These are our silent obsessions stemming from perfectionism. I still find it funny how some professional players and streamers don’t share the obsession with this level of optimization!!
This is nuts... only a true academic would be so thorough! I applaud your dedication to accuracy! Has there been a comparison of wireless latency on all these controllers?
Yeah, it's also in the video (still available in the description). I don't think the wireless results are affected by the bug but I haven't had the time to retest those.
@@RocketScienceplease reply me . What if I’m using Xbox x controller connected from usb c thuntherbolt to usb c thuntherbolt to my z690 motherboard directly !? I’m felling it’s going crazy fast on input lag, I even feel the difference if I use a normal usbc to usbc non thuntherbolt cable. And of course crazier slow usbc to usb 2.0. You can make a test insert to think I’m crazy but I feel difference
Thank you for this. Clear sign of professionalism to admit a mistake like this and figuring out the cause of it. Looking forward to new video! Please keep up the good work you are doing.
Can you report this finding to your motherboard vendor so they do in-lab testing and fix this damn bug for their next MB series? Otherwise they wont do shit and other users will suffer
Don't worry, if it's about Rocket League we'll make sure to pay attention ;) At this point, we don't know whether it's something on our end or if it's for example chipset related. We're in contact with Rocket Science and will investigate the problem to hopefully find the root cause and to see if it affects only this platform or others as well. For now, we can only suggest to connect your controller to the USB ports highlighted green in the thumbnail of this video. After all, we don't want you to get 'what a saved' because of input lag (I might personally use it as an excuse for whiffing though).
@@MSIGamingOfficial Holy Smokes these badasses showed up in a super niche YT video comments section to help with a tiny technical problem? My next products will be MSI no doubt. Previous MSI user BTW. Legends for showing up.
this may sound weird, but couple years ago I had a theory that different usb ports are giving me different inputlag.. and this was only by "feel" and not tested or anything... since then I always plugged my mice and controller to the usb ports that I felt was the fastest. (which are the 4 USB ports that are directly connected to the CPU) turns out I did it right all along... thanks for the finding hwd
@cas curse dumb take.. if you play a lot of latency sensitive games you can absolutely feel a difference of latency to this degree. Please go watch aperture grills latest video on latency split testing, and look at his results. I downloaded the tool myself and can consistently guess the difference between 0 and 4ms latency. And this is with only 144hz. There is a massive difference to the feeling of inputs when it's delayed by even several ms that you will notice as feeling desynced from what you expect to see. People who don't know any better or just don't do any latency sensitive gaming, ignorantly and baselessly assume this is all meaningless because "human reaction time is only ~200ms you will never notice a few ms" but as explained in the aperture grille video, there is a giant difference between reacting to a visual stimuli and having to process a physical response, vs creating an input yourself and noticing a difference in response from the game.
From all I know the issue with AMD Ryzen systems has something to do with the polling of the devices. It seems to depend on how many interfaces are needed to be polled per controller and how fast. Meaning the more devices are connected to the same USB controller the higher the chance that something has problems. But the chance also increase the higher the polling rate is. Also the devices which are enumerated first seems to have no problems, but the later they are enumerated the higher the chance is that some interface from that device isn't polled correctly anymore. This is true if the devices share the same bus, meaning if they use the same USB speed (like USB full-speed which is common for input devices). So using a USB hub can change this because then the low speed data is send over the hi-speed bus instead. So as long as there is only one device connected per USB controller they should work fine. Like if you connect the game controller to a USB port handled by the CPU and your mouse to a port handled by the chipset or vice versa while don't have any other USB device connected (so no keyboard and so on) you should not have any additional weird input delays. By the way, to me this seems to be an AMD issue and not a mainboard vendor one.
@@theshowtime4123 It only makes a difference for playstation controllers, but basically make sure to only use the USB ports that come from the CPU and not the motherboard. (in my case motherboard ports are in the front)
@@BlackFlameBoss I have the same issue, my pc is pre-built by Lenevo, so I am going to try to contact them to know which usb ports are connected to my cpu and which are connected to my chipsets. Anyways thanks !
This man is a God amongst mortals. I KNEW I was feeling problems in certain USB ports but not others. People on the internet told me I was crazy. But I’m not. I knew it. You would think in 2021 when you buy a game and a controller, it should just work. But no, some of us have to go through hell to make our game feel right. Thank you man. For all this hard work.
I was losing my mind over this for months!!!!! I was using a scuf controller and I received a noticeable lagging input. I switched to a cheap Xbox controller and it worked fine. I switched cables and ran multiple test, I emailed scuf and they had no clue. I am running a b450 rog stix with an AMD processor. I'm glad you found this bc I thought I was just crazy!!!!
hey rocket science. I have an elite series 2 and have been dealing with insane amounts of input lag. At times paying on my Xbox felt better than being on my pc until I came across this video. Turns out that i was dealing with the same usb bug and adding the adapter made a massive improvement. thank you for taking the time to research stuff no one else does. Also noticed that over time the input delay got worse and worse. not really sure why that is but you have saved me from throwing my pc out of the window lol.
I have been using front panel just because they are easier to reach. But I have also always been a console player so anything PC feels way less laggy. But I may try rear ports just to see if its better. Im old and slow so I most likely wont see any different. XD
@@njb-mm7129 I have been playing since december of 2019 and actually trying since March April of last year. Currently d2-d3. Have hit champ but can't stay there. I'm happy with my progess. Will get to gc one day.
The dedication to the accuracy, and integrity of your content is excellent. Much appreciated. One question. Regarding DS4Windows, I doubt the input lag reading from that software is 100% accurate, but do you have any insight as to if it is off by a consistent amount?
it's just mislabeled. What it tells you is the time since last poll. Which is part of the input lag of course but it doesn't tell you about any lag that happens inside the controller. You can pretty much use it as confirmation of the polling rate and it can be useful for wireless because it regularly spikes to 2ms + your Bluetooth dongle is worse than the one I tested. For wired it should be possible to assume that the input lag is just the same for everyone, so it really only serves as a polling rate check.
@@RocketScience Thank you, I appreciate that response. It was at least useful for confirming that overclocking had taken effect. With my Dualsense (that I bought based on your previous video. Thank you.) the reading went from ~3.5ms to ~0.1/0.0ms after going to 8000hz.
just now found this video and i was definitely affected. changed to the CPU controlled port and the controls are quite noticeably more responsive. i'm kind of wondering if the chipset may throttle itself on my board based on temperature of the chipset because it seems like the hotter the ambient temperature is in my place, the more input lag i was experiencing on the chipset controlled port i was on. in any case, things are smooth as can be. definitely going to be combing through the rest of your content to see if there are any other gems 😛 keep up the good work! i'm on the MSI x570 Tomahawk Wi-Fi in case it helps anyone.
This is obvious and well-known, some ports are routed directly to the CPU and most go through the chipset. If you don't want to study trace layout but want to make sure you have a low-latency input for a keyboard, get a motherboard with a PS/2 port as that is always a CPU port, and USB ports on the same I/O cluster as the PS/2 port will pretty much always be CPU ports as well.
That really shouldn't make that much of a difference, though. As he said in the video, the USB on his PCIe extension card was as fast as the USB that went directly to the CPU, and on his friend's board the chipset and CPU had the same input lag as well.
Eh idk about the USB ports on the same cluster being connected to the cpu. The board shown in this video has 2 USB 2.0 slots on the same cluster as the ps/2 port yet they are the laggy ones that go through the chipset. I also have the same board, just the max version, and recently realized the same thing. I've been plugged into the laggy 2.0 ports this entire time because I assumed they would be the fastest being next to the ps/2 port and being sort "designated" for kb and mouse. But they are in fact chipset ports and laggy
This is very informative. I'm getting 3.4 ms with my 2013 launch DS4 v1 while plugged in both the front and back compared to my old pc which only has usb 2.0 while my newer pc has usb3.2 gen1 and gen2 maybe that's why I used to get crap latency. To be honest, bluetooth is the best way to connect your controller (3.4ms as well). The AX210 wifi card is currently the best card right now imo. Get the ones with the antenna and you're good to go. I just avoid buying the USB dongles, even the more expensive ones, they are all terrible and unreliable cuz they lack the necessary hardware. Just to add to this, the fake DS4 is just terrible it has 10+ms and terrible audio. Stop buying those crap. specs: ryzen 5600, b550m steel series, 16gb 3600mhz, ax210ngw m.2 card + 2 antennas
Can you know which ports are connected to your cpu without opening the case? Because my manufacturer does not provide any info about which ports that are directly connected to my cpu.
If you use ds4 windows, you can get the correct Playstation controls on the screen by starting a match or training, move your finger on the touchpad, unplug the usb hookup to the controller while the match is loading. Once in match plug it back in and hit the options button. Then your set for the entire session. Then youll have the square, triangle, circle, etc instead of the xbox symbols in game
@Rocket Science, do you think there could be any correlation between additional input lag and the "heavy bug" issue? I dealt with the heavy bug problem on and off for 5 years until I moved off of Steam and onto the Epic games client. I never did figure out a fix for it but at times the heavy bug issue seemed to go away when plugging in my controller into a different port. Although because it was sporadic I never actually figured out what the problem was.
Made sure to check my keyboard and mouse (I have 2 controllers but both have different issues that prevent me from using them) are plugged into CPU ports, and glad to say they were :)
really good content bro! keep it up! and also i have a doubt, is it the same if i use a HDMI over a displayport in terms of input delay ? or is displayport better?
Dude I thought it was just me. Turns out my friend & I have similar motherboards (B550 series as well). If you use the usb 3.2 without the overclock, the ms is 1.5/500hz (I checked via ds4 windows) but with the overclock it goes up to 1000hz but feels weird. If you use the usb 2.0 ports without overclocking, it’s the actual default speed of a controller; 250hz/3.5-4ms. This isn’t happening with ps5 controllers. However regardless of the controller, when I overclock, the aim assist feels weird on cpu ports. It’s definitely AMD related & these specific motherboards that’s making the polling rate much faster than usual or buggy.
Hey mate. Great video. Is this still an issue? I have the B450 Tomahawk Max. I've noticed my keyboard has more jitter when plugged into a chipset managed USB port compared to the CPU managed ports. I have a mouse, controller and keyboard I want to use on the CPU ports. I only have two though. You said hubs are okay. What would you recommend? Should it have external power?
Also I've noticed the DualShock 4 and other controllers that have a headphone input feel different when aiming, when headphones are connected to them. Maybe the polling rate and latency changes when headphones are connected? Maybe the internal headphone amp when activated causes interference to the analogue stick ADC?
Can you do a video testing USB interference and how it affects controllers latency and analogue stick accuracy? I've done research into it and USB has interference with 2.4Ghz devices like Wi-Fi and Bluetooth. USB devices can also emit EMI/RFI. USB HDDs for example can inject interference into the devices internal USB hub, causing other devices connected to the hub to experience interference. Many people feel latency and control issues when they have an external HDD connected via USB to their PS4 for example.
Good stuff, thank you for this context. I have an arcade stick and sometimes use WASD for directional inputs -- I've never had consistent just-frame inputs and was seriously wondering why that was the case, perhaps the keyboard was too low quality? Turns out I should have been using the CPU USB ports. I'm gonna try it and see if I notice any difference. Am also on a b450 tomahawk. Thanks again!
Intel based systems and motherboards have worked better with sony controllers for over a decade now. On amd motherboards in the late 2000's, DS3 could not be recognized when plugging in. Intel mobos all worked plug and play though. Ds3 was recognized without issue and not requiring third party/chinese drivers like motioninjoy to work
I found just from my use in rocket league that it is tough to get a reliable Bluetooth signal. I had to try several different dongles to get the consistency I required. It’s really a shame that the Dual Sense doesn’t use the DS4 Dongle. The DS4 Dongle even tho it’s still bluetooth I found it to be much more reliable than any of the Bluetooth dongles I tried. I ended up with a usb3 Bluetooth dongle on my Dual Sense and DS4 windows shows me 1ms+/_ and on USB C with a C to usb 3.0 adapter I show 8ms+/-. I know that’s not real world numbers but the numbers consistently change between plugging in and wireless across DS4 and dual sense. The dual sense seems to be a significant upgrade. ALso the sticks in the DS4 wore for me quite frequently and I found myself having to do the game stop insurance every 6 months or so. Since I’ve been on the dual sense I haven’t had to change the controller yet with the insurance so the sticks seem much more durable. Also quick note to those who have GME insurance on a DS4 and can’t find any controllers bc they seem to not ever have them anymore you can turn your insurance program on the DS4 into a Dual sense for $20. Just go in with your DS4 and insurance sticker and 20 bucks and they will give you a fresh Dual Sense. Profit. Took me a while to get used to the Dual sense also. I had sore parts of my hands but I got used to it after about a week and now can go between the two no issues.
When saying it seemed fine on the extension card - did you have your extension card plugged into the chipset ports or cpu ports? Or does this not make a difference and it’s just the PS4 directly to chipset usb that causes the issue
Pure logic, just make the device work at 1000hz and you get more responsive device. Works the same for mouse and keyboard. USB 2.0 or 3.0 the only difference comes with flash drives read write, and depends on flash drive themselves, so yes it's irrelevant for gaming, unless you use a flash or usb hard drive.
Well I'll be damned, I'm using this motherboard and a DS4 controller. Probably shouldn't matter much since I'm using the 1000 Hz polling overclock anyways. But just to be sure, I plugged my mouse and my controller into the CPU ports.
No, I don't think that matters. Stick drift happens cuz of a mechanical wear. It will just tell the PC where the stick is drifting more often than xbox controllers i.e
The USB ports on my Asus Z490 motherboard are not differentiated on the Asus website or in User Manual the way they are with your MSI board. Is there some other way to determine which USB ports belong to which USB Controller?
Fascinating. This reminds me of a the FireWire days in Pro audio. We would have to seek out specific controller manufactures (Texas instrument chips used to be best) to get acceptable input latencies as not all connections behaved consistantly
Check the website. There's differences berween AGESA different bios cpu and even motherboard revision might have this or not have it. For now just plug your mouse and your controller into the cpu Edit: short answer to your question. Yes should be the ports above the single port.
@@Erksah68 But how do I know which USB are CPU related and which are chipset related? By CPU we are talking about MoBo usb ports in the I/O backpanel? Are the chipset USB the ones u have to connect to the USB in the bottom of my MOBO? I have an ASUS PRIME B550 PLUS, and they dont talk about CPU or chipset. Have a good day all. PD: Amazing video.
can anyone help me? i got a gaming pc runs well evrything is good but as soon as i go plug in my webcam (usb) my controller and mouse start doing its own thing. I start doing 360s with my controller mouse is delayed.
i have a laptop but have the same problem. I dont know how to find the specifications of the motherboard. The motherboard is Lenovo lnvnb161216. I have a ryzen 7 4800h. I dont know how to find the right port
Awesome. I’m glad this was made because now I know that I need to look up my motherboard and see what port is “correct” for the lowest input lag. EDIT: I actually have no idea how to do that please help.
I actually have an Xbox type controller, specifically the Xbox XE controller. So since there’s no actual added delay, I just plugging it into the back of my motherboard and that’s what gave me the better timings.
I’ve been using my Xbox elite controller on rocket league coming from Xbox and the input lag has me having heavy car syndrome bad. Like I turn so slow it feels like and it’s so late I can’t even hit a flip reset
Is there a way for an average person like me to see if my USB port has this weird bug? Like could I use DS4 Windows and see which one reports the lowest input lag? Or should I just assume to use the 3.1 gen 2 port? I got a little superstitious a while back and have kept my controller plugged into the same port this whole time because I felt like it has the lowest lag but I don’t really know for sure
@cas curse do you know which BIOS revision it was addressed in? I have tried looking around at the different releases for the b450 tomahawk max and see no mention of it.
can you do a games example video like :. far cry 3, FC6, assassins creed , valorant , typical input delay with xbox contr/ps5 controller and mouse with win 10 .. . so we all would have some values to know if we are in the right direction here at home ? that WOULD BE COOL !!
Could you test a white dualsense vs a black dual sense. I'm on my second black Controller and going back and forth, they seem to have more input lag than the white ones.
I have one question regarding dual sense .I watched some video where they say that conecting via usb c or thunderbolt can decrease input lag .is that true ?or is the best way to connect it usb c to usb a cable into procesor dedicated usb port ? Becouse usb c /thunderbolt is chipset port and 2 usb a 3.1 gen 2 are procesor ports .I run x570 gigabyte aorus master .please someone respond
i was actually about to try this next as well since i switched my PS5 controller to my USB 3.2 Gen 2 port and its made a huge difference for my input latency but i want to see if usb-c to c port is even lower latency
@cas curse wtf is your problem? im not arguing with anyone I was just asking. I'm more than capable of checking the site myself as I have plenty of times. "Done helping you" what exactly did you help me with lmao
I'm aware this might be niche content, but I love it.
These are our silent obsessions stemming from perfectionism. I still find it funny how some professional players and streamers don’t share the obsession with this level of optimization!!
I knew there was something preventing me from ranking up!!! It was the USB port all along!!!
Lol
rip
😂😂
I love how seriously you take your work. The rocket league world needs you and are so grateful for everything that you do!
This is nuts... only a true academic would be so thorough! I applaud your dedication to accuracy! Has there been a comparison of wireless latency on all these controllers?
Yeah, it's also in the video (still available in the description). I don't think the wireless results are affected by the bug but I haven't had the time to retest those.
@@RocketScienceplease reply me . What if I’m using Xbox x controller connected from usb c thuntherbolt to usb c thuntherbolt to my z690 motherboard directly !? I’m felling it’s going crazy fast on input lag, I even feel the difference if I use a normal usbc to usbc non thuntherbolt cable. And of course crazier slow usbc to usb 2.0. You can make a test insert to think I’m crazy but I feel difference
taking the science in your name really seriously, true act of honor that you are correcting it even after the whole video was made
Thank you for this. Clear sign of professionalism to admit a mistake like this and figuring out the cause of it. Looking forward to new video! Please keep up the good work you are doing.
This is how real science is done. No expectations and no ego. Just follow data and testing. No agenda. Many people do not do this.
@@spencerorr4374 fax
Can you report this finding to your motherboard vendor so they do in-lab testing and fix this damn bug for their next MB series? Otherwise they wont do shit and other users will suffer
Don't worry, if it's about Rocket League we'll make sure to pay attention ;)
At this point, we don't know whether it's something on our end or if it's for example chipset related. We're in contact with Rocket Science and will investigate the problem to hopefully find the root cause and to see if it affects only this platform or others as well. For now, we can only suggest to connect your controller to the USB ports highlighted green in the thumbnail of this video. After all, we don't want you to get 'what a saved' because of input lag (I might personally use it as an excuse for whiffing though).
@@MSIGamingOfficial major respect that yall care msi 👏
@@MSIGamingOfficial Aaaaand I'm an MSI fan now. Well played 👊🏻
@@MSIGamingOfficial Holy Smokes these badasses showed up in a super niche YT video comments section to help with a tiny technical problem? My next products will be MSI no doubt.
Previous MSI user BTW. Legends for showing up.
@@MSIGamingOfficial any updates to what was solved??
Also my next mb I can certainly say will be Msi for your attention on this issue
this may sound weird, but couple years ago I had a theory that different usb ports are giving me different inputlag.. and this was only by "feel" and not tested or anything... since then I always plugged my mice and controller to the usb ports that I felt was the fastest. (which are the 4 USB ports that are directly connected to the CPU) turns out I did it right all along... thanks for the finding hwd
@cas curse dumb take.. if you play a lot of latency sensitive games you can absolutely feel a difference of latency to this degree. Please go watch aperture grills latest video on latency split testing, and look at his results. I downloaded the tool myself and can consistently guess the difference between 0 and 4ms latency. And this is with only 144hz.
There is a massive difference to the feeling of inputs when it's delayed by even several ms that you will notice as feeling desynced from what you expect to see. People who don't know any better or just don't do any latency sensitive gaming, ignorantly and baselessly assume this is all meaningless because "human reaction time is only ~200ms you will never notice a few ms" but as explained in the aperture grille video, there is a giant difference between reacting to a visual stimuli and having to process a physical response, vs creating an input yourself and noticing a difference in response from the game.
From all I know the issue with AMD Ryzen systems has something to do with the polling of the devices. It seems to depend on how many interfaces are needed to be polled per controller and how fast. Meaning the more devices are connected to the same USB controller the higher the chance that something has problems. But the chance also increase the higher the polling rate is. Also the devices which are enumerated first seems to have no problems, but the later they are enumerated the higher the chance is that some interface from that device isn't polled correctly anymore. This is true if the devices share the same bus, meaning if they use the same USB speed (like USB full-speed which is common for input devices). So using a USB hub can change this because then the low speed data is send over the hi-speed bus instead.
So as long as there is only one device connected per USB controller they should work fine. Like if you connect the game controller to a USB port handled by the CPU and your mouse to a port handled by the chipset or vice versa while don't have any other USB device connected (so no keyboard and so on) you should not have any additional weird input delays.
By the way, to me this seems to be an AMD issue and not a mainboard vendor one.
I have an amd laptop how do I know which USB port is connected to my motherboard?
That could actually explain why I sometimes feel a difference when changing from back to front USB ports! Thank you for this video, great explanation!
Which is faster?
@@theshowtime4123 It only makes a difference for playstation controllers, but basically make sure to only use the USB ports that come from the CPU and not the motherboard. (in my case motherboard ports are in the front)
@@BlackFlameBoss I have the same issue, my pc is pre-built by Lenevo, so I am going to try to contact them to know which usb ports are connected to my cpu and which are connected to my chipsets. Anyways thanks !
@@BlackFlameBoss alr
@@BlackFlameBoss Hey i’m 1 year late but how do I know which usb ports come from the cpu/motherboard if I have a laptop witb 3 usb ports?
Remember to check your motherboard block diagram for cpu and chipset usb ports
What's the difference ?
This man is a God amongst mortals. I KNEW I was feeling problems in certain USB ports but not others. People on the internet told me I was crazy. But I’m not. I knew it. You would think in 2021 when you buy a game and a controller, it should just work. But no, some of us have to go through hell to make our game feel right. Thank you man. For all this hard work.
@cas curse Reddit. Rocketleagueschool sub.
I was losing my mind over this for months!!!!! I was using a scuf controller and I received a noticeable lagging input. I switched to a cheap Xbox controller and it worked fine. I switched cables and ran multiple test, I emailed scuf and they had no clue. I am running a b450 rog stix with an AMD processor. I'm glad you found this bc I thought I was just crazy!!!!
Never would have thought about overclocking a USB port! Great stuff!
hey rocket science. I have an elite series 2 and have been dealing with insane amounts of input lag. At times paying on my Xbox felt better than being on my pc until I came across this video. Turns out that i was dealing with the same usb bug and adding the adapter made a massive improvement. thank you for taking the time to research stuff no one else does. Also noticed that over time the input delay got worse and worse. not really sure why that is but you have saved me from throwing my pc out of the window lol.
As soon as I saw the motherboard come up I finally realized IM NOT CRAZY Thank you for this video!!!
Nice to see input lag measurements videos where everything is done rigorously.
Man I've been waiting for something like this forever! I've always felt the front panel ports are slower on average.
I have been using front panel just because they are easier to reach. But I have also always been a console player so anything PC feels way less laggy. But I may try rear ports just to see if its better. Im old and slow so I most likely wont see any different. XD
@@njb-mm7129 I have been playing since december of 2019 and actually trying since March April of last year. Currently d2-d3. Have hit champ but can't stay there. I'm happy with my progess. Will get to gc one day.
The dedication to the accuracy, and integrity of your content is excellent. Much appreciated. One question. Regarding DS4Windows, I doubt the input lag reading from that software is 100% accurate, but do you have any insight as to if it is off by a consistent amount?
it's just mislabeled. What it tells you is the time since last poll. Which is part of the input lag of course but it doesn't tell you about any lag that happens inside the controller. You can pretty much use it as confirmation of the polling rate and it can be useful for wireless because it regularly spikes to 2ms + your Bluetooth dongle is worse than the one I tested. For wired it should be possible to assume that the input lag is just the same for everyone, so it really only serves as a polling rate check.
@@RocketScience Thank you, I appreciate that response. It was at least useful for confirming that overclocking had taken effect. With my Dualsense (that I bought based on your previous video. Thank you.) the reading went from ~3.5ms to ~0.1/0.0ms after going to 8000hz.
Thank u for your time and patience 👍🏼
Absolutely excellent work that put out fir us needs at heart, THANK YOU and Awesome Karma out to you for your channel 🤘😎
just now found this video and i was definitely affected. changed to the CPU controlled port and the controls are quite noticeably more responsive. i'm kind of wondering if the chipset may throttle itself on my board based on temperature of the chipset because it seems like the hotter the ambient temperature is in my place, the more input lag i was experiencing on the chipset controlled port i was on. in any case, things are smooth as can be. definitely going to be combing through the rest of your content to see if there are any other gems 😛 keep up the good work!
i'm on the MSI x570 Tomahawk Wi-Fi in case it helps anyone.
This is obvious and well-known, some ports are routed directly to the CPU and most go through the chipset. If you don't want to study trace layout but want to make sure you have a low-latency input for a keyboard, get a motherboard with a PS/2 port as that is always a CPU port, and USB ports on the same I/O cluster as the PS/2 port will pretty much always be CPU ports as well.
That really shouldn't make that much of a difference, though. As he said in the video, the USB on his PCIe extension card was as fast as the USB that went directly to the CPU, and on his friend's board the chipset and CPU had the same input lag as well.
@@theKiwii That's what happens when the PCIe extension card is plugged into a CPU-connected PCIe slot
Eh idk about the USB ports on the same cluster being connected to the cpu. The board shown in this video has 2 USB 2.0 slots on the same cluster as the ps/2 port yet they are the laggy ones that go through the chipset. I also have the same board, just the max version, and recently realized the same thing. I've been plugged into the laggy 2.0 ports this entire time because I assumed they would be the fastest being next to the ps/2 port and being sort "designated" for kb and mouse. But they are in fact chipset ports and laggy
lol 🤣
This is very informative. I'm getting 3.4 ms with my 2013 launch DS4 v1 while plugged in both the front and back compared to my old pc which only has usb 2.0 while my newer pc has usb3.2 gen1 and gen2 maybe that's why I used to get crap latency. To be honest, bluetooth is the best way to connect your controller (3.4ms as well). The AX210 wifi card is currently the best card right now imo. Get the ones with the antenna and you're good to go. I just avoid buying the USB dongles, even the more expensive ones, they are all terrible and unreliable cuz they lack the necessary hardware.
Just to add to this, the fake DS4 is just terrible it has 10+ms and terrible audio. Stop buying those crap.
specs: ryzen 5600, b550m steel series, 16gb 3600mhz, ax210ngw m.2 card + 2 antennas
Can you know which ports are connected to your cpu without opening the case? Because my manufacturer does not provide any info about which ports that are directly connected to my cpu.
what motherboard do you have?
@@WrexBF A lenevo motherboard which was not specified when I bought my pc (not even in lenevo’a website), so in other words, a shitty motherboard.
If you use ds4 windows, you can get the correct Playstation controls on the screen by starting a match or training, move your finger on the touchpad, unplug the usb hookup to the controller while the match is loading. Once in match plug it back in and hit the options button. Then your set for the entire session. Then youll have the square, triangle, circle, etc instead of the xbox symbols in game
@Rocket Science, do you think there could be any correlation between additional input lag and the "heavy bug" issue? I dealt with the heavy bug problem on and off for 5 years until I moved off of Steam and onto the Epic games client. I never did figure out a fix for it but at times the heavy bug issue seemed to go away when plugging in my controller into a different port. Although because it was sporadic I never actually figured out what the problem was.
@@Sweet-oj4ob how can you tell which ports are connected to the cpu or chipset?
You're doing awesome work. Thank you!
It will be interesting to see if this issue was caused by the USB issue AMD is releasing bios patches for...
great video, could use some graphics when you do stuff like this in the future (to help us follow along and keep us engaged), but very good info
Nice, as usual I appreciate the work!
Made sure to check my keyboard and mouse (I have 2 controllers but both have different issues that prevent me from using them) are plugged into CPU ports, and glad to say they were :)
how can you tell if they are cpu ports?
@@liamthomas6093 It'll be on the specs list of your motherboard, though it's being a long time since this happened so my memory's quite vague.
really good content bro! keep it up! and also i have a doubt, is it the same if i use a HDMI over a displayport in terms of input delay ? or is displayport better?
display port is always better
Dude I thought it was just me. Turns out my friend & I have similar motherboards (B550 series as well). If you use the usb 3.2 without the overclock, the ms is 1.5/500hz (I checked via ds4 windows) but with the overclock it goes up to 1000hz but feels weird. If you use the usb 2.0 ports without overclocking, it’s the actual default speed of a controller; 250hz/3.5-4ms. This isn’t happening with ps5 controllers. However regardless of the controller, when I overclock, the aim assist feels weird on cpu ports. It’s definitely AMD related & these specific motherboards that’s making the polling rate much faster than usual or buggy.
how to distinguish cpu usb port and chipset usb port
2nd video like this and you're already a pro at being on camera!
Hey mate. Great video. Is this still an issue? I have the B450 Tomahawk Max. I've noticed my keyboard has more jitter when plugged into a chipset managed USB port compared to the CPU managed ports. I have a mouse, controller and keyboard I want to use on the CPU ports. I only have two though. You said hubs are okay. What would you recommend? Should it have external power?
What do you mean by keyboard jitter?
@@RequiemOfSolo disregard. I fixed it. It was a Warzone problem.
@@ghallora gotcha. Glad you don't have an issue anymore at least.
Also I've noticed the DualShock 4 and other controllers that have a headphone input feel different when aiming, when headphones are connected to them. Maybe the polling rate and latency changes when headphones are connected? Maybe the internal headphone amp when activated causes interference to the analogue stick ADC?
yes i think plugging headphones in your controller adds input lag, especially if you use a mic
That would make sense since they're on the same bandwidth and 1 might be straining the other.
Dude you are amazing.
how do u know which one is the cpu usb port???!??!?!?!?! i have ROG MAXIMUS XI HERO
What about the ports on the consoles? Is the Xbox slower because it's USB-A instead of USB-C?
Well Damn lol sometimes tech just wanna do its own thing lol good video bro im looking forward to the re-upload video 👍🏽
That's it... heavy car bug confirmed
You should test how prioritizing IRQ priority affects latency, also, I reached 0ms on my DualSense that way :3
Can you do a video testing USB interference and how it affects controllers latency and analogue stick accuracy?
I've done research into it and USB has interference with 2.4Ghz devices like Wi-Fi and Bluetooth. USB devices can also emit EMI/RFI. USB HDDs for example can inject interference into the devices internal USB hub, causing other devices connected to the hub to experience interference.
Many people feel latency and control issues when they have an external HDD connected via USB to their PS4 for example.
Keep your vedio
We love it
Amazing detail
All the best regards
JOKER BANAJA
Good stuff, thank you for this context. I have an arcade stick and sometimes use WASD for directional inputs -- I've never had consistent just-frame inputs and was seriously wondering why that was the case, perhaps the keyboard was too low quality?
Turns out I should have been using the CPU USB ports. I'm gonna try it and see if I notice any difference. Am also on a b450 tomahawk. Thanks again!
Intel based systems and motherboards have worked better with sony controllers for over a decade now. On amd motherboards in the late 2000's, DS3 could not be recognized when plugging in. Intel mobos all worked plug and play though. Ds3 was recognized without issue and not requiring third party/chinese drivers like motioninjoy to work
what port should I plug in my ds4 on the Z490?
It's absurd that Microsoft makes BOTH the controller AND the OS (on most PC's) but still has one of the HIGHEST input lags!? Elite my a$$...
Doesinput lag change on the xbox usb ports?
I love these kinds of bugs. T.T
My sympathies.
RYZEN has USB issues. AMD has acknowledged it.
Thanks for the video
I found just from my use in rocket league that it is tough to get a reliable Bluetooth signal. I had to try several different dongles to get the consistency I required. It’s really a shame that the Dual Sense doesn’t use the DS4 Dongle. The DS4 Dongle even tho it’s still bluetooth I found it to be much more reliable than any of the Bluetooth dongles I tried. I ended up with a usb3 Bluetooth dongle on my Dual Sense and DS4 windows shows me 1ms+/_ and on USB C with a C to usb 3.0 adapter I show 8ms+/-. I know that’s not real world numbers but the numbers consistently change between plugging in and wireless across DS4 and dual sense. The dual sense seems to be a significant upgrade. ALso the sticks in the DS4 wore for me quite frequently and I found myself having to do the game stop insurance every 6 months or so. Since I’ve been on the dual sense I haven’t had to change the controller yet with the insurance so the sticks seem much more durable.
Also quick note to those who have GME insurance on a DS4 and can’t find any controllers bc they seem to not ever have them anymore you can turn your insurance program on the DS4 into a Dual sense for $20. Just go in with your DS4 and insurance sticker and 20 bucks and they will give you a fresh Dual Sense. Profit.
Took me a while to get used to the Dual sense also. I had sore parts of my hands but I got used to it after about a week and now can go between the two no issues.
When saying it seemed fine on the extension card - did you have your extension card plugged into the chipset ports or cpu ports? Or does this not make a difference and it’s just the PS4 directly to chipset usb that causes the issue
Pure logic, just make the device work at 1000hz and you get more responsive device. Works the same for mouse and keyboard. USB 2.0 or 3.0 the only difference comes with flash drives read write, and depends on flash drive themselves, so yes it's irrelevant for gaming, unless you use a flash or usb hard drive.
Well I'll be damned, I'm using this motherboard and a DS4 controller. Probably shouldn't matter much since I'm using the 1000 Hz polling overclock anyways. But just to be sure, I plugged my mouse and my controller into the CPU ports.
Can you tell us if there are noticeable differences? (After you switch to the cpu ports) Thanks
Could the playstation sending a signal every poll rather than when there is an update have an affect on stick drift?
No, I don't think that matters. Stick drift happens cuz of a mechanical wear. It will just tell the PC where the stick is drifting more often than xbox controllers i.e
The USB ports on my Asus Z490 motherboard are not differentiated on the Asus website or in User Manual the way they are with your MSI board. Is there some other way to determine which USB ports belong to which USB Controller?
Turns out that Intel only has ports on the chipset. I didn't check that before the video. The big is probably AMD only though
@@RocketScience so intel ports are just connected to the chipset not directly to the cpu right?
Fascinating. This reminds me of a the FireWire days in Pro audio. We would have to seek out specific controller manufactures (Texas instrument chips used to be best) to get acceptable input latencies as not all connections behaved consistantly
Do you have any info on whether 3.2 gen 1 slots suffer from the same glitch? I don't have any 3.1 gen 1 slots.
If I connect a 1m usb extender to a usb hub, will I have input lag?
keep in mind that AMD vs INTEL matters here. AMD has usb controller built in, while INTEL doesn't.
Report it to AMD! They can push firmware updates if this needs fixing
3/4 way dead here
So do i want to be plugging in my Dual sense or PS4 controller in to the middle USB ports of my B450 TOMAHAWK motherboard?
Check the website.
There's differences berween AGESA different bios cpu and even motherboard revision might have this or not have it. For now just plug your mouse and your controller into the cpu
Edit: short answer to your question. Yes should be the ports above the single port.
@@Erksah68 But how do I know which USB are CPU related and which are chipset related? By CPU we are talking about MoBo usb ports in the I/O backpanel? Are the chipset USB the ones u have to connect to the USB in the bottom of my MOBO? I have an ASUS PRIME B550 PLUS, and they dont talk about CPU or chipset.
Have a good day all.
PD: Amazing video.
@@nosumable if you check the website for information.
Generally they are grouped.
can anyone help me? i got a gaming pc runs well evrything is good but as soon as i go plug in my webcam (usb) my controller and mouse start doing its own thing. I start doing 360s with my controller mouse is delayed.
i have a laptop but have the same problem. I dont know how to find the specifications of the motherboard. The motherboard is Lenovo lnvnb161216.
I have a ryzen 7 4800h. I dont know how to find the right port
does intel boards also affected by this?
cheers!
So my MSI H110M (intel) has 4x USB 3.2 Gen 2 (USB 3.1) and 2x USB 2.0 inputs. Which one should i use?
Awesome. I’m glad this was made because now I know that I need to look up my motherboard and see what port is “correct” for the lowest input lag.
EDIT: I actually have no idea how to do that please help.
Still need help?
@@duncandee Nah, I figured it out. Thanks for replying though. Means a lot to know that people are willing to help. :)
@@DarkSansTV how did you do it?
I actually have an Xbox type controller, specifically the Xbox XE controller. So since there’s no actual added delay, I just plugging it into the back of my motherboard and that’s what gave me the better timings.
@@duncandee I need help
I’ve been using my Xbox elite controller on rocket league coming from Xbox and the input lag has me having heavy car syndrome bad. Like I turn so slow it feels like and it’s so late I can’t even hit a flip reset
poor guy, just plugged it in the wrong spot
im sure if you google "guy plugged it in the wrong spot" the first link will send you to Phub
I have Xbox Series s with original wifi controller. If I plug the usb cable to the device for rpg games, may I have less lag? Ty
so will I GET more or less if I use usb extender ?
WAIT?! how can you over clock a controler ???!!!
Hey guys, I've got a question. Can you overclock a wireless controller?
What software do you use to measure input lag?
z690 Aorus pro - 3.2 ports do a less spread on 500HZ in Mouse tester
You can eliminate microsoft variable by testing controller input lag on a different operating system
what cable to buy for the xsx controller?
Now overclock the controller and get below 1ms input lag on DualShocks and never look back
I’m curious if this effects keyboards as well.
Is there a way for an average person like me to see if my USB port has this weird bug? Like could I use DS4 Windows and see which one reports the lowest input lag? Or should I just assume to use the 3.1 gen 2 port? I got a little superstitious a while back and have kept my controller plugged into the same port this whole time because I felt like it has the lowest lag but I don’t really know for sure
@cas curse do you know which BIOS revision it was addressed in? I have tried looking around at the different releases for the b450 tomahawk max and see no mention of it.
All this for 4ms... Incredible! 👍
can you do a games example video like :. far cry 3, FC6, assassins creed , valorant , typical input delay with xbox contr/ps5 controller and mouse with win 10 .. . so we all would have some values to know if we are in the right direction here at home ? that WOULD BE COOL !!
Hmm proof of Heavy Car Bug?
I knew I wasn’t crazy
i have a b450 tomhawk max, does it get affected by the same "bug"? Cause i don't have any 3.1 gen ports :( Should i plug it into the case ports?
i have the same mother board and use the vr ports it feels way smoother than the ones on top, idk why maybe its a placebo but it just does
Okay so how to identify what USB ports connected to CPU?
They are the ones most directly connected to your mother board. Usually the ones in the rear of your pc
Whats better for fps , USB 3 or USB c
Would this affect a bluetooth dongle when using wireless DS4?
It didn't when I tested it.
First Review I found who understands about this!
If U want an Detailed explanation about this let me know. :)
TheWhale :)
Epic Launcher causes more Input lag to me then Steam. I dont use Steam Controller Support.
Should I use the SS usb port?
Interesting !! Did you try to update your drivers ? or your motherboard bios ???
Could you test a white dualsense vs a black dual sense. I'm on my second black Controller and going back and forth, they seem to have more input lag than the white ones.
Racist
Racist
Once you go black you have to send it back
I have one question regarding dual sense .I watched some video where they say that conecting via usb c or thunderbolt can decrease input lag .is that true ?or is the best way to connect it usb c to usb a cable into procesor dedicated usb port ? Becouse usb c /thunderbolt is chipset port and 2 usb a 3.1 gen 2 are procesor ports .I run x570 gigabyte aorus master .please someone respond
i was actually about to try this next as well since i switched my PS5 controller to my USB 3.2 Gen 2 port and its made a huge difference for my input latency but i want to see if usb-c to c port is even lower latency
I have a B550 Taichi and I have no way of knowing what ports go to my CPU. ASRock doesnt specify.
@cas curse they dont specify. can you let me know where you see that? in device manager i have 2 amd host controllers thats it.
@cas curse wtf is your problem? im not arguing with anyone I was just asking. I'm more than capable of checking the site myself as I have plenty of times. "Done helping you" what exactly did you help me with lmao
@@joshjbeats Lol that took a turn