposing a flag would either require to change the way the console handles scaling, or require developers to plan for a third 'downscale to 1080p' setting in their game.
That guy who described caressing the console looks exactly like you think a guy who would describe caressing a console would look like.
If your PS4 Pro is loud, get a vertical stand on eBay for like $15. They install with one screw and my ps4 pro I bought the week it released has never been very loud. The additional surface area of the console standing vertically I think helps keep it cooler and really keep air moving through the console better than if you sit it horizontally
Its better to change thermal grease even if its new.
Ive got my pro horizontal but its raised up slightly on foam pads, increases airflow and the foam pads cut out any vibration noise.
what was the reason to reupload?
Alfred Chicken backlash.
@@pandapolygon Lol!!! I had to recheck my internet connection.
Copyright
This was super fun to watch! Especially the last third with John's postman. Thank you guys! I wonder if John actually speaks German - you can at least hear him say "Dankeschön" and "Tschüss!".
He lives in Germany
24:48 Richard's "I cannot work like this!" face. 😄
PS4 pro hits the sweet spot for 1080p gaming twice as much GPU power and extra CPU performance.
Why do you guys always laugh awkwardly when you say hi to each other at the start of a video?
they're still a lil awkward since they made out at the company christmas party
Kind of awkward to begin with, so for some people it's funny and make the other person laugh. These aren't the kind of guys that are used to being on TV or camera, but that's just the kind of age we live in right now where these types of people who has expertise in this area can actually find an audience and following.
lmao, for real.
DylValentine LOL
Good concept for a vid. Nice to listen in on a convo with the DF folks.
Okay I really liked that ending. Please more of that!
28:54
Speaking of Tom. Why is he never in DF Direct?
I cant get used to Bloodstained running animation ,, still looks like she is running wearing rollerblades
But doesn't the PS4 Pro always downsample from 4k? meaning you are getting performance at a 4K level, even if display is 'downsampled' to 1080p?
Is it me or does John Linneman Kinda look like Wreck it Ralph?
@Digital Foundry, would you guys be able to test if lowering the resolution for 720 would increase framerate? Monster Hunter World struggles to go over 50fps, and I wonder if it can reach 60fps on 720p.
I think 900p should be enough
@@ShooNeyt you can't force 900p. only options are 720p and 1080p, and 4k.
720p won't do you any good because PS4 games aren't rendered at 720p. The PS4 would simply downscale it.
@@symphony137 I'm not so sure
@@Solegor he's right. Other than 4K and 1080p, and even that is on a game by game basis, the PS4 settings are for display output only and don't affect rendering. Only options you get are up to the developers, if there's performance mode and resolution mode, etc.
The xbox one x is a better option for cross platform games
Don't use facts here. 😁 I was just going to say the same thing. It's nice switching the display option to 1080p 120hz sometimes. Especially with online shooters. 🤪
I think it all comes down to price. PS4 Pro has very good discounts depending on where you live. Microsoft is just not doing justice with their marketing to compete, I really want to try Xbox one X, but there is no deals like 300 dollar brand new PS4 Pro from Sony I am having right now. And it seems like Xbox is NA and EU thing. I would be like playing single player in online games if I play Xbox one in Japan.
The PS4 Pro is a better option for Death Stranding!!! 👌👌👌
Not everyone can and want multiple consoles hooked up, if they have to pick one it has to be the Pro surely as you can play all them cross platform games anyway plus much more.
@@IronsWorks1990 but if your someone like me who prefers better graphics and better performance xbox one x is where my money is
1080P is more than enough even 4K material Looks Perfect on it . Tested on Sony Realty X Pro Series 3D TVs
I still own a 1080p screen but you conviced me to get a PS4 Pro. Now I am wondering how to decide which type of HDMI cable you need for your gaming needs. Perhaps it's interesting to share your thoughts on this in a video? Anyway thanks for the PS4 Pro tip!
I'm fully satisfied with my Ps4 Pro Purchase and i'm ready for the PS5
You complete fool
@@carbonsuicidemtb1583 don't see how im fool of Im satisfied with the product i purchuse
@@acebreaker7 that is exactly why you are a fool
Get a PC instead of getting a ps4 pro then a ps5
@@theroyalmemes8611 I've been on pc since 2012 and I regret it the lack of quality 3rd person games is unbearable
PC has a lot of which I don't give a shit about simulators strategic games and fps (which is just reskinned trash) nothing unique
So I'm thinking but ps4 pro or wait for PS5?
Wait, so DON'T enable supersampling mode?
@AnEn what games benefit from supersampling
@AnEn Would you recommend buying a Ps4 pro for the supersamplig feature? Is the difference noticeable? Less jaggies etc
@@Bcap222 It seems to me that Sony first party titles clearly benefits for the supersampling without any performance issues. I have a pro setup for a 40inch 1080p led tv and all their first party titles run smoothly with supersampling enabled but there's a few issue in 3rd party triple A titles like the Wither 3 with supersampling enabled but when turning off the ss mode, it runs smooth again. Here's my final though: The PS4 Pro is worth every penny for a 1080P Led TV (every games are now rendered in a native 1080P plus a huge improvement in performance) rather than a fake 4k renederd with a dip in performance.
One of the main benefits from the pro is the vr, and as they stated better 1080p . I have a pro since launch and love it. The upscale is not bad and I've enjoyed better looking vr titles but if I was to buy a pro now would not be worth it with the 5 looming around the corner.
With PS5 coming soon, I would say wait for the PS5 arrival for stable 1080/60fps or maybe even 4k/60fps(?).
If switching to 1080p will make my Pro less noisy I'm all for it, thing sounds like a rocket blasting off into space. I have my One X for 4K anyway lol
Pro is great for 1080p screens as it does not have a 1440p output and very few games are 4K.
X1X is great for 1440p-4K screens.
@@AssassinIsAfk sure but pro and ps4 are 3 years apart yet not that differenent.
@Andrei Despinoiu and mp is only 1080p
@@AssassinIsAfk , 1080p vs 4K is a huge difference. Unless your viewing distance is too far.
@@vandammage1747 😨😭👈😂😂
@@vandammage1747 there is more difference between the pro and base ps4 than the pro and X
I was just considering this, thanks for the timely video.
The segment of John talking about his Twin Famicom is once again reminding me of passing up a JVC X'Eye back in 2002.
I was on a mission to own every Sega console variant ever, and I desperately wanted an X'Eye not just for its two in one aspect, but mainly for its S-Video output.
I had a chance to get one for $20, and it worked and ran PERFECTLY!!! But it was absolutely destroyed cosmetically.
I turned it down due to the cosmetics, and I still hate myself to this day for not buying it.
Ugh.....
Do you still get the performance upgrades on the ps4 pro in 1080 with boost mode and super sampling on?
Not with supersampling. But with everything else yes.
Do ps4 pro have low fps on 1080p than ps4 slim?
@@rockbrayn978 no, it always has higher fps than PS4 Slim when it output Regular 1080P without Supersampling, PS4 Slim barely even hit 1080P
Shame 1080p isnt a thing anymore in my house. Its like playing in 720p now.
Games are 1080p
18:04 I'm one of those people. But I watch DF because you guys show a lot of side by side comparisons. That's a lot easier than figuring out the settings yourself.
So hurray for DF ! :)
The PRO also helps a lot in many PSVR games.
Ps4 pro was the first console purchase since 3do that I actually regretted. The Xbox one x was a massive upgrade. The ps4p isn’t even necessarily an upgrade at all for me. Graphics are negligibly improved, I can hear the system running from the other room, I guess it saves me money on running the heater during winter?
If you own a ps4, do not upgrade. If you do not own a ps4, get the slim instead.
I agree I had the pro I was disappointed from day one so I sold it after several months of playing games that looked just about the same way they do on ps4 base the pro was pointless I got the X now and difference is real
Nope, PS4 pro have better performace than the base version or slim, so there is a big difference here
Eko Permana are you talking about the 40ish fps sometimes 50 reaching for 60 frames per second performance mode option because thats not big not even consistent you will see when ps5 comes out and run those ps4 games the way they were meant with a solid 60
@@alecatttheman896 yes it is, as someone who already fit with 60fps, there is a big difference between 40fps and 30fps. 40fps on the pro is very consistent, unlike PC
@@alecatttheman896 you said you felt dissapointed by the pro, is it because the pro and the base version difference only 10-20fps? But, you said there is a big difference between the pro and the X, when the fact is, The X just slighly better than the pro. The X vs PS4 pro, is just same as PS4 Pro vs base version, there is a contradiction in your statement
I don't want to sound like an asshole but: had 1080p 240hz gsync monitor and to say the truth, framerate is something I quickly forget about. The fact that I am running a game almost 240fps is something You get used to and stop noticing. Few hours with 60 or even 30 fps and I am used to those again. Ofcourse 30fps only with gamepad and 60 with mouse or gamepad. 30 is unplayable with mouse. Good motion blur does a lot of work to make 30 or 60fps look great. 24fps video looks smooth because each frame is a capture of time frame and posed static frame.
And since Ive got 4k 27" freesync ips monitor... I am always in awe of 4k detail and antialiasing. Freesync with rtss locked to 58fps is doing amazing work too. No tearing, low input lag, no microstutter...Going back to 1080p ps4 games is ok but its more jarring than going back to 30 or 60fps from high refresh rate.
Tldr: I quickly get used to framerates as long as they are stable but 4k is always nice.
Nobody's talking about the fact that DF members were already in quarantine way before coronavirus.
Hey John, couldn't help but notice the panzer dragoon titles missing from that backlog of games.... If you think I'll forget you're mistaken, and if you think I'll forgive you give me far too much credit.
I play my pro on a 720p display, haha.
: (
All I care about is if the fan is as loud as a 747 or not
if u get the og pro model then yeh but if u get the newer 7215b model then no
shouldn't even be a question. it's the definitive PS4 and if you like anything more than 1080p it's worth it as well. while not as strong as the xbox one x, the exclusives library is GI-FUCKING-GANTIC. It amazes me how people are still stuck on 720 and 1080p when we've been blessed with 4k years ago. 4k HDR 10 televisions are so cheap compared to even 2 years ago it's ridiculous. you owe it to yourself to upgrade from 1080p to 4k and get the PS4 Pro. When it's on sale it's literally only $50 more than the crappy slim...
The postman always rings twice.
I was just reading your comment when the doorbell rang
I knew that this boy was a fool for blonds
What happened?
NEW RULE: Whenever a DF Direct gets hijacked Richard must do fast rhythmic hand gestures (or voguing) to German house music.
If music is unavailable Stewie Griffin style "oonce tss oonce tss oonce tss" mouth noises made by a crew member will work too.
I need this
Does DF have a podcast that i could get the audio version of these sort of chats? Would definitely give it more of a listen on my daily commute to work. Great video again guys. Insightful as always.
Tom Pitcher YT premium helps!
Richard doesn't like messing around
I feel like i've just watched this? What happened?
it was a video from back in the day but different. i sorta remember it being the same but not completely
@@FreeAimDog no this video got reuploaded it was uploaded like yesterday originally, some copyright claim probably.
@@HEADSHOTPROLOL yesterday? i was not online much yesterday so thats why i must have missed it
Had it for 2 years now on 1080P, i'm so thankful for choosing a Pro.
ps4 does 1080p also
@@tommybull6578 Yeah, i obviously know that.
Have you watched the video?
PS4 Pro has supersampling, so 1080P with Pro still looks better than 1080P with base model and at some games keep steadier fps or higher fps.
I have the PS4 Pro & a 1080tv. I enjoyed God of War on performance sure is not 60fps locked but i preferred playing that way than with 30fps.
Watched the first one and I'm back!! Can't get enough of Richard (WICHARD) and John L...
Should we have super sampling turned on for the Ps4 pro? What's the recommendation? It's annoying we have to go into the settings to change this system wide, I want to set it and play my games.
Why wouldn't all 4k panels just handle 1080p by doing 4:1 scaling? It should look just as crisp as a 1080p panel at the same size.
Some just can't do nearest neighbor scaling, for some reason. I've heard that Vizio HDTVs in particular have poor upscaling. =\
@@CaveyMoth That doesn't make sense, nearest neighbor is for when there is a "mismatched" resolution, say 720 to 1080 or 1080 to 1440. For 1080 to 4K it's just make one pixel 4 pixels, a simple integer scale that shouldn't require any processing.
@@pieguy1098 Ohhh. I thought that nearest neighbor was simply a direct, multiplicative conversion based on whole numbers. Or something.
1080p looks perfect on all my 4k/uhd tv's...
@@pieguy1098 You clearly don't know what nearest neighbor scaling is.
Team Xbox is terrible about marketing, no doubt about it. However, PlayStation is terrible about hardware, no doubt about it. When you make a 4K console and it doesn't do 4K, but makes 1080p better, there are serious problems there. Sony and Microsoft should just work together. Microsoft should make the console hardware and the network and Sony should just make some games and do marketing.
I got a 1Tb PS4 Slim with RDR2 and GoW for $180. Saved the rest for the upcoming PlayStation.
its going to suck to play gow in 30 fps (with drops)... pro does 60 fps mode of the time in comparison.
@@Dr.WhetFarts no it doesn't. The pro runs the game at 45 fps with judder. A performance analysis video is here on the channel.