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𝗙𝗜𝗡𝗔𝗟𝗟𝗬 Dragon Ball Super Explains This NEW POWER SYSTEM...
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- Опубликовано: 5 июл 2024
- With that in mind, what is your top ten ranking of the characters? Do you think characters like Jiren still belong among the top fighters? Does current Jiren scale above the gods in the manga? Many of us believe he was holding back during the Tournament of Power, as outlined in my Beerus video, which I recommend you watch. In the anime, both he and Goku surpassed Beerus, so does the manga Jiren follow the same lore? I'd love to hear your thoughts on these questions.
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If liked this video you will love this one ruclips.net/video/4T4VBkeR37c/видео.htmlsi=Q4suuSpEZTdxOYur cheers 🎉
hard to like this video with the 666 do i become that person who ruins that guess i will lol
What if Vegeta didn't use it because of the destruction powers that come along with it. If he was to Haki someone by accident it could be bad.
Alright so here’s the explanation of a fan since Dragon ball and used to buy Shonen Jump Magazines.
Goku is a martial artist who focused primarily on inner tactics & ki control. Goku was known for copying any technique he experienced. Goku by far is the weakest saiyan. Yet his inner tactics gives him an arsenal of moves to draw upon. Example Goku achieves SSJ3 by storing a Genki Dama within himself. This always gave Goku reserves which gave him his confidence cause he got stamina. Goku then uses Kaioken to boost his physical abilities beyond his limits. Yet cause Goku is always copying he is reactive. Hence why Ultra Instinct was dramatic difference in his character. Whis stated Ultra Instinct is about honing your inner tactics so you predict your opponent and utilize the ideal move with minimum effort. During the Jiren fight Goku burned through all his reserves so he could move more naturally. Essentially making him weaker, but improving his quality of movement.
Vegeta is an elite who boast a higher battle power than Goku. Vegeta never needed techniques to defeat his opponents. As such he was to simplistic in his method of attacks. As such no matter how powerful you attack is. Means nothing if it doesn’t land. Vegeta learned ki control to make full use of his power. Yet recently he is learning to refine his ki to greater quality. This is akin to combining ki blast with melee attacks in tandem. The greatest example of this is Jujustu Kaisen BLACK FLASH or One Piece Haki ryu. By timing your hit and sending energy into your opponent you can destroy them from within. Now Vegeta Ultra Ego is all about refining his ki into his own type. To do this he has to release all his power at once yet at the same time compress it. This contradiction creates unbearable pressure on his body. Yet it creates a self sustaining cycle. Allowing Vegeta to fight longer.
Gohan is a prodigy cause he was taught by Goku ki control: reserves & his mother’s intuition. Chi chi always stops and thinks. Though she seems fiery she keeps her ki composed like a serene lake. This is why Goku fancied her cause this tranquil state didn’t match her fiery personality. This allows Gohan to not only subconsciously build reserves. But also keep it hidden from others. His issue is that he always needs a catalyst.
Hence why he undergone Mystic ki. Mystic ki is described as purest type of energy. As such it cleanses & rejuvenates the body. This allows Gohan to maintain his peak at all times. Yet his saiyan physiology is always progressing. His Beast form is when Gohan catalyst was both instinct & intuitive. Gohan Ozaru is his primal state, that causes him to be brutal & thanks to chi chi he also calculating. Fusing SSJ2 with Mystic ki allows Gohan to break his limits.
Neo-Broly is more akin to Nappa in that they unconsciously put their ki solely into their physiques. You see the Ozaru transformation is a 10 time multiplier of all stats. Yet due to speed of the shift one can lose themselves in pain & power. Yet by slowly transitioning they can dominate the enemy with brutality.
As for Piccolo see Namekiana sustained themselves on accumulation of energy from their surroundings. Like plants they commit a process like photosynthesis. Essentially Namekians are the polar opposites to Saiyan. His Orange form allows him to finally generate his own power. This creates bio-feedback that gives him no end to how much ki he can make. The issue is he has to burn it as fast as he creates it.
Imagine wishing to be the strongest in your universe just to have eight or nine people pass you.
Not just that but you also gave up almost all of your life for that wish
Stuff like that is why people think that Beerus letting Frieza kill the Saiyans was some kind of big brain play and not his usual catlike pettiness. Saiyans are absolute anomalies on a multiversal scale if they put in the effort of honing their combat that they're genetically predisposed toward doing as a warrior race. Frieza and King Cold are literally described as genetic freaks amongst their own race, and Nameless Namekian Piccolo has been in a similar boat for ages. On that note, with the years of speculation on how the power scales of Piccolo fusing with King Piccolo would work, until proven otherwise I headcanon that Shenron's "extra" was just that, patch up that last bit of extra potential that would otherwise require dragging out a Dragon Ball villain to get completely bodied.
Tuff
Goku got knocked out of ui then proceeds to knock Gohan back with one palm while focusing on Broly mid fight
Which did nothing to Gohan and he's in UI even when he's not looking his body moves by itself, so this just means you don't know much about UI. Gohan knocked Goku out of UI with a single kick while Goku couldn't do the same to Gohan.
The kiai thing is just not a good argument considering both Frieza and EoZ Uub used it on Goku who was stronger than them. At this point whether it makes sense or not we just have to accept Gohan and Goku are relative to one another.
@@cheeseburgerfreddy6350
Knocking Goku out of ui did nothing aswell. UI is a state of mind. Gohan could only do that because Goku made him power up and get stronger meanwhile we didnt even see tui.
@@enma8441 You still think TUI is his stronger form? No need for any further discussion.
Literally Goku held back against,I'm just saying
I’d have to assume that Frieza is leagues ahead of Gohan and co. right now. I imagined his statement “I couldn’t keep losing to Saiyans my whole life” as an indication that Black Frieza wasn’t just meant to surpass Ultra Instinct, but effectively put an end to the arms race between him and the Saiyans and any power ups he could forsee them attaining. That’s just my interpretation, but it seems to be his way of future-proofing the power scale in his eyes.
Yeah Black Frieza is definitely stronger than the Saiyans cause Frieza actually managed to knocked out TUI Goku & UE Vegeta without effort.
Beast Gohan didn't knocked out Goku.
Plus they ain't going to make Black Frieza so strong just to get 1 shooter by Beast Gohan that would be stupid and pointless.
Plus Freeza knows about fusion so obviously he would prepare for that too
Vegeta holding his own with just blue evolution suggests that he has gotten very powerful and could beat gohan beast if we went full power ultra ego, considering the major leap in power he would get.
Since this is a sparring match, he wouldn't use it
we dont know how the fight went so u cant say he held his own in blue evolved, he didnt even get to 1v1 gohan it was a free for fall cause goku, broly and goten and trunks jumped in
@@Meta.Muncher that's why I said it's a possibility, not concrete
I wouldn't take that part too seriously at all honestly considering you see ssj goten and trunks also "holding their own" against ssj broly... yeah right
@@ortanicallityDifference is…that is Trunks, and Goten current limit. They couldn’t go further even if they wanted to. Vegeta could, and just seen Gohan go toe2toe with UI Goku, and still chose to hold back on using Ego. I do think he did indeed used it, but that little snippet proved he must’ve gotten way stronger.
You are right sir if you look at the goku fight you know vegeta could of done Gohan in if he were to go all out
I can see why Vegeta didn't use UE, since it's practically him going psycho, it would've been dangerous to the others and Beerus's planet
Dawg half the planet could of beaten him so he wouldn’t pose any threat, infact beerus, whis, or gohan could of one shoted him so it really wouldn’t be an issue, him not going ego is simply toyo being stupid
@@runin12if Gohan was pushed by SSBE Vegeta, how Gohan has any chance against UE Vegeta
Vegeta's current focus is to fight like Jiren in utilizing his ki/chi to its full potential and not be dependent of max transformations.
The end goals for both Goku and Vegeta is not to utilize any form's power but to stack that power onto their base forms.
In example their base forms will eventually be at the level of either Gogeta or Vegito once they master UE and UI.
When you see Gogeta or Vegito their base form is enough to end the fight but they transform and go overkill on power gap.
@@user-ct7ix8nz1w pushed doesn't mean Vegeta is stronger
@@runin12 aw hell naw, you did not just said, apart from beerus and whis, you did not said Vegeta in UE gets One shot by everyone, man you are high as fuck!
ppl are acting like mui is a regular power up transformation like ssj. it’s a constant state of mind transformation. gohan surprised goku with his speed and that broke his concentration, thus taking him out of mui. it had nothing to do with overpowering him because he instantly recovered with no real show of harm and went right back into mui.
Well gohans point wasn’t to hurt goku it was to penetrate his mui counter with sheer speed. Which is in itself still insane with what mui is capable of now
this, you'd be surprised how some people would even say that gohan could've followed up an attack when goku was "knocked out" of UI when gohan was puffing and breathing heavily, who's to say he didnt power down on his own when he got up?
@@itpugilif he was huffing and puffing goku obviously did not go out of ui and get knocked out of it
@@dontslapthenoah9184 I do understand why they said he got knocked out of it, but it wasn't that significant. Landing a shot, although not damaging, was significant on gohan's part and should be commended. But I see the reasoning on both sides. It was obviously left to the reader's imagination.
Sure, but Goku's skill with MUI is exactly why it's a massive feat for Gohan. That happening in a real battle would be potentially disastrous for Goku.
I really appreciate you taking the time to lay all this out... one differing opinion I have however: As far as Vegeta and Ultra Ego... this is his "serious" form. He's not going to use this and pull out all the stops on his friends in a spar, as his mind has to be utterly bent and focused on destruction. Since it's a friendly spar, with his allies and friends, its hard for me to see Vegeta pulling out his "damage me while I try to kill you" technique. This shows signifigant character growth for Vegeta, even though he's astonished at the levels of power being shown, he's content testing it for himself in Blue evolution, rather than raging out and trying to establish and prove his dominance at all costs. It's safe to assume that he knows the difference in power between evolution and ego, so he's probably got a pretty good bead on where he sits on the ladder.
Completely understandable
@@MajinBird you could be right though, we haven't seen Ultra Ego since the Gas fight! Vegeta is my fave honestly and if he can tap into ego in any other state than dire world saving circumstances I know he'd be practicing with it... Sheesh I don't think Goku would even stop pestering him about sparing UE until he was mad enough to do it 😅
It does raise questions though since we've only seen him debut the form one time- it seems to be a focus and a mind thing so maybe he doesn't need to use it unless the circumstances call for it but he can master the mentality and focus in base... I don't know feel like he and Goku would be throwing hands UI vs UE to train if it were at all possible... Unless Vegeta is WAYYY stronger than he used to be I don't think blue Evo would be a challenge for UI Goku
Vegeta holding his own with just his blue evo form, is very impressive. Considering how great the gap in power is between this and ultra ego, he might be stronger than asspull gohan
@@alatus_knight No doubt... I'm not gonna pretend to know what Toryama's plan's for the Frieza Black arc are but few things would get me more STOKED than Vegeta blasting through his limits in UE as all hope seems lost and dismantling an astonished and terrified Frieza with his bare hands... Really though they've brought back Frieza like 4 times now and Vegeta has never really gotten the piece of him that he deserves... yeah he killed Golden Frieza but it was more of a post battle execution than a long overdue beat down... Icing frost was alright but tbh that's like a consolation trophy, after all Frieza put him through the dude deserves his hero of the day moment by crapping on a maniacally laughing Frieza victory lap with a sense of finality similar to the android 19 fight 😅 Now that I think about it no other conclusion would really hit the same for me.
@@sethnaffziger1402 true
You do realize that Broly has another superior transformation that he didn't managed to control yet?
What, Ikari?
@@Sarge327 his Full Power SSJ mode
@@Scott-kv7we A: That’s not in the manga
B: That isn’t a different form, that’s just his Berserk Super Saiyan form at full power, hence the name.
@@Sarge327 the green hair
@@SinisterElite3Gaming Yeah, I’ve been told and responded already
honestly I'm not the biggest fan of Gohan surpassing Goku and Vegeta like that
they were training their ass off with two of the most powerful, experienced and skilled fighters in the universe (I'm including Wis here)
and Gohan just trained, off screen, on his own, probably without even a gravity room or something and pulled out a new form that puts him higher then everyone else
like my man, how many times are you going to tap into your untapped potential? How many untapped potentials resulting in a new form do you have?
This is just bad writing tbh.
Gohan had his potential unleashed twice and instead of making his power increase in his mystic form. They gave him a new form and one that rivals goku and vegeta.
It’s happened 3 times it’s tapped then untapped therefor he had to tap into it again. It was explained after mystic and during return of F or T. O. P that’s his character he’s human so he doesn’t care to fight or train but his saiyan blood boils n spills over when he wants to win. Life or death situations builds character
@princevaun3180 gotten is human and saiyan too. Smae with future and present trunks.
They don't have the plot armor Gohan has.
No one cares
Sorry but almost 90%dbs character got there power like that frieza and broly are top at that
Im tired of this misinformation Goku DID NOT surpass Beerus in the anime. Beerus was shocked to see Goku use a technique he had a hard time grasping. Jiren is stronger then HIS universe's destroyer not EVERY destroyer. Beerus does in fact scale above Belmond even in the anime. Beerus has only been implied to have lost an "arm wrestle" against another god and it wasnt even Belmond not to mention it was said to be centuries ago. And when Goku used MUI for the first time he was able to speed blitz regular Jiren and make the void quake something beerus can replicate without much effort like in battle of gods. MUI Goku then is only on par with powered up Jiren.
@@RaylinKHD not all DB fans pay attention to the dialogue. Most are selective hearing too because they all want Goku to surpass everyone. Jiren never surpassed his destroyer it was stated that he was just as strong as his destroyer. Whis even says it was rumored about a mortal being strong as a god of destruction. That includes Toppo as well because he’s a god of destruction candidate. In the exhibition match between Toppo and Goku. Grand Priest said that only one of them was walking out alive which implies to Toppo being stronger than Goku at that time. Later we saw Toppo transform into UE meaning that he was already capable of transforming into UE when he fought Goku. The god of destruction that beat Beerus was Quintella as he’s second to Beerus in strength. The only god that was still standing against Beerus in the exhibition match of the gods.
What?
Full Power Jiren is verbatim in a level of power on par to Belmod.
Belmod and Beerus are only relative in the anime. Nothing else has been stated to say otherwise. Even if Beerus is above Belmod, so is Jiren.
Check promo material for the ToP. FP Jiren vs 3rd Omen Goku was literally being shown as a battle between 2 characters who are above GoD level. Toppo became a LITERAL GoD and Vegeta in Blue Evo was clashing with him.
It would be redundant to present a GoD and have Jiren vs Goku be....weaker than that?
Then MUI literally made all the GoDs sit in awe. FP Jiren was barely fighting back and he broke his limits in a power NEVER before seen.
And that's BEFORE Goku used his rage amp to overpower said Jiren.
To state that Beerus has not been surpassed in the anime, is a fool's errand. Yes in the manga. Not in the anime.
Subsequently, both movies take place after the ToP and we have the following info.
Goku cannot use UI anymore. Vegeta is capped in Evo. Blue Goku and Vegeta are their "peaks" in the Broly movie, based on which the Gammas were built and Broly at his FPSS as we saw him, could defeat incomplete Cell Max.
A clear indicator is how JIREN has been referenced in BOTH movies as a wall that is still being studied. And he always stands with GoDs.
Broly is relative to Beerus and so is Cell Max and to an extend Piccolo.
Beast Gohan can low-diff Cell Max, the same way Blue Gogeta could Broly. It all checks out.
Blue Vegeta and Goku could NOT defeat Cell Max, same way they could NOT defeat Broly. But that takes into account that they cannot use MUI/Ego respectively and their KK/Evo would only serve as a momentary amp, which both Broly and Cell Max could surpass (in the anime).
@@marshal8358You do Know that not all GoD are in the same tier right? Also the Super Hero Movie retconned Jiren’s Strength and even then it was stated Goku didn’t surpass Beerus in the anime after the Broly Movie came out.
@SonZackSSJ9k GoD level is from Sidra (someone Golden Frieza could repell) till Beerus.
Toppo needs time to charge Hakai unlike someone like Sidra, but he is still showcasing GoD tier of power even if he isn't above all the GoDs. Beerus, Quitella and Belmod are depicted relative with their rivalries.
All the GoDs stand in awe of MUI and Full Power Jiren is a level of power that Belmod hasn't seen ever, Belmod being the guy who has matched Beerus in at least 1 instance.
Broly being thought to be potentially stronger than Beerus is also very valid considering his full power would stomp a KK Goku and Evo Vegeta, with the former having no UI and the latter no other special power. It's worth noting how in games like Xenoverse, Jiren matches Broly in Full Power and needs Super Full Power to defeat him in place of Gogeta Blue.
Blue Fusion being depicted as an equal trumpcard to MUI.
All of whom are above anime Beerus.
And Superhero didn't retcon anything about Jiren, they made it clear he had great ki control and that they managed to somewhat catch up on his power. The statement itself about his ki not being big is idiotic cause his ki surpasses GoDs as shown repeatedly throughout the arc.
The sheer fact he's still being discussed alludes to him being a great obstacle.
@@marshal8358 You do realize even if Goku is stronger than Beerus in the Anime, once it returns Beerus will be stronger than Goku again anyway right? And no, that’s not how GoD tier works, and Frieza was literally sweating and panting after “repelling” a Hakai and that was just a fraction of Sidra’s Ki.
Black Frieza was stated to be near GoD Level tier and at that point he was stronger than Belmond who is a GoD so by that logic, Your saying Belmond isn’t in his own tier in the Manga while he clearly is.
Yup vegeta not pulling out UE in that "sparring" match seems plausible, it's not like he's fighting bad guys. Why would he wanna spar with his close ones with a form that literally runs on the concept of utter destruction. Also, it'll be quite dangerous for a few it he did have used any destruction move in the sparring match.
@@saiyajin6969 why would Gohan use a form that runs on the concept of Anger during a Sparring match? Oh wait he did that against Goku, why wouldn’t Vegeta be able to do the same with Ultra Ego? Especially since Beerus could use Hakai without even trying to destroy and Granolah used it without even knowing it, Vegeta should be able to use UE against Gohan just fine.
Don’t take v jump serious, the writing is on the walls If you read the chapter you’ll see that Goku stopped the fight without going all out, he didn’t even use TUI! (Which is similar to what Gohan used to land a hit on UI Goku, emotions) Vegeta is the only one that knows he’s gained TUI- not even Beerus and Whis know because they weren’t at the Grahnola fight. This is signified by the fact that beerus kept saying Goku is at his top form, he at his top form, blah blah…no he wasn’t and everyone knows this except them
I think the reason Vegeta doesn’t use Ultra Ego anymore is because it makes him revert back to his old self. His more destructive and psychotic like he was in the Sayian Saga and Buu Saga when he became Majin. Ultra Ego seems like a form Vegeta will only use against an Enemy and it has to be on a planet that isn’t inhabitable. But that fact that his boost up his power in Super Sayian Blue Evolution so much to a point that he was able to seeming keep up with Beast Gohan is pretty impressive.
Lmfao I laughed so hard when you posted the 100% picture vs going for the win. Basically sitting up closer to the TV in his video game chair.
I love your scaling, your highly underrated
Jiren is still training
He will maintain his domination
I am hyped if we see something like "The return of Jiren the grey"
I'm not so convinced, Whis even confirmed that Jiren wasn't that much more powerful than Goku or Vegeta, but he wastes so much less power than Goku or Vegeta did, which is why he seemed so much more powerful during the tournament. It's not a matter of strength, but skill. I would love to see Jiren make an appearance in a later arc
He did not get knocked out of his ffs he powered down because he saw what he needed to see.... It took Gohan everything he's got just to land a single punch and that punch didn't even leave a mark.... Goku's fight against granolah and gas was 100x more intense... It's like no one has any common sense Gohan still isn't on par with Goku or vegeta period
0:03 where are these little animations from of Black firing the ki blasts and his kamehameha flashing the screen? That seems like a commercial rather than being from the anime
It's from the Opening
@@lone7892 when the anime aired like 8 years ago, we skipped the intro, i must've missed it then. Thank you.
I love this almost scientific analysis, glad gohan is established as the most powerful but that THAT FACT doesn’t mean he’s the strongest or most capable of winning.
Végéta’s current role is to serve as our narrator. But my current head cannon is that Goku and Vegeta are on par with one another in terms of power and potential. Goku will always unlock forms first but Vegeta will soon follow
If I know Jiren, he trained the day the tournament ended and won’t stop until the next tournament
Good night these comments. Beast>blue evolution. Beast~Mui/ue/ssj broly. Nobody held back but vegeta, that’s the point of this whole thing to clearly show where everybody’s at. I don’t care what your opinion is, this is all there is. If u think blue vegeta=beast then by that same logic ssj trunks and goten=ssj broly. Goku pushed gohan back. Like frieza did to him on namek at 70% power. I know y’all are gonna say I can’t read because ur children, but it doesn’t change the way things are, which will become apparent when more dbs content is eventually released. Calling bs fact doesn’t make it fact.
In the time that’s passed, Jiren would have probably improved greatly, especially after losing in the ToP and having a chip on his shoulder
No shot jiren hasn’t been training this whole time for a rematch with goku. Hopefully we get to see another fight in the future
Japanese reader here to say there are some minor discrepancies within the translative differences of your English translation and the Japanese original. Goku is not really going all out and so far, neither is Vegeta. Brolly can't because he can't control it.
Thank you! Jesus, someone who actually knows context clues!
We need see difference between *who is better* and *who is stronger* . Raw power is not the same as raw power + skill, experience, good ki control, god like dodges from angel technique etc. Goku in raw power is not strong compare to Broly, Gohan, Vegeta UE, O Piccolo or Cell Max but it doesn't mean he is worse. Goku is still top tier of universe 7. Also I want add that it stated Jiren not was much stronger than Blue level, he was just very good at ki controling so it was looks like he is much stronger. Gohan still need some experience, get some skills, maybe learn god ki so don't underistmate him guys. He is now main or one of the main characters.
I don't know why Vegeta is surprised when Gohan landed a few hits on MUI Goku when the previous opponent/enemies did more to MUI Goku than Beast Gohan.
Jiren was the first one to land hits on UI & MUI Goku then Moro a bit and definitely Granolah & Gas managed to give a good beating to MUI Goku.
In all those fights Vegeta was there and saw it so again why act surprised when someone managed to hit MUI Goku 😅.
We know Goku UI is still in rookie stage so we'll see more of UI and hopefully someday actually perfected to Whis level.
But that's for the next generation fans to see cause most of us will be old and dead by that time if actually happens 😂.
I think the major take away was explaining beast. Gohan beast how i understand it is a cheat. So basically he did what gas did until its almost close to breaking apart and then he lets it snap back like a rubber band. The elder kai ability allows the rubber band to keep going without getting worn out like what happened to gas.
Yes.... its true Gohan is stronger in his beast form....
But ..
1.Goku : its not about winning the gohan... just assessing power level😈😈
2.Vegeta : holding back his psychotic destruction form👹
3.Broly : fought in controlled ssj form as he cant control his full powered form.... which required Fusion GOAT to stop....
Years of training just cant be surpassed by emotional buffs and background training😂😂😂
I think Gohan has so business being that strong apart from Frieza I feel Goku should be the strongest
In my opinion Goten and Trunks should been Super Saiyan 2's
I love Gohan he's my second favorite saiyan behind broly yet goku even said he wasn't trying to win he was just glad how strong gohan has gotten goku was definitely holding back 😂 Gohan was literally getting visibly frustrated in their sparring session because he couldn't bearly land a hit
If gohan was able to unlock a transformation of his own, can humans potentially reach a level like that as well
Nice explanation bro, keep it going
My power scaling
Beerus
Black Frieza
Vegeta
Goku
Gohan
Broly
Piccolo
17
18
Trunks
Goten
Roshi
Krillin
Tien
Yamcha
You know Jiren was getting busy while all of this went on i would not be surprised if he got a transformation
Can we all agree that frezia had ten years to perfect his new found power (black) then one shot a Mui goku( who clearly just learned that he has levels to ultra instinct) and ultra ego vageta ( power up come within the arch frezia so happening to be training already)
I wished y’all remembered in the manga beast gohan didn’t one shot cell max he still needed help😑
💯 💯💯💯💯
Neither did the anime.
Too imobilize cell max ?? Yea , to kill him??? Huge NO.
@@ramonkranus3916 yes they did don’t be delusional go look at the panel
@@ramonkranus3916 and that still counts as help
This was a great and thorough analysis. I'm subscribing to support the channel in hopes that it grows. Keep up the good work!
9:21 It could be that he can't use the form on them since they're his allies, so he knows he doesn't want to destroy them. I think the Ego can come out when it's someone Vegeta doesn't mind killing, lol. That's why he couldn't get it off quite right with Granolh, because he felt bad and empathized even with him. Vegeta has to be in a state of thinking only destruction.
I believe that's what it was 🤔 lol
In terms of sheer power its gohan, vegeta would technically become stronger later in a fight but he has to avoid passing out, goku is the happy medium
9:10 i believe that much like UI or the god forms, the essence or powers of UE is more than likely part of him now, which if that is the case would make some kind of sense
If piccolo would take on a master for training I think he would grow I power faster but he is so stubborn that he won't learn from someone else.
@3:53 “ power comes in response to a need”
Haven’t watched the video yet, but Vegeta definitely can still use Ultra Ego. He went in, and out of the form multiple times during the Granolah Arc. He chose to hold that form back for some reason even after seeing Gohan fight UI Goku.
Because Gohan wasn’t worthy of it.
This guy doing my man Monaka dirty
9:08 true UI isn’t superior to MUI it’s just an easier form for goku to fight in because it takes less focus, beerus litch says mui is gokus strongest form
I am wondering whether or not Broly will use his green form again.
I don’t agree due to the fact that Goku was holding back, Gohan still can’t damage Goku enough even while pushing his power, and goku wasn’t very offensive against Gohan
there is no green hair broly or legendary ssj broly in the manga
God damn y'all, it was a Training session 😭
what's got me thinking is when do we get the ancient nemekian arc and learn the real and full history of the dragon balls and the destruction of the races original planet i figure they lost a lot of knowledge after the destruction of their home world
They didnt. They just put a minimal amount of thought into something to try and fix the train wreck that is modern DB. Even more so when they realized they have to remove all of this, because they forgot to do the Uub section first and now have a human fighting with gods.
"Oh no! We fucked up! How do we fix this!?"
"By never, ever addressing it and jingling louder and shiner keys infront of the babes. Theyll never care about lack of forethought or decent story telling that way."
We’ve seen nothing from beerus imagine him having to actually use UI omen
I've always wondered if fusion could be counted in at some point, but I rarely see this. I could see Mastered UI & UE, as it was already in DB Heroes. Briefly.
1. Beerus
2. Frieza
3/4: Goku/Vegeta
5. Gohan
6. broly
7. Gotenks
8. Piccolo
9. Granola
10.gamas
@@tylenolthepainkillers101 gohan above Goku 😇
@@MajinBird I won't argue that because it honestly might be true. But personally i think if it was a real fight I'd give it to Goku just cause of his experience and hax.
I see what you did there. You specially asked if we think characters like Jiren are still amongst the top fighters, but this video was about your top 10 from Universe 7. He’s from Universe 6. You’re trying to get comment engagement.
I still believe Goku and Vegeta to be equals, Gohan is a bit weird to place him since they didn't go all out, but I believe both Vegeta and Goku should be above Gohan, even Gohan competes and potentially outstats, His seniors definitely have the hax and experience advantage over him. Black frieza is above all the saiyans and beerus is above him.
If jirens still out there training which I’m pretty sure he is he’s still scratching top 5 top 3 if the authors continue to make he relevant in the story.
we will see Brohan vs gogeta oneday
Jiren would still be top among the fighters, dont forget, UI Goku never really defeated Jiren, and Jiren manage to stand against the rest of the fighter till the end. On top of that, I doubt that Jiren wont do his training during all these events. Which potentially leads to Jiren still top fighter. But if he isnt, I would definitely be frustrated.
People use picolo words saying he is stronger than Goku and Vegeta from the super hero but until he got his orange transformation dude couldn't even sense god ki so that's a terrible fucking indication
This was in no way a "final all out battle" lol
Saying Vegeta can’t use UE against Gohan because UE requires a Destroying Mindset is next level coping if I know it. By that logic Gohan can’t use Beast against Goku because Beast is literally the same thing for UE except instead of Thinking of Destroying, Gohan needs to be full of Anger.
Anger and Destruction are totally different things you know that right? 😊
@@redred1952 Doesn’t debunk my point, especially since Beerus can use Hakai without trying to destroy.
Ah so you think Beast and UE(god technique) are the same and this is your argument lmao. There is no next level than being copy goku and vegeta fans.
@@SonZackSSJ9k Another invalid argument. Yea bro Vegeta mastered UE becasue Beerus mastered. Goku mastered UI because Whis mastered. You are Great man.
@@zetset8098 it’s not invalid because Destroying and staying calm are completely different things. Vegeta is also shown to toy with Granolah in UE so he’s not really urging destruction when he uses UE.
I think broly handling his own in super saiyan implies if he ever went past that he'd be unstoppable. Imagine ssj God or ultra ego broly
Gohan beast is so unearned lol…
He’s been training since before the TOP…and even alluded to working on “a new form that no Saiyan has ever seen before” in the manga during the TOP…
This is shit as big as when Madara was impaled from behind by black Zetsu
Has this man only been around since super? He suggested he hadn't known/met goku before his gold form 6:50
I was more so saying that Frieza wouldn't be aware of how strong Goku had become. However somehow he was able to gage that in his months of training and knew when he would have surpassed a HYPOTHETICAL Goku of the current time
Goku vs gohan fight proves no matter if your kid can bench press more than you, or run faster than you, they're your kids and one backhand is enough
Broly power output will only reach his peak when combining ikari with supersaiyan. But now that he can control super saiyan somewhat he can use that power better
Who is stronger? Supreme Kai or Tien?
Imagine if the universal tournament was actually a multiversal tournament.
idk where the fuck people get that "Goku can lower his power level in MUI" part. Brother, you can't hold yourself back from focusing lol, that would make Goku use UI Sign instead of MUI lol.
except holding back power also uses focus, and by that logic Goku can’t hold himself back in Blue.
I just want to know what's next for my boy Broly
It's stupid that ghoan beast is the same strength as goku, vegeta and broky.vegeta, goku, and broly should be stronger no matter what being trained by a god and an angel
Goku using his full power is not him going all out he is using his strongest form which is MUI gohan was going all out thats one
2. Gohan knocking goku out of his form is not just pure power goku was caught off guard by how strong and fast gohan became at that moment if gohan was so strong he wouldve knocked goku out after that goku controlled the battle
3. Gohan and broly were fighting on par with gohan having more battle experience
4. Vegeta has fought against goku and broly so it was only right for him to get a feel of gohans strength for himself
THIS IS THE POWER SCALE
VEGETA > GOKU > GOHAN = BROLY
caught off guard lmao ye it was same situation like in buu saga when majin vegeta punched goku in the head lmao
@@zetset8098it’s literally similar giving that Goku wasn’t expecting a rage boost like that out of nowhere.
@@SonZackSSJ9k So black frieza is...no no no no no... get outta here bro, just don't spam my notifications, idk maybe you really have 47 chromosomes if this is true then I'm sorry but DB fandom is not for you sir. Trust me and take care sir.
I agree with u 65% MajinBird. It’s been a while, glad ur back. The way I see it, great context was given to showcase Goku is Stronger than Gohan. Goku fighting Gohan, not talkin him seriously at all. Whereas Gohan goin all out from Da start. When Goku did get serious momentarily. That’s U.I.M. Goku highly suppressed.
Gohan straining himself to win bcuz he’s using 100% and actively tryin to win a sparring match with a highly suppressed U.I.M. Goku. Goku actively took his eyes off Gohan, showin he can disengage from the fight, while casually overpowering Beast Gohan.
He recognized Broly’s interest and enthusiasm. Therefore he wanted Gohan to fight Broly bcuz they have identical based powers from Pure Rage.
Vegeta also wanted to fight Beast Gohan to test him, to personally see how Strong Gohan is. This is The Saiyan way. This is what goes down with Uub.
Goku & Vegeta represent the Old School Martial Arts Masters. They are Masters, of course they can defeat the Younger Generation. But they are far more mature. It’s about testing the next generation & guiding them thru their inner potential.
Think of Goku & Vegeta at the beginning of DBZ, they were always down to fight to prove themselves their Power, their Strength. The Path To Power. Now in their stage in life, they have the Power. They are now The Masters. They have nothin left to prove. They’ll still get Stronger. They are The Masters they used to look up to.
Goku & Vegeta’s dialogue about not having a winner. Goku tellin Vegeta, it’s not about winning anymore. He only wanna test these powerful warriors, to ensure, when Goku & Vegera are off world. Gohan, Broly, Goten & Trunks now have the power to defend the Earth. Instead of having to always rely on them.
Goku is The Epitome of Power. That’s his destiny, it’ll come to pass at The End of Z. This moment marks Goku being Happy that the next generation have crossed the threshold of Power, for the safety of Earth.
This is a glimpse of Goku & Vegeta’s Maturity, we get to see fully at the end of Z.
Beerus
Gohan
Frieza
Goku
Vegeta
Broly
Piccolo
Gamma 2
Granola
17
Trunks
Goten
18
Uub
Tein
Krillin
Pan
Correction. Thats not full powered Broly. He only managed to control his ssj form. You can tell by the hairstyle that it's ssj and not full power.
Goku objectively was not using his full power, because he didn't use the UI giant form. He clearly wasn't trying his very best and admitted he was just trying to test out gohan's strength. I think they're equal in power, and goku is more skilled.
To all the Brainless commenting "Oh if vegeta couldn't use a form because its based on destruction, why could gohan use one based on anger." Destruction is an energy that destroys. That right there should be self explanatory. But also Just because someone is angry doesnt mean they cant control it. Thats the whole point of beast, and even Super saiyan 2 when gohan first transformed. Over the years after getting his rage boosts, Gohan has slowly become more and more conscious when hes angry. Gaining and garnerning more control. Literally in this video OP shows a panel where gohan literally states "Its like powering up to the point im on the verge of snapping, but i dont. I stay just below that level."
And its a different kind of rage boost than broly, whos rage boost is a constant build, the more uncontrollably angry he gets, the more his energy rises. Where as Gohan has been stronger the more he controls his rage.
Doesn’t change the fact the 2 are technically variants to each other, besides we see Beerus use Hakai so casually without trying to Hakai Vegeta so it’s not impossible for Vegeta to use UE as he same way.
We need to see more orange piccolo
the magazine is sometimes false
Who let this man cook
Vegeta used ssbe vs gohan probably stronger than goku nd broly
Fun fact: dragon balls exist in real life, they will be used to revive toriya,a so vegeta takes another L and doesn't hakai frieza.
Man... reading all these comments on this video tells me that even after you lay out the complete facts like you did in this video people will still just believe what they want to believe LMAO
"B-but my fav character is still obviously the strongest tho!" 🙄🙄🙄
Am I the only one that just cant accept Gohan being stronger than Goku or Vegeta?? Like ALL of those years of training, ALL OF THOSE FIGHTS and zenkais, and Gohan can just pull a form out of his ass to SURPASS all of that with while being out of the loop with training?? Idc about the time skip between Super Hero and 103, theres just no way he should be on that level and I REALLY hope they correct that and put Goku and Vegeta back on top soon. It makes the power scaling and power creep look so much worse than it already was.. And people talk about pulling a stupid strong form out of their ass.. the multiplier for Beast has to be in the millions for him to get from TOP level minus getting rusty from not training(getting weaker from not training is a stated thing in Dragon Ball, even with Gohan in particluar), all the way up to SURPASSING Goku, Vegeta, and Broly.. It makes no sense..
IT'S BEEN EXPLAINED YEARS AGO
@legacyofkaz4107 What has? The form? I'm not saying I don't get the form.. I'm saying I can't accept how strong he was able to get with no training whatsoever.. That godly power wasn't earned, it was pulled out of his ass..
@@skylarmason573 It was, but in my opinion it was better then trunks
@legacyofkaz4107 But even Trunks was constantly doing shit between Z and Super to warrant getting stronger and makes his ass-pull more earned than Gohan. Trunks has been fighting for his life for his entire life and watched everyone he loves die, him having some built up rage power could be explained. With Gohan, there's no reasoning.. He hasn't been training or anything minus some "secret training" to teach himself the Special Beam Cannon.. But that would be honing ki to do the attack instead of physical training.. So it makes no sense
A teenaged Gohan was stronger than Goku.
The thing about jiren is we haven’t seen anything about him since the tournament but vegeta did say that. Vegeta, goku, Moro, gas, broly and jiren were all on par with each other during the cell max arc in the manga. But vegeta also said that jiren had the best ki control out of all of them. The way he utilized his power was far superior than the rest and that’s what gave him the edge. So I imagine a hypothetical jiren who lost his first ever fight against anyone would have train to levels unseen in Dragonball so far. He was already a prodigy getting as strong as he did without the use of god ki. People sleep on jiren but this is still THE jiren
Yes and no, Vegeta says that Jiren was equal to him and Goku (never mentions anyone else) in power that the only difference was the utilization of his ki control that made him more effective in battle. Jiren would be completely relaxed until it was time to strike or be on the offense in which he utilized all 100% at that moment.
When Goku and Vegeta fought they would let their ki leak out so they will use like 80% while the other was wasted during striking.
An example of what Vegeta is talking about can be seen in the Moro arc when he goes to train with the Yardrats.
When Vegeta simply just wanted to shoot a single beam from his finger but it resulted in him releasing a big beam.
He realized how much his power was amplified from mind and spirit training with the Yardrats.
Jiren is most likely on their level off screen as he told Topo that the next time he sees Goku that he will be ready.
@@chaotic2insanitymovie and manga version are not the same movie vegeta said jiren wasn't that powerful straight up, while manga version vegeta mention all opponent jiren,broly,moro,gas,granolah,black frieza to be on par with him reason he lose because he wasted to much energy while fighting.
can someone list this guys top 10 characters i lost track after number 2.
Why do you reupload the same videos though?
I can be a bit of a perfection ist, sometimes I take videos down because how i dont like something I did or said. I will fix them and reupload them with the added change in there real bad habit of mine
No jirin is not in list and cell max was weka Dan borly fool power borly, So sins goku and vegeta has sopast borly ,So cell mex did not sopast
Goku and vegeta
Goku was holding back with best gohon so if goku turn in to trow Ul he cooled defeat best gohon
Yea, disagree with your assumptions. It’s likely Beerus, Gohan, Freiza, then the rest lol
@@Kdotkon my list would be Beerus, Frieza, Gohan then the rest so I’m not sure what you mean
@@MajinBird we have two names in different spots
jiren above broly for me. around gohan beast (not fulll power) inmanga jiren stronger than mui goku and in broly movie goku said mui is stronger than blue gogeta.
is beastform exclusive to gohan. if yes why and if no can goku vegeta and broly also achieve that form?
I love how the thumbnail is a bunch of nonsense for the most part
1:54 is a KI WAVE FULL POWER!?
Krillin > SSGB
"Silver Ultra instinct" its just Ultra instinct sign and Mastered Ultra instinct. 😅
It's UI sign and UI, there's no "mastered"
@@perreban MUI is UI just being mastered and not having a massive blowback from using it