Another important thing to note is that Batman didn’t force any of them to become crime-fighters and in fact actively objected to the very idea, especially with Dick and Tim. But he knew that they would fight crime with or without him, so in his mind, the least he could do was teach them the skills and knowledge to not get themselves killed.
Why do people keep repeating this point to try to absolve him from blame? If a 9-year-old insists on putting himself in the line of fire, it is the responsibility of the adult to say No and stop the child. So Batman is still to blame because he still failed to guide them from that idea.
@@Rengokuo4o6 Maybe, but that 9 year old child is going to go out and fight crime with or without Bruce’s help, which would get them seriously injured or dead on their first day, which Bruce knows. That’s why he trains them, so that when they do go in the field, they have the skills to protect themselves, and Bruce there too to watch over them. Edit: Regardless, at the end of the day this is still a very fantastical, larger than life superhero world with ninjas, assassins, killer robots, aliens, gods, demons, magicians, ect. A little suspension of disbelief is required and a 9 year old crime fighter isn’t nearly the craziest thing in the DC world.
I really don't like Hollywood's obsession with making Batman a dark and brooding lone wolf. It's so boring. Batman is far more interesting when he has the Batfamily. Him being a father is such a great growth for the character. Someone who lost his parents gets to provide that for someone else. It's so sweet and wholesome. It's one of the reasons i like Batman. Sure, it can be campy, but campiness is part of Batman's history. I've been wanting a proper live action adaptation of the Bat family for years, but they always just ignote them or make them so edgy that they're not even recognizable.
Cass is the only Batgirl who can be considered Batman's daughter (he adopted her) but she rarely gets the attention she deserves. Gunn did say he wanted to use her in the dcu so hopefully non comic fans will know her more.
This might be biased because not only is Tim my favorite Robin but he’s my favorite character in comics overall but there’s needs to be more stories of him and Bruce. Tim is the entire reason why Bruce NEEDS Robin he’s the best example of what the Robin mantle means to Batman and I love how his whole reason isn’t because “oh my parents died pls adopt me rich person” but rather that he sees how this person he looks up to as a hero is seemingly being more and more violent and he uses what he’s best at (his smarts) to not only figure out Nightwing’s identity but he puts the clues together and figures out Bruce’s and I love how he basically has to force Bruce into letting him take up the mantle of Robin because Batman is still regretful of Jason that he doesn’t want another sidekick and when you put all of that together the whole reason why there’s such a big Batfamily (Damian, Cass, Steph, Duke ect) is all because of Tim bringing Bruce from his lowest possible breaking point back to reality and back to what Batman is supposed to be and why he needs a Robin to ground him out.
If you want to see Bruce be a good dad, you should read this official webtoon called “Wayne Family Adventures”. It’s a wholesome slice-of-life comedy with some action thrown in that shows that you can have Bruce struggle with his trauma and make mistakes while still being a good father.
They don't? He's a great father to Tim and Damian in the current run. You're probably only name a few moments while we have more good dad moments then bad.
I don't think the Contingency plans are out of cold distrust, he clearly trusts Superman. Its because of their line of 'work' that consistently has mind control. Although they do break free, the fear of the unknown takes hold. The possibility that one day there will be mind vontrol they can't break free from scares him. He doesnt WANT to hurt them, but he knows it's a possibility, he also had contingency for himself and his children is other heros, the Justice League. I think hes the kind of guy to cry if he has to incapacitate or even put down Superman or Wonder Woman, or anyone in the League.
This is my hopes for the movies The Batman Part 2: we see the beginning of that growth with introducing Dick Grayson Brave & the Bold: we see what that growth leads to with a established & growing Bat family.
Batman is more compelling when he's a compassionate and empathetic person that cares about not only his villains but his family as well. I hate the edgy douche Batman that treats everyone like shit it ruins the character for me.
I actually like it when writers strike a fine balance between the two sides. I thought he was a little too soft at times in classic B:TAS for example. The Arkham games hit my personal sweet spot for Batman. He's compassionate, but not very expressive. He shows he cares through his actions, and can be ruled by his emotions or fears, emblematic of his humanity.
@@sageoverheaven Batman wasn't soft in BTAS he was just a good person. He actually cared about helping people. That's what Batman should always be. That version of Batman deserves the legion of fanboys not the edgy douche version. Batman: The Animated Series made me fall in love with the character. I wish we could get a Batman that cares again. Psycho Bat God is getting annoying.
@@callmejacob3234 I don't hate that version. I just think he's unrealistically good at expressing himself for someone who had his emotional growth stunted by trauma at 8 years old. My main problem with that iteration is the Batman/ Batgirl relationship. I am 100% behind the notion of a Batman who cares. Arkham Batman has extremely deep compassion for his rogues and his allies. He's just shit at expressing it.
I never though in how really Batman's superhero side contrast with his father side😂. He has shown in the past to hide things from his family but differently to the companions in his superhero side that he looks with a "side-eye" because he can't completely trust them, he hides stuff from his children because of fear that any parent would have putting their kid in harm ways, which led him to learn once again that he cannot hold all of them,"safe by his side", forever ❤😂
you really should have brought up Cassandra Cain, Barbara might have gotten some parenting from Bruce too cause this man cant help himself, but considering that Bruce adopted Cassandra and everything shes a way better example of a Batgirl to use for this kind of theme. He was a great fahter for her too,even beat up her old terrible parent when he found out how he raised her cause fuck David Cain, that man is a horrible bastard... Also I want to point out that Bruce didnt adopt Jason and give him the Robin mantle only for the whole channeling his darkness thing,even when eh was fond of him instantly for stealing his tires he left him in an orphanage at first and when it turned out to be run by a criminal operation and the kid literally treid to stop a robbery even when by doing so he would have ended up homeless again Bruce saw that Jason also had a strong sense of justice
Seriously, people forget the sheer heroism Jason displayed during his Robin tenure. He has this weird reputation of being the "problem" kid, and people twisting his being Batman's Greatest Failure. The failure was extremely nuanced and a disconnect born of a variety of factors. In his last moments in Israel, Jason fought with everything he had against the crippling crow bar injuries to save the same mother that sold him out to the Joker.
@@sageoverheaven oh man if we start talking about all the victim blaming that Jason had to deal with we wont stop, I hate that so much!!!!!!! people who blame him for his own death when he was betrayed by his own motehr who he still tried to save???!!!! even as she died she called him a good kid for that, jeeze,when the woman who sold out her own son and watched him get beaten up while smoking a cigarette is better at recognizing heroism tahn regular comic book readers thats a problem... also all the things people were trying to call Jason a bad kid for are so weird like??? oh how dare the kid who grew up in one of the poorest neighbourhoods in Gotham have a problem when women and children are getting hurt and react a little more violently?? the whole Felipe Garzonas thing,my god,those issues are great cause even as pissed as Jason was he still didnt hit the guy when eh didnt resist arrest,remember thosep anels where hes like "resist!!"so he could hit him but the guy didnt so he didnt,that was restraint.Also I believe he didnt push Felipe in the end,he pulled a batman begins and was like"I wont kill you,but I dont have to save you", I mean he has done that since,he did it to black mask in the rebirth RHATO series lol
@@Demona9999Marluxia Yeah, I agree with everything said here. Few things I can't stomach are how Jason got the boss character → unlockable player character nerf ever since UtH. Then there's the total heel turn Batman's characterisation takes over and over just to reignite conflict between the two. I think Red Hood works best when he's not buddy buddy with Batman and the rest of the family, won't let Batman push him around, but still ultimately cares for them despite their radically differing ideals.
@@sageoverheaven I like when its kinda that one meme that like "fine Ill help, but I will be complaining the whole time" kind of situation when it comes to Red Hood working with the batfam lol. Sadly as the main character and all Bruce gets screwed over by different writters all too often, like just Grant Morrison and Tom King alone have done so much damage to the character its unbelievable and why I at least tend to ignore everything they wrote lol
My only problem with the Batfamily is that it's too damn big. At the most, it should be Batman Bruce Wayne, Alfred, Dick, Jason, Tim, Damian, and Cassandra Cain in my opinion. They should make him a loving compassionate father figure somewhat like the Wayne family Adventures. Instead of making him a jackass of a father. I know some will not like Barbara being left off but to me, she has a father in Jim.
its so frustrating that the batfam doesn't make an appearance in the live action when every inch of batman's life is at least in some wya affected by them. it's not right to see him as a loner when he was so much more to his character!
Thank you for just calling Damian the biological son instead of something like "the real son" or "Batman's actual son". Is constantly overlooked in the community, fans, and even the comics itself but I always felt there was always something dismissive of calling him that like because the other 3 are adopted they are not his "real sons". He loves them all of them equally and has show it in the past but Damian is always the "real" son, when he is just the biological son, same blood does not mean family and Batman without realizing is the biggest adoptive father representation out there (not the best but one of the biggest) and it was a big part of what make me love him as a character.
Batfamily sucks. They should have stopped at Jason Todd. Batman taking in more children after what happened to Todd shows that he's a very lousy parent.
@@callmejacob3234 it's not about fixing relationships it's about putting kids in harm's way. Plus the Batfamily doesn't make him stronger, all they do is lecture him about nonsense. It's the opposite infact because they nerf Batman in order to make the Batfamily seem useful. The DC animated Cartoon that adapted new 52 did it best. Just two Robins Dick and Damian, that's all.
@@callmejacob3234 Also i have seen your comment about Batman being compassionate and all I'll say is that compassion must be mixed with being pragmatic and practical like the arkham games. Batman must be pragmatic and practical.
that description is crazy
Another important thing to note is that Batman didn’t force any of them to become crime-fighters and in fact actively objected to the very idea, especially with Dick and Tim. But he knew that they would fight crime with or without him, so in his mind, the least he could do was teach them the skills and knowledge to not get themselves killed.
Why do people keep repeating this point to try to absolve him from blame?
If a 9-year-old insists on putting himself in the line of fire, it is the responsibility of the adult to say No and stop the child. So Batman is still to blame because he still failed to guide them from that idea.
@@Rengokuo4o6 Maybe, but that 9 year old child is going to go out and fight crime with or without Bruce’s help, which would get them seriously injured or dead on their first day, which Bruce knows. That’s why he trains them, so that when they do go in the field, they have the skills to protect themselves, and Bruce there too to watch over them.
Edit: Regardless, at the end of the day this is still a very fantastical, larger than life superhero world with ninjas, assassins, killer robots, aliens, gods, demons, magicians, ect. A little suspension of disbelief is required and a 9 year old crime fighter isn’t nearly the craziest thing in the DC world.
@@Mr.DelicateTouch I am sure Batman can figure out another way to stop them from doing that. He does in the tomorrowverse.
@@Rengokuo4o6 Not really he still adopts Dick Grayson in that universe.
@@callmejacob3234 No he doesn't, he takes him to central city and finds him an Orphanage.
I really don't like Hollywood's obsession with making Batman a dark and brooding lone wolf. It's so boring. Batman is far more interesting when he has the Batfamily. Him being a father is such a great growth for the character. Someone who lost his parents gets to provide that for someone else. It's so sweet and wholesome. It's one of the reasons i like Batman. Sure, it can be campy, but campiness is part of Batman's history. I've been wanting a proper live action adaptation of the Bat family for years, but they always just ignote them or make them so edgy that they're not even recognizable.
Batman is someone who lost his parents as a child, now as an adult he's a father to 4 sons
Cass is the only Batgirl who can be considered Batman's daughter (he adopted her) but she rarely gets the attention she deserves.
Gunn did say he wanted to use her in the dcu so hopefully non comic fans will know her more.
She technically already appeared in a movie, but that movie was Birds of Prey 💀
I really hope James don't disappoint in the family dynamics in brave and the bold, that's what I'm looking forward the most
I feel like out of everyone in the batfamily Cass is the one who understands what the bat symbol stands for the most, more than Bruce does sometimes.
This might be biased because not only is Tim my favorite Robin but he’s my favorite character in comics overall but there’s needs to be more stories of him and Bruce. Tim is the entire reason why Bruce NEEDS Robin he’s the best example of what the Robin mantle means to Batman and I love how his whole reason isn’t because “oh my parents died pls adopt me rich person” but rather that he sees how this person he looks up to as a hero is seemingly being more and more violent and he uses what he’s best at (his smarts) to not only figure out Nightwing’s identity but he puts the clues together and figures out Bruce’s and I love how he basically has to force Bruce into letting him take up the mantle of Robin because Batman is still regretful of Jason that he doesn’t want another sidekick and when you put all of that together the whole reason why there’s such a big Batfamily (Damian, Cass, Steph, Duke ect) is all because of Tim bringing Bruce from his lowest possible breaking point back to reality and back to what Batman is supposed to be and why he needs a Robin to ground him out.
I wish Batman writers didn’t make him a terrible dad, sometimes they write him good but holly hell, they ruin him so badly sometimes.
It's because controversy sells and they think they're being cool when in reality it's cringe.
@@FriendlyBatDoom unfortunately, u are correct
If you want to see Bruce be a good dad, you should read this official webtoon called “Wayne Family Adventures”. It’s a wholesome slice-of-life comedy with some action thrown in that shows that you can have Bruce struggle with his trauma and make mistakes while still being a good father.
They don't? He's a great father to Tim and Damian in the current run. You're probably only name a few moments while we have more good dad moments then bad.
@@kaine8911 DC is forever doing my boy Tim dirty.
With 4 sons
1 daughter and 2 sorta daughters, you’d think they’d show them off more in media, I mean who knows who Cassandra Cain is aside comic fans?
People who watched Birds of Prey 💀
@@sageoverheaven I refuse to acknowledge that as Cassandra lol
@@carltonpowell5313 Me too, but I find it hilarious to the point of sadness that they adapted her in that manner.
I don't think the Contingency plans are out of cold distrust, he clearly trusts Superman. Its because of their line of 'work' that consistently has mind control. Although they do break free, the fear of the unknown takes hold. The possibility that one day there will be mind vontrol they can't break free from scares him. He doesnt WANT to hurt them, but he knows it's a possibility, he also had contingency for himself and his children is other heros, the Justice League. I think hes the kind of guy to cry if he has to incapacitate or even put down Superman or Wonder Woman, or anyone in the League.
This is my hopes for the movies
The Batman Part 2: we see the beginning of that growth with introducing Dick Grayson
Brave & the Bold: we see what that growth leads to with a established & growing Bat family.
Batdad know no pain! Batdad know no fear!
Batman is more compelling when he's a compassionate and empathetic person that cares about not only his villains but his family as well. I hate the edgy douche Batman that treats everyone like shit it ruins the character for me.
I actually like it when writers strike a fine balance between the two sides. I thought he was a little too soft at times in classic B:TAS for example.
The Arkham games hit my personal sweet spot for Batman. He's compassionate, but not very expressive. He shows he cares through his actions, and can be ruled by his emotions or fears, emblematic of his humanity.
@@sageoverheaven Batman wasn't soft in BTAS he was just a good person. He actually cared about helping people. That's what Batman should always be. That version of Batman deserves the legion of fanboys not the edgy douche version. Batman: The Animated Series made me fall in love with the character. I wish we could get a Batman that cares again. Psycho Bat God is getting annoying.
@@callmejacob3234 I don't hate that version. I just think he's unrealistically good at expressing himself for someone who had his emotional growth stunted by trauma at 8 years old. My main problem with that iteration is the Batman/ Batgirl relationship.
I am 100% behind the notion of a Batman who cares. Arkham Batman has extremely deep compassion for his rogues and his allies. He's just shit at expressing it.
@@sageoverheaven I'm not a fan of the Bruce and Barbara relationship either but DCAU Batman is still peak Batman.
I never though in how really Batman's superhero side contrast with his father side😂. He has shown in the past to hide things from his family but differently to the companions in his superhero side that he looks with a "side-eye" because he can't completely trust them, he hides stuff from his children because of fear that any parent would have putting their kid in harm ways, which led him to learn once again that he cannot hold all of them,"safe by his side", forever ❤😂
"becomes less bratty piece of shit" is crazy thats my favorite Robin 😩
you really should have brought up Cassandra Cain, Barbara might have gotten some parenting from Bruce too cause this man cant help himself, but considering that Bruce adopted Cassandra and everything shes a way better example of a Batgirl to use for this kind of theme. He was a great fahter for her too,even beat up her old terrible parent when he found out how he raised her cause fuck David Cain, that man is a horrible bastard...
Also I want to point out that Bruce didnt adopt Jason and give him the Robin mantle only for the whole channeling his darkness thing,even when eh was fond of him instantly for stealing his tires he left him in an orphanage at first and when it turned out to be run by a criminal operation and the kid literally treid to stop a robbery even when by doing so he would have ended up homeless again Bruce saw that Jason also had a strong sense of justice
Seriously, people forget the sheer heroism Jason displayed during his Robin tenure. He has this weird reputation of being the "problem" kid, and people twisting his being Batman's Greatest Failure.
The failure was extremely nuanced and a disconnect born of a variety of factors. In his last moments in Israel, Jason fought with everything he had against the crippling crow bar injuries to save the same mother that sold him out to the Joker.
@@sageoverheaven oh man if we start talking about all the victim blaming that Jason had to deal with we wont stop, I hate that so much!!!!!!! people who blame him for his own death when he was betrayed by his own motehr who he still tried to save???!!!! even as she died she called him a good kid for that, jeeze,when the woman who sold out her own son and watched him get beaten up while smoking a cigarette is better at recognizing heroism tahn regular comic book readers thats a problem...
also all the things people were trying to call Jason a bad kid for are so weird like??? oh how dare the kid who grew up in one of the poorest neighbourhoods in Gotham have a problem when women and children are getting hurt and react a little more violently?? the whole Felipe Garzonas thing,my god,those issues are great cause even as pissed as Jason was he still didnt hit the guy when eh didnt resist arrest,remember thosep anels where hes like "resist!!"so he could hit him but the guy didnt so he didnt,that was restraint.Also I believe he didnt push Felipe in the end,he pulled a batman begins and was like"I wont kill you,but I dont have to save you", I mean he has done that since,he did it to black mask in the rebirth RHATO series lol
@@Demona9999Marluxia Yeah, I agree with everything said here. Few things I can't stomach are how Jason got the boss character → unlockable player character nerf ever since UtH. Then there's the total heel turn Batman's characterisation takes over and over just to reignite conflict between the two.
I think Red Hood works best when he's not buddy buddy with Batman and the rest of the family, won't let Batman push him around, but still ultimately cares for them despite their radically differing ideals.
@@sageoverheaven I like when its kinda that one meme that like "fine Ill help, but I will be complaining the whole time" kind of situation when it comes to Red Hood working with the batfam lol.
Sadly as the main character and all Bruce gets screwed over by different writters all too often, like just Grant Morrison and Tom King alone have done so much damage to the character its unbelievable and why I at least tend to ignore everything they wrote lol
@@sageoverheaven People forget that Jason stopped Batman from killing Joker once. He kept Batman in check that's what Robin is supposed to do.
9:20 Less bratty piece of s***, 😂 thats very accurate on most of the fanbase's reception of Damian😂
He’s not really a father figure to Babs she has a father
Barbra looks up to Batman he trained her
@@yarc9 But he not a father figure.
@@huntertezz Definitely not a father figure but he's like a cool uncle.
@@huntertezz he is
Amazing video bro. Keep it up.
My only problem with the Batfamily is that it's too damn big. At the most, it should be Batman Bruce Wayne, Alfred, Dick, Jason, Tim, Damian, and Cassandra Cain in my opinion. They should make him a loving compassionate father figure somewhat like the Wayne family Adventures. Instead of making him a jackass of a father. I know some will not like Barbara being left off but to me, she has a father in Jim.
Barbara is still family even if she is not one Batman's kids. Also she is kinda the daughter in law
DC is obsessed with turning Batman into a douche and it's very annoying.
its so frustrating that the batfam doesn't make an appearance in the live action when every inch of batman's life is at least in some wya affected by them. it's not right to see him as a loner when he was so much more to his character!
Thank you for just calling Damian the biological son instead of something like "the real son" or "Batman's actual son". Is constantly overlooked in the community, fans, and even the comics itself but I always felt there was always something dismissive of calling him that like because the other 3 are adopted they are not his "real sons". He loves them all of them equally and has show it in the past but Damian is always the "real" son, when he is just the biological son, same blood does not mean family and Batman without realizing is the biggest adoptive father representation out there (not the best but one of the biggest) and it was a big part of what make me love him as a character.
A video about Green Arrow please?
Hawkgirl and Masculinity?
I am interested in what are your views on James Bond’s masculinity
Why does Man not have his own daddy? Is he bad sun?
I had a peculiar idea, what about "Ghost Rider and masculinity"? Specifically Johnny Blaze
Now we need a video about masculinity of J. Jonah Jameson 😏
Can you do a video on Saitama and masculinity?
Yes.
Can u do masculinity on iron man tony stark
Bat family sucks. Most of the times at least
Batfamily sucks. They should have stopped at Jason Todd. Batman taking in more children after what happened to Todd shows that he's a very lousy parent.
Not really because he fixed his relationship with Jason. The Bat-Family makes Batman stronger.
@@callmejacob3234 it's not about fixing relationships it's about putting kids in harm's way. Plus the Batfamily doesn't make him stronger, all they do is lecture him about nonsense. It's the opposite infact because they nerf Batman in order to make the Batfamily seem useful. The DC animated Cartoon that adapted new 52 did it best. Just two Robins Dick and Damian, that's all.
@@callmejacob3234 Also i have seen your comment about Batman being compassionate and all I'll say is that compassion must be mixed with being pragmatic and practical like the arkham games. Batman must be pragmatic and practical.
Batman had Robin a year after his introduction. Bruce has always had a partner, and that will never stop.
It's Batman becoming an anti-social ASSHOLE after Jason's death that convinces Tim Drake of becoming Robin.
Batman needs a Robin.