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First time here. Would be nice to see video on the unemployment filing experience. They want you to find a job ASAP. Due to theft ? Tons of checks and balances . Outdated search systems. The workers there OMG. From one trauma to anther. Thanks for your work.
@@sanle7515 I believe all electronic communications are being recorded. Private conversations are allowed to be recorded in some states with only one persons consent. In other states it requires both parties knowledge. For example, when someone leaves a voicemail they KNOW they are being recorded so they have given their consent. And you can use that in a courtroom as evidence. If you secretly record someone with a hidden camera or recording device in a location where they think they have privacy, or they believe it's just the two of you, depending on the state, that is not admissible in court. Silicon valley is in a 2-party consent state It's one reason I prefer a doctor appointment in person and not over the phone. Doctor patient confidentiality goes out the window as soon as your appointment is done online or by phone Every ZOOM meeting, online learning, court appearance, all of it, was being watched by the Chinese and they were gathering more data on Americans per day than the NSA does. Anything that can transmit can also receive. The Ring doorbell is apparently easy to break into and watch people inside their homes. I'll never understand people who want robots or smart devices in their homes It's bad enough already with these cell phones.
I would posit that we no longer have a true capitalist society. If you look at the definitions of corporatism(or mercantilism), those would be the closest to what we're currently living. And it's global, which means we're all in trouble.@@derekprospero
I once begged an HR person letting me go to call it a 'reduction of force' instead of performance. He coldly told me that would be up to unemployment administartive judge. They had a handbook we all signed that included the process was first a verbal, then two written warnings about your supposed poor perfomance. It affectced about 40 people. So I appealed with unemployment and asked the company to produce the 'handbook'. They would not produce the copy for the judge who saw that as willful denial on the companies part. I was able to get the wrongly listed performance layoff changed to a layoff and everybody got their unemployment. I was the only person on the project willing to asppeal it and everybody won.
Wow congrats on the win. Why was everyone else such cowards that they wouldnt appeal? This is why i dont like working with others in large companies. In most jobs ive been in, most people show to be cowards. I prefer to work solo and have my own business.
Here:🏆✨”VIP Award for Triumph over Tyranny“ CONGRATULATIONS . Thank you for Being a resilient, assertive speaker of Truth in a flock of sheep who don’t think to question the Shepard. Speaking Up, Standing your Ground, Being Assertive in the Face of Intimidating authority in spite of Uncertainty , this is what real power is, and who we should all strive to be. You are an inspiration and on behalf of everyone who you’ve helped, thank you, and Good Job. 👍
I guess I wasn't clear enough. They lied about it being performance based in order to get out of their obligation to pay the unemployment. I proved that by showing they had not followed their own guidelines.@@busandcoach
@@dannylaza1326 Neah, don't be nervous. Everything will be alright. It's just the way the economy is. Vote out the democrats and it helps. I promise you that. Plus food and gas comes way down when Conservatives are in office.
Used to work in HR. They fire you as opposed to laying you off because if they fire you "with cause" you aren't eligible for unemployment. "Poor performance" is the major reason for "firing" someone in these situations. If they lay you off, and all of you collect unemployment, their unemployment insurance premiums go sky high. It's all about money.
Not selling anything isn’t “for cause”. It’s just performance at that point. For cause is fighting, stealing, insubordination, gross safety violations, etc.
An old employer tried to suspend me for three days over Christmas, after Moving the Goalposts so that I would never succeed: overlapping negative evaluations and evaluation periods with no end in sight. So I reisgned with Immediate Effect, the Unemployment Office ruled it as a Constructive Dismissal and I got Unemployment Benefits that supported me until I re-enlisted a couple months later.
I live in the US, in WA state. "Failing" at a job is not cause. You can still collect unemployment. "Cause" has to be either an illegal act or a clear direct violation of a company policy. It's very rare to not qualify for unemployment pay if the company let's you go.
First, you are never going to argue your way out of being let go. That said, getting the HR person to state the reason(s) on audio or in writing will help for the lawsuit that you should definitely file. The way this was done was shady. They framed it as being fired for underperforming when it was in fact a layoff. Where I live, people who are fired don't get severance and can't file for unemployment (which the employer pays for), while people who are laid off must be paid severance and can get unemployment. I suspect the reason they tried to say her performance was lacking was to avoid the cost of severance and unemployment. Get a lawyer.
It doesn’t matter. The fact that you still don’t grasp that they’ve been having employees sign paperwork on day of hiring that days your job can let you go WITHOUT CAUSE at any given time. You sign that to be hired meaning NO YOU CANT SUE WHEN YOURE LET GO. THEY CAN LET YOU GO FOR ANY REASON OR NONE. This is bc sometimes, MOST TIMES, the employee has a shitty personality and no HR rep is going to tell you that your energy is killing the vibe in the office…so they always use the ole under performance excuse. Bc they know they are protected either way. This clause has been active for 30+ year. Good luck wasting ur time and money.
@@DrLauraRPalmer It absolutely does matter. Your employment might be at will but that does not mean they can legally terminate you for any reason. If they terminate you without cause aka laying you off, you are eligible for benefits (severance, unemployment compensation, etc). They cannot legally misclassify your termination as for cause("performance metrics") to deny you benefits.
@allthingsnm354 Unions can also Bargain away your assured rights in a State with a Contract, like mine did. Oh they also sent paid political campaigners to my home to tell me how to Vote, paid for with our Union Dues. Because of 2020 the Current Administration in the White House told our Union and Our Company they did not need our consent for our new Contract, they gave away so much for our department it isn't funny, I can work 16 hour days 7 days a week and not get double time, ALL other department get double time after 48 hours. Our department gets 40 hours sick and kin care, ALL other departments get 96 hours of the two. Well time for a new contract and time for a new Administration that doesn't sell Unions out, time to switch political parties
@@stevensola3361Yes, I have had negative results from a union as well. If you think about it, the primary goal of any organization (including unions, companies, governments) is to survive. Second is to thrive (aka make a profit and expand). Organizations will prioritize these goals above all others, even if it means selling out their members.
I was forced to resign due to my company trying to get me to skip safety protocols for years. I had text proof and pictures. I went to HR told them I had to quit because I was forced. Went to unemployment got denied cuz HR lied . Appealed and won. They appealed and I won again. I sued with coworkers and now on Friday we are going to a settlement meeting for the 2nd time. Play stupid games win stupid prizes
Sounds like your looking to get paid without working. You were the type of employee to complain to HR and then you quit and somehow got unemployment anyways, and now your trying to get them to give you free money because that is what you wanted from the get go. whatever, you do you, but I am sure the company is completely happy with their decision to get rid of you. After you sue them, they will just be even happier your gone.
@criticalthinker420 oh your mistaken I'm part of 4 employees but I guess all 4 of us were looking to get paid and justice system is rigged in our favor? Why so mad stranger? You def seem like your mad about something. Did your company shutdown cuz you didn't know how to run it? Bankruptcy? Lose it all? Lmao. Maybe you should lay off the drugs pothead.
@criticalthinker420 Read again 420 I quit because I was forced to. They didn't fire me. I had to quit because my job which you have no idea what field it's in was trying to get me to cut corners and disregard safety protocols that could have endanger myself and the public and so I was forced to quit. Next time read 420. They are settling to avoid getting arrested Genius. You sound like the guy who does whatever he's told even if it's illegal and than when the company gets in trouble they fire you the scape goat. Lol. The employee's under me loved me because I protected their life above all. I'm positive the small company I worked for will go under after the lawsuit. Not everyone is fit to run a company.
I had something similar happen to me. I took my former employer to court and won as well. Definitely hold employers accountable and never let them get away with breaking the law.
This baffles me. My first layoff was similar. It was a small company/start up. I was devastated. But the remaining coworkers and the ceo reached out personally and helped us find jobs. I wish other companies follow this.
@@MojofoeTrust me brother, they could give you examples all day long and you would still think it's bs cause at the end of the day you're gone. And you know what, sometimes it is bs. Just take it on the chin and start applying or go on vacation. No need to be dramatic about it.
@@SnowCompanion what she’s doing isn’t drama sis. This is putting them on blast and holding them accountable. Things don’t change when people are passive and allow others to treat them like a trash can. If that’s how you choose to live your life then blessing to you. And ACTUALLY he couldn’t give any examples because he started stumbling all over himself.
Funny how they want you to give 2 week notice when you quit and if you dont you will be deemed unprofessional yet they can let you go at any time for BS reasons. Some wacky shenanigans if you ask me.
It's unfair. That's why I always snap photos of and read the fine print to see if it is AT WILL employment. Most retail and food service is. They can fire you at anytime without a reason and you can quit as well for any reason without notice. I gave a week's notice out of courtesy and had one boss act funny but I told them about the at will policy and they looked annoyed that I made sense and they didn't need nor deserve two weeks notice for a cashier position they can fire me whenever. I watched them fire someone after that person came in for their shift. They clocked in and started work, were called into the office and let go after they traveled all the way there in the cold and rain on public transportation so they can go to H-E-double hockey sticks.
@@michaelandrews4783 yah ...unions aren't what they used to be. They are more about dues then actually helping workers today. I am sure there are good ones but the ones I had to join didn't give a crap about anything but getting money. Nobody where I worked liked them are the rep who never even came by to talk to us. Fricken joke man.
My late wife worked in HR at an Outdoor TV company when they decide to layoff a large percentage of the company employees, she came home crying after having to layoff people she knew personally, the worse was she had to layoff a husband & wife the same day, she left that company shortly after due to her lack of respect for the upper management - as for me I have NO loyalty to any company I work for, my loyalty is to my paycheck!
For me personally I would love to see more companies who do these kind of new hire layoffs (reduction in workforce) exposed for how poorly they are managed. None of this had to happen had the CEO and C-suite execs "read the tea leaves" and not ramped up hiring when other tech companies are doing mass layoffs in 2023. To me this shows all the verifiable signs of extremely poor business leadership and decision making. And in my view the wrong tier of employees are being laid off.
Why is there someone else delivering the message …. When the business make the decision the manager get an approved script and a list of people As manager this is one of the most traumatic experiences of your life because you need to deliver a decision not under your control to the people you work with, people you consider friends, know their families and life situations…. Even the decision is not your own, the process is made to feel like you made the call as they would give you the options which of your staff need to go - not IF but WHICH…. it is reduced to an percentage of cost. You experience this trauma with each of them over and over …. even if you just sit in the call and some consultant deliver the message. That is why ‘seasoned’ managers often do not build close relationships with the people in their organisation structures - but they fight for the performance measures of their staff… never allow the performance review to be used as the reason.
It's super nasty how the HR lady repeatedly uses the phrase "how you feel". Because it's not about how she feels, it's about her rights. She's trying to diminish her rights by re-labeling them as her feelings.
It's the corporate version of "who hurt you?" Meant to dismiss any issue with a blindly confident "I know this is really about something else, not what you're saying"
I got laid off for taking too much time off. My parents died 18 days apart, and I took bereavement leave. I was allowed 5 days per but only took 3 days for each parent. I loved the shocked face of the HR person when I thanked her for laying me off so I could settle the two estates. When I explained what I meant, she sat there with her mouth open, looking stupid. She had no idea what was going on. Same thing as this company, they hired too many people in anticipation of a contract they didnt get. Cowards! Own up to your mistakes rather than blaming somebody else.
So sorry you had to go through that experience. At least they are together again. One of my employers I will speak highly of in regards to this topic was my time at Nike INC, my grandmother passed and I was not even aware we were allowed bereavement time for it, but multiple managers above me encouraged I do so after I mentioned it as reason for my spaceyness that day. It’s no surprise that most places are not like that but I’m glad you got a little bit of “fuck you” to them being shocked at your reply
I tell my undergrads all the time, loyalty is a one-way street. Your company doesn't care how much a termination will upend your entire existence. No matter how many extra hours and sacrifices you make, they will happily ruin your career, your family, and your life if it saves them a nickel, or even, nothing. Keep your skills current, your professional networks up to date, and your resume ready to go.
You are amazing for doing that. So many people, MANY, stay in horrible places because of a loyalty or guilt feeling. I always tell people, companies are not doing you a favor. It is an exchange. You are providing a service and are getting compensated for that. Period.
One thing I've learned over the years in working with a major finance company with a HUGE HR dept is this: HR is NOT there to protect the employees. HR's sole purpose is to protect the company. HR is NOT your friend.
HR does payroll, recruitment, and paperwork involved with hiring, and firings. And advice managers do they dont accidentally cause large fines to the company when employment laws are violated. Why would anyone think they are advocates for the workers?
@@danielch6662 They aren't generally, but really in a sustainable company they need to be. How a company treats employees is a factor in recruitment of talent. Companies that treat their workers better can much more easily attract and retain top talent. As such advocating for employee treatment is an important part of HR as it has positive effect on recruitment.
Imagine being the AD system admin and getting alerts for accounts being disabled in mass in 15 minute increments. You throw up a flag to your boss that something’s going on and are told don’t worry everything is fine then realize you also have a 15 minute meeting on your calendar…
@@ewe392 corporations often embed a code in the documents saved so they cannot be opened offsite but have to be logged into the main server, even from home. The files will say: "Server not found. Contact your system admin."
Frankly, if they are this blatantly lying to their own employees, then how honest are they being with their clients? Why should anyone trust this company at all?
Well. In this case, cloudflare is the world's primary anti hacking web site securer. If you have a web site, you either use them or you have no security since no other company in the world is able to do what they do. None of this makes them right in any way, but nobody with a web site has any choice but to use them. Not using them is an automatic death sentence for your site.
I completely agree there being deceptive. Why is it so hard to simply be blunt, just like Bryan worded it. Were all professional adults here that understand that businesses have metrics to meet. Plus layoffs don’t affect stock value on the company on contrary it benefits companies so I don’t understand the logic of being deceptive which now opened them up to a PR nightmare and potentially a discriminatory lawsuit.
I agree. I was laid off right before Christmas because the contract that I was hired for fell through. But they were honest about it and even asked if I would come back if they got the contract after all and I said yes. They didn't lie to me, I am an adult and understood it was not personal.
I used to work for a really great data company that was purchased by IBM. Our company was decimated over the course of 5 short years, and then the remainder was sold for pennies compared to the purchase price. What i learned is that these companies are a revolving door, desperately trying to prop up the illusion that they can still offer a value proposition to customers. IBM didn't care about our expertise or about improving our product with the use of Watson. They just wanted to look like they cared about this particular industry, sell products that weren't fleshed out, and "resource action" employees to cut costs. Companies like these don't value real expertise. They will pressure older employees to retire early. It's just a mess and all barely legal (if legal at all).
Honest to their own clients.....interesting perspective. One company made a habit to overcharge the clients on all project quotes, and at the end of the year, all of the left over money in the project accounts was divded up for the fat cat bonuses. How's that for trust worthy.
There needs to be a law that any company that laid off workers in the last 12 months can't give executive bonuses. If they cant afford employees then how can you afford a executive bonus?
Like the whole thing is that you’re the boss and you’re supposed to make sure everyone under you knows what they are doing. If they aren’t then who’s really underperforming??????? MAKE IT MAKE SENSE
Tha amount of times i’ve been throwing into the fire no real TRAINING. But then all of a sudden they want to fire me but i’ve never been told im doing a bad job?? I hate everyone
Yes! Because if an ENTIRE team failed, it’s whoever is running the business unit from the top down! THEY failed to set expectations and communicate metrics. But nothing will happen to them because the whole thing is BS, made up reasons to improve the bottom line without regard for the people who just signed new leases or turned down other offers to work at Cloudflare. It’s so upsetting.
I was actually laid off once, and very gently as a mass layoff due to my company not receiving a contract renewal. I loved the place I worked at, was very dedicated to them, and was sad to go. However, they helped each of us with job placement going forward, resumes, additional schooling, we all received severance, they really looked out for us. By far, the best place I ever worked at in my former career. ❤️💛💙
@@madkrakatoa it really did make a difference, and I still feel very fond of the company. The hearts are random; they initially began as a “thing” I just did after posting online MANY years ago. However, I now do so, so I may find my comments far more easily (due to vision issues). 😄❤️💛💙
No regard for their employees what-so-ever: You're just a number. My heart goes out to that young woman, her former peers and all of the others who are in line for the corporate Fascists and their lackeys who treat people like they are taking used receptacles to the Recycle Bin. And if most all of it ends up in the dump anyway, is no real concern to them. Not really. They can say what they want, but the noise of what they are actually doing drowns that out their evasive utterances like white noise. Anyone with a sliver of compassion would leave that position at the first opportunity. Anyone with a sliver of a bran would realize "If they'll do that to them..." and leave that position at the first opportunity. But no, they are there to get paid to do what they do. It's their job, glorified custodians that apparently manage to sleep at night, but I don't see how they can. They have to at least know at some level that the same thing can come back an hit them, at least in a "karmic" sense.
Maybe if we spread the truth about working in HR wide enough, people will stop applying and the entire concept of an HR department will vanish, leaving management open, exposed, and unprotected from the wrath of the people they have so consistently wronged.
Just another reminder, there are no guarantees in life. Save for a rainy day and be as self sufficient as possible. This helps mitigate these surprises life throws our way.
For sure, but when the people built an entire society based on lies... at some point we have to admit we're doing it to ourselves, and it's not just like oh, Nature threw us a bad storm today.
@@dh1163 Incorrect, it's a matter of priorities and making excuses like that will keep you poor. Besides, your just making a statement based on feelings and assumptions with nothing to back it up.
@@Nothankyou219 This is the land of opportunity. The overwhelming majority of people who are one paycheck away from being homeless have made and are making poor choices, that's a fact.
If I am in a termination call...as soon as they say "We are going to have to let you go". Then I am no longer an employee and I will not be signing anything without my lawyer looking at it firs thanks. I'll get back to you in a few days.
These are 3 rules that help keep me grounded. 1. As an employee should show the company as much loyalty as they show you. 2. It's just a job. It's not who I am. 3. You are only a number so don't take it personal. Btw she completely destroyed them.
Agree except the end. She didn't destroy anything but her own hirability for a while. It was a SALES job. She wasn't selling. She was less than 6 months into the role and presumably still within the probation period. Out of 1400 salespeople, she was in the bottom 40 and was let go....nothing personal. It has ALWAYS been this way in Sales. Full Stop.
Just about 5 years ago, I got laid off from a long-term job. It was in person, with my manager and the HR director. The first thing the manager said was that it wasn't anything to do with my performance, and that the decision came from above him. It was tough, but at least they were honest. Good on her for pushing back against the BS.
@@IgorBosnjakfx sandwiched between two major holidays. I suppose you ignored that detail. She only had two weeks of full on production. The HR folks here are being dishonest and are potentially walking the company into a lawsuit.
@@IgorBosnjakfx you have very strong opinions for knowing so little about the situation. I think you might have a chauvinist aversion to female confidence and/or you're just a company man who loves big daddy?
@@IgorBosnjakfx whoa pal, you're changing horses in midstream. I barely pushed and you completely fell over! Just a few minutes ago you were reprimanding her for having a bad attitude, now you're conceding she was good standing up for herself??!! And because you asked, I'm a veteran infantry Marine - separated 17+ years ago honorably. And I'm now a licensed electrical contractor in the Midwest. And actually, I do stay in a basement most of the time when I'm not out and about... It's called my man cave! 😂
@@geofferypmeyersright?! I prefer to here they changing the dynamics of the company, or unfortunately they no longer need a certain amount of workers, but stop lying and say it is the workers fault. Just be honest. The company making changes and that is it. 😌
I started a new job, more of a promotion that required relocation. I was experiencing issues with the flights and travel that THEY did without covering what THEIR policies allow, and encountered crazy weather. The HR representative stated “If you don’t arrive on the day you are suppose to arrive and start date you WILL BE heavily reprimanded and or fired”. I started crying on the phone… I was stuck in an airport, with my luggage and cat. Technically homeless since my car and household was already shipped. I called my supervisor right after, and he got mad and said he would handle it. Thank god for him ❤
They want to avoid unemployment. They did this to a friend who had some issues, but they could not prove that they had tried to coach her to improve performance and my friend won and recieved unemployment.
Absolutely, their is no reason to work for a corporation. A number on a page is all you are, if we know anything, it's that NOTHING matters other than PROFIT. Especially you. Stop applying and start local.
That’s what you get buying into big corps, and big titles for your instagram and tik tok. A sterile letting go of. Small biz will always be the backbone
I found while WORKING here in the last 40+yrs that the ones REALLY Working Hard are held to a higher standard than those who don't. Belonging to the Group that brown noses around often Ineffective "mismanagement" even gets you repeatedly 2hr breaks.....AND YES....some even SLEEP on Duty in front of the Camera !!! I'm NOT Lying here !! Worked 15 of my 19yrs in Miami DadeCounty Jails.....just remember...you have to be from the fitting culture,color too !!!! German Immigrant to Florida 40yrs ago. FORMER RN 😊😊😊FORMER !!!
As someone who’s been through this exact thing - the employer is stating that it’s performance, because if they layoff due to downsizing, they have to pay your unemployment benefits.
I see this all the time. Why is it so hard for people to understand that of course the company is going to try to characterize this as a performance issue, because if they call it fired for cause then the company does not get charged higher unemployment tax rates. Follow the money! Of course companies will lie, they are directly compensated for doing so. The entire unemployment benefit system is a corrupt mess, and it hurts most the people who can afford it the least.
This woman didn't sell anything or make any money at all for the company during her time there apparently. Pretty sure its performance based and this is just an entitled brat who tanked future job prospects because of main character syndrome.
I don't think that's true in California. According to the state website, it doesn't matter if you get laid off or fired as long as you don't get fired for misconduct. I don't think under performance falls under misconduct.
I found this triggering as hell (in a medical sense, I have diagnosed PTSD from workplace abuse), but also incredibly comforting - your professional analysis of a set of experiences similar to my own is really validating. Thank you for this video.
I was laid off by the US National Park Service after I broke my hand. My manager did not know first aid! I was laid off while recovering from hand surgery. Federal law saved me-- it was paid for by the Dept of Labor. ... but the NPS? Corrupt to the core.
My park location was notorious for this. Lyme disease recovery? Broken bone? Even after healing, workers were not hired back. ... Illegal! The Dept of Labor investigated due to these irregularities.
Also i love how UNPREPARED hr was for her questions. Take notes guys. If someone is going to be cold, callous and gaslight you, at least give them a little taste of their own medicine!
It's not HR's job to be prepared or knowledgeable. HR is a group of hitmen, they perform firings and reprimands, that's it. HR people are purposefully kept in the dark in order to not reveal anything that would make the company culpable at a later date
@@AspiePilo82 you can defend yourself and ask questions about your termination. Nobody said you have to record it and post to the internet! Re read the comment as it was clearly focused on her asking them pointed questions 📖👓🤯
Can I just say that I really admire her communication skills? I stutter and stumble on words all of the time. She's in a high-stress, high-emotion situation, and she's speaking more clearly and confidently than I do casually chatting with friends. That's an extremely valuable soft skill, one that's hard to acquire if it doesn't come naturally. Cloudflare's loss
Agree, she seems like she has potential. But Cloudflare probably discovered they can hire offshore remote workers to do the same job for 1/10 the cost...
I suggest that she hires a Employment Attorney. Because to come up with no excuse or a ridiculous excuse is just unacceptable. And like someone also said, HR is not there for the employee, they are there to protect the company as best as they can before lawyers get involved!!
I had HR falsely accuse me of something without evidence or details. Luckily I did not lose my job or get disciplined, but it was such bs. They were just going through the script to save themselves from getting sued by those accusing me. I'm pretty sure that they knew it was a false accusation, but couldn't tell me that due to the politics of it. You lose so much trust after going through that. All I wanted was details because maybe I did unintentionally do something, but was so frustrated when they wouldn't actually tell me what I was accused of.
The ultimate sign of disrespect from a company: Appoint some flunkies with no knowledge of your work history or performance to fire you while everyone you did work for goes and hides.
It’s a big company trimming the fat 🤷♀️ she herself admitted she made ZERO contracts (and closing contracts is her job). So the company has been paying her for over 4 months for nothing in return 🤷♀️ companies want results and are in the business of making money, not keeping ppl around who don’t achieve their objectives 🤷♀️ if u don’t know “ramping up” is when u have a manager or someone who has more experience there for u as a support system- so if u have questions and whatnot they are there for u and generally they will sit in on contact closings to make sure it goes well… so she has had 3 months of that plus 1 month of being fully on her own with zero contracts 🤷♀️ therefore her performance is the worst
@@candicecart9786Your argument doesn't hold up. She barely had any actual work time yet due to when she was hired. All her feedback received up to that point had been positive. So it clearly was not performance.
Based on the repeated vague responses that didn't make much sense, I wouldn't be surprised if the HR people were an A.I. program. If not, it's something that will be coming soon.
As a people manager I was told the night before the company was going to lay off all of my team members. The next morning my team received 15 minute calls on their calendars asking me why they had meetings on their schedule when I had been told I couldn’t tell them. I then had to sit on the video calls with my manager and HR and watch while my team members were laid off. It was one of the worst experiences of my career.
I had a friend laid off after 27 years with a company. 27 years and they discarded him like a piece of trash. Luckily he was smart with money and a good saver and investor.
They hire you to do a job. I would say working 27 years at one job shows a great work culture. Also, good for him. If he had work 27 years and not been financially stable he would have no one to blame but himself.
@@MrTwenty6point2 Everything you said is completely correct, but they’re all very silly points to make in response to OP’s comment. Laying someone off without notice after 27 years may be a perfectly prudent thing to do, but it’s also a bit heartless
@@MrTwenty6point2Staying at a job for 27 years isn't a result of a "good work culture", it's due to being stable employment that provides health insurance. People stay in government jobs forever for the benefits, not because government is a great place to work - on the contrary government environments are very toxic.
@@SurpriseMeJT I agree. I sold my soul to a government job to afford treatments for an extremely pricey autoimmune disease. I’m not sure what the point to even being alive is anymore.
@@heinzerbrew That seems like a scheduling issue. Why would you not schedule time to explain why you're firing people, in between all the people you're firing? If anything, perhaps HR needed to be fired, for poor performance. I'm about to upend peoples lives, with zero notice. They have rent/mortgage, bills, their lives likely depend on making steady money. Yet you don't schedule atleast 30min to discuss how you're potentially leaving them homeless and their kids hungry?
In other words, HR is not going to allow the conversation to drag on for a useless rebuttal. Terminations should be short. There is not much to discuss in the mind of HR.
I’ve been on BOTH sides of this conversation. As a corporate senior manager who had to terminate/layoff staff and the whole process that leads up to it, and as the person getting suddenly laid off over the phone. I can completely relate to both sides. I can tell you, firing someone, even for cause, SUCKS. I hated it. It’s the worst thing I’ve ever had to do. It’s even worse in situations where legal and HR tell you exactly what you can/cannot say. My entire day of firing someone put me in a full-on depression. It sucks. I also received death threats from angry spouses and legitimately feared walking to my car from the office on the day of and following week of a termination. As far as being the one getting laid off…I know exactly what it’s like to answer a phone to hear HR say I’m laid off, instantly feeling the weight of a force pushing my body down, getting tunnel vision as I glared at the inside of my new house that I knew I would likely lose because I just lost my one and only income. And it was a large income. But, I took a very large severance and started a business. I now have multiple incomes, including my own businesses.
This is exactly why I feel zero need to be “loyal” to whatever company I’m working for. These people in HR seem so disconnected from the average worker. If you own a business, don’t ask me to come work loyally for you and then tell me it’s not personal when I am laid off because you sold the company for a billion dollars. I’ll do my job as best as I can but that’s where it ends for me.
When that happens, remind them that they did not answer your question. Then repeat the question, and if they still are not giving you an answer, ask to speak with someone else.
@@judyheller"you'll be hearing from my attorney" is what HR should be told in these cases. Give them a reason to shit bricks knowing they've just potentially exposed the firm to litigation.
People say the employee fired ruined her future career prospects uploading this. But actually, she is holding these companies accountable for taking advantage of people.
Both can be true. I have sympathy but knowing she’s gotten praise for recording company meetings without consent and releasing them publicly, would you hire her?
It's great content for us but I am on the side that recording and uploading this is going to hurt her future prospects. Not a good idea. Always protect your interests!
Honestly this is just giving me the realization that I need to immediately mention that I’m “discussing this with my lawyer” if I’m given “performance issues” if I get laid off, because my reviews are always stellar
I had this video in my queue the other day and lost it. I'm glad it popped up again. I'm retired for a while now and wow. This girl is young, smart, articulate and right on! God bless her. This was wrong. Praying for her to get her dream job. 🙏❤️
Two quotes that I absolutely love to be mentally prepared for such situations: 1. Love your job and not the company. 2. A bird doesn't worry if the branch he is resting on will break or not.
That's very good advice. Clever bit about the bird not caring if the branch breaks. Young people need to hear this advice. Love your job not the company. Fantastic.
Sorry I’m young, can someone explain? Seems to me when you don’t worry about the branch breaking ( just assuming it will support you) you fail to plan a safety net, and it’s a huge shock when it does break. I must be missing something. Can anyone clarify please?
@@icu3869 since the bird has wings it need not worry if the branch breaks. It will fly away and sit on another branch. Similarly, I need to be so self sufficient or confident about my skills (read wings) that it wouldn’t matter if I loose the job.
Loyalty is a two-way street. Although it’s can reasonably be seen to be harsh for an employer to suddenly terminate their employees, the employees can easily do the same.
If your boss says "hey we're all family here" immediately correct them "NO we are not. Family doesn't fire you at the earliest convenience. Family doesn't fire you even after your death. We are just here to trade our time for a little money, and that's all there is to this job. We are not family. We're employees."
Once you leave the negotiating table, you become a statistic on a payscale to be cost-managed. From that point on, it is HR's (and management's) job to psycho-manipulate you into higher productivity without additional pay. If using the word "family" motivates employees to work harder and not leave the company for higher pay, then so be it.
For 7 months, (6 of them were training), I worked for a state office as a social worker. On my way to work, a guy ran a red light and totaled my car, causing a TBI (traumatic brain injury). When I was unable to return to the job, they waited for my vacation to run out and then terminated me for "poor performance." Only 1 person in the department ever met their standards; she had been there for 14 years. I hired a lawyer, but due to my brain damage, I didn't make the best witness.
What I find strange when it comes to layoffs, especially of newer employees, is that the employer spends all these resources on hiring staff, interviewing them, training them; only to fire them a short time later. It seems like a huge waste of money.
In some fields employers got a lot of money from government to hire new employees. If they are later fired because of bad performance - no one care. Employer can hire new employees an got new money. Follow the money.
@oliver_twistor It’s very common that the left hand doesn’t know what the right hand is doing. Different teams are doing different things without knowledge of what the other is doing.
How is a company gonna say you’re fired because of performance, but not be able to IMMEDIATELY produce data to back it up!?! How is that NOT wrongful termination!?!
@@jimbojones9118 They didn't have to give a reason. But they did. That's the problem. If they had said "we're moving in another direction, bye" that's a consequence of at-will employment. No reason needed. Once you make a claim about performance, you're open to being questioned about it. And that can lead to consequences, especially if you're violating employment rules. At-will isn't a "get out of discrimination free card" for example. I'm not a lawyer, but I know this topic well enough to know this was a risk.
One prominent tech company that I worked for, simply emailed firing notices and de-activated employee badges on a Friday after work hours ended. When I came into work on Monday, I had to walk past newly installed security guards. They were there in case any employees came to retaliate. Disgusting !
At the end of the day, the employer doesn’t need to tell you WHY they are terminating the employment, as long as it's not for the protected reasons. But, them lying and saying that her performance doesn’t meet their metrics is totally b.s. They just don't want to pay unemployment.
Long, long ago, I was advised to never befriend or speak willingly with any in HR. They will take anything out of context, betray your trust and turn it against you.
At minimum you should be very very careful if at any point you're being asked to take part in a meeting where anyone from HR is present. My former employer learned very quickly to not involve HR with me directly because I will verbally go after and destroy HR if they open their mouth, easy enough since they know less than zero about actual productive work. Any meeting with me and HR just became me trashing HR and being right, so it wasn't "productive" for them heh. I've been recently terminated, but apparently HR refused to touch it so just my manager alone doing it. He also made promises they haven't kept, and tried to tell me I could keep the company mobile phone that they never gave me 🤣🤣 which was quite funny in a sad way... I was terminated because I broke my back + other related health issues meant I couldn't go to the office, so I worked remote until they shut my account off and filed to terminate me.
@@noth606That happened to me when I was young. The company had meetings that it said was to improve the company. During the meeting about 30 of us were around a large conference table. Nobody answered any questions or engaged in a discussion while the two HR people tried everything to get us to comment or discuss anything they brought up. Finally one of my coworkers from our group made a comment. Everyone looked around at each other. I spoke ip in agreement with my colleague. After the meeting he went up to the HR Director and totally backtracked everything he commented on. I overheard him, but felt like I couldn’t say anything. I also thought it was really bizarre. I got laid off a month later with several others who were at different meetings. My colleague kept his job. I will never forget this lesson.
I love this young lady's discernment. She's no slow leak as we say in the South . God Bless and I pray he opens a door for her somewhere that her hard work will be appreciated . Companies look at you as disposable in most circumstances like this. I hope she at least got unemployment .
Agreed. It's not that everyone in hr is bad, it's that the snakes are SNAKES and there's so many people who almost seem to delight in others misfortune
Exactly… Also I get as a new hire it’s horrible to be let go, but at the same time I feel like she’s acting like she has been at the job for 35 years and actually closed contracts 😂 and is just meeting some randos 🤷♀️ companies pay u- they aren’t your friend or family, that’s why they pay u 😂
Huhu but jumping from company to another company at age 20’s might be okay, but past that age, not that much job people want to hire tho, especially in office work related. Atleast in my country area.
Been there.. and after a 20 yr career at a leading Canadian TELCO my entire team was given a pkg by a manager we had testified against for sexual harassment of his male employee. Sometimes it’s not the large companies to blame, but managers within the company who have their own personal vendettas. He had vowed to get even with us, and when he temporarily inherited our team, he took advantage of that power.
When my mother, along with a bunch of others, was chucked out the door for 'excessive age' her direct supervisor nearly blew a gasket. The excuse they used was 'we don't need your department at that plant, so we don't need you.' 90 days later they hired a fresh out of school young lady to staff the now re-opened department. HOWEVER Mom's attorney said: "YES you have a great case for age discriminations BUT the deal they are offering is health care for LIFE!!" In the end said health care covered Mom and later Dad through multiple bouts of cancer over multiple decades. THAT was expensive!
Healthcare for life isn’t any severance I’ve ever heard of. COBRA benefits suck ass - companies should have to cover all of the cost while you are on unemployment.
I went through this 20 years ago at AT&T after that I rented a retail space and opened up my own small buisness doing taxes and bookkeeping, I worked hard and I am financially secure and could retire tomorrow if I wanted too. I would rather shovel snow and cut grass self employed than ever work for these heartless soulless companies.
An employee invests a lot just accepting the job in the first place. Often they move to a new location, maybe buy a car, rent an apartment, even buy a home, change a relationship to physically be there. They turn down another job or leave other employment for what appears to be a better opportunity. When fired for some kind of cause, all their security in the new situation vanishes. Now their health insurance is gone and that is a giant perk few understand. The question "Why were you let go?" will jeopardize new job opportunities.
OMG!! I Have sooo much respect for you and what you did and especialy what you went thru and rebounded with VICTORY on your side. F-'um if they cant take a joke. soulless heartless! YOU nailed it. Tons of respect and appreciation !! Maybe someone else will take a lead in their own lives, when they read this, than put up with this totally heatless bullshit.
Same here. I worked for different company’s and got laid off twice sucks. Now I’m in the chip and snack business I’m my own boss started servicing two stores and now I service 40 accounts. Started small but I build my route in 2 years.
If your company would hit the fan and you will have to sack them all, what would you do? :D be souless and tell them exact same busllhit, there is no good or bad guys here :) just people who get fired and people who don't :)
I was called into my HR office right after lunch one day, and was told that the owners had decided to retire and hand over the business to their son and he decided to lay off people across 3 plants that the business had and last 5 people who were hired were to be let go. I had been with them 4 years, had just been given a promotion and raise literally 2 months before this, I had just bought a house and was about to move in that same month but didn’t matter of course they gave me a severance package and out the door I went. Heard later the son sold the company to some Asian group a year later, they closed and relocated out of the state it was based in.
That part! I put way too much trust in HR and got screwed over pretty badly. HR is not there to protect you. HR is there to protect the company from you.
@@PortlandMark67 Oh, I'm fully accepting they can be very American in that way, but it's not as prolific / across the board. The difference is probably in the employee rights laws which the current UK clown train is hell bent on relieving them of ? Fair comment and good to see someone actually dispute something in a mannerly fashion. Kudos.
I love how she is defending herself. This would be unheard of in my day. Termination with cause can also effect Unemployment benefits. Hope she fights it. Remember 1980’s early 1990’s they did this to people who gave 20 years of their lives. Never trust a company to be there tomorrow.
But putting it on social media was a real dumb idea. More and more companies as part as of a background check are doing a social media check. If this video comes up most prospective employers are going to trash can her resume/application.
So what's the problem? The business exists ONLY for the benefit of those who put their money into it. There's nothing wrong with that. The vendors, including the vendors of labor, are also trading only to serve their interests. There is nothing wrong with that.
My husband was in the semi conductor industry for nearly 20 years when he was finally laid off in 2009. We used half of his 401k to stay in our home of 11 years. Ended up losing it all. Come across so many people who weren’t affected by the mass fall outs from 2008 era. He was considered over qualified for basic jobs and no tech companies were hiring in any state. The info and advice you give is great! We can relate to those who may feel “it can’t happen to me.” I’d caution anyone who may tend to feel that way. Plan for the worst, hope for the best. 💜
Having been laid off via mass email last February (worked at the company 9 years when it got bought by an overseas investor), watching this video gave me the sense of closure I’ve desperately needed. This girl said so many things I wish I had the chance to say. Thanks for covering this!
I hope you are doing good I wish the best a better future but it’s sad nowadays the corporate world it’s very harsh and I don’t know what was yuor job but tech sales it’s hard it’s very difficult and demanding very it’s not easy money
It had nothing to do with you it’s them they have their own motives to let you go that yu never know yu did a great job believe me when a company decides to let go of employees they will let you go regardless how hard yu worked don’t take it personal I know after 9 years secured job it’s awful feeling sorry but it’s going on all over look into videos of this how companies sneak treat employees
A mass email is heinous, but at least it’s impersonal. These people were blaming the employee for poor performance, as if it were personal when her only mistake was in being a recent hire when they were told to layoff a certain number of people.
I worked for a huge bank. They fired people left and right. whole departments would be gone in the blink of an eye. There was a management guy in a cubicle near me and he had been there 20 years - one day I came in and he wasn't there. He had been let go. There was a group of people who got hired and then let go 6 weeks later .... the bank said they changed their mind about the new dept - too bad for you. So all those people gave up other jobs to work there and were unemployed 6 weeks later. The way companies act towards employees is disgusting.
your livelihood hangs from the whims of a clueless group of executives who make stupid and unpredictable decisions to please shareholders, often unsuccessfully. work for yourself
@@momoneyinvestingIf they're foolish, the business will fail. Should employees not be allowed to leave a company unless they document a bunch of problems and go through a big process?
@@nwatson2773no if you work for American companies in a decent country even then American companies tries to do this and often they get sued big time. It’s actually happening more often than not now. American companies suck period.
"Poor Performance" I love how at my company there are metrics that are literally impossible to get anything other than an average or worse rating on. Perfect Attendance with no incidents gets you 3 stars out of 5.
Love your channel!!! Can I just say that this is why I think it's so important that as a country, us Americans have to band together because it's the shareholders and the CEOs, the millionaires and the politicians who are our enemy, not each other. We are stronger together.
The shareholders are largely you and me and endowments. The average guy with a few million is just buying mutual funds and has nothing to do with making decisions any more than you do thru the mutual fund I your 401k plan. The enemy here is incompetent companies which is probably why they are laying off to start.
“I cannot speak to what your manager said to you directly” Well they sure tried in the beginning when they suggested her performance was the cause of her layoff.
That's one of the wildest things to me, the HR team should have a list of everything the manager has to say ab an employee but instead they seem to be as hands off as possible
@darkriku12 That's exactly what it is. The company is trying to prevent itself from having it's unemployment insurance tax from going up, which would happen if they did a big layoff. They are hoping no, or only a few people successfully fight it, so that their rates don't go up, or don't go up as much as if 100% of those laid off got unemployment.
Neologistic nonsense. Buzzwords. Sound and fury, signifying nothing. “A changing strategy going forward” is another example. People hearing but not listening.
13 years at the company I was with, they let go of 22 people over a mass phone call. Some had been there longer. Then a few months later the company was bought out and they were hiring. All the hr staff left. They said it was due to covid. Covid was over and the others I knew that were let go all had health issues but were all hard workers. We were always told we were a family too. It was life changing. At the time it did not feel good I was devastated. Now I am glad it happened. My life is better. Things happen for a reason. The way they did it was so wrong. Being my own boss and helping others is so much better for me and my family.
If i were the owner of any company, i would want old school culture, no HR, that would be me...requirements for the job is, your history of your skills you applied for..then its up to me, no circle jerks for a interview, your demeanor and history is all i need, the ability to make us money, you clock out, you do what you do. Are there any takers out there?
As a manager, I would quit my job if my company was laying people off without me being there and without my input. I value treating my team members as a humans with families. This is cold and calculating. The composure and passion this lady has is very valuable. Good luck on her future endeavors.
Why can’t these companies just say they aren’t meeting their performance expectations? They hired too many people, they invested in the wrong strategy, they’re not ramping as expected, they’re existing a particular field? Why do they tear down the employee and try to make them feel worthless? Ugh!
Because they expect the employees they are laying off to be idiots and blindly accept the fact that they are being let go due to performance reasons. This way, the company can pay a tiny severance (or no severance at all).
So they don't have to offer severance, job placement services, or an option to rehire or post into another internal position. They close the door, lock it, throw away the key, and burn all the bridges to the door. But clearly the company is on notice that no one in their right mind is ever going to want to work for them.
No one in their right mind is going to want to work for Cloudflare, the premier online cybersecurity firm in the world whose stock price is up 93% over the last year? Cloudflare is forecast to grow earnings and revenue by 28.9% and 21.9% per annum respectively. EPS is expected to grow by 38.9% per annum. Return on equity is forecast to be 19.9% in 3 years. Account Executive makes $94k/yr and enterprise account executive is $149k/yr.
@@obcane3072 🤣 Bro, do you work for Cloudflare's marketing department?? You're quoting a bunch of shit that helps the people who own stock in the company (i.e. the wealthy), or people who are connected in such a way to be able to land your quoted executive jobs (those related to the wealthy). This is about normal rank and file workers, getting screwed over by a well preforming company. If they are doing so well, why are they firing that woman's whole department basically? How good a company is preforming on the stock market isn't a consideration most people use when wanting to work for a company, as many companies maximize their profit margins (and therefore their stock performance) by doing things as cheaply as possible, and the main overhead in any business is personnel. Pay, benefits, and how easy it is to leave without too many entanglements are the mains ones with today's workers, so they can try to at least maximize their most likely limited times with said company. Who do those companies pay to maximize their workforce with the lowest possible investment? Middle managers, who get a bonus based on the performance of those under them, usually some dumb ratio such as hours worked per employee. Ever work in retail? They'll ask you to grind your ass off doing "mandatory" overtime, just to cut everyone's hours to under full time when they can sucker enough young people into working for them to do so. The general store manager gets the quarterly bonus for maximizing the place's profits per square feet, and the employees get to walk on eggshells even worse then office/skilled workers.
They are saying that. The problem is that it's a lie. If it were truth they'd have performance metrics with them (at the very least they will have already been compiled into a document, and do not need to be generated after the firing upon request), she would have been told about poor performance in the past, and she'd have been put on a performance improvement plan. Not sure what law is surrounding redundancy in this area, but she is being made redundant and they do not want this to be the official reason, probably for legal or financial reasons.
I totally agree with your assessment that those who are planning the layoffs after hiring only a short time ago should be held accountable. That is incompetence. It costs thousands to onboard new people and to just fire them all after 3 months is ridiculous and speaks to a real organizational issue, IMO.
Had one job 30 years ago, where at the Christmas party I am praised by CEO and received standing ovation and had great year. Went on holidays, came back & told I screwed up & laid off.
I feel like she'll have a possible lawsuit. They didn't say she was being downsized. They said she was being let go due to performance issues that they couldn't produce. Basically, lying on her.
In the US if I fire someone for cause I need the process fully documented. Inform the employee of performance problems, track their performance, deliver a PIP (performance improvement plan) if things aren't improving and finally let them go. At that point they know it's coming. I've never let someone go with cause that didn't have ample time to get their act together. Failing all that, it's very common for someone to sue for unlawful termination and get paid.
Idk, she admitted herself she made no sales as a sales person, at a time of year when people had leftover budgets to spend. I get she was new, and maybe it was just poor luck that she didn't close any deals, but it seriously does sound like she had an opportunity to close some deals but was unable to by her own admission. Sounds like the company does have a leg to stand on, even if it's crappy of them.
@jackbeame yup and she admitted it. It sucks but that’s sales. The enemy here is the economy being terrible right now and it’s only going to get worse.
True, but they have a case if she was a salesperson and she made 0 sales by admission. “I was really good in meetings with my manager and really good at almost selling” is not gonna hold up in court. Or shouldn’t anyways. If you’re an NBA star and practice super hard but in games score 0, you won’t be employed.
At one time I was working in the O&G industry, my team had an impromptu meeting one day with the HR representative in the area. She laid off all the staff. At the end she was laughing at us until she got a phone call from higher HR and he told her that she was also on the next bus. This put a smile on my face this day.
That is a common occurrence. They often pass the job of laying staff off to someone who's going to be receiving the same message in the not too distant future. I suppose, to their mind, it minimises the 'stench' that lingers...
No idea, some people are sadistic like that, or maybe it was a kind of reaction, as she already knew that she will be the last one on the list. I don't care anymore.
Amazon tried screwing me over on an injury. We were about to hit a big safety bonus the next day after I hurt my shoulder and my manager told me not to go to medical and sent me home for the day, then he disabled my badge. I tried clocking in for 3 days in a row and couldnt. Then they marked me as a no call no show and terminated me. When i was able to prove all this to the judge, i won my unemployment case. The judge was pissed and said some stuff to HR. Fuck you Dave and fuck amazon. Started my art career and im making way more money and im way happier. And im my own boss!
I think my key takeaway was "you're not being singled out". You mean my whole department is under-performing? Why weren't we put on performance improvement plans? Is the whole department being let go because a manager failed to meet their metrics?
This hit hard, I just got let go in a mass layoff this month, following a company merger. It was a "last hired, first fired... er... laid-off" situation. I had just finished my training period 🙄
CloudFlare is really going to struggle to hire new talent after this. Who wants to risk being fired before you’ve even understood your role or product.
@@EMdragonKnight They told her she was being fired for performance issues which they couldn’t substantiate. Working at CloudFlare may be more detrimental to your resume or career than the benefits of working for a great company.
@robmcd So they suck at firing people. However as far as the products they sell its pretty competitive. I am coming from the perspective of interviewing with them (so I researched their products and company during that) and I've come across their employees over the years in meetups. It's a good company and they suck at firing people. That doesn't mean their products and working conditions suck.
Original video: www.tiktok.com/@brittanypeachhh/video/7323004085043612959
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First time here. Would be nice to see video on the unemployment filing experience. They want you to find a job ASAP. Due to theft ? Tons of checks and balances . Outdated search systems. The workers there OMG. From one trauma to anther. Thanks for your work.
isn't it illegal to surreptitiously record conversations the way she did?
@ALifeAfterLayoff ,isnt it illegal to record electronic conversations w/o consent??
@@sanle7515 I believe all electronic communications are being recorded. Private conversations are allowed to be recorded in some states with only one persons consent. In other states it requires both parties knowledge. For example, when someone leaves a voicemail they KNOW they are being recorded so they have given their consent. And you can use that in a courtroom as evidence.
If you secretly record someone with a hidden camera or recording device in a location where they think they have privacy, or they believe it's just the two of you, depending on the state, that is not admissible in court. Silicon valley is in a 2-party consent state
It's one reason I prefer a doctor appointment in person and not over the phone. Doctor patient confidentiality goes out the window as soon as your appointment is done online or by phone
Every ZOOM meeting, online learning, court appearance, all of it, was being watched by the Chinese and they were gathering more data on Americans per day than the NSA does.
Anything that can transmit can also receive. The Ring doorbell is apparently easy to break into and watch people inside their homes. I'll never understand people who want robots or smart devices in their homes
It's bad enough already with these cell phones.
I would posit that we no longer have a true capitalist society. If you look at the definitions of corporatism(or mercantilism), those would be the closest to what we're currently living. And it's global, which means we're all in trouble.@@derekprospero
I once begged an HR person letting me go to call it a 'reduction of force' instead of performance. He coldly told me that would be up to unemployment administartive judge. They had a handbook we all signed that included the process was first a verbal, then two written warnings about your supposed poor perfomance.
It affectced about 40 people. So I appealed with unemployment and asked the company to produce the 'handbook'. They would not produce the copy for the judge who saw that as willful denial on the companies part. I was able to get the wrongly listed performance layoff changed to a layoff and everybody got their unemployment.
I was the only person on the project willing to asppeal it and everybody won.
Wow congrats on the win. Why was everyone else such cowards that they wouldnt appeal? This is why i dont like working with others in large companies. In most jobs ive been in, most people show to be cowards. I prefer to work solo and have my own business.
Here:🏆✨”VIP Award for Triumph over Tyranny“
CONGRATULATIONS . Thank you for Being a resilient, assertive speaker of Truth in a flock of sheep who don’t think to question the Shepard. Speaking Up, Standing your Ground, Being Assertive in the Face of Intimidating authority in spite of Uncertainty , this is what real power is, and who we should all strive to be. You are an inspiration and on behalf of everyone who you’ve helped, thank you, and Good Job. 👍
So if you take on a job and it doesn't work out cos your not suited to it can't pick up the training you can't get unemployment. Assume America wth?
I guess I wasn't clear enough. They lied about it being performance based in order to get out of their obligation to pay the unemployment. I proved that by showing they had not followed their own guidelines.@@busandcoach
Niiice ❤
I was laid off for "Performance Issues" 5 days after I got a 5 star performance review and a 4% raise. They're all full of shit.
Same thing happened to me!
Very similar experience
I literally just got a 5 star performance review a few days ago, no raise sadly, but you're making me nervous
Wow
@@dannylaza1326 Neah, don't be nervous. Everything will be alright. It's just the way the economy is. Vote out the democrats and it helps. I promise you that. Plus food and gas comes way down when Conservatives are in office.
Used to work in HR. They fire you as opposed to laying you off because if they fire you "with cause" you aren't eligible for unemployment. "Poor performance" is the major reason for "firing" someone in these situations. If they lay you off, and all of you collect unemployment, their unemployment insurance premiums go sky high. It's all about money.
Not selling anything isn’t “for cause”. It’s just performance at that point. For cause is fighting, stealing, insubordination, gross safety violations, etc.
An old employer tried to suspend me for three days over Christmas, after Moving the Goalposts so that I would never succeed: overlapping negative evaluations and evaluation periods with no end in sight. So I reisgned with Immediate Effect, the Unemployment Office ruled it as a Constructive Dismissal and I got Unemployment Benefits that supported me until I re-enlisted a couple months later.
I appreciate the honesty. Can I ask why you no longer work in HR? Tired of being unethical with people so you quit?
This must be the US. I have never heard of unemployment insurance.
I live in the US, in WA state. "Failing" at a job is not cause. You can still collect unemployment. "Cause" has to be either an illegal act or a clear direct violation of a company policy. It's very rare to not qualify for unemployment pay if the company let's you go.
First, you are never going to argue your way out of being let go. That said, getting the HR person to state the reason(s) on audio or in writing will help for the lawsuit that you should definitely file.
The way this was done was shady. They framed it as being fired for underperforming when it was in fact a layoff. Where I live, people who are fired don't get severance and can't file for unemployment (which the employer pays for), while people who are laid off must be paid severance and can get unemployment. I suspect the reason they tried to say her performance was lacking was to avoid the cost of severance and unemployment. Get a lawyer.
My guess is that this is what they were trying to prevent.. I would be curious to see if anyone filed.
It doesn’t matter. The fact that you still don’t grasp that they’ve been having employees sign paperwork on day of hiring that days your job can let you go WITHOUT CAUSE at any given time. You sign that to be hired meaning NO YOU CANT SUE WHEN YOURE LET GO. THEY CAN LET YOU GO FOR ANY REASON OR NONE. This is bc sometimes, MOST TIMES, the employee has a shitty personality and no HR rep is going to tell you that your energy is killing the vibe in the office…so they always use the ole under performance excuse. Bc they know they are protected either way.
This clause has been active for 30+ year. Good luck wasting ur time and money.
@@DrLauraRPalmer It absolutely does matter. Your employment might be at will but that does not mean they can legally terminate you for any reason. If they terminate you without cause aka laying you off, you are eligible for benefits (severance, unemployment compensation, etc). They cannot legally misclassify your termination as for cause("performance metrics") to deny you benefits.
@@ZackForester they do change classification in Florida. If they fire u for being gay, they can put poor performance on form
This is why it is laughable when a company expects any loyalty. It is a contract, I work, you pay me, end of relationship.
That is correct and when in a labor union it is a literal defined legal contract. Unions take companies out of their preferred grey area.
@allthingsnm354 Unions can also Bargain away your assured rights in a State with a Contract, like mine did. Oh they also sent paid political campaigners to my home to tell me how to Vote, paid for with our Union Dues. Because of 2020 the Current Administration in the White House told our Union and Our Company they did not need our consent for our new Contract, they gave away so much for our department it isn't funny, I can work 16 hour days 7 days a week and not get double time, ALL other department get double time after 48 hours. Our department gets 40 hours sick and kin care, ALL other departments get 96 hours of the two. Well time for a new contract and time for a new Administration that doesn't sell Unions out, time to switch political parties
@@stevensola3361Yes, I have had negative results from a union as well. If you think about it, the primary goal of any organization (including unions, companies, governments) is to survive. Second is to thrive (aka make a profit and expand). Organizations will prioritize these goals above all others, even if it means selling out their members.
@@stevensola3361 Get out of the union, hire a lawyer, and sue both the union and the employer ? 🤷🏼♀️
💯
I was forced to resign due to my company trying to get me to skip safety protocols for years. I had text proof and pictures. I went to HR told them I had to quit because I was forced. Went to unemployment got denied cuz HR lied . Appealed and won. They appealed and I won again. I sued with coworkers and now on Friday we are going to a settlement meeting for the 2nd time. Play stupid games win stupid prizes
Sounds like your looking to get paid without working. You were the type of employee to complain to HR and then you quit and somehow got unemployment anyways, and now your trying to get them to give you free money because that is what you wanted from the get go. whatever, you do you, but I am sure the company is completely happy with their decision to get rid of you. After you sue them, they will just be even happier your gone.
@criticalthinker420 oh your mistaken I'm part of 4 employees but I guess all 4 of us were looking to get paid and justice system is rigged in our favor? Why so mad stranger? You def seem like your mad about something. Did your company shutdown cuz you didn't know how to run it? Bankruptcy? Lose it all? Lmao. Maybe you should lay off the drugs pothead.
@criticalthinker420 Read again 420 I quit because I was forced to. They didn't fire me. I had to quit because my job which you have no idea what field it's in was trying to get me to cut corners and disregard safety protocols that could have endanger myself and the public and so I was forced to quit. Next time read 420. They are settling to avoid getting arrested Genius. You sound like the guy who does whatever he's told even if it's illegal and than when the company gets in trouble they fire you the scape goat. Lol. The employee's under me loved me because I protected their life above all. I'm positive the small company I worked for will go under after the lawsuit. Not everyone is fit to run a company.
My responses keep getting removed so obviously something weird is going on. Moving on and ignoring
I had something similar happen to me. I took my former employer to court and won as well. Definitely hold employers accountable and never let them get away with breaking the law.
How do you come to a meeting to fire someone and can’t tell them the reason you’re firing them? 🤣
This baffles me. My first layoff was similar. It was a small company/start up. I was devastated. But the remaining coworkers and the ceo reached out personally and helped us find jobs.
I wish other companies follow this.
They literally said performance. Open your ears 😂
@@ragnarok7976 people can use WORDS all day long, but when they don’t have any actual EXAMPLES that doesn’t mean anything.
@@MojofoeTrust me brother, they could give you examples all day long and you would still think it's bs cause at the end of the day you're gone. And you know what, sometimes it is bs. Just take it on the chin and start applying or go on vacation. No need to be dramatic about it.
@@SnowCompanion what she’s doing isn’t drama sis. This is putting them on blast and holding them accountable. Things don’t change when people are passive and allow others to treat them like a trash can. If that’s how you choose to live your life then blessing to you.
And ACTUALLY he couldn’t give any examples because he started stumbling all over himself.
The HR person sounds like a Politician never answering the question directly.
Because they can't. They're basically trying to minimize any lawsuits.
If AI ever takes over any job the first should be HR, because they sounded just like robots.
AHahahah
But yes
the one firing u is someone higher up. hr is just the messenger.
And they literally do nothing 🙄
Precisely
The HR could be replaced with one of Jolly Roger Phone Company's bots.
Funny how they want you to give 2 week notice when you quit and if you dont you will be deemed unprofessional yet they can let you go at any time for BS reasons. Some wacky shenanigans if you ask me.
It's unfair. That's why I always snap photos of and read the fine print to see if it is AT WILL employment. Most retail and food service is. They can fire you at anytime without a reason and you can quit as well for any reason without notice. I gave a week's notice out of courtesy and had one boss act funny but I told them about the at will policy and they looked annoyed that I made sense and they didn't need nor deserve two weeks notice for a cashier position they can fire me whenever. I watched them fire someone after that person came in for their shift. They clocked in and started work, were called into the office and let go after they traveled all the way there in the cold and rain on public transportation so they can go to H-E-double hockey sticks.
Never give two weeks.
Make sure to use vacation before hand too, they won’t always pay it out. I had 3 weeks saved and didn’t get any of it paid out.
Join a union and do something about it like every other modern country.
@@michaelandrews4783 yah ...unions aren't what they used to be. They are more about dues then actually helping workers today. I am sure there are good ones but the ones I had to join didn't give a crap about anything but getting money. Nobody where I worked liked them are the rep who never even came by to talk to us. Fricken joke man.
My late wife worked in HR at an Outdoor TV company when they decide to layoff a large percentage of the company employees, she came home crying after having to layoff people she knew personally, the worse was she had to layoff a husband & wife the same day, she left that company shortly after due to her lack of respect for the upper management - as for me I have NO loyalty to any company I work for, my loyalty is to my paycheck!
I love this young woman. So composed and confident. A lot of people, not just women, would start tearing up and shutting down.
I also love how she prolongs the meeting when it is clear that the people on the other end want it to be over and to move on to the next poor soul.
She was rude.
@@KayDejaVu It's not rude to ask for clarification on why your life is being disrupted seemingly out of nowhere.
@@KayDejaVu Is it rude to tell a criminal that they are lying?
@@KayDejaVu
I suspect you levy that determination upon anyone with whom you disagree.
It's invalid.
With employers like this I don’t think you’ll ever run out of content…
😂😂😂😂 right.
For me personally I would love to see more companies who do these kind of new hire layoffs (reduction in workforce) exposed for how poorly they are managed. None of this had to happen had the CEO and C-suite execs "read the tea leaves" and not ramped up hiring when other tech companies are doing mass layoffs in 2023. To me this shows all the verifiable signs of extremely poor business leadership and decision making. And in my view the wrong tier of employees are being laid off.
CloudFail
Why is there someone else delivering the message ….
When the business make the decision the manager get an approved script and a list of people
As manager this is one of the most traumatic experiences of your life because you need to deliver a decision not under your control to the people you work with, people you consider friends, know their families and life situations…. Even the decision is not your own, the process is made to feel like you made the call as they would give you the options which of your staff need to go - not IF but WHICH…. it is reduced to an percentage of cost.
You experience this trauma with each of them over and over …. even if you just sit in the call and some consultant deliver the message.
That is why ‘seasoned’ managers often do not build close relationships with the people in their organisation structures - but they fight for the performance measures of their staff… never allow the performance review to be used as the reason.
And this is only mildly bad, they get much much worse
It's super nasty how the HR lady repeatedly uses the phrase "how you feel". Because it's not about how she feels, it's about her rights. She's trying to diminish her rights by re-labeling them as her feelings.
My thoughts exactly.
It's the corporate version of "who hurt you?"
Meant to dismiss any issue with a blindly confident "I know this is really about something else, not what you're saying"
@@cleanmikeandtheboys3165 Yep, it's the same tactic.
Not even a matter of rights, "how your feel" is just a machavelian cover for HR's brazen lies.
she's a vulture and i haven't met an HR rep who isn't
The main issue was that she was not being laid off, she was being fired for inadequate performance before she even had a chance to perform.
This corporation uses the "revolving door" hiring and firing system. She can reapply in a year if she wants to return.
I got laid off for taking too much time off. My parents died 18 days apart, and I took bereavement leave. I was allowed 5 days per but only took 3 days for each parent. I loved the shocked face of the HR person when I thanked her for laying me off so I could settle the two estates. When I explained what I meant, she sat there with her mouth open, looking stupid. She had no idea what was going on. Same thing as this company, they hired too many people in anticipation of a contract they didnt get. Cowards! Own up to your mistakes rather than blaming somebody else.
Yeah I would get an attorney, take my reviews and take them to court for wrongful termination, or at least lying for the reason I was let go.
So sorry you had to go through that experience. At least they are together again. One of my employers I will speak highly of in regards to this topic was my time at Nike INC, my grandmother passed and I was not even aware we were allowed bereavement time for it, but multiple managers above me encouraged I do so after I mentioned it as reason for my spaceyness that day. It’s no surprise that most places are not like that but I’m glad you got a little bit of “fuck you” to them being shocked at your reply
I tell my undergrads all the time, loyalty is a one-way street. Your company doesn't care how much a termination will upend your entire existence. No matter how many extra hours and sacrifices you make, they will happily ruin your career, your family, and your life if it saves them a nickel, or even, nothing. Keep your skills current, your professional networks up to date, and your resume ready to go.
Facts
💯
You are amazing for doing that. So many people, MANY, stay in horrible places because of a loyalty or guilt feeling. I always tell people, companies are not doing you a favor. It is an exchange. You are providing a service and are getting compensated for that. Period.
But they want a 2 week notice when you resign.
It's like that woman working her arse off for Elon Musk, even sleeping in the office, but just laid her off despite her loyalty.
One thing I've learned over the years in working with a major finance company with a HUGE HR dept is this: HR is NOT there to protect the employees. HR's sole purpose is to protect the company. HR is NOT your friend.
HRs primary purpose is to protect itself and milk money from the organisation!
No. HR is still people. So HR’s job is to make sure they themselves are not fired.
For the intra-company affairs, HR is nobody's friend. They're are merely the intermediary taking action on tasks assigned to them from higher ups.
HR does payroll, recruitment, and paperwork involved with hiring, and firings. And advice managers do they dont accidentally cause large fines to the company when employment laws are violated. Why would anyone think they are advocates for the workers?
@@danielch6662 They aren't generally, but really in a sustainable company they need to be. How a company treats employees is a factor in recruitment of talent. Companies that treat their workers better can much more easily attract and retain top talent. As such advocating for employee treatment is an important part of HR as it has positive effect on recruitment.
Not me but my husband’s colleague, got the firm’s annual “top performer” reward and got fired for performance 2 months later🤪
Exact thing happen to me. What a bunch of two faces right
Imagine being the AD system admin and getting alerts for accounts being disabled in mass in 15 minute increments. You throw up a flag to your boss that something’s going on and are told don’t worry everything is fine then realize you also have a 15 minute meeting on your calendar…
Screenshot and save everything
@@ewe392 corporations often embed a code in the documents saved so they cannot be opened offsite but have to be logged into the main server, even from home. The files will say: "Server not found. Contact your system admin."
Frankly, if they are this blatantly lying to their own employees, then how honest are they being with their clients? Why should anyone trust this company at all?
Well. In this case, cloudflare is the world's primary anti hacking web site securer. If you have a web site, you either use them or you have no security since no other company in the world is able to do what they do.
None of this makes them right in any way, but nobody with a web site has any choice but to use them. Not using them is an automatic death sentence for your site.
I completely agree there being deceptive. Why is it so hard to simply be blunt, just like Bryan worded it. Were all professional adults here that understand that businesses have metrics to meet. Plus layoffs don’t affect stock value on the company on contrary it benefits companies so I don’t understand the logic of being deceptive which now opened them up to a PR nightmare and potentially a discriminatory lawsuit.
I agree. I was laid off right before Christmas because the contract that I was hired for fell through. But they were honest about it and even asked if I would come back if they got the contract after all and I said yes. They didn't lie to me, I am an adult and understood it was not personal.
I used to work for a really great data company that was purchased by IBM. Our company was decimated over the course of 5 short years, and then the remainder was sold for pennies compared to the purchase price.
What i learned is that these companies are a revolving door, desperately trying to prop up the illusion that they can still offer a value proposition to customers. IBM didn't care about our expertise or about improving our product with the use of Watson. They just wanted to look like they cared about this particular industry, sell products that weren't fleshed out, and "resource action" employees to cut costs. Companies like these don't value real expertise. They will pressure older employees to retire early. It's just a mess and all barely legal (if legal at all).
Honest to their own clients.....interesting perspective. One company made a habit to overcharge the clients on all project quotes, and at the end of the year, all of the left over money in the project accounts was divded up for the fat cat bonuses. How's that for trust worthy.
There needs to be a law that any company that laid off workers in the last 12 months can't give executive bonuses. If they cant afford employees then how can you afford a executive bonus?
It's disgusting that you think the government should have so much control over private businesses. Go to China if that's the kind of rule you want.
THANK YOU!!!
Like the whole thing is that you’re the boss and you’re supposed to make sure everyone under you knows what they are doing. If they aren’t then who’s really underperforming??????? MAKE IT MAKE SENSE
Tha amount of times i’ve been throwing into the fire no real TRAINING. But then all of a sudden they want to fire me but i’ve never been told im doing a bad job?? I hate everyone
Yes! Because if an ENTIRE team failed, it’s whoever is running the business unit from the top down! THEY failed to set expectations and communicate metrics. But nothing will happen to them because the whole thing is BS, made up reasons to improve the bottom line without regard for the people who just signed new leases or turned down other offers to work at Cloudflare. It’s so upsetting.
I was actually laid off once, and very gently as a mass layoff due to my company not receiving a contract renewal. I loved the place I worked at, was very dedicated to them, and was sad to go. However, they helped each of us with job placement going forward, resumes, additional schooling, we all received severance, they really looked out for us. By far, the best place I ever worked at in my former career. ❤️💛💙
Wow that marks a difference, quite nice of them.
Curious, are the hearts colors at the end of your comment random? Or are they a flag?
@@madkrakatoa it really did make a difference, and I still feel very fond of the company.
The hearts are random; they initially began as a “thing” I just did after posting online MANY years ago. However, I now do so, so I may find my comments far more easily (due to vision issues). 😄❤️💛💙
@@ashleyh9695 clever emoji usage 💜
That is sad. Having anonymous bureaucrats fire employees is corporate cowardice at its finest.
Sickening.
Totally gutless
Remember H/R is not your friend nor will they ever be, they work for the company and you are human resources its in the name !
Lady definitely has a deep throat with no gag
They add little to no value to a business at best.
HR's main priority is to protect the company from being sued by the employee.
@@untouchable360x they're doing a terrible job
No regard for their employees what-so-ever: You're just a number. My heart goes out to that young woman, her former peers and all of the others who are in line for the corporate Fascists and their lackeys who treat people like they are taking used receptacles to the Recycle Bin.
And if most all of it ends up in the dump anyway, is no real concern to them. Not really. They can say what they want, but the noise of what they are actually doing drowns that out their evasive utterances like white noise.
Anyone with a sliver of compassion would leave that position at the first opportunity. Anyone with a sliver of a bran would realize "If they'll do that to them..." and leave that position at the first opportunity.
But no, they are there to get paid to do what they do. It's their job, glorified custodians that apparently manage to sleep at night, but I don't see how they can. They have to at least know at some level that the same thing can come back an hit them, at least in a "karmic" sense.
I’ll never regret no longer working in HR. You’re just the fall person that does the dirty work for management.
T H I S
I hate America’s work culture
Maybe if we spread the truth about working in HR wide enough, people will stop applying and the entire concept of an HR department will vanish, leaving management open, exposed, and unprotected from the wrath of the people they have so consistently wronged.
good choice you made
You may be surprised that some people do enjoy it.
Just another reminder, there are no guarantees in life. Save for a rainy day and be as self sufficient as possible. This helps mitigate these surprises life throws our way.
True that.
For sure, but when the people built an entire society based on lies... at some point we have to admit we're doing it to ourselves, and it's not just like oh, Nature threw us a bad storm today.
Most people don't make enough to "save for rainy days."
@@dh1163 Incorrect, it's a matter of priorities and making excuses like that will keep you poor. Besides, your just making a statement based on feelings and assumptions with nothing to back it up.
@@Nothankyou219 This is the land of opportunity. The overwhelming majority of people who are one paycheck away from being homeless have made and are making poor choices, that's a fact.
If I am in a termination call...as soon as they say "We are going to have to let you go". Then I am no longer an employee and I will not be signing anything without my lawyer looking at it firs thanks. I'll get back to you in a few days.
These are 3 rules that help keep me grounded.
1. As an employee should show the company as much loyalty as they show you.
2. It's just a job. It's not who I am.
3. You are only a number so don't take it personal.
Btw she completely destroyed them.
Exactly.
Agree except the end. She didn't destroy anything but her own hirability for a while. It was a SALES job. She wasn't selling. She was less than 6 months into the role and presumably still within the probation period.
Out of 1400 salespeople, she was in the bottom 40 and was let go....nothing personal. It has ALWAYS been this way in Sales. Full Stop.
No, she didn't "destroy" them, them being just the HR people who were merely delivering on action items that had been decided by the powers that be.
Plus, if she takes legal action, any chance of getting a job in the future just went down the loo.
@@snazzyd8866 True. They should have been prepared rather than waffle.
Just about 5 years ago, I got laid off from a long-term job. It was in person, with my manager and the HR director. The first thing the manager said was that it wasn't anything to do with my performance, and that the decision came from above him. It was tough, but at least they were honest. Good on her for pushing back against the BS.
Bingo. Their #1 mistake was blaming it on her performance when it was clearly the fact that cLoUdFlArE couldnt afford payroll 🤨
@@IgorBosnjakfx sandwiched between two major holidays. I suppose you ignored that detail. She only had two weeks of full on production. The HR folks here are being dishonest and are potentially walking the company into a lawsuit.
@@IgorBosnjakfx you have very strong opinions for knowing so little about the situation. I think you might have a chauvinist aversion to female confidence and/or you're just a company man who loves big daddy?
@@IgorBosnjakfx whoa pal, you're changing horses in midstream. I barely pushed and you completely fell over! Just a few minutes ago you were reprimanding her for having a bad attitude, now you're conceding she was good standing up for herself??!! And because you asked, I'm a veteran infantry Marine - separated 17+ years ago honorably. And I'm now a licensed electrical contractor in the Midwest. And actually, I do stay in a basement most of the time when I'm not out and about... It's called my man cave! 😂
@@geofferypmeyersright?! I prefer to here they changing the dynamics of the company, or unfortunately they no longer need a certain amount of workers, but stop lying and say it is the workers fault. Just be honest. The company making changes and that is it. 😌
I started a new job, more of a promotion that required relocation. I was experiencing issues with the flights and travel that THEY did without covering what THEIR policies allow, and encountered crazy weather. The HR representative stated “If you don’t arrive on the day you are suppose to arrive and start date you WILL BE heavily reprimanded and or fired”. I started crying on the phone… I was stuck in an airport, with my luggage and cat. Technically homeless since my car and household was already shipped. I called my supervisor right after, and he got mad and said he would handle it. Thank god for him ❤
They want to avoid unemployment. They did this to a friend who had some issues, but they could not prove that they had tried to coach her to improve performance and my friend won and recieved unemployment.
Corporations wonder why there’s been a great resignation, and why good employees are so hard to find. Bottom line, they don’t deserve them.
THIS.. exactly THIS.. this should be the highest rated comment.
Absolutely, their is no reason to work for a corporation. A number on a page is all you are, if we know anything, it's that NOTHING matters other than PROFIT.
Especially you. Stop applying and start local.
That’s what you get buying into big corps, and big titles for your instagram and tik tok. A sterile letting go of. Small biz will always be the backbone
It’s just a job.
I found while WORKING here in the last 40+yrs that the ones REALLY Working Hard are held to a higher standard than those who don't. Belonging to the Group that brown noses around often Ineffective "mismanagement" even gets you repeatedly 2hr breaks.....AND YES....some even SLEEP on Duty in front of the Camera !!! I'm NOT Lying here !! Worked 15 of my 19yrs in Miami DadeCounty Jails.....just remember...you have to be from the fitting culture,color too !!!!
German Immigrant to Florida 40yrs ago.
FORMER RN 😊😊😊FORMER !!!
As someone who’s been through this exact thing - the employer is stating that it’s performance, because if they layoff due to downsizing, they have to pay your unemployment benefits.
Yup, they are lying to save their own arses.
I see this all the time. Why is it so hard for people to understand that of course the company is going to try to characterize this as a performance issue, because if they call it fired for cause then the company does not get charged higher unemployment tax rates. Follow the money! Of course companies will lie, they are directly compensated for doing so. The entire unemployment benefit system is a corrupt mess, and it hurts most the people who can afford it the least.
This woman didn't sell anything or make any money at all for the company during her time there apparently. Pretty sure its performance based and this is just an entitled brat who tanked future job prospects because of main character syndrome.
in her case she hasn't been there long enough. she may be able to draw on her last job.
I don't think that's true in California. According to the state website, it doesn't matter if you get laid off or fired as long as you don't get fired for misconduct. I don't think under performance falls under misconduct.
I found this triggering as hell (in a medical sense, I have diagnosed PTSD from workplace abuse), but also incredibly comforting - your professional analysis of a set of experiences similar to my own is really validating. Thank you for this video.
I was laid off by the US National Park Service after I broke my hand. My manager did not know first aid! I was laid off while recovering from hand surgery. Federal law saved me-- it was paid for by the Dept of Labor. ... but the NPS? Corrupt to the core.
My park location was notorious for this. Lyme disease recovery? Broken bone? Even after healing, workers were not hired back. ... Illegal! The Dept of Labor investigated due to these irregularities.
Also i love how UNPREPARED hr was for her questions. Take notes guys. If someone is going to be cold, callous and gaslight you, at least give them a little taste of their own medicine!
It's not HR's job to be prepared or knowledgeable. HR is a group of hitmen, they perform firings and reprimands, that's it. HR people are purposefully kept in the dark in order to not reveal anything that would make the company culpable at a later date
I’m thinking the same thing. In fact, I could do a better job at being HR than these two clowns, and I have ZERO HR experience.
And turn off prospective employers of hiring you? No thanks.
@@AspiePilo82 you can defend yourself and ask questions about your termination. Nobody said you have to record it and post to the internet! Re read the comment as it was clearly focused on her asking them pointed questions 📖👓🤯
HR is all about what the lawyers allow you to say. Anyone good at HR obeys.
Can I just say that I really admire her communication skills? I stutter and stumble on words all of the time. She's in a high-stress, high-emotion situation, and she's speaking more clearly and confidently than I do casually chatting with friends. That's an extremely valuable soft skill, one that's hard to acquire if it doesn't come naturally. Cloudflare's loss
I agree, I think she did amazing. Much better than I did in that situation.
Cloudflare sucks anyway.
Can you just say? Yes you can.
I agree. I wouldn’t have been as good as she is at standing up for myself
Agree, she seems like she has potential. But Cloudflare probably discovered they can hire offshore remote workers to do the same job for 1/10 the cost...
You can tell how ethical and moral a company is by watching how HR conducts itself.
I suggest that she hires a Employment Attorney. Because to come up with no excuse or a ridiculous excuse is just unacceptable. And like someone also said, HR is not there for the employee, they are there to protect the company as best as they can before lawyers get involved!!
I had HR falsely accuse me of something without evidence or details. Luckily I did not lose my job or get disciplined, but it was such bs. They were just going through the script to save themselves from getting sued by those accusing me. I'm pretty sure that they knew it was a false accusation, but couldn't tell me that due to the politics of it. You lose so much trust after going through that. All I wanted was details because maybe I did unintentionally do something, but was so frustrated when they wouldn't actually tell me what I was accused of.
The "nice to meet you" while being fired is INSANE
You'd rather get "Hi douchebag, you're fired"?
Yep. Meant to protect those you actually work for from the discomfort of firing you.
Yep. Meant to protect those you actually work for from the discomfort of firing you.
Yep. Meant to protect those you actually work for from the discomfort of firing you.
Yep. Meant to protect those you actually work for from the discomfort of firing you.
The ultimate sign of disrespect from a company: Appoint some flunkies with no knowledge of your work history or performance to fire you while everyone you did work for goes and hides.
It’s a big company trimming the fat 🤷♀️ she herself admitted she made ZERO contracts (and closing contracts is her job). So the company has been paying her for over 4 months for nothing in return 🤷♀️ companies want results and are in the business of making money, not keeping ppl around who don’t achieve their objectives 🤷♀️ if u don’t know “ramping up” is when u have a manager or someone who has more experience there for u as a support system- so if u have questions and whatnot they are there for u and generally they will sit in on contact closings to make sure it goes well… so she has had 3 months of that plus 1 month of being fully on her own with zero contracts 🤷♀️ therefore her performance is the worst
@@candicecart9786Your argument doesn't hold up.
She barely had any actual work time yet due to when she was hired.
All her feedback received up to that point had been positive.
So it clearly was not performance.
@@thelastvigil111 she has been working since August and has had $0 sales ...nothing
@@duermedespierto you're missing the point. She met tbe expectations thst were set for her and she had received nothing but positive feedback.
Sounds like her own boss didn't know.
Based on the repeated vague responses that didn't make much sense, I wouldn't be surprised if the HR people were an A.I. program.
If not, it's something that will be coming soon.
As a people manager I was told the night before the company was going to lay off all of my team members. The next morning my team received 15 minute calls on their calendars asking me why they had meetings on their schedule when I had been told I couldn’t tell them. I then had to sit on the video calls with my manager and HR and watch while my team members were laid off. It was one of the worst experiences of my career.
I had a friend laid off after 27 years with a company. 27 years and they discarded him like a piece of trash. Luckily he was smart with money and a good saver and investor.
They hire you to do a job. I would say working 27 years at one job shows a great work culture. Also, good for him. If he had work 27 years and not been financially stable he would have no one to blame but himself.
@@MrTwenty6point2dumbass bootlicker
@@MrTwenty6point2 Everything you said is completely correct, but they’re all very silly points to make in response to OP’s comment. Laying someone off without notice after 27 years may be a perfectly prudent thing to do, but it’s also a bit heartless
@@MrTwenty6point2Staying at a job for 27 years isn't a result of a "good work culture", it's due to being stable employment that provides health insurance. People stay in government jobs forever for the benefits, not because government is a great place to work - on the contrary government environments are very toxic.
@@SurpriseMeJT I agree. I sold my soul to a government job to afford treatments for an extremely pricey autoimmune disease. I’m not sure what the point to even being alive is anymore.
I can’t get over the HR lady saying they don’t have time to discuss details on this short call when HR are scheduling the calls.
Typical corporate
You do understand that they have other people to fire, right? They have already sent out the meeting invites. There is a schedule to keep.
@heinzerbrew was going to say same thing.
@@heinzerbrew That seems like a scheduling issue. Why would you not schedule time to explain why you're firing people, in between all the people you're firing? If anything, perhaps HR needed to be fired, for poor performance.
I'm about to upend peoples lives, with zero notice. They have rent/mortgage, bills, their lives likely depend on making steady money. Yet you don't schedule atleast 30min to discuss how you're potentially leaving them homeless and their kids hungry?
In other words, HR is not going to allow the conversation to drag on for a useless rebuttal. Terminations should be short. There is not much to discuss in the mind of HR.
I’ve been on BOTH sides of this conversation. As a corporate senior manager who had to terminate/layoff staff and the whole process that leads up to it, and as the person getting suddenly laid off over the phone. I can completely relate to both sides. I can tell you, firing someone, even for cause, SUCKS. I hated it. It’s the worst thing I’ve ever had to do. It’s even worse in situations where legal and HR tell you exactly what you can/cannot say. My entire day of firing someone put me in a full-on depression. It sucks. I also received death threats from angry spouses and legitimately feared walking to my car from the office on the day of and following week of a termination.
As far as being the one getting laid off…I know exactly what it’s like to answer a phone to hear HR say I’m laid off, instantly feeling the weight of a force pushing my body down, getting tunnel vision as I glared at the inside of my new house that I knew I would likely lose because I just lost my one and only income. And it was a large income.
But, I took a very large severance and started a business.
I now have multiple incomes, including my own businesses.
This is exactly why I feel zero need to be “loyal” to whatever company I’m working for. These people in HR seem so disconnected from the average worker. If you own a business, don’t ask me to come work loyally for you and then tell me it’s not personal when I am laid off because you sold the company for a billion dollars. I’ll do my job as best as I can but that’s where it ends for me.
It feels like talking to a politician that keeps evading the question with complete nonsensical answers
When that happens, remind them that they did not answer your question. Then repeat the question, and if they still are not giving you an answer, ask to speak with someone else.
@@judyheller"you'll be hearing from my attorney" is what HR should be told in these cases. Give them a reason to shit bricks knowing they've just potentially exposed the firm to litigation.
People say the employee fired ruined her future career prospects uploading this. But actually, she is holding these companies accountable for taking advantage of people.
Both can be true. I have sympathy but knowing she’s gotten praise for recording company meetings without consent and releasing them publicly, would you hire her?
@@ca8824 I would i a heartbeat. And I have hired roughly 50-60 people in my career so far
@@ca8824OMG she didn't get their consent!!!!! This sin is UNPARDONABLE!!!!!!!!
@ca8824 - Yes I would. The only people who wouldn’t hire her are those with shady practices to hide.
It's great content for us but I am on the side that recording and uploading this is going to hurt her future prospects. Not a good idea. Always protect your interests!
Honestly this is just giving me the realization that I need to immediately mention that I’m “discussing this with my lawyer” if I’m given “performance issues” if I get laid off, because my reviews are always stellar
I had this video in my queue the other day and lost it. I'm glad it popped up again. I'm retired for a while now and wow. This girl is young, smart, articulate and right on! God bless her. This was wrong. Praying for her to get her dream job. 🙏❤️
Two quotes that I absolutely love to be mentally prepared for such situations:
1. Love your job and not the company.
2. A bird doesn't worry if the branch he is resting on will break or not.
That's very good advice. Clever bit about the bird not caring if the branch breaks. Young people need to hear this advice. Love your job not the company. Fantastic.
Sorry I’m young, can someone explain? Seems to me when you don’t worry about the branch breaking ( just assuming it will support you) you fail to plan a safety net, and it’s a huge shock when it does break.
I must be missing something. Can anyone clarify please?
@@icu3869 since the bird has wings it need not worry if the branch breaks. It will fly away and sit on another branch. Similarly, I need to be so self sufficient or confident about my skills (read wings) that it wouldn’t matter if I loose the job.
@@soumen_dasYes, it's a daft aphorism...
@cheapchipsable huh? Can you elaborate?
Love how these companies demand your loyalty but do not even consider you to be a human being once a spread sheet hits the table.
All corporations demand loyalty from all their employees but they are not loyal with their employees when it actually matters
I think loyalty on both sides have mostly disappeared. Companies that are loyal are out there and they mostly have loyal employees
Loyalty is a two-way street. Although it’s can reasonably be seen to be harsh for an employer to suddenly terminate their employees, the employees can easily do the same.
If your boss says "hey we're all family here" immediately correct them "NO we are not. Family doesn't fire you at the earliest convenience. Family doesn't fire you even after your death. We are just here to trade our time for a little money, and that's all there is to this job. We are not family. We're employees."
Once you leave the negotiating table, you become a statistic on a payscale to be cost-managed. From that point on, it is HR's (and management's) job to psycho-manipulate you into higher productivity without additional pay. If using the word "family" motivates employees to work harder and not leave the company for higher pay, then so be it.
For 7 months, (6 of them were training), I worked for a state office as a social worker. On my way to work, a guy ran a red light and totaled my car, causing a TBI (traumatic brain injury). When I was unable to return to the job, they waited for my vacation to run out and then terminated me for "poor performance." Only 1 person in the department ever met their standards; she had been there for 14 years. I hired a lawyer, but due to my brain damage, I didn't make the best witness.
Management is not your friend, HR is not your friend. your employer is not your friend. You a literally just a number that gets paid to perform tasks.
What I find strange when it comes to layoffs, especially of newer employees, is that the employer spends all these resources on hiring staff, interviewing them, training them; only to fire them a short time later. It seems like a huge waste of money.
It is a huge waste of money AND time (everybody's including the one being terminated)!
Because they need to keep everyone at starting wages only.
In some fields employers got a lot of money from government to hire new employees. If they are later fired because of bad performance - no one care. Employer can hire new employees an got new money.
Follow the money.
@oliver_twistor It’s very common that the left hand doesn’t know what the right hand is doing. Different teams are doing different things without knowledge of what the other is doing.
. Exactly!
How is a company gonna say you’re fired because of performance, but not be able to IMMEDIATELY produce data to back it up!?! How is that NOT wrongful termination!?!
The data is she made ZERO sales in a sales job. It is kind of obvious 😂
@@22wabbit not in at-will states
I LOVE this channel I'm learning so much thank you 🎉🎉🎉
@@jimbojones9118 They didn't have to give a reason. But they did. That's the problem.
If they had said "we're moving in another direction, bye" that's a consequence of at-will employment. No reason needed.
Once you make a claim about performance, you're open to being questioned about it. And that can lead to consequences, especially if you're violating employment rules. At-will isn't a "get out of discrimination free card" for example.
I'm not a lawyer, but I know this topic well enough to know this was a risk.
Self evident she made no sales
One prominent tech company that I worked for, simply emailed firing notices and de-activated employee badges on a Friday after work hours ended. When I came into work on Monday, I had to walk past newly installed security guards. They were there in case any employees came to retaliate. Disgusting !
At the end of the day, the employer doesn’t need to tell you WHY they are terminating the employment, as long as it's not for the protected reasons. But, them lying and saying that her performance doesn’t meet their metrics is totally b.s. They just don't want to pay unemployment.
Because they did give a reason, I think they opened themselves to a legal case.
Long, long ago, I was advised to never befriend or speak willingly with any in HR. They will take anything out of context, betray your trust and turn it against you.
At minimum you should be very very careful if at any point you're being asked to take part in a meeting where anyone from HR is present. My former employer learned very quickly to not involve HR with me directly because I will verbally go after and destroy HR if they open their mouth, easy enough since they know less than zero about actual productive work. Any meeting with me and HR just became me trashing HR and being right, so it wasn't "productive" for them heh. I've been recently terminated, but apparently HR refused to touch it so just my manager alone doing it. He also made promises they haven't kept, and tried to tell me I could keep the company mobile phone that they never gave me 🤣🤣 which was quite funny in a sad way... I was terminated because I broke my back + other related health issues meant I couldn't go to the office, so I worked remote until they shut my account off and filed to terminate me.
I worked in HR , and always advocated for the employees ~. But yes I was a ship at sea alone when it came to that!
@@noth606That happened to me when I was young. The company had meetings that it said was to improve the company. During the meeting about 30 of us were around a large conference table. Nobody answered any questions or engaged in a discussion while the two HR people tried everything to get us to comment or discuss anything they brought up. Finally one of my coworkers from our group made a comment. Everyone looked around at each other. I spoke ip in agreement with my colleague. After the meeting he went up to the HR Director and totally backtracked everything he commented on. I overheard him, but felt like I couldn’t say anything. I also thought it was really bizarre. I got laid off a month later with several others who were at different meetings. My colleague kept his job. I will never forget this lesson.
I love this young lady's discernment. She's no slow leak as we say in the South . God Bless and I pray he opens a door for her somewhere that her hard work will be appreciated . Companies look at you as disposable in most circumstances like this. I hope she at least got unemployment .
Agreed. It's not that everyone in hr is bad, it's that the snakes are SNAKES and there's so many people who almost seem to delight in others misfortune
This is why you don't show any loyalty to a corporation. Be a merc and be prepared to jump ship at any time.
Work efficiency has increased over 200% in the last couple of years while wages have remained pretty much stagnant about 3% increase.
Unfortunately, great advice.
Exactly… Also I get as a new hire it’s horrible to be let go, but at the same time I feel like she’s acting like she has been at the job for 35 years and actually closed contracts 😂 and is just meeting some randos 🤷♀️ companies pay u- they aren’t your friend or family, that’s why they pay u 😂
Huhu but jumping from company to another company at age 20’s might be okay, but past that age, not that much job people want to hire tho, especially in office work related. Atleast in my country area.
Short sweet and true !
The company's response was basically, "we're so sorry... we got recorded doing it."
Been there.. and after a 20 yr career at a leading Canadian TELCO my entire team was given a pkg by a manager we had testified against for sexual harassment of his male employee.
Sometimes it’s not the large companies to blame, but managers within the company who have their own personal vendettas.
He had vowed to get even with us, and when he temporarily inherited our team, he took advantage of that power.
When my mother, along with a bunch of others, was chucked out the door for 'excessive age' her direct supervisor nearly blew a gasket. The excuse they used was 'we don't need your department at that plant, so we don't need you.' 90 days later they hired a fresh out of school young lady to staff the now re-opened department. HOWEVER Mom's attorney said: "YES you have a great case for age discriminations BUT the deal they are offering is health care for LIFE!!" In the end said health care covered Mom and later Dad through multiple bouts of cancer over multiple decades. THAT was expensive!
Awesome! Good for her!
Sometimes, things we see as terrible events in our life are really gifts. God knows what's coming down the road and what you need to get through it.
Healthcare for life isn’t any severance I’ve ever heard of. COBRA benefits suck ass - companies should have to cover all of the cost while you are on unemployment.
@@Danielle-zq7kbwhy?
Your mom made out well. That must have been a long time ago. These days companies barely want to cover healthcare for existing employees.
I went through this 20 years ago at AT&T after that I rented a retail space and opened up my own small buisness doing taxes and bookkeeping, I worked hard and I am financially secure and could retire tomorrow if I wanted too. I would rather shovel snow and cut grass self employed than ever work for these heartless soulless companies.
An employee invests a lot just accepting the job in the first place. Often they move to a new location, maybe buy a car, rent an apartment, even buy a home, change a relationship to physically be there. They turn down another job or leave other employment for what appears to be a better opportunity. When fired for some kind of cause, all their security in the new situation vanishes. Now their health insurance is gone and that is a giant perk few understand. The question "Why were you let go?" will jeopardize new job opportunities.
That's great! It makes me feel very hopeful (and proud of you) to read this. I'm so happy when people stick up for themselves
OMG!! I Have sooo much respect for you and what you did and especialy what you went thru and rebounded with VICTORY on your side. F-'um if they cant take a joke. soulless heartless! YOU nailed it. Tons of respect and appreciation !! Maybe someone else will take a lead in their own lives, when they read this, than put up with this totally heatless bullshit.
Same here. I worked for different company’s and got laid off twice sucks. Now I’m in the chip and snack business I’m my own boss started servicing two stores and now I service 40 accounts. Started small but I build my route in 2 years.
If your company would hit the fan and you will have to sack them all, what would you do? :D be souless and tell them exact same busllhit, there is no good or bad guys here :) just people who get fired and people who don't :)
I was called into my HR office right after lunch one day, and was told that the owners had decided to retire and hand over the business to their son and he decided to lay off people across 3 plants that the business had and last 5 people who were hired were to be let go.
I had been with them 4 years, had just been given a promotion and raise literally 2 months before this, I had just bought a house and was about to move in that same month but didn’t matter of course they gave me a severance package and out the door I went.
Heard later the son sold the company to some Asian group a year later, they closed and relocated out of the state it was based in.
Holy...
The CEO found it painful to watch bc he's thinking he should've spent more money for better terminators
HR people are not your friends. Their job is to save money for the company. If you're new or too senior, you're always at risk of being cut.
That part! I put way too much trust in HR and got screwed over pretty badly. HR is not there to protect you. HR is there to protect the company from you.
😂that's every job!! Funny af
@@colettejaques2559 Maybe that's 'Only in America' ?
[Not maybe]
@@PirateCommander I just don't think that large companies around the world have shown they're any better in this regard than American companies are.
@@PortlandMark67 Oh, I'm fully accepting they can be very American in that way, but it's not as prolific / across the board. The difference is probably in the employee rights laws which the current UK clown train is hell bent on relieving them of ?
Fair comment and good to see someone actually dispute something in a mannerly fashion. Kudos.
I love how she is defending herself. This would be unheard of in my day. Termination with cause can also effect Unemployment benefits. Hope she fights it. Remember 1980’s early 1990’s they did this to people who gave 20 years of their lives. Never trust a company to be there tomorrow.
Yup, most companies will drop you the second they don't need you!
She wouldn't have an issue getting unemployment (depending on if she's claimed unemployment elsewhere in the past year)
But putting it on social media was a real dumb idea. More and more companies as part as of a background check are doing a social media check. If this video comes up most prospective employers are going to trash can her resume/application.
@@georgeromey4971Disagree. I'd hire her. She has a spine.
Good for her! I am glad she is pushing back! The company acted shady on their part.
They dump staff just to make there quarterly earning reports look good for investors and bonuses.
So what's the problem? The business exists ONLY for the benefit of those who put their money into it. There's nothing wrong with that. The vendors, including the vendors of labor, are also trading only to serve their interests. There is nothing wrong with that.
My husband was in the semi conductor industry for nearly 20 years when he was finally laid off in 2009. We used half of his 401k to stay in our home of 11 years. Ended up losing it all. Come across so many people who weren’t affected by the mass fall outs from 2008 era. He was considered over qualified for basic jobs and no tech companies were hiring in any state. The info and advice you give is great!
We can relate to those who may feel “it can’t happen to me.” I’d caution anyone who may tend to feel that way. Plan for the worst, hope for the best. 💜
Having been laid off via mass email last February (worked at the company 9 years when it got bought by an overseas investor), watching this video gave me the sense of closure I’ve desperately needed. This girl said so many things I wish I had the chance to say. Thanks for covering this!
No problem. Mass emails are ridiculous.
I hope you are doing good I wish the best a better future but it’s sad nowadays the corporate world it’s very harsh and I don’t know what was yuor job but tech sales it’s hard it’s very difficult and demanding very it’s not easy money
HR protect themselves they are trained to speak like that
It had nothing to do with you it’s them they have their own motives to let you go that yu never know yu did a great job believe me when a company decides to let go of employees they will let you go regardless how hard yu worked don’t take it personal I know after 9 years secured job it’s awful feeling sorry but it’s going on all over look into videos of this how companies sneak treat employees
A mass email is heinous, but at least it’s impersonal. These people were blaming the employee for poor performance, as if it were personal when her only mistake was in being a recent hire when they were told to layoff a certain number of people.
I worked for a huge bank. They fired people left and right. whole departments would be gone in the blink of an eye. There was a management guy in a cubicle near me and he had been there 20 years - one day I came in and he wasn't there. He had been let go. There was a group of people who got hired and then let go 6 weeks later .... the bank said they changed their mind about the new dept - too bad for you. So all those people gave up other jobs to work there and were unemployed 6 weeks later. The way companies act towards employees is disgusting.
Only in America
your livelihood hangs from the whims of a clueless group of executives who make stupid and unpredictable decisions to please shareholders, often unsuccessfully. work for yourself
@@momoneyinvestingIf they're foolish, the business will fail.
Should employees not be allowed to leave a company unless they document a bunch of problems and go through a big process?
@@nwatson2773America is better than most places regarding this and a lot of other things. Take the blinders off.
@@nwatson2773no if you work for American companies in a decent country even then American companies tries to do this and often they get sued big time. It’s actually happening more often than not now. American companies suck period.
"Poor Performance"
I love how at my company there are metrics that are literally impossible to get anything other than an average or worse rating on.
Perfect Attendance with no incidents gets you 3 stars out of 5.
Love your channel!!! Can I just say that this is why I think it's so important that as a country, us Americans have to band together because it's the shareholders and the CEOs, the millionaires and the politicians who are our enemy, not each other. We are stronger together.
The shareholders are largely you and me and endowments. The average guy with a few million is just buying mutual funds and has nothing to do with making decisions any more than you do thru the mutual fund I your 401k plan.
The enemy here is incompetent companies which is probably why they are laying off to start.
“I cannot speak to what your manager said to you directly”
Well they sure tried in the beginning when they suggested her performance was the cause of her layoff.
That's one of the wildest things to me, the HR team should have a list of everything the manager has to say ab an employee but instead they seem to be as hands off as possible
Unemployment payments. If it's for performance, many states you won't qualify for unemployment
@darkriku12 That's exactly what it is. The company is trying to prevent itself from having it's unemployment insurance tax from going up, which would happen if they did a big layoff.
They are hoping no, or only a few people successfully fight it, so that their rates don't go up, or don't go up as much as if 100% of those laid off got unemployment.
"...data that was calibrated." Hold on while I make something up.
Hahaha such corporate bullshit speak
Neologistic nonsense. Buzzwords. Sound and fury, signifying nothing. “A changing strategy going forward” is another example.
People hearing but not listening.
"Calibrated" means they cherry picked numbers to support what they wanted to do.
13 years at the company I was with, they let go of 22 people over a mass phone call. Some had been there longer. Then a few months later the company was bought out and they were hiring. All the hr staff left. They said it was due to covid. Covid was over and the others I knew that were let go all had health issues but were all hard workers. We were always told we were a family too. It was life changing. At the time it did not feel good I was devastated. Now I am glad it happened. My life is better. Things happen for a reason. The way they did it was so wrong. Being my own boss and helping others is so much better for me and my family.
If i were the owner of any company, i would want old school culture, no HR, that would be me...requirements for the job is, your history of your skills you applied for..then its up to me, no circle jerks for a interview, your demeanor and history is all i need, the ability to make us money, you clock out, you do what you do.
Are there any takers out there?
As a manager, I would quit my job if my company was laying people off without me being there and without my input. I value treating my team members as a humans with families. This is cold and calculating. The composure and passion this lady has is very valuable. Good luck on her future endeavors.
my manager wasn't even in the office the day that I got laid off. i think he had the day on PTO if i remember right. fuck Allianz Life.
You would get replaced
"Ok bye" is what the company will say. Been there, seen that.
clearly someone who does not have a mortgage. When you get a mortgage you are trapped.
The manager was probably already fired.
Why can’t these companies just say they aren’t meeting their performance expectations? They hired too many people, they invested in the wrong strategy, they’re not ramping as expected, they’re existing a particular field? Why do they tear down the employee and try to make them feel worthless? Ugh!
Because they expect the employees they are laying off to be idiots and blindly accept the fact that they are being let go due to performance reasons. This way, the company can pay a tiny severance (or no severance at all).
So they don't have to offer severance, job placement services, or an option to rehire or post into another internal position. They close the door, lock it, throw away the key, and burn all the bridges to the door. But clearly the company is on notice that no one in their right mind is ever going to want to work for them.
No one in their right mind is going to want to work for Cloudflare, the premier online cybersecurity firm in the world whose stock price is up 93% over the last year?
Cloudflare is forecast to grow earnings and revenue by 28.9% and 21.9% per annum respectively. EPS is expected to grow by 38.9% per annum. Return on equity is forecast to be 19.9% in 3 years.
Account Executive makes $94k/yr and enterprise account executive is $149k/yr.
@@obcane3072 🤣 Bro, do you work for Cloudflare's marketing department?? You're quoting a bunch of shit that helps the people who own stock in the company (i.e. the wealthy), or people who are connected in such a way to be able to land your quoted executive jobs (those related to the wealthy).
This is about normal rank and file workers, getting screwed over by a well preforming company. If they are doing so well, why are they firing that woman's whole department basically?
How good a company is preforming on the stock market isn't a consideration most people use when wanting to work for a company, as many companies maximize their profit margins (and therefore their stock performance) by doing things as cheaply as possible, and the main overhead in any business is personnel. Pay, benefits, and how easy it is to leave without too many entanglements are the mains ones with today's workers, so they can try to at least maximize their most likely limited times with said company.
Who do those companies pay to maximize their workforce with the lowest possible investment? Middle managers, who get a bonus based on the performance of those under them, usually some dumb ratio such as hours worked per employee.
Ever work in retail? They'll ask you to grind your ass off doing "mandatory" overtime, just to cut everyone's hours to under full time when they can sucker enough young people into working for them to do so. The general store manager gets the quarterly bonus for maximizing the place's profits per square feet, and the employees get to walk on eggshells even worse then office/skilled workers.
They are saying that. The problem is that it's a lie. If it were truth they'd have performance metrics with them (at the very least they will have already been compiled into a document, and do not need to be generated after the firing upon request), she would have been told about poor performance in the past, and she'd have been put on a performance improvement plan. Not sure what law is surrounding redundancy in this area, but she is being made redundant and they do not want this to be the official reason, probably for legal or financial reasons.
I'm so proud of this young woman for telling these people the truth and not allowing them to get away with this word vomit.
I totally agree with your assessment that those who are planning the layoffs after hiring only a short time ago should be held accountable. That is incompetence. It costs thousands to onboard new people and to just fire them all after 3 months is ridiculous and speaks to a real organizational issue, IMO.
Had one job 30 years ago, where at the Christmas party I am praised by CEO and received standing ovation and had great year. Went on holidays, came back & told I screwed up & laid off.
Sounds about right
what was the supposed screw up? how did they try to justify the discrepancy between pre/post holiday feedback?
😮 I'm so sorry to hear that.
Why say this with NO Explanation ? Soundz like 🐂💩
holidays, very dangerous for jobs
I feel like she'll have a possible lawsuit. They didn't say she was being downsized. They said she was being let go due to performance issues that they couldn't produce. Basically, lying on her.
Where is she though? Not sure there's as much protection for employees outside the EU? (Ahem, America)
In the US if I fire someone for cause I need the process fully documented. Inform the employee of performance problems, track their performance, deliver a PIP (performance improvement plan) if things aren't improving and finally let them go. At that point they know it's coming. I've never let someone go with cause that didn't have ample time to get their act together.
Failing all that, it's very common for someone to sue for unlawful termination and get paid.
Idk, she admitted herself she made no sales as a sales person, at a time of year when people had leftover budgets to spend. I get she was new, and maybe it was just poor luck that she didn't close any deals, but it seriously does sound like she had an opportunity to close some deals but was unable to by her own admission. Sounds like the company does have a leg to stand on, even if it's crappy of them.
How much money do you think she has set aside for a lawsuit? It sounds like she’s just starting her career.
@DovidM if you have a case that's at all likely to win, an attorney will take it and take their fee out of the judgment awarded to you.
It should be easier to sue for wrongful termination
@jackbeame yup and she admitted it. It sucks but that’s sales. The enemy here is the economy being terrible right now and it’s only going to get worse.
So, if anyone at work ever uses the term "going forward" or "Circle Back" it is time to look for another job!
The reason the company is telling her it’s a performance issue is so they can protest unemployment benefits.
Exactly.
100%
True, but they have a case if she was a salesperson and she made 0 sales by admission. “I was really good in meetings with my manager and really good at almost selling” is not gonna hold up in court. Or shouldn’t anyways.
If you’re an NBA star and practice super hard but in games score 0, you won’t be employed.
Not true. Ben Simmons is still making millions sitting on bench because he too scared to shoot.
You have hit the nail on the head with your comment!
At one time I was working in the O&G industry, my team had an impromptu meeting one day with the HR representative in the area. She laid off all the staff. At the end she was laughing at us until she got a phone call from higher HR and he told her that she was also on the next bus. This put a smile on my face this day.
That is a common occurrence. They often pass the job of laying staff off to someone who's going to be receiving the same message in the not too distant future. I suppose, to their mind, it minimises the 'stench' that lingers...
How could she laugh at you and your team after laying you off? What the F?
No idea, some people are sadistic like that, or maybe it was a kind of reaction, as she already knew that she will be the last one on the list. I don't care anymore.
A classic example of what goes around, COMES around!
Instant Karma.
Amazon tried screwing me over on an injury. We were about to hit a big safety bonus the next day after I hurt my shoulder and my manager told me not to go to medical and sent me home for the day, then he disabled my badge. I tried clocking in for 3 days in a row and couldnt. Then they marked me as a no call no show and terminated me. When i was able to prove all this to the judge, i won my unemployment case. The judge was pissed and said some stuff to HR. Fuck you Dave and fuck amazon. Started my art career and im making way more money and im way happier. And im my own boss!
I’m confused…Did she say she has not closed anything yet? Does that mean that she has not brought any money into the company?
Thats why ppl these days don’t bother giving 2 weeks notice.
Why should we..they fire us with no notice and will try and stall your career with other companies "NDA"
Companies are catching on to that too by denying certain benefits if you bail.
I think my key takeaway was "you're not being singled out".
You mean my whole department is under-performing? Why weren't we put on performance improvement plans? Is the whole department being let go because a manager failed to meet their metrics?
Or maybe, okay, then how do you know that my performance has been substandard compared to others?
This hit hard, I just got let go in a mass layoff this month, following a company merger. It was a "last hired, first fired... er... laid-off" situation. I had just finished my training period 🙄
Imagine the anger after over a decade of going above and beyond, and being directly responsible for the businesses success.
H.R. in no way is there for you or your rights. They are there to protect the company and it's assets.
There should be a law to call them corporate resources
I was just thinking that. H.R. never treat people fairly.
CloudFlare is really going to struggle to hire new talent after this. Who wants to risk being fired before you’ve even understood your role or product.
I doubt they will struggle
Sadly they won't. From what I've seen it's a great company to work for.
All companies suck when they let you go.
@@EMdragonKnight They told her she was being fired for performance issues which they couldn’t substantiate. Working at CloudFlare may be more detrimental to your resume or career than the benefits of working for a great company.
@robmcd So they suck at firing people. However as far as the products they sell its pretty competitive.
I am coming from the perspective of interviewing with them (so I researched their products and company during that) and I've come across their employees over the years in meetups.
It's a good company and they suck at firing people. That doesn't mean their products and working conditions suck.
@@EMdragonKnight did you get the job?
Go Brittany and thank you for sharing this to help others and shine a light on what is really going on 👏