Not really...lets say Lebron, if he really does make his teammates better, his teammates would have improved and therefore performed better not only when lebron is on the court but also more when he is off the court...
The false narrative is that since -Lebron- passes a lot, that makes his teammates better. That's stupid as hell. You make you teammates better by making them increase their strengths, and lessen their weaknesses, through practice against yourself (the better player).
Weren't stacked teams, it was teams that matured and got better as the years went by, all because MJ made his team better in so many ways because of his leadership. Leflop joined super teams and over the years he did not make his teams better. There's a huge difference between these two aspects, which I don't know if it's because of kids like you youth or just not being too intelligent...
Those Bulls definitely weren’t “Super Teams.” Pippen and Grant were drafted by Chicago. They developed under MJ and got better over time. Mike didn’t hand pick a bunch of All NBA selections. For the 2nd 3-peat, Kukoc was a draft pick, and Rodman and Harper were brought in to replace other departures. Still effective guys, just not quite in their primes. Big difference from having guys like Wade & Bosh and Love & Kyrie in their All Star primes.
Exactly Wht we try to Teach or get them to Understand but no matter what no matter how they never accept it. LeChic went to the Cavs and lost & lost & lost then he said he had enuff and joined MIA with D Wade n Bosh. Now MJ was just as Dominant and more wen he entered the NBA, so you telln me tht leading the NBA in Scoring and voted DPOY the same Season which LeChic never and will never do bcse he cannot play DEFENSE but you're telln me tht isn't Dominant but hey he was in the same predicament like LeChic as in not having a good team around him. Now remember Scottie & Grant were both nurtured by MJ & Phil and as the yrs went by the Blossomed. MJ himself reopened his eyes to the Team concept bcse he now had Teammates he cud trust. A mean hey he went abt it the Tough Rough or the Brutal way but even so Players got their own accolades plus their Rings. So hey my Leader was an Ass Hole most the time and we parted after 4 Seasons but hey I didn't leave empty handed at least tht Ass Hole bckd his cht wen it was time to do just tht.
Youngin, I was born in the 70's. I DID watch Jordan play. And I absolutely DESPISE that man!!! I was born and raised in Michigan, so you already know I'm a Piston fan to the bone. I used to LOVE watching my Bad Boys send him home in the playoffs! That was better than my birthday! 😂 And with that said, the man is the GOAT and it's not even close! LeBron is a beast. And as much as I hate Jordan and want to give someone else the GOAT, the realness in me can't allow me to pretend I didn't see what I saw when MJ was on that court! The dude was INCREDIBLE!!! Listen, the man was SO good, he would do something during a game and made me forget I was rooting AGAINST him! My dumb ass would jump off the couch like "YES!!! YES!!! DID YALL SEE THA....wait! I mean....no! NOOOOO!" Man, they year they finally beat us, I thought my uncle was gonna have a heart attack the way he was yelling at the TV. All you heard was "DO SOMETHING! PULL A GUN OUT AND SHOOT THAT MF IF YOU HAVE TO! JUST STOP HIM!" I know y'all can't fathom someone being greater than LeBron because he's amazing. But, that man DID exist. And it was Michael Jeffrey Jordan. And this is coming from his biggest hater.
MJ is a true leader. He was already super elite and really couldn’t get much better, BUT he helped develop his teammates into winners bc he pushed them and demanded nothing less than their very best. That’s why they got better during those years. Huge difference in leadership between him and Lebron.
@@blindprophet182 No. Lebron’s star teammates all took a step back and played worse with the exception of Kyrie. Bosh, Wade, Love and AD all had better numbers before joining with him. Especially Love & Bosh
@@maestro4337 this shoots down the BS narrative of LeBron making his teammates better, which was created by the media and regurgitated constantly to justify LeBron being "better" (than Jordan).
Watched both players entire careers, Lebron and Jordan and I'll just say this: every player, team and coach genuinely feared playing against Jordan. No one anywhere fears playing Lebron.
That's not entirely true, a 6'8 265 locomotive with 0 body fat with sprinter speed and long jumper hops gets a free run at the basket, in getting the f out of there in a hurry. Not saying just saying. Now that same guy is holding the ball at 22 feet saying, I'm going to shoot it if you don't guard me" I'm like fine shoot it and getting in position for the board
It's a great video. I used to think Lebron was the better teammate than Jordan while Jordan was the better player than Lebron. This video proved me wrong. Not only was Jordan the better player, but also the better teammate! He dragged a useless team to glory whether they liked it or not. And they excelled because of his relentless leadership. So inspirational!
The lebron carrying his teams to the finals is so overrated when lebron played in the eastern conference lebron had no competition in that conference it’s not that lebron had scrubs in a tough conference he just had a way easier path so the statistics are going to favor him when you just go off numbers which again lebron fans only care about stats verses reality.. also that point that Jordan’s help was comparable to the warriors point he made was again only a STATISTIC not player for player because everyone knows that if you go player for player for lebrons supporting cast in Miami, his championship in Cleveland and LA lebron had much better players than Jordan played with💯 Yes Jordan played on great teams that played well at times without him that’s only because in the regular season in the 90s superstars were spread out among teams so every night your probably going against one star per team and he didn’t include looking better playing the BAD teams which he didn’t mention at all which again can alter those stats to make it look like that team was better without him😂 crazy how people just look at stats and believe it instead of actually watching games themselves lol
Just like LeBron is controlling the Lakers roster, he did the same with the Cavs. When he couldn't get his way in Miami, he went back to Cleveland. The Bulls were able to keep their core together is the main difference.
The Malice in the Palace made Lebron's path easier BECAUSE both Indiana and Detroit was STACKED...... INDIANA broke up and NBA punished Detroit by letting them go to 5 straight Eastern conference but ONE CHAMPIONSHIP
Ohh I might ADD, to my stats about Detroit during LeBron era they had ANOTHER JORDAN PROTEGE FOR THE CLUTCH AND MID-RANGE GAME... via Richard Hamilton who JORDAN taught when he was at Washington... AND then people want to argue LeBron take the Cleveland cavaliers to the championship in 2007 against the Spurs they cheated them past Detroit you don't tell me Lebron I don't care if he average 50 points a game that he could be Richard Hamilton Chauncey Billups Tayshaun Prince, Rasheed Wallace and Ben Wallace.. who beat the SAME Spurs that took out the 🧹 LeBron got swept by..... And to be honest he done kept that same team of referees to help him win his other championship hell they wasn't even supposed to beat the Oklahoma thunder but they cheated them Kevin Durant and Russell Westbrook so damn bad when they played in Oklahoma shit they might as well been playing in Miami for home court advantage....
Bro lebron won early hard to build a team when you picking late also had a owner who refused to build around lebron on the other hand the bulls was good but wasn’t winning like the lebron teams until Scottie so stop
@@DailyMIKAL fyi, Scottie averaged 7ppg in the same season that MJ was named MVP, DPOY, scoring leader, steals leader, slam dunk champion, and All-Star MVP. Don't get me wrong, MJ definitely needed Pippen to win, but let's not overlook that MJ made Pip who he was.
@@DailyMIKAL you think mike didn’t groom to Scottie to the player he was. Scottie was the ball boy his first year in college. Bron lost lost. Goes to Miami joins wade , Bosch, then leaves to go to Cleveland. Oh wait Kyrie and Kevin love already their. Bron had nothing to do with that.? Then jumps to lakers. Can’t win. I need AD to win at Disney world bubble. Not even comparable bro. Your hoops bias is laughable at best.
@@DailyMIKAL You got it all backwards LBJ can't keep his teams ego in check it's not about the owner who refused to build around LBJ, he gave him the will why do you think how the Lebron system was made and how it works? that's why him and kyrie and love got a conflict, some leader who can't tame his team and got saved his ass in multiple occasions! so your only reason is scottie?? lolz what a weak argument, pip drafted from Seattle but got traded in Chicago he wasn't that good not in several years MJ work on him make strong and durable for him to be able to keep with him MJ made his team better with strict tutelage and trainings routine, they get by, so Lets go to LBJ who or what teams he played in again pls remind me! Cavs Kyrie, irvine, tristan thompson, Mo Williams, Richard Jefferson man those guys can play well, in MIA the already champ team Wade BoSH and Ray Allen those are big HOF names you can't denied that, and in L.A w/c LABRON hand pick west brook, carmelo, Anthony Davis, Rajon Rondo, Carusso etc. what efforts did LBJ need to work for, as he already playing with HOF players and teams then your only argument is scottie??? Fuck hahaha! you stop bro this is why LBJ fans has been said had weak argumentative capabilities! it's not like Pippen is already a superstar when he first start in Chicago FYI it's not after the first 2 championships, and he accumulated to many foot and back injuries so most of the games
Jordan is just greater than lebron. Stats dont need to back that up. Think of the most iconic jersey in basketball and immediately you will thing of that 23 jordan jersey. Mjs greatness will outway any player to come, including lebron. Mj is just the greatest simply
Jordan actually molded Scottie Pippen and Horace, who as rookies had skills and talent, but they were mentally soft, and Jordan toughened them up, and he was hard on the team , as he was brutally tough demanding perfection at their positions. Him and Coach Jackson made superstores out of thempractice
When Kerr went to the Bulls Jordan tested him and ended up giving him a black eye in practice. Kerr after getting the black eye was still standing up to Joran, that's when he earned Jordan's respect, and that's when he started getting passes in the game from Jordan for wide open shots. Jordan built his team, LJ just wanted to join a prebuilt team. That's one difference that you really don't understand. Another difference you don't understand is the Drama that LJ causes on his teams. LJ cries about not having better teammates instead of leading his teammates and challenging them to be better. Both of them had great team mates, there's no dispute there. MJ made them better with his focus and LJ made them worse with his distractions. And as far as Rodman joining the Bulls, he joined because he wanted to play with the GOAT. Players wanted to be on Jordan's team, they don't want to be on LJ's team. He causes too much drama on the court. Look, let me break it down for you like this without the noise. LJ is under 75% from the line LJ is well under 40% when he's 3 feet or more from the rim LJ is 20% in the Clutch No one with that many gaping holes in their game should ever be considered in the GOAT conversation. Real talk, if I was picking a team of the best players of all time, LJ doesn't make the team with that many holes and with that much drama. My forwards on that team are Tim Duncan, Malone, Bird, & Irving.
Rodman joined the Bulls because the Spurs wanted to get rid of him and he had little value. Unless you want to say Will Perdue is a valuable trade chip. That said, Phil and Jordan were able to mostly keep Dennis in line. I don't know if another team could have.
@@cheeseburger12 - The Spurs made a bad trade there. The Bulls picked him up because they needed someone who could keep Shaq out of the paint, and also to take some of the heat off an aging MJ on defense. He was too wild for the 90s which is saying a lot. lol, but MJ & the boys did keep him in line, kind of for the most part. But all in all he was just what that team needed at the time
@@paulcrist7190 The Spurs didn't make a bad trade. They had to dump Rodman, he wore out his welcome. No one wanted him. If they didn't trade him, he would have been cut.
@@paulcrist7190 they got better value then if the Bulls wouldn't have traded. If no one else wanted Rodman and no one else could control Rodman, then what is his value?
I don't know why supporting casts matter so much to LeBron fans. They don't really affect the goat debate that much. Like if MJ had a better supporting cast, so what? Does that automatically overrule the whole 2 more championships he won? Does it change the fact that he has more regular season and finals MVPs? Does it change the fact that he's better statistically, or that he is better defensively, or that he shoots more efficiently in the clutch? The point is, you have so much more to prove before you convince anybody that LeBron is the goat, and even then it's a big reach to say Jordan had more help in the first place.
First the vid tells you had a better supporting cast second did you just say why dies a supporting cast have to do with success in a TEAM sport and also he doesn’t have better stats than lebron stop just saying things
@@DailyMIKAL Firstly, did it really? Basing supporting casts off of literally just box plus minus is dumb for obvious reasons. Secondly, we're comparing individual players, not teams. And Lastly, Jordan easily has better advanced stats than Lebron. He has the highest PER of all time, the highest winshares per 48 minutes of all time, and funnily enough he has a higher box plus minus both offensively and defensively. The only advanced stats LeBron is better in are accumalative ones, such as VORP. Didn't you watch "Jordan vs Lebron - The Best GOAT Comparison" a while back? That video broke down in detail how Jordan is better statistically.
@@riquetc0060 why are people even debating this, it’s obvious Jordan was better. I don’t even know why they consider Lebron better than Kobe, Kobe’s wnd in my opinion. Lebron is the opposite of clutch and can’t shoot for shit outside 3 meters
Most of the major changes on the Bulls were role players. LeBron has played GM everywhere he has gone. Name a young player that became great playing with LeBron? Hard to name one because he wants proven players to make his runs. Even in Miami, Bosh and Wade not enough. Had to get Ray Allen
Bro, I heard you say that slick remark about "stacked team, stacked team, stacked team", but you do know Jordan's "stacked team" he's talking about in the video was built up through the draft, and role player trades. You get an "A" for effort tho !!
Anyone who thinks that the Bulls teams were stacked like Dub City is seriously hallucinating. All you have to do is compare the player stats. Even Pip got much better as the years passed. He was no where near the Pip he turned into when he arrived. The Bulls matured into a team of role players and they gelled well. Their style of play (triangle) worked well for them. The shooters knew they were expected to hit shots and the big men rebounded.
Jordan's team became better because of HIS LEADERSHIP and HE ACCEPT NOTHING FROM HIS TEAM BUT 100% commitment and lj don't have the ability to make his team mates work hard and commit, that's why this only add up why Michael Jeffrey Jordan is the GOAT, because with his leadership he condition his team to be better year after year after year unlike LJ who team up with the best players but still didn't win simply because he didn't not made his team mates better.
Scotty didn't choose to go to Chicago. He was traded to Chicago immediately after being drafted. That team was drafted and developed with and around Jordan.
You should look at point distribution on Lebron and Jordan Championship teams. In 2012 finals, Lebron's team scored 73.4 ppg, leaving Lebron with 24.6 to match OKC's total production. Lebron and Wade were outmatched by Westbrook and Durant by 6.4 ppg. It's the depth that made the difference. Outside both team's top two players, the Heat's depth outscored OKC's by 10.4 ppg. In 2013, LJ needs 26 ppg to match the Spurs total and he scored 25.3. In 2016, Lebron needed 29.2 to match the warriors. He got 29.7 and Irving had 27.1. In 2020, LJ needed 24.3 to match the Heat, he got 29.8 while Davis had 25. Jordan had similar support in some of his finals, but there are others where it's clear he had less offensive support. In 93, the team outside Jordan scored 65.7. Jordan needed a whopping 41 ppg to match the Suns's high production. He finished with 41ppg. In 97, Jordan needed 31.7 to match the Jazz, he finished with 32.3. And even when he had lower scores to match like Lebron, he went much higher. In 92, 28.5 to match, he scores 35.8 for the whole series. When it comes to the sidekick, Lebron always had better offensive help in his finals wins. He outscored his second man by 6 ppg in 2012, 5.7 in 2013, 2.6 in 2016 and 4.8 in 2020. MJ ouscored Pippen by 10.4 in 91, 15 in 92, 19.8 in 93, 11.3 in 96, 12.3 in 97 and 17.8 in 98. Lebron never outscored his sidekick by more than 6 ppg while MJ never outscored Pip by less than 10.4. In his 6 finals mvp, MJ produced 34.7% of all his team's points. In LJ's finals mvp, he produced 27.7% of his team's points. And assists is not the reason for the difference. MJ had 6 apg in his 6 finals mvp while LJ had 8 apg. Least we mention Lebron had better offensive teammates to pass to, especially his sidekicks. As for competition in the finals they won, Jordan had to beat 10 top3 teams in 6 years because the east was strong, meaning that in 4 of his 6 championships, the Bulls had to through the league's two best teams (other than the Bulls). In his 4 finals MVP, Lebron had 3 top3 teams to beat. In total, MJ's finals competition averaged 61.2 wins and a +7.3 rating. Mj outscored the opp #1 33.6 vs 24.0 (+9.6) His #2-3 vs #2-3 31.3 vs 30.2 (+1.1) Rest of the teams: 31.8 vs 37.0 (-5.2) Team total outside #1vs#1: -4.1 Jordan scored 34.7% of his team points and needed 28.1 on average to match the other team's production. He went +5.5 over. For LJ's 4 finals MVP, opp averaged 59.5 wins and +6.6 Lebron vs opp : 28.3 vs 24.0 (+4.3) #2-3 vs #2-3: 35.9 vs 32.3 (+3.6) Rest of the team: 37.9 vs 43.7 (-5.8) Team total outside #1vs#1: -2.2 LJ scored 27.7% of his team's points and needed 26.2 on average to match the opposition. He went +2.1. The sheer difference in production gives a lot more merit to MJ's Finals MVPs. And whatever happened when Lebron loss with bad teams is no different than what MJ lived through with the super teams in Boston and Detroit. I have even more data that shows the chasm in production. Like... before ever winning a Finals, before 90-91, MJ played 53 playoffs game with an average opponent at 55 wins and +5.1, he scored 35.8 ppg in 53 games (35.6%) while needing to score 37.1 to match the other team. Outside of #1vs#1, his team was -14.6 ppg. Out of those 11 series, 9 were top 10 teams. For Lebron, before 11-12, he played 92 playoff games with an average opposition of 50.5 wins and +3.4. He scored 26.6 (30.2%) and needed to score 20.6 ppg to meet the other teams's total production. Outside #1 vs #1, his team was +0.7. In those 17 series, only 9 were top10 teams. So they both had 9 series vs top 10 teams. They both were 3-6 in those series before winning. Lebron's teams had weaker opposition in the playoffs because they finished higher in the season, but was it because of Lebron or did he have a better team? So let's look at those 9 series each vs top 10 teams before winning it all: Opposition similar, 58.1 +6.2 for MJ, 58.3 +6.3 for LJ. MJ vs #1 34.6 vs 22.5 (+12.1) LJ vs #1 26.6 vs 21.9 (+4.7) MJ's #2-3 vs #2-3 27.8 vs 33.6 (-5.8) LJ's #2-3 vs #2-3 31.0 vs 32.3 (-1.3) MJ's rest of team vs rest 36.0 vs 45.9 (-9.9) LJ's rest vs rest 32.4 vs 37.0 (-4.6) MJ's team outside #1vs#1 -15.7 ppg LJ's team outside #1 vs #1 -5.9 ppg For clarity, Jordan was 6.9 apg in those 53 games while LJ was 6.7 in his 92 games, so it's not a question of one of the two helping his teammates more. It's pretty clear that Jordan had a weaker team vs his opposition which is why his team ended lower and faced stiffer competition early in the playoffs, so the whole "10 finals" is just situational.
JUST THE FACTS: CAREER - Bottom line: MJ scored more, turned it over less, stole the ball more, more offensive rebounds, and blocked the same as LJ…led league in points 10x and steals 3x...played in all 82 games 8x and 80+ 10x Lebron has more assists, total/defensive rebounds but turned it over more, blocked the same as MJ - led the league in assists once and in points once…played in all 82 games 1x and 80+ 3x So would you rather have MJ, an unstoppable scorer who turned it over less, got more steals, more offensive rebounds, same blocks, and led the league in darn near everything and plays ALL 82 games and plays ALL OUT in each game? and WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS but only for 13yrs*...or Lebron, a guy who gives more assists, def rebounds, same blocks, but doesnt play every game, takes a lots of plays off to "rest" and wins sometimes....but he'll do that for 20yrs... MJ is the goat....period...Lebron is talented but most of the categories he has over MJ is longevity...not that longevity is a bad thing, but just because you do something for 20yrs doesn't mean you were the BEST at it...MJ is at the top of stats that dont even have anything to do with his position LOL MJ has options A, B, C, etc Lebron only has option A and when option A goes wrong he becomes passive and reluctant to score...People always say "why did the defender fall for that fake, the defense is horrible" - you HAD to respect a pump fake or jab step from MJ (same with Bird). They had so many tools in their bag, that you had to respect them all...and they'd just score with another tool as soon as you bit on one. The guy who can hurt you the most is the guy who can score from anywhere/anytime NOT just close to the basket. Look at these stats...MJ has the better offense/defense career numbers and did it in less time (300 games less) AND this INCLUDES his Wizard years where he was 38/39yrs old and basically an on court coach and not focused on being the usual dominant MJ. Lebron has more assists/total blocks but has had 300 more games to do it in... Season G MP FG FG% 3P 3PA 3P% 2P 2PA 2P% eFG% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PTS MJ Career 1072 *38.3 *11.4 0.497 0.5 1.7 0.327 10.8 21.2 0.51 0.509 *6.8 *8.2 *0.835 *1.6 4.7 6.2 5.3 *2.3 *0.8 *2.7 *30.1 LJ Career *1366 38.2 9.9 *0.505 1.6 4.5 *0.346 8.3 15.1 *0.552 *0.545 5.7 7.8 0.734 1.2 *6.3 *7.5 *7.4 1.6 *0.8 3.5 27.1 In fact, Lebron doesn't lead in any of these categories in career....none...look for yourself ;) Season MP FG% 3P% 2P% eFG% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PTS CAREER PTS MJ Career 38.3 0.497 0.327 0.51 0.509 6.8 8.2 0.835 1.6 4.7 6.2 5.3 2.3 0.8 2.7 30.1 32292 LJ Career 38.2 0.505 0.346 0.552 0.545 5.7 7.8 0.734 1.2 6.3 7.5 7.4 1.6 0.8 3.5 27.1 37062 Bird Career 38.4 0.496 0.376 0.509 0.514 4.4 5 0.886 2 8 10 6.3 1.7 0.8 3.1 24.3 21791 Jabbar Career 36.8 0.559 0.056 0.56 0.559 4.3 6 0.721 2.4 7.6 11.2 3.6 0.9 2.6 2.7 24 38387 Magic Career 36.7 0.52 0.303 0.541 0.533 5.5 6.5 0.848 1.8 5.5 7.2 11.2 1.9 0.4 3.9 19 17707 Wilt 45.8 0.54 5.8 11.4 0.511 22.9 4.4 30.1 31419 Kareem leads in 9, MJ in 5...the rest in 1 or 2...except Lebron...ZERO
The comment in the video at about 22:30 mark was that the Bulls with Jordan were about on par from an overall plus minus as the Warriors with Steph, KD, etc.. it did not say his supporting cast was. Re-listen to what he said.
When MJ retired before the 94 season the roster was improved with Kukoc Longley etc etc. if MJ didn’t retire the Bulls win 75 games that year. Lebron has terrible efficiency outside of the rim, he ain’t no 🐐
The 94 Bulls had 12 players on the roster who were a part of the 1st and 2nd 3-peats. I love how they always bring up 55-wins like it was an incredible accomplishment for a 3-peat dynasty that added key additions in Jordan's absence. There were 6 other teams in the 1994 NBA who also won 55-games without MJ too LOL.
94 was still Cartwight, 95 was when Luke Joined, I think. I remember because Cartwright rallied the team after Scottie's 1.8. That would have been something though with Kukoc added to essentially the 93 team. Although I don't know how easily they could have given Kukoc minutes with Jordan, Scottie and Grant. Would Kukoc be point guard?
Jordan had a super team because he MADE them a super team. They were majority all drafted with a couple cast-off from other teams. LBron recruited friends to play together. At no time did Jordan get a top 3/5/10player in the league to join him. He had to wait on the teams drafted players to develop and he was a huge part of their development
Yep, Like Russell, Magic, Bird...Zeke and the majority in the all time greats. Only Lebron gets special credit without having actually helped develop the talent.
Jordan and the Bulls was not a super team, he had a great cast of players surrounding him. Compared to Lebron, he had to team up or invite a cast of super star players, which ended up becoming a super team.
I don't remember the Bulls going out and picking up super free agents apart from Rodman. Most of the players they won championships with were drafted or free agents that were coachable and understood systems.
Rodman wasn't a super free agent. No team wants Rodman, Spur was willing to let off Rodman if no one want to trade that's literally how bad Rodman situation is when the bulls took him in.
The teams got better because of MJ and the experience of all the battles , but Lebron ran to Miami to be around stars, in the finals, it was more Wade and Bosh, than Lebron.
Somebody tell me when has Lebron faced double and triple team defense game after game, and still be the best and most dominant player in the league. Lebron's great no doubt about it, but MJ was just different.
Sweetie, if you watched what a lot of his coaches and teammates said about Jordan then you would know that he treated every practice as if they were playing in the playoffs. He wasn’t stacked with a super team. It was his drive, work ethic, and killer mentality that pushed the players on his team. Let’s not forget that a lot of the players now were fans of Jordan’s and mimicked his game. I can’t knock you for who you like, but I remember when Jordan was in the NBA and how he played every game on both lines. He was amazing to watch.
The Last Dance should make sense to everyone now in why MJ was so demanding. There was no need to change teams. Just improve YOUR team chemistry from year to improve by being tougher on your teammates in practice. There was no super team in Chicago.
Exactly... How could a team be a "super team", when only "1" guy (MJ) was the LONE selected All Star in all 6 of their title seasons? Let that sink in for a min... The ONLY reason WHY LBJ's fanboys LOVE the old: "MJ had better teams!" narrative so much, is because they think it'll minimize MJ's OBVIOUS impact on the Bulls winning fortunes, which they think will level the playing field and make for a more favorable comparison for LBJ, when his repeated failures are highlighted in a comparison with MJ. That's what the intent/motive is behind this particular narrative: finding a way to level the playing field for LBJ.
@@natedablack7857 They also tried to claim that Jordan had superteam and every other teams in his era were weak.. but look at Pistons 93 roster, 3 hall of famers still in their prime, but couldn't even make it to the playoffs. Those people are clearly doing it to diminish Jordan's impact on the Bulls to make certain someone look better in comparison, when there was never a comparison to begin with.
Michael Jordan has 7 of the top 10 playoff SERIES scoring averages of all time... singlehandedly. He averaged 40+ on blistering efficiency in 5 playoff series, including the record setting 41 ppg in the 1993 finals and the only back-to-back 50 point games ever in the playoffs (Cleveland 89, winning a series the Bulls were supposed to lose). Nope, these statements are not cap.
MJ didn’t call and team up with other allstars and franchise players IN HIS PRIME to become a champion! Fact of the matter is, when MJ was getting beat up by Detroit, he didn’t call on other allstars to form a super team so he can get pass the one team he couldn’t beat, Mj went to the gym and got stronger to take the punishment that Detroit was dishing out. LBJ couldn’t get pass the Boston Celtics and he left home to team up with 2 other franchise players in his prime!!! It’s the journey that you take to get the top that defines you,… he clearly took the easy way to get there! Jordan pushed his teammates to reach their best and that’s why even without him on the court, his teammates still performs at a very high level.
There's a video series out there you can watch that talks about GOAT discussions for many players. One section of it talk about the help each player had. Scottie Pippen was the only all-star on MJ's championship teams and that was in the later years. Think about that for a moment... XD Here's the start of the video: ruclips.net/video/bdDg4y1FwNM/видео.html You can see the other parts by checking out the channel the vid is on.
Jordan was the ultimate competitor and held his teammates accountable to stay focused and win! If you remove Jordan from that team like 94-95 seasons you get a slightly above average team. Jordan made them a super team. Plus Jordan was on the bulls for 13 seasons and the front office did a good job surrounding him with the right supporting cast over time.
He said the team WITH Jordan was comparable to KD warriors. While Jordan was the only Superstar scorer. No other Bull during these years scored 20points per game in the playoffs, and MJ still carried them to that lvl. And teammates improving while playing with MJ is something he should get credit for, because Brons teammates didn't become better, unless they are spot up shooters.
I don't believe how dumb Brons fans are. He said Jordan's second three peat bulls were almost as dominant as KD warriors. But that doesn't make them a superteam. Jordan was the ONLY superstar and he had just one allstar in Scottie. So the fact that his team was almost as dominant as these Warriors speaks only to his greatness. Lebron on the other hands was NEVER able to make his teams so dominant while having 2 different SUPERTEMS, especially the one in Miami.
To be honest, the Jordan and Bulls where all about defense. That, to me is what won them their 6. Scottie was a big part of that but on offense Scottie wasn’t really a scorer. He only had over 20 a season 3 times and never above 22. Wade had over 20 every season with Lebron and Kyrie averaged 25 in 2016. Lebron gets over that hump and wins when he has that score first All-Star top 75 player to get buckets because he is facilitates.
Defense is the best offense, but JORDAN ruled both categories being the best offensive player averaging high and being the DPOY both in a tough league a true man's game! he also facilitates but seldom because they are role players
Stop it. LeBron has never wanted to play for a HOF coach or great GM, because LeBron thinks he knows better than GMs and coaches. He played in Miami under Pat Riley, but Pat wouldn't allow him to be the GM. Stop with the LeBron Stan narratives. I watched both and I have no problem saying LeBron is #2. But the gap between him and MJ is not small. If you watched MJ play in real-time, I'm 100% certain you would agree. I actually feel bad you young guys didn't get to witness it. It's like being born the year after Halley's Comet passes the earth.
Yeah: Dickey simpkins jue bucheler and bill wennington constitute a stacked team. Lebron needed at least 2 other all stars to win his championships. Jordan needed team oriented role players that could be molded. Those bulls teams in some respects were more like the Duncan spurs: a bunch of no name players playing the right way
Ight let’s do this. No lebron has not had less talented teams. Lebron just doesn’t utilize his teammates to their full potential.. he doesn’t sacrifice anything to make his teams gel correctly. He has his heliocentric style of everything revolves around me, and no matter the teammates, they have to conform to his system. He has turned some of the greatest bigmen in the game into spot up shooters, and dynamic role players into corner specialist. Jr smith went from sixth man with a dynamic scoring game to a catch and shoot player playing next to bron. And I’m not mad at it, because it has worked. But the issue is that because of the way lebron politics and builds teams, he only looks for the big names to stack the deck instead of actually taking the time to build a proper roster. When u go into every season trying to trade all your assets to get new star teammates instead of just building on your current roster and creating a real chemistry and system, what do u expect? He treats teammates like expendable pawns and it hurts his consistency. Jordan did jump ship. He stuck through the bad years, he let his gm and coach do their jobs, and they added the pieces around him. They won 3 times, fell a bit, retooled without completely jumping ship, and won again. When has lebron ever built something with a team? When has he ever stayed the course? When has he sacrificed his pretty numbers for the hood of the team? When u have to be the man in the middle and your team gets built to appease you and solely you, it’s doomed to fail as soon as you leave. Example- all the planets on our solar system revolve around the sun in a particular way. If the suns suddenly disappeared, what do u think would happen to the rest of the solar system? Same thing applies for lebron led teams. Their all top heavy, and never have a good bench. Not because the players are bad. But because the stars take away from the money needed to actually build a hood team.
the bulls in the 90s were never a superteam!! The only superstar they had besides MJ was Scottie, and he had to develop and mature from when he first got to bulls!! MJ was always the number 1 guy on the bulls, even when he came back from retirement in '95. Lebron played with more all stars and hall of famers than MJ ever did!
I do have to laugh when Lebron fans find one stat that gives Lebron the edge and think the debate is over. Aside from tallying up numbers over a longer career what else does Lebron have over Jordan? I get he is this generations best player but he's never been the best in the league at anything except finishing through defenses but that's mainly due to his size. Would he be dominant at 6'6"? Jordan was a lethal finisher, mid range scorer and had an amazing post game. Jordan challenged teammates while Lebron throws his under the bus and moves to greener pastures. Will never understand this debate tbh. It was over in 2011 when Lebron failed against Dallas.
Here is what you missed. Jordan demanded excellence from his teammates. He made them practice hard. He made them execute. So well, here you arw thinking everyone, outside of Pippin equated to a stacked team.. These teams were not started. These teams had the Jordan standard. Another reason he is better the LeBron. By far.
24:09 remember the Bulls before 93 were a team with no championship record, built a team around him, they all worked hard placing right resources to win, the choach was not experienced, the team around him realized or saw him putting the work as a leader so they too improved, not just leaving to joining the Heat remind to LaGM said it himself he went there to win. This is the mentality of saying the teams that built their roasters are super team is just dumb 🙄
Jordan didn't have a superteam the Bulls were just super good and LeBron James had a good situation which was Miami great coach and GM but he couldn't run the show because Pat Riley wouldn't allow it so he left
I personally don't believe that anyone has ever said that MJ and the Bulls were not a super yeam...they were in fact...The GOAT TEAM. MJ has always said that he could have not done it alone. But with that being said he and the Bulls did not attempt to build a team based on Hall of Famers switches every year. They great players that played greater as a TEAM = GOAT TEAM
But the fact that before they came to Chicago those guys were NOT championship material except for Rodman, but the point is MJ made his team a competitive one with his tutelage and very strict training they been able to keep up, Bulls w/o MJ made it to the semi, its because they already champions so its reasonable enough that they can get through the semi, but w/o MJ they can't pass a strong hurdle Goat team there's no such thing, HOF teammates maybe it existed in LBJ's play book but if you go straight the answer lies ahead. the question is who made them better who put them in that HOF spot, It's MJ, though they have the right to keep their status quo as they played really well in the bulls but the main reason why they played so good is because of MJ, that kind of leader will make sure that they can tap into their fullest potential! and basketball doesn't win by just one man it's a team sport, it's simple if you want to win make your team better (MJ) If you want to win chase other Hof, and champion teams then join them (LBJ)
Bro think rationally. A player leaving behind a champions team will of course be strong without him. That was his mentality enforced on his teammates. Winning championships changes players. Makes them believe in themselves. LBJ when he left or joined a team, it wasn't him alone or joining or leaving.. this usualy was a complete overhual. He came with firepower and he left with them as well. If 2 or 3 keyplayers arrive or leave, of course that will have a considerable impact on the team. That's not solely because of LBJ only. So the impression here is wrongly portrayed..
Have to take in account that MJ talked about how he had to change the culture of the Bulls. It’s seems every year his tm8s got better. To me this shows how great of a leader MJ was. He literally made his tm8s better
Bro can you please look at the rosters before you call MY bulls a "super team". NO one during that time would even remotely call them a super team. no one during that time thought Jerry Krause was a good GM. NOT ever 🤦♂️
Lmao stacked team wtf🤦♂️, lebron fans looking for anything now to support there argument for lebron being the goat. All these comparisons don’t make any sense cause KOBE is number 2 after MJ not lebron.
Counting MJ’s Tar Heels championship, 2 dream team golds, 2 Pan Am golds & 6-6 in NBA/6-6 MVP it’s pretty much a mic drop 11-0 in championship games. Jordan made his teammates better instead of instigating trades to better teams. This isn’t a debate worth having. I’m a Pistons fan btw
Hahahaaa lol Anyway... Jordan steps in when the opposing team's star players are in the game... when they tire out, Jordan also goes out. Scoring against them is the hard part. He get's it done. The other players can handle the rest. Coach Jackson is a master. Why? Because Jordan plays almost every single game of the season... Lebron only plays a few. Who's showing more Longevity? Jordan will burn out because he's not on vacation for more than half of the season like Lebron, so he leaves when the opposing star players leave the court, & comes on when they do. :)
that aint a super team thats more of a team getting better with time. none of those bench players or role players would have been stars on other teams.
This kid has a very young and biased mindset when it comes to the differences with having a team grow and become better around a specific player over years, as opposed to collecting a bunch of superstars together to make a great team. That is why the bulls chemistry was overall better thus allowing them to win more.
It doesn't add up because the Bulls performed as a Super Team because of the Triangle concept. They role players performed their roles perfectly. And they were plug and play almost totally different personnel between both 3peat teams but still performed splendidly.
Home grown teams. But the moral of the story is tht they never ever scored more with Jordan off the court then they did with him on the court. On top of tht, Jordan figured out how to just win the game. He was playing a different game then everyone else. If you saw the games you would understand. I saw Both play n I’m telling you Jordan couldn’t be stopped once he started winning n he made his teammates better n made them make shots n his want to win at all cost rubbed off on his team. Tht means more then anything…..
Also missed that he does not disappear in the playoffs. LeBron against 2011 mavs avg less than 18 pts. Out played by Jason Terry 6' 2"/ JJ Barea (was he even 6 ft?) combo.
Jordan played for one franchise and those guys he played with played together atleadt 3 seasons so that means they grew together. They would be a super team if Jordan recruited them cause he felt like he needed them.
Super team? Jordan played with players that had a TOTAL of 10x All Stars. Pippen was a 7x All Star, Rodman was a 2x All Star and Grant a 1x All Star. And note that Rodman and Grant were All Stars when they DIDN'T play with Jordan. Rodman was an All Star during his Pistons days and Grant had his lone All Star appearance when Jordan played Baseball. So basically Jordan, when playing, had only Pippen as an All Star player. What Super Team did Jordan play on? Jordan was such a leader that he elevated the game of his team. Everyone is talking about the Bulls during the 93-94 season when they got to the ECSF when they rode on the coattails of their championship season, but no one is talking about the 94-95 Bulls before MJ returned when they struggled and were 34-31. But back to the supposed super team argument. MJ only had players with a total of 10 all star appearances throughout his entire career. Lebron up until now has players with a total of 91 all star appearances during his career. If the Bulls were a super team with that roster, then you can't say Jordan played in a weak era, since there obviously were players in the league that were much better than the "super players" on Jordan's team. Those other players made the All Star teams and all NBA teams, not the players on Jordan's "super team". Those players on the Bulls teams were good, but Jordan simply elevated their game so they got the better of teams they played. The player who's gotten more help here is Lebron, not MJ.
I think the difference in OG fans is the Bulls worked their way up the ladder. The only big free agent was Rodman for 2nd 3 peat, who didn’t contribute to offensive side except offensive rebounds. Other trades were merely finding players with a mentality to deal with Jordan’s expectations/abuse. We watched Jordan & Pippen get hammered by Bad Boys but instead of making trades. They worked harder to level up to overcome the challenges. Lebron didn’t make 1st super team. Lakers had Magic, Worthy & Kareem with above average player Byron Scott. 2 🐐 candidates and 2 All Stars. Jordan’s 1st 3peat was 2 All Stars. We don’t hate Lebron but having watched 40 years of NBA he’s a generation great like Shaq or Hakeem but hasn’t made All Time great list. Lebron also had bad timing entering league with Kobe & Timmy and then Steph emerged. I think fans prefer players who ride ups & downs in 1 city. That maybe unfair but so is life
This is a prime example with Lebron fans not understanding the context and actual points the guy is making. This is why MJ was considered the hardest worker in practice. His presence drew so much attention in the floor the importance of his teams development… showed based on how hard they worked. When you look at each player individually,., you can see they weren’t actually a super team.
Stephon Marbury said it best Jordan should not even be mentioned in the same breath as any other player because he is unrankable number one is Kobe then number two LeBron then everybody can pick which players after that it's that simple.
MJ played for one team his whole career (Bulls) and was only traded once to the Wizards at the end of his career. Lebron James has played for Cleveland (twice), Miami, and LA. Jordan wasn't jumping teams trying to win with other stars when the Bulls struggled. That is something that is missing from the NBA now. Players used to have a sense of pride when they played for a team, and always wanted to compete against the best and be challenged. Now guys just leave their team for more money, chance to win rings with other stars, and for popularity in a larger market. That's why I respect Giannis a lot for sticking with Milwaukee and winning a ring with them. They are a small market team that would have never won a ring unless Giannis wanted to stick around. Who would want to play for the Milwaukee Bucks now when they can go play for the Lakers, Clippers, Warriors, Heat, Knicks, Nets, Bulls, or 76er's and have a chance to play with an all star line up. You have to really have that mental drive and passion to stick with the same team. I hate when players take the easy road now and join a team that is already playoff built. Jordan had Pippen, but it wasn't like the Bulls traded for Pippen and he was already a superstar. Pippen had to come along and learned to be great from Michael because he knew that Michael would always be critical of him if he did not perform up to par. I watched Magic, Bird, Jordan, Olajuwon (who know one talks about. Legendary player also), Kobe, and Lebron and the one thing that stands out is Lebron is the only one that was jumping teams. All of those other guys stuck with their teams until maybe the end of their careers when they were finally traded. Jordan is the best player I have ever watched play. Hands down. It isn't even close. If MJ were drafted when he was in high school just imagine what his stats might look like now. Who would catch him? Imagine how many 40, 50, 60, 70 point games he would have. He might have more than 6 rings too.
I don't think this young dude really gets it. There is a difference in what the Bulls did, as opposed to what -Lebron's- teams do. The only "big name talent" the Bulls ever brought in was Dennis Rodman, (which was to replace Horace Grant's defense and rebounding which they lost the year before). Anybody else they brought in were role players to support the core. Steve Kerr? Ron Harper? Bill Cartwright? Role players. Pippen, Grant, BJ Armstrong, Tony Kukoc etc were *drafted* by the Bulls and became award winners *because of* Jordan. MJ forced/made/willed his teammates to be better. That is called "building a chamnpionship team". -Lebron- on the other hand went to and played with superstar D-Wade (arguably the 3rd best SG ever behind Kobe) and Chris Bosh (multi-time all-star, 20&10 dude) and a hand-picked bench in Miami. Then because Kyrie emerges as a multi all-star, top tier point guard, and Kevin Love (a multi-time all-star, 20 & 10 guy like Bosh) is available, he decides to go back to Cleveland and once again with a hand picked bench. Then forces the Lakers to get rid of EVERYTHING so he can eventually play with (20 & 10) superstar Anthony Davis, and another superstar in Russell Westbrick. Then builds a bench comprising of stars like Carmelo Anthony and Dwight Howard. That's what is called "buying championships". People are too caught up in the moment. The greatest thing you witness is not necessarily the greatest thing ever. Everyone wants to feel that they witnessed the greatest thing ever, or that it came from their generation.
Super team argument.. Pippen or D Wade who you picking? Horace Grant or Chris Bosh who you picking? Craig Hodges or Ray Allen? Shane Battier or John Paxson? Mike Miller or Bill Cartwright? Then LeBron ran with Kyrie and K Love. In a vacuum I'm picking Pippen over Irving, ok. But people forget that Rodman was hella one dimensional and you are playing 4 on 5 offensively, plus he was on his last legs in Chicago (especially 98) so picking him over K Love is arguable. I'll give you that those later Bulls teams had Harper and Kukoc. BUT! Harper was a shell of himself after that knee injury in LA when he was with the Clippers (back when he was Hollywood Harper) and Kukoc was over rated. Left the Bulls and did NOTHING. With ample opportunity. He shined in the system. The triangle is why Mike's team was able to shine as much as they did in those championship runs without him. That triple post offense is a motion offense with hella options. It keeps the defense from keying in on one specific person. When the D could focus on Mike the result was the late 80s results. Once the triangle was implemented and Scottir became the main ball handler instead of Mike, the 90s was the result. That's why LeBron couldn't win unless he had someone to get the D's attention off of him (Wade, Irving, Davis) but he always remains the system, hence his team depends on him to do more, hence more failure. Wilt could write a book on this subject. If you study the game, you'll see this theme repeated throughout history. The teams with systems dominate (60s Celtics, early 70s Knicks, Lakers and Celtics of the 80s, 90s Bulls, 2000s Lakers and Spurs, 10s Warriors etcetera set ya watch and watch).
Ball movement…the best teams ever were great at ball movement. The “Bron” didn’t get enough guys involved. It’s also slow and predictable which is why the spurs beat Miami by a record margin.
You failed to realize that Jordan didn't start off with a "super team." His supporting cast absolutely sucked when he first entered the NBA. They only improved after years of playing with him. Great players improve the players around them. Lebron failed to do this in seven years in Cleveland before he quit and bailed on his team. That's one of the reasons why he's not the GOAT.
What superteam ? A superteam is a team with 3 players that can carry their own franchise. Pippen did it for one year and Grant never did that, so very dubious claim. Meanwhile, D Wade and Bosh did it. K Love and AD did too.
K love carried the Timberwolves to where exactly? Bosh carried the raptors to where exactly? Being on a bad team and putting up good stats don’t mean you carried your franchise anywhere except to the lottery each year maybe you make the playoffs one or twice but come on stop it juror never made it to playoffs without lebron before he went to Cleveland did he carry that franchise ? And at that time two superstars are kinda the equivalent to three now Barkley was alone Kevin Johnson was good no superstar the Sonic’s had kemp and Payton idk if you call Kemp a superstar then jazz had two superstars laker only had magic and blazers had drexler so I mean at that time there was no three superstars teams and when he went up against a two superstar team he had three with Rodman you heard the vid his team and supporting cast was compared to the kd warriors come on now
@@DailyMIKAL I like how you guys talk about Lebron's teams records dropping off when he leaves, but yall don't mention the Wolves going from a 40 win team to a 16 win team after Love left. That's what I call a carry. Toronto also went from a 40 win team to a 22 win team without Bosh. It's not their fault they had bad teams, but when it's Bron we supposed to feel for that dude ? Lmao the only Jordan Bulls team that didn't have a decent to large on off gap was 1992 and like we established, MJ/Pip/Horace isn't a superteam and don't dare compare them to KD, Steph and Klay. Second threepeat Bulls weren't a superteam either, MJ carried on/off in the playoffs, two lowest supporting cast in NBA history, 8 rebounds in 1997 playoffs with Rodman on the team, the Spurs sold Rodman for a sock, no superstar. He was literally the definition of a role player like Draymond, just defend and rebound.
@@kristijanEX The Bulls got Rodman straight up for Will Freaking Perdue...that's how badly the Spurs wanted to unload Rodman. Phil Jackson in his book said Dennis was 7th on their list of potential power forwards. No one wanted to deal with Rodman at the time. These young kids don't know this stuff.
The bulls team have grown during several years. It was the same team with just one all star, Pippen. It doesn't mean that he had better players than Lebron, but a team that knew every player really well.
I think your theory that Lebron got "better" will yield some disappointing results as his shooting %s don't change much throughout his career. He's always been an average to below average 3pt shooter, and a poor FT shooter. His career shooting % is buffed by all the uncontested dunks and drives to the basket he gets in the current era.
The 93 suns were not a shit team by any stretch. They have the best record in the league and they had an identical offensive rating to the 2017 warriors. They just had only slightly better than average defense.
Bulls team "Practice games are harder because we went against MJ, to prepare us for whatever pressure we face" He made his team play to almost his level. That is what it is. MJ was called THE best player by Bobby Knight even before he played in the NBA. He led 84 Olympics team against NBA All Star to win all 8 games. That NBA team had prime Bird, Magic, Isiah Thomas, Drexler, Parish, McHale, English etc. So of course he "didn't get better", he was already at his best.
His teams didn't drop off as much as they should have once Phil got there because of the triangle offense and how it lets you get quality shots. When you also have someone like Scotty who's versatile it helps with the drop off.
Theirs a difference between having super stars, and developing players to support a position in the game. Pay attention to what he is telling you. And see if Michael Jordan teammates became Allstars.
His teammates getting better during their championship run meant that Jordan made his teammates better...
The same can be said for a lot of other superstars also
Not really...lets say Lebron, if he really does make his teammates better, his teammates would have improved and therefore performed better not only when lebron is on the court but also more when he is off the court...
Lol this proves lebron didn't make his team better that's why he kept running
The false narrative is that since -Lebron- passes a lot, that makes his teammates better. That's stupid as hell. You make you teammates better by making them increase their strengths, and lessen their weaknesses, through practice against yourself (the better player).
@@DailyMIKAL true, but not LeBron, because ha has no loyalty to any of his team mates.
Weren't stacked teams, it was teams that matured and got better as the years went by, all because MJ made his team better in so many ways because of his leadership. Leflop joined super teams and over the years he did not make his teams better. There's a huge difference between these two aspects, which I don't know if it's because of kids like you youth or just not being too intelligent...
I agree. The Bulls kept their core guys together and managed to add thru the draft. LeBron was the M on the Cavs for both times.
Those Bulls definitely weren’t “Super Teams.” Pippen and Grant were drafted by Chicago. They developed under MJ and got better over time. Mike didn’t hand pick a bunch of All NBA selections. For the 2nd 3-peat, Kukoc was a draft pick, and Rodman and Harper were brought in to replace other departures. Still effective guys, just not quite in their primes. Big difference from having guys like Wade & Bosh and Love & Kyrie in their All Star primes.
unnecessary
Exactly Wht we try to Teach or get them to Understand but no matter what no matter how they never accept it. LeChic went to the Cavs and lost & lost & lost then he said he had enuff and joined MIA with D Wade n Bosh. Now MJ was just as Dominant and more wen he entered the NBA, so you telln me tht leading the NBA in Scoring and voted DPOY the same Season which LeChic never and will never do bcse he cannot play DEFENSE but you're telln me tht isn't Dominant but hey he was in the same predicament like LeChic as in not having a good team around him. Now remember Scottie & Grant were both nurtured by MJ & Phil and as the yrs went by the Blossomed. MJ himself reopened his eyes to the Team concept bcse he now had Teammates he cud trust. A mean hey he went abt it the Tough Rough or the Brutal way but even so Players got their own accolades plus their Rings. So hey my Leader was an Ass Hole most the time and we parted after 4 Seasons but hey I didn't leave empty handed at least tht Ass Hole bckd his cht wen it was time to do just tht.
Exactly bro you said it best these lebron fans I think they kind of slow lol
Youngin, I was born in the 70's. I DID watch Jordan play. And I absolutely DESPISE that man!!! I was born and raised in Michigan, so you already know I'm a Piston fan to the bone. I used to LOVE watching my Bad Boys send him home in the playoffs! That was better than my birthday! 😂
And with that said, the man is the GOAT and it's not even close!
LeBron is a beast. And as much as I hate Jordan and want to give someone else the GOAT, the realness in me can't allow me to pretend I didn't see what I saw when MJ was on that court! The dude was INCREDIBLE!!!
Listen, the man was SO good, he would do something during a game and made me forget I was rooting AGAINST him! My dumb ass would jump off the couch like "YES!!! YES!!! DID YALL SEE THA....wait! I mean....no! NOOOOO!"
Man, they year they finally beat us, I thought my uncle was gonna have a heart attack the way he was yelling at the TV. All you heard was "DO SOMETHING! PULL A GUN OUT AND SHOOT THAT MF IF YOU HAVE TO! JUST STOP HIM!"
I know y'all can't fathom someone being greater than LeBron because he's amazing. But, that man DID exist. And it was Michael Jeffrey Jordan.
And this is coming from his biggest hater.
MJ is a true leader. He was already super elite and really couldn’t get much better, BUT he helped develop his teammates into winners bc he pushed them and demanded nothing less than their very best. That’s why they got better during those years. Huge difference in leadership between him and Lebron.
You mean he actually made his team better, over just feeding guys easy buckets.
@@blindprophet182 No. Lebron’s star teammates all took a step back and played worse with the exception of Kyrie. Bosh, Wade, Love and AD all had better numbers before joining with him. Especially Love & Bosh
@@maestro4337 this shoots down the BS narrative of LeBron making his teammates better, which was created by the media and regurgitated constantly to justify LeBron being "better" (than Jordan).
Exactly. He was already called "God disguised as MJ" by a legend in his early years of NBA. Can't get much better than that lol.
Watched both players entire careers, Lebron and Jordan and I'll just say this: every player, team and coach genuinely feared playing against Jordan. No one anywhere fears playing Lebron.
Exactly
That's not entirely true, a 6'8 265 locomotive with 0 body fat with sprinter speed and long jumper hops gets a free run at the basket, in getting the f out of there in a hurry. Not saying just saying. Now that same guy is holding the ball at 22 feet saying, I'm going to shoot it if you don't guard me" I'm like fine shoot it and getting in position for the board
It's a great video.
I used to think Lebron was the better teammate than Jordan while Jordan was the better player than Lebron.
This video proved me wrong.
Not only was Jordan the better player, but also the better teammate!
He dragged a useless team to glory whether they liked it or not.
And they excelled because of his relentless leadership.
So inspirational!
The lebron carrying his teams to the finals is so overrated when lebron played in the eastern conference lebron had no competition in that conference it’s not that lebron had scrubs in a tough conference he just had a way easier path so the statistics are going to favor him when you just go off numbers which again lebron fans only care about stats verses reality.. also that point that Jordan’s help was comparable to the warriors point he made was again only a STATISTIC not player for player because everyone knows that if you go player for player for lebrons supporting cast in Miami, his championship in Cleveland and LA lebron had much better players than Jordan played with💯 Yes Jordan played on great teams that played well at times without him that’s only because in the regular season in the 90s superstars were spread out among teams so every night your probably going against one star per team and he didn’t include looking better playing the BAD teams which he didn’t mention at all which again can alter those stats to make it look like that team was better without him😂 crazy how people just look at stats and believe it instead of actually watching games themselves lol
Big facts
Just like LeBron is controlling the Lakers roster, he did the same with the Cavs. When he couldn't get his way in Miami, he went back to Cleveland. The Bulls were able to keep their core together is the main difference.
The Malice in the Palace made Lebron's path easier BECAUSE both Indiana and Detroit was STACKED...... INDIANA broke up and NBA punished Detroit by letting them go to 5 straight Eastern conference but ONE CHAMPIONSHIP
Ohh I might ADD, to my stats about Detroit during LeBron era they had ANOTHER JORDAN PROTEGE FOR THE CLUTCH AND MID-RANGE GAME... via Richard Hamilton who JORDAN taught when he was at Washington... AND then people want to argue LeBron take the Cleveland cavaliers to the championship in 2007 against the Spurs they cheated them past Detroit you don't tell me Lebron I don't care if he average 50 points a game that he could be Richard Hamilton Chauncey Billups Tayshaun Prince, Rasheed Wallace and Ben Wallace.. who beat the SAME Spurs that took out the 🧹 LeBron got swept by..... And to be honest he done kept that same team of referees to help him win his other championship hell they wasn't even supposed to beat the Oklahoma thunder but they cheated them Kevin Durant and Russell Westbrook so damn bad when they played in Oklahoma shit they might as well been playing in Miami for home court advantage....
Ppl still actually think LeBron carried his teams to the finals?? 🤔🤦
They built their team over years. Easy button. They got better and worked hard. They didn’t jump teams to link up for instant wins.
Bro lebron won early hard to build a team when you picking late also had a owner who refused to build around lebron on the other hand the bulls was good but wasn’t winning like the lebron teams until Scottie so stop
@@DailyMIKAL fyi, Scottie averaged 7ppg in the same season that MJ was named MVP, DPOY, scoring leader, steals leader, slam dunk champion, and All-Star MVP. Don't get me wrong, MJ definitely needed Pippen to win, but let's not overlook that MJ made Pip who he was.
@@DailyMIKAL you think mike didn’t groom to Scottie to the player he was. Scottie was the ball boy his first year in college. Bron lost lost. Goes to Miami joins wade , Bosch, then leaves to go to Cleveland. Oh wait Kyrie and Kevin love already their. Bron had nothing to do with that.? Then jumps to lakers. Can’t win. I need AD to win at Disney world bubble. Not even comparable bro. Your hoops bias is laughable at best.
@@DailyMIKAL you wouldnt know who Scottie are if hé didnt play with Mike.
@@DailyMIKAL You got it all backwards LBJ can't keep his teams ego in check it's not about the owner who refused to build around LBJ, he gave him the will why do you think how the Lebron system was made and how it works? that's why him and kyrie and love got a conflict, some leader who can't tame his team and got saved his ass in multiple occasions! so your only reason is scottie?? lolz what a weak argument, pip drafted from Seattle but got traded in Chicago he wasn't that good not in several years MJ work on him make strong and durable for him to be able to keep with him MJ made his team better with strict tutelage and trainings routine, they get by, so Lets go to LBJ who or what teams he played in again pls remind me! Cavs Kyrie, irvine, tristan thompson, Mo Williams, Richard Jefferson man those guys can play well, in MIA the already champ team Wade BoSH and Ray Allen those are big HOF names you can't denied that, and in L.A w/c LABRON hand pick west brook, carmelo, Anthony Davis, Rajon Rondo, Carusso etc. what efforts did LBJ need to work for, as he already playing with HOF players and teams
then your only argument is scottie??? Fuck hahaha! you stop bro this is why LBJ fans has been said had weak argumentative capabilities! it's not like Pippen is already a superstar when he first start in Chicago FYI it's not after the first 2 championships, and he accumulated to many foot and back injuries so most of the games
Jordan is just greater than lebron. Stats dont need to back that up. Think of the most iconic jersey in basketball and immediately you will thing of that 23 jordan jersey. Mjs greatness will outway any player to come, including lebron. Mj is just the greatest simply
Super teams aren't formed through the draft. Jordan never left to form a superteam. He made his teammate that much better.
Jordan actually molded Scottie Pippen and Horace, who as rookies had skills and talent, but they were mentally soft, and Jordan toughened them up, and he was hard on the team , as he was brutally tough demanding perfection at their positions. Him and Coach Jackson made superstores out of thempractice
When Kerr went to the Bulls Jordan tested him and ended up giving him a black eye in practice. Kerr after getting the black eye was still standing up to Joran, that's when he earned Jordan's respect, and that's when he started getting passes in the game from Jordan for wide open shots.
Jordan built his team, LJ just wanted to join a prebuilt team. That's one difference that you really don't understand.
Another difference you don't understand is the Drama that LJ causes on his teams. LJ cries about not having better teammates instead of leading his teammates and challenging them to be better. Both of them had great team mates, there's no dispute there. MJ made them better with his focus and LJ made them worse with his distractions.
And as far as Rodman joining the Bulls, he joined because he wanted to play with the GOAT. Players wanted to be on Jordan's team, they don't want to be on LJ's team. He causes too much drama on the court.
Look, let me break it down for you like this without the noise.
LJ is under 75% from the line
LJ is well under 40% when he's 3 feet or more from the rim
LJ is 20% in the Clutch
No one with that many gaping holes in their game should ever be considered in the GOAT conversation. Real talk, if I was picking a team of the best players of all time, LJ doesn't make the team with that many holes and with that much drama. My forwards on that team are Tim Duncan, Malone, Bird, & Irving.
Rodman joined the Bulls because the Spurs wanted to get rid of him and he had little value. Unless you want to say Will Perdue is a valuable trade chip. That said, Phil and Jordan were able to mostly keep Dennis in line. I don't know if another team could have.
@@cheeseburger12 - The Spurs made a bad trade there. The Bulls picked him up because they needed someone who could keep Shaq out of the paint, and also to take some of the heat off an aging MJ on defense.
He was too wild for the 90s which is saying a lot. lol, but MJ & the boys did keep him in line, kind of for the most part. But all in all he was just what that team needed at the time
@@paulcrist7190 The Spurs didn't make a bad trade. They had to dump Rodman, he wore out his welcome. No one wanted him. If they didn't trade him, he would have been cut.
@@cheeseburger12 - He was worth more than what they got back, that's the definition of a bad trade.
@@paulcrist7190 they got better value then if the Bulls wouldn't have traded. If no one else wanted Rodman and no one else could control Rodman, then what is his value?
I don't know why supporting casts matter so much to LeBron fans. They don't really affect the goat debate that much. Like if MJ had a better supporting cast, so what? Does that automatically overrule the whole 2 more championships he won? Does it change the fact that he has more regular season and finals MVPs? Does it change the fact that he's better statistically, or that he is better defensively, or that he shoots more efficiently in the clutch? The point is, you have so much more to prove before you convince anybody that LeBron is the goat, and even then it's a big reach to say Jordan had more help in the first place.
First the vid tells you had a better supporting cast second did you just say why dies a supporting cast have to do with success in a TEAM sport and also he doesn’t have better stats than lebron stop just saying things
@@DailyMIKAL Firstly, did it really? Basing supporting casts off of literally just box plus minus is dumb for obvious reasons. Secondly, we're comparing individual players, not teams. And Lastly, Jordan easily has better advanced stats than Lebron. He has the highest PER of all time, the highest winshares per 48 minutes of all time, and funnily enough he has a higher box plus minus both offensively and defensively. The only advanced stats LeBron is better in are accumalative ones, such as VORP. Didn't you watch "Jordan vs Lebron - The Best GOAT Comparison" a while back? That video broke down in detail how Jordan is better statistically.
@@riquetc0060 why are people even debating this, it’s obvious Jordan was better. I don’t even know why they consider Lebron better than Kobe, Kobe’s wnd in my opinion. Lebron is the opposite of clutch and can’t shoot for shit outside 3 meters
Most of the major changes on the Bulls were role players. LeBron has played GM everywhere he has gone. Name a young player that became great playing with LeBron? Hard to name one because he wants proven players to make his runs. Even in Miami, Bosh and Wade not enough. Had to get Ray Allen
@@riquetc0060 i think he has short term memory jordan has better stats
MJ set the precedent on his team. He involuntary made his teammates raise their game by being the example through his work ethic and demeanor
Bro, I heard you say that slick remark about "stacked team, stacked team, stacked team", but you do know Jordan's "stacked team" he's talking about in the video was built up through the draft, and role player trades. You get an "A" for effort tho !!
When was the 90s bulls ever stacked? MAYBE the second three peat, because of 3 people mainly. These narratives 🤦♂️
Bulls got better, because Jordan pressured them to get better. That is why even his teammates had fear of him
Anyone who thinks that the Bulls teams were stacked like Dub City is seriously hallucinating. All you have to do is compare the player stats. Even Pip got much better as the years passed. He was no where near the Pip he turned into when he arrived.
The Bulls matured into a team of role players and they gelled well. Their style of play (triangle) worked well for them. The shooters knew they were expected to hit shots and the big men rebounded.
Jordan's team became better because of HIS LEADERSHIP and HE ACCEPT NOTHING FROM HIS TEAM BUT 100% commitment and lj don't have the ability to make his team mates work hard and commit, that's why this only add up why Michael Jeffrey Jordan is the GOAT, because with his leadership he condition his team to be better year after year after year unlike LJ who team up with the best players but still didn't win simply because he didn't not made his team mates better.
Scotty didn't choose to go to Chicago. He was traded to Chicago immediately after being drafted. That team was drafted and developed with and around Jordan.
You should look at point distribution on Lebron and Jordan Championship teams. In 2012 finals, Lebron's team scored 73.4 ppg, leaving Lebron with 24.6 to match OKC's total production. Lebron and Wade were outmatched by Westbrook and Durant by 6.4 ppg. It's the depth that made the difference. Outside both team's top two players, the Heat's depth outscored OKC's by 10.4 ppg.
In 2013, LJ needs 26 ppg to match the Spurs total and he scored 25.3.
In 2016, Lebron needed 29.2 to match the warriors. He got 29.7 and Irving had 27.1.
In 2020, LJ needed 24.3 to match the Heat, he got 29.8 while Davis had 25.
Jordan had similar support in some of his finals, but there are others where it's clear he had less offensive support.
In 93, the team outside Jordan scored 65.7. Jordan needed a whopping 41 ppg to match the Suns's high production. He finished with 41ppg.
In 97, Jordan needed 31.7 to match the Jazz, he finished with 32.3.
And even when he had lower scores to match like Lebron, he went much higher. In 92, 28.5 to match, he scores 35.8 for the whole series.
When it comes to the sidekick, Lebron always had better offensive help in his finals wins. He outscored his second man by 6 ppg in 2012, 5.7 in 2013, 2.6 in 2016 and 4.8 in 2020.
MJ ouscored Pippen by 10.4 in 91, 15 in 92, 19.8 in 93, 11.3 in 96, 12.3 in 97 and 17.8 in 98.
Lebron never outscored his sidekick by more than 6 ppg while MJ never outscored Pip by less than 10.4.
In his 6 finals mvp, MJ produced 34.7% of all his team's points.
In LJ's finals mvp, he produced 27.7% of his team's points.
And assists is not the reason for the difference. MJ had 6 apg in his 6 finals mvp while LJ had 8 apg. Least we mention Lebron had better offensive teammates to pass to, especially his sidekicks.
As for competition in the finals they won, Jordan had to beat 10 top3 teams in 6 years because the east was strong, meaning that in 4 of his 6 championships, the Bulls had to through the league's two best teams (other than the Bulls).
In his 4 finals MVP, Lebron had 3 top3 teams to beat.
In total, MJ's finals competition averaged 61.2 wins and a +7.3 rating.
Mj outscored the opp #1
33.6 vs 24.0 (+9.6)
His #2-3 vs #2-3
31.3 vs 30.2 (+1.1)
Rest of the teams:
31.8 vs 37.0 (-5.2)
Team total outside #1vs#1:
-4.1
Jordan scored 34.7% of his team points and needed 28.1 on average to match the other team's production. He went +5.5 over.
For LJ's 4 finals MVP, opp averaged 59.5 wins and +6.6
Lebron vs opp :
28.3 vs 24.0 (+4.3)
#2-3 vs #2-3:
35.9 vs 32.3 (+3.6)
Rest of the team:
37.9 vs 43.7 (-5.8)
Team total outside #1vs#1:
-2.2
LJ scored 27.7% of his team's points and needed 26.2 on average to match the opposition. He went +2.1.
The sheer difference in production gives a lot more merit to MJ's Finals MVPs.
And whatever happened when Lebron loss with bad teams is no different than what MJ lived through with the super teams in Boston and Detroit.
I have even more data that shows the chasm in production.
Like... before ever winning a Finals, before 90-91, MJ played 53 playoffs game with an average opponent at 55 wins and +5.1, he scored 35.8 ppg in 53 games (35.6%) while needing to score 37.1 to match the other team. Outside of #1vs#1, his team was -14.6 ppg. Out of those 11 series, 9 were top 10 teams.
For Lebron, before 11-12, he played 92 playoff games with an average opposition of 50.5 wins and +3.4. He scored 26.6 (30.2%) and needed to score 20.6 ppg to meet the other teams's total production. Outside #1 vs #1, his team was +0.7. In those 17 series, only 9 were top10 teams.
So they both had 9 series vs top 10 teams. They both were 3-6 in those series before winning. Lebron's teams had weaker opposition in the playoffs because they finished higher in the season, but was it because of Lebron or did he have a better team?
So let's look at those 9 series each vs top 10 teams before winning it all:
Opposition similar, 58.1 +6.2 for MJ, 58.3 +6.3 for LJ.
MJ vs #1
34.6 vs 22.5 (+12.1)
LJ vs #1
26.6 vs 21.9 (+4.7)
MJ's #2-3 vs #2-3
27.8 vs 33.6 (-5.8)
LJ's #2-3 vs #2-3
31.0 vs 32.3 (-1.3)
MJ's rest of team vs rest
36.0 vs 45.9 (-9.9)
LJ's rest vs rest
32.4 vs 37.0 (-4.6)
MJ's team outside #1vs#1
-15.7 ppg
LJ's team outside #1 vs #1
-5.9 ppg
For clarity, Jordan was 6.9 apg in those 53 games while LJ was 6.7 in his 92 games, so it's not a question of one of the two helping his teammates more.
It's pretty clear that Jordan had a weaker team vs his opposition which is why his team ended lower and faced stiffer competition early in the playoffs, so the whole "10 finals" is just situational.
JUST THE FACTS:
CAREER - Bottom line:
MJ scored more, turned it over less, stole the ball more, more offensive rebounds, and blocked the same as LJ…led league in points 10x and steals 3x...played in all 82 games 8x and 80+ 10x
Lebron has more assists, total/defensive rebounds but turned it over more, blocked the same as MJ - led the league in assists once and in points once…played in all 82 games 1x and 80+ 3x
So would you rather have MJ, an unstoppable scorer who turned it over less, got more steals, more offensive rebounds, same blocks, and led the league in darn near everything and plays ALL 82 games and plays ALL OUT in each game? and WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS but only for 13yrs*...or Lebron, a guy who gives more assists, def rebounds, same blocks, but doesnt play every game, takes a lots of plays off to "rest" and wins sometimes....but he'll do that for 20yrs...
MJ is the goat....period...Lebron is talented but most of the categories he has over MJ is longevity...not that longevity is a bad thing, but just because you do something for 20yrs doesn't mean you were the BEST at it...MJ is at the top of stats that dont even have anything to do with his position LOL
MJ has options A, B, C, etc Lebron only has option A and when option A goes wrong he becomes passive and reluctant to score...People always say "why did the defender fall for that fake, the defense is horrible" - you HAD to respect a pump fake or jab step from MJ (same with Bird). They had so many tools in their bag, that you had to respect them all...and they'd just score with another tool as soon as you bit on one. The guy who can hurt you the most is the guy who can score from anywhere/anytime NOT just close to the basket.
Look at these stats...MJ has the better offense/defense career numbers and did it in less time (300 games less) AND this INCLUDES his Wizard years where he was 38/39yrs old and basically an on court coach and not focused on being the usual dominant MJ. Lebron has more assists/total blocks but has had 300 more games to do it in...
Season G MP FG FG% 3P 3PA 3P% 2P 2PA 2P% eFG% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PTS
MJ Career 1072 *38.3 *11.4 0.497 0.5 1.7 0.327 10.8 21.2 0.51 0.509 *6.8 *8.2 *0.835 *1.6 4.7 6.2 5.3 *2.3 *0.8 *2.7 *30.1
LJ Career *1366 38.2 9.9 *0.505 1.6 4.5 *0.346 8.3 15.1 *0.552 *0.545 5.7 7.8 0.734 1.2 *6.3 *7.5 *7.4 1.6 *0.8 3.5 27.1
In fact, Lebron doesn't lead in any of these categories in career....none...look for yourself ;)
Season MP FG% 3P% 2P% eFG% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PTS CAREER PTS
MJ Career 38.3 0.497 0.327 0.51 0.509 6.8 8.2 0.835 1.6 4.7 6.2 5.3 2.3 0.8 2.7 30.1 32292
LJ Career 38.2 0.505 0.346 0.552 0.545 5.7 7.8 0.734 1.2 6.3 7.5 7.4 1.6 0.8 3.5 27.1 37062
Bird Career 38.4 0.496 0.376 0.509 0.514 4.4 5 0.886 2 8 10 6.3 1.7 0.8 3.1 24.3 21791
Jabbar Career 36.8 0.559 0.056 0.56 0.559 4.3 6 0.721 2.4 7.6 11.2 3.6 0.9 2.6 2.7 24 38387
Magic Career 36.7 0.52 0.303 0.541 0.533 5.5 6.5 0.848 1.8 5.5 7.2 11.2 1.9 0.4 3.9 19 17707
Wilt 45.8 0.54 5.8 11.4 0.511 22.9 4.4 30.1 31419
Kareem leads in 9, MJ in 5...the rest in 1 or 2...except Lebron...ZERO
The comment in the video at about 22:30 mark was that the Bulls with Jordan were about on par from an overall plus minus as the Warriors with Steph, KD, etc.. it did not say his supporting cast was. Re-listen to what he said.
You’re not from Elmhurst IL are you? I knew a Brian Hunt from there and am wondering if it could be you? If not, sorry to bother you.
When MJ retired before the 94 season the roster was improved with Kukoc Longley etc etc. if MJ didn’t retire the Bulls win 75 games that year. Lebron has terrible efficiency outside of the rim, he ain’t no 🐐
The 94 Bulls had 12 players on the roster who were a part of the 1st and 2nd 3-peats. I love how they always bring up 55-wins like it was an incredible accomplishment for a 3-peat dynasty that added key additions in Jordan's absence. There were 6 other teams in the 1994 NBA who also won 55-games without MJ too LOL.
94 was still Cartwight, 95 was when Luke Joined, I think. I remember because Cartwright rallied the team after Scottie's 1.8. That would have been something though with Kukoc added to essentially the 93 team. Although I don't know how easily they could have given Kukoc minutes with Jordan, Scottie and Grant. Would Kukoc be point guard?
@@cheeseburger12 wrong
@@mannyneva1760 ok, my bad, Luke was on the bench mostly. Started 17 games to Cartwright 's 41.
“Fu€£ u Scottie, I’m shooting this Sh!t” lmfao. That Sh!t had me dyin lol
Jordan had a super team because he MADE them a super team. They were majority all drafted with a couple cast-off from other teams. LBron recruited friends to play together. At no time did Jordan get a top 3/5/10player in the league to join him. He had to wait on the teams drafted players to develop and he was a huge part of their development
Yep, Like Russell, Magic, Bird...Zeke and the majority in the all time greats.
Only Lebron gets special credit without having actually helped develop the talent.
Jordan and the Bulls was not a super team, he had a great cast of players surrounding him. Compared to Lebron, he had to team up or invite a cast of super star players, which ended up becoming a super team.
I don't remember the Bulls going out and picking up super free agents apart from Rodman. Most of the players they won championships with were drafted or free agents that were coachable and understood systems.
Rodman wasn't a super free agent. No team wants Rodman, Spur was willing to let off Rodman if no one want to trade that's literally how bad Rodman situation is when the bulls took him in.
@@shade0180 The Bulls were Rodmans last chance in the NBA, like Lebron nobody wanted his drama.
The teams got better because of MJ and the experience of all the battles , but Lebron ran to Miami to be around stars, in the finals, it was more Wade and Bosh, than Lebron.
Somebody tell me when has Lebron faced double and triple team defense game after game, and still be the best and most dominant player in the league. Lebron's great no doubt about it, but MJ was just different.
Most dominant player on BOTH ENDS of the court.
Sweetie, if you watched what a lot of his coaches and teammates said about Jordan then you would know that he treated every practice as if they were playing in the playoffs. He wasn’t stacked with a super team. It was his drive, work ethic, and killer mentality that pushed the players on his team. Let’s not forget that a lot of the players now were fans of Jordan’s and mimicked his game. I can’t knock you for who you like, but I remember when Jordan was in the NBA and how he played every game on both lines. He was amazing to watch.
The Last Dance should make sense to everyone now in why MJ was so demanding. There was no need to change teams. Just improve YOUR team chemistry from year to improve by being tougher on your teammates in practice. There was no super team in Chicago.
Exactly...
How could a team be a "super team", when only "1" guy (MJ) was the LONE selected All Star in all 6 of their title seasons?
Let that sink in for a min...
The ONLY reason WHY LBJ's fanboys LOVE the old: "MJ had better teams!" narrative so much, is because they think it'll minimize MJ's OBVIOUS impact on the Bulls winning fortunes, which they think will level the playing field and make for a more favorable comparison for LBJ, when his repeated failures are highlighted in a comparison with MJ.
That's what the intent/motive is behind this particular narrative: finding a way to level the playing field for LBJ.
@@natedablack7857 They also tried to claim that Jordan had superteam and every other teams in his era were weak.. but look at Pistons 93 roster, 3 hall of famers still in their prime, but couldn't even make it to the playoffs. Those people are clearly doing it to diminish Jordan's impact on the Bulls to make certain someone look better in comparison, when there was never a comparison to begin with.
And if I'm picking someone too win with, I'm picking Jordan... That's Facts !
Jordan didn't have a good team, he practically build it himself. Lebron haven't been able to do that. It wasn't only his game, it was his play making.
Michael Jordan has 7 of the top 10 playoff SERIES scoring averages of all time... singlehandedly. He averaged 40+ on blistering efficiency in 5 playoff series, including the record setting 41 ppg in the 1993 finals and the only back-to-back 50 point games ever in the playoffs (Cleveland 89, winning a series the Bulls were supposed to lose). Nope, these statements are not cap.
Averaged 43 against the Celtics in 86, too.... but lost all 3 games to a much better team...
wow, thats nuts
He still never built a super team The organization built the team You listen but you don't listen
MJ didn’t call and team up with other allstars and franchise players IN HIS PRIME to become a champion! Fact of the matter is, when MJ was getting beat up by Detroit, he didn’t call on other allstars to form a super team so he can get pass the one team he couldn’t beat, Mj went to the gym and got stronger to take the punishment that Detroit was dishing out. LBJ couldn’t get pass the Boston Celtics and he left home to team up with 2 other franchise players in his prime!!! It’s the journey that you take to get the top that defines you,… he clearly took the easy way to get there! Jordan pushed his teammates to reach their best and that’s why even without him on the court, his teammates still performs at a very high level.
There's a video series out there you can watch that talks about GOAT discussions for many players. One section of it talk about the help each player had. Scottie Pippen was the only all-star on MJ's championship teams and that was in the later years. Think about that for a moment... XD
Here's the start of the video: ruclips.net/video/bdDg4y1FwNM/видео.html
You can see the other parts by checking out the channel the vid is on.
Jordan was the ultimate competitor and held his teammates accountable to stay focused and win! If you remove Jordan from that team like 94-95 seasons you get a slightly above average team. Jordan made them a super team. Plus Jordan was on the bulls for 13 seasons and the front office did a good job surrounding him with the right supporting cast over time.
If you had watched both of them during their career, you would NOT think LeKaren is the Goat.
He said the team WITH Jordan was comparable to KD warriors. While Jordan was the only Superstar scorer. No other Bull during these years scored 20points per game in the playoffs, and MJ still carried them to that lvl.
And teammates improving while playing with MJ is something he should get credit for, because Brons teammates didn't become better, unless they are spot up shooters.
6 and 0. Never failed to show up when needed. MJ is THE GOAT.
I don't believe how dumb Brons fans are. He said Jordan's second three peat bulls were almost as dominant as KD warriors. But that doesn't make them a superteam. Jordan was the ONLY superstar and he had just one allstar in Scottie. So the fact that his team was almost as dominant as these Warriors speaks only to his greatness. Lebron on the other hands was NEVER able to make his teams so dominant while having 2 different SUPERTEMS, especially the one in Miami.
To be honest, the Jordan and Bulls where all about defense. That, to me is what won them their 6. Scottie was a big part of that but on offense Scottie wasn’t really a scorer. He only had over 20 a season 3 times and never above 22. Wade had over 20 every season with Lebron and Kyrie averaged 25 in 2016. Lebron gets over that hump and wins when he has that score first All-Star top 75 player to get buckets because he is facilitates.
Big facts on the defense
Defense is the best offense, but JORDAN ruled both categories being the best offensive player averaging high and being the DPOY both in a tough league a true man's game! he also facilitates but seldom because they are role players
He created a good team. He didn’t come in with a good team.
Jerry Krause created a good team
@@DailyMIKAL was it Kraus or Jordan they were afraid of upsetting??
@@DailyMIKAL Created such a good team he had no prior success nor any success after Jordan.
Stop it. LeBron has never wanted to play for a HOF coach or great GM, because LeBron thinks he knows better than GMs and coaches. He played in Miami under Pat Riley, but Pat wouldn't allow him to be the GM. Stop with the LeBron Stan narratives. I watched both and I have no problem saying LeBron is #2. But the gap between him and MJ is not small. If you watched MJ play in real-time, I'm 100% certain you would agree. I actually feel bad you young guys didn't get to witness it. It's like being born the year after Halley's Comet passes the earth.
Yeah: Dickey simpkins jue bucheler and bill wennington constitute a stacked team. Lebron needed at least 2 other all stars to win his championships. Jordan needed team oriented role players that could be molded. Those bulls teams in some respects were more like the Duncan spurs: a bunch of no name players playing the right way
STOP MAKING EXCUSSES. JORDAN DID NOT HAVE A SUPER TEAM. HE JUST HAD A BETTER TEAM.
It wasn’t a (stacked team) like Bron created. They just (improved over time). And when they were ready, they couldn’t be stopped.
Ight let’s do this. No lebron has not had less talented teams. Lebron just doesn’t utilize his teammates to their full potential.. he doesn’t sacrifice anything to make his teams gel correctly. He has his heliocentric style of everything revolves around me, and no matter the teammates, they have to conform to his system. He has turned some of the greatest bigmen in the game into spot up shooters, and dynamic role players into corner specialist. Jr smith went from sixth man with a dynamic scoring game to a catch and shoot player playing next to bron. And I’m not mad at it, because it has worked. But the issue is that because of the way lebron politics and builds teams, he only looks for the big names to stack the deck instead of actually taking the time to build a proper roster. When u go into every season trying to trade all your assets to get new star teammates instead of just building on your current roster and creating a real chemistry and system, what do u expect? He treats teammates like expendable pawns and it hurts his consistency. Jordan did jump ship. He stuck through the bad years, he let his gm and coach do their jobs, and they added the pieces around him. They won 3 times, fell a bit, retooled without completely jumping ship, and won again. When has lebron ever built something with a team? When has he ever stayed the course? When has he sacrificed his pretty numbers for the hood of the team? When u have to be the man in the middle and your team gets built to appease you and solely you, it’s doomed to fail as soon as you leave. Example- all the planets on our solar system revolve around the sun in a particular way. If the suns suddenly disappeared, what do u think would happen to the rest of the solar system? Same thing applies for lebron led teams. Their all top heavy, and never have a good bench. Not because the players are bad. But because the stars take away from the money needed to actually build a hood team.
the bulls in the 90s were never a superteam!! The only superstar they had besides MJ was Scottie, and he had to develop and mature from when he first got to bulls!! MJ was always the number 1 guy on the bulls, even when he came back from retirement in '95. Lebron played with more all stars and hall of famers than MJ ever did!
I do have to laugh when Lebron fans find one stat that gives Lebron the edge and think the debate is over. Aside from tallying up numbers over a longer career what else does Lebron have over Jordan? I get he is this generations best player but he's never been the best in the league at anything except finishing through defenses but that's mainly due to his size. Would he be dominant at 6'6"? Jordan was a lethal finisher, mid range scorer and had an amazing post game. Jordan challenged teammates while Lebron throws his under the bus and moves to greener pastures. Will never understand this debate tbh. It was over in 2011 when Lebron failed against Dallas.
Here is what you missed. Jordan demanded excellence from his teammates. He made them practice hard. He made them execute. So well, here you arw thinking everyone, outside of Pippin equated to a stacked team..
These teams were not started. These teams had the Jordan standard. Another reason he is better the LeBron. By far.
Jordan's team wasn't that good until he made them that good
24:09 remember the Bulls before 93 were a team with no championship record, built a team around him, they all worked hard placing right resources to win, the choach was not experienced, the team around him realized or saw him putting the work as a leader so they too improved, not just leaving to joining the Heat remind to LaGM said it himself he went there to win. This is the mentality of saying the teams that built their roasters are super team is just dumb 🙄
Jordan didn't have a superteam the Bulls were just super good and LeBron James had a good situation which was Miami great coach and GM but he couldn't run the show because Pat Riley wouldn't allow it so he left
MJ is a great defensive and offensive promise. HE WAS NOT A THREAT ... HE WAS A PROMISE.
The chart tells you that MJ made the team better each and every year!!!!
There is no argument Michael is the goat Kobe a second LeBron is a distant third, the end
I personally don't believe that anyone has ever said that MJ and the Bulls were not a super yeam...they were in fact...The GOAT TEAM. MJ has always said that he could have not done it alone. But with that being said he and the Bulls did not attempt to build a team based on Hall of Famers switches every year. They great players that played greater as a TEAM = GOAT TEAM
But the fact that before they came to Chicago those guys were NOT championship material except for Rodman, but the point is MJ made his team a competitive one with his tutelage and very strict training they been able to keep up, Bulls w/o MJ made it to the semi, its because they already champions so its reasonable enough that they can get through the semi, but w/o MJ they can't pass a strong hurdle
Goat team there's no such thing, HOF teammates maybe it existed in LBJ's play book
but if you go straight the answer lies ahead. the question is who made them better who put them in that HOF spot, It's MJ, though they have the right to keep their status quo as they played really well in the bulls but the main reason why they played so good is because of MJ, that kind of leader will make sure that they can tap into their fullest potential!
and basketball doesn't win by just one man it's a team sport, it's simple if you want to win make your team better (MJ)
If you want to win chase other Hof, and champion teams then join them (LBJ)
Bro think rationally. A player leaving behind a champions team will of course be strong without him. That was his mentality enforced on his teammates. Winning championships changes players. Makes them believe in themselves. LBJ when he left or joined a team, it wasn't him alone or joining or leaving.. this usualy was a complete overhual. He came with firepower and he left with them as well. If 2 or 3 keyplayers arrive or leave, of course that will have a considerable impact on the team. That's not solely because of LBJ only. So the impression here is wrongly portrayed..
Have to take in account that MJ talked about how he had to change the culture of the Bulls. It’s seems every year his tm8s got better. To me this shows how great of a leader MJ was. He literally made his tm8s better
Mike is one of the greatest shooters of all time lebron can't hit back to back free throws please don't compare mj to lebum James
Jordan didn't get any better because you can't get any better than the Greatest. 😂
Bro can you please look at the rosters before you call MY bulls a "super team". NO one during that time would even remotely call them a super team. no one during that time thought Jerry Krause was a good GM. NOT ever 🤦♂️
Lmao stacked team wtf🤦♂️, lebron fans looking for anything now to support there argument for lebron being the goat. All these comparisons don’t make any sense cause KOBE is number 2 after MJ not lebron.
Counting MJ’s Tar Heels championship, 2 dream team golds, 2 Pan Am golds & 6-6 in NBA/6-6 MVP it’s pretty much a mic drop 11-0 in championship games. Jordan made his teammates better instead of instigating trades to better teams. This isn’t a debate worth having. I’m a Pistons fan btw
Those ass whooping the pistons gave Jordan made him better.
Just wrap this around your mind, 2 times 3peats with 6 final MVPs. He is a pretty good basketball player......GOAT
Jordan built the players. Tough love to playing thier full potential. Not jump to a stacked team
I grew up watching Jordan, that was not a stacked team by any means
Hahahaaa lol Anyway... Jordan steps in when the opposing team's star players are in the game... when they tire out, Jordan also goes out. Scoring against them is the hard part. He get's it done. The other players can handle the rest. Coach Jackson is a master. Why? Because Jordan plays almost every single game of the season... Lebron only plays a few. Who's showing more Longevity? Jordan will burn out because he's not on vacation for more than half of the season like Lebron, so he leaves when the opposing star players leave the court, & comes on when they do. :)
YOU DON'T HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT . DO MORE RESEARCH LIL MAN MJ NEVER GOT ALONG WITH THE OWNER OR ANYONE ELSE 😕
that aint a super team thats more of a team getting better with time. none of those bench players or role players would have been stars on other teams.
This kid has a very young and biased mindset when it comes to the differences with having a team grow and become better around a specific player over years, as opposed to collecting a bunch of superstars together to make a great team. That is why the bulls chemistry was overall better thus allowing them to win more.
It doesn't add up because the Bulls performed as a Super Team because of the Triangle concept. They role players performed their roles perfectly. And they were plug and play almost totally different personnel between both 3peat teams but still performed splendidly.
Home grown teams. But the moral of the story is tht they never ever scored more with Jordan off the court then they did with him on the court. On top of tht, Jordan figured out how to just win the game. He was playing a different game then everyone else.
If you saw the games you would understand. I saw Both play n I’m telling you Jordan couldn’t be stopped once he started winning n he made his teammates better n made them make shots n his want to win at all cost rubbed off on his team. Tht means more then anything…..
the part you're missing is Jordan's leadership & competitiveness made his teammates better, he didn't except trash teams !
Also missed that he does not disappear in the playoffs. LeBron against 2011 mavs avg less than 18 pts. Out played by Jason Terry 6' 2"/ JJ Barea (was he even 6 ft?) combo.
Jordan played for one franchise and those guys he played with played together atleadt 3 seasons so that means they grew together. They would be a super team if Jordan recruited them cause he felt like he needed them.
Please name 1 all star outside of scottie pippen. I'll wait. Name the all stars for lebron
Super team? Jordan played with players that had a TOTAL of 10x All Stars. Pippen was a 7x All Star, Rodman was a 2x All Star and Grant a 1x All Star. And note that Rodman and Grant were All Stars when they DIDN'T play with Jordan. Rodman was an All Star during his Pistons days and Grant had his lone All Star appearance when Jordan played Baseball. So basically Jordan, when playing, had only Pippen as an All Star player. What Super Team did Jordan play on? Jordan was such a leader that he elevated the game of his team. Everyone is talking about the Bulls during the 93-94 season when they got to the ECSF when they rode on the coattails of their championship season, but no one is talking about the 94-95 Bulls before MJ returned when they struggled and were 34-31.
But back to the supposed super team argument. MJ only had players with a total of 10 all star appearances throughout his entire career. Lebron up until now has players with a total of 91 all star appearances during his career. If the Bulls were a super team with that roster, then you can't say Jordan played in a weak era, since there obviously were players in the league that were much better than the "super players" on Jordan's team. Those other players made the All Star teams and all NBA teams, not the players on Jordan's "super team". Those players on the Bulls teams were good, but Jordan simply elevated their game so they got the better of teams they played. The player who's gotten more help here is Lebron, not MJ.
You know what doesn't add up? Labrons free throws 🤣
I think the difference in OG fans is the Bulls worked their way up the ladder. The only big free agent was Rodman for 2nd 3 peat, who didn’t contribute to offensive side except offensive rebounds. Other trades were merely finding players with a mentality to deal with Jordan’s expectations/abuse.
We watched Jordan & Pippen get hammered by Bad Boys but instead of making trades. They worked harder to level up to overcome the challenges.
Lebron didn’t make 1st super team. Lakers had Magic, Worthy & Kareem with above average player Byron Scott. 2 🐐 candidates and 2 All Stars. Jordan’s 1st 3peat was 2 All Stars.
We don’t hate Lebron but having watched 40 years of NBA he’s a generation great like Shaq or Hakeem but hasn’t made All Time great list. Lebron also had bad timing entering league with Kobe & Timmy and then Steph emerged. I think fans prefer players who ride ups & downs in 1 city. That maybe unfair but so is life
This is a prime example with Lebron fans not understanding the context and actual points the guy is making.
This is why MJ was considered the hardest worker in practice. His presence drew so much attention in the floor the importance of his teams development… showed based on how hard they worked. When you look at each player individually,., you can see they weren’t actually a super team.
Nah not a super team. It was a team that practiced like Mike and got better because of him. Unlike someone who jumped teams a few times
Stephon Marbury said it best Jordan should not even be mentioned in the same breath as any other player because he is unrankable number one is Kobe then number two LeBron then everybody can pick which players after that it's that simple.
MJ played for one team his whole career (Bulls) and was only traded once to the Wizards at the end of his career. Lebron James has played for Cleveland (twice), Miami, and LA. Jordan wasn't jumping teams trying to win with other stars when the Bulls struggled. That is something that is missing from the NBA now. Players used to have a sense of pride when they played for a team, and always wanted to compete against the best and be challenged. Now guys just leave their team for more money, chance to win rings with other stars, and for popularity in a larger market. That's why I respect Giannis a lot for sticking with Milwaukee and winning a ring with them. They are a small market team that would have never won a ring unless Giannis wanted to stick around. Who would want to play for the Milwaukee Bucks now when they can go play for the Lakers, Clippers, Warriors, Heat, Knicks, Nets, Bulls, or 76er's and have a chance to play with an all star line up. You have to really have that mental drive and passion to stick with the same team. I hate when players take the easy road now and join a team that is already playoff built. Jordan had Pippen, but it wasn't like the Bulls traded for Pippen and he was already a superstar. Pippen had to come along and learned to be great from Michael because he knew that Michael would always be critical of him if he did not perform up to par. I watched Magic, Bird, Jordan, Olajuwon (who know one talks about. Legendary player also), Kobe, and Lebron and the one thing that stands out is Lebron is the only one that was jumping teams. All of those other guys stuck with their teams until maybe the end of their careers when they were finally traded. Jordan is the best player I have ever watched play. Hands down. It isn't even close. If MJ were drafted when he was in high school just imagine what his stats might look like now. Who would catch him? Imagine how many 40, 50, 60, 70 point games he would have. He might have more than 6 rings too.
I don't think this young dude really gets it. There is a difference in what the Bulls did, as opposed to what -Lebron's- teams do. The only "big name talent" the Bulls ever brought in was Dennis Rodman, (which was to replace Horace Grant's defense and rebounding which they lost the year before). Anybody else they brought in were role players to support the core. Steve Kerr? Ron Harper? Bill Cartwright? Role players. Pippen, Grant, BJ Armstrong, Tony Kukoc etc were *drafted* by the Bulls and became award winners *because of* Jordan. MJ forced/made/willed his teammates to be better. That is called "building a chamnpionship team".
-Lebron- on the other hand went to and played with superstar D-Wade (arguably the 3rd best SG ever behind Kobe) and Chris Bosh (multi-time all-star, 20&10 dude) and a hand-picked bench in Miami. Then because Kyrie emerges as a multi all-star, top tier point guard, and Kevin Love (a multi-time all-star, 20 & 10 guy like Bosh) is available, he decides to go back to Cleveland and once again with a hand picked bench. Then forces the Lakers to get rid of EVERYTHING so he can eventually play with (20 & 10) superstar Anthony Davis, and another superstar in Russell Westbrick. Then builds a bench comprising of stars like Carmelo Anthony and Dwight Howard. That's what is called "buying championships".
People are too caught up in the moment. The greatest thing you witness is not necessarily the greatest thing ever. Everyone wants to feel that they witnessed the greatest thing ever, or that it came from their generation.
Not to mention the brons sports agency. Imagine having a sports agency colluding to get guys on your team. It’s cheating!
COPIUM. MJ is the G.O.A.T.
Super team argument..
Pippen or D Wade who you picking?
Horace Grant or Chris Bosh who you picking?
Craig Hodges or Ray Allen?
Shane Battier or John Paxson?
Mike Miller or Bill Cartwright?
Then LeBron ran with Kyrie and K Love. In a vacuum I'm picking Pippen over Irving, ok. But people forget that Rodman was hella one dimensional and you are playing 4 on 5 offensively, plus he was on his last legs in Chicago (especially 98) so picking him over K Love is arguable. I'll give you that those later Bulls teams had Harper and Kukoc. BUT! Harper was a shell of himself after that knee injury in LA when he was with the Clippers (back when he was Hollywood Harper) and Kukoc was over rated. Left the Bulls and did NOTHING. With ample opportunity. He shined in the system.
The triangle is why Mike's team was able to shine as much as they did in those championship runs without him. That triple post offense is a motion offense with hella options. It keeps the defense from keying in on one specific person. When the D could focus on Mike the result was the late 80s results. Once the triangle was implemented and Scottir became the main ball handler instead of Mike, the 90s was the result. That's why LeBron couldn't win unless he had someone to get the D's attention off of him (Wade, Irving, Davis) but he always remains the system, hence his team depends on him to do more, hence more failure. Wilt could write a book on this subject. If you study the game, you'll see this theme repeated throughout history. The teams with systems dominate (60s Celtics, early 70s Knicks, Lakers and Celtics of the 80s, 90s Bulls, 2000s Lakers and Spurs, 10s Warriors etcetera set ya watch and watch).
Ball movement…the best teams ever were great at ball movement. The “Bron” didn’t get enough guys involved. It’s also slow and predictable which is why the spurs beat Miami by a record margin.
You failed to realize that Jordan didn't start off with a "super team." His supporting cast absolutely sucked when he first entered the NBA. They only improved after years of playing with him. Great players improve the players around them. Lebron failed to do this in seven years in Cleveland before he quit and bailed on his team. That's one of the reasons why he's not the GOAT.
What superteam ? A superteam is a team with 3 players that can carry their own franchise. Pippen did it for one year and Grant never did that, so very dubious claim.
Meanwhile, D Wade and Bosh did it. K Love and AD did too.
K love carried the Timberwolves to where exactly? Bosh carried the raptors to where exactly? Being on a bad team and putting up good stats don’t mean you carried your franchise anywhere except to the lottery each year maybe you make the playoffs one or twice but come on stop it juror never made it to playoffs without lebron before he went to Cleveland did he carry that franchise ? And at that time two superstars are kinda the equivalent to three now Barkley was alone Kevin Johnson was good no superstar the Sonic’s had kemp and Payton idk if you call Kemp a superstar then jazz had two superstars laker only had magic and blazers had drexler so I mean at that time there was no three superstars teams and when he went up against a two superstar team he had three with Rodman you heard the vid his team and supporting cast was compared to the kd warriors come on now
@@DailyMIKAL I like how you guys talk about Lebron's teams records dropping off when he leaves, but yall don't mention the Wolves going from a 40 win team to a 16 win team after Love left. That's what I call a carry.
Toronto also went from a 40 win team to a 22 win team without Bosh. It's not their fault they had bad teams, but when it's Bron we supposed to feel for that dude ?
Lmao the only Jordan Bulls team that didn't have a decent to large on off gap was 1992 and like we established, MJ/Pip/Horace isn't a superteam and don't dare compare them to KD, Steph and Klay.
Second threepeat Bulls weren't a superteam either, MJ carried on/off in the playoffs, two lowest supporting cast in NBA history, 8 rebounds in 1997 playoffs with Rodman on the team, the Spurs sold Rodman for a sock, no superstar.
He was literally the definition of a role player like Draymond, just defend and rebound.
@@kristijanEX The Bulls got Rodman straight up for Will Freaking Perdue...that's how badly the Spurs wanted to unload Rodman. Phil Jackson in his book said Dennis was 7th on their list of potential power forwards. No one wanted to deal with Rodman at the time. These young kids don't know this stuff.
@@DailyMIKAL Kevin Johnson was the defacto best pg from 91 to 94
@@DailyMIKAL and LeBron made Kevin love better ?😂😂
The bulls team have grown during several years. It was the same team with just one all star, Pippen. It doesn't mean that he had better players than Lebron, but a team that knew every player really well.
I think your theory that Lebron got "better" will yield some disappointing results as his shooting %s don't change much throughout his career. He's always been an average to below average 3pt shooter, and a poor FT shooter. His career shooting % is buffed by all the uncontested dunks and drives to the basket he gets in the current era.
The 93 suns were not a shit team by any stretch. They have the best record in the league and they had an identical offensive rating to the 2017 warriors. They just had only slightly better than average defense.
As did the Warriors. 15th in D in 2015. 19th in 2016. 11th in 2017 and 18th in 2018.
Bulls team "Practice games are harder because we went against MJ, to prepare us for whatever pressure we face"
He made his team play to almost his level. That is what it is.
MJ was called THE best player by Bobby Knight even before he played in the NBA. He led 84 Olympics team against NBA All Star to win all 8 games. That NBA team had prime Bird, Magic, Isiah Thomas, Drexler, Parish, McHale, English etc. So of course he "didn't get better", he was already at his best.
🤣...using owners and general managers in his case... 🤣
His teams didn't drop off as much as they should have once Phil got there because of the triangle offense and how it lets you get quality shots. When you also have someone like Scotty who's versatile it helps with the drop off.
Also brought in Kukoc and Kerr and others, it WASNT THE SAME TEAM, well, it was, with more new talent.
Jordan is Tom Brady - always wins
Lebron is Jim Kelly - lose in finals, repeat
...big difference.
HOF teammates: MJ x4/ LBJ x12
If you like passes, you need to check out Magic Johnson’s Ultimate Mixtape
ruclips.net/video/pt4kfQhvI48/видео.html
MJ actually is a better passer than LBJ, he just dont wanna do it .. HE IS PAYED TO SCORE ...
Theirs a difference between having super stars, and developing players to support a position in the game. Pay attention to what he is telling you. And see if Michael Jordan teammates became Allstars.