@@onebigfish7742 You place it as an anchor below you in the event that you fall, or when getting to a spot to reach a rock you can grip/get a foothold/employ the use of a different piece of gear; you don't pull it out while falling. And if it wouldn't be useful on that particular climb, there's other gear available. He never said it was the best and most versatile piece of gear lol, don't know why people are acting like he did.
I can promise that those will support a fall, especially several in a series. Just have to place it properly and at the right fall angle. Have to trust your PRO!
@@wraith8323 Atleast 10 to 15 of each. Especially if you're pitch climbing. There 2 styles, either you use the cam or the wedge style if the cracks aren't big enough to fit.
The rock is probably more likely to break than the gadget itself. You don’t want to use something like this on sandstone as the stone could give way and let it rip out.
In construction, the anchor point needs to hold 5000 lbs if you're tethered in a harness. That cam IS NOT going to handle 5k lbs of pull shock force. He can be cutesy all he wants but Im not putting my life on it
seems like a lot of non-climbers in the comments, Hello! to put the gear in perspective, youtuber's break test for some random cams came out to neighborhood of 3,600 lbs of force to break it. even the biggest of falls won't produce that much force. given, that is if you have a perfect placement of your protection, this style of self placed protection is called trad climbing. it involves cams, nuts, hexes, and a few other sorts of protection you place on the wall so that you can attach your climbing rope to it. The climbing rope itself is dynamic, meaning that it stretches when you fall on it. Because dynamic ropes stretch, the force on the climber when the rope goes taught is reduced and doesn't instantly break your back. It also reduces shock load on the cams/anchors a bit, but climbers still need to make sure the placement is as solid as possible. Cams popping out of a bad placement is a danger that is very real, trad climbing in general is a very methodical sport where you need to keep a good headspace at all times. But if you do it well you can find yourself in amazing places
@@francoherrera601 there is a “spring loaded plastic bar” that has little wires that goes to each spring loaded cam. The same way you pull the cams back, you just pull the cams back ... and it’s free. Easy
Thanks for the explanation. That being said, a sport where 1 mistake leads to death isn’t particularly great…I am of course talking about the extreme variety of climbing which I am shocked that some people practice. Just constant gambling with luck really.
When the "friends" were first developed the name was to hide the existance of the device, used in the "do you want to go climbing this weekend, my "friends" will be there", so that competitors would not know that a new device existed. The name just stuck after this
People not trusting cams and saying this isn’t a good demonstration are forgetting the fact that these tools are used hundreds of times every day by climbers globally. YES, they work.
Just think of the mechanics of it. His weight is being pressed in between that Crack by the device and that thing is made of some ridiculously durable material
@@Grazzio558??? Don't matter. It's man made.. man made things fail all the time.. ships built extremely top notch, sink... I shouldn't have to explain this yet again..
I’m 200lbs+ and I’ve taken 40ft ‘leader falls’ onto these without issue MANY times. The key is that the harder you fall on them, the more ‘camming’ (AKA ‘wedging’) force they generate. So a bigger fall makes them work even better!
Dude I’ve been trad climbing for a decade and I still barely believe some of the gear that I’ve put my life on. I know that it will hold, but I still have my doubts. Always tie a stopper knot friends
@@lukesweeney3396 they’re called whippers and are quite fun once you get past falling 40 feet or so. What happens is your last piece of gear is maybe 20 feet down, so you fall that length, plus the rope length from the gear, and also a bit of stretch in the rope
It depends on the line of force when you fall. The hope is that people are smart enough to line up the equipment with the direction of force when they fall not while they’re climbing up
This piece of engineering really fascinate me because the heavier load it holds, the more force it pushes outward on the side of those cracks. Super cooll
@@byb7915 tbh rock climbing in general is terrifying to me, and I’ve gone skydiving. Rock climbers are built different, but the engineering of the cam is legit
Everybody keep in mind that the ropes these guys use most times are dynamic ropes. Which means they stretch almost like a bungie. Acting as a suspension system in the event of a fall. Reducing the amount of shock put on the equipment such as the cam he is using right here. You would be surprised at the physics of how these things work. Yes it can be dependent on where it is placed. That's why climbers study their routes before attempting them. And that routes are scouted out and checked most times to make sure there are stable holds for equipment to be placed in. There is a process that goes behind this sport and using this equipment that people aren't seeing. Which is causing people to act like they know it all even though they have never performed in this sport at all.
That's all good and well. But as someone who works with rope systems fairly regularly: I can say with certainty that I wouldn't trust my life to just that in a fall. Everything works until it doesn't.
One typically brings a mat while bouldering and sometimes climbing if you're going without a rope. It's likely he already had it out. And it's best practice anyway.
The more you pull that thing up, it holds stronger right? Cz the flipper (or trigger? I guess) you push it to loosen and pull it to widen up. Your body weight actually pull it and holds it even stronger.
Yeah, my worry would be accidently displacing it while I'm above it rather than it supporting my weight. Also add the strength of the crack, if I was confident it would stay exactly where I place it and the rock is strong I would happily use it.
Most people don’t know how these work. You can see how the head looks kinda like gears. If you apply a lot of force to it, the head push out against the rocks making it more stable. The harder you fall the tighter it stays in.
People calling him out for having a mat when he literally said "it's not an ideal placement" which is why he has a mat there. People hear one thing that benefits their argument and disregard most of the information.
people will argue anything. here I'll show you. why not perform the demonstration with AN IDEAL setup and placement to give a best test, so-to-speak? otherwise ignore the hate because because find a way
For anyone doubting the actual holding strength of cams how not to highline has break tests of them. Basically, they'd hold like three motorcycles when properly placed.
@n325aej basically rock climbing is always dangerous. and these devices are just to be used as a "just in case, last resort" type of situation. yeah they might save you in an emergency. but if you fall high enough with a poor placed device and the rock breaks, you're pretty much effed.
I believe it works but wouldn’t he want to be a foot or 2 higher so that there is a little momentum to show that it can support a fall and not just support you hanging
The short rope he has is non dynamic, meaning no stretch. A fall over 1ft would actually be pretty sharp and kinda hurt. These are just meant to extend how far the cam it's attached to can reach your climbing rope(which is dynamic) The rope stretch gives you a softer catch
Thats what im tryna explain to him because it will be more weight fallin from any height rather than what he done in this video its a matter of life or death so he really needs to check what were on about
Used to work for BD and made these things. Watching the stress tests on these were nuts. Some, depending on type and size, could actually hold the weight of a small car statically. They definitely hold.
@@glumreaper8885 which is what could cause the devices hold to fail. we arent worried about his weight being held. it's the force put on the device stopping all that momentum.
@@fml7814 do you even know what weight is? Weight is not mass. 1 kg only equals 2.205 lbs under the force of earths gravity. 1 kg on the moon is not 2.205 lbs on the moon or on Jupiter. This is basic physics man, learn the difference between mass and weight. A falling mass that has accelerated in a downward direction will exert more force on the rope when the rope becomes taught. Go ahead and prove me wrong if you thing you know what you are talking about. TLSR : weight is a force ( mass x acceleration). It's basics physics dude 🙄
@@gangstaelegantproductions2780 something like " if you ease a 100 lb weight to hang, it's not gonna to have as much energy or force as if you just dropped it." The dude just leaned into a hanging position, he didn't just drop.
@@bker5376 I’m not talking about an anchor. You can fall on a cam whilst climbing, that’s the whole reason they exist. Falling on a single piece is the way they were made and if u think u need more than one every time you use them you clearly haven’t fallen on one before
@@gearaddictclimber2524 Haha I definitely have fallen onto them before I've got a full rack of abused Wild Country's. I understand what you're saying but even in a fall scenario you've got another piece of pro below you. I'm pretty sure the original commenters trying to imply that you need redundancy within an anchor and shouldn't rest your life on one cam.
Lol when I jumped off my roof to my trampoline I was CONFIDENT the trampoline wouldn’t break, but I still threw down some blankets and couch cushions to soften the impact
Popped out two chocks on a fall on glacier point apron, the third was a cam (friend),it held under an extreme amount of pressure. It was about 5 +feet below the start of my fall, so about a twelve foot fall. Saved my life. It’s all about placement of your gear, play smart.
@@IBaitman I don't know about you, but a controlled jump/fall is completely different from falling backwards on a climb you dingus, when you have a job and you pay taxes you can come back and act like the adults will listen to anything you have to say. Until then, buzz off lil fella
@@IBaitman If I am understanding it correctly, he wasn’t 12 feet above the ground, he was much higher up, slipped, and free fell 12 feet. Which means that the cam has a CRAZY amount of pressure on it all at once, but still held.
@@IBaitman bro all I know is I wouldnt want to jump in a empty pool 12ft imagine falling backwards all it takes is for a limb or going neck first the wrong way too f uuuu up lmaoo
I’ve personally experienced several “whippers”, “screamers” whatever you wanna call them with less than ideal pro and always been caught. Trust your gear!
@@gearaddictclimber2524 deeeeen son! That’s awesome - I bet that shit snapped your back in half though that kinda fall has got to hurt lol. Thanks for the info y’all! It just kinda seemed like a lackluster demonstration of the tool-
I like how these people who have never been rock climbing in their lives are questioning the ability of specially engineered equipment. Edit: please stop arguing in the comments I’m tired of getting notifications at 2 in the morning
As an engineer with an IQ of 142, I can say two things: 1) You dont need to be a genius to question the integrity of something as simple as cams in a crevice and 2) You should question the integrity of cams in a crevice This solution maximizes simplicity, not efficacy
The first time I started experimenting around with trade climbing I didn't really trust the cams either now that I know how to use them I trust them with my life
I use those when I go camping to hang my hammock inside of small caves to protect myself from the weather. They're a great invention and haven't failed me yet.
@@topology9562 The cams can hold well over 12000 Newtons of force and the harder the fall the harder the cam grips to the crack, so it is basically fool proof safe. Also climbers use dynamic ropes which stretch like a bungee so it wont jerk in a fall.
@@KennyT187 YO WHO INVITED BILL NYE THE SIENCE GUY, NAH IM KIDDING COOL FACTS BY THE WAY, I THOUGHT IT WAS 11000 NEWTONS OR AROUND OPROXIMENTLY 8890.06 KNs JUST BY A GUESS
yes lets all just stop using safety measures because clearly nothing can go wrong, lets just remove all life jackets, rafts, oxygen masks and seatbelts on planes because crashs are unlikely
@@Zephyr-Queen bro just stfu. His whole point was the fact it’s safe for a cliff edge and that we should trust it. So why doesn’t he trust it fully himself not to put a safety mat there? And the whole point in a plane isn’t to prove it can fly safely. It’s to get me somewhere. The whole point of this video is him proving we can trust it. Big difference.
There meant for safety, not so you can jump off a cliff and expect to be fine, it’s like a backup plan. If you fall would you rather have a chance to die or die?
@@tylerkondrat8668 Your definition of falling on the ground and falling while climbing are different. It's probably more of just a "catch" than a fall sure, but the equipment does the same lol. blah blah blah basically it'll hold
@@birdboy8592 No he just knows that trusting something not to fail dosent mean it want.. intelligence is key..why do people think the matt is a sign of distrust... Lmao
Camming devices like that work great especially for a layback when you need to stick and move. I carried camelots, tricams and stoppers when I still climbed. Stay with it. You’ll miss it after you stop. Kids, mortgages, etc tend to cut away your free time lol.
I dont know why but I really love rockclimbing. even tough Ive never set foot on an actual mountain, just doing routes in a gym designed for that feels awesome to me, both the process and the finnish
Climbers use stretchy (dynamic) ropes for this reason. You want to avoid shock loading your protection, but more importantly, if you took a big fall on a non-stretchy (static) rope and this device caught your fall, you would likely have internal organ damage from the forces on your body.
when is overcammed the position is perfect, of course it will be difficoult to take it out (a lot of times impossible, so the placement of the video is of course wrong), but the most is cammed the most it will be safe
I remember using those for the first time. Eyewitness everyone else not having a problem with those. At that point I was used to using the bolts that are already installed on the rock. One weekend my friends decided to try a different route and we loaded up with cams and lucky for me they held my weight when I lost my grip. I was about eight hundred feet up. Even with that it was a great day of climbing.
All the non-climbers and non-trad folks disbelief in cams is quite amusing. They're surprisingly good. Even on big falls. Check out How Not To Highline.
Tbf, as soon as you learn how good they can be, you learn how many factors it takes to make a good placement, and the cycle starts again 😂 I'm not worried about the cam, just everything it's attached to
@@Youthereimnot you guys are speculating about a sport you've never done, he is fine unless he were to fall going nearly 60 km an hour 30m and broke the rock, and people dont just use one
yeah. it was so dangerous, my heart almost skilled a beat. but then I saw that soft square mat to soften his fall from the potential deadly demonstration.
The cams can hold well over 12000 Newtons of force and the harder the fall the harder the cam grips to the crack, so it is basically fool proof safe. Also climbers use dynamic ropes which stretch like a bungee so it wont jerk in a fall.
Doesn’t the shock from an actual fall create force that is much more than your actual weight? When I have to resort to a weighted anchor in my work, I’m supposed to use one that is at least triple my body weight.
Correct, for an example of cam capacities if we look at BD c4 camalot they range from 8 - 14KN over their lineup of sizes. For reference most falls exert in the range of 2-6KN which is less than even the smallest cam rating. Of course this assumes good placement on good rock, but that's half the experience of rock climbing is you have to know how to use your equipment.
The cams can hold well over 12000 Newtons of force and the harder the fall the harder the cam grips to the crack, so it is basically fool proof safe. Also climbers use dynamic ropes which stretch like a bungee so it wont jerk in a fall.
Falling for just a fraction of a second and stopping suddenly can increase the force applied to the rope by many times your weight. This could make the rock holding it shatter. Test it with much more weight, or by falling and having it catch you, and I will believe it.
You can just see on the internet that they are rated for around 10 kilonewtons, or a thousand kilos, which is like? 12 times your bodyweight? It's a similar rating to that of the carabiners you would use (usually 20k or more, a difference easily explained by the fact one is a static object and one is fairly more complicated) is it as secure as a bolt? Probably not, as this is still a safety device designed for particular situations Still, it's extremely more likely that the rock fails or the placement is wrong, rather than the cam failing. You'd hear many more incidents otherwise
@@mr.bobdabbalina1246 I am more concerned with the amount of force the rock can withstand before breaking. If I should just look it up, or assume it's safe, what's the point of this video? I want to see it tested in a realistic scenario, c'mon man.
People have been using these for years. The gear works. Now, if you don't know know how/where to place it, then you run into problems. I trust that my gun won't go off when I drop it, but I won't drop a loaded gun just to prove it's safe to people on the internet.
@@alloypaulson7520 I have seen many guns drop tested online, in controlled environments. It is because of tests like these, we know that guns with internal safety mechanisms are safe beyond a reasonable doubt.
He literally caught himself with his foot before really dropping. Doesn’t even trust it 2 foot off the ground w/o mat. Do this under a highway over pass with cars under you and I’ll trust ya
I love how he still made sure he was over a soft surface just incase
fact, but there's no soft surface if it happens in reality
Gonna say the same thing. Than why the mat bro?
It’s for bouldering. It’s a crash pad
Not only that, your weight increases due to velocity, a person who falls 3 feet and weighs 200 pounds lands with 900 pounds of force.
Safety first. You wear a helmet without knowing if you’ll crash, same deal
Imagine if the entire boulder just fell on him right after he gave it a tug lol
🤣🤣🤣🤦♂️
That's a morbid thought.
Imagine imagining shit
This comment is just too much 🤣
Your friends must love your positivity
It's a genius design and has saved many, many lives. However, it's definitely circumstantial, let's not pretend otherwise.
Exactly, you better hope if you’re gonna fall there’s cracks around
The more weight on it the stronger it expands between the crack. Kind of like how a monkey wrench works.
Almost like you only place/bring it if you know it'll be useful... 🤔
@@onebigfish7742 You place it as an anchor below you in the event that you fall, or when getting to a spot to reach a rock you can grip/get a foothold/employ the use of a different piece of gear; you don't pull it out while falling. And if it wouldn't be useful on that particular climb, there's other gear available. He never said it was the best and most versatile piece of gear lol, don't know why people are acting like he did.
Yeah that's why there was pad underneath him
I need a relationship that has the amount of trust he has in that device
He’s got a mat under him my dude
Yeah man, he didn't trust that cam at all lol
Not gonna happen
@@14nads probably wasn’t even the first try recording it, he ended it right away as well bet he fell on his ass right after.
Lmao
I can promise that those will support a fall, especially several in a series. Just have to place it properly and at the right fall angle. Have to trust your PRO!
True that! It'll work so well that it'll probably break you're back on a fall before it comes out of place!
@@6Sisu9 I've had them come out before. All they real do is slow your fall. And hopefully your fall is shorter than your climb.
Well since YOU promised i guess i will believe it
My question is, how many of these bad boys do you pack on an average outing?
@@wraith8323 Atleast 10 to 15 of each. Especially if you're pitch climbing. There 2 styles, either you use the cam or the wedge style if the cracks aren't big enough to fit.
The rock is probably more likely to break than the gadget itself. You don’t want to use something like this on sandstone as the stone could give way and let it rip out.
Thank you for educating us Mr. .... bent rod was it? 😂😭
@@auditoryaudacity5712 pretty sure that’d be obvious to any seasoned climber smart ass
@@theflyingegg3557 that was satire 🤦♂️
Hah tell that to the thousands of people that whip on cams in indian creek each year. Guess what kind of rock those cracks are made of?
@Bevan It was heavily implied that I was responding to his statement about sandstone..
The real question is how much impact force needs to be applied when you have a fall for the device to fail?
You definitely want more than one in series
In construction, the anchor point needs to hold 5000 lbs if you're tethered in a harness.
That cam IS NOT going to handle 5k lbs of pull shock force. He can be cutesy all he wants but Im not putting my life on it
@@longbow6416 Exactly!
@@longbow6416 as someone who has taken a 30ft fall on that same piece of gear. It works great.
@@13crunchbar I may have judged abit quick. Whats the rated pull on that cam? Did you have an arrestor?
seems like a lot of non-climbers in the comments, Hello!
to put the gear in perspective, youtuber's break test for some random cams came out to neighborhood of 3,600 lbs of force to break it. even the biggest of falls won't produce that much force. given, that is if you have a perfect placement of your protection, this style of self placed protection is called trad climbing. it involves cams, nuts, hexes, and a few other sorts of protection you place on the wall so that you can attach your climbing rope to it.
The climbing rope itself is dynamic, meaning that it stretches when you fall on it. Because dynamic ropes stretch, the force on the climber when the rope goes taught is reduced and doesn't instantly break your back. It also reduces shock load on the cams/anchors a bit, but climbers still need to make sure the placement is as solid as possible.
Cams popping out of a bad placement is a danger that is very real, trad climbing in general is a very methodical sport where you need to keep a good headspace at all times. But if you do it well you can find yourself in amazing places
but this is a naked cam
like where is the gear sling?
got too old? cut off for safety?
How do you take them out
@@francoherrera601 there is a “spring loaded plastic bar” that has little wires that goes to each spring loaded cam. The same way you pull the cams back, you just pull the cams back ... and it’s free. Easy
Thanks for the explanation. That being said, a sport where 1 mistake leads to death isn’t particularly great…I am of course talking about the extreme variety of climbing which I am shocked that some people practice. Just constant gambling with luck really.
minutes 2 kn
or minus 500 pounds of fall catching force even clipping to a loop not a gear sling that is missing in that 0.75 cam
I remember when they were called “friends” and were a new thing.
Friends is just Wildcountry brand cams
When the "friends" were first developed the name was to hide the existance of the device, used in the "do you want to go climbing this weekend, my "friends" will be there", so that competitors would not know that a new device existed. The name just stuck after this
What year was that? Im assuming before I was born
Wait I’m confused
In Italy we always call these friends!
Him: You guys didn't trust it would hold me in a fall
Also Him: gently bounces with mat underneath himself
That's what I was saying . He thinks we're stupid
He did say its not an optimal placement.
@@s4tsug4i74 but if he were to really prove if it’ll save you from a fall then he should put more force in his weight to simulate actually falling
That thing has been use long time ago
Real trust would be jumping off the top and see if it stops you on the way down
People not trusting cams and saying this isn’t a good demonstration are forgetting the fact that these tools are used hundreds of times every day by climbers globally. YES, they work.
Then why did he need a mat underneath him when he's like 2 feet off the ground
@@dandude5407 please refer to the comment above non mountain climber before you try and prove your dumb point
Add the extra force a “fall” not a “slight swing and tug” causes. Cams can fail.
@@maddox3804 so that means if u fall u done for
And im sure fences work too but im not about to tempt fate by leaning on one thats 30 stories high. Its people who i dont trust
Just think of the mechanics of it. His weight is being pressed in between that Crack by the device and that thing is made of some ridiculously durable material
Metal
Brass
Metal bends and things made my man always have flaws.. but idk nothing about climbing so idk if it's trust worthy or not
@@boogerburger1225 sure, but some metal need tons of force to bend
@@Grazzio558??? Don't matter. It's man made.. man made things fail all the time.. ships built extremely top notch, sink... I shouldn't have to explain this yet again..
"That thing ain't goin anywhere."
(Pulls down entire cliff, crumbles as he proceeds to become buried in hundreds of tons of rock)
That's what I thought 😂
200 tons*
😂
But it didn't go anywhere now did it😌
@@fenderbender6826 yep at least the thing held lol
I’m 200lbs+ and I’ve taken 40ft ‘leader falls’ onto these without issue MANY times. The key is that the harder you fall on them, the more ‘camming’ (AKA ‘wedging’) force they generate. So a bigger fall makes them work even better!
You've taken 40+ ft falls many times? Dude I think you need to place more gear
I think you need a new sport
I was just gonna ask if a big fall and yanking on it super hard, if would make it not work as well.
Dude I’ve been trad climbing for a decade and I still barely believe some of the gear that I’ve put my life on. I know that it will hold, but I still have my doubts. Always tie a stopper knot friends
@@lukesweeney3396 they’re called whippers and are quite fun once you get past falling 40 feet or so. What happens is your last piece of gear is maybe 20 feet down, so you fall that length, plus the rope length from the gear, and also a bit of stretch in the rope
**Trusts it with his life to hold him up in high places **
Puts a Matt for a 5 foot demonstration
Damn son
I don't think you'd want to fall on the hard ground where there is rocks 🗿
Safety first.. right ?
Why would he climb up 30 feet to show us something much easier to film and prepare right right above the ground?
@Glennjamin i think the point was he does that at high hights but puts a mat on the ground for 5 feet off the ground
It depends on the line of force when you fall. The hope is that people are smart enough to line up the equipment with the direction of force when they fall not while they’re climbing up
For example:
Placing your cams at appx 45 degrees downwards…not 90 straight out of the rock.
This piece of engineering really fascinate me because the heavier load it holds, the more force it pushes outward on the side of those cracks. Super cooll
Still cant trust it. I know it's real and it works, but gosh that's scary!
@@byb7915 tbh rock climbing in general is terrifying to me, and I’ve gone skydiving. Rock climbers are built different, but the engineering of the cam is legit
A "Plate Dog" uses the same principle but in reverse. It is for lifting and the heavier the load, the tighter the Dog grabs.
@Tup yeah its pretty basics 😂
Me to
Everybody keep in mind that the ropes these guys use most times are dynamic ropes. Which means they stretch almost like a bungie. Acting as a suspension system in the event of a fall. Reducing the amount of shock put on the equipment such as the cam he is using right here. You would be surprised at the physics of how these things work. Yes it can be dependent on where it is placed. That's why climbers study their routes before attempting them. And that routes are scouted out and checked most times to make sure there are stable holds for equipment to be placed in. There is a process that goes behind this sport and using this equipment that people aren't seeing. Which is causing people to act like they know it all even though they have never performed in this sport at all.
This distract you from the fact that "Bungee Gum has the properties of both rubber and gum."
@@seriousclown4139 hunter hunter?
@@chrisasian45 I first thought one piece, but I think your right on the mark with hunter x hunter
The dunning-kruger effect is a bitch.
That's all good and well. But as someone who works with rope systems fairly regularly: I can say with certainty that I wouldn't trust my life to just that in a fall. Everything works until it doesn't.
He didn't even trust it, he has a mat under him
Point taken. 🤣👍
Exactly 😂
I typed the same comment!! I trust it so much that I brought a cushion just in case it doesn't!!
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
One typically brings a mat while bouldering and sometimes climbing if you're going without a rope. It's likely he already had it out. And it's best practice anyway.
The more you pull that thing up, it holds stronger right? Cz the flipper (or trigger? I guess) you push it to loosen and pull it to widen up. Your body weight actually pull it and holds it even stronger.
Yeah, my worry would be accidently displacing it while I'm above it rather than it supporting my weight. Also add the strength of the crack, if I was confident it would stay exactly where I place it and the rock is strong I would happily use it.
Most people don’t know how these work. You can see how the head looks kinda like gears. If you apply a lot of force to it, the head push out against the rocks making it more stable. The harder you fall the tighter it stays in.
Yeah true that's how it's suppose to work but they have flaws.. unfortunately they want always work..
Same idea as all Fall arrest equipment works the force of the fall engages the brakes/locking paws amd the more force the harder it grabs
Yes yes go on tell us more PogO
Its not that we don't trust that stuff, but how if the crack is cracker wilder
You will get beauty falling hohoho
People calling him out for having a mat when he literally said "it's not an ideal placement" which is why he has a mat there. People hear one thing that benefits their argument and disregard most of the information.
people will argue anything. here I'll show you.
why not perform the demonstration with AN IDEAL setup and placement to give a best test, so-to-speak?
otherwise ignore the hate because because find a way
It’s simply putting safety measures into place. This is the guy I would want to guide me on a climb! Well done!
Lol I said the exact same thing but i did say just kidding. He clearly knows what he's doing.
In a test environment, i see no issue with a bit of extra safety.
For anyone doubting the actual holding strength of cams how not to highline has break tests of them. Basically, they'd hold like three motorcycles when properly placed.
@n325aej basically rock climbing is always dangerous. and these devices are just to be used as a "just in case, last resort" type of situation.
yeah they might save you in an emergency. but if you fall high enough with a poor placed device and the rock breaks, you're pretty much effed.
@n325aej how the fuck does rock brake?
They use Brembo brake with moss as brake pads?
Or do you mean break?
@n325aej English is my 2nd language tho,lol
Yes “like 3 motorcycles” - the industry standard 😂
@n325aej "How does a rock brake?"
"The pioneers used to ride these babies for miles"
I believe it works but wouldn’t he want to be a foot or 2 higher so that there is a little momentum to show that it can support a fall and not just support you hanging
The short rope he has is non dynamic, meaning no stretch. A fall over 1ft would actually be pretty sharp and kinda hurt. These are just meant to extend how far the cam it's attached to can reach your climbing rope(which is dynamic)
The rope stretch gives you a softer catch
u dont understand this non-climber
Jump and don’t catch yourself to replicate you falling off the side of a mountain
Cams will break the rock before they break
Yup
Thats what im tryna explain to him because it will be more weight fallin from any height rather than what he done in this video its a matter of life or death so he really needs to check what were on about
If he did that, the sling would possibly break before the cam.
Yes. Add some kinetic energy to that. And a shock load. Then ill be impressed
I'm guessing the more you pull, the more it presses outwards so the strength is proportional to you. Super cool!
to some extent but it will slip after a lot of force
@@keke_h972 anything will break/fall if you put enough force...
I’m sure the person that loses their life to this invention would’ve a hell of a time suing the makers
If u use it correctly this thing would either crush the rock than break and let u fall into death.
This buddies are just insane
Nope, you can't sue mfr for user error.
How. They're dead
@@BeefbrothHD3L exactly what I was thinking 🧐
@@Hurb2 that’s the point of the original comment.
Good to see you Empire.
Used to work for BD and made these things. Watching the stress tests on these were nuts. Some, depending on type and size, could actually hold the weight of a small car statically.
They definitely hold.
Damn that's cool, still not gonna trust it in a midway climb tho.
Enjoy the comments section
Same
Still nobody asked if you would tho
Cars are more dangerous statistically but it’s ok, I’m used to simple minded folk like you.
The rock will literally break first
@@rickytrockclimbing2935 not everybody climbs nearly everybody drives so the stats are irrelevant
OK so nobody’s gonna talk about how this rock looks like a cool looking tree
I THOUGHT THE SAME THING!!! Before the video started I was thinking “a rock climber and a big ass tree, this must be new”
@@RXQ003 me TOO
No
No
You all arent ready for that talk yet
The guy tapping the rock as if his gonna do anything😂
Its holds his weight from no fall, his weight (a.k.a. a force) would be much greater of he actually fell some distance first.
His weight wouldn't change but the impulse forces involved in stopping his momentum would be much higher
I can’t even explain how wrong you are
@@glumreaper8885 which is what could cause the devices hold to fail. we arent worried about his weight being held. it's the force put on the device stopping all that momentum.
@@robosing225 there is a youtube channel that have tested these the rope goes before they go
@@fml7814 do you even know what weight is? Weight is not mass. 1 kg only equals 2.205 lbs under the force of earths gravity. 1 kg on the moon is not 2.205 lbs on the moon or on Jupiter. This is basic physics man, learn the difference between mass and weight. A falling mass that has accelerated in a downward direction will exert more force on the rope when the rope becomes taught. Go ahead and prove me wrong if you thing you know what you are talking about.
TLSR : weight is a force ( mass x acceleration). It's basics physics dude 🙄
Shock load can easily be 10x static weight.
Exactly
What are u saying?
@@gangstaelegantproductions2780 something like " if you ease a 100 lb weight to hang, it's not gonna to have as much energy or force as if you just dropped it." The dude just leaned into a hanging position, he didn't just drop.
They work I know first hand.
I just want to see a 5 foot shock drop.
Dude is so confident yet he’s got a 4 inch pad underneath him while he test this theory in 4 feet of air
There is a very important phrase, in the lil speech he gave, probly the reason for the crash pad!
Not an ideal placement
He'll need ice for that BURN!!! : )
I'm not afraid of the device loosening and coming off
I'm afraid of a big chunk of rock coming out with it
Cams, when used correctly will suspend you your gear and a friend, but never rely on only one . Always smart to have an alternate fall arrest back up.
Not at all. You should not be double placing every time you place a cam. A .75 BD cam can hold 14 kN, way above any forces that a human can produce
@@gearaddictclimber2524 But your anchors need to be redundant, hence placing two or more.
@@bker5376 I’m not talking about an anchor. You can fall on a cam whilst climbing, that’s the whole reason they exist. Falling on a single piece is the way they were made and if u think u need more than one every time you use them you clearly haven’t fallen on one before
@@gearaddictclimber2524 Haha I definitely have fallen onto them before I've got a full rack of abused Wild Country's. I understand what you're saying but even in a fall scenario you've got another piece of pro below you. I'm pretty sure the original commenters trying to imply that you need redundancy within an anchor and shouldn't rest your life on one cam.
@@bker5376 gotcha. That I’m more susceptible to
So confident he used a matt and didn't "fall"
Lol when I jumped off my roof to my trampoline I was CONFIDENT the trampoline wouldn’t break, but I still threw down some blankets and couch cushions to soften the impact
U do know people who are confident in driving a bike still wear helmets? Idiot think please
@@manurindt3091 yeah I don't wear a helmet when I drive
@@Casual_Comment what a cool kid
@@manurindt3091 oh sorry, I havnt heard of driving a bike
I expected an actual fall seeing him dropping with momentum and watching that clip could hold
It's a exactly how these things work. The harder you fall the more clamming force they generate.
the mat shows absolute confidence
Is that Tanzania? 🇹🇿
Haha
our profile pics
That was a really soft fall my dude lol.
Catching a fall and supporting your weight are two very different things
Yes, but that device is enough for both if it's used properly
Nylon rope stretches. I’ve fallen on many cams just like this and they hold very well when placed correctly
Popped out two chocks on a fall on glacier point apron, the third was a cam (friend),it held under an extreme amount of pressure. It was about 5 +feet below the start of my fall, so about a twelve foot fall. Saved my life. It’s all about placement of your gear, play smart.
How are you gonna die from a 12 ft drop? People jump from that height. 🙄
@@IBaitman Did you even read his comment? Have you ever climbed or are you literate enough to even understand what you read?
@@IBaitman I don't know about you, but a controlled jump/fall is completely different from falling backwards on a climb you dingus, when you have a job and you pay taxes you can come back and act like the adults will listen to anything you have to say. Until then, buzz off lil fella
@@IBaitman If I am understanding it correctly, he wasn’t 12 feet above the ground, he was much higher up, slipped, and free fell 12 feet. Which means that the cam has a CRAZY amount of pressure on it all at once, but still held.
@@IBaitman bro all I know is I wouldnt want to jump in a empty pool 12ft imagine falling backwards all it takes is for a limb or going neck first the wrong way too f uuuu up lmaoo
All those equipment are pretty cool, I love watching your videos!!!!😀😀😀😀😁😀
Everyone's suddenly a experienced rock climber or mechanical engineer XD
Lmao
Lol, yeah...
tbh, I see alot these hate comments towards the guy like, yeah...
I cant talk, you can figured it out XD
*shakes legs laterally*
“That things not going anywhere!”
Well he can't exactly jump down
*slaps rock*
March of the titans! Hell yeah brother
I was putting a decent amount of weight going up and down towards the end dude
Lmao and he put a pad beneath him
“See, protects me in a fall”
*slaps the mountain*
Lmfao, i don't even know why i laughed so hard at this. 🤣
HE was so confident he made sure there was a mattress on the ground
I’ve personally experienced several “whippers”, “screamers” whatever you wanna call them with less than ideal pro and always been caught. Trust your gear!
I feel like a person actually falling and putting a LOT of force on that is a whole other story
almost like more force makes it less likely to fail or something, crazy
Also my grocery bag looks heavier than him...
I was just thinking the same thing. That first initial pull would be atleast twice his actual body weight.
That cam can hold 14 kilonewtons of force. I’ve taken a 60 ft fall into one and it was basically unscathed. They’re incredibly strong
@@gearaddictclimber2524 deeeeen son! That’s awesome - I bet that shit snapped your back in half though that kinda fall has got to hurt lol.
Thanks for the info y’all! It just kinda seemed like a lackluster demonstration of the tool-
There's a difference between a static weight and a dynamic one(one that's moving and has momentum)
And a cams grip strength increased with weight. The grip strength spikes as the shock force does during a fall.
This cam holds 14 kilonewtons of DYNAMIC force. Well above the force achievable by a human
@@gearaddictclimber2524 No it doesnt. The gear relies on rock grip. Its up to the grip, not the gear.
@@UnknownUser-nz3io luckily rock tends to hold compressive strength quite well
@@austinchasteeny Depends on the rock. I studied engineering and geology.
The amount of convincing he does to doubtful people who don't even climb amazes me.
He hits the rock with his hand like a cave man as if that would simulate him almost falling LMAO 🤣
Thats hilarious i said the same thing. And why is there a cushion under him.
I like how these people who have never been rock climbing in their lives are questioning the ability of specially engineered equipment.
Edit: please stop arguing in the comments I’m tired of getting notifications at 2 in the morning
Never going rock climbing doesn’t mean you can’t understand basic physics…
@@Youthereogre But wouldn't it be ironic to act like an expert of a certain field if you're not actually the expert of the said field, right?
Forget climbing. It's people that suck at math, physics, and engineering that are questioning the device.
@@Trials22 It could be both experienced climbers and people that have the IQ above a sheep.
As an engineer with an IQ of 142, I can say two things:
1) You dont need to be a genius to question the integrity of something as simple as cams in a crevice and
2) You should question the integrity of cams in a crevice
This solution maximizes simplicity, not efficacy
It's perfectly safe, the more weight that's put on it the better it will hold in place until either it or the rock breaks.
That boy got a safety pad
The first time I started experimenting around with trade climbing I didn't really trust the cams either now that I know how to use them I trust them with my life
Haters: "if you weren't gonna fall, then why is there a mat!?" 😵😱😤😩😓😣😖
Yes? It's valid criticism of the device.
Have you learned anything from schooling?
@@oddgbmo3036 have you ever seen someone bouldering without a mat? Doing that is simply irresponsible that's why he uses it cause safety first
I use those when I go camping to hang my hammock inside of small caves to protect myself from the weather. They're a great invention and haven't failed me yet.
The fact he was soooo confident he had to put a mat down
"I'm going to show you how it supports me falling"
_Doesn't show how it supports him falling_
did you watch the video
What
He just suspends itself, he doesn't fall, there is no momentum so the strength is pretty different than a fall.
@@topology9562 The cams can hold well over 12000 Newtons of force and the harder the fall the harder the cam grips to the crack, so it is basically fool proof safe. Also climbers use dynamic ropes which stretch like a bungee so it wont jerk in a fall.
@@KennyT187 YO WHO INVITED BILL NYE THE SIENCE GUY, NAH IM KIDDING COOL FACTS BY THE WAY, I THOUGHT IT WAS 11000 NEWTONS OR AROUND OPROXIMENTLY 8890.06 KNs JUST BY A GUESS
“A lot of you guys didn’t trust this would hold me”
*Puts safety mat underneath him*
Axactly
yes lets all just stop using safety measures because clearly nothing can go wrong, lets just remove all life jackets, rafts, oxygen masks and seatbelts on planes because crashs are unlikely
@@Zephyr-Queen bro just stfu. His whole point was the fact it’s safe for a cliff edge and that we should trust it. So why doesn’t he trust it fully himself not to put a safety mat there? And the whole point in a plane isn’t to prove it can fly safely. It’s to get me somewhere. The whole point of this video is him proving we can trust it. Big difference.
Someone's not using ppe in workplace. Whooops
Well he did say in the video that it wasn’t an ideal placement, he probably trusted the device but didn’t fully trust the stone
The fact you're less that a foot off the ground and there's a mat on the ground shows this took more than one take 🤣
That mattress down there shows your real confidence in that hook 😂😂😂😂😂
Hahaa
It's called a precaution chief
There meant for safety, not so you can jump off a cliff and expect to be fine, it’s like a backup plan. If you fall would you rather have a chance to die or die?
The cam is only as good as your placement.
You wouldn't want to risk a broken back right?
Since it's still possible to fall, it's just not likely
You didn’t actually “fall”. Lots more tension in a real situation. I’m sure it works but be real about it.
Same thing would happen if he lost his footing, at that level that IS a fall. All things aside though, it will hold.
@@aspecttnd you cannot call that a fall bro 😂😂
@@aspecttnd there was barely any slack before he "fell" 2 inches
If he falls the force will pull out the gear and increase the hold...
@@tylerkondrat8668 Your definition of falling on the ground and falling while climbing are different. It's probably more of just a "catch" than a fall sure, but the equipment does the same lol. blah blah blah basically it'll hold
Oh yeah, that accurately simulates the shock load of a fall.
Lol, this dude just started climbing. And someone convinced him that way. Lol
I know I sound like a heckler but hear me out. He sat down he didn't fall.
“This non-fall proves it would hold me in a fall”
I love how he made sure there was a mat underneath just incase he fell 2 feet
Ikr was he doubted his self.
@@birdboy8592 I guess so
He was probably just bouldering and decided to take a minute to film this. Anyone whos ever used a cam has total trust in them.
@@birdboy8592 No he just knows that trusting something not to fail dosent mean it want.. intelligence is key..why do people think the matt is a sign of distrust... Lmao
@@boogerburger1225 then whats rhe purpose of the mat for if he trust his product then no worry no need for mat
He: "I trust this thing but foam will do if i fall from this height just to be safe"
Me: bruh
I think it's cause he trusts the tool but the rock itself could be weak.
Beat me to it 🤣🤣
Or he's bouldering, already had the pad there, and just decided to do a demonstration unrelated to bouldering
Camming devices like that work great especially for a layback when you need to stick and move. I carried camelots, tricams and stoppers when I still climbed. Stay with it. You’ll miss it after you stop. Kids, mortgages, etc tend to cut away your free time lol.
This guy left his Star Wars audition early to tell us about rock climbing.
I dont know why but I really love rockclimbing. even tough Ive never set foot on an actual mountain, just doing routes in a gym designed for that feels awesome to me, both the process and the finnish
Ok, but "drop" while clipped. The jerking motion would be different than just swinging there
Go look up videos of climbers taking whippers. Lots of falling on exactly these devices. They hold. They’ve held me and friends plenty of times.
I'll have a gander. Climbing terrifies me haha
Climbers use stretchy (dynamic) ropes for this reason. You want to avoid shock loading your protection, but more importantly, if you took a big fall on a non-stretchy (static) rope and this device caught your fall, you would likely have internal organ damage from the forces on your body.
"That's not going anywhere"
I've heard that before.
Everybody believed you till we peeped the mat 😂
"That things not going anywhere"
*rock decides to roll over him instead*
🤣🤣
😂😂😂
Bruh not ideal it's horrendous 😂😂 it's completely over cammed
when is overcammed the position is perfect, of course it will be difficoult to take it out (a lot of times impossible, so the placement of the video is of course wrong), but the most is cammed the most it will be safe
It's called 'making a donation'
I’m more amazed at his granny sandals.
shaggy without a beard is very courageous man
I remember using those for the first time. Eyewitness everyone else not having a problem with those. At that point I was used to using the bolts that are already installed on the rock. One weekend my friends decided to try a different route and we loaded up with cams and lucky for me they held my weight when I lost my grip. I was about eight hundred feet up. Even with that it was a great day of climbing.
800 ft. How tf do you get yourself to do that? Does it just come with time?
All the non-climbers and non-trad folks disbelief in cams is quite amusing.
They're surprisingly good. Even on big falls.
Check out How Not To Highline.
Tbf, as soon as you learn how good they can be, you learn how many factors it takes to make a good placement, and the cycle starts again 😂 I'm not worried about the cam, just everything it's attached to
It'd be different in an actual fall though. A fall would be where it wouldbe more likely to fail, especially in a non-ideal placement
No it wouldn’t. The rock is going to break before the cam does. They would be sold if they didn’t work
My thoughts exactly. Falling at 9.8m per second per second packs some weight
@@Youthereimnot you guys are speculating about a sport you've never done, he is fine unless he were to fall going nearly 60 km an hour 30m and broke the rock, and people dont just use one
Bro got comfortable in a second... He could sleep in that position or spend his remaining life 💀
Anything can hold you bruh, you are spider's weight.
I love how people always say than some dude is skinny unless hes a 250 pound bodybuilder
Dude that fall was like wow!
The momentum of the fall was just mind blowing !
yeah. it was so dangerous, my heart almost skilled a beat. but then I saw that soft square mat to soften his fall from the potential deadly demonstration.
@@robosing225 kiss me.
@@99jdogg down by the milky twilight
@@znk753 ikr, god forbid someone doing their hobby knows what they're talking about
I love how he taps the rock as if it's gonna bounce him up and down more.
That was hilarious! 😂
His flow is 👌👌👌
LOL this man's trying to convince us of this gadget yet still places a mat under him 🤣
It can’t hurt to have a redundancy plan. Tools and equipment can break suddenly even if you trust it.
He proved it holds, not stupidity. Why wear a helmet if you trust your race car.
Even though I just witnessed him not falling, I still won’t trust my life with it tbh in my opinion
The cams can hold well over 12000 Newtons of force and the harder the fall the harder the cam grips to the crack, so it is basically fool proof safe. Also climbers use dynamic ropes which stretch like a bungee so it wont jerk in a fall.
Whats the mattress for
Doesn’t the shock from an actual fall create force that is much more than your actual weight?
When I have to resort to a weighted anchor in my work, I’m supposed to use one that is at least triple my body weight.
Yes definitely. However, the way cans work means that the more force you put on them, the more the gears spread out, making them more secure
Correct, for an example of cam capacities if we look at BD c4 camalot they range from 8 - 14KN over their lineup of sizes. For reference most falls exert in the range of 2-6KN which is less than even the smallest cam rating. Of course this assumes good placement on good rock, but that's half the experience of rock climbing is you have to know how to use your equipment.
Bro you brave for trusting that widget
Your “llittle tug” is definitely not to be compared with the “fall” he’s worried about.
The cams can hold well over 12000 Newtons of force and the harder the fall the harder the cam grips to the crack, so it is basically fool proof safe. Also climbers use dynamic ropes which stretch like a bungee so it wont jerk in a fall.
If I could have a tenth the trust this man has for this tiny device to save his life as I do with people, I’d be chilling
They use multiple
Falling for just a fraction of a second and stopping suddenly can increase the force applied to the rope by many times your weight. This could make the rock holding it shatter. Test it with much more weight, or by falling and having it catch you, and I will believe it.
You can just see on the internet that they are rated for around 10 kilonewtons, or a thousand kilos, which is like? 12 times your bodyweight? It's a similar rating to that of the carabiners you would use (usually 20k or more, a difference easily explained by the fact one is a static object and one is fairly more complicated) is it as secure as a bolt? Probably not, as this is still a safety device designed for particular situations
Still, it's extremely more likely that the rock fails or the placement is wrong, rather than the cam failing. You'd hear many more incidents otherwise
No shit sherlock but you think tgwse things are not tested in these scenarios before they were sold to the public? Cmon man. Use your brain
@@mr.bobdabbalina1246 I am more concerned with the amount of force the rock can withstand before breaking. If I should just look it up, or assume it's safe, what's the point of this video? I want to see it tested in a realistic scenario, c'mon man.
People have been using these for years. The gear works. Now, if you don't know know how/where to place it, then you run into problems. I trust that my gun won't go off when I drop it, but I won't drop a loaded gun just to prove it's safe to people on the internet.
@@alloypaulson7520 I have seen many guns drop tested online, in controlled environments. It is because of tests like these, we know that guns with internal safety mechanisms are safe beyond a reasonable doubt.
He hit the rock like if it was going to move! 🤣😂
If he’s so confident, then why he’d place a mattress on floor.
He might have been bouldering before-hand and the mattress was there for convenience.
Its a crash pad, and he's clearly not actually intending to climb
Still no way I'm trusting this little something during a climb hahahah
😂😂😂😂
He literally caught himself with his foot before really dropping. Doesn’t even trust it 2 foot off the ground w/o mat. Do this under a highway over pass with cars under you and I’ll trust ya
These cams are used every single day by hundreds, maybe thousands, of people and they work just fine.
It’s mad how something so small and unimportant looking could be so vital!