It’s been a fun year Andrew. We build a wide range of highly technical equipment, at Magswitch, for many industries around the world, but our maker family is an entrenched part of who we are as a company. Thank you for your inspiration and the fun I have had sitting in on the new product sessions. Some of what I saw this week tells me 2021 will be just as exciting.
Lol, When you said these are high-end tools I was like... These will be expensive but I was honestly expecting them to cost twice as much. Love the idea and the product!
What an awesome design! I’ve always held off on bench press fences because I work with steel and wood. This will function for both! Ordered mine just now!
As one of your oldest fans - although too broke and too far away to be a supporter or afford those products - I'm so proud of you, man! You are one of the jewels of our community.
The fence is awesome, hope to afford one soon...however I have a suggested item for you to invent. A drill press vice that attaches to the drill press table with a couple of MagSwitches.
So, when are they going to ship? Understanding was that fulfillment would occur in April 2021. It is April 20th. Update : MagTools shipped my drill press fence yesterday, 6/10/21. I think they have been shipping all week.
Andy, I got my preordered fence. I notice the back of fence do not stick to it? The magnets do stick to the drill press table but not to back of fence. Maybe they magnet on that side is not magnetized? What should I do?
nice! always love seeing your ideas come to fruition Andrew! Looking at the fence i'm just thinking is there a way to add a few more tapped holes around the middle U area to accommodate a dust chute? Magsafe might be able to sell this as an optional accessory to the fence on their website too
Any idea when it will be shipped? May is practically over and no sign of shipping. I payed for mine like a day after this video came out and I watched it. I've bought most tools you show because I know they're good tools Andrew. Thanks
Very cool Andrew! Something that would be cool if one edge had either a lip to act as a stop and a hold down or had a flip out hold down. I guess you could get an extra magnet to act as a hold down though. Question: My current drill press table uses a wood table top. If I put a piece of steel in the area for this new fence does the thickness of the metal affect how strong the mag switch will be? Thanks for your time and all that you do. I like how inventive your mind is! Ron
Gotta say, as a blacksmith, I use my drill press all the time and have often lamented not having a nice big fence. I've never heard of this fence being mentioned on any of the metalworking forums I frequent. Aside from the big openings, it looks like it could be a very handy piece of equipment for here at Three Rivers Forge and I just might have to pull the trigger on it!
@@AndrewKleinWW Mag Switch is very popular in the metalworking world and I'm sure a variant of this fence would find favor there, especially with the hobbyists. The only downside I can imagine would be people complaining that the holes are too large to easily clamp work to. I'm sure there's a workaround that'd be easy enough, but I can see some folks asking that the fence be a uniform height and covered in 5/8" holes like a lot of the fixtures and welding tables currently on the market. Can't make everyone happy, I know, but it might be a good idea for the next version to come out.
@@soulsignastrology3712 in case you haven't seen it yet, it looks like the dimensions are up now: "The fence plate is 21 inches long by 4 5/16 inches high. "
Brilliant idea and nice execution! I have a question about the design though. With that tall a fence (4-1/2" on the pro version), have your drill press handle ever hit the fence when turning? If yes how did you address that? I would really love to get one of this fence as it looks so cool. But my homemode drill press table has a 2-1/2" tall fence and even that is too tall and constantly gets in the way of the handles. :(
Ordered and paid for your mag switch drill press fence in I think January after it was said that they would be delivered by late April. Still don’t have it . And I now see Grizzly is offering the same thing. When is it coming?
No question, if it is an Andy product im buying one. I have the wood taps, the vise and cant wait to get the drill press fence. Yet again I think you could charge 2x as much as you are asking and I would be all in
@@AndrewKleinWW Unfortunately not Andrew. Not that I was going to make a big purchase, but the Magswitch MagJig interested me a lot. I'm a woodworking and welding enthusiast, and their items are perfect for both. Not to mention the workbend you made for Adam Savage. Congratulations on this masterpiece.
I invested in a few medium mag switches for a bandsaw fence and I’m hoping Santa brings me a couple more this year so I don’t have to keep moving them around. The fences look great. Typical AK design.
It’s great to see these go into production! I provided feedback online but any chance you can use your contacts to get dimensions posted on the website? Not sure which size to get at the moment. Also: with the narrow mounting holes it looks like the longer fence could be used on a smaller table to allow positioning the stop blocks further out. Do you think that would be a reasonable use or would you recommend the smaller fence for smaller tables?
Large one is 21” by 4 5/16”, small one is 13” by 2 1/2”, and we put that on the website to, sorry it was missing. For a small drill press you can definitely have the ends of the fence sticking off a bit. I’d probably recommend the larger fence unless it’s height would interfere with the handles, in that case go with the smaller ones.
Hey Andrew. Not sure if you've done a video on this previously but would you consider doing one on the process of what it's like and the steps involved in licencing a product to a company. You've done a few now and I am sure your advice and tips would be of benefit to many of us in the community. Love the fence. I will be dropping huge hints to my missus in the hope it appears here in time for Christmas ;-)
I’ve thought about it but honestly I could never do as good a jog as InventrightTV does here on RUclips, so I’ve always just referee people there. Glad you like the fence, thanks!
@@AndrewKleinWW Ha ha I also sub to IventRightTV and have all of Stephen's books. Glad to know you approve of their method. Did you go through their course? Do you tend to start with a Sales Sheet of product benefits as they suggest? Promise that's my last two questions. Thanks for the response.
On the sales sheet thats really the only point I differ on because I like making videos so much more, I’ve always use video because making a compelling video is something I’ve gotten ok at
@@AndrewKleinWW Than you so much for taking the time to respond Andrew and thank sharing part of your approach. Clearly you are more than "ok" at making compelling videos! Been a subscriber of yours for years and been watching you longer than that. So stoked you are having so much success. Blessings for the future brother.
"Funny" question for you, if someone bought the small drill press fence as it looks amazing, and then realizes....oh crap my drill press table on my older 12" blue Ryobi drill press is too small to properly use even the small super cool fence. Do you have any suggestions on where or how to find a replacement larger cast iron drill press table to use? I have been looking around and so far look to be searching incorrectly. Even though the fence is not here yet, I am still happy I bought the fence, but hopefully I will be able to figure out how to use it. :) So if you have any ideas, they are appreciated :) Eventually I will get a larger drill press/better shop space to have more of the larger tools. But for now what I have mostly works. Other than the new fence when it gets here ;) Thanks.
So a couple questions, what makes the table too small? Because the magnets can be positioned really close together on the small fence, and if the sides stick out past the table that doesn’t hurt anything, or I don’t think it does, is that the issue? If I really needed a bigger table I would probably buy a 1/2” thick steel plate, drill appropriate holes in it, and fix it to the existing table T tracks.
@@AndrewKleinWW Thanks, that is the kind of useful information was what I was hoping to get :) Hopefully that will mean my table is not too small after all, it is only around 10.75" in diameter. And a half inch steel plate should be easier to find and use than what I had been thinking of, ie hacking a larger drill press table in place of this one.
@@AndrewKleinWW I 'solved' my problem and am now the happy owner of a rockwell delta 15-665 which has a nice big table off of craigslist. So the drill press fence will have a good home when it gets here. :)
@@AndrewKleinWW I'm in Canada, just across the border. I am used to paying more for shipping, but not like 5x more. Magswitch ships this to Buffalo for $15, but $80 to take it across the bridge to Canada. There are much cheaper shipping options to Canada, it looks like Magswitch hasn't found them.
This press has worked like a charm for my projects ruclips.net/user/postUgkxajoEbapTfqWaadnqb04h6U576yxXp-FE . I didn't even secure it to my table top, mainly due to the fact that I was using a 15 lbs drill vise. It's not flimsy at all as to what others have claimed it to be. Make sure the locking nuts and levers are secured and there won't be any issues with light pressure and patience. I was able to drill through aluminum, plastic, and steel (steel took a while) with no problems at all. Yeah it took a little longer than a regular drill press, but I don't have the space OR the money for one.The instruction manual was worthless, but luckily assembling the press was intuitive. However, the manual would be good for ordering replacement parts if needed. There is a nice breakdown of the parts that are included in the kit. Before ordering, make sure it is compatible with your unit, it is clearly stated what models the press is compatible with.This was an excellent purchase for $40!!
Looks like you could use some new doors! Just spitballing here! I have some magswitch products and am very satisfied. Can we buy just those mag switches for the fence?
I’ll need to buy new doors eventually but I’m happy to delay that purchase. We don’t have those magnets for individual sale at this point, but maybe someday. What would you use them for?
@@AndrewKleinWW If I had those switches I could make that metal fence. I know you don’t want to hear that, buts it’s true. But of course I’d make it a little different so not to infringe on any rights. Your a very clever Man, and I like seeing your ideas. Please keep it up!
@@AndrewKleinWW I can see using separate mag switches as hold downs or on a tablesaw as an angle stop near the front edge of the tablesaw when using a miter fence.
Man I'll be honest... This fence seems pretty cool but holy shit has the makers marketing push been relentless and absurd. I literally have 4 videos and a story or 2 about it in my RUclips feed right this second. I am 1 nice away from telling Google I'm not at all interested busy so I don't have to see another several listings about it. It's cool but I don't be spilling out my paycheck over it. My drill press table does all the tricks i.e. it has t-tracks for a highly adjustable ¾ or 3 inch tall fence, clamping via the t-tracks in the table or the fence and a replaceable zero clearance insert. The only advantage I see here is the added drilling depth due to the lack of the table... Other than that... Cool... Magnets 😒 Although I feel John Oliver would have been a better "non-spokesperson"
Yep, the relationship to the 2D axis of the spindle is all that matters. You can theoretically spin the fence a full 360 degrees about that axis without changing the relationship or the end result. In the real world it will change your errors because the fence and the table won't be perfectly oriented, so you could care about repeatability if you need to remove the fence for some reason, but it wouldn't matter which orientation you pick as long as you can return to it.
Yeah, I didn’t mention this in the video, but I like to leave one man gent on, turn the other off, and just move one side of the fence in and out to fine tune the depth,
![OsamaSon - ik what you did last summer [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4DIQDnu3mr4/mqdefault.jpg)
It’s been a fun year Andrew. We build a wide range of highly technical equipment, at Magswitch, for many industries around the world, but our maker family is an entrenched part of who we are as a company. Thank you for your inspiration and the fun I have had sitting in on the new product sessions. Some of what I saw this week tells me 2021 will be just as exciting.
It sure has been, looking forward to more!
Lol, When you said these are high-end tools I was like... These will be expensive but I was honestly expecting them to cost twice as much.
Love the idea and the product!
Very cool! Could be useful for cove cutting on the table saw, too.
What an awesome design! I’ve always held off on bench press fences because I work with steel and wood. This will function for both! Ordered mine just now!
Awesome, you’ll like it, thanks!
As one of your oldest fans - although too broke and too far away to be a supporter or afford those products - I'm so proud of you, man! You are one of the jewels of our community.
thanks man, means a lot
The fence is awesome, hope to afford one soon...however I have a suggested item for you to invent. A drill press vice that attaches to the drill press table with a couple of MagSwitches.
🤫
“Right outta the box, with no screwing around” should be the new Mag Switch slogan
I’m an excellent copy writer
So, when are they going to ship? Understanding was that fulfillment would occur in April 2021. It is April 20th. Update : MagTools shipped my drill press fence yesterday, 6/10/21. I think they have been shipping all week.
It really looks great, Andrew! Fantastic work! 😃
Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
Thanks!
That’s a awesome piece and a great value for the price
Thanks!
Andy, I got my preordered fence. I notice the back of fence do not stick to it? The magnets do stick to the drill press table but not to back of fence. Maybe they magnet on that side is not magnetized? What should I do?
Great idea!
Hello from Yorkton, Saskatchewan, Canada. Thanks for sharing your great video’s please keep them coming.
Ordered! Great solution!
Thanks, You'll like it!
nice! always love seeing your ideas come to fruition Andrew!
Looking at the fence i'm just thinking is there a way to add a few more tapped holes around the middle U area to accommodate a dust chute? Magsafe might be able to sell this as an optional accessory to the fence on their website too
It’s a good idea and I think a few accessories would make sense, I’ll give it some thought
Any idea when it will be shipped? May is practically over and no sign of shipping. I payed for mine like a day after this video came out and I watched it. I've bought most tools you show because I know they're good tools Andrew. Thanks
Very cool Andrew! Something that would be cool if one edge had either a lip to act as a stop and a hold down or had a flip out hold down. I guess you could get an extra magnet to act as a hold down though.
Question: My current drill press table uses a wood table top. If I put a piece of steel in the area for this new fence does the thickness of the metal affect how strong the mag switch will be?
Thanks for your time and all that you do. I like how inventive your mind is!
Ron
I just drilled 800 holes today. I could have used this! I use my Beisermeyer mounted feather board ALL THE TIME.
how r u verified
@@PrisonedPizza11 Earned it just like everyone else. OG RUclips creator.
@@GregsGarage ok tnx for answering
Gotta say, as a blacksmith, I use my drill press all the time and have often lamented not having a nice big fence. I've never heard of this fence being mentioned on any of the metalworking forums I frequent. Aside from the big openings, it looks like it could be a very handy piece of equipment for here at Three Rivers Forge and I just might have to pull the trigger on it!
Thanks, yes, we haven't don't nearly as well getting the word out to metal workers, but I'm glad you found it
@@AndrewKleinWW Mag Switch is very popular in the metalworking world and I'm sure a variant of this fence would find favor there, especially with the hobbyists. The only downside I can imagine would be people complaining that the holes are too large to easily clamp work to. I'm sure there's a workaround that'd be easy enough, but I can see some folks asking that the fence be a uniform height and covered in 5/8" holes like a lot of the fixtures and welding tables currently on the market. Can't make everyone happy, I know, but it might be a good idea for the next version to come out.
Purchased!!! Wish it would ship before April!!
Good idea, Andy. Happy Thanksgiving, too!
Thanks, same to you bud!
Easy to see why you kept putting off the windows, turned out great in the end.
It’s a boring project, but I’m glad it’s done
How about a magswitch setup for a miter saw? 🤔 The drill press fence is the best idea I’ve seen yet! 🤙🏻
Andrew, could you ask Mag-tools to include the dimensions of the fences on their web site? I couldn't find how wide and tall they are.
Yes, we'll get that on there
I was about to ask for dimensions as well before skimming the comments. Thanks!
It's 5 hrs later and no dim's. Possible to post them here? Thanks
Yup looking for size of both fences
@@soulsignastrology3712 in case you haven't seen it yet, it looks like the dimensions are up now: "The fence plate is 21 inches long by 4 5/16 inches high.
"
Brilliant idea and nice execution!
I have a question about the design though. With that tall a fence (4-1/2" on the pro version), have your drill press handle ever hit the fence when turning? If yes how did you address that?
I would really love to get one of this fence as it looks so cool. But my homemode drill press table has a 2-1/2" tall fence and even that is too tall and constantly gets in the way of the handles. :(
Seems like it'd be a great fence for the bandsaw, as well!
Yes, that is a strong second use case
Bought--can't wait!
nice job
Well you did it, you made me buy one. Looks like it will be well worth it
Love it. Got me thinking... can you make a Vise with magnets? What about embedding a steel sheet in the work top of my next work bench? So many ideas
Henceforth thou shall be dubbed Sir Andrew kl Einstein, Tool Genius. (unlike me, I'm just a tool.)
Awesome product. If I only have a descent drill press to mount one too.
Thanks, maybe someday
It is april 2021! The future finally arrived.
Ordered and paid for your mag switch drill press fence in I think January after it was said that they would be delivered by late April. Still don’t have it . And I now see Grizzly is offering the same thing. When is it coming?
Yes, we receive them tomorrow and will ship them out to you ASAP!
No question, if it is an Andy product im buying one. I have the wood taps, the vise and cant wait to get the drill press fence. Yet again I think you could charge 2x as much as you are asking and I would be all in
Thanks Jesse, I'm glad you like the ideas i'm putting out there, I'll keep em coming.
Why don't they ship it to Germany?
Head over to the mag switch .eu site, you can order from there, it has just been posted. And the discount code also works. I ordered mine today.
great products, but no shipping to Brazil ?
We ship internationally, is it not accepting your address?
@@AndrewKleinWW Unfortunately not Andrew. Not that I was going to make a big purchase, but the
Magswitch MagJig interested me a lot. I'm a woodworking and welding enthusiast, and their items are perfect for both. Not to mention the workbend you made for Adam Savage. Congratulations on this masterpiece.
bravo
love your work m8, whats that hoodie your wearing?
those are so cool!
That's awesome!
Is the 15% discount still available?
Very cool!! Andrew!!
Thanks!
I haven’t built mine yet, so I bought one. 😂
I invested in a few medium mag switches for a bandsaw fence and I’m hoping Santa brings me a couple more this year so I don’t have to keep moving them around. The fences look great. Typical AK design.
Thank you, yeah, switching magnets around gets old
What was the purpose of adding the extra clear plastic windows, to the existing windows?
The windows had broken and fallen out, so they were just holes
Very cool. Now if only I could get it in Europe. Stupid Atlantic ocean.
Well get this figured out
cool tool
may I please ask where you get the 'push sticks' for your saw-bench?
Sorry not sure which one you mean
Is that a single 4-bay garage door? I don't think I've ever seen one that big.
Just 2 bays
1 min 45 hell yes
You do know there are special drill bits designed not to crack plexi glass when you drill it?????
It’s great to see these go into production! I provided feedback online but any chance you can use your contacts to get dimensions posted on the website? Not sure which size to get at the moment.
Also: with the narrow mounting holes it looks like the longer fence could be used on a smaller table to allow positioning the stop blocks further out. Do you think that would be a reasonable use or would you recommend the smaller fence for smaller tables?
Large one is 21” by 4 5/16”, small one is 13” by 2 1/2”, and we put that on the website to, sorry it was missing.
For a small drill press you can definitely have the ends of the fence sticking off a bit. I’d probably recommend the larger fence unless it’s height would interfere with the handles, in that case go with the smaller ones.
Hahaha. The Matt Cremona fence is so cute. It may need some more hair on the fence though.
Definitely needs more hair
What are the holes for along the bottom?
Different mounting positions for the magnets for different sized drill press tables
Hey Andrew. Not sure if you've done a video on this previously but would you consider doing one on the process of what it's like and the steps involved in licencing a product to a company. You've done a few now and I am sure your advice and tips would be of benefit to many of us in the community. Love the fence. I will be dropping huge hints to my missus in the hope it appears here in time for Christmas ;-)
I’ve thought about it but honestly I could never do as good a jog as InventrightTV does here on RUclips, so I’ve always just referee people there. Glad you like the fence, thanks!
@@AndrewKleinWW Ha ha I also sub to IventRightTV and have all of Stephen's books. Glad to know you approve of their method. Did you go through their course? Do you tend to start with a Sales Sheet of product benefits as they suggest? Promise that's my last two questions. Thanks for the response.
I read one book and watch the free content, but didn’t go through the course.
On the sales sheet thats really the only point I differ on because I like making videos so much more, I’ve always use video because making a compelling video is something I’ve gotten ok at
@@AndrewKleinWW Than you so much for taking the time to respond Andrew and thank sharing part of your approach. Clearly you are more than "ok" at making compelling videos! Been a subscriber of yours for years and been watching you longer than that. So stoked you are having so much success. Blessings for the future brother.
"Funny" question for you, if someone bought the small drill press fence as it looks amazing, and then realizes....oh crap my drill press table on my older 12" blue Ryobi drill press is too small to properly use even the small super cool fence. Do you have any suggestions on where or how to find a replacement larger cast iron drill press table to use? I have been looking around and so far look to be searching incorrectly. Even though the fence is not here yet, I am still happy I bought the fence, but hopefully I will be able to figure out how to use it. :) So if you have any ideas, they are appreciated :) Eventually I will get a larger drill press/better shop space to have more of the larger tools. But for now what I have mostly works. Other than the new fence when it gets here ;) Thanks.
So a couple questions, what makes the table too small? Because the magnets can be positioned really close together on the small fence, and if the sides stick out past the table that doesn’t hurt anything, or I don’t think it does, is that the issue? If I really needed a bigger table I would probably buy a 1/2” thick steel plate, drill appropriate holes in it, and fix it to the existing table T tracks.
@@AndrewKleinWW Thanks, that is the kind of useful information was what I was hoping to get :) Hopefully that will mean my table is not too small after all, it is only around 10.75" in diameter. And a half inch steel plate should be easier to find and use than what I had been thinking of, ie hacking a larger drill press table in place of this one.
@@AndrewKleinWW I 'solved' my problem and am now the happy owner of a rockwell delta 15-665 which has a nice big table off of craigslist. So the drill press fence will have a good home when it gets here. :)
What are the dimensions of the two fences?
Large one is 21” by 4 5/16”, small one is 13” by 2 1/2”
It would be useful in making a purchase decision to have the width & height dimensions of both fence models.
Paul
Good point, we'll add that
Large one is 21” by 4 5/16”, small one is 13” by 2 1/2”
@@AndrewKleinWW Thanks
Mi è piaciuto molto istruttivo
They should do something about the $80 shipping charge if they want presales. That sting makes me say I will wait for it in stores.
Ouch, that is high, where are you located?
@@AndrewKleinWW I'm in Canada, just across the border. I am used to paying more for shipping, but not like 5x more. Magswitch ships this to Buffalo for $15, but $80 to take it across the bridge to Canada. There are much cheaper shipping options to Canada, it looks like Magswitch hasn't found them.
Dust port for shop vac?
This press has worked like a charm for my projects ruclips.net/user/postUgkxajoEbapTfqWaadnqb04h6U576yxXp-FE . I didn't even secure it to my table top, mainly due to the fact that I was using a 15 lbs drill vise. It's not flimsy at all as to what others have claimed it to be. Make sure the locking nuts and levers are secured and there won't be any issues with light pressure and patience. I was able to drill through aluminum, plastic, and steel (steel took a while) with no problems at all. Yeah it took a little longer than a regular drill press, but I don't have the space OR the money for one.The instruction manual was worthless, but luckily assembling the press was intuitive. However, the manual would be good for ordering replacement parts if needed. There is a nice breakdown of the parts that are included in the kit. Before ordering, make sure it is compatible with your unit, it is clearly stated what models the press is compatible with.This was an excellent purchase for $40!!
Looks like you could use some new doors! Just spitballing here! I have some magswitch products and am very satisfied. Can we buy just those mag switches for the fence?
I’ll need to buy new doors eventually but I’m happy to delay that purchase. We don’t have those magnets for individual sale at this point, but maybe someday. What would you use them for?
@@AndrewKleinWW If I had those switches I could make that metal fence. I know you don’t want to hear that, buts it’s true. But of course I’d make it a little different so not to infringe on any rights. Your a very clever Man, and I like seeing your ideas. Please keep it up!
@@AndrewKleinWW
I can see using separate mag switches as hold downs or on a tablesaw as an angle stop near the front edge of the tablesaw when using a miter fence.
where do you get the magnets?
They come with the fence
The easiest way to drill plexiglass, is with a hot nail.
Hmm never tried that
Drooling at the big boy, but as mag switch. EU does not have it, I'll have to skip buying it as it will cost too much from the states. 🙄😢
the 15% off code is not working only giving 10%
Yep, the 15% expired after the holiday, sorry if that wasn’t clear
@@AndrewKleinWW thanks
Man I'll be honest... This fence seems pretty cool but holy shit has the makers marketing push been relentless and absurd. I literally have 4 videos and a story or 2 about it in my RUclips feed right this second. I am 1 nice away from telling Google I'm not at all interested busy so I don't have to see another several listings about it. It's cool but I don't be spilling out my paycheck over it. My drill press table does all the tricks i.e. it has t-tracks for a highly adjustable ¾ or 3 inch tall fence, clamping via the t-tracks in the table or the fence and a replaceable zero clearance insert. The only advantage I see here is the added drilling depth due to the lack of the table... Other than that... Cool... Magnets 😒 Although I feel John Oliver would have been a better "non-spokesperson"
Love all your products, just can not afford them.....just like you can't afford a new garage door. just kidding
Haha! I’ll need a new garage door sooner or later, but I’m happy to kick that purchase down the road several years
Tempting. I'm surprised there's nothing to line the fence orthogonal to the base. Guess it doesn't absolutely matter for most uses.
Yep, the relationship to the 2D axis of the spindle is all that matters. You can theoretically spin the fence a full 360 degrees about that axis without changing the relationship or the end result. In the real world it will change your errors because the fence and the table won't be perfectly oriented, so you could care about repeatability if you need to remove the fence for some reason, but it wouldn't matter which orientation you pick as long as you can return to it.
Yeah, I didn’t mention this in the video, but I like to leave one man gent on, turn the other off, and just move one side of the fence in and out to fine tune the depth,
Just way too damn expensive for me. I think the design is very clever, as usual, but unattainable for folks like me.