As far as I’m concerned, it was both Wells and editorials fault for why this run turned out the way it did. Stuff like Mary Jane still being with Paul and becoming Jackpot after the fake kids disappearing , or Kamala Kahn dying in order for her become a mutant, reek of editorial mandates. The stuff that Zeb seemed only to care about was the Tombstone storyline, the sins and the return of the Green Goblin , and of course Rek-Rap, which ughh.
@@AceLM92 One More Day was more... a hope that it could be temporary The fact they keep teasing MJ and Peter Back only for the new writers to set them back... it broke the illusion for many.
Nope we didn’t overreact. This story sucked. Period. This run did everything wrong. Most of all fucking over peter again again. Making him look like the bad guy where Paul is the one who stole mj.
It wasn't the downfall of Spider-Man comics, it was a new low for the gradual descent that the wall crawler was on. The reason Spider-Man sucks now is because he's made to be milked as a cash cow. He's a meaningless caricature, a one trick pony that exists solely for his image. He will never be good again, don't look for it because Marvel Comics doesn't have to prove anything anymore. His comics will sell, no matter how much we loathe them
@@Linklex7 I mean, you say that, but Miles also carries the Spider-Man mantle and he's become fairly popular. I've got nothing against Peter, but I'd honestly prefer him to die/retire and pass the mantle onto someone else if the alternative is keeping him broke and miserable just to maintain a status quo.
Did editorial have a major effect on the outcome of this latest run? Probably, but even if Wells was following orders from the top, he still could have found ways to carry out those orders without ruining many characters in the process. Like let’s say editorial wanted MJ & Peter broken up. Did Wells really have to write that she got stuck in a weird dimension with some random dude and then decided to marry him? He could have chosen to write a subtle and believable breakup but chose all these weird and bizarre directions.
Considering Paul is barely a character (really just a avatar for the fans to channel all their hate)and he's still around after wells left, he was probably a editorial mandate as well.
The peak of ASM since at least 2005/Civil War was Nick Spencer.. which was nothing special, but by being passably entertaining and not insulting Spider-man fans it was the best ASM of the last 20 years. Zeb Wells run is awful but ASM has been stuck in the mud since the days of Joe Quesada running editorial.
Another problem with Zeb Wells is that he clearly only saw the Raimi films and never touched a Spidey comic book. That's why everything feels weird and more miserable for Peter Parker.
@@mayotango1317 ok, and? Zeb Wells got a detail wrong.JMS run said Peter got bit by the spider at age 17(which is wrong). That's not evidence that Wells has never read Spider-Man.
@@mttylerdurden9Peter did get bit by the spider when he was 17. Go back and read the original Stan Lee run. Peter and Daredevil both confirmed this. The whole “he got bit when he was 15” only got retconned in after Ultimate and Spectacular became popular. Stan Lee didn’t have Spider-Man in high school as long as people think. He graduated issue 28
Yes lmao. Everytime he has to write mj he diminishes her importance or makes her suffer physically . That isnt without mentioning how he wrote peter, ben reilly, felicia and janine. So yeah. Keep him writing x-men and other things. Also the one aspect that was criticised of DPW was the only one that was similar to asm. The out of nowhere breakup between vanessa and wade(which unlike here the hinted at a much better futire for them and didnt destroy vanessa fully for it)
Considering I'm a part of the minority that wasn't the biggest fan of deadpool 3's writing, I personally have doubts on his writing skills. That's just me tho
What Nick Lowe said prove that in Marvel Comics they don't want Peter to develop and grow up as a character. Lowe is also editor of the AMS comics. So what the writer wrote have to been approved by him as editor. That's a pity they choose this Path for the character. Personally, I'm not reading anymore the new Spider-man comics. As a reader I want the main character to develop, issue after issue I felt as they cheated with my feeling. I read plenty of old Spidey comics. That are good. There you can see that Stan Lee, Steve Ditko, John Romita Sr. And many others authors that worked with Spider-man wanted the character to grow up. You can clearly see that if you read with attention the "original" Spider-man comics
Omd has to be removed. Nick Lowe has to be fired... And stop defending Zeb Smells.. They ask him to write the flagship of Marvel. You have some power, if you really love the character you can just decline. In this case career wise it would have been better. A lot of Spider-man fans including me won't forgive him for this atrocious run. There is absolutly no valid reason why Maryjane can't be Peters girlfriend. But a character like Shay can. Yes i do think editorial had a big hand in how awful this run was. But all i am saying as a writer you can stil steer the ship. But Zeb came up with Paul...Zeb came up with rekrap. Zeb came up with chasm. Zeb made Tombstone a notorious c lvl gangster into Spider-man A lvl threat. ..ok i can tell i'm still a tad overly aggrevated. Sorry if i upset or offended anyone.. Nick Lowe must go away... And eight deaths will just continue the torture of Spider-man. I'm skipping it i'm not into torture.
Do you remember Nick Spencer? He tried to use his run to undo OMD and Joe Quesada actually showed up and tore into Nick trying such a thing and they took him off the book. The writers can’t just “fix Spider-Man” cause the higher ups will just stomp that idea to the ground,
@@MclucasrvThat’s true. People need to stop buying the books and that’s the only way it’ll get better. Spider-Man is too big to be cancelled. So it’s not like they’ll just get rid of it forever, but low sales will convince them they need to change course
I blame editorial of one nicke lowe. His insufferable and clownish behavior is killing the title meanwhile spider-man appearing in other books is treated with more respect then his own spinoff books!!
It was the opposite. The editor is one deciding what they want Spider-Man and the writer can’t say no. Remember how Joe Quesada tore into Nick Spencer for dating to try to undo One More Day. Joe Quesada and Nick Lowe are more responsible for Spider-Man’s downfall more than any writer of the last 20 years.
There are a few signs Zeb Wells wasn't writing a script he was inspired by but a script by wditorial decree. Mary Jane as Jackpot and Hallows Eve seem to have the same power set. Paul is an ancillary character with no personal motivation. The kids were literally erased, seemingly because they were naratively inconvenient. Black Cat is a girl friend but not romatic. Black Cat was there to fill a girl friend narative hole.
Here is the thing while yes editorial played a big hand in this, Zeb even before this run was horrible for the Spider corner of the Marvel Universe. He was the one that wrote what we of the Venom fandom consider Venom's OMD, Venom Dark Origin. Thankfully Donny restored Lethal Protector back to being the true origins of Eddie Brock but like Nick Spencer (who was horrible with Captain America) maybe he should be writing for Deadpool or the X-Men instead.
He only had a hand in writing and you know what’s funny he broke up wade and Vanessa. Doesn’t that sound familiar to a recent ASM run that should just burn in hell for doing the same thing
Well he is equally to blame as well for the Editorials that really want Peter Parker to stay immature and do the same thing all over again but it kinda shows that Peter Parker way is outdated and I was thinking about Batman Caped Crusader that we should try to subvert expectations and like Miles say I gotta do my own thing.
Honestly this was basically both sides fault on this one, oh don’t get me wrong zeb wells has done good stuff and i respect that but his writing on Spider-Man as a whole especially the way he wrote Peter Parker and Mary Jane was freaking garbage and complete slap in the face for us Spider-Man fans who a been begging for the return of Peter Parker and Mary Jane back as a couple for decades at this point but that’s just my opinion. However as much I want to put the blame on him, I don’t think everything he did on this book was on him. Oh no I think the main problem of his run comes down to basically editorial who are so hellbent and garbage logic of not allowing Peter Parker Spider-Man not being able to develop as a character and move forward with his life is the real prime problem with Spider-Man comics as a whole, and until somebody anyone at the top realizes that these assholes in charge of Spider-Man comics don’t know what they are doing and gets rid of these idiots nothing is going to change sadly. Which is just isn’t fair because if there one character who should be able to develop and move forward as a character it should be Spider-Man peter Parker allowed to grow up get remarried to his wife Mary Jane and they have there daughter mayday Parker spider girl alive and kicking Mephisto ass would be spectacular pun intended. My point is in conclusion the main problem with Spider-Man comics isn’t the writer it’s more of editorial who refuse to grow up and get with the times at this point and let Peter Parker Spider-Man to grow up and moved forward as a whole at least in my opinion.
@@TevyaSmolka by the way I found another commenter who replied to another comment on this video said that while he can't find it, there was a video where Wells apologized and acknowledged the Peter and MJ relationship thing. Another commenter on this video also said that he met him at the Montreal Comic Con this year and said he sounded like a real professional. And when he signed the copy of the first issue he gently added "Fuck Paul Rabin". It makes me wonder if there was some other factor going on behind the scenes, and if it was meant to be handled better then it was.
I would say yes & no. Yes Wells did made Spider-Man’s life more miserable, but it feels like he had no choice (or something). Like maybe he done it to make a better story, but that ended up as bad as you can get. Maybe Zeb didn’t know much of Spidey’s history (heck even I haven’t read all of the ASM issues) but the point is you could have listened to the fans. Or read what they have posted about Spider-Man.
100% correct, there is zero development of the character last 25 years. That’s why all the recent writers are on repeat. It actually seems he is de-aged. Hence bendis and hickman’s USM runs are more interesting and Zdarsky’s Life Story was an hit
I met Zeb Wells at Montréal comic-con this year. I interviewed him and he was a real professional. He even signed my Amazing Spider-Man #1 'Fuck Paul Rabin'. He added (gently), which made it funnier.
Great video as always,I think that a substantial but not the entire part of the story is his fault,there’s always the Hollywood story of someone having an amazing script just for the final product to end up pretty bad because too many people got their hands on it,but when it comes to comics,there’s less but still are people who drive the quality of the book, but from my understanding some big books like FF work on pitches,where the best one gets the job,so while Wells was on during Beyond,his pitch might have came before or after he was already on the book,but he probably still had one,and one that the editorial liked or aligned with what they were looking for so a substantial part of the ideas,some of the villains,and different story points came from him,I guess I would say that he was partially involved in the big ideas,and the structure,but a substantial part was editorial but as for the quality of the writing I think it fell to him,like to a degree he might have not always been involved in the end results of character interactions and plot points,but was tasked on working up to those results
Yes it was his fault, along with others. And we don’t know to what extent he contributed to Deadpool 3. Honestly would we really miss out much if he wasn’t on staff for that film? So long as Ryan Reynolds heads the Deadpool franchise it’s going to be good. So Well’s merits on Deadpool 3 is dubious, his name is on the credits but that doesn’t say much. Raimi’s name is on Dr. Strange 3 and we know he could do better, but we got a barely mediocre product instead. Names on credits don’t equate to merits or lack thereof. What we do know is the quality of Well’s run was unsatisfactory for many fans, was it his fault alone? No. But it was his fault to write such a story. May he never write another comic again. Good riddance.
I’d say yes. It is his and editorials fault because the feeling of backtracking Peter’s development back to that status quo was done in the beginning of the book so Wells did know what he was getting into as he did still put his name onto the book for those 2 years unlike most other asm writers where you feel the weight of editorial more towards the end of their runs I.e Nick Spencer run
Zeb Wells recently signed to Rick remenders Giant Generator imprint at image comics. This is probably the best thing he could do right now. Hopefully he won't have to deal with Spider-Man fans wanting his head on a platter for long.
As another comic book RUclipsr said "The amazing Spider-Man is a dream crushing factory. Every writer who's worked on the book (since JMS)has come out of it worse for wear."
The end of the day the blame has always fallen under two people Joe Quesada (who’s publicly admitted he’s always hated Mary Jane and Peter Parker graduating High School) & Nick Lowe (who is just Joe’s lackey at this point). Look at Nick Spencer, he tried to undo One More Day, and Joe Quesada (who doesn’t even deal with the comics anymore) came down from his perch and tear Spencer a new one. Even if Zeb wanted to do Spider-Man right, Quesada & Lowe would just squash it.
Simple answer yes it is zebs fault Nick Spencer improved Peter as a character while Nick Lowe was still there and zeb brought peter so far down the new ultimate universe became better within just a few issues how sad is that so again simple answer yes it is zebs fault
Hilariously, one of the main things (probably even the only primary thing) that people have criticized about Deadpool & Wolverine is it's subpar writing. Point still stands, Zeb sucks
I got a controversial onion here. Paul did nothing wrong. I hate him too. BUT if you were in his place you'd prolly do the same things. MJ had to be character assassinated for the plot to work. Also the reason why most love interests for peter never stays, he usually hops between felicia and mj, and sometimes bring gwen back every once in a while, is writers don't what to write the slow burn of the characters being integrated into Peter's life. That would mean, like mj, you introduce her and make her acquainted before setting up a romance plot. Another controversial onion. Spiderman isn't really relatable anymore. He also isn't inspirational either. By not adding development to the character he's slowly going stale.
Getting really tired from statements like that, where they defend Wells, that he was innocent and it's all the editorial's fault. I'm leaving a link for a an interview with Well, where he says that "he never wrote anything he hasn't vouched for" when he was writing ASM (4:50 - 4:57) ruclips.net/video/S3ZHwDFGjo0/видео.htmlsi=x8VNjrKp_DMuZxk5 Wells is just as much at fault as the editorial itself. Also, using the DP&W movie for a defense is just ridiculous - he was also a writer for "The Marvels" and that movie didn't became a hit ...
Don't try to use the fact that she was a co-writer on Deadpool and Wolverine as a reason why I was such a good writer what is he a good writer because you're only best friendly known for your last run and so far everybody's going to know him for this lackluster Spider-Man nobody cares that he wrote a movie people care about his comic book work and his comic book work was dog crap because she didn't set up the mystery if you're going to do a mystery do it right or don't do it at all and it was convoluted as hell there was really no reason for it and then knowing that the audience don't want to see Peter Parker and Mary Jane separate You're still kept them separate and get doubled and triple down on it I don't know You're kind of a warrior and then you kept making Peter Parker evil several times over you know Peter Parker really was barely part of some of his own plots and The amazing Spider-Man run I don't know I feel like that's a terrible writer regardless if he wrote Deadpool and Wolverine which co-right which means he needed a co-writer for his amazing Spider-Man run
I normally agree with a lot you say but this time I simply can’t. While I will agree that editorial have some blame here, both for setting the climate for the book and not challenging poor decisions, this was clearly what Wells wanted to write, and it was the darkest most miserable run I’ve read in a long time. “MJ treats Peter like garbage in defence of an accessory to genocide.” I’m sorry but MJ never acts like MJ this whole frigging run. I can’t remember where I read it, but IIRC Lowe said Wells was not brought in just to split them up. I believe it was Wells who said he wanted to write a run where Peter wanted to be with MJ but couldn’t, and wanted to pull the rug on fans. At the very least he is responsible for the goddamn awful “What Did Peter Do” opening that dragged on for a year with everyone in peters life treating him like garbage only to reveal all he did was be a hero and save MJ without saying please a few times. That was it. Utter brain rot. And Peter getting dominated by Vulture and having a hard time against Tombstone? Peter looking up to Norman like a father? The FF who are like family to Peter giving him a hard time? The Goblins sins acting like an independent entity? Please. It’s like the man never cracked open an SM comic. I wouldn’t lean too heavily into him being a writer on DP and W in his defence. He was A WRITER. Not THE Writer. We have no idea which bits he wrote. And really, the plot was ass. I enjoyed it for the fan service, I mean REALLY enjoyed it, but the plot was nothing. What little plot there was? DP breaking up with Vanessa for crappy reasons. Wonder where we heard that before… The one thing I won’t blame on Zeb is Jackpot. That has the stink of editorial all over it…
Well maybe you can ask him if you meet him. After all the only way to know our sure is to go to the source. Also there is another comment where someone said he met him at a convention and he whispered "Bleep" Paul. So who knows.
@@disneyboy3030 well, I recall someone who met him at a convention saying he had said he wanted to do the MJ story as he wanted to pull the rug on fans. Of course I only have that commenters word for it, just like many things you hear. But I think there was some comment he made somewhere else too directly about it, about MJ being the obvious endgame but this was the “they can’t be together” story he wanted to write. Am sure that Lowe was always 100% backing it though. I recall people discussing on Reddit one panel where he and Wells were present they got booed for trying to suggest there was nothing particularly special about MJ and she was just one of many love interests for SM. Lowe also described MJ and Paul as married at a panel, then claimed that was only a mistake in one bit of blurb and they are not married. He also wrote an editors note that “we like Paul” after he was introduced. So while he may have claimed Wells was not brought in to split them up, Lowe was clearly very much in agreement with it.
@@jonathanl-j4i well this is where things get interesting on Wells side because another commenter who replied to another comment on this video said that while he can't find it, there was a video where Wells apologized and acknowledged the Peter and MJ relationship thing. Another commenter on this video also said that he met him at the Montreal Comic Con this year and said he sounded like a real professional. And when he signed the copy of the first issue he gently added "Fuck Paul Rabin". It makes me wonder if there was some other factor going on behind the scenes, and if it was meant to be handled better then it was.
As far as I’m concerned, it was both Wells and editorials fault for why this run turned out the way it did. Stuff like Mary Jane still being with Paul and becoming Jackpot after the fake kids disappearing , or Kamala Kahn dying in order for her become a mutant, reek of editorial mandates. The stuff that Zeb seemed only to care about was the Tombstone storyline, the sins and the return of the Green Goblin , and of course Rek-Rap, which ughh.
It was the start of the downfall of the comic books of Spider-Man but luckily we have the new Ultimate Spider-Man and the new Spectacular Spider-Man
The start of the downfall? You never read one more day did you?
The disrespect spectacular Spider-Men comic has been getting makes me sad
Why is everyone dissing Miles Morales: Spider-Man?
@@AceLM92 One More Day was more... a hope that it could be temporary
The fact they keep teasing MJ and Peter Back only for the new writers to set them back... it broke the illusion for many.
@gotmog22 ..."a hope that it could be temporary?" Can I buy some pot from you?
Nope we didn’t overreact. This story sucked. Period.
This run did everything wrong. Most of all fucking over peter again again. Making him look like the bad guy where Paul is the one who stole mj.
It wasn't the downfall of Spider-Man comics, it was a new low for the gradual descent that the wall crawler was on.
The reason Spider-Man sucks now is because he's made to be milked as a cash cow. He's a meaningless caricature, a one trick pony that exists solely for his image. He will never be good again, don't look for it because Marvel Comics doesn't have to prove anything anymore. His comics will sell, no matter how much we loathe them
Problem is Spider-Man isn’t a character anymore. He’s a brand, and you can never change a brand.
@@Linklex7 I mean, you say that, but Miles also carries the Spider-Man mantle and he's become fairly popular. I've got nothing against Peter, but I'd honestly prefer him to die/retire and pass the mantle onto someone else if the alternative is keeping him broke and miserable just to maintain a status quo.
Did editorial have a major effect on the outcome of this latest run? Probably, but even if Wells was following orders from the top, he still could have found ways to carry out those orders without ruining many characters in the process. Like let’s say editorial wanted MJ & Peter broken up. Did Wells really have to write that she got stuck in a weird dimension with some random dude and then decided to marry him? He could have chosen to write a subtle and believable breakup but chose all these weird and bizarre directions.
Hard to make a subtle and believable breakup with Peter and MJ.
Considering Paul is barely a character (really just a avatar for the fans to channel all their hate)and he's still around after wells left, he was probably a editorial mandate as well.
Not all. John Ronita Jr also deserves some blame for all of that godawful art.
Ed Mcguinness carried the art and he should’ve been the main artist of the book
The peak of ASM since at least 2005/Civil War was Nick Spencer.. which was nothing special, but by being passably entertaining and not insulting Spider-man fans it was the best ASM of the last 20 years.
Zeb Wells run is awful but ASM has been stuck in the mud since the days of Joe Quesada running editorial.
Another problem with Zeb Wells is that he clearly only saw the Raimi films and never touched a Spidey comic book. That's why everything feels weird and more miserable for Peter Parker.
Yeah I think the Raimi influence has done a lot of harm to Spider-Man in the long run
That doesn't make any sense.
@mttylerdurden9 Norman Osborn never was a "father" to Peter. He always was a creepy weirdo in the comics.
@@mayotango1317 ok, and? Zeb Wells got a detail wrong.JMS run said Peter got bit by the spider at age 17(which is wrong). That's not evidence that Wells has never read Spider-Man.
@@mttylerdurden9Peter did get bit by the spider when he was 17. Go back and read the original Stan Lee run. Peter and Daredevil both confirmed this. The whole “he got bit when he was 15” only got retconned in after Ultimate and Spectacular became popular. Stan Lee didn’t have Spider-Man in high school as long as people think. He graduated issue 28
The editorial acolytes of Joe Q. need to pass from power. Then there will be progress.
Take a shot every time Lewis says “was this really Zeb Wells fault?”
Damn you be drunk lmao
😂@@LewisFilmsProductions
@@LewisFilmsProductions I can't find it anywhere but I know he issued an apology to all the fans before his ran began.
@@Ando1428man alot of people don't know that. What did he say.
@@disneyboy3030 he acknowledged Peter and mj being together and said to all who read this he's sorry for who it would hurt.
Yes lmao. Everytime he has to write mj he diminishes her importance or makes her suffer physically . That isnt without mentioning how he wrote peter, ben reilly, felicia and janine. So yeah. Keep him writing x-men and other things. Also the one aspect that was criticised of DPW was the only one that was similar to asm. The out of nowhere breakup between vanessa and wade(which unlike here the hinted at a much better futire for them and didnt destroy vanessa fully for it)
Considering I'm a part of the minority that wasn't the biggest fan of deadpool 3's writing, I personally have doubts on his writing skills. That's just me tho
They clearly need to fire the editorial and bring people who can actually do their job
Yes it really was his fault
What Nick Lowe said prove that in Marvel Comics they don't want Peter to develop and grow up as a character. Lowe is also editor of the AMS comics. So what the writer wrote have to been approved by him as editor. That's a pity they choose this Path for the character. Personally, I'm not reading anymore the new Spider-man comics. As a reader I want the main character to develop, issue after issue I felt as they cheated with my feeling. I read plenty of old Spidey comics. That are good. There you can see that Stan Lee, Steve Ditko, John Romita Sr. And many others authors that worked with Spider-man wanted the character to grow up. You can clearly see that if you read with attention the "original" Spider-man comics
Omd has to be removed.
Nick Lowe has to be fired...
And stop defending Zeb Smells..
They ask him to write the flagship of Marvel.
You have some power, if you really love the character you can just decline.
In this case career wise it would have been better.
A lot of Spider-man fans including me won't forgive him for this atrocious run.
There is absolutly no valid reason why Maryjane can't be Peters girlfriend.
But a character like Shay can.
Yes i do think editorial had a big hand in how awful this run was.
But all i am saying as a writer you can stil steer the ship.
But Zeb came up with Paul...Zeb came up with rekrap.
Zeb came up with chasm.
Zeb made Tombstone a notorious c lvl gangster into Spider-man A lvl threat.
..ok i can tell i'm still a tad overly aggrevated.
Sorry if i upset or offended anyone..
Nick Lowe must go away...
And eight deaths will just continue the torture of Spider-man.
I'm skipping it i'm not into torture.
I mean if people keep buyingit should they really fired him? I think until the sales are hurt he will keep there doing fuck up shit.
Do you remember Nick Spencer? He tried to use his run to undo OMD and Joe Quesada actually showed up and tore into Nick trying such a thing and they took him off the book. The writers can’t just “fix Spider-Man” cause the higher ups will just stomp that idea to the ground,
@@MclucasrvThat’s true. People need to stop buying the books and that’s the only way it’ll get better. Spider-Man is too big to be cancelled. So it’s not like they’ll just get rid of it forever, but low sales will convince them they need to change course
I blame editorial of one nicke lowe. His insufferable and clownish behavior is killing the title meanwhile spider-man appearing in other books is treated with more respect then his own spinoff books!!
I mean, he was the writer but the editor could have told him no
It was the opposite. The editor is one deciding what they want Spider-Man and the writer can’t say no. Remember how Joe Quesada tore into Nick Spencer for dating to try to undo One More Day. Joe Quesada and Nick Lowe are more responsible for Spider-Man’s downfall more than any writer of the last 20 years.
There are a few signs Zeb Wells wasn't writing a script he was inspired by but a script by wditorial decree.
Mary Jane as Jackpot and Hallows Eve seem to have the same power set.
Paul is an ancillary character with no personal motivation.
The kids were literally erased, seemingly because they were naratively inconvenient.
Black Cat is a girl friend but not romatic. Black Cat was there to fill a girl friend narative hole.
Here is the thing while yes editorial played a big hand in this, Zeb even before this run was horrible for the Spider corner of the Marvel Universe. He was the one that wrote what we of the Venom fandom consider Venom's OMD, Venom Dark Origin. Thankfully Donny restored Lethal Protector back to being the true origins of Eddie Brock but like Nick Spencer (who was horrible with Captain America) maybe he should be writing for Deadpool or the X-Men instead.
He only had a hand in writing and you know what’s funny he broke up wade and Vanessa. Doesn’t that sound familiar to a recent ASM run that should just burn in hell for doing the same thing
Well he is equally to blame as well for the Editorials that really want Peter Parker to stay immature and do the same thing all over again but it kinda shows that Peter Parker way is outdated and I was thinking about Batman Caped Crusader that we should try to subvert expectations and like Miles say I gotta do my own thing.
Batman Cape Crusader show that Batman is a jerk, always a jerk.
@@mayotango1317not entirely
Honestly this was basically both sides fault on this one, oh don’t get me wrong zeb wells has done good stuff and i respect that but his writing on Spider-Man as a whole especially the way he wrote Peter Parker and Mary Jane was freaking garbage and complete slap in the face for us Spider-Man fans who a been begging for the return of Peter Parker and Mary Jane back as a couple for decades at this point but that’s just my opinion. However as much I want to put the blame on him, I don’t think everything he did on this book was on him. Oh no I think the main problem of his run comes down to basically editorial who are so hellbent and garbage logic of not allowing Peter Parker Spider-Man not being able to develop as a character and move forward with his life is the real prime problem with Spider-Man comics as a whole, and until somebody anyone at the top realizes that these assholes in charge of Spider-Man comics don’t know what they are doing and gets rid of these idiots nothing is going to change sadly. Which is just isn’t fair because if there one character who should be able to develop and move forward as a character it should be Spider-Man peter Parker allowed to grow up get remarried to his wife Mary Jane and they have there daughter mayday Parker spider girl alive and kicking Mephisto ass would be spectacular pun intended. My point is in conclusion the main problem with Spider-Man comics isn’t the writer it’s more of editorial who refuse to grow up and get with the times at this point and let Peter Parker Spider-Man to grow up and moved forward as a whole at least in my opinion.
Why not send a letter to Kevin Feige himself to demand that Nick be removed.
@ I don’t think he’s
care
@@TevyaSmolka it wouldn't help to try.
@@disneyboy3030 true and you are right about that
@@TevyaSmolka by the way I found another commenter who replied to another comment on this video said that while he can't find it, there was a video where Wells apologized and acknowledged the Peter and MJ relationship thing. Another commenter on this video also said that he met him at the Montreal Comic Con this year and said he sounded like a real professional. And when he signed the copy of the first issue he gently added "Fuck Paul Rabin". It makes me wonder if there was some other factor going on behind the scenes, and if it was meant to be handled better then it was.
I would say yes & no. Yes Wells did made Spider-Man’s life more miserable, but it feels like he had no choice (or something). Like maybe he done it to make a better story, but that ended up as bad as you can get. Maybe Zeb didn’t know much of Spidey’s history (heck even I haven’t read all of the ASM issues) but the point is you could have listened to the fans. Or read what they have posted about Spider-Man.
I think an interview can help clear things up.
@ Do you know the name of the interview, the one with Wells in it?
@@kevin-2.1 I meant for someone to do an interview.
100% correct, there is zero development of the character last 25 years. That’s why all the recent writers are on repeat. It actually seems he is de-aged. Hence bendis and hickman’s USM runs are more interesting and Zdarsky’s Life Story was an hit
I met Zeb Wells at Montréal comic-con this year. I interviewed him and he was a real professional. He even signed my Amazing Spider-Man #1 'Fuck Paul Rabin'. He added (gently), which made it funnier.
Really. Did you ask about what was going on behind the scenes.
@@disneyboy3030 I doubt he could have answered that
@@mttylerdurden9 wouldn't hurt to try.
@@disneyboy3030 not if Wells was under an N.D.A
It was so bad it make it made drop the series don’t care about 8 deaths or what’s to come
Sorry but this run is just hell. Zeb Wells ruin Spider-Man forever.
@@mayotango1317 he was "ruined* way before this.
Great video as always,I think that a substantial but not the entire part of the story is his fault,there’s always the Hollywood story of someone having an amazing script just for the final product to end up pretty bad because too many people got their hands on it,but when it comes to comics,there’s less but still are people who drive the quality of the book, but from my understanding some big books like FF work on pitches,where the best one gets the job,so while Wells was on during Beyond,his pitch might have came before or after he was already on the book,but he probably still had one,and one that the editorial liked or aligned with what they were looking for so a substantial part of the ideas,some of the villains,and different story points came from him,I guess I would say that he was partially involved in the big ideas,and the structure,but a substantial part was editorial but as for the quality of the writing I think it fell to him,like to a degree he might have not always been involved in the end results of character interactions and plot points,but was tasked on working up to those results
An interview may help explain things.
Yes it was his fault, along with others.
And we don’t know to what extent he contributed to Deadpool 3.
Honestly would we really miss out much if he wasn’t on staff for that film? So long as Ryan Reynolds heads the Deadpool franchise it’s going to be good.
So Well’s merits on Deadpool 3 is dubious, his name is on the credits but that doesn’t say much.
Raimi’s name is on Dr. Strange 3 and we know he could do better, but we got a barely mediocre product instead. Names on credits don’t equate to merits or lack thereof.
What we do know is the quality of Well’s run was unsatisfactory for many fans, was it his fault alone? No. But it was his fault to write such a story.
May he never write another comic again. Good riddance.
You know he worked on good stuff before this run.
When are you going back to LewisFiction?
I always liked his work on New Mutants and Hellions, I think he works best with mutants (including Wolverine of course)
Zeb Wells also wrote Hellions, New mutants, New warriors, and carnage USA. He's a pretty good writer.
I’d say yes. It is his and editorials fault because the feeling of backtracking Peter’s development back to that status quo was done in the beginning of the book so Wells did know what he was getting into as he did still put his name onto the book for those 2 years unlike most other asm writers where you feel the weight of editorial more towards the end of their runs I.e Nick Spencer run
Zeb Wells recently signed to Rick remenders Giant Generator imprint at image comics. This is probably the best thing he could do right now. Hopefully he won't have to deal with Spider-Man fans wanting his head on a platter for long.
As another comic book RUclipsr said "The amazing Spider-Man is a dream crushing factory. Every writer who's worked on the book (since JMS)has come out of it worse for wear."
The end of the day the blame has always fallen under two people Joe Quesada (who’s publicly admitted he’s always hated Mary Jane and Peter Parker graduating High School) & Nick Lowe (who is just Joe’s lackey at this point). Look at Nick Spencer, he tried to undo One More Day, and Joe Quesada (who doesn’t even deal with the comics anymore) came down from his perch and tear Spencer a new one. Even if Zeb wanted to do Spider-Man right, Quesada & Lowe would just squash it.
I blame both editorials and Zeb Wells.
Simple answer yes it is zebs fault Nick Spencer improved Peter as a character while Nick Lowe was still there and zeb brought peter so far down the new ultimate universe became better within just a few issues how sad is that so again simple answer yes it is zebs fault
Hilariously, one of the main things (probably even the only primary thing) that people have criticized about Deadpool & Wolverine is it's subpar writing. Point still stands, Zeb sucks
I feel like zeb wells just read one more day and said ok so i'll do that except somehow way worse
I got a controversial onion here. Paul did nothing wrong. I hate him too. BUT if you were in his place you'd prolly do the same things. MJ had to be character assassinated for the plot to work.
Also the reason why most love interests for peter never stays, he usually hops between felicia and mj, and sometimes bring gwen back every once in a while, is writers don't what to write the slow burn of the characters being integrated into Peter's life. That would mean, like mj, you introduce her and make her acquainted before setting up a romance plot.
Another controversial onion. Spiderman isn't really relatable anymore. He also isn't inspirational either. By not adding development to the character he's slowly going stale.
Getting really tired from statements like that, where they defend Wells, that he was innocent and it's all the editorial's fault. I'm leaving a link for a an interview with Well, where he says that "he never wrote anything he hasn't vouched for" when he was writing ASM (4:50 - 4:57)
ruclips.net/video/S3ZHwDFGjo0/видео.htmlsi=x8VNjrKp_DMuZxk5
Wells is just as much at fault as the editorial itself.
Also, using the DP&W movie for a defense is just ridiculous - he was also a writer for "The Marvels" and that movie didn't became a hit ...
Dude, Zeb Wells viciously retaliates against Mary Jane for his divorce. He doesn't deserve you defending him.
I can't wait for Marvel to announce the new writer of amazing Spider-Man:
Rick Sanchez
Please
The downfall started with OMD, honestly
Awww yes
Deadpool & wolverine was not that good mate it's was mid ass cash grab
Zeb Wells was a writer on Deadpool and Wolverine?
That explains a lot!
So....he's just a bad writer.
I disagree with you that
y’all like deadpool and wolverine for its writing?
No it was editorial
Also yes zed just sucks at writing spidermam
This zeb well fault
Don't try to use the fact that she was a co-writer on Deadpool and Wolverine as a reason why I was such a good writer what is he a good writer because you're only best friendly known for your last run and so far everybody's going to know him for this lackluster Spider-Man nobody cares that he wrote a movie people care about his comic book work and his comic book work was dog crap because she didn't set up the mystery if you're going to do a mystery do it right or don't do it at all and it was convoluted as hell there was really no reason for it and then knowing that the audience don't want to see Peter Parker and Mary Jane separate You're still kept them separate and get doubled and triple down on it I don't know You're kind of a warrior and then you kept making Peter Parker evil several times over you know Peter Parker really was barely part of some of his own plots and The amazing Spider-Man run I don't know I feel like that's a terrible writer regardless if he wrote Deadpool and Wolverine which co-right which means he needed a co-writer for his amazing Spider-Man run
don't you mean he not she.
Haha yeah
I normally agree with a lot you say but this time I simply can’t.
While I will agree that editorial have some blame here, both for setting the climate for the book and not challenging poor decisions, this was clearly what Wells wanted to write, and it was the darkest most miserable run I’ve read in a long time. “MJ treats Peter like garbage in defence of an accessory to genocide.” I’m sorry but MJ never acts like MJ this whole frigging run.
I can’t remember where I read it, but IIRC Lowe said Wells was not brought in just to split them up. I believe it was Wells who said he wanted to write a run where Peter wanted to be with MJ but couldn’t, and wanted to pull the rug on fans. At the very least he is responsible for the goddamn awful “What Did Peter Do” opening that dragged on for a year with everyone in peters life treating him like garbage only to reveal all he did was be a hero and save MJ without saying please a few times. That was it. Utter brain rot.
And Peter getting dominated by Vulture and having a hard time against Tombstone? Peter looking up to Norman like a father? The FF who are like family to Peter giving him a hard time? The Goblins sins acting like an independent entity? Please. It’s like the man never cracked open an SM comic.
I wouldn’t lean too heavily into him being a writer on DP and W in his defence. He was A WRITER. Not THE Writer. We have no idea which bits he wrote. And really, the plot was ass. I enjoyed it for the fan service, I mean REALLY enjoyed it, but the plot was nothing. What little plot there was? DP breaking up with Vanessa for crappy reasons. Wonder where we heard that before…
The one thing I won’t blame on Zeb is Jackpot. That has the stink of editorial all over it…
Well maybe you can ask him if you meet him. After all the only way to know our sure is to go to the source. Also there is another comment where someone said he met him at a convention and he whispered "Bleep" Paul. So who knows.
@@disneyboy3030 well, I recall someone who met him at a convention saying he had said he wanted to do the MJ story as he wanted to pull the rug on fans. Of course I only have that commenters word for it, just like many things you hear. But I think there was some comment he made somewhere else too directly about it, about MJ being the obvious endgame but this was the “they can’t be together” story he wanted to write.
Am sure that Lowe was always 100% backing it though. I recall people discussing on Reddit one panel where he and Wells were present they got booed for trying to suggest there was nothing particularly special about MJ and she was just one of many love interests for SM. Lowe also described MJ and Paul as married at a panel, then claimed that was only a mistake in one bit of blurb and they are not married. He also wrote an editors note that “we like Paul” after he was introduced. So while he may have claimed Wells was not brought in to split them up, Lowe was clearly very much in agreement with it.
@@jonathanl-j4i well this is where things get interesting on Wells side because another commenter who replied to another comment on this video said that while he can't find it, there was a video where Wells apologized and acknowledged the Peter and MJ relationship thing. Another commenter on this video also said that he met him at the Montreal Comic Con this year and said he sounded like a real professional. And when he signed the copy of the first issue he gently added "Fuck Paul Rabin". It makes me wonder if there was some other factor going on behind the scenes, and if it was meant to be handled better then it was.