Corporals Corner Mid-Week Video #19 Old School Gear Challenge the LBE Versus the LBV Which is Better
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- Опубликовано: 1 окт 2024
- Time For an Old School Gear Comparison, which is Better? Please Hit the LIKE and SUBSCRIBE BUTTONS as well as the NOTIFICATION BELL. Feel Free to Check out my Amazon Influencer Page and Follow Me on Instagram, Facebook and Twitter. Thanks For Watching.
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My Australian Grandfather was at a place called Pozieres Ridge in 1916. The Krauts had made a breakthrough with Stormtrooper superior forces . Eight Australians digging out of a Bunker .Reliable reports say it was 20 to 1 against the Australians who went at the Krauts who had Captured other Australians who had been devastated after Eight Hours of Shelling, mostly wounded ,captured and being taken back to the Krauts Lines. All Eight, in Eyewitness reports being Hit multiple times, rounded up the Krauts killing or capturing the Enemy forces ! Freeing their Mates !....now my People the Australians have been covertly exterminated and covertly replaced with mostly moronic third world migrants ...Lest WE forget.
Thank you for this video
very helpful info on how and why to set up the gear. another reason to have the belt at your navel is if you feel yours sides at that level, that is actually where the top of your hips are. you want the wait distributed onto your hips at the waist. chainmail is worn with a belt at the waist to help the weight of the chainmail to be distributed to your hips and not left solely to your shoulders. 🤗
Thank you for your Service Brother! Great mid week vid and info!!!
Does the wide mouth canteen have the attachment to accept the gas mask straw like the plastic one you have?
Semper Fi!
I went in in '88 and had LBE...as you know, it was All Purpose for an Individual!
As a old fart, I like the LBE. The nylon is better than the cotton, for at least one reason. The nylon doesn't rot away in hot humid conditions.
I like the weight being mostly on the hips with LBE. The vest puts the weight and stress on the lower back.
Like you, my personal preference, after all these years, is still the good old LBE. I combine it with my ALICE pack, and I'm good to go.
As a child growing up in the 80's, with all of the action movies, Soldier of Fortune magazine, and the cold war raging in the news on TV, for me, having a complete set of ALICE gear was the Holy Grail of all military equipment.
I can still remember the smell of digging through a used gear bin at the local Army & Navy store, dreaming about building a perfectly correct infantryman's loadout. Oh the memories!!!
Ultimately my Mother actually helped me fill out a paper order form from the Brigade Quartermaster's catalog, sign a check, stuff it all in a stamped envelope, and drop it in the mailbox. I don't remember exactly how long it took to finally receive that order, but it felt like an eternity. 😃 lol
Once it arrived, I put it all together, and my friends and I were off to the woods, to run around acting out our favorite military movie scenes.
Great times! 🙂
Ah, deuce gear! I took my swing at the Corps with OCS in the '70s. During the first increment in '75, I was issued WWII 782 gear and an M14! In '77, we got ALICE and we thought we were on top of the world!
I far prefer the M1956 pattern with the H-harness, for all the reasons you mention. IF I ever have to go prone for protection, I want as little as possible between me and the Good Earth! Carrying a bunch of gear on a chest rig just looks like it keeps the wearer too high.
There's also an episode of 'Magnum, P.I.' where he wears an LBE rig for a day hike.
The LBE/LCE is still best for the Infantry on foot. The LBV is more for being in a vehicle; Hummer or M113 or any armored vehicle. The LBV has it's own rear pack, not shown in the video. More of a camelbak looking thing. Basically, less snagging going in and out of a vehicle, esp. a hatch. Using a modded pilot vest with an LBE seems to work too. You can load up or load down depending on the situation. Great video!
We wore the ammo pouches directly in front on the belt when I was in the Air Force. There’s an eyelet on the ammo pouch the suspender can attach to.
Might be a little critical to assume someone wasn’t in the military or hadn’t use this setup based on where the mag pouches are. Because that would be a broad assumption
The SAW pouches almost require the use of those eyelets. A 200rd drum is heavy and worn on the side, tend to flop.
One of your best midweek videos, I've never been in the military nor will I ever do what you do, but, I truly enjoy watching and flowing you. You are doing what you want to in life and that rocks.
Hey Corporal....I've been with you for over 3 years now, went back and watched Every single video from your start and I've learned a few knots, Many shelters, and Hundreds of hours of
Invaluable information...so my Brother, I'll be right here for the last Ever video !!!!....
Which I Hope never comes....Ever Forward !!
As a Brit, I have to say I love the molle gear and gucci stuff the kids have these days, but our version of the LBE was 58 Pattern webbing, still have it, still love it, still use it.
Another old fart watching, Switched to the LBV due to low back issues. Still have both setups, but the LBE is for light loads these days.
Semper Fi, E4 mafia since 08/01/80.
I have 3 setups; M1956/M1967 H-Harness, ALICE Y-Harness, and Enhanced Tactical Vest. My favorite is the LBV, however I do like the H-Harness also.
The real answer is they are all good. The Y-Harness has the least material on your back so you cool off better. The H-Harness has better weight distribution, and the M1967 Harness has hooks for a second buttpack if you need it. The LBV lets you load up a ton of stuff with extra pouches. They all work well. They are all battle tested. They all get the job done on a small budget.
I say get all 3 systems so you can have the flexibility of using whichever one fits the role best. I have about $200 in all 3 setups. I do still need a couple buttpacks and an ammo pouch for the 56 gear, but you can set up an LBV and ALICE for about $120. That's total, not each. Throw in an ALICE pack and you are GOLD.
Old school gear will always be king
I'm an LBE kinda grunt.1982 baby.
Long Live the Republic 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸 God Bless America 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
I still use both. If I HAD to grab one, id grab my alice gear. Including my medium alice pack , with frame, and woodland pack cover.
I preferred the H-Harness.
Still wearing canvas H rig
Dude that's REAL old school lol
I use the H harness as well 👍
Same here.
Still have my H harness, ALICE gear x3. Using a Blackhawk H harness now and love it.
Wowza / Corporal Kelly’s Corner Saved my Life!!!
me~ 67 male USNMCB Fighting 40 That’s twice now a Most Honorable USMC Corporal has saved my skin!!! “O Ya we weren’t in Cambodia”🤣🤣🤣
I’m at Archery ELK camp 🏕️ and I did the worst🤷🏻♂️ I forgot some of the knots 🤪 I asked my Son how He learned to tie knots & He said Corporal🫡 TY🙋🏻♂️🗽
Hang in there Kelly!!!!!
We Need You, FRIEND
I am a Vietnam Vet and the y harness is my favorite because it is what I am familiar with and used. I have adaptive my y to hold bedroll for overnight or multi day trips. Good info and examples with your video. Thanks for your service.
I like the LBE. Free open chest area so you can get real low when you have to hit the dirt.
I still use the LBE (web gear) as my standard for hunting and hiking Alice gear for the win
I still prefer the H harness LBE. It took me digging through several pallets of old gear to find mine when I was in, but when you are a medic, you need a little bit more support for your gear.
Those ammo pouches, I cut the plastic inside, then a Sawyer Mini Filter Kit fits inside, it makes a great water kit to have on the belt.
ALICE gear with the "butt pack" and utility belt. Old school, but it works for me.
I'm old & still prefer the "harness." The vest has its points, but to me, falls short of the harness.
The LBE is my favorite for all the reasons you stated. I have a slightly larger butt pack. I tried a commercial mesh vest , to hot , not adaptable. For day hikes nothing beats the LBE.
I just mixmaster stuff for my uses.
One time i was running a cobbled together load bearing harness from an old BAR belt, a nylon H harness, a non gi butt pack, 2 Lowe pouches.
Old infantryman here, old school LBE for me.
putting one together again to have put up.
Same here 11B4H
Being an old Infantrymen I prefer my LBE personally, And as always, the gear you have is the best gear to use
frigging HATED the vest.!!! made me Overheat AND i was the 203 gunner/asst mg/team ldr/medic.... h harrness also was easier to weave in between the old flak vest vs the tac vest that got twisted
My 782 issue had parts dated 1942 -- even in RVN. Afterwards, my new job required also using Load Baring gear. I agree with you. The LBV had better shoulder pads but I still like the older Alice LBE with H harness (improved with various mods for wear comfort). Besides being cooler, and it is more adaptable; I like being able to adjust on the belt. I still use a stainless canteen and cup (also a Camelback and newer pack). It also seems old is new again as there are gear discussions ongoing regarding best JUNGLE types of LBE. I still have my LBE available but my movements capability has down graded. It an aging thought process and an aging guy thing. I recently gave my blues, uniforms, old 782 gear and associated uniform gear to a younger family collector for exhibition. We collect when we are younger and pass it on as we get older. Weapon use gear stays with the weapons. More space is nice. Good topic.
I love my LBE. And the whole ALICE system. I was issued it in 1988 when I joined the Army and still use it today. I’m just an old school old fool I guess.
87-93 ... I got old school LBE to
This us what you do best. Equipment comparisons and how to wear and use. While I am recovering from throat cancer surgery this Tuesday, I will be catching up on some of your past videos. Keep up the good work.😊
The old lbe was simple and still works....
There's alot to be said about "old school" gear, I tend to tell my kids it's "experienced, and field proven".. lol 😂 Love the comparison sir. 😊
You need an LBV-88, the newer vests with the mesh and slanted mag pouches are way better.
I preferred the LBE because it was easier to sling carry a bandolier and a belt for the M60 as was SOP for every rifleman. That said I only had vest for brief period before MY ETS in 93.
@@guyring8912 Yeah, I have both, I prefer the LBV-88 but both vests are very good.
@@therocknroller184 I like the old one best.
I wore both in the USMC. 93-03 . The LBE was far superior!! As comfort goes, the arm rest and brain bucket holder "ammo pouch" vs the LBV which you couldn't rest your arms or hang your bucket from... Also, all the loops from the vest made it harder to attach your gear and hook on my beloved Vietnam era canvas butt pack for storing Chef B and my stove. It was also harder when we had to wear a flak jacket. I fielded the LBV at MCT in 93 for trials and coming from the old stuff at P.I. from boot, we didnt care for it. Fast forward 30 years and I am wearing OCP body armor with all the high speed garbage and I still rather have my canteens and ammo pouches as trying to get in and out of vics at 50 is starting to suck! GO National Guard!!! lol
Thanks! You did a better job explaining the load out than my drill sergeant did 43 years ago!
I love the old school gear. When I was in the Army back in the late 80's, I wore and used the LBE. It was great gear, versatile, light weight and very functional. I do miss it. If I ever come across another one, I'm getting it. Great video Shawn; definitely a trip down memory lane for me.
I preferred the LBE. The LBV was too restrictive and hot.
Thank you for sharing your knowledge and expertise and hello from romulus Michigan brother thank you again and GOD-BLESS
That titanium bottle would be an awesome upgrade as the green plastic made the water taste terrible. Good video bud
LBE I absolutely hated when the ARMY switched.
Hey corp. I don’t remember if you’ve ever done this, but a neat reminder for a midweek clip would be to remind people to make charcoal whenever the opportunity comes up. I was homeless for a short 30 month stint in the early 70’s living in a low cider lock hut I built in a patch of woods behind a grocery store, and I had to be careful about smoke from my cook fire because the local talent would call the cops. In my frequent scrounging I found two sections of 6 inch clay sewer pipe. Whenever I had a fire, I had this pipe stuffed with dry oak chunks (be sure to seal the ends with clay) against the fire so I had a steady supply of slower burning, relatively smokeless fuel. Easy to do and takes very little effort.
All my gear is M1956 A.L.I.C.E canvas stuff with the "Y" harness. I guess I'm just really old school.
First,enjoy your mid week videos. Next, what great info you share . Interesting how new equipment is designed. I like the old school one.
Thank you for the video , i hope this may helps you i use the NSN 8465-01-314-4286 / canteen cover arctc insulated ALICE you can find them for like $12.00 or $15.00 , now they will work with the 34 1/2 ounces wide mouth canteens cup & stove and more room in the pouches & my British army pattern 1958 canteen & BCB Cruader cup. to just trying to keep you ALICE ha ha .
I think you should join forces with guy from Ranger Survival 50/50 and put on your own class. You guys were cut from the same cloth. I think it would be top notch.
I'm with you, LBE all the way. I wasn't always this sweet little old grandma.
Ran both of those systems during my time in the Army between 93-97. Started with the LBE, then around 95 I was issued the LBV. Like you said, it's a love hate relationship. Pretty much ran the same set up as yours. I can say I hated the pistol belts, chaffing was a bitch during rucks no matter where you positioned the belt.
First! Great video man. I love seeing the older gear in play.
I was in before you so I kept all my deuce gear. I have the H harness on mine and the belt has the metal buckle. If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it so I’ve used it for years. Good information
LBEs work for big guys but as a manlet I feel like one of those clowns with hula hoop pants.
The LBE sure brings back memories!! 😊
Thank you for another great video!!
I love this-thank you so much for posting-I use so much surplus and have brought my children up on these types of load outs and gear. Proud moment they have continued doing this into their own adult years.
While I never served in the military, I spent a career in Emergency Services. While I was in Search & Rescue I used the LBE. I later transitioned to a Rescue vest for the ambulance, I still preferred the LBE for any ground work.
I like it because it is very versatile. I could change the position of equipment, or add non-military items.
Got to say that I never liked the Mollie gear.
You call it old school but we’re still using the LBE throughout the National Guard. Haven’t seen anyone using the LBV though.
Train like you fight, because you will fight like you train.
Muscle memory is huge in stressful situations.
If your rig is always the same, there will be less fumbling and confusion.
Figure out what works for you and stick with it.
The problem with these is finding a good pack that will be compatible and not sag on the rear part of the belt or a buttpack. A chest rig with a zip down the middle or one you can unhook fast and lift up to go into prone is much more compatible with a pack. Though I like the idea of the LBE is you are not using a sustainment pack.
Always liked the LBE. That's what I use. Reminds me of what my Pop used in Vietnam n I still have!
I have an LBV 88 Enhanced with associated ALICE gear, I can hold 12 magazines, but looking at how you set up your stuff makes me think I should reorganize.
Building out my own LBE currently. Great video, Corporal!
Very cool video....thanks for explaining....I like the old school as well!!
Old school , Vietnam used and approved by Sgt. Six
Lbe personally. run a padded belt under the carrier with ifak, self sustainment, and a couple mags.
I have an issue with my neck an shoulders. Ironically I have titanium plate an screws in my neck. I am guessing the H harness would be better then the Y because of this? Would you agree? Or are they relatively the same?
An it isn’t if the SHTF, it’s when?
When I came in the military in the mid 70's they were transitioning to the nylon LBE. It was all green and had the Y harness. I liked the bit older gear and chose the cotton web belt the old H harness and buttpack which was made for it. This is what the old salts from vietnam wore and to me, it just felt better. The only downside was it needed more care in asian locations due to rot when being wet . When I was stationed in europe in the early 80's I found a older X harness that was from WW2. Although it didn't have the padding the H harness had, it did distribute the weight of the gear better. It wasn't until the mid to late 80's, when I changed to the LBE nylon Y harness. Our unit was transitioning to the LBV when I left the military early 90's, to pursue a career change into law enforcement. Good video with a bit of individual history wrapped into it.
I split the difference. Replaced the chest rig portion with lbe front straps to get a lbe rig with very nice shoulder padding.
LBE all the way
Thanks sharing your expertise. You always give great lessons.
I like the LBE....awesome AF
I can see why you like the one system. Especially if you're carrying a sidearm. Thanks for sharing the difference between the systems Corporal Kelly. Have a great day.
I had both and prefer the LBE.
Wholeheartedly agree, definitely use the LBE for day trips, I use the old first aid kit in lieu of mag pouches though. They were great for keeping Copenhagen cans dry during a PEX and still are.
Only had the LBV for the first 9 months I was in, but some of us brought them to Squad Leaders Course, they came in handy for some training evolutions, where we didn't have to wear flak jackets and SAPIs.
Hey Corporal. You content is awesome. Everything is tough and watching your stuff is a great little escape and for me to get away from it all and be out there in the field with you for a bit.
As I have said before some people are just never happy no matter what ya do , love my butt pack
Shawn , We called in it Duce gear (782). We had a entrenching tool . And Bayonet.
so did we, but most didnt so I used the legit name
I recall seeing pictures of the load bearing vests, being tested back in 1987 at Ft. Ord, California, 7th Infantry Division (Light).
When I was stationed at Ft. Ord, California in 1991 to 1993, my unit had the regular LBE and old Alice Packs. I carried and preferred the old Vietnam LBE H straps for comfort when in the field.
Our unit, got the LBV about the time I got out. Of course you were told by the 'chain of command' to figure it out.. when setting it up. But it was pretty easy. Just not real comfortable in my opinion. By that time we had been told they were closing the post, and the 7th Infantry Division was being deactivated. Funny, they could give us a new web gear, but we couldn't get parts for our M119 Howitzers and Humvees..SMH..🤔🤨😕
Breathing is an essential element of human performance/efficiency. You lose roughly 25% of your breathing capacity with a belt above or at your navel. It should be a few inches below your navel for effective breathing. Secondly, water, normally the heaviest item stored should be at your spine as the spine is the center of your hip and torso rotation. When storing a heavy item away from the spine you spend energy thrusting and returning the side to side shifting load as your hips and torso move side to side during forward motion. By adding tubing from the bottom of a water bottle thru the cap to the front of the pack and a bite valve, you have on the go hydration. If the bottle is metal, you need to add a one way valve for air to enter to replace the liquid space. The LBB pack has the sternum strap laying across the pectoral muscles, an uncomfortable positon, best placed just below the pectoral muscles. You don't want to place a knife vertically on your belt as it interferes with your walking, slapping up against your thigh and interfering with concentration. Removing a knife from a sheath is sometimes difficult vs adding webbing for mounting the sheath horizontally on your belt for swift removal although you loose a lot of belt space for other gear. The typical backpack sold throughout the world has five to eight bio-mechanical inefficiencies that reduces speed, endurance, comfort, safety and increases fatigue. I've described just two of the inefficiencies applied to the storage system shown, basically good performing storage devices.
the video showed how to wear both kits
Great video and very informative.
I learned a lot, as always.
Please keep your videos coming.
I never miss an episode.
Thank you, Shawn
LBE for the win. Army 74-94.
Was issued an LBV in US Army, 2000-03. I didn't like it @ all. Felt generic. I'd take an LBE anyday
Speaking the truth brother.
I always do, and some cant handle the truth.......
LBE all day every day. Ours was a different configuration.
2 F88 rifle mag pouches on the left, F89 minimi to the right, water bottle/cups canteen each side and bum bag rear.
Aussie setup.
The best part of the LBV was cannabalizing the shoulder harness portion and using it in place of the issued Y harness. Super easy mod and hella comfortable in the field.
@@TexasNationalist1836 concur, the older M1956 suspenders were better in this respect as they were 4-point harness. Chopping up the LBV shoulder harness recreated that suspension though. All you had to do was unlace the panels, snip the front adjustment straps on the front and replace them with the front straps off a Y harness. If you grabbed a couple Y harnesses from the surplus store then you could get really fancy and use the rear, y-shaped straps on the front of your modified LBV harness. This helps spread the load around your waist and give better support. Of course you stripped those buckles and replaced them with 550 like everyone learned after the first ruck and them digging into your body.
@@TexasNationalist1836Get a Condor H harness. I rig the belt with Paracord loops for the suspenders. My butt pack is a SpecOps S.O.B. The big D rings are perfect for the Condor straps. Pack dropped? Use the loops.
I love your old school videos. Still have mine from way back in the day, nineteen eighty-mumble-mumble.
I had the same gear in military😂😂😂😂
I wished they made six AK mag pouches to fit retro gear I had to modify canvas five mag pouch on each side, I also wished they made metal two quart canteens, I like having more water and a way to retain my mags, and I also enjoy my pistol on these belt systems, "not the crotch rot rigs". Finallh I like the harness style systems y and h for A.l.i.c.e. gear
I'm a little late, sorry
don't worry most missed
I run the H harness mostly. I have the Y but found it bit into my neck
while wearing it that high how do you wear a pack though?
It depends on your pack. A smaller one rides above/just on top of the butt pack. A larger ruck can lay over the butt pack if it's not too bulged out or you can drop the butt pack and add its contents to a big rucksack. I assume the big ruck on a march is what you are thinking of. Just tuck the butt pack into your gear and use it when you drop ruck.
@@45calibermedic ive tried that with an Alice pack and it just doesnt work
@devreed5931 understood, sounds like you know what you need! Just passing on what I've heard. My small pack rides just on top of the butt pack on my german kit.
I was notified by youtube. I'm also subscribed so they are doing their part imo with all Your videos because I get all your notifications 🙂
I've worn an ALICE belt and suspenders with a machete scabbard and a butt pack/hydration carrier regularly since I was 12. I used the setup when I was surveying, I use it for work on the property, I use it for beatin the bushes for fun, I use it for a grab and go business kit with rifle mags and sustenance... I'll grab one of them for about anything... I have carriers I have vests, Ive got molle out my ass, but I always go back to my old ALICE gear (and new ALICE gear too.. sure), it just works... If you're running an "angry" scenario, the LBV is better for feeding a rifle longer, but for just generally working around the homestead or recreating a suspender and belt setup is hard to beat.
I'd love to see reviews of the current gear that is used nowadays.
Hands down I'll always love a.l.i.c.e. gear, more then the new highspeed stuff
Cpl. KELLY, OUTSTANDING AF Video, I still have my L.E.B. Gear '79-'86 ,W.E.B. Gear was a name change I think in 1980 ,also have the most of my TA-50 . I Greatly Appreciate All Your Videos. Also Sharing Your Time and Knowledge and Wisdom and Experience and Passing on the Craft and Your Time In Service and Keeping Us Safe..Tim L. U.S. Army Vet.
I don't wear one but I really enjoyed your explanation and getting familiar with that equipment great explanation
Best feature of the LBV is you can fit a can of Coke in the outside ammo pouches.
So if your only reliable cover is the terrain or you have to do a lot of sneaky-sneak, then the LBE, a no-brainer.
If it's patrol duty, or urban combat where you want your grenades and magazines to be easy to reach, and while also in an environment with lots of corners and objects that you can hide behind - LBV is better.
So it seems the LBV is a not a step forward, but rather a step in another direction.
But the most amazing thing is that none of these use Velcro. )
We were issued the exact same gear (non-mesh version) in the Air Force and no one explained it to us like you did. Figures. Of course we were non-combatants- as in medical- and carried different gear on the loadout. Although we flew out of Scott AFB, we exercised in the mosquito infested swamps of Louisiana and I know exactly what you're talking about when it comes to heat, chafing, and embracing the suck.