This Comic Shop Owner HATES Graded Comic Books ... Epic Rant
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- Опубликовано: 11 окт 2024
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original video - • Don't grade another Co...
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Thanks for watching and reacting to our little show. The tattoos are Old Irish Left arm means storyteller and right means soul friend. I don't buy single books only collections (allows me to spread my risk). We are a diggers paradise with more than 6k dollar books (our bread and butter) our books are usually 20 to 40% below ebay. Stop on by!
Moral of the Story: Some people like wasting $25.00. 😅
Yup he's not wrong. Grading obviously has a place (e.g. online sales) but his complaint is about modern grading, fair market values, conflict of interest and greed. He's absolutely not wrong.
He was a little wrong on the overall narrative. We absolutely need third-party authentication and grading services in the hobby.
I believe this guy has the a few good perspective on a good part of what his rant.
Maybe, but when this happens, the grade should decrease. A brick shouldn’t be the same grade as a regular book. You can’t even read it. You can’t even see the art. How can a comic that you can’t read be the same grade as a comic that you can?
@CharlesCharles-bb6qx 🤔🤔🤔 I may have been in a previous life but not currently
He's completely right. There are no holes in his arguments, especially with regards to the 4% fees.
He's completely right....Shut the heck up and let him talk.
Think about it: You pay CGC to press and clean your silver age book, which will probably result in a higher grade, and a higher fair market value. Then you have CGC to grade it, they somehow determine it’s fair market value, and charge you 4% of that number.
They have every incentive to make your book look it’s best, give it the highest grade they can (without suspicion), and charge you the most that they can. If your book received a higher grade than you thought it would get, you will be a happy camper and CGC will get more of your money when you inevitably submit more books in the future.
This shouldn’t be happening. Are we not smarter than this?
Good for him. It's "The King's New Clothes" and everyone has fallen for it. I don't think he has an axe to grind. What's funny is when I see channels who try to tell us what we should buy? Please!
He's not wrong. I do like slabs but it does ruin the joy of collecting and appreciating the artwork.
His left arm says "Seanchai" who were traditional Irish storytellers and the custodians of history for centuries in Ireland
He is right on those dead books what a waste of
If people want graded comics, that's fine, not my way to collect and I prefer mine raw, for me it's a nostalgia thing. When I sit down to read a silver age comic it transports me to my younger self reading a brand new comic while sitting on the edge of the sidewalk in front of the local 7/11 store. I can't get that from reading digital copies or trade paperbacks (I did try them though).This does not mean I won't buy a graded comic for my collection, but then I am always wondering why it has the grade that it does, why is it 4.0 or a 8.5? Since there are no graders notes included with CGC comics and I am not willing to pay for the information. my choices are either accept it for what they say it is, or crack it and examine it myself.
I do understand that some people have no idea what is involved in grading a comic, I am not one of those people. I have been evaluating the grades on comics for over 50 years and am confident in my abilities. I also understand that people disagree, which is why when I decide to sell a book I put it in one of three categories, High Grade, Mid Grade or Low Grade. No one has ever argued with me over that, where as if I say a book is a 9.8 someone will invariably look until they find flaws that I might have missed. I am currently working on a form that people can use to access the grade of a comic based loosely on the Overstreet grading and Overstreet Price Guides.
If you want you comics slabbed slab them, if you want to put them in poly bags do that, Personally I prefer Mylar sleeves and have for about 30 years. Collect what and how you like, and don't try to tell people it is the right or wrong way to collect. Collecting, like grading is subjective when it comes to each individual.
Great comment, however just wanted to let you know grader's notes have been free for all books for a couple years now 👍
@@etrx87 I appreciate your correction, I was not aware that they were available to everyone now.
I collect comics. I don't collect slabs.
"Matt Nelson wouldn't steer us wrong"😂😂😂😂 wow! your wallet is showing.
Been collecting over 30 years. I actually read my comics, one of the reasons I dont have a single slab. Collect what you love 👍🏻👍🏻
pretty sure everyone collects what they love. Do you know someone that collects what they hate or something?
@@donaldvonglitchenberger4108 Many people speculate. People can be influenced. People can purchase on pure FOMO. It's not a difficult concept to grasp lol
Yeah, some of the books people get slabbed just boggles my mind, but, slabbing is the worst thing to ever happen to comics. It's not for me.
Slabbing has gotten out of hand. There are too many books that are getting slabbed for no reason other than they are hoping they will end up with another 1st appearance of miles morales type situation
who cares tho. i don’t even know those books exist cause i’m not looking for them
The shop owner is a great guy. We know him personally. Haven for Heroes is one of the best comic shops in NY! Highest Council Recommendation 👍
If Santa lived in Arizona and had a doomsday bunker… but I agree with Mad Max Santa.
Lmao
i kind of love this guy. I'm totally on board with him. Grading is old. I really hope it goes out of style. I don't understand the appeal other reason than greed. Are we getting so competitive about our treasures to the point that we have to claim "mine is better than yours", and have a cute little number to prove it. Furthermore, it certainly does not protect your book any better than a mylite and fullback combo. In fact its worse. Zero UV protection. Its really time to move on from grading
Goooooooood Lawwwd! - Let that man preach. Turn around brother man, this is the choir. He is righteously correct. We only judge covers, forget about fabulous inside panels. We allow the grader to charge a fee to improve the comic, and theeeeeeen - we have clowns saying "buy the book, not the grade" but they push grading 24/7. This man is a Comic Gods Certified (CGC) 9.9!
I agree with both of you. The Shop owner and StickyGoose. I read the moderns thru the Golden age in my raw collection. They are all fun reads, and some are pretty goofy! I just have to grade all the major keys and valuable books (minimum 2.5K and up). I have no choice because I may need to send one or two in for 100K investing cash. Those have to stay slabbed. Anything under 2,500. is a waste of cash. Especially the 4% fair value scheme they had at CGC prior to the 24th. Though it does not feel any better. Finally, learn to grade and stick to your guns when selling to shops.
I buy both.. love to preserve the color and condition with slabs . Look for deals and don’t be bitter when you don’t the hammer price from an auction if you decide to sell.
Plastic slabs are not uv resistant. Just fyi. Keep your expensive paper out of sunlight
I have recently stop using CGC but I see no problem with graded comics. These books are 60, 70 sometimes 80 yrs old, heck my oldest book is 82! I’m not trying to constantly flip through paper that wasn’t even suppose to last a year let alone 82. I read my books digitally. Half the time comic collectors don’t even put on deodorant before a con or wash their hands coming out the bathroom , you really want to encourage them to handle grail books?
I see his point about the cost of grading VS the return, still people just like to slab what they want sometimes. I like the part on discussing grade & pricing in person, it gives you a chance to get a better deal & see the book for yourself. FMV varies based on overstreet & online sites for a multitude of reasons, I've experienced ebay sellers telling me " I've already got this much $$$ into this comic, so it's higher than what you see elsewhere, or that's my price". What the seller doesn't understand is it's always been a BUYER'S market.
I’m not into slabbing, but that’s just me. Everyone has their own preferences. I began reading comics in the 70’s. I still have a lot of my original comics, I like to pick them up, feel the pages it reminds me of when I used to get them at quick shops. I’ve never bought a slabbed book. I also collect hot wheels same story I want to set the track out and play with the cars like I did when I was a kid. I don’t want to entomb my car in a plastic cube to just look at the car. So I can see where he is coming from. Everyone has their own opinions and that’s fine. We don’t all have to agree or disagree.
The only people who like to seal stuff like Pokemon cards, hot wheels and comic books are the ones making money of it or making content on it. Im new in comics and none of my 20 y.o. new head comic book/ Pokemon collectors seal stuff. We just enjoy it haha.
@@jelvaschyeah absolutely nobody likes to preserve the quality of their books
@ChesterNutter you guys that get all horny smelling and touching comics from the 70s like wtf lol
@@Hingusbingus4
That Big Jim Ski Jump ⛷️ set is epic - and enormous when assembled.
Right! I mean, who doesn't know who Big Jim is? Remember the Big Jim Van?
@@aftacomics5865 The Big Jim sports camper is iconic - I never owned it but I did have the Evel Knievel Scramble Van - which is virtually the same vehicle for Evel Knievel. He used it to tow his motorcycle 🏍️ and it had a ramp for jumps.
I had the van, the motorcycle, and most of what was available at the time. From the mid 60's, to the early 70's, I was just the right age for all of that 💩, and I loved it. A couple of years later, I was going to see The Ramones, Dead Kennedy's, Bad Brains, and The Plasmatics.
He’s just an old dealer who wants to go back to the old way of doing business. The dealer had control of setting prices for his books. He used Overstreet as a starting point but then he estimated what he thought the final price should be according to what he paid. It wasn’t a science. It was really more of an art. Everyone accepted this process. If you thought the price was too high then you haggled for a lower price. If he didn’t come down you looked for another dealer. You didn’t have the whole world as a shopping market. Sometimes you had to take what you could get. The world has changed around that old dealer and he doesn’t like it.
He’s really not wrong in his view on the conflict of interest. Esp. Since black rock took over the grading company and pushed it into being more about turning profits.
Market manipulation and all is pretty scummy in my opinion. And there being no true standard by them. As we have seen with many books we send in and suddenly a book get a 8.5 and then sent back in with zero work and it gets a 9.4, yes there is an issue.
Now I do get my vintage major key books graded, but that’s to keep in secure and intact due to its age. But people slabbing all these modern books that are worthless is annoying as well.
So I can get behind his views
CGC has proven itself to be no guarantee of quality or accurate grading.... which is supposed to be why they exist.
I agree w/everything this guy sed. You don't hafta been burned by CGC to recognized th absurdity of this corrupt business model rife w/conflicts of interest. And everyone just goes along with it. If I say this stuff out loud my fellow hobbyists just kill th messenger and crawl back in their holes.
And Big Jim was awesome. Read a book.
He's totally right!
Buying or getting your books slabed is idiotic.
Buying a book you can't read is idiotic.
Dude, are we getting hit with the same algorithm? This guy popped up on my feed just a few days ago and I watched this and a couple of his other videos. He does have some valid points that I can agree with but I feel he's just stuck in the pre-internet past: Online selling bad / In store selling good. People that buy and resell are ruining the hobby, you must buy from a lcs to visually touch and inspect books... It sounds like he runs a nice shop and offers good prices. Sadly you don't get that from every LCS. I like my LCS, but they don't really have any competition , so $5 books cost $5 and $10 books cost $10. I also got hit up with a couple other youtubers doing CGC unboxing to random comics with bad grades. A lot of people out there just throwing money away, but, it's their money...
Ok I totally feel for this guy becasue that s how I felt in the early 2000s regarding pressing and cgc . at the same time I think he s a little bitter maybe he missed the boat on the cgc deals and the all the money that was and has been made. at the same time you gotta move forward to the times and also be open to new collectors plus look at his wall those books haven't moved for ages the bags are all old and this is the type of dealer where he won't budge on his prices and probaly over grades his books . then when u want to deal the deal is always on that dealers side.. No thank you !
He makes perfect sense.
He’s obviously a comic purist that rejects the entire slabbing idea. Some of the things he’s mentioning aren’t wrong but I think the comic world does well with both raw and slabbed comics.
Stickygoose always about that sticky YT drama!
oh and you nailed it I was a punk in my youth glad it still shows.
Slabs are called comic coffins for a reason.
Nothing better than smelling pages of old comics
I like graded books, it makes them easy to display and gives me assurance that what I am buying online is real and has all the pages. I can read most stuff online now, so buying physical books is mostly about collecting and displaying.
I like the way slabs look. Therefore. I buy the magnetic cases for $9, a piece, and change out the comics whenever I want. Reprints and facsimile editions have made the key issues obtainable for all of us. I’ll buy a facsimile and slab it. I’m in it a total of $15 and I’m perfectly happy with it. Graded key issues are nothing more than status symbols.
I'm on the side of the "motorcycle santa" everybody else got their head up cgcs ass.
Grading modern books is pretty much a waste of money overall. Or for that matter any older book that isn't over a certain value. He's not wrong.
Not really, I bought a 1/500 Spider-Man, I’ll have it slabbed to preserve it.
@@jaya076 Do you know how many were printed? If not, what are you basing your valuation of the book on? This is unfortunately the trip up with modern books. There is no transparency from anyone as to how many copies of a book are out there and what happened to unsold copies
@@jaya076 I was on a Whatnot show for ComicTom the other day. He must have sold a dozen 1:100s. Where did he get all of those from?
@@slickjolly I am not sure. But it wasn’t this comic
I don’t know how many were printed but I could probably find out.
Amazing spider 1 1/500 Rose Besch
I got fuked by a seller at a con for a raw hulk 181. Got it graded and it came back a 8.5 restored. But I definitely hate when resellers grade every modern book and whats worse is a buyer saying "i only buy cgc"
::edit:: .. i have that same nike/mickey hat in blue 👍
He is right, his prob. been doing this for 40-50 years. It is not about how u look. CGC is bad just look at all the bad review lately. i have been collecting since the 70s and not one is graded like avengers 1, tales of suspense 1, to astonish 1 etc. Stand your ground.
We have digital comics now. You can read them digitally.
yeah but these older guys like to smell and lick their childhood books . it’s just not the same digitally
Old Sami Zayn landing those Helluva Kicks on CGC.
Like it or not, he's speaking the absolute truth!
You are complete right man ... its really crazy to pay grading comics, unless you hope in 70 years is gonna worth something... that is common science .... thank you .... all the best from Serbia :)
The thing I agree with him most is grading ultra modern comic books...same thing happens with sports cards...people open up a box of 2024 prizm basketball cards and send every rookie, parallel and insert to get graded. It makes zero sense. If the grade comes back anything other and a Gem Mint 10 then the card is actually worth less. Good video, love I don't love that WVU garb! #H2P haha
CGC is nothing but outsiders horning in to take a cut. The prestigious auction houses of the 90s started inserting themselves between the seller and buyer when the price of some comics hit over five figues.
I get the silver age comics from my collection graded. No high-grade stuff, but once those comics are gone, they are gone. The modern books will be around forever.
I personally love this dude. Yes he hates graded books, I personally don't...but he comes from a different generation. He hits on a lot of good points especially when CGC is charging a % of FMV on high value books. "When money is involved fuckery is always afoot" lmao
It truly is weird to see clearly worthless books being sent out for slabbing. Walking Dead Deluxe is a great example here, you're actually LOOSING money by sending it to CGC, you'll never recover from that cost and you will most likely LOOSE money when selling it.
Though he makes a strange argument out of the fact that you can't read slabbed books. You can read the trade paperback version, you can read it digitally, the fac simile if there are one, originals copies stored at archive services or even the LOC, etc. Just because some books are slabbed doesn't mean you can't enjoy the original work behind the glass elsewhere. Beside, the paper quality on older books is terrible, the colors fade, you're better off reading a reprint if you want to enjoy it.
The FMV is set by the market itself, literally, weird take again. CGC probably does nothing more than see recent sales online.
If CGC began publishing comics, I'm sure this dude would be on speed dial to complain about it, so I don't see why he disqualifies CGC here on the basis that they "just" slab the books.
I’m not a fan of how they colour modern reprints. Way over saturated. The warmth of the colour on the newsprint is lost.
@@curtisnordstrom sure if you're a purist it'll bother you, but the common readers don't really care about that. Also there are digital scans of newsprints, so even there...
@@lafanfarlo4872 not a purist. But I am an artist so I think about and love things like the art of a comic. Usually the main reason I buy comics
Of course he’s gonna say all that. Back in the day, the comic book owners would take advantage of not very knowledgeable collectors and they would sell them crap for a very high price now with the cgc at least we know what we’re buying. And they cannot take advantage of us.
Without slabbing, third-party grading becomes meaningless. Without third-party grading, we are back to the days when sellers graded the books they sold. Would anyone deny that that conflict of interest is a major reason these grading companies have prospered? Greed and selfishness are the root problems here. Why would anyone grade a book that is not particularly sought after? People like to experiment, test things out, and even like the fun of their own CGC unboxing. What's wrong with that?
I like my books raw. But i also want high grade slabs of some of my favorite books.
Well I guess that I’ve been buying comics in two different Millenia! Actually about the same amount of time in each one too!
Agree with man 100% Grading is for people who care about money, not art.
So correct. A comic is meant to be read, handled, used. CGC has taken all the fun and the whole point out of comics. What is to *enjoy* about an object that loses its entire purpose? Trading cards I can sort of understand, you’re not hiding anything. Also, no-one is going on Antiques Roadshow permamently encasing watches, paintings and furniture. Because why would you?
My question about CGC/CBCS charging based on FMV is... why? Do they spend more time depending on the books value? Do they put it in a better case? Does it take longer to grade? No No, and No, so why charge more? What is their rational? Have they ever been asked? If it's because their risk is more (which is isn't since they never take responsibility for anything) then why not just a flat rate for books over a certain value? It makes NO sense for them to charge based on FMV.
My guess is that the person grading an Action Comics #1 is probably at the top of the food-chain but they still have to factor in the damages that could occur with exceptionally old books (brittle pages, oxidized paper, centerfolds detaching, etc) so that insurance premium goes into the cost of grading in case damage does occur. Just a guess but it makes sense...
They do because they can. It is a for-profit company
@@joshuawyatt4381 I'm sure they will say "insurance" but they have to carry the highest levels regardless due to the amount of books they have at any one time. Plus, high value does not mean "old". There are many modern, bronze, and silver age books that are worth thousands, without brittle pages, etc. For example, Walking Dead #1, 9.8 value $2,500.00 or so. This modern book doesn't take any more time than a $5 book. They should price per era with flat rates, and they should spend more time on silver+. As @etrx87 says below... it's about money.
Most dealers that don't like gradding are afraid of grading. They are afraid of the real grade. These are the dealers that will take a book that is torn up and sell it as a gem mint comic. They are afraid that a grading service will take their so called gem mint comic and give it a grade that fits the book. I will agree you do not grade every book, but there's nothing wrong with grading if you are truthful about the condition of your book.
I saw this video and I agree this gentleman had me cracking up with some of his takes. I don't agree with his whole take on grading comics but I did agree on two key points. Like you stated one of the real issues is the books that people are sending out to get graded, its ridiculous the garbage that people will send out to CGC but that is not on CGC that is on the people sending garbage books to get graded. The other point I agreed with him is on the whole issue of the perceived conflict of interest with CGC providing their own in house cleaning and pressing service. Other than that I disagree with him on the rest of it, we are better off today with third party grading than we were in the wild wild west that we had before.
This man is right about everything.
I love when he smashes the slabs together, lol. I call him the Grumpy Ole Santa. He kind-of got bent out shape with Swagglehaus Karen letters. Everyone who knows better never uses CGC pressing, they sux! Look, what happens when I die and my family has no idea what these books are worth. At least grading will give them a piece of mind of FMV. Who grades a Walking Dead deluxe? Some noob who is learning the ropes, lol
6:27…….like him or not, that statement could not be any more true. May seem like a crusty old man, but he understands the business world.
I love this guy! He's Old School, into comics for the love of the stories and wants people to get into the art form as readers, not ruin it as pure speculators. Top man!
I have several books signed by Don Perlin and a couple of them are keys that are signed by him in art studio inside his house, should I get them slabbed?
It is quite hilarious that the pro-CGC people will turn around and tell you to buy the book, not the grade. I mean, really give that a moment to sink in. I will never own a slab. All of my high value books are in mylar and top loaders. If they fall apart in that, oh well. The books can still be accessed. These are books. They aren't cards or posters. Can you imagine someone incasing an actual book...say a first printing of The Great Gatsby? And the advocate of this encasing would tell you to simply buy a reader copy? Insanity! Ludicrous!! IMO.
This guy asks, in another video, how many of these people are millionaires from selling graded comics? Millionaires BUY them for their own collections, but people aren't rolling in the dough doing this. They are just ruining the industry for people like me. Again, IMO. I'm not suggesting I am the end all be all. This is simply how I feel. I 100% agree with him, though. If brick and mortar goes away, the hobby is dead for people like me, who love it above and beyond the slabbing.
👍. Totally agree with you.
I have only had two comics graded and that's because one ,meet Rob Liefeld at a comic store signing and wanted It for my PC and two. An Avengers #11 to be protected because of It's age.
it's not for everyone...but on the right books it brings the value up whether you like it or not
Bravo! I read my comics, stabbing is lame, especially stabbing last week's comics
I would love to see a case that allows you to choose a page/spread you showcase, with a case shaped like a V. At least you'd get a cover, back , and one spread.
I’ve sent Avengers #4 #18 #57 Submariner #1 and captain America #100 sgt. fury #13 to cgc and gotten good grades on them.
All about graded COVERS. How about this... no comics should be slabbed if under 20 years old. Let's see how many of these raw comics make it to a mint condition in collectors collections when they are eligible to be slabbed. I bet a lot of these current collectors or influencers will have moved on from the hobby to something else, like NFTs.
So I watched them grade books and they don't even wear gloves. Why would I trust someone to tell me what my comic is worth. It should be seller and buyer agreement
Turns comics into giant trading cards
Just for future videos involving watching another video. Don't talk over the other video that your watching. Remember we're watching it with you too, some of us for the first time.
When you do need to comment during the video simply pause it , make you comment about that moment then unpause.
Many youtubers do this above method and the overall video flows better IMO.
Cgc has not helping with pricing. They have artificially inflated a lot of books such as 1st appearance of miles morales. Its a modern book and was heavily printed.
Hey I was looking thru some of my belongings and I found some very old 60s-91 comic books about 200 of them how can I sell them for the best price?
If they're not graded you won't get the best price.
The only place where this guy is flat out wrong is the "conflict of interest" part. If BEFORE you send a book to CGC, you are informed that "we control and own the entire process from FMV, to cleaning and pressing, to grading and encapsulating" then there is no LEGAL conflict of interest. A "conflict of interest" is where you don't tell someone you have an interest in any recommendation you make - i.e. doctors cannot recommend a lab center that they own without telling you. Otherwise, enjoying his rant immensely.
Cgc is made not for kids who used to be the core clients of the comic book industry.
Cgc is the symptom not the root of the problem. And that problem is yhe comic book industry is dying because most clients are 30+ year olds.
If the younger generations don't connect with the comics then all that's left is a nostalgia convention sprinkled in with tertiary buyers and sellers acting like those sleezoids on wallstreet on tv always making their predictions and speculations and never actually enjoying comics as they were originally intended as a kid; which was to read and collect.
Anyways comicbook owners are the mainstream sellers of comics at least for kids and as soon as the older generations either lose interest or die off, it will not replenish itself as it did in previous generations.
Nah, I’m grading those Peach Momoko covers! Works of art!
He ain’t wrong
"Mr. Who? He's the arbitrator" who's his successor? Is there a crown or pedestal included with the job.
I agree, would never buy a slabbed book, overpriced and unreadable. I buy comics to read, they're not wallpaper.
Why would I want to buy a raw book from 1950 and not know if it has restoration or have to count the pages or get screwed rather just get a CGC graded and know everything is fine this guys a complainer
a CGC grade means nothing as people like to display the comics and light will change the color over time .
Is this a discussion video on CGC slabs or a let’s make fun of the shop owner?
11:30 I think there's some subjectivity. People can be guided by passion more than money. It might not do their bank account any favors, but maybe this guy is in a position at this stage of life where he doesn't need to worry and he runs his shop according to his principles around the hobby.
Cover price for slabs? Strap on and head in there StickyGoose!! I want to watch that video!!!
A person who makes a living buying collections for pennies on the dollar and reselling those same books to collectors for 2-3X their 'FMV' is concerned about CGC ripping people off? Please give me more videos like this because this is fucking hilarious, most people have no idea the way the world works. Scammers hate other scammers, especially when their scams cut into their profit the way that CGC has for retail stores. "Buyin' comics online? Back in my day we paid for the store owner's rent, utilities, and overhead for a single issue before that fancy Internet came along and underpriced us!"
Keep them coming, you should check out “reserved investments” videos about comic investments. Sorry for sounding like a broken record. You’re just on to something ❤
This guy CLEARLY doesnt understand WHY people grade books LOL
and most everyone here will STILL send shit to them to give CGC money. CGC could commit murders, and the community would still send them books to grade.
He's not wrong, and most of your comments weren't really constructive other than talking about his appearance and saying "come on dude" during his video. maybe I'm not the type of people you're trying to keep on your channel. Best of luck to you.
Don’t forget the shipping on the dead $25 9.2
So, he doesn't like book slabs because he likes to read the books? 😂
If you don't want the service then don't do it, grading comics is not mandatory. If you don't want to deal with them then don't. He didn't have to buy that 9.2. I have some graded comics and i love them.
Kinda agree with both, why do people grade modern shite.