South America in the dream makes me think of where the coffee plant grows, and that there seems to be a contrast of nature symbols and cultural ones.. the rivers and fish vs the modern culture symbols which are broken, or bland, the broken coffee machine, the paper cups, the bad coffee… but older cultural symbols are still alive like the knights and the king and could bring life and something to fight for…
Loved his distinction between dreams and visions. Visions are broken down into three categories by St. Augustine who borrowed heavily from the ideas of latter Neoplatonists, imaginative (in dreams), corporeal (occur when we are awake) and finally intellectual where the mind suddenly grasps some revealed truth. The first two include universal characteristics like rays of light. The rushing sounds heard during this process, according to Iamblichus, were the same sounds generated by the movement of stars and recreated by Pythagoras in his prototheurgical rites as a means of initiating his pupils into this inner mystery of the midnight sun. Great interview.
Loved the entire conversation, learned a lot. However the part closest to my heart was when you were rooting for and cheering the dreamer ❤ I hope he decides to follow his bliss ⭐️🙏🏼⭐️
This episode is such a treat! I am reading Jung’s Map of the Soul at the moment and wish I had found it earlier. It is so helpful, many thanks to Murray Stein. And to the three of you of course for all that you share in the podcast.
Interesting example of symbolism within music, which can evoke unconscious feelings. When experienced collectively within a political context (such as Hitler did with Wagner), the symbol evoking the yet unconscious feeling can be disorienting and twist people in the wrong direction, but is it really "symbol" within music (not containing language) that evokes unconscious feeling? I guess the takeaway is that we should recognize the power of symbol and better learn how to work with it.
My first time commenting. 1st, I've watched a few dozen episodes over the last few years. Thank you for these wonderful posts and I'm certain everyone who views them feels the same. Ok, so the dream. Much was discussed re the knights drinking coffee. Aside from images of a Monty Python movie coming to mind, I had a different take...though im not in your domain. Joseph referenced possible bullying when the dreamer was young. Wondering now that he has matured that the knights drinking coffee were the former bullies. Clad in armor that protected them from harm. Is this not the persona of a bully...bullied themselves? And drinking lousy coffee from paper cups. They, being humbled by tilting up their "masks" so they could drink. They exposed their hidden/protected, vulnerable, human identity. I would expect an armored knight to be clanging their metal cups with a "manly" beverage, like beer. But coffee? Paper cups? Maybe he is seeing these threats from the past (and even the present) as no longer a threat. They are regular, frail, humans. As for piranhas, they attack in schools, so there are many. Or are they "beat myself up" for not continuing in school? The river was dry, not real, no real fish to draw my blood, destroy me...and the intro punitive torment about not finishing school is also a mechanism to freeze progress. I'm a 70 yr old male, worked on a psych unit in college and few years after. Then a long career in business. Was introduced to Joseph Campbell's work by a movement therapist I dated for a couple of years in the '70's, which led me to Jungs work
Deep and rich, I soaked it all up. In King Arthur's legends, in addition to going to battle, knights also sit around the round table to discuss, argue and resolve. Great discussion here, thank you!
In my opinion, a symbol is strictly constituted by the elements of sign instead a function as a sign. So, it should be recognizable as visual stimuli to evoke the experience. A symbol is an concrete representation of an abstract entity, so sound and scent in nature had a limited function to grasp this abstract ideas of certain entity. Except, if we could properly translate what we want to represent with a proper association that satisfy both of the intelligibility between the realm of vision and the realm of others non-visual sensories. For example, we use freshness of water to 'symbolized' idea of blue and a scent of mushed leaf as idea of green to a blind person.
Very nice and interesting. One thing, Jesus Christ is an archetype and not more, trust me. Suddenly pops up a question in me. What is the difference between the intelligence of the dreammaker and our personal intelligence.
I love the art of symbols. It’s gotten me deep into Reiki and sacred geometry.
South America in the dream makes me think of where the coffee plant grows, and that there seems to be a contrast of nature symbols and cultural ones.. the rivers and fish vs the modern culture symbols which are broken, or bland, the broken coffee machine, the paper cups, the bad coffee… but older cultural symbols are still alive like the knights and the king and could bring life and something to fight for…
Loved his distinction between dreams and visions. Visions are broken down into three categories by St. Augustine who borrowed heavily from the ideas of latter Neoplatonists, imaginative (in dreams), corporeal (occur when we are awake) and finally intellectual where the mind suddenly grasps some revealed truth. The first two include universal characteristics like rays of light. The rushing sounds heard during this process, according to Iamblichus, were the same sounds generated by the movement of stars and recreated by Pythagoras in his prototheurgical rites as a means of initiating his pupils into this inner mystery of the midnight sun. Great interview.
Thank you! That was insightful!
very heavy man. man if you get bored we can talk here about this topic I would like to recommend you books. We can talk on email also. Take care
Jung said "beware of unearned wisdom" regarding psychedelics
Loved the entire conversation, learned a lot.
However the part closest to my heart was when you were rooting for and cheering the dreamer ❤
I hope he decides to follow his bliss ⭐️🙏🏼⭐️
This episode is such a treat! I am reading Jung’s Map of the Soul at the moment and wish I had found it earlier. It is so helpful, many thanks to Murray Stein. And to the three of you of course for all that you share in the podcast.
This conversation is a powerful symbol in itself.
The difference between hallucination and vision is so simple and mindblowing
Thanks!
This is a very valuable interview, thank you 🙏
How come an episode on Wotan hasn't been done yet? 🤔
They've definitely mentioned Wotan before, maybe in the archetype of war episode?
Great interview
Interesting example of symbolism within music, which can evoke unconscious feelings. When experienced collectively within a political context (such as Hitler did with Wagner), the symbol evoking the yet unconscious feeling can be disorienting and twist people in the wrong direction, but is it really "symbol" within music (not containing language) that evokes unconscious feeling?
I guess the takeaway is that we should recognize the power of symbol and better learn how to work with it.
One day the ice cream cone will take its place in the gallery of archetypes.
My first time commenting. 1st, I've watched a few dozen episodes over the last few years. Thank you for these wonderful posts and I'm certain everyone who views them feels the same.
Ok, so the dream. Much was discussed re the knights drinking coffee. Aside from images of a Monty Python movie coming to mind, I had a different take...though im not in your domain.
Joseph referenced possible bullying when the dreamer was young. Wondering now that he has matured that the knights drinking coffee were the former bullies. Clad in armor that protected them from harm. Is this not the persona of a bully...bullied themselves? And drinking lousy coffee from paper cups. They, being humbled by tilting up their "masks" so they could drink. They exposed their hidden/protected, vulnerable, human identity. I would expect an armored knight to be clanging their metal cups with a "manly" beverage, like beer. But coffee? Paper cups?
Maybe he is seeing these threats from the past (and even the present) as no longer a threat.
They are regular, frail, humans.
As for piranhas, they attack in schools, so there are many.
Or are they "beat myself up" for not continuing in school? The river was dry, not real, no real fish to draw my blood, destroy me...and the intro punitive torment about not finishing school is also a mechanism to freeze progress.
I'm a 70 yr old male, worked on a psych unit in college and few years after. Then a long career in business. Was introduced to Joseph Campbell's work by a movement therapist I dated for a couple of years in the '70's, which led me to Jungs work
"Power is not alluring to the pure mind." -Thomas Jefferson.
Thanks
Deep and rich, I soaked it all up. In King Arthur's legends, in addition to going to battle, knights also sit around the round table to discuss, argue and resolve. Great discussion here, thank you!
Jung’s Map of the Soul is excellent for a relative newcomer like me. Love it
Would you guys ever do Active Imagination interpretations?
dual aspect monism sounds interesting,monadology is Leibniz not Spinoza but how you describe it seems similar to chitta in vedic science
I like Debbi’s taste for clothes ❤❤❤
❤❤
what about smells? like candles inscents could does be signs and symbols ?
In my opinion, a symbol is strictly constituted by the elements of sign instead a function as a sign. So, it should be recognizable as visual stimuli to evoke the experience. A symbol is an concrete representation of an abstract entity, so sound and scent in nature had a limited function to grasp this abstract ideas of certain entity. Except, if we could properly translate what we want to represent with a proper association that satisfy both of the intelligibility between the realm of vision and the realm of others non-visual sensories. For example, we use freshness of water to 'symbolized' idea of blue and a scent of mushed leaf as idea of green to a blind person.
❤❤❤
🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🏆
Very nice and interesting. One thing, Jesus Christ is an archetype and not more, trust me.
Suddenly pops up a question in me. What is the difference between the intelligence of the dreammaker and our personal intelligence.
look out, we got an expert here lol !