Something not mentioned was CQC, while the combat is different enough and the lives are so quick I wouldn't say there is a ton of value in developing skill (though some), I think there is a lot of value in getting used to facing human commanders instead of bots. It's a good place to learn to control your emotions in a fight and get used to losing to someone over and over and not become enraged, all at no risk whatsoever to your finances. It's also very fun.
True - and that's for a specific reason, as I'm working on a video specifically about CQC as it really is a different type of flying to PvP. It's fantastic, don't get me wrong, but very different.
I really don't feel like I can get used to flight assist off, not having any rotational counterforce just makes me motion sick. Eh, I've always got lateral thrusters to use at least.
Fdev really needs to add an uncoupled FA on mode. There's literally no reason not to other than elitism. Their official explanation is "hurr durr we want it to be hard", which is a stupid stance since they also give MKB players an easy mode with relative mouse.
lol you don't have to, just to make manouver quickly you can always be behind of your enemies that why we use flight assist ON and OFF i think you got the message now lol
? Maybe try thermal rounds? They'll come off super quick (sometimes). Also use one or two pa's. Most cmdrs have resistances, so a few pa's will go a long way.
Large ships are good in PVE situations EG: RES sites, conflict zones and so on, theres nothing I love more than the anaconda in a haz res site or conflict zone. But in pvp, those sorts of ships just dont have the speed or maneuverability to really work, a chieftain in particular can go to town on all the big three ships. But I do like that about elite though, that the best pvp ships aren't the ships that are the biggest and most expensive, but are quite affordable. And yes, the shields on bigger ships are undoubtedly stronger, with the right weapons it wont really matter.
Jesus chrsit so many engineers needed. So far i havent played pvp, just did things to gain credits and rank (road to riches, passenger missions, combat missions, transport and so on) , somewhen i started engineering my fsd drive for larger jumprage , farming mats has been a huge pain in the a**. Imaging doing this for 8 other Engineers - i feel devastated already x)
Nice. Concise and to the point. San tu discord to learn pvp is also a nice place to start. Pvp can be very fun but be prepared to be destroyed 100 times before starting to do something enjoy the learning process. And be the fun with you CMDRs !
So they went the WoW route. I played WoW for years, and I have played Elite from day one. Seeing some things from the WoW type of grind in this game and I don't get it. In WoW they keep you grinding, because they get a monthly subscription from the players. Elite, however, does not charge a monthly sub, so why the grind. Genuinely curious.
I'm assuming its the developers wish to make it grindy as almost all aspects of the game are grinds. A friend and I actually really love grinding, go figure haha. My buddy got his corvette from nothing in a couple days. I think it just comes down to enjoying the grind. Some people do some people don't, like everything else in life. I personally enjoy cutting virtual trees but not everyone does. My best guess is that your development just simply loves the grind as I do
Because it's life in game, and in real life you also have to grind to make for a living. Elite allows me to quickly get enormous amount of credits (from painite mining) and spend on whatever I like. The grind is needed so the game would not be boring too fast and it keeps us playing. Grinding elements on the planets for example is quite fun to do from time to time.
its not that big of a grind if you deep core mining.. All you need is a keelback (cost 3 M, make it 4 M with the average mining equipment) and you can earn easily 20M to 30M an hour. Just got it this week and after like 3 cargo drop of minerals, I got a Krait-II (a 45 M ship). I'm grinding faster than I can handle those new ships tbh, making money is fast but learning/applying all the stuff in the game takes the longest
Because the devs think that grinding is fun. The only way to get engineering materials in any reasonable amount of time involves borderline exploits to farm them.
If someone is wanted, I will interdict with crimes on and instantly open fire. I just make the assumption that they're out ganking weak ships and they deserve to face the swarm.
That's totally valid since you're doing organic pvp and not arranged fights, although I'd still encourage you to attack them with "report crimes" turned off as the NPCs that spawn in can cause lag in the instance. Also, although it's probably not very common in practice, those NPC cops can actually steal your kill and deprive you of what little bounty cash you might have earned from killing the ganker.
Now **THIS** is a series I'm very keen to watch - I've only recently started any combat, and I suck BIG time at it! I hope in future videos you will explain some of the terms you use here (eg 'resistances', 'hull tank', 'shield tank', etc), show us various tactics (both offensive and defensive), outlining the combat strengths and weaknesses of the various ships, ship builds, modules, engineering, etc. Question: Do the tips given here for PvP also apply to PvE? And how important is it to master PvE combat prior to starting PvP?
Well keep watching as the entire series will cover everything you've asked for - all are in the process, these take a LOT more work than the standard tutorials and quickies, but they are a ton of fun to do. So while it may take a bit we'll get there. As for PvE combat yes, 100% all this translates - other than strategies as you'll fight a human very differently. I get annoyed when I hear "this isn't a PvP build" as a combat build is a combat build - the only real difference would be weapons where lasers and even multicannons are generally preferred for PvE since you won't run out of ammo as quickly as you will with a PA/rail setup. That said practicing with PA/rails against NPCs is great to get used to those weapons, as they are higher skill than just mashing the trigger as you can with lasers/multicannons. Most important is to find a mentor or other players you can spar with, hopefully without paying a rebuy as you're gonna need to die - and a lot - at first.
Yeah, there are a LOT of subjects to cover; and I realise that you can't hurry them. Thanks very much for putting all these tutorials together - we're lucky you enjoy this sort of thing! :)
And I'm lucky to have gotten such a warm reception - never did I think I'd hit 14k subs - when I started my goal was 5k for the first year - here we are about 5 months later and I'm way past that. As I'm at over 3000 hours in the game it's given me a new focus of things to do and a reason to do them.
I’m working on a FGS with reverb torps, pack-hounds, and a large frag cannon, and it’s going to be a silent running build, sure won’t hold much water in a group fight but it is meant as an assassin build after all. Just need so many core dynamic composites.
I think you'll find that build will be next to useless as you'll never get a torp within 2 KM of a good pilot - and remember they have an arming distance of 800m so you can just sneak up on them either. Give it a try and you'll learn quickly how bad an idea it is.
CMDR Exigeous maybe it will maybe it won’t, any build regardless of how effective it is is meant to be fun for the player using it. I have a love for torpedoes and missiles, and I’m well aware of the downsides of both, but it doesn’t stop me from trying to have fun with the build regardless of how effective/good it is. And though I appreciate the criticism, I’m the one the playing it and the one that is supposed to have fun with it, regardless of the outcome.
Oh don't worry, I'm all about fun and you should absolutely do what you think is fun. I've seen many commanders think this exact thing - then fail so completely with it they had zero fun and realized they wasted a ton of time engineering something useless. If however you want to have fun with the reverb cascade effect that actually works (far more often) try the mine launcher, the most misunderstood weapon there is. So again please do enjoy - but for others reading just realize there is no possible way this build will work against any player who's had more than 2 PvP encounters.
What about a sneak at that Krait build you were using there? ;) I'm curious about the shields and rails set up, everything else is covered! Built my first PvP ship, Mamba, MC Dakka boat. Unbelievable fun! Wanting to build more in the future! Cheers for all the sound advice CMDR o7
@Jess Garcia got interdicted (by a shieldless meta-FAS on my way to farseer for experimentals) in my g5 pve mamba one (burst lasers and multicannons/srv scoop n stuff) got his hull to 80% 10+ minutes in and my biweaves at 60% when i decided to just push the bye bye button a few times. Was my first pvp encounter ever. At least it seems gankproof
Well yeah, if you're just looking for a random fight like that it's pretty tough - you can try the PvP hub system of San Tu, a Community Goal system or a popular one like Shinrarta Dezhra or LHS 20 - or better jump into a Discord like GCI or Level 11 and find someone that way.
Coming from you buddy I take that as very high praise indeed! While I'm clearly not the best combat pilot in the game, not by a long shot, I do understand the mechanics and am possibly a better instructor than many others - looking forward to other topics in this series.
It's counter-intuitive to think a large ship is at disadvantage against a medium ship in PVP, but that's the reality. It' not even only about the rebuy, meta PVP is medium ships and if you go in a big ship you will have a hard time. Only thing they have going for them is that you can run away more often.
I really don't like to fly an hull tank, last time I've played my FAS against a scramble spectrum/corrosive shell was a total nightmare. He constantly annoyed me turning my core modules off and my hull looked like paper with corrosive. I'm probably a bad pilot, but I really hated that experience and I never flyed that ship anymore. Moreover in a shield tank build isn't better to use guardian shield reinforcements if you have the power to run them? The hull isn't gonna be that good anyways and adding some flat shields seems nice, of course phasing is gonna be really dangerous. Nice guide Ex, very useful.
Guardian shield reinforcements are great for sure, remember this wasn't getting into very specific ship builds or modules - just a general overview there - that will come later. As for your FAS and hull-tanks you can't let one engagement make a decision for you - you need to have 50-100 fights to see what's really going to work. There are counters to everything and you came up against a strong hull counter. Next fight you may jump into a shield/cell-bank ship and get smoked by cascade rails over and over and then hate shield tanks, due to one fight. It takes LOTS of experience - so in short just go get seat time!
I cannot help but wonder how many of those expert pilots use a HOTAS (Hands on Throttle and Stick) and whether I would need to make a similar financial investment in order to reach their level?
hotas is better for flight controls but its harder to aim hitscans with a stick. kb/m makes aiming hitscans easier. the pvp community is mixed between HOTAS and kb/m users for these reasons
When aiming fixed weapons, do you look at your circle reticle or the dots? I have a feeling that getting the dots into suggested position is the most accurate while aligning the cirlce is less accurate but can still hit. I thought I should ask to make sure!
Love to see that there is a kind of etiquette to the fights to let your opponent know you're engaging in a certain style of combat. Hate that there are styles of combat which are frowned upon or shaming players for engaging in them (reverski stands out).
Sadly there is a huge amount of gatekeeping and toxicity in the game's PVP community. I even got personal attacks from a whole group of players just for flying a Diamondback Scout and intentionally staying in fights to the death instead of high waking out to build up PVP experience. I wish Exigious would discuss this in his videos, because I feel like a lot of people may have followed this tutorial and then got turned off from PVP by these type of players.
Why is reverski frowned apon? Doesnt build skill? Im not saying to use it all the time but i find it very useful with FA off as a method to keep people off your tail or at correct distancing.
A few reasons, it's not just that it doesn't "build" skill but it also takes no skill whatsoever, just a specific build that's faster than your opponent. It's also zero fun to fight against and easy to counter - you just don't chase. So if one person insists on reverski and the other won't chase you can just stop. Basically being blunt it's just a bitch move, do you wanna fight or do you wanna run away shooting?
@@Exigeous if the ship is capable of functional movement in all 6 directions, why wouldn't you utilize that? And im not talking about all the time but the point being trying to maintain a specific combat distance and orientation if you just go charging forward all the time giving to the chase i think thats just poor judgement, don't let your opponent lead you. Thank you for replying btw, I love your content.
Well first I do agree that if the game allows it (as in modules, engineering, etc) then all's fair in love and war, right? That's why I said "frowned upon" - I'm also not saying you just have to joust, etc. and what you're describing isn't what I'd call reverski. That's when you literally just try to get your opponent to chase you while you fly backwards, that's what I'd call a "bitch move". If you're "floating like a butterfly" sure, that's cool with me certainly, make more sense?
I think using a hull tank with bi-wave is far more harder, than a shield tank. The shield tank build is the basic "beginner" build in the game. Using an SCB is not need big skill, than use your pips to manage shield regen/speed/firepower.
Look at my Engineering playlist - I have a complete overview to engineering, then guides on unlocking each engineer and how to gather each type of material. Then on all the options for each core and utility module and several weapons (more coming soon)
J. Ramos is exactly right - you can easily balance that resistance with a single class 2 thermal reinforcement and get far more overall hull. I used to do it that way and HD/DP is far better.
It's a choice rather than a requirement. Thermal is far lighter than reinforced. If you feel like you need extra speed then thermal is a good way to go IMHO.
@WiggyB less helpful comment responses, more interesting build guide videos! Your video series on those is great, I've built them all and need new fun ideas!
Ugh, I still have to unlock most of the mentioned engineers and it's sooo frickin' tedious. Why did they make engineering so grindy? I guess I'll stick to solo mode.
I know this video's kind of old but I really wish you included some more information in the "setting some expectations" segment of your video. There is a small but nonetheless significant portion of the PVP community that will launch personal attacks and harass you in-game and outside of it for being new in PVP. I started doing PVP a few months ago (I'm new to this game in general and only bought it late last year) and have already encountered massive amounts of toxicity from some members of the PVP community just for being new, for flying a small ship, and choosing not to high wake out of fights to build more combat experience, and also for really dumb unrelated stuff like simply having conversations with other players in the system chat. I've been insulted for flying a stealth hulltank Diamondback Scout and for not high waking out of fights, opting to fight to the death instead to build PVP experience since I don't really care about the cheap rebuy on a small ship. I've even had some PVPers follow me around in the comments section of totally unrelated videos on RUclips to insult me for this, calling me a "killfarm" and making personal attacks suggesting that I have a mental disability and other nasty stuff. You recommend players start with small or medium ships, which is also something I did, but you did not mention the amount of toxicity that they may face from other PVPers for flying a small ship, like I did for using a Diamondback Scout. I've even had some players go around to different PVPer Discords and twitch streams spreading nasty rumors about me, trying to rally other players against me. I've also had them go around in-game spreading rumors to newer players, telling them that I am a ganker (I am not) and encouraging them to block me to break instancing for me, apparently just because I chose to join a lawful squadron to fly with instead of being a ganker. I've seen this behavior from some very well known and well established PVPers, although I will not name them in this comment. Some of these players are legitimately skilled pilots, and there is a lot of valuable experience to be gained from fighting them, but some of them also have extremely toxic attitudes and spew a lot of genuinely hateful remarks that make it basically impossible to interact with them in any positive way. I think it's important that new players are warned about this so that they are not discouraged from continuing to learn PVP. While I am old have fairly thick skin, I imagine this sort of toxicity from the PVP community can be very offputting to a lot of younger players, and may greatly discourage them from actually continuing to learn PVP and just give up on it entirely. It would be nice if you made a video to address this for the new players out there, because there is a substantial amount of toxicity in the PVP community and I think it's important that they are warned about it and encouraged to ignore these players and continue, rather than feel like they did something wrong to warrant said toxicity and give up, which I'm sure a lot of younger players have. Edit: And to any new players reading this, I strongly recommend you avoid the EDC discord at all costs, as well as the "PVP hub" and GCI discords. These "communities" are essentially run by griefers and the only "PVP" they teach is 8v1ing unarmed explorers. If you want to learn actual PVP there are some great mentors on the Galactic Academy discord server. EDC is an absolute dumpster fire, as is PVP hub and GCI. The moderators of these servers do not enforce their own rules and routinely break them. they curate messages to unfairly manipulate discussions, they host genuinely toxic players who have been banned from the game for abusing cheat programs and harassing frontier employees and other players, engage in targeted harassment of new players and their only goal seems to be to cause grief to other players, even using out-of-game means (like cross-platform/IRL stalking and harassment) to do so. They bait new players into ganks and openly shame and harass new players for losing arranged duels, essentially using these servers as a platform for grooming/recruiting new griefers, actively spreading disinformation about other players and trying to drive everyone else out of the game. They are either teenagers or have the mentality of teenagers, are extremely immature and hostile to anyone outside their immediate circles. Even the most skilled and seasoned players among them still behave like they're in middle school and will not hesitate to resort to childish name calling, racial epithets and other nastiness if you do manage to beat them in a fight. They are not interested in mentoring new players and contrary to their claims, are quite literally the most toxic people in this game and are actually genuinely awful people IRL who hold abhorrent racist and sexist views.
my initial experience in the EDC was actually good, i was expecting people to be toxic. to my surprise at that time, the people in the vc were nice to me. i basically got myself stuck in the witch head nebula, i bought a new ship when i went there and lost all of my modules( kind of a dumb move), so basically i could not jump my way out of the area. i joined the vc and asked for help and to my surprise one guy sent his fleet carrier near me and picked me up and dropped me in the bubble. the chat and the staff members can be toxic at times. overall they are kinda nice now. i see cmdrs helping new cmdrs there from time to time
Though on ships like a Federal Assaultship, Chieftain or Challenger, a 2D and 4D may be better. As they offer more module protection than a 5D, at the cost of slightly less hull integrity.
VR - I rarely post VR videos due to that but as I suck huge ass doing combat outside of VR I had little choice. I shot a few fights without VR and was so bad it was embarrassing!
CMDR Exigeous Oh come man, you are just being modest. You can't actually suck a at all that much because you have a lot of experience, or enough to make this series. :)
Oh I'm good, but there are many far more skilled than I - as for when I'm not in VR yeah, I'm really bad then as I'm just so used to tracking my target visually.
Not at all - the Python has to be a bi-weave hull-tank now and in now way would I recommend that as a starter ship. Way too expensive and way too difficult for a starter ship - you really want to start in something like a FAS or Chieftain.
I can’t even do the begginer tutorial where you shoot the unarmed drone. I suck ass that much. I rage quit. It’s giving me a headache and making me feel motion sick.
Dunno why I found myself here. But hybrids are more work HANDS DOWN than bank tanks. Two counters to shield tanks. Five times that at least for hull/hybrid counters.
Define "more work" - more counters absolutely but for beginners banks are far more work needing to deal with when to bank, the heat issues, being cancelled by cascade, banking at the wrong time, etc. It is a shame hull builds are so easily countered though, I'll give you that for sure.
@@Exigeous Well for one Bi weaves have much higher distributor draw, thus resulting in new pilots having considerable delays between shield recharges, which is often a death scentence for a hybrid build. Couple that with the volume of module killing weapons avalible the TTK on a new pilot's hybrid is very, very short. Bank tanks require a bit of timing sure, but generally less pip management is required, and timing an SCB is easier in a lot of situations than having a high draw, fast regen shield. Leaves more space for boost and more space or firepower.
As for the counters thing... I really would like to see reverb cascade added as a special effect to dumbfire rockets. It's quite a challenging weapon and would make a far more effective anti shield tank counter than the existing setups avalible. Also i would bring shield tanks down to some level of balance, of which in the current build they severely lack. (See Prismo FDL)
Honestly no, not at all - my Sidewinder is really my all time favorite to fight in. The trouble is you're going to come up against a lot of medium and large class and the small guys just can't compete at that level. So if you know who you're going up against small class is awesome.
You can, you'll just be at an extreme disadvantage against anyone in a more tankier ship (pretty much every other ship in the game). If you are planning to 1v1 against a fellow eagle pilot it'll be pretty fair, but if you try to go up against any other ships, you'll probably lose the fight.
Just got Elite in exploration. Happy, I proudly put the badge on the side of my exploration anaconda and off to Shinra I go To purchase my Krait Mk2. I was happy and for a time it was good. 4 jumps later I arrive in system. And for a time OH SHIT SHIT IM BEING INTERDICTED AAAHHH...SHIT HE IS RESETING MY HIGH WAKE FSD. Explodes and spawns in Jameson. At least I got to where I was going.
The official reason why they haven't added an uncoupled FA on mode is literally elitism. They say that they want flying uncoupled to be hard, and I can't figure out for the life of me why. The gimped aiming doesn't add any new gameplay or strategy, it just makes it harder to use.
Mainly as it takes no skill and you won't grow as a pilot. Let's say you do that and I just sit still and don't chase you - now you're running from me and if you keep it up I essentially win due to that. So while all is fair in love and war if you want to learn to fight and become a better pilot then reverski isn't the way.
In short yes. It's just too "big", too expensive and requires a mixed shield/cell-bank/hull build that is far more complex to fly. It's a great PvP ship in the right hands but early on you need to die like 100+ times. And that $10M+ rebuy is gonna get reeeeeealy expensive fast.
Hmm, although I generally don't like PvP, I thought of trying to get at least a little practice in, after getting my a** kicked 3 times in Cubeo about a week ago or 2. Even though 2/3 were with (literally) unarmed ships, specifically the Type-9 (didn't have any cargo whatsoever... at that time.) & Anaconda. (stripped down for minimum "weight", or rather, maximum Jump Range, and minimize Rebuy cost) as for the Krait, since I had "0 PvP EXP", and were "Target Lock Breaker locked"... In the end, it was pretty much the same with it. Anyway, apparently, I'm gonna have to get another ship for PvP, though the one thing I didn't like about the Chieftain/Challenger was that I really don't like Small Weapons on ANY of my ships. And so far, I prefer hull Tanking because that even the Bi-Weaves recharges too slow for my liking.
The great thing about the small hardpoints on the Chieftain/Challenger is the number of hardpoints you get for additional experimental effects. On my builds I run 3 small rails there - so I can have 2 feedback cascade (to cancel cell banks) and 1 super penetrator (to snipe modules). In both cases I don't care so much about the damage but about the experimental (using one for a corrosive multicannon is also a great idea). Another benefit of 3 small rails is less heat and distributor draw - again wins. So look at it like a big Vulture or even FAS where you get a few more experimental weapons for little drawback.
I have a Python set up for JUST fighting.. thats all.. Its a good fighter.. not the best fighter I own.. BUT the best ship I own for fighting is the Anaconda.. easily.. fully A level on everything and Engineered to the max very few ships can ever take the Anaconda down.. BUT .. a group of ships can easily.. SOOO I don't fight with it.. because it cost 16+ Mil to replace.. I've only lost this ship 2 times since I bought it.. and one was because I had a bounty on my head and got hit at a station by security ships. The other Was a bunch of ships..6 ships interdicted me and attacked me the second I enters a Star system. I've had many try but I've waxed them all. The Python on the other hand.. only takes like 3 mil to replace.. it is a great fighter. But much easier to destroy.
16 million credits is really not a lot of money in this game. I just bought the game a few months ago and already have over a billion credits just from mining and stacking wing missions. It's really easy to grind credits in the game. You can earn about 200 million credits in one hour. Rebuys are totally inconsequential. The only time dying in this game really hurts is if you were carrying a ton of exploration data, bounty vouchers, or high value commodities in your cargo hold (which you can easily avoid, since avoiding dangerous locations and escaping from a hostile player is super easy in this game)
So, you want to start to learn combat on practice? Is your ship engineered? No? Then you will need first to spend shit tons of time and nerves (and probably some money if in open play) to farm mats and visit many engineers over and over and over again. Only after that you maaaaybe will be able to learn combat. Good luck and have fun :P
campers ruined my open play exp. never playing open again. getting iterjected and killed by a vulture on spawn for 3 hours in my kheelback was too much. love this game but never playing open again.
Soooo... In order to be competitive in PvP you need engineering, and to do that you need the horizon DLC... I will keep doing passenger mission with my type 7 for a while then. You dont think that horizon is a must? I mean, if you want a explorer ship with a good jump range, you need engineering. If you want to engage thargoids (which I've never done) you might need engineering. If you want pvp, you need engineering. I think that this "sort of meta" DLC shouldnt be behind a paywall. Unless you buy it, you are not going to be competitive (in late game, thats true) And dont get me wrong, im enjoying the game...
Uh, I suppose I would assume anyone playing Elite would OF COURSE have Horizons, I mean are you really that cheap? So yes, of course Horizons is a must, you couldn't figure that out when I said engineering was necessary?
CMDR Exigeous well, when i initially bought the game i didnt knew that horizons (and engineering in particular) were that important. So yeah it was, my fault, but what i say is if you think that a content that is so important should be paid. Some people may think that devs do this to grab ppl money to have higher progression Also, i will probably buy it on winter sales, while i farm for an anaconda or a corvette And im sorry if i expressed myself wrong, i apologize. But i also love the game ^^ Ps: i guessed that horizon would be important in pvp aspects, but i didnt knew that in other aspects it would be that huge difference. In exploring, an enginereed fsd could give you, aprox +20ly more jump range on an asp explorer Also, ofc when i hear engineering, i know that i will need horizons. But it seems that for everything (not only combat) you need engineering :s
blise518B i will buy it on winter sales probably, im loving this game atm and i will support the devs. The only thing is that, a dlc shouldnt have elements that gets you a significant advantge over people that dont have it , despite you farmed that engineering materials
When people try to compare Horizons to a money grab or pay to win I could laugh louder - are you serious with that shit? I have over 3000 hours in this game - my money to enjoyment ratio is insane as are the VAST majority of players. Money grab - that's fucking hysterical. 4 years of content for even $100 is an insane value. And yes, playing Elite without Horizons is just silly at this point - it's no an optional thing anymore, it's just the base game. I actually think it's absurd they aren't just requiring it at this point - I mean recently I got a third account with Elite and Horizons for $22 - yeah, money grab for sure.
CMDR Exigeous : please do not suggest any new player join ANY elite discord channel. The official ED discord channel AND the Galactic discord channel is some of the most toxic, non friendly shit you can subject yourself to. I joined both and basically deleted discord soon after. Its the most depressing, hostile, non helpful environment around. Even the mods are known gankers in game. Much better off just arranging spars with friends you make in game. Trust me.
Everyone is going to have a different experience in different places. I know many of the guys at GCI and the vast majority there are great, fun players. The "official" Discord you mention, which is in no way "official" (no such thing exists, it's just the biggest and linked from the subreddit) is absolutely awful due to the moderation team (I was a mod there for 9 months and resigned due to the tyranny there) - so if you're looking for a truly non-toxic place to play you're welcome to join my player group, Level 11 as you won't find that crap in our group.
@@Exigeous gonna have to echo what marko said. There is a substantial amount of toxicity in the game's pvp community, sadly. While there are a lot of very friendly and helpful players like you in the PVP community, there's also a lot of really toxic ones, and some of the most toxic ones are also well known and well established pvpers.
So basically you’re saying that PvP is not fun because everyone else has the best weapons? Alright got it. Self-destructing every time I get interdicted from now on.
Chris Klitou It’s vulnerable. And yes they in fact are. With a shield, no module damage is done unless you use a specific weapon for that, while without one, you will be very vulnerable to module damage as a lot of weapons could be able to pierce the hull. You just need to make he ship good
Uh, yeah, Chris you obviously have done very very little PvP combat. Once you start and come up against any of the weapons Jazod mentioned your modules will fold like a paper airplane. If you don't believe that please feel free to join me someone time at Ohm City in LHS 20 to show us this invincible build you've created that no one else in the community has ever been able to create.
I mean that's the difference between organized PvP and emergent PvP. I'm pretty sure the game is designed so that you can get into position against an enemy to give yourself an advantage before firing the first shot.
PVP is pretty fun and despite the constant screeching from some members of the community regarding what ships you should and shouldn't use, what kind of weapons you should/shouldn't use, and other assorted gatekeeping, there's a lot of variety and fun to be had. Just ignore the toxic players who make personal attacks on you for choosing to fly a ship you like rather than what they think you should be flying and you'll be just fine. In arranged fights there is certain etiquette that you are expected to follow, like having "report crimes" turned off, doing a standard pass 'n go, not using premium ammunition, etc. In organic PVP (non-arranged, random fights), pretty much anything goes. The only thing you really shouldn't do in organic PVP is use NPC SLFs, as these cause horrible lag for everyone in the instance and is basically an exploit, and also menu logging/combat logging, which is just lame. Anything else goes in organic PVP, even reverski and prems (although I agree with other players that doing that is still pretty cheesy, and would still discourage you from doing it)
So when i get interdicted by a wing of 4 FDLs is it "frowned upon" to reverse? Haha pvp is a joke in this game. I've never encountered a "consensual" pvp situation. Only interdictions by wings full assholes.
It is a custom overlay I created using GamePadViewer.com - they only work for HOTAS controls, specifically if you use 3 controllers (stick, throttle and pedals). But I do have a tutorial on the channel that covers how to use them as I had them done in such a way that others could use them (and a few have)
you're doing God's work here man, we really need more people involved in PvP for the health of the game
Not sure I'd go *that* far but I appreciate the sentiment. I do have a great deal more content planned around this.
@@Exigeous please continue!
Glad to see you making more combat videos! As a very experienced player who never really tried PvP I think this was a really good intro. Keep it up!
Love your videos, direct, very well informed and my go to guide... keep up the good work chap
Something not mentioned was CQC, while the combat is different enough and the lives are so quick I wouldn't say there is a ton of value in developing skill (though some), I think there is a lot of value in getting used to facing human commanders instead of bots. It's a good place to learn to control your emotions in a fight and get used to losing to someone over and over and not become enraged, all at no risk whatsoever to your finances. It's also very fun.
True - and that's for a specific reason, as I'm working on a video specifically about CQC as it really is a different type of flying to PvP. It's fantastic, don't get me wrong, but very different.
CMDR Exigeous i love CQC but i played only DM. TDM and CTF are impossible to find. At least for me.
I agree that CQC is different, but it's a great place to get pip management and ship handling, plus it has the glorious aspect of being without risk.
I really don't feel like I can get used to flight assist off, not having any rotational counterforce just makes me motion sick.
Eh, I've always got lateral thrusters to use at least.
Fdev really needs to add an uncoupled FA on mode. There's literally no reason not to other than elitism. Their official explanation is "hurr durr we want it to be hard", which is a stupid stance since they also give MKB players an easy mode with relative mouse.
@@ENCHANTMEN_ you dont wanne know how hard it can be on ps4 i just dont do pvp
lol you don't have to, just to make manouver quickly you can always be behind of your enemies that why we use flight assist ON and OFF i think you got the message now lol
Really good guide, really encouraging for the less ‘dangerous’ among us, but where’s the stream gone??? I watched an hour of it but it’s disappeared!
Sorry, I hide all the streams to keep things clean - they are all in the playlist.
ok, no worries, should have checked ..
He needs more subs. I don’t understand why he does not. I am brand new and he has been great in helping me.
Also large ships are, in fact, large targets 😂. No, for real. They are so large, chaff doesn't help.
Exar Kun bug they also have like 10 Times the shield... i sometimes drain all frag ammo before there shields go down.
? Maybe try thermal rounds? They'll come off super quick (sometimes). Also use one or two pa's. Most cmdrs have resistances, so a few pa's will go a long way.
Certainly learned this the hard way...
Large ships are good in PVE situations EG: RES sites, conflict zones and so on, theres nothing I love more than the anaconda in a haz res site or conflict zone. But in pvp, those sorts of ships just dont have the speed or maneuverability to really work, a chieftain in particular can go to town on all the big three ships. But I do like that about elite though, that the best pvp ships aren't the ships that are the biggest and most expensive, but are quite affordable. And yes, the shields on bigger ships are undoubtedly stronger, with the right weapons it wont really matter.
@@blise518B *laughs in reverberating cascade*
I'm a simple man, i see a tutorial by cmdr exigeous I press Like. Godsend against all the other "jokesters" or badly edited videos out there.
Jesus chrsit so many engineers needed. So far i havent played pvp, just did things to gain credits and rank (road to riches, passenger missions, combat missions, transport and so on) , somewhen i started engineering my fsd drive for larger jumprage , farming mats has been a huge pain in the a**. Imaging doing this for 8 other Engineers - i feel devastated already x)
How did you do that extra buttons on screen?
Your content is incredible
even though I don't like combat, your vid is good for others to look at.
Nice. Concise and to the point. San tu discord to learn pvp is also a nice place to start. Pvp can be very fun but be prepared to be destroyed 100 times before starting to do something enjoy the learning process. And be the fun with you CMDRs !
And no reason you can't enjoy getting blown up those 100 times too!
So they went the WoW route. I played WoW for years, and I have played Elite from day one. Seeing some things from the WoW type of grind in this game and I don't get it. In WoW they keep you grinding, because they get a monthly subscription from the players. Elite, however, does not charge a monthly sub, so why the grind. Genuinely curious.
I'm assuming its the developers wish to make it grindy as almost all aspects of the game are grinds. A friend and I actually really love grinding, go figure haha. My buddy got his corvette from nothing in a couple days. I think it just comes down to enjoying the grind. Some people do some people don't, like everything else in life. I personally enjoy cutting virtual trees but not everyone does. My best guess is that your development just simply loves the grind as I do
because its fun
Because it's life in game, and in real life you also have to grind to make for a living. Elite allows me to quickly get enormous amount of credits (from painite mining) and spend on whatever I like. The grind is needed so the game would not be boring too fast and it keeps us playing. Grinding elements on the planets for example is quite fun to do from time to time.
its not that big of a grind if you deep core mining.. All you need is a keelback (cost 3 M, make it 4 M with the average mining equipment) and you can earn easily 20M to 30M an hour. Just got it this week and after like 3 cargo drop of minerals, I got a Krait-II (a 45 M ship). I'm grinding faster than I can handle those new ships tbh, making money is fast but learning/applying all the stuff in the game takes the longest
Because the devs think that grinding is fun. The only way to get engineering materials in any reasonable amount of time involves borderline exploits to farm them.
If someone is wanted, I will interdict with crimes on and instantly open fire.
I just make the assumption that they're out ganking weak ships and they deserve to face the swarm.
That's totally valid since you're doing organic pvp and not arranged fights, although I'd still encourage you to attack them with "report crimes" turned off as the NPCs that spawn in can cause lag in the instance. Also, although it's probably not very common in practice, those NPC cops can actually steal your kill and deprive you of what little bounty cash you might have earned from killing the ganker.
I don't actually know why im watching this i literally got stuck in a Prison Ship for 30+ minutes today. So basically im not doing PVP soon.
Oof
Now **THIS** is a series I'm very keen to watch - I've only recently started any combat, and I suck BIG time at it! I hope in future videos you will explain some of the terms you use here (eg 'resistances', 'hull tank', 'shield tank', etc), show us various tactics (both offensive and defensive), outlining the combat strengths and weaknesses of the various ships, ship builds, modules, engineering, etc.
Question: Do the tips given here for PvP also apply to PvE? And how important is it to master PvE combat prior to starting PvP?
Well keep watching as the entire series will cover everything you've asked for - all are in the process, these take a LOT more work than the standard tutorials and quickies, but they are a ton of fun to do. So while it may take a bit we'll get there. As for PvE combat yes, 100% all this translates - other than strategies as you'll fight a human very differently. I get annoyed when I hear "this isn't a PvP build" as a combat build is a combat build - the only real difference would be weapons where lasers and even multicannons are generally preferred for PvE since you won't run out of ammo as quickly as you will with a PA/rail setup. That said practicing with PA/rails against NPCs is great to get used to those weapons, as they are higher skill than just mashing the trigger as you can with lasers/multicannons. Most important is to find a mentor or other players you can spar with, hopefully without paying a rebuy as you're gonna need to die - and a lot - at first.
Yeah, there are a LOT of subjects to cover; and I realise that you can't hurry them. Thanks very much for putting all these tutorials together - we're lucky you enjoy this sort of thing! :)
And I'm lucky to have gotten such a warm reception - never did I think I'd hit 14k subs - when I started my goal was 5k for the first year - here we are about 5 months later and I'm way past that. As I'm at over 3000 hours in the game it's given me a new focus of things to do and a reason to do them.
I’m working on a FGS with reverb torps, pack-hounds, and a large frag cannon, and it’s going to be a silent running build, sure won’t hold much water in a group fight but it is meant as an assassin build after all. Just need so many core dynamic composites.
I think you'll find that build will be next to useless as you'll never get a torp within 2 KM of a good pilot - and remember they have an arming distance of 800m so you can just sneak up on them either. Give it a try and you'll learn quickly how bad an idea it is.
CMDR Exigeous maybe it will maybe it won’t, any build regardless of how effective it is is meant to be fun for the player using it. I have a love for torpedoes and missiles, and I’m well aware of the downsides of both, but it doesn’t stop me from trying to have fun with the build regardless of how effective/good it is. And though I appreciate the criticism, I’m the one the playing it and the one that is supposed to have fun with it, regardless of the outcome.
Oh don't worry, I'm all about fun and you should absolutely do what you think is fun. I've seen many commanders think this exact thing - then fail so completely with it they had zero fun and realized they wasted a ton of time engineering something useless. If however you want to have fun with the reverb cascade effect that actually works (far more often) try the mine launcher, the most misunderstood weapon there is. So again please do enjoy - but for others reading just realize there is no possible way this build will work against any player who's had more than 2 PvP encounters.
What about a sneak at that Krait build you were using there? ;) I'm curious about the shields and rails set up, everything else is covered! Built my first PvP ship, Mamba, MC Dakka boat. Unbelievable fun! Wanting to build more in the future! Cheers for all the sound advice CMDR o7
@Jess Garcia got interdicted (by a shieldless meta-FAS on my way to farseer for experimentals)
in my g5 pve mamba one (burst lasers and multicannons/srv scoop n stuff) got his hull to 80% 10+ minutes in and my biweaves at 60% when i decided to just push the bye bye button a few times.
Was my first pvp encounter ever. At least it seems gankproof
@@dadrising6464 The FAS is anything but meta lol. I
Great video! Are these "axis view windows" part of the game or mod?
I actually wanna try this. Get into a Viper III and ask in chat for a duel, let's see how many players want to teach newbies ingame...
Well yeah, if you're just looking for a random fight like that it's pretty tough - you can try the PvP hub system of San Tu, a Community Goal system or a popular one like Shinrarta Dezhra or LHS 20 - or better jump into a Discord like GCI or Level 11 and find someone that way.
CMDR Exigeous oh yeah i forgot to mention i was thinking about Shinrarta all along. But i wanna try visiting San Tu too sometime
great video!
there are tons of great pvp records out there but so far this is definitely the best "how to start pvp" guide Ive ever watched
Coming from you buddy I take that as very high praise indeed! While I'm clearly not the best combat pilot in the game, not by a long shot, I do understand the mechanics and am possibly a better instructor than many others - looking forward to other topics in this series.
It's counter-intuitive to think a large ship is at disadvantage against a medium ship in PVP, but that's the reality. It' not even only about the rebuy, meta PVP is medium ships and if you go in a big ship you will have a hard time. Only thing they have going for them is that you can run away more often.
Yep 100% correct. Many assume that bigger must be better but that just isn't the case at all.
Gives me an excuse to roll out my trusty FAS. Appreciated!
You're most welcome, if you're looking for targets to shoot at come join us any time.
i thought you can only outfit one cell bank, is this still possible?
who told you that?
you can fit as many SCB's as you want.
only 1 generator though
@@DuwMinh okay thanks
where are The Extra Indicators On Your Screen From ? ie , itch /roll / boost/chaff ?
I really don't like to fly an hull tank, last time I've played my FAS against a scramble spectrum/corrosive shell was a total nightmare. He constantly annoyed me turning my core modules off and my hull looked like paper with corrosive. I'm probably a bad pilot, but I really hated that experience and I never flyed that ship anymore.
Moreover in a shield tank build isn't better to use guardian shield reinforcements if you have the power to run them? The hull isn't gonna be that good anyways and adding some flat shields seems nice, of course phasing is gonna be really dangerous.
Nice guide Ex, very useful.
Guardian shield reinforcements are great for sure, remember this wasn't getting into very specific ship builds or modules - just a general overview there - that will come later. As for your FAS and hull-tanks you can't let one engagement make a decision for you - you need to have 50-100 fights to see what's really going to work. There are counters to everything and you came up against a strong hull counter. Next fight you may jump into a shield/cell-bank ship and get smoked by cascade rails over and over and then hate shield tanks, due to one fight. It takes LOTS of experience - so in short just go get seat time!
Great video as always! Do you think you'll make a more detailed video on PvP somewhen?
Yep, this is just the first in a series I have planned so stay tuned.
@@Exigeous Great! Looking forward to it.
I cannot help but wonder how many of those expert pilots use a HOTAS (Hands on Throttle and Stick) and whether I would need to make a similar financial investment in order to reach their level?
hotas is better for flight controls but its harder to aim hitscans with a stick. kb/m makes aiming hitscans easier. the pvp community is mixed between HOTAS and kb/m users for these reasons
When aiming fixed weapons, do you look at your circle reticle or the dots? I have a feeling that getting the dots into suggested position is the most accurate while aligning the cirlce is less accurate but can still hit. I thought I should ask to make sure!
Love to see that there is a kind of etiquette to the fights to let your opponent know you're engaging in a certain style of combat.
Hate that there are styles of combat which are frowned upon or shaming players for engaging in them (reverski stands out).
Sadly there is a huge amount of gatekeeping and toxicity in the game's PVP community. I even got personal attacks from a whole group of players just for flying a Diamondback Scout and intentionally staying in fights to the death instead of high waking out to build up PVP experience.
I wish Exigious would discuss this in his videos, because I feel like a lot of people may have followed this tutorial and then got turned off from PVP by these type of players.
Why is reverski frowned apon? Doesnt build skill? Im not saying to use it all the time but i find it very useful with FA off as a method to keep people off your tail or at correct distancing.
A few reasons, it's not just that it doesn't "build" skill but it also takes no skill whatsoever, just a specific build that's faster than your opponent. It's also zero fun to fight against and easy to counter - you just don't chase. So if one person insists on reverski and the other won't chase you can just stop. Basically being blunt it's just a bitch move, do you wanna fight or do you wanna run away shooting?
@@Exigeous if the ship is capable of functional movement in all 6 directions, why wouldn't you utilize that? And im not talking about all the time but the point being trying to maintain a specific combat distance and orientation if you just go charging forward all the time giving to the chase i think thats just poor judgement, don't let your opponent lead you. Thank you for replying btw, I love your content.
Well first I do agree that if the game allows it (as in modules, engineering, etc) then all's fair in love and war, right? That's why I said "frowned upon" - I'm also not saying you just have to joust, etc. and what you're describing isn't what I'd call reverski. That's when you literally just try to get your opponent to chase you while you fly backwards, that's what I'd call a "bitch move". If you're "floating like a butterfly" sure, that's cool with me certainly, make more sense?
@@Exigeous i get you, i guess i was just missing context. I was assuming you meant just flying backwards in general d1uring a dogfight.
I think using a hull tank with bi-wave is far more harder, than a shield tank. The shield tank build is the basic "beginner" build in the game. Using an SCB is not need big skill, than use your pips to manage shield regen/speed/firepower.
Feel free to swing by LHS 20 sometime and someone will happily show you why a SCB build is "far more harder" for a beginner
They both require skills, scbs will get sniped with feedback cascade since rail guns are meta atm
If you think that's hard try flying without a shield entirely! Now THAT's hard!
Is it a good idea making a combat focused Krait MarkII? I love that ship but I already have a Python for my medium sized money farmer
yes
Nice video, thank you... have you got a guide on how to start engineering your ship?dummies guide lol
Look at my Engineering playlist - I have a complete overview to engineering, then guides on unlocking each engineer and how to gather each type of material. Then on all the options for each core and utility module and several weapons (more coming soon)
Isn't Thermal Resistant mod for Reactive Armour is better than Heavy Duty?
Only if you don't have space for hull reinforcements. Your total gain will be greater by balancing that resistance using a small hull reinforcement.
J. Ramos is exactly right - you can easily balance that resistance with a single class 2 thermal reinforcement and get far more overall hull. I used to do it that way and HD/DP is far better.
It's a choice rather than a requirement. Thermal is far lighter than reinforced. If you feel like you need extra speed then thermal is a good way to go IMHO.
@WiggyB less helpful comment responses, more interesting build guide videos! Your video series on those is great, I've built them all and need new fun ideas!
@Mastermind-PK Thanks. Been busy of late, plus Exigeous and KB keep doing great videos on the ideas I have before me!
'Reverski' is frowned upon? It's a space game if you're not using zero-g to your advantage what's the point?
it's a cheesy tactic that's boring to fight
"Failure is the best teacher."
Ugh, I still have to unlock most of the mentioned engineers and it's sooo frickin' tedious. Why did they make engineering so grindy? I guess I'll stick to solo mode.
This game seems to be one big grind.
Elite has been a grindy game since 1984
I know this video's kind of old but I really wish you included some more information in the "setting some expectations" segment of your video.
There is a small but nonetheless significant portion of the PVP community that will launch personal attacks and harass you in-game and outside of it for being new in PVP. I started doing PVP a few months ago (I'm new to this game in general and only bought it late last year) and have already encountered massive amounts of toxicity from some members of the PVP community just for being new, for flying a small ship, and choosing not to high wake out of fights to build more combat experience, and also for really dumb unrelated stuff like simply having conversations with other players in the system chat.
I've been insulted for flying a stealth hulltank Diamondback Scout and for not high waking out of fights, opting to fight to the death instead to build PVP experience since I don't really care about the cheap rebuy on a small ship. I've even had some PVPers follow me around in the comments section of totally unrelated videos on RUclips to insult me for this, calling me a "killfarm" and making personal attacks suggesting that I have a mental disability and other nasty stuff.
You recommend players start with small or medium ships, which is also something I did, but you did not mention the amount of toxicity that they may face from other PVPers for flying a small ship, like I did for using a Diamondback Scout.
I've even had some players go around to different PVPer Discords and twitch streams spreading nasty rumors about me, trying to rally other players against me. I've also had them go around in-game spreading rumors to newer players, telling them that I am a ganker (I am not) and encouraging them to block me to break instancing for me, apparently just because I chose to join a lawful squadron to fly with instead of being a ganker. I've seen this behavior from some very well known and well established PVPers, although I will not name them in this comment.
Some of these players are legitimately skilled pilots, and there is a lot of valuable experience to be gained from fighting them, but some of them also have extremely toxic attitudes and spew a lot of genuinely hateful remarks that make it basically impossible to interact with them in any positive way.
I think it's important that new players are warned about this so that they are not discouraged from continuing to learn PVP. While I am old have fairly thick skin, I imagine this sort of toxicity from the PVP community can be very offputting to a lot of younger players, and may greatly discourage them from actually continuing to learn PVP and just give up on it entirely.
It would be nice if you made a video to address this for the new players out there, because there is a substantial amount of toxicity in the PVP community and I think it's important that they are warned about it and encouraged to ignore these players and continue, rather than feel like they did something wrong to warrant said toxicity and give up, which I'm sure a lot of younger players have.
Edit: And to any new players reading this, I strongly recommend you avoid the EDC discord at all costs, as well as the "PVP hub" and GCI discords. These "communities" are essentially run by griefers and the only "PVP" they teach is 8v1ing unarmed explorers. If you want to learn actual PVP there are some great mentors on the Galactic Academy discord server.
EDC is an absolute dumpster fire, as is PVP hub and GCI. The moderators of these servers do not enforce their own rules and routinely break them. they curate messages to unfairly manipulate discussions, they host genuinely toxic players who have been banned from the game for abusing cheat programs and harassing frontier employees and other players, engage in targeted harassment of new players and their only goal seems to be to cause grief to other players, even using out-of-game means (like cross-platform/IRL stalking and harassment) to do so.
They bait new players into ganks and openly shame and harass new players for losing arranged duels, essentially using these servers as a platform for grooming/recruiting new griefers, actively spreading disinformation about other players and trying to drive everyone else out of the game. They are either teenagers or have the mentality of teenagers, are extremely immature and hostile to anyone outside their immediate circles. Even the most skilled and seasoned players among them still behave like they're in middle school and will not hesitate to resort to childish name calling, racial epithets and other nastiness if you do manage to beat them in a fight. They are not interested in mentoring new players and contrary to their claims, are quite literally the most toxic people in this game and are actually genuinely awful people IRL who hold abhorrent racist and sexist views.
my initial experience in the EDC was actually good, i was expecting people to be toxic. to my surprise at that time, the people in the vc were nice to me. i basically got myself stuck in the witch head nebula, i bought a new ship when i went there and lost all of my modules( kind of a dumb move), so basically i could not jump my way out of the area. i joined the vc and asked for help and to my surprise one guy sent his fleet carrier near me and picked me up and dropped me in the bubble. the chat and the staff members can be toxic at times. overall they are kinda nice now. i see cmdrs helping new cmdrs there from time to time
You didn't mention module reinforcement. Are they useless or are hull reinforcement just much better?
Uh, yes, yes I did - and yes, they are very important. On a hull-tank you're going to generally run 1 of the largest size, usually class 5.
Though on ships like a Federal Assaultship, Chieftain or Challenger, a 2D and 4D may be better. As they offer more module protection than a 5D, at the cost of slightly less hull integrity.
Ah feck it. So you did. Sorry about that. Next time have a neon sign and shout loudly for us with an attention span of a moth :-)
Oh no worries, there is a LOT of content crammed in this one so no worries ;-)
How can you use freelook and pitch at the same time?
Maybe he has two separate mushroom controllers one on the joystick, another on the throttle. I use single joystick so my freelook is on the mouse.
VR headset probly
Is that camera movement because of VR or because of Tobii?
VR - I rarely post VR videos due to that but as I suck huge ass doing combat outside of VR I had little choice. I shot a few fights without VR and was so bad it was embarrassing!
CMDR Exigeous Oh come man, you are just being modest. You can't actually suck a at all that much because you have a lot of experience, or enough to make this series. :)
Oh I'm good, but there are many far more skilled than I - as for when I'm not in VR yeah, I'm really bad then as I'm just so used to tracking my target visually.
Returning player, Is shield tank Python any good? That's what I used to run back in the day
Not at all - the Python has to be a bi-weave hull-tank now and in now way would I recommend that as a starter ship. Way too expensive and way too difficult for a starter ship - you really want to start in something like a FAS or Chieftain.
if you make another video like this more people will do PvP
I can’t even do the begginer tutorial where you shoot the unarmed drone. I suck ass that much. I rage quit. It’s giving me a headache and making me feel motion sick.
Dunno why I found myself here. But hybrids are more work HANDS DOWN than bank tanks. Two counters to shield tanks. Five times that at least for hull/hybrid counters.
Define "more work" - more counters absolutely but for beginners banks are far more work needing to deal with when to bank, the heat issues, being cancelled by cascade, banking at the wrong time, etc. It is a shame hull builds are so easily countered though, I'll give you that for sure.
@@Exigeous Well for one Bi weaves have much higher distributor draw, thus resulting in new pilots having considerable delays between shield recharges, which is often a death scentence for a hybrid build. Couple that with the volume of module killing weapons avalible the TTK on a new pilot's hybrid is very, very short. Bank tanks require a bit of timing sure, but generally less pip management is required, and timing an SCB is easier in a lot of situations than having a high draw, fast regen shield. Leaves more space for boost and more space or firepower.
As for the counters thing... I really would like to see reverb cascade added as a special effect to dumbfire rockets. It's quite a challenging weapon and would make a far more effective anti shield tank counter than the existing setups avalible. Also i would bring shield tanks down to some level of balance, of which in the current build they severely lack. (See Prismo FDL)
for beginners are sidwinders,eagles ,dbs(all small ships;) useless metal toys or what?hehe..
Honestly no, not at all - my Sidewinder is really my all time favorite to fight in. The trouble is you're going to come up against a lot of medium and large class and the small guys just can't compete at that level. So if you know who you're going up against small class is awesome.
Can i realistically pvp in an eagle?
no
You can, you'll just be at an extreme disadvantage against anyone in a more tankier ship (pretty much every other ship in the game). If you are planning to 1v1 against a fellow eagle pilot it'll be pretty fair, but if you try to go up against any other ships, you'll probably lose the fight.
Just got Elite in exploration. Happy, I proudly put the badge on the side of my exploration anaconda and off to Shinra I go To purchase my Krait Mk2. I was happy and for a time it was good. 4 jumps later I arrive in system. And for a time OH SHIT SHIT IM BEING INTERDICTED AAAHHH...SHIT HE IS RESETING MY HIGH WAKE FSD. Explodes and spawns in Jameson. At least I got to where I was going.
Now i wish i didn't trade all my materials for hull engineering for shield engineering...
The biggest thing keeping me from doing PVP is FA off... It feels like shit to use and gives MKB players a huge advantage over HOTAS
The official reason why they haven't added an uncoupled FA on mode is literally elitism. They say that they want flying uncoupled to be hard, and I can't figure out for the life of me why. The gimped aiming doesn't add any new gameplay or strategy, it just makes it harder to use.
The fucking Apollo lander in the 1960s had uncoupled FA on, you're telling me it's somehow impossible in the year 3300?
What's wrong with firing while flying backwards? If the objective is to destroy the opponent why is this way frowned upon?
Mainly as it takes no skill and you won't grow as a pilot. Let's say you do that and I just sit still and don't chase you - now you're running from me and if you keep it up I essentially win due to that. So while all is fair in love and war if you want to learn to fight and become a better pilot then reverski isn't the way.
Ask CMDR Dangerous about this :-D
Hey.. anyone play's "jumpgate"?
Good video, a good aiming training is to fly to some compromised nav beacon and try to fight NPC elite eagles :) ...
Corvette #1
Fare de lons?
regarding the Medium Ships to start with, I'm guessing that the Krait MkII have enough "issues" to not be a viable PvP Starter ship?
In short yes. It's just too "big", too expensive and requires a mixed shield/cell-bank/hull build that is far more complex to fly. It's a great PvP ship in the right hands but early on you need to die like 100+ times. And that $10M+ rebuy is gonna get reeeeeealy expensive fast.
Hmm, although I generally don't like PvP, I thought of trying to get at least a little practice in, after getting my a** kicked 3 times in Cubeo about a week ago or 2. Even though 2/3 were with (literally) unarmed ships, specifically the Type-9 (didn't have any cargo whatsoever... at that time.) & Anaconda. (stripped down for minimum "weight", or rather, maximum Jump Range, and minimize Rebuy cost)
as for the Krait, since I had "0 PvP EXP", and were "Target Lock Breaker locked"... In the end, it was pretty much the same with it.
Anyway, apparently, I'm gonna have to get another ship for PvP, though the one thing I didn't like about the Chieftain/Challenger was that I really don't like Small Weapons on ANY of my ships. And so far, I prefer hull Tanking because that even the Bi-Weaves recharges too slow for my liking.
The great thing about the small hardpoints on the Chieftain/Challenger is the number of hardpoints you get for additional experimental effects. On my builds I run 3 small rails there - so I can have 2 feedback cascade (to cancel cell banks) and 1 super penetrator (to snipe modules). In both cases I don't care so much about the damage but about the experimental (using one for a corrosive multicannon is also a great idea). Another benefit of 3 small rails is less heat and distributor draw - again wins. So look at it like a big Vulture or even FAS where you get a few more experimental weapons for little drawback.
I have a Python set up for JUST fighting.. thats all.. Its a good fighter.. not the best fighter I own.. BUT the best ship I own for fighting is the Anaconda.. easily.. fully A level on everything and Engineered to the max very few ships can ever take the Anaconda down.. BUT .. a group of ships can easily.. SOOO I don't fight with it.. because it cost 16+ Mil to replace.. I've only lost this ship 2 times since I bought it.. and one was because I had a bounty on my head and got hit at a station by security ships. The other Was a bunch of ships..6 ships interdicted me and attacked me the second I enters a Star system. I've had many try but I've waxed them all. The Python on the other hand.. only takes like 3 mil to replace.. it is a great fighter. But much easier to destroy.
16 million credits is really not a lot of money in this game. I just bought the game a few months ago and already have over a billion credits just from mining and stacking wing missions. It's really easy to grind credits in the game. You can earn about 200 million credits in one hour. Rebuys are totally inconsequential. The only time dying in this game really hurts is if you were carrying a ton of exploration data, bounty vouchers, or high value commodities in your cargo hold (which you can easily avoid, since avoiding dangerous locations and escaping from a hostile player is super easy in this game)
So, you want to start to learn combat on practice? Is your ship engineered? No? Then you will need first to spend shit tons of time and nerves (and probably some money if in open play) to farm mats and visit many engineers over and over and over again. Only after that you maaaaybe will be able to learn combat. Good luck and have fun :P
YEEEEA!
Im in over my head
campers ruined my open play exp. never playing open again. getting iterjected and killed by a vulture on spawn for 3 hours in my kheelback was too much. love this game but never playing open again.
Hire someone from Iridium wing.
Watch Rinzler's guide on trading in open and chances are you probably won't ever get ganked again
Soooo... In order to be competitive in PvP you need engineering, and to do that you need the horizon DLC...
I will keep doing passenger mission with my type 7 for a while then.
You dont think that horizon is a must? I mean, if you want a explorer ship with a good jump range, you need engineering. If you want to engage thargoids (which I've never done) you might need engineering. If you want pvp, you need engineering. I think that this "sort of meta" DLC shouldnt be behind a paywall. Unless you buy it, you are not going to be competitive (in late game, thats true)
And dont get me wrong, im enjoying the game...
Uh, I suppose I would assume anyone playing Elite would OF COURSE have Horizons, I mean are you really that cheap? So yes, of course Horizons is a must, you couldn't figure that out when I said engineering was necessary?
They can’t just keep on developing a game for years without getting something back... if you wait for a discount event it should be pretty cheap.
CMDR Exigeous well, when i initially bought the game i didnt knew that horizons (and engineering in particular) were that important. So yeah it was, my fault, but what i say is if you think that a content that is so important should be paid. Some people may think that devs do this to grab ppl money to have higher progression
Also, i will probably buy it on winter sales, while i farm for an anaconda or a corvette
And im sorry if i expressed myself wrong, i apologize. But i also love the game ^^
Ps: i guessed that horizon would be important in pvp aspects, but i didnt knew that in other aspects it would be that huge difference. In exploring, an enginereed fsd could give you, aprox +20ly more jump range on an asp explorer
Also, ofc when i hear engineering, i know that i will need horizons. But it seems that for everything (not only combat) you need engineering :s
blise518B i will buy it on winter sales probably, im loving this game atm and i will support the devs. The only thing is that, a dlc shouldnt have elements that gets you a significant advantge over people that dont have it , despite you farmed that engineering materials
When people try to compare Horizons to a money grab or pay to win I could laugh louder - are you serious with that shit? I have over 3000 hours in this game - my money to enjoyment ratio is insane as are the VAST majority of players. Money grab - that's fucking hysterical. 4 years of content for even $100 is an insane value.
And yes, playing Elite without Horizons is just silly at this point - it's no an optional thing anymore, it's just the base game. I actually think it's absurd they aren't just requiring it at this point - I mean recently I got a third account with Elite and Horizons for $22 - yeah, money grab for sure.
Finally someone in ED who doesn't sound like a drunk scot speaking from the bottom of a barrel.
Ahaha, long range Pa's xD
CMDR Exigeous : please do not suggest any new player join ANY elite discord channel. The official ED discord channel AND the Galactic discord channel is some of the most toxic, non friendly shit you can subject yourself to. I joined both and basically deleted discord soon after. Its the most depressing, hostile, non helpful environment around. Even the mods are known gankers in game. Much better off just arranging spars with friends you make in game. Trust me.
Everyone is going to have a different experience in different places. I know many of the guys at GCI and the vast majority there are great, fun players. The "official" Discord you mention, which is in no way "official" (no such thing exists, it's just the biggest and linked from the subreddit) is absolutely awful due to the moderation team (I was a mod there for 9 months and resigned due to the tyranny there) - so if you're looking for a truly non-toxic place to play you're welcome to join my player group, Level 11 as you won't find that crap in our group.
@@Exigeous gonna have to echo what marko said. There is a substantial amount of toxicity in the game's pvp community, sadly. While there are a lot of very friendly and helpful players like you in the PVP community, there's also a lot of really toxic ones, and some of the most toxic ones are also well known and well established pvpers.
So basically you’re saying that PvP is not fun because everyone else has the best weapons? Alright got it. Self-destructing every time I get interdicted from now on.
lol
Not true my ship is a hull tanker and I have 2 module a reforcements and a point defence
And what's not true again? No issue with that build, depending on the ship as you didn't give much information at all....
CMDR Exigeous you said hull tankers are valuable to missiles and modules malfunction mine isn't
Chris Klitou It’s vulnerable. And yes they in fact are. With a shield, no module damage is done unless you use a specific weapon for that, while without one, you will be very vulnerable to module damage as a lot of weapons could be able to pierce the hull. You just need to make he ship good
Scramble spectrum lasers, rail guns and packhounds can still fuck you up.
Uh, yeah, Chris you obviously have done very very little PvP combat. Once you start and come up against any of the weapons Jazod mentioned your modules will fold like a paper airplane. If you don't believe that please feel free to join me someone time at Ohm City in LHS 20 to show us this invincible build you've created that no one else in the community has ever been able to create.
When PvP has THAT much "etiquette" it's pretty safe to say the whole game is just broken.
Maybe I'll just stick to PvE after all...
I mean that's the difference between organized PvP and emergent PvP. I'm pretty sure the game is designed so that you can get into position against an enemy to give yourself an advantage before firing the first shot.
PVP is pretty fun and despite the constant screeching from some members of the community regarding what ships you should and shouldn't use, what kind of weapons you should/shouldn't use, and other assorted gatekeeping, there's a lot of variety and fun to be had. Just ignore the toxic players who make personal attacks on you for choosing to fly a ship you like rather than what they think you should be flying and you'll be just fine.
In arranged fights there is certain etiquette that you are expected to follow, like having "report crimes" turned off, doing a standard pass 'n go, not using premium ammunition, etc. In organic PVP (non-arranged, random fights), pretty much anything goes. The only thing you really shouldn't do in organic PVP is use NPC SLFs, as these cause horrible lag for everyone in the instance and is basically an exploit, and also menu logging/combat logging, which is just lame. Anything else goes in organic PVP, even reverski and prems (although I agree with other players that doing that is still pretty cheesy, and would still discourage you from doing it)
So when i get interdicted by a wing of 4 FDLs is it "frowned upon" to reverse? Haha pvp is a joke in this game. I've never encountered a "consensual" pvp situation. Only interdictions by wings full assholes.
Oh will sure, because you haven't engaged in real PvP it's a joke, because, uh, "logic". Ugh.
PVP, no thx.
Silly comment, no thx.
Where do you get those hud widgets?
It is a custom overlay I created using GamePadViewer.com - they only work for HOTAS controls, specifically if you use 3 controllers (stick, throttle and pedals). But I do have a tutorial on the channel that covers how to use them as I had them done in such a way that others could use them (and a few have)