If you have a Surface Pro 7+, 8 or 9 which requires additional drivers, there now is a script available which automatically installs all dependencies for you: github.com/themediocredev/LTSS
Currently, only Fedora is officially supported, but the script can easily be altered.
Bonjour, Le tactile ne fonctionne pas nativement pour les surfaces 8 ? Il est obligatoirement nécessaire d'installer le script ? ---- Hello, The touchscreen does not work natively for surfaces 8? Is it necessary to install the script ?
Thank you for the information. It is only Surface Pro 7, think the basic version with 4gb and i3 10th gen cpu. I have Mint on in now and i like it a lot, but a little sad about non function touch.
I have a Surface Book 2. I just installed Fedora 36 and HOLY COW! Basically everything works perfectly, including the detach, the camera and the pen. The pen even works better than in Windows 11 with Xournal++.
THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN SAYING!!! I mean I'm using an HP Envy x360 convertible and ParrotOS, but xournal++ and Write (by stylus labs) were the first and only 2 notetaking apps I've tried thus far, and they're both INFINITELY better than any notetaking app I've ever used in the past 5 years on Windows, obviously including OneNote. And I've tried just about every single notetaking app in existence on Windows. It's so frustrating, mindblowing, and also amazing (now that I'm actually using linux) that some random linux dudes make better software than multi-billion dollar companies like microsoft...
Got myself a Surface Go 3 for Uni last year and Fedora works way better then Windows. Everything except for the cameras worked just as expected. Now, with the latest kernel release from the linux-surface team those work too. Need a bit of fine-tuning, but they work good enough already. Am happy with my choice
@@aleckbo if you have secure boot off, yes you can have grub to handle it but only with secure boot off or signed kernels. So yes, dual boot is possible.
How are the speakers and battery life? Just picked up a base model for a crazy good price and thinking about trying to install to a Micro SD card and making grub boot to it.
@@LazyPCRehab camera not working - touch not properly functional sometimes - Bluetooth freezes and doesn't keep settings - pen not working - speakers were performing very well audio was very good. I had latest Fedora and latest surface kernel for my surface pro 7 - still a lot of job but progressing very fast. Battery life? Well battery life was just incredibly long, it had a very very very well balanced and long lasting power setup. 2 days without charging and still 60 % of course not all hardware is fully functional, but it's impressive 😍
@@mistercrisper84 wow ok. I have fedora 36 and 37(beta) on Surface Pro 4. Touchscreen not working. I am reading about the right kernel. Will try again.
Got a Surface Go 3 and installed ubuntu on it - I'd be lying if I said I had no issues, but after getting most things resolved it's now almost a perfect device for a cs student. Great for taking notes with xournal++, plus all the benefits of development you get with linux, and considering the low specs it's all very smooth.
I've installed Kali Linux on my Surface Pro 7, but the resolution isn't compatible. I've tried to change it from settings, but the problem persists. Additionally, in tablet mode, I can't double-click, and I can't zoom in.
Dude you are my soulmate. I got a Surface Go and Installed Ubuntu with Xournal++, to use for my cs bachelor lol. Though I did have issues as well, xournal would crash but I fixed it with an updated driver.
I'm very excited to install linux on my new surface, it's a bit of a learning curve since I've never used things like shim for validation. Was initially going to install it with arch (that's what I use on my desktop), I did try that and had some issues with secureboot and shim, going to try again but I have to say fedora does look appealing for this purpose.
I've Microsoft Surface 3 (2 Gb RAM). Bodhi Linux 6.0 is really cool with it, besides it doesn't show battery level, however Ubuntu 20.04 does. BL consumes only 230 Mb RAM, and that's why Windows is much worse choice for this tablet.
I don't like gnome on desktops (I prefer more classic GUIs), but on touch screen it can be really good. Something like this would be the perfect device for me to study (previously) and work (now). That is, I need a small lightweight computer with different physical ports and a fully functional OS. At one time, such devices were netbooks, but now they, as a class of devices, are practically dead. Android tablets are not suitable for me - they usually do not have the necessary ports (usb, ethernet, etc.), and the OS is too limited. Great for fun, but not for work. So a Windows or Linux tablet with a physical keyboard seems ideal. The only problem is that these are either unusable Chinese junk or rather expensive models.
Too bad nothing works anymore since the last firmware update. Essentially blocks all 3rd party OS. Can't even boot into a USB . Spent 2 days trying to figure out how to downgrade my firmware with no luck at all. This will be my last surface. F Microsoft
I own a SP 7, been using Linux and windows hopping that the touch drivers will get better and to have pen support, the developers added pen support a month ago, since then I just removed windows out of my life
@@sanjay59741 Is way better now, but I'm no longer using the SP7, I was tired of dealing with MS products so I'm now using an HP Envy x360 that has way better Linux support, pretty much everything works out of the box
@@sanjay59741 no, it doesn't work, but for the rest is great, I'm no longer using the SP7, currently shifted to a HP Envy x360 so I could not be able to give any updates on this, the HP is working awesome for far 😅
I had the Original Surface Pro back in and around 2015, it came with windows 8 installed, but within about a year I had Ubuntu installed on it. almost nothing worked, even the WIFI was not working and I had to buy a wifi dongle for it. but it was amazing to me. fast forward about 2 years later and almost everything worked with the stock Ubuntu Kernel. glad to see that I wasn't the only one crazy enough to do this.
very intersting as I was getting VERY ANGRY with a second hand surface 5 i gave to my wife, as the battery is next to dead (too complex to DIY change) so I run DC, the craposoftware detected my utter sadness and slowed the CPU right down to a crawl, sub 0.8Ghz, etc, I tried throttlestop, hammerstop etc, didnt work as I needed to set semething in the BIOS, but really had enough trying to find a BIOS core, I hate windoze anyway, so assumed there is no access to the BIOS in the way I need to on MOBOS, having had enough I put it in the near to the exit bin-it-later drawer, UNTIL I saw this -------- so a heartfelt thanks from Thailand as I hate throwing good tech away and cannot spend years delving into it, so Linux on my wifes surface here we come , and for me hehehehe proxmox etc on surplus rack Hua Wei servers yummy so cheap and tasty...
Subscribed due to this video. For me lack of camera support is the negative, but as soon as that is added, I am moving away. Win 11 killed my tablets performance and battery. But really looking forward to this. Great video, look forward to your content.
My Surface 4 Pro has cooling issues on Windows 10. It seems that things have come a long way since I last checked. Excited to ditch Windows on my Surface as well. I would also agree that Gnome seems a better fit than Windows on touch hardware
I've used Linux for years and i never thought I would say this.. But you really convinced me to buy a Surface. At least, is there another tablet that allows you to install Linux?
9 months later and still no camera. Its a bummer because I was debating doing this on my Surface, but unfortunately there still isnt support for the Camera on the SP7
Endeavour OS (arch based) works wonderfully on SP5. However, touchscreen is really not great, doesn't really get input well at all. And the cameras don't work on browsers, you can create some sort of backloop but that's a pain in the ass and actually doesn't work anymore. So I suggest put Linux on it exclusively if you want to REVIVE your laptop, but otherwise don't, at least yet..
Thank you man you've just convinced me going to Linux... Well my uefi is locked I have to send it back for a replacement to boot any custom kernel. Yesterday I've just tried Ubuntu with generic kernel wow I am amazed, true: Linux on surface is 10000 smoother, safe and powerful than Windows. I'm pretty sure full Linux support is coming soon for surface users.
I tried doing this a few years ago and almost nothing worked, especially the touch screen, which was a no go for me since I use it primarily as a drawing tablet. Seeing that it's finally possible is so exciting, because a surface pro with linux is exactly the kind of laptop and drawing tablet i've always wanted! If only clip studio worked better on linux...
Things were not great with me with using Linux in a surface pro. I owned a Surface Pro 6, sold it two months ago. Although touchscreen works, pen works but… it’s far from ideal. It seems the touch sample has some problems; the pen writing and drawing is completely inconsistent. I tried with both Wayland and Xorg. It’s barely usable if you want to write, it’s totally unusable if you need to draw or constantly write (like a student using onenote like apps). Unless someone just developed a really great new touch drive or has made a breakthrough, I do not recommend to install Linux unless as an interesting test device. Or if you don’t need a reliable touch and pen support.
I used Surface Go 1 and 2, and both worked fine with pen. Including pressure sensitivity. But I'm not using them enough (mostly writing temporary math to avoid paper). I did see a review where they tested 2 Wacom digitizer technologies, and the ones in SGO1/2 had some zig-zagging on diagonal lines; but the RUclipsr did this test in Windows, so a HW limitation, not SW. I also own a 2-in-1 Lenovo and a Wacom Pen that can switch between the 2 techs (and working on Surfaces and Lenovo by just using the switch).
@@MichaelNROH it showed to me as a registered pen/touch device. Every time I tried to draw a continuous line, the line kept getting interrupted every 2 or 3 centimeters. As if the touch and pen sampling rate was low.
The tough part for me here is longevity. I bought a Chromebook in a similar circumstance and lucked out: I bought it because it was very cheap and people had patched the Linux kernel to support all the hardware on it so I figured I could run Linux. For a while it was a bit frustrating to use the patched kernel, because it took a while to bring down upstream changes. Luckily within a few years, the hardware on my Chromebook was supported natively on the Linux kernel itself, and I could abandon the custom patched kernel. As long as it is relatively promising that hardware support for these devices will make their way upstream into the Linux kernel itself at some point, I'd be comfortable purchasing a Surface tablet to run Linux. However, I'm a bit wary as I don't know how sure of a thing that is. If for some reason the hardware support doesn't make its way upstream, or the developers on surface-kernel abandon the project, I'd be left a sad camper.
Using a more niche product like a "Tablet"-PC and Lightweight laptops will probably always result in more of a hassle. But this isn't exclusive to Linux. In my case, even Windows has major flaws when not using a custom Surface version. A regular Windows installation with the typically ISO, will have no touchscreen, camera or some additional feature support. It's more the nature of the device itself, in my opinion
I don't think you need to worry about longevity or the custom kernel getting abandoned. I've been running Debian on my Pro 7 for over a year now and the developer is very active and pushes updates basically weekly. He's even had a bunch of people join him since I started using it so he is no longer alone on the project. It even had a fork for the Surface ARM devices now that he recomends and links to from his GitHub. And yes he does push all his work upstream to the mainline kernel as well. It just doesn't show up there near as fast.
Thanks for the video. one of the very few videos on surface pro and linux. I recently picked up a used surface pro 6 just to run linux on it. I picked the pro 6 based on the compatibility matrix for linux support. One of my requirements was to have a working camera for zoom meeting. Looking forward to installing and using linux on this thing.
Also installed fedora on my SGO3. Windows Explorer and overall performance FU**ed me up. I'm Quote happy now. Camera isn't Wirkung yet, but not a big deal.
You should check out this link right here: github.com/linux-surface/linux-surface/wiki/Supported-Devices-and-Features#feature-matrix Unfortunately, depending on the version of your laptop, there might not be a driver yet. There's nothing you can really do about it unless you want to reverse engineer it from Windows (Spoiler: It's very hard)
Is there any chance that drivers for the SP7 cameras will become available? I plan to install macOS, however the lack of camera drivers is the same problem as with Linux.
Gawsh you make it sound easy, then you look into the installation and it's a hell of a lot more work than just installing Linux onto the surface pro 4 haha
@@MichaelNROH sometimes the touchscreen goes haywire and trigger random locations on the screen. I did not have this issue on Windows 10 though, so it couldn't be the display itself. Also, resolution scales terribly on multiple display because you cannot set independent scale for different display, causing the UI to either be so small or so big, following the main display's scale.
I bricked my surface pro trying to install the github drivers. I could get Linux Mint installed, the only installer that worked of several I tried. Even so, going to the next step, the surface drivers...bricked, bricked, bricked....redo reinstall Windows 10, move on.
I have Fedora 36 stock on an Acer 2-in-1 and everything 'just works'. Touchscreen is good, touchpad gestures fantastic, it even auto-detects when I flip into tablet mode. Battery life is also better without Windows 10 scanning for 'viruses' 12 times in a row everyday. I don't use encryption, but it is free on Linux and not for Windows Home. Much snappier overall. Recently switched to Fedora 36 on my Windows 11 desktop and its great (although I can't get Davinci Resolve working at all).
@@MichaelNROH Thanks man, most up-to-date guide I've seen lol. Doesn't help me personally, though. Gotta mess with AMD Pro drivers and Kernal versions that risk borking my system so I gave up. Using Kdenlive now but its color correction is absolute garbage.
I am using Gnome 46 DE ( On L Mint) on my Dell 2in1 laptop and touch support is horrible i don't know why, I can't even open Show Apps Manu from the dock and too much latency while drawing, not usable... Is there anything I can do to improve it?
Hello everyone, I'm French and I haven't figured out how to make the touchscreen work... I do have a Surface Pro 4 and a Surface Pro 8 that I'd like to put under Linux, but it's important to me that the touchscreen works. Thanks in advance for your answers :-)
Could you please link in the video description the Surface compatibility website you told about? BTW, I wanted to install Linux on my Surface Go 2 but was swayed by the lack of clear documentation and a lot of negative comments about the compatibility
I can agree with a lot of what you said, except for the battery life claim. I love Linux, and it is my preferred OS, but I have never gotten anywhere near as good battery life out of my devices on Linux, as compared to their native operating systems of Windows or macOS. I have used multiple devices, from multiple manufacturers, and with different performance profiles... I systematically get 2 hours less on Linux than I do on Windows. It has been my only real gripe with Linux. I am far from the only one that has had this experience. My colleagues have experienced the same, and it is also something I see a lot in the community forums. There are utilities that can make the experience better, but out of the box, do not expect better battery performance.
Very nice!! And to think I have been wasting a lot of time looking for a Linux tablet when the solution is this simple!! By the way, have you tried the fly-pie gnome extension? I think that extension would enhance your tablet experience!
I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you're referring to as Linux, is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I've recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX. Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU which is widely used today is often called "Linux", and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project. There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine's resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called "Linux" distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux. I use arch btw.
I've said it in previous videos, that GNU/Linux and the Linux Kernel are different but in the context of referring to distributions, it's fine since it adds more confusion. You are 100% correct about the lingo, but I like to keep it simple as long as it stays in context.
@@vanodon2257 No, Richard, it's 'Linux', not 'GNU/Linux'. The most important contributions that the FSF made to Linux were the creation of the GPL and the GCC compiler. Those are fine and inspired products. GCC is a monumental achievement and has earned you, RMS, and the Free Software Foundation countless kudos and much appreciation. Following are some reasons for you to mull over, including some already answered in your FAQ. One guy, Linus Torvalds, used GCC to make his operating system (yes, Linux is an OS -- more on this later). He named it 'Linux' with a little help from his friends. Why doesn't he call it GNU/Linux? Because he wrote it, with more help from his friends, not you. You named your stuff, I named my stuff -- including the software I wrote using GCC -- and Linus named his stuff. The proper name is Linux because Linus Torvalds says so. Linus has spoken. Accept his authority. To do otherwise is to become a nag. You don't want to be known as a nag, do you? (An operating system) != (a distribution). Linux is an operating system. By my definition, an operating system is that software which provides and limits access to hardware resources on a computer. That definition applies whereever you see Linux in use. However, Linux is usually distributed with a collection of utilities and applications to make it easily configurable as a desktop system, a server, a development box, or a graphics workstation, or whatever the user needs. In such a configuration, we have a Linux (based) distribution. Therein lies your strongest argument for the unwieldy title 'GNU/Linux' (when said bundled software is largely from the FSF). Go bug the distribution makers on that one. Take your beef to Red Hat, Mandrake, and Slackware. At least there you have an argument. Linux alone is an operating system that can be used in various applications without any GNU software whatsoever. Embedded applications come to mind as an obvious example. Next, even if we limit the GNU/Linux title to the GNU-based Linux distributions, we run into another obvious problem. XFree86 may well be more important to a particular Linux installation than the sum of all the GNU contributions. More properly, shouldn't the distribution be called XFree86/Linux? Or, at a minimum, XFree86/GNU/Linux? Of course, it would be rather arbitrary to draw the line there when many other fine contributions go unlisted. Yes, I know you've heard this one before. Get used to it. You'll keep hearing it until you can cleanly counter it. You seem to like the lines-of-code metric. There are many lines of GNU code in a typical Linux distribution. You seem to suggest that (more LOC) == (more important). However, I submit to you that raw LOC numbers do not directly correlate with importance. I would suggest that clock cycles spent on code is a better metric. For example, if my system spends 90% of its time executing XFree86 code, XFree86 is probably the single most important collection of code on my system. Even if I loaded ten times as many lines of useless bloatware on my system and I never excuted that bloatware, it certainly isn't more important code than XFree86. Obviously, this metric isn't perfect either, but LOC really, really sucks. Please refrain from using it ever again in supporting any argument. Last, I'd like to point out that we Linux and GNU users shouldn't be fighting among ourselves over naming other people's software. But what the heck, I'm in a bad mood now. I think I'm feeling sufficiently obnoxious to make the point that GCC is so very famous and, yes, so very useful only because Linux was developed. In a show of proper respect and gratitude, shouldn't you and everyone refer to GCC as 'the Linux compiler'? Or at least, 'Linux GCC'? Seriously, where would your masterpiece be without Linux? Languishing with the HURD? If there is a moral buried in this rant, maybe it is this: Be grateful for your abilities and your incredible success and your considerable fame. Continue to use that success and fame for good, not evil. Also, be especially grateful for Linux' huge contribution to that success. You, RMS, the Free Software Foundation, and GNU software have reached their current high profiles largely on the back of Linux. You have changed the world. Now, go forth and don't be a nag.
I'm just checking that cameras are still not supported on SP7 and newer. 1yr past from the video. Not sure is many things changed. I don't really like win11 , so wonder if i can try Linux on my SP8.
I have successfully installed PCLinuxOS on Surface Pro device, in fact more than one Surface Pro device, the issue is that it runs fine on older devices, in recent surface pro devices the requirement is that Microsoft original Keyboard be replaced with external USB Kbd and Mouse.
Installing linux is a thing i've been trying to do on older windows tablets (the win8 era), problem is these device have 32bit efi with 64bit cpu or even 32bit cpu, and aside from windows linux 32bit efi boot if its 32bit os its not really easy, if the os is 64bit and even though it boots to 32bit efi the instrutions set of the x64bit cpu are not quite there and works real slow.. So aside from win8 32bit nothing else works good on them and its really sad, as w'd not mind using as an ebook or smt.
Actually booting linux on those tablets is pretty easy. All you need is to get EFI32 isolinux binaries (I got them from debian packages) and inject them in a regular linux image (ISO or flash drive). The problems I had, which I could not solve, were driver issues with Atom SOCs, including eMMC problems (would spew errors during install), no touch drivers, no wifi drivers (not just missing binary blob/firmware...the whole driver). I could basically use it just with USB hub with KB/mouse/network.
@@mateiberatco500 yeah then we ran into the same issues. I think the wifi worked once for me with fedora and the touch screen with the kde neon Test build for the kde mobile desktop, but I’ve gotten neither to work with what I’ve got currently installed on it. Right now I have installed SteamOs 3.0 using holoiso.
@@erdragh hi, yes i succeded in installing the os 64 bit with 32bit efi boot however like @Matei Beratco mentioned there are drivers issues.. Being so slow and sluggish. Also trying to install windows back again(like on my surface) also fucks by a lot as either drivers wont be easy to install does not even recognize an usb pen drive.. Or on my x64bit tablet that i need a win key(can be solved but another pain) . These things were made with no proper thought for the future and imo should not be release with such problems in the table, whoever started this should at least consider linux was a thing..
I got myself a Windows Surface Pro 9 16GB, Windows is just horrible as a developer.... + some other problems. i really need to switch back to Linux... however, im in such a doubt if it will go smooth. I really need to get away from Windows with WSL2, it sucks so bad and is extremely slow even on 16gb.... Also, window's 2fa Yubikey's does not even work on windows even tho it is supposed to work. Can i safely make an ISO with either Mint or Kali and switch w/o many problems? i honestly dont even care about the toch stuff.... i just need a tiny pc that can be somewhat fast when visiting localhost... the build process is fine.
To be honest Linux on a surface is cute and all but from my experience I don’t think it’s topping windows on the surface, I have a surface go 2 and though I understand there was touch issues,but it actually had the opposite effect than the ones you mentioned, draining more resources than Windows, thus more battery, and freezes up alot. I originally got my surface without an OS and added Manjaro gnome, and it was a nightmare, there was this thing I call “touch disease” where every time I touch my screen the distro would essentially fall apart, alongside having every resource issue I had earlier. And when my window manager fell apart I was left in a really bad position and lost a lot of data. I eventually switched to windows 10 and * Poof * my problems were gone, it was like I had a newer, much more powerful device, I even had enough room to run Bluestacks, the undisputed best android Virtual Machine, And my Windows’ window manager never falls apart. Honestly I can understand that Linux looks nice and all and has big buttons, but At least in my case, Linux is definitely not daily drivable on a surface. I currently do have Linux on my surface’s SD card, but I would never put it on my hardware again, and I would never suggest anyone else to do it either
@gilkesisking I say Linux because I tried it with Debian (current) and Manjaro(Past), and though Debian is doing alot better, I still shared some issues, and windows 11 is still vastly better, including the usage of less ram. I can try fedora, but it froze up on my 8gb VM, so would I try it on my 4GB Surface? No sir.
I've been running Manjaro KDE, Manjaro Gnome, KDE Neon and Now Ubuntu on a Surface Go 2 without any issues. Battery life is also fine. Only thing not working is the camera but that's a known issue.
@gilkesisking Did I forget to mention that Debian is doing A lot better, it’s doing more than just work. When I say “shared some issues” I mean gnome issues, like “touch disease”, things like the panel consuming a metric ton of ram, and lack of rotation has been fixed. XFCE,LXQT, and KDE are tip top. As for basing things off of a VM, that’s just the way things go, my Mac Pro essentially has all the resources to replicate my Surface (besides graphics) eightfold, It got 2x the resources my surface had and still failed (All other VM’s do spectacular on half load) while having the drivers built in. I admit I can just put it in a usb, and test it on my 16gb MacBook, but let’s be honest, why would I extend my hand further than I have now when I already have an OS that succeeded in the task I gave it? Either way I have nowhere else to put it. Look man I hate to sound like I hate Linux cause I don’t, I love it all. Linux has a lot of potential, but it also has a long way to go, especially in the consumer area. And just like how I don’t pull any punches with Mac OS or Windows I’m not gonna pull on Linux
I installed Pop OS on my Surface Pro 4 but unfortunately touch doesn’t work correctly even with the Surface kernel, I’m getting ghost touches everywhere, I tried the solution mentioned on GitHub but didn’t work. Can anybody help me ? Has someone incurred in the same issue ?
IMO both Windows 11 (especially after this year's update) and Gnome are quite comparable when it comes to the touch only experience. Although they both have specific pros and cons. I've replaced Windows 11 with Fedora on my Asus 2in1 to test some things out. I definitely prefer GNOME's dashboard over the current start menu. The thing that Windows definitely does better is the touch keyboard - it's almost on pair with the iPadOS keyboard. Gesture support and window manipulation using touch are also slightly better on Windows 11 22H2.
I've been running Fedora on a Surface Pro 3, and it works wonderfully. I want to put an Arch based distro on there, but for some reason none of the Arch based distros recognize the Wifi hardware for the Surface. But, hey. Fedora is working just fine for the time being.
I have an old surface pro 3, the Microsoft driver for the keyboard cover is constantly getting "corrupted" and it stops working. I want to turn the device into an E-Reader. and still be able to do a little work on the device. Now I might try Fedora 36 on it. Wish me luck
Howdy doesn't use the infrared sensor though, it only uses the camera. So it's not gonna be as secure, nor will it work as well under bad lighting conditions compared to windows hello facial recognition. That being said, I am using howdy on an LG gram and it's much faster than windows hello.
My company sells a product that uses Toughbooks as an interface to it. It might be cooler to use a Surface. We wouldn't even need things like the camera to work. Just the WiFi and Bluetooth and the touchscreen.
I will do a full scale video with exact results and a showcase once all features become available since some stuff is still experimental. Kind of sucks to have such a recent device
In my experience, battery life is where Windows always wins, Linux may be lighter but Windows has proprietary software which is completely tuned to the battery and OS, in all of my tests Windows absolutely destroys Linux when it comes to battery life and it's not just me, a quick Google search confirms that. I still use Linux on my Laptop regardless but you saying Linux will give better battery life is the only thing you have said that I disagree with.
Actually it depends, on my tests Linux always lasts longer than Windows, I always doubt when people say that Windows have better power management, because all the times that I tested the result was the same: hot laptop, fans crying and battery draining, the only time Windows gave me better battery was on a Windows 10 customized ISO, without background apps and a lot of things removed, it gave me 9 hours of battery, while on Linux I got easily 8 hours on Fedora and Pop!_OS, Ubuntu gave me a little less with 7 and half hours, but still good considering I don't need to do any tweaks
Coming to this a year late, but have been tempted by older Surface devices as potentially cheap play toys, and am happy to hear that even a year ago Fedora was well suited for reinvigorating these devices. I recently picked up a Razer Blade Stealth 2016 and immediately wiped the drive and threw Nobara on it (Glorious Eggroll’s custom “recipe” for Fedora, as it were), and haven’t looked back.
It seems like it's a bit of a hit or miss depending on the model you have. My S7+ has seen an increase in idle and low energy workloads (browsing the web), but a drop when watching RUclips videos. Others with older Surface versions often see better results, while some laptops don't. Bear in mind though, that this video is basically a year old and a lot of updates have been made
The issue I have is that all the videos about linux on surface always has the keyboard as the primary input. If you use the tablet only, how is the touch screen right click and virtual keyboard done?
It depends on the Desktop Environment, but on Gnome it's a long tap to bring up the right-click menu, and depending on if it's a GTK application, a keyboard pops up automatically, or you can do a swipe up gesture from the bottom of the screen
I think it's because of several issues. I'm not sure if every macBook supports different boot options since it is not designed to be repaired by an end user. Also, especially on newer devices, Apple Hardware is more incompatible than regular Intel and AMD CPU's.
As an actual mac user, I can say Yes, we can boot Linux, I’ve done it many times, Macs come with a built in boot manager known as EFI which is essentially a fusion between UEFI and MBR, and can boot off of anything that is a pariphial, such as: SD Cards, USB’s, internal and external forms of storage, Including, SATA, FireWire, Nvme, Thunderbolt, Bootable IPv4/3 networks, etc. And that applies to any MacBook, repairable or not and they do not brick their devices unless you’re doing something incredibly stupid with it. In terms of CPU’s they are also fine because most Macs have Intel CPU’s, and for M1 devices there’s Asahi Linux So what’s The problem? Linux is made for laptops and old windows computers, no in-between which is fine for MacBooks, especially the ones with integrated GPU’s but all the others is a crimson flag, Linux cannot comprehend the EFI Bios on removable GPU devices like the iMacs and Mac Pro, causing horrible Driver issues. Linux also can’t comprehend the SMC controller on macs, so you get alot of fan and battery issues. for example, on the iMac if you replaced your SSD, you’re fans are on Max, there is mbp fan control, but it just turns off your fans completely, causing thermal issues. and for some accursed reason, Firefox just eats your Ram on iMacs, no matter how much you have by absurd amounts, (12gb = 3Tabs 24gb = 8 Tabs 32gb = 20 Tabs(Ram speed does change results)) That aside, if you are only installing on on a MacBook, you’re fine. And more importantly Asahi Linux on M1 macs are actually alot better than their intel variants because A. M1 is an SOC so it kind of bundles things up B. Asahi is a Mac-based Linux distribution, so unlike other distros they actually want Mac users to actually use Linux, who knows, maybe they ACTUALLY own macs
I'm watching this video because I'm switching from a macbook to a surface, I didn't install linux on my macbook because it kept having hardware issues and I didn't want to void my warranty for repairs or make it so I need to reinstall macos every time I went to the apple store
I have an extended video and comparison about all of this planned, once all of the features like cameras work. For the while being, only personal experiences have to do.
@@MichaelNROH that works for me, I can find that out myself. But where did you get touchscreen driver for 7+? I saw you definitely used it. I happened to have one myself and guess what Hat is already installed there. Except I am completely lost about the touchscreen, do you still have a link?
@@mpakaboy github.com/quo/ithc-linux This is the driver but by default it is only single-touch. They linked an experimental iptsd-fork which should become the default quite soon probably
Hei. I have a surface book 2 and I have installed Linux Mint on it and I have a problem with the auto rotation when I use it lik a tablet. Do you know how to fix this??
Linux Mint is not really the best for tablets right now, since it still uses an old display protocol that isn't made for it. You should take a look into Wayland
If you have a Surface Pro 7+, 8 or 9 which requires additional drivers, there now is a script available which automatically installs all dependencies for you: github.com/themediocredev/LTSS
Currently, only Fedora is officially supported, but the script can easily be altered.
Bonjour,
Le tactile ne fonctionne pas nativement pour les surfaces 8 ? Il est obligatoirement nécessaire d'installer le script ?
----
Hello,
The touchscreen does not work natively for surfaces 8? Is it necessary to install the script ?
Thank you for the information. It is only Surface Pro 7, think the basic version with 4gb and i3 10th gen cpu.
I have Mint on in now and i like it a lot, but a little sad about non function touch.
I have a Surface Book 2. I just installed Fedora 36 and HOLY COW!
Basically everything works perfectly, including the detach, the camera and the pen.
The pen even works better than in Windows 11 with Xournal++.
@fernando henriques camera compatibility doesn’t work for anything yet
@fernando henriques but, I have the same issue with the pen (Surface Pro 7)
THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN SAYING!!! I mean I'm using an HP Envy x360 convertible and ParrotOS, but xournal++ and Write (by stylus labs) were the first and only 2 notetaking apps I've tried thus far, and they're both INFINITELY better than any notetaking app I've ever used in the past 5 years on Windows, obviously including OneNote. And I've tried just about every single notetaking app in existence on Windows. It's so frustrating, mindblowing, and also amazing (now that I'm actually using linux) that some random linux dudes make better software than multi-billion dollar companies like microsoft...
@giusn How is the battery ? How many hours ?
@@memeperor_ include rnote in the list its also great
Microsoft ：Why Surface is better than Apple silicon MacBook?
Linux User ：because it can run Linux
Asahi devs be like: hold my beer
@@DMSBrian24It is still in development.
Tada!!!
@@DMSBrian24 Asahi is still not working since you are not able to use you laptop thunderbolts =(
Got myself a Surface Go 3 for Uni last year and Fedora works way better then Windows. Everything except for the cameras worked just as expected. Now, with the latest kernel release from the linux-surface team those work too. Need a bit of fine-tuning, but they work good enough already. Am happy with my choice
Do you dual-boot? Just curious
@@aleckbo if you have secure boot off, yes you can have grub to handle it but only with secure boot off or signed kernels. So yes, dual boot is possible.
How are the speakers and battery life? Just picked up a base model for a crazy good price and thinking about trying to install to a Micro SD card and making grub boot to it.
@@LazyPCRehab camera not working - touch not properly functional sometimes - Bluetooth freezes and doesn't keep settings - pen not working - speakers were performing very well audio was very good. I had latest Fedora and latest surface kernel for my surface pro 7 - still a lot of job but progressing very fast. Battery life? Well battery life was just incredibly long, it had a very very very well balanced and long lasting power setup. 2 days without charging and still 60 % of course not all hardware is fully functional, but it's impressive 😍
@@mistercrisper84 wow ok. I have fedora 36 and 37(beta) on Surface Pro 4. Touchscreen not working. I am reading about the right kernel. Will try again.
Got a Surface Go 3 and installed ubuntu on it - I'd be lying if I said I had no issues, but after getting most things resolved it's now almost a perfect device for a cs student. Great for taking notes with xournal++, plus all the benefits of development you get with linux, and considering the low specs it's all very smooth.
I love and really appreciate your honesty man!
I've installed Kali Linux on my Surface Pro 7, but the resolution isn't compatible. I've tried to change it from settings, but the problem persists. Additionally, in tablet mode, I can't double-click, and I can't zoom in.
Dude you are my soulmate. I got a Surface Go and Installed Ubuntu with Xournal++, to use for my cs bachelor lol.
Though I did have issues as well, xournal would crash but I fixed it with an updated driver.
How’d you fix charging
I'm very excited to install linux on my new surface, it's a bit of a learning curve since I've never used things like shim for validation. Was initially going to install it with arch (that's what I use on my desktop), I did try that and had some issues with secureboot and shim, going to try again but I have to say fedora does look appealing for this purpose.
I have arch running on my surfacebook 2, but i dont have secureboot enabled
I've Microsoft Surface 3 (2 Gb RAM). Bodhi Linux 6.0 is really cool with it, besides it doesn't show battery level, however Ubuntu 20.04 does. BL consumes only 230 Mb RAM, and that's why Windows is much worse choice for this tablet.
I don't like gnome on desktops (I prefer more classic GUIs), but on touch screen it can be really good. Something like this would be the perfect device for me to study (previously) and work (now). That is, I need a small lightweight computer with different physical ports and a fully functional OS. At one time, such devices were netbooks, but now they, as a class of devices, are practically dead. Android tablets are not suitable for me - they usually do not have the necessary ports (usb, ethernet, etc.), and the OS is too limited. Great for fun, but not for work. So a Windows or Linux tablet with a physical keyboard seems ideal. The only problem is that these are either unusable Chinese junk or rather expensive models.
Why not 14 inch laptop
Linux is getting better for every single thing! Yay go linux!
Too bad nothing works anymore since the last firmware update. Essentially blocks all 3rd party OS. Can't even boot into a USB . Spent 2 days trying to figure out how to downgrade my firmware with no luck at all. This will be my last surface. F Microsoft
I own a SP 7, been using Linux and windows hopping that the touch drivers will get better and to have pen support, the developers added pen support a month ago, since then I just removed windows out of my life
which distro? can you point me towards installation/set-up help/instructions. thank you
@@dannygboyo man, just install any distro you like, and google how to install the Linux surface kernel
How is it now. Did it improve? I own SP7+ and read that the camera will not work.
@@sanjay59741 Is way better now, but I'm no longer using the SP7, I was tired of dealing with MS products so I'm now using an HP Envy x360 that has way better Linux support, pretty much everything works out of the box
@@sanjay59741 no, it doesn't work, but for the rest is great, I'm no longer using the SP7, currently shifted to a HP Envy x360 so I could not be able to give any updates on this, the HP is working awesome for far 😅
I had the Original Surface Pro back in and around 2015, it came with windows 8 installed, but within about a year I had Ubuntu installed on it. almost nothing worked, even the WIFI was not working and I had to buy a wifi dongle for it. but it was amazing to me. fast forward about 2 years later and almost everything worked with the stock Ubuntu Kernel. glad to see that I wasn't the only one crazy enough to do this.
very intersting as I was getting VERY ANGRY with a second hand surface 5 i gave to my wife, as the battery is next to dead (too complex to DIY change) so I run DC, the craposoftware detected my utter sadness and slowed the CPU right down to a crawl, sub 0.8Ghz, etc, I tried throttlestop, hammerstop etc, didnt work as I needed to set semething in the BIOS, but really had enough trying to find a BIOS core, I hate windoze anyway, so assumed there is no access to the BIOS in the way I need to on MOBOS, having had enough I put it in the near to the exit bin-it-later drawer, UNTIL I saw this -------- so a heartfelt thanks from Thailand as I hate throwing good tech away and cannot spend years delving into it, so Linux on my wifes surface here we come , and for me hehehehe proxmox etc on surplus rack Hua Wei servers yummy so cheap and tasty...
i tried 2 linux distro on my surface go (manjaro,debian) and now i'm using it with FideOs(chromeOS with android support) and it work wonderfully
Subscribed due to this video. For me lack of camera support is the negative, but as soon as that is added, I am moving away. Win 11 killed my tablets performance and battery. But really looking forward to this.
Great video, look forward to your content.
Meanwhile mircosoft : **internal screaming intensifies**
Why would anyone dare to install Linux on a Microsoft Surface you say? To further rub it on Microsoft's face just for simple pleasure.
but you already gave them money :(
I love Fedora too!
Somehow it only uses 6gb of storage space on my laptops SSD upon install!
Really great
Now try fedora 39 with KDE on it, which should give you a windows-like experience.
I'm not really looking for a Windows experience tbh
sadge.
My Surface 4 Pro has cooling issues on Windows 10. It seems that things have come a long way since I last checked. Excited to ditch Windows on my Surface as well. I would also agree that Gnome seems a better fit than Windows on touch hardware
Did u switch over? If so, how do u like it? I also have a SP4 and plan on doing this.
Were you able to get touch to work? I’ve been really struggling with that.
@@black_horse_lover2655 I’ve also been struggling with touch, I’ve been getting ghost touches everywhere. Had any luck getting it to work ?
@@gordon3002
Not yet.
I haven’t been able to get any sort of touch at all. But I’m not too smart and I’ve seen other people get it, so don’t give up!
I've used Linux for years and i never thought I would say this.. But you really convinced me to buy a Surface.
At least, is there another tablet that allows you to install Linux?
Using Zorin 16 on a Surface Pro 3. It is excellent, far better than Windows ever was.
The most important are some thing. Gnome, package manager no spyware :* gnome is the best thing avinable in linux :)
Please update this video on surface pro 11. I am looking to buy and run linux on it.
9 months later and still no camera. Its a bummer because I was debating doing this on my Surface, but unfortunately there still isnt support for the Camera on the SP7
Endeavour OS (arch based) works wonderfully on SP5. However, touchscreen is really not great, doesn't really get input well at all. And the cameras don't work on browsers, you can create some sort of backloop but that's a pain in the ass and actually doesn't work anymore. So I suggest put Linux on it exclusively if you want to REVIVE your laptop, but otherwise don't, at least yet..
i remember compiling a custom kernel on my surface pro 4 at the time lol.
Thank you man you've just convinced me going to Linux... Well my uefi is locked I have to send it back for a replacement to boot any custom kernel. Yesterday I've just tried Ubuntu with generic kernel wow I am amazed, true: Linux on surface is 10000 smoother, safe and powerful than Windows. I'm pretty sure full Linux support is coming soon for surface users.
I tried doing this a few years ago and almost nothing worked, especially the touch screen, which was a no go for me since I use it primarily as a drawing tablet.
Seeing that it's finally possible is so exciting, because a surface pro with linux is exactly the kind of laptop and drawing tablet i've always wanted!
If only clip studio worked better on linux...
Things were not great with me with using Linux in a surface pro. I owned a Surface Pro 6, sold it two months ago. Although touchscreen works, pen works but… it’s far from ideal. It seems the touch sample has some problems; the pen writing and drawing is completely inconsistent. I tried with both Wayland and Xorg. It’s barely usable if you want to write, it’s totally unusable if you need to draw or constantly write (like a student using onenote like apps). Unless someone just developed a really great new touch drive or has made a breakthrough, I do not recommend to install Linux unless as an interesting test device. Or if you don’t need a reliable touch and pen support.
Ok, that is interesting. I've not come across these problems but maybe it's because the newer pen is not registered as a touch device?
I used Surface Go 1 and 2, and both worked fine with pen. Including pressure sensitivity. But I'm not using them enough (mostly writing temporary math to avoid paper). I did see a review where they tested 2 Wacom digitizer technologies, and the ones in SGO1/2 had some zig-zagging on diagonal lines; but the RUclipsr did this test in Windows, so a HW limitation, not SW. I also own a 2-in-1 Lenovo and a Wacom Pen that can switch between the 2 techs (and working on Surfaces and Lenovo by just using the switch).
@@MichaelNROH it showed to me as a registered pen/touch device. Every time I tried to draw a continuous line, the line kept getting interrupted every 2 or 3 centimeters. As if the touch and pen sampling rate was low.
This is sure to be cool. I owned a surface but next I sold it because I got in love with my Thinkpad
Loved this video. Never thought about buying a Surface before this.
Thanks
The tough part for me here is longevity. I bought a Chromebook in a similar circumstance and lucked out: I bought it because it was very cheap and people had patched the Linux kernel to support all the hardware on it so I figured I could run Linux. For a while it was a bit frustrating to use the patched kernel, because it took a while to bring down upstream changes. Luckily within a few years, the hardware on my Chromebook was supported natively on the Linux kernel itself, and I could abandon the custom patched kernel.
As long as it is relatively promising that hardware support for these devices will make their way upstream into the Linux kernel itself at some point, I'd be comfortable purchasing a Surface tablet to run Linux. However, I'm a bit wary as I don't know how sure of a thing that is. If for some reason the hardware support doesn't make its way upstream, or the developers on surface-kernel abandon the project, I'd be left a sad camper.
Using a more niche product like a "Tablet"-PC and Lightweight laptops will probably always result in more of a hassle.
But this isn't exclusive to Linux. In my case, even Windows has major flaws when not using a custom Surface version.
A regular Windows installation with the typically ISO, will have no touchscreen, camera or some additional feature support.
It's more the nature of the device itself, in my opinion
I don't think you need to worry about longevity or the custom kernel getting abandoned. I've been running Debian on my Pro 7 for over a year now and the developer is very active and pushes updates basically weekly.
He's even had a bunch of people join him since I started using it so he is no longer alone on the project. It even had a fork for the Surface ARM devices now that he recomends and links to from his GitHub. And yes he does push all his work upstream to the mainline kernel as well. It just doesn't show up there near as fast.
Thanks for the video. one of the very few videos on surface pro and linux. I recently picked up a used surface pro 6 just to run linux on it. I picked the pro 6 based on the compatibility matrix for linux support. One of my requirements was to have a working camera for zoom meeting.
Looking forward to installing and using linux on this thing.
So, the is camera working on SP6 right? I’m looking to tinker my SP6 as well. But I mostly use it for photoshop.
I run Linux on my surface book 2 and it is awesome
Also installed fedora on my SGO3. Windows Explorer and overall performance FU**ed me up. I'm Quote happy now. Camera isn't Wirkung yet, but not a big deal.
Awesome video! Installing Fedora as I type this! Looking forward to the power profiles so hopefully will prevent eating my battery life.
Can you please do a 1 year update
I installed Ubuntu 22.04 on the microsoft surface pro 7+ and its so much better
Look like surface pro4
I have installed linux mint cinnamon and is flying😂
Battery still bad against my expectations
Low resources used
I manage to installed Ubuntu on a Surface laptop 3 it work good but I can not get the touch screen to work.... need help..
You should check out this link right here: github.com/linux-surface/linux-surface/wiki/Supported-Devices-and-Features#feature-matrix
Unfortunately, depending on the version of your laptop, there might not be a driver yet. There's nothing you can really do about it unless you want to reverse engineer it from Windows (Spoiler: It's very hard)
@@MichaelNROH thank you I will try this and let you know later
Just put Pop_OS! on my Surface Go 1. Everything out of the box. I didn't need to change a thing. So nice!
Is there any chance that drivers for the SP7 cameras will become available? I plan to install macOS, however the lack of camera drivers is the same problem as with Linux.
Gawsh you make it sound easy, then you look into the installation and it's a hell of a lot more work than just installing Linux onto the surface pro 4 haha
I am using Ubuntu 22.04 on my pc, it only shows two power modes, balanced and power saver, there is no performance mode. 😂
Same for me
5:32 Wow I never thought that this setting would be hidden deep down there, I've been trying this all day. Thank you man
Try Juno computer's new linux tablets, pretty cool.
yooeeefih love it 🤣
Very good idea
i might switch
I love the performance of Fedora 36 in my SP5, but it is still too unstable for my work use, especially on the touchscreen side.
What kind? I didn't notice stability problems
@@MichaelNROH sometimes the touchscreen goes haywire and trigger random locations on the screen. I did not have this issue on Windows 10 though, so it couldn't be the display itself. Also, resolution scales terribly on multiple display because you cannot set independent scale for different display, causing the UI to either be so small or so big, following the main display's scale.
I bricked my surface pro trying to install the github drivers. I could get Linux Mint installed, the only installer that worked of several I tried. Even so, going to the next step, the surface drivers...bricked, bricked, bricked....redo reinstall Windows 10, move on.
I have Fedora 36 stock on an Acer 2-in-1 and everything 'just works'. Touchscreen is good, touchpad gestures fantastic, it even auto-detects when I flip into tablet mode. Battery life is also better without Windows 10 scanning for 'viruses' 12 times in a row everyday. I don't use encryption, but it is free on Linux and not for Windows Home. Much snappier overall. Recently switched to Fedora 36 on my Windows 11 desktop and its great (although I can't get Davinci Resolve working at all).
I made a video about Davinci Resolve
@@MichaelNROH Thanks man, most up-to-date guide I've seen lol. Doesn't help me personally, though. Gotta mess with AMD Pro drivers and Kernal versions that risk borking my system so I gave up. Using Kdenlive now but its color correction is absolute garbage.
I am using Gnome 46 DE ( On L Mint) on my Dell 2in1 laptop and touch support is horrible i don't know why, I can't even open Show Apps Manu from the dock and too much latency while drawing, not usable... Is there anything I can do to improve it?
I read lot of pdfs who many hours i can get if power saver mode with only pdfs running. This can help me as student
Ofc, their hardware works best without their own product 😂
these companies should create a device for Linux, i'd love a surface like laptop/tablet made by Sony or LG, or even the best guys... Lenovo
Hello everyone,
I'm French and I haven't figured out how to make the touchscreen work... I do have a Surface Pro 4 and a Surface Pro 8 that I'd like to put under Linux, but it's important to me that the touchscreen works. Thanks in advance for your answers :-)
Late 2024 and these features still aren't merged with the kernel...annoying...
Could you please link in the video description the Surface compatibility website you told about? BTW, I wanted to install Linux on my Surface Go 2 but was swayed by the lack of clear documentation and a lot of negative comments about the compatibility
Ohhh, my bad 🤦♂️
I thought I did. Thanks for noticing
@@MichaelNROH thanks to you :-)
I can agree with a lot of what you said, except for the battery life claim. I love Linux, and it is my preferred OS, but I have never gotten anywhere near as good battery life out of my devices on Linux, as compared to their native operating systems of Windows or macOS. I have used multiple devices, from multiple manufacturers, and with different performance profiles... I systematically get 2 hours less on Linux than I do on Windows.
It has been my only real gripe with Linux. I am far from the only one that has had this experience. My colleagues have experienced the same, and it is also something I see a lot in the community forums. There are utilities that can make the experience better, but out of the box, do not expect better battery performance.
Very nice!! And to think I have been wasting a lot of time looking for a Linux tablet when the solution is this simple!!
By the way, have you tried the fly-pie gnome extension? I think that extension would enhance your tablet experience!
If only the pen pressure works seamlessly on Krita, it would be perfect usage
I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you're referring to as Linux, is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I've recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX. Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU which is widely used today is often called "Linux", and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project. There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine's resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called "Linux" distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux. I use arch btw.
I've said it in previous videos, that GNU/Linux and the Linux Kernel are different but in the context of referring to distributions, it's fine since it adds more confusion.
You are 100% correct about the lingo, but I like to keep it simple as long as it stays in context.
@@MichaelNROH Obvc but have to copy pasta when the opportunity arises 🙃
@@vanodon2257 No, Richard, it's 'Linux', not 'GNU/Linux'. The most important contributions that the FSF made to Linux were the creation of the GPL and the GCC compiler. Those are fine and inspired products. GCC is a monumental achievement and has earned you, RMS, and the Free Software Foundation countless kudos and much appreciation.
Following are some reasons for you to mull over, including some already answered in your FAQ.
One guy, Linus Torvalds, used GCC to make his operating system (yes, Linux is an OS -- more on this later). He named it 'Linux' with a little help from his friends. Why doesn't he call it GNU/Linux? Because he wrote it, with more help from his friends, not you. You named your stuff, I named my stuff -- including the software I wrote using GCC -- and Linus named his stuff. The proper name is Linux because Linus Torvalds says so. Linus has spoken. Accept his authority. To do otherwise is to become a nag. You don't want to be known as a nag, do you?
(An operating system) != (a distribution). Linux is an operating system. By my definition, an operating system is that software which provides and limits access to hardware resources on a computer. That definition applies whereever you see Linux in use. However, Linux is usually distributed with a collection of utilities and applications to make it easily configurable as a desktop system, a server, a development box, or a graphics workstation, or whatever the user needs. In such a configuration, we have a Linux (based) distribution. Therein lies your strongest argument for the unwieldy title 'GNU/Linux' (when said bundled software is largely from the FSF). Go bug the distribution makers on that one. Take your beef to Red Hat, Mandrake, and Slackware. At least there you have an argument. Linux alone is an operating system that can be used in various applications without any GNU software whatsoever. Embedded applications come to mind as an obvious example.
Next, even if we limit the GNU/Linux title to the GNU-based Linux distributions, we run into another obvious problem. XFree86 may well be more important to a particular Linux installation than the sum of all the GNU contributions. More properly, shouldn't the distribution be called XFree86/Linux? Or, at a minimum, XFree86/GNU/Linux? Of course, it would be rather arbitrary to draw the line there when many other fine contributions go unlisted. Yes, I know you've heard this one before. Get used to it. You'll keep hearing it until you can cleanly counter it.
You seem to like the lines-of-code metric. There are many lines of GNU code in a typical Linux distribution. You seem to suggest that (more LOC) == (more important). However, I submit to you that raw LOC numbers do not directly correlate with importance. I would suggest that clock cycles spent on code is a better metric. For example, if my system spends 90% of its time executing XFree86 code, XFree86 is probably the single most important collection of code on my system. Even if I loaded ten times as many lines of useless bloatware on my system and I never excuted that bloatware, it certainly isn't more important code than XFree86. Obviously, this metric isn't perfect either, but LOC really, really sucks. Please refrain from using it ever again in supporting any argument.
Last, I'd like to point out that we Linux and GNU users shouldn't be fighting among ourselves over naming other people's software. But what the heck, I'm in a bad mood now. I think I'm feeling sufficiently obnoxious to make the point that GCC is so very famous and, yes, so very useful only because Linux was developed. In a show of proper respect and gratitude, shouldn't you and everyone refer to GCC as 'the Linux compiler'? Or at least, 'Linux GCC'? Seriously, where would your masterpiece be without Linux? Languishing with the HURD?
If there is a moral buried in this rant, maybe it is this:
Be grateful for your abilities and your incredible success and your considerable fame. Continue to use that success and fame for good, not evil. Also, be especially grateful for Linux' huge contribution to that success. You, RMS, the Free Software Foundation, and GNU software have reached their current high profiles largely on the back of Linux. You have changed the world. Now, go forth and don't be a nag.
If I install a bunch of GNU software on Windows, should I call it GNU/Windows?
@@speedyfox9080 So you just use the base kernel, ahh i bet you a systemd hater aswell 🤔. Interesting choice.
I'm just checking that cameras are still not supported on SP7 and newer.
1yr past from the video. Not sure is many things changed.
I don't really like win11 , so wonder if i can try Linux on my SP8.
I have successfully installed PCLinuxOS on Surface Pro device, in fact more than one Surface Pro device, the issue is that it runs fine on older devices, in recent surface pro devices the requirement is that Microsoft original Keyboard be replaced with external USB Kbd and Mouse.
Hah, that's a new one but you are right. The most recent ones don't have the driver upstreamed to the mainline Linux kernel it seems
I am not a laptop fan, but after watching this, it looks exciting, look like worth doing. Thank you Michael ❤❤
😎 Cool
Installing linux is a thing i've been trying to do on older windows tablets (the win8 era), problem is these device have 32bit efi with 64bit cpu or even 32bit cpu, and aside from windows linux 32bit efi boot if its 32bit os its not really easy, if the os is 64bit and even though it boots to 32bit efi the instrutions set of the x64bit cpu are not quite there and works real slow.. So aside from win8 32bit nothing else works good on them and its really sad, as w'd not mind using as an ebook or smt.
Fedora generally supports 32bit UEFI with a 64Bit OS.
Actually booting linux on those tablets is pretty easy. All you need is to get EFI32 isolinux binaries (I got them from debian packages) and inject them in a regular linux image (ISO or flash drive).
The problems I had, which I could not solve, were driver issues with Atom SOCs, including eMMC problems (would spew errors during install), no touch drivers, no wifi drivers (not just missing binary blob/firmware...the whole driver). I could basically use it just with USB hub with KB/mouse/network.
@@mateiberatco500 yeah then we ran into the same issues. I think the wifi worked once for me with fedora and the touch screen with the kde neon Test build for the kde mobile desktop, but I’ve gotten neither to work with what I’ve got currently installed on it. Right now I have installed SteamOs 3.0 using holoiso.
@@erdragh hi, yes i succeded in installing the os 64 bit with 32bit efi boot however like @Matei Beratco mentioned there are drivers issues.. Being so slow and sluggish. Also trying to install windows back again(like on my surface) also fucks by a lot as either drivers wont be easy to install does not even recognize an usb pen drive.. Or on my x64bit tablet that i need a win key(can be solved but another pain) . These things were made with no proper thought for the future and imo should not be release with such problems in the table, whoever started this should at least consider linux was a thing..
i really want a more portable PC, and holy crap this is so cool
In my case, I installed chrome OS on my surface pro 3 lol
I got myself a Windows Surface Pro 9 16GB, Windows is just horrible as a developer.... + some other problems. i really need to switch back to Linux... however, im in such a doubt if it will go smooth. I really need to get away from Windows with WSL2, it sucks so bad and is extremely slow even on 16gb.... Also, window's 2fa Yubikey's does not even work on windows even tho it is supposed to work.
Can i safely make an ISO with either Mint or Kali and switch w/o many problems? i honestly dont even care about the toch stuff.... i just need a tiny pc that can be somewhat fast when visiting localhost... the build process is fine.
Kde plasma mobile is also quite fun on a surface. (have it on my SB 2)
it is ages that I am searching for a good linux tablet. not a fan of surface though since my surface pro 4 but nice video
To be honest Linux on a surface is cute and all but from my experience I don’t think it’s topping windows on the surface, I have a surface go 2 and though I understand there was touch issues,but it actually had the opposite effect than the ones you mentioned, draining more resources than Windows, thus more battery, and freezes up alot. I originally got my surface without an OS and added Manjaro gnome, and it was a nightmare, there was this thing I call “touch disease” where every time I touch my screen the distro would essentially fall apart, alongside having every resource issue I had earlier. And when my window manager fell apart I was left in a really bad position and lost a lot of data.
I eventually switched to windows 10 and * Poof * my problems were gone, it was like I had a newer, much more powerful device, I even had enough room to run Bluestacks, the undisputed best android Virtual Machine, And my Windows’ window manager never falls apart.
Honestly I can understand that Linux looks nice and all and has big buttons, but At least in my case, Linux is definitely not daily drivable on a surface. I currently do have Linux on my surface’s SD card, but I would never put it on my hardware again, and I would never suggest anyone else to do it either
@gilkesisking I say Linux because I tried it with Debian (current) and Manjaro(Past), and though Debian is doing alot better, I still shared some issues, and windows 11 is still vastly better, including the usage of less ram. I can try fedora, but it froze up on my 8gb VM, so would I try it on my 4GB Surface? No sir.
I've been running Manjaro KDE, Manjaro Gnome, KDE Neon and Now Ubuntu on a Surface Go 2 without any issues. Battery life is also fine. Only thing not working is the camera but that's a known issue.
@gilkesisking Did I forget to mention that Debian is doing A lot better, it’s doing more than just work. When I say “shared some issues” I mean gnome issues, like “touch disease”, things like the panel consuming a metric ton of ram, and lack of rotation has been fixed. XFCE,LXQT, and KDE are tip top.
As for basing things off of a VM, that’s just the way things go, my Mac Pro essentially has all the resources to replicate my Surface (besides graphics) eightfold, It got 2x the resources my surface had and still failed (All other VM’s do spectacular on half load) while having the drivers built in. I admit I can just put it in a usb, and test it on my 16gb MacBook, but let’s be honest, why would I extend my hand further than I have now when I already have an OS that succeeded in the task I gave it?
Either way I have nowhere else to put it. Look man I hate to sound like I hate Linux cause I don’t, I love it all. Linux has a lot of potential, but it also has a long way to go, especially in the consumer area. And just like how I don’t pull any punches with Mac OS or Windows I’m not gonna pull on Linux
Ugh.. Here we go again.. Just leave hardware specific to windows alone already.
It's like stalking and comparing yourself to your ex all the time 😂😂😂
I installed Pop OS on my Surface Pro 4 but unfortunately touch doesn’t work correctly even with the Surface kernel, I’m getting ghost touches everywhere, I tried the solution mentioned on GitHub but didn’t work. Can anybody help me ? Has someone incurred in the same issue ?
There is a guide on how to fix that in the WiKi of the linux-surface- project on the Pro 4 page.
@@AP-kx4yw That didn’t work for some reason, I have no idea what to do.
@@gordon3002 You could open an issue in the Repository or look if already one exists.
IMO both Windows 11 (especially after this year's update) and Gnome are quite comparable when it comes to the touch only experience. Although they both have specific pros and cons. I've replaced Windows 11 with Fedora on my Asus 2in1 to test some things out. I definitely prefer GNOME's dashboard over the current start menu. The thing that Windows definitely does better is the touch keyboard - it's almost on pair with the iPadOS keyboard. Gesture support and window manipulation using touch are also slightly better on Windows 11 22H2.
I agree on the touch keyboard. The default one in Gnome feels kind of small and not that satisfying to use.
@@MichaelNROH It baffles me that of all desktop environments it's KDE that has one of the best touch keyboards while Gnome's one is very basic
I've been running Fedora on a Surface Pro 3, and it works wonderfully. I want to put an Arch based distro on there, but for some reason none of the Arch based distros recognize the Wifi hardware for the Surface. But, hey. Fedora is working just fine for the time being.
Hi, did you also experience random touch screen or device freeze? Only Reboot solves it for me and happens a lot ... Got the Surface 3 (non pro) Thx
I have an old surface pro 3, the Microsoft driver for the keyboard cover is constantly getting "corrupted" and it stops working. I want to turn the device into an E-Reader. and still be able to do a little work on the device. Now I might try Fedora 36 on it. Wish me luck
Fedora was the most pleasant experience for me so far
Howdy doesn't use the infrared sensor though, it only uses the camera. So it's not gonna be as secure, nor will it work as well under bad lighting conditions compared to windows hello facial recognition. That being said, I am using howdy on an LG gram and it's much faster than windows hello.
personally for me using a 2 in 1 i prefer KDE to GNOME for touch.
good to know...I was skeptical until I saw this.....thanks
My company sells a product that uses Toughbooks as an interface to it. It might be cooler to use a Surface. We wouldn't even need things like the camera to work. Just the WiFi and Bluetooth and the touchscreen.
True, but at least it's more robust 😅
Damn I was so excited to get a surface laptop go 2 with arch +gnome.
Hmm okay but please show more of the tablet. Like, … the whole experience of using it 🤷🏾♂️
I will do a full scale video with exact results and a showcase once all features become available since some stuff is still experimental.
Kind of sucks to have such a recent device
In my experience, battery life is where Windows always wins, Linux may be lighter but Windows has proprietary software which is completely tuned to the battery and OS, in all of my tests Windows absolutely destroys Linux when it comes to battery life and it's not just me, a quick Google search confirms that. I still use Linux on my Laptop regardless but you saying Linux will give better battery life is the only thing you have said that I disagree with.
Actually it depends, on my tests Linux always lasts longer than Windows, I always doubt when people say that Windows have better power management, because all the times that I tested the result was the same: hot laptop, fans crying and battery draining, the only time Windows gave me better battery was on a Windows 10 customized ISO, without background apps and a lot of things removed, it gave me 9 hours of battery, while on Linux I got easily 8 hours on Fedora and Pop!_OS, Ubuntu gave me a little less with 7 and half hours, but still good considering I don't need to do any tweaks
Coming to this a year late, but have been tempted by older Surface devices as potentially cheap play toys, and am happy to hear that even a year ago Fedora was well suited for reinvigorating these devices. I recently picked up a Razer Blade Stealth 2016 and immediately wiped the drive and threw Nobara on it (Glorious Eggroll’s custom “recipe” for Fedora, as it were), and haven’t looked back.
Thanks for this video. Can i purchase tjos tablet on line and install any linux distro like mint? Or the only one works fone is fedora?
Theoretically yes, but the Surface Repo does not supply custom Kernels for that many distros. Functionalities might be limited
sure if the cpu can handle this:
Multi Tabs in firefox
Burpsuite
Brute force...?
Does battey life improve significantly improve with Linux?
It seems like it's a bit of a hit or miss depending on the model you have.
My S7+ has seen an increase in idle and low energy workloads (browsing the web), but a drop when watching RUclips videos.
Others with older Surface versions often see better results, while some laptops don't.
Bear in mind though, that this video is basically a year old and a lot of updates have been made
it's pretty cool until you realize you have to manually setup hibernation und lid close sleep yourself. It's basically trial and error.
I didn't check if hibernation works, but the sleep mode does when I close the cover.
I've verified this with the "Unblank lock screen" extension.
The issue I have is that all the videos about linux on surface always has the keyboard as the primary input. If you use the tablet only, how is the touch screen right click and virtual keyboard done?
It depends on the Desktop Environment, but on Gnome it's a long tap to bring up the right-click menu, and depending on if it's a GTK application, a keyboard pops up automatically, or you can do a swipe up gesture from the bottom of the screen
Why people don't install Linux in MacBook
Why only in windows machine
I heard max book brick their device 🤔
I think it's because of several issues.
I'm not sure if every macBook supports different boot options since it is not designed to be repaired by an end user.
Also, especially on newer devices, Apple Hardware is more incompatible than regular Intel and AMD CPU's.
As an actual mac user, I can say Yes, we can boot Linux, I’ve done it many times, Macs come with a built in boot manager known as EFI which is essentially a fusion between UEFI and MBR, and can boot off of anything that is a pariphial, such as: SD Cards, USB’s, internal and external forms of storage, Including, SATA, FireWire, Nvme, Thunderbolt, Bootable IPv4/3 networks, etc. And that applies to any MacBook, repairable or not and they do not brick their devices unless you’re doing something incredibly stupid with it.
In terms of CPU’s they are also fine because most Macs have Intel CPU’s, and for M1 devices there’s Asahi Linux
So what’s The problem? Linux is made for laptops and old windows computers, no in-between which is fine for MacBooks, especially the ones with integrated GPU’s but all the others is a crimson flag, Linux cannot comprehend the EFI Bios on removable GPU devices like the iMacs and Mac Pro, causing horrible Driver issues. Linux also can’t comprehend the SMC controller on macs, so you get alot of fan and battery issues. for example, on the iMac if you replaced your SSD, you’re fans are on Max, there is mbp fan control, but it just turns off your fans completely, causing thermal issues. and for some accursed reason, Firefox just eats your Ram on iMacs, no matter how much you have by absurd amounts, (12gb = 3Tabs 24gb = 8 Tabs 32gb = 20 Tabs(Ram speed does change results)) That aside, if you are only installing on on a MacBook, you’re fine. And more importantly Asahi Linux on M1 macs are actually alot better than their intel variants because A. M1 is an SOC so it kind of bundles things up B. Asahi is a Mac-based Linux distribution, so unlike other distros they actually want Mac users to actually use Linux, who knows, maybe they ACTUALLY own macs
I'm watching this video because I'm switching from a macbook to a surface, I didn't install linux on my macbook because it kept having hardware issues and I didn't want to void my warranty for repairs or make it so I need to reinstall macos every time I went to the apple store
I thought this was going to be the original microsoft surface, like the one that's a table, from the thumbnail
i have a surface 2 and the touchscreen and keypad are horrible
My guy, please provide some data about 'longer battery life' as for now it became top 1 problem at least for me when I use my 7+ as a portable device
I have an extended video and comparison about all of this planned, once all of the features like cameras work.
For the while being, only personal experiences have to do.
@@MichaelNROH that works for me, I can find that out myself. But where did you get touchscreen driver for 7+? I saw you definitely used it. I happened to have one myself and guess what Hat is already installed there. Except I am completely lost about the touchscreen, do you still have a link?
@@mpakaboy github.com/quo/ithc-linux
This is the driver but by default it is only single-touch. They linked an experimental iptsd-fork which should become the default quite soon probably
@@MichaelNROH thanks for replies! I think I will have to revisit it some time later
Hei. I have a surface book 2 and I have installed Linux Mint on it and I have a problem with the auto rotation when I use it lik a tablet. Do you know how to fix this??
Linux Mint is not really the best for tablets right now, since it still uses an old display protocol that isn't made for it.
You should take a look into Wayland
i love that i finally get special benefits for being too poor to get the fancier version of something lolol
GUTEN MORGEN, GUTEN MITTAG, oder auch GUTEN ABEND.... Wurde da etwa ein Outro geklaut :)