WONDER WOMAN, WATCHMEN, JOSS WHEDON
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- Опубликовано: 4 фев 2025
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Kevin and Marc discuss the week in Geek.
00:30 - Wonder Woman wages
05:00 - Robert Downey Jr.
08:45 - Wonder Woman Sequel Thoughts
11:30 - Patty Jenkins
14:30 - Joss Whedon Wonder Woman,
19:00 - Batgirl
21:15 - Wonder Woman/Conan Crossover
24:00 - Watchmen
Three times a week, Marc Bernardin and Kevin Smith talk about all the daily news in movie make believe, terrific TV and anything that squeaks in Geek!
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Jay and Silent Bob’s Secret Stash jayandsilentbob...
Kevin: "What did they die of?"
Mark: "WW1"
This had me cracking the hell up.
They was allergic to bullets
Also, immediately after WWI there was a terrible influenza outbreak.
They died of a hundred years :-P
The Wonder Woman film score is pretty rockin'.
Dapper Skeleton I would enter the octagon to her theme music
WoPoTHA & Spidey:HC also!!
thank you for putting time stamps in descr!!! much appreciated.
Listening to Mark say 'member over and over reminded me of the South Park episode of 'member-berries. My brain just jumped to a comic book board room full of member-berries saying what Mark said.
Nothing beats that Dr. Manhattan origin scene Snyder put on screen back in 08
Wonder Woman's success is awesome.
Now we can have those MCU/DCU easter eggs in each other movies,like the comics.
I was extremely pleasantly surprised
Kevin smith singing run the jewels! My day is made thanks kev and Marc
When did Kevin Smith make a two dudes in space movie??
You should watch and discuss the new Twin Peaks, guys! It was actually you two talking about Twin Peaks in an early episode of this podcast, that introduced me to the show, which is now my favorite show. It's worth watching this new season!
They could do it this way: Watchmen Season 1 - 1940's & 50"s Season 2 - Watchmen in the 60's before they were forced to retire. Season 3 - Adapt the 12 issue mini series Season 4 - Post Ozymandias foiled plan
A chronological telling would be rather inexciting. Not that the stories would be boring, but they simply wouldn't draw an audience.
If the studio chooses to do it over several seasons, they will have to carefully make it into a non-linear story, just like the movie did - with lots of flashbacks and Dr. Manhattan time-hopping.
Think Pulp Fiction but 10-40 hours long.
i like it exept the post ozymandias foiled plan thats how you end the show never go past that
How about a separate show for the minute men?
Best cometary pair on the tube. Fuckin fantastic dudes.
Marc is the reason I am changing my views about Diversity in Hollywood. While there is certainly a pandering agenda being pushed, Marc keeps pointing out that not everyone has an agenda, some people with diverse perspectives can bring something new to the table and thats great.
I dont think films like Wonder Woman and Get Out would be successful without the directors. Sure "anyone" can direct a movie, but I think its good that these people are not being successful because they are black or a women, they are successful because they bring NEW ideas to the table, something that "any director" wouldnt do.
Anthony, some friends and I were chatting about the WW movie and I caused a stunned silence when I pointed out that they _hadn't_ made Diana sexy. Compared to how she's been portrayed for years in comics and TV as a busty underwear model, this was new for what it wasn't. Not to say that Gal Godot in a leather mini-dress isn't hot, she clearly is, but that is an incidental by-product of Diana the Warrior in typically Amazonian armour. An innovation doesn't have to be radical or even obvious, it just has to be new. Just a thought.
Nicholas Cross And how about a love story thats told by NON SEDUCTIVE close ups of 2 people gazing at each other and a single kiss.
I don't think anybody will dispute that. I think Kevin is a bit of a simp with his constant progressive talking points. Like saying that right-wing people don't want to see women/minorities work. People are inherently meritocratic. If we see that people are doing good work, we will enjoy their work, and respect them more. This is perfectly normal. If a director has a take that's super exclusive and doesn't resonate with broader audiences then they shouldn't expect it to perform as well as something that's more universal in it's appeal (and they shouldn't see it as some king of indictment about society at large) The way Marvel Movies are going to make mountains more than a Jodorowsky or Guy Maddin film. Saying that the way the management in hollywood have done things is a reflection of the general public is just silly. They're operating on models that worked in previous generations. Even now as Disney churns out serialized content in the vein of old radio shows like Buck Rogers. It's all old-hat, really.
One scene I think many people have ovelooked is when Charlie suggests that they would be better off without him. Now Superman would probably respond with something about 'Truth, Justice and the American Way' and Captain America would have had something to say about duty and honour and loyalty other soldierly virtues. And what does Wonder Woman do? She just smiles sweetly and in a tone that suggests that him leaving would be unthinkable says "But Charlie... who will sing for us?" And you just know that even if she then announced that they were to assault the very gates of hell, the whole motly crew would be with her.
Lamashtar just by making a movie that is a success
HBO could do a series of the Unknown Soldier. It is a Vertigo currently, I believe. I remember reading them in the 70's and I read the Vertigo run, but more would be a good thing.
I would like to see Wonder Woman II set in the 80's during the Cold War. It's timely and an homage to the TV show. Plus I want to see a movie version of I.R.A.
I am definitely aboard the Pine as Manhunter train.
LicoriceLain pause
That would go over like a lead balloon. Can you imagine the backlash for a character that has traditionally been portrayed as black being recast as a white dude? The only way to do it that would be remotely acceptable would be to have Pine show up the first time, then have him shapeshift into someone that looks more like J'onn J'onz and, at that point, why even spend the money on Pine to begin with?
The problem solves itself. Even on Supergirl, he changes form quite often.
Sam Dunham Martian Manhunter is Green(blue ish) not black... And also a literal alien from Mars
And his first 'Human' guise was as a white guy.
Thanks for thevideos Kev and Mark!!?👍
Regarding the pay gap and financial stuff:
1. Wonder Woman had a 149mil USD budget. Man of Steel had a 225mil USD budget. That's quite a difference there, and likely accounts for the initial "pay gap" between Gadot and Caville. Conversely, because WW cost less and made more, Gadot's intake from merchandising, bonuses etc. might actually be higher than Cavill's for just this one film. Also, Amy Adams brought in 7 figures just for Man of Steel. So this perceived pay gap has little to nothing to do with sexism and is merely the cause of high profile actors, high profile characters, and budgets.
2. Everyone knows that Terrance Howard was the highest-paid actor in Iron Man, and he didn't return to the franchise due to negotiation over salary.
RE: Joss Whedon directing Batgirl -- I can't think of another director, man or woman, that can do compelling young adult female leads than Joss Whedon. Let's see, he gave us *Buffy* who was way ahead of the times when it came to youthful expressions of feminism and growing into adulthood; *River*, a tragic superheroine with a family to support and care for her when she's not in full beast mode; *Willow*, a super smart witch whom just happens to be a lesbian; *Zoe* from Firefly/Serenity whose arguably the biggest badass and most pragmatic character in that universe; *Darla* whom has a great arc throughout both Buffy and Angel where she transitions from villain to sympathetic mother; *Cordelia* whose arc takes her from being a shallow snotty brat to the heart of the show of Angel... I could go on and on, but it would be extremely tedious. So, if anyone has the chops to tackle a strong, young adult female superhero who is a badass but also grounded, intelligent, and has a heart of gold, it's going to be Whedon.
Wonder Woman made me realize how soulless the other DC films really were (post Nolan). I was never emotionally invested in any characters in Man Of Steel, Batman V Superman or Suicide Squad. Superman's death SHOULD have brought the entire audience to tears, yet I felt absolutely nothing (except cheated). I LIKED the other DC movies as the popcorn action films they are, but as powerful cinematic stories they fall short.
Loved the rounders shout out or whatever you wanna call it. great movie and better accent
The thing about RDJ that people aren't realizing is that he is being both Stark and Reed Richards. Reed was the guy that Parker went to for his science-y and mentor stuff. Would Stark be there if they had Reed from the beginning of the MCU?
I don't know...the scene where she flips the tank was also pretty awesome.
What surprised me is Robin Wrights character is listed in IMDB on Justice League.
Derek Rowe its old news. Robin already let the cat out of the bag that she and Connie Nielsen are in JL. Probably part of the LOTR style opening that explains the Mother Boxes.
I think HBO should drop Watchman and do something like Fables instead. Those comics are lesser known, they have a much bigger world, they have sex, they have violence, and could be improved by being tightened and brought to Tv. Fables is much more HBO's speed and Vertigo/WB own the rights. Watchmen is not going to work like Game of Thrones does.
monokhem well that's my point, we got a fairly decent watchmen movie. Where do they go from there? Fables at least has more to chew on and improve from. Besides Once Upon A Time is just a weak sauce rip off. I think they could do better. I'm also just saying something like that- something that hasn't bee done. I'd love to see Invincible as a show but I doubt that will happen.
Cut It Films omg fables. YES! why has nobody brought this up!? That is such a perfect series for HBO.
monokhem have you read Fables? It doesn't sound like you have. Fables has a tight cast of characters similar to Thrones: Bigby Wolf, Snow, Boy Blue, Flycatcher, Prince Charming, and Red Rose. It's a perfect chance for Noir to hit television in a new and interesting way. Thrones costs millions per episode. The show would be set in modern NYC. That's not nearly as expensive haha. Also I think you are thinking about the video game. There's no forced feminist plot and there are also no weak female characters there are just complicated characters men and women alike, Also, no cultural significance? The whole series is about survivors from an invasion fleeing to NYC. If anything there is an amazing opportunity for a new perspective on the refugee crisis and people being ousted from their home. You clearly have never touched the comics hahahaha
monokhem you just got totally wrecked hahahahaha
Cut It Films the watchmen doesnt have to be known. it just has to be good & true to comics
When was this recorded?! It's over 600 mil.
Wonder Woman was dope
Ask Whedon to come on the show. You would kill it together!
I would like to see, like Marc suggested, a series exploring the greater mythos of Watchmen. The Watchmen film was almost perfectly cast and nearly every alteration to the story felt logical. I'm not interested in watching a lower-budget, lower-risk serialized do-over.
I LOVE Watchmen! I'm down for an HBO series!
I think people are so picky about it! like Whedon makes one mistakes and he's a fucking sexist! the Wonder Woman movie we saw kinda said that everyone in the "real world" was fascinated by her beauty and I think I read something about he describing her just like that... and I say this as somone who is called a "feminazi" pretty much three times a month.
What about the Before Watchmen books that came out recently, couldn't they use some of that to stretch out a couple seasons? I don't know the verdict on any of them but just an idea. pay me, I got ideas! lol
Henry was a known quantity. He had more movies under his belt as leading role. Gal didn't have a known movie history where she was a lead. I hope she gets a ton on the back end. But it should be no mystery about why Henry got paid more for Man of Steel. It's not a male/female thing, it's a resume thing.
"Nothing can kill the Grimace" -Mayor McCheese -Wayne Gretzky -Michael Scott
I don't get why people are busting Joss Whedon's balls over a ten year old script that never made it into production. I honestly believe that without Whedon's previous forays into the world of female heroes, maybe Wonder Woman doesn't come out for another five years or so. He was the guy that showed having an intelligent, intimidating woman as a hero was viable. Sure it didn't hurt that he had Sarah Michelle Geller and a stellar cast ensemble but it was the character that made Buffy such a great show. I'll go to bat for Whedon until he gives me a good reason not to. As far as people being offended by a female hero leading a film, complaining about "SJWs" or whatever, they're idiots. Humanity's nature is to progress. Be it technologically or philosophically, humanity is constantly progressing. If you have a problem with that, maybe think about suicide because that's the only way as a human that you, yourself won't progress.
Mark Bernardin, I'd say the first big internet backlash was the cancellation of firefly!
Guys this already made more money than Man of Steel and it hasn't slowed down. People are loving this chick and the movie
I just wish they'd have had another couple of drafts of WW before shooting, so they could've cleaned up the repetitive exposition, and fixed the third act
welcomeback brothers
As a marvel fanboy ill say watchmen was one of my favorite comic runs of all time, im in no matter what but with the conclusion of the movie, if it took off from there it would be out the comedian and rorschak and those two make it work so well. So hopefully not that, hell they should do alt multiverse stories or something or just non canon stuff who cares theyre amazing
I think Kevin Smith puts down his filmmaking skills way too much. Yes he made Yoga Hosers but he also made Chasing Amy, which stands head and shoulders with any comedic drama today. Jersey Girl gets a bum rap because of the Gigli fall out Ben Affleck and Jen Lopez were toxic to the press. I saw Jersey girl in the theaters and it was almost as good as Chasing Amy in some ways. It's way better than the press made it seem.
They have all of Greek mythology to play with. It would be pretty easy to bring Steve Trevor back. Have some villain like Felix Faust or the Titans open up the gates of Tartarus, the Greek underworld, and unleash the dead on the world. Steve can be among the spirits who return.
Watchmen would make a great HBO series. Zack Snyder's movie was very well done, so of course it does have to live up to at least that. Fables while a good option, I just can't see becoming a very concise series; now, Watchmen could never really be compared to Game of Thrones, the scales of the production are just not comparable. No matter, I really think Watchmen is a great decision, and I'm very excited to see how it goes.
Love the Ming t-shirt Marc.
Justice League meetings will be awkward for Diana if J'onn looks like Steve...
I mean, Henry Cavill was also a notable, though not necessarily well known, actor, he was on The Tudors on Showtime, and he was being considered for James Bond, but was only 22 at the time so Daniel Craig was cast instead. What's Gal Gadot's most notable role before WW? Fast and Furious? Not exactly top notch acting in those movies (which is also why I was a little suspicious of Gal Gadot's casting as WW). It makes a little sense to me if Henry Cavill makes a little more
They should just make another Watchmen movie. I feel like that movie even stands up in today's standards. Especially the over 3 hour directors cut.
It would be great if we could stop reducing people to their sex and/or gender. It informs part of an individual's perspective, but Kevin is talking like it's the only piece of the puzzle that matters.
James MacDonald, well said
Some people would say he shouldn't have directed Yoga Hosers cuz it sucked.
James MacDonald liberals love identity politics, when you don't have logic or reasoning, you pander to lower IQ people.
That's why Brian K Vaughan went to Image Comics for Saga.
What's so hard about an overhead or individual/wireless clip-on mics? You had that setup for crying out loud!
Also... did Whedon write the script he wanted, or the script that he felt the ol horny white suits with the pocketbook would back? We don't know.
I would play Wonder Woman for 5k! And I'm a dude!!
Sure, but I wouldn't see it.
I'd download it lol
I think you should direct a movie for the comic book character Gwenpool.
I love these two guys, my comment is this... Women and Men can work together creating great stuff, the WW/Conan is ok to be handled right by a female writer and a male artist... let us work together to create art!
Thank GOD they had SOME nuance with the WW thing.
Kevin smith, do u think they will have the Watchmen show take place in the DCEU
They really.. really need to bring back the original theme song...
cool
new intro !!
Kevin certainly knows about Warner Bros. studio interference in a DC script.
Wait, Arnold Schwarzenegger's character (essentially), time travelling? Sounds familiar....
They should do the Authority on HBO.
Look kids! It's emperor Ming!
I don't want to through shade, but, I'm not crazy about the new intro music. I kind of liked it better before.
SPOILERS - Steve could of found a grenade and a parachute and survived the explosion in Wonder Woman.
I don´t care if a Movie has a Male of Female Director - I only want that Movie to be good!
Patty and Josh working together would be money rain
alright, let's talk about a few things. Man of Steel made a few hundred million less than Wonder Woman.But when you talk merch sales - Superman is part of (what I like to call) the untouchable 3 - Batman, Superman, and Spiderman.
Wonder Woman has 2 things against her. The first being - she is not the star of her own movie, She is the MacGuffin. It's completely Steve Trevor's movie, without him Wonder Woman has nothing to carry through to the second. The Second is; Wonder Woman is selling against Disney Princesses and Barbie. She is not going to sell like gang busters or a "shit ton" of merch. She is going to fade because she is not profitable also she is up against Baby Groot currently and soon she'll be up against Spiderman (untouchable).
If I were Patty Jenkins, especially since she is more about the art over churning out movies to satisfy fans (basically the money). I wouldn't want to do the 2nd, actually I would outright refuse. I do not know if this is Patty Jenkins' stance. but it would be my thinking, especially when they throw more money at something they expect more control. I admire what Patty Jenkins did with the Steve Trevor movie, since she can't make a second movie that is all about him, it would be better if she walks (actually runs) away from continuing to do Wonder Woman projects.
No news on Superman: Red Son?
Mayor mcCheese just put out a warrant for the Hamburglar...
i love the MING Tshirt Mark
can't wait for Watchmen
Are we headed to a point where only women can direct movies with a female lead, only African Americans can direct a film with an African American lead, and so on? I'm all for diversity, and I'm all for filmmakers from a wide variety of backgrounds and perspectives having the opportunity to tell their stories. But I worry that in our quest for diversity, we might end up further dividing ourselves along these lines.
What if I told you that a character of a specific identity does not HAVE to be acted/directed/drawn/etc. by someone of that same identity?
It's set in the 80s!!! Great thinking; it's chasing the demographic which made it a hit. Plus there are so many great pop culture references to the 80s. It would be even better to have Tim Burton meg it :D Just sayin'...
During the ending, she meets another Wonder Woman - her mom Hippolyta, and she doesn't want to give up her tiara. ... Wonder Woman 3
so happy for Wonder Woman!! 💰💰💰
they should do a Westworld to it. watchmen was completely of its time, related to what was happening at that time. you have to do it relevant to now, not the 80s.
IIRC downey got 350k, and terrence howard was most paid of Iron man 1 too, at least a million; and wouldnt take cut for 2. I thought hemsworth and evans both got 300k for their first movies too (though it'd make sense if Hemsworth did get less for Thor 1 as he was less known). Tom Holland is probably in the same boat right now.
Napi (Chief) is a Demi-god is probably still alive. Could be in the next movie.
Volume is so low
Dear Gods, please don't let Lindelofs Watchmen get greenlit -_-
Chief COULD come back.. apparently he's a demi-God named Napi, sooooo he could theoretically show up somewhere. I think people brought up the old WW script because of him doing the re-shoots for Justice League & people are concerned about what it could become.
nerdist.com/wonder-woman-actor-demi-god-chief/
Interesting. I always thought that Zack Snyder hated "Watchmen" because of his treatment of the film, and was trolling anyone who liked it.
I wish they would discuss the idea of how much of a Wonder Woman's popularity is just hype. I'm really curious about whether there will be some right-sizing of the audience when the heat dies out from the feminist agenda to make these movies succeed.
Speaking of things that are unconventional and unpredictable, if you are not watching Twin Peaks: The Return on Showtime then you are doing yourself a huge disservice. It's some of the best and most imaginative work ever done on television or any medium.
Invite Joss Whedon onto the show! #Amazing
Kevin, I salute you. It takes a certain ability to drop a person's ego. No real way to say this, but some (maybe most) straight white men have an issue when it comes to giving away people t POC and women. I can see how that would be difficult, you do it well.
Marvel / Iron Man saved Robert Downey JR career
I've got that WHAT IF? !! Pimp Conan FTW!!!
Who do you think should play Batgirl?
I think they shud continue the Watchmen from the movie with the same actors!
im hyped for watchmen because i have faith it will be amazing. if moore is upset he can cry more, but i do hope that he gets paid (so he shuts up)
I wish there was a Moon Knight series instead of Watchmen.
Ditto.
well if netflix would get here shit together he should be about of the Defenders
i think watchman is more suitable more a tv show than a movie coz you have more time fleaching out all characters
I'm not sure what fleaching is (and I'm not sure I want to), but I concur.
The pay difference of 300k vs 400k makes sense looking at the character and Cavill had a bigger resumee.
And here is how Gal pronounces her own name (Pretty sure she is right):
ruclips.net/video/-V4XyghZQ-4/видео.html
HBO should do Camelot 3000 comic book to TV show
I think that Bat Girl will serve a market that is starving. Joss or no Joss it will be huge!
Batgirl is more like Buffy so Whedon should be fine. Wonder Woman is one of the harder characters to do. They can't even make a good Superman movie.
A Women directing a female driven film?!? Now that's a crazy idea.
Don't forget about the heroines in the martial arts genre....
Love you guys but Chris Hardwick did not direct twilight 2 it was Chris Weitz.
#thatsthejoke
Technically Cheif can come back, since he is revealed to be a Demi-God by the Writer and Actor.
Come on boys, catch up and watch Spider-Man, I want to hear your opinion on how amazing it is