JCM800 -vs- JMP - Which one should I buy? MARSHALL Shootout!
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- In this video we're comparing a 1977 Marshall JMP 2204 to a 1983 Marshall JCM800 2204 (4010, but is the combo version of 2204). I'm playing them through a 1971 Marshall 1960B and through the 4010 cabinet with a 1971 G12H30 55Hz Pulsonic Greenback in it. The guitar is a 2008 Gibson Les Paul R9.
Can't hear any obvious difference, both sound great. Rockin' tune !!
Thanks Byron, great to hear that!
I agree. Both sound great and very similar. I'm actually a proud owner of a '78 JMP 2203. :)
@@sidneymorris910 88 JCM 800 2205 ( 6550) here and I couldnt hear a diff either
Another great video! The JMP sounds a tad brighter but both sound fantastic. I have both and play the JMP more often.
Byron Laird the 800 is tighter with more bottom push to me 🤷🏻♂️
Ive modded TONS of these amps and I can tell you every single one sounds different, find one you love and keep it :)
So much myth, legend, & misinformation over the years about these JMP v.s.JCM master models.........after all the smoke clears.........
I’ll listen to the mechanics over the salesman any day.......everytime🤘
@@Auen73 I’ve seen a lot of factory errors from the mid 70s, maybe the transition wasn’t smooth? I’m not sure. 1979-1980 seems to be the years for the Jmp and The vertical 800s pre reissue all seem to be great. I do stick by my original comment that you should keep an amp you love, I’ve seen so many people regretting amps that they never can replace. 🤘
@@Monomythamplification There's a great interview with Steve Grindrod that's worth reading. Marshall had a lot of reliability issues transitioning from PTP to PCB in the 70's according to Grindrod. I've also heard from other modders/builders.....that Marshall would use whatever components they could get thier hands....(vender of the week club🙄) to get them out the door $$$ Throw in a slew of other inconsistencies.......and you end up a bunch of different versions of a 2204/2203....for better or worse. Love your Monomyth Mods & clips btw 🤘
@@Auen73 Besides the 2203/2204 circuit in 1976, Steve Grindrod also designed the JCM 2000 DSL100 in 1995 right before he left to start Albion in case anyone was unaware.
@@scottdunn2178 Right on👍.........Interesting stuff. The misconception is that Jim Marshall was the wizard behind the soldering iron & engineering, but he was not. So many unsung heroes behind the scenes. James Brown (Peavey5150) Mike Bernidelli (Mesa MK2 C+) come to mind.
Don't miss this one! The relatively affordable JCM800 may surprise you! :-)
How much would either of these sell for in $$?
which one would YOU take? and what about the 1 watt versions for the 50th anniversary?
I have the 2203x :)
Michael Craig a used JCM 800 $1200-$1800. The JMP late 70s upwards of $4-5,000.00
@@Thomasdgolden You can find a jcm800 for around 1000. That's what I bought mine for
I bought my first real amp, a Marshall jmp 2204 when I was 16, back in 1980! Still have it and it has never been modded. Stock original. Somehow I traded the head case with a combo case ( including speakers) 4 years later. I’ve regretted this until today . In recent years I also bought a jmp combo and a 1987 lead , but my first jmp will always be special ! Great amp
So you traded the head shell for a combo shell and you put your amp in the combo shell?
@@cameronland4439 yeah, aint that stupid?
Please for the health of the amp, get it recapped. If you want all the important things like the OT to stay stock, replacing the old dried out caps will save its life one of these days when you go to plug it in.
@@Altarofpigs thanks. The caps still hold their loads over months, so they are still functioning pretty good. I have tools to check their health as well . At some point they will have to be replaced but there is no reason to do this just on their age
@@Johnsormani I would certainly consider a properly grounded mains cable, and elimination of the death cap.
I’d take the JMP on principle but the 800 sounds just as good.
Thanks Wade!
Classic tones! The JCM800 sounds a tad bit fuller, slightly more midrange to it when heard separately, but in a mix, they´re almost indistinguishable from one another.
I like the brightness of the JMP. Serves the mix better.
Great demo of two fine sounding amps. To my ear, the JMP is a little bit brasher and has more sizzle in the top end. The JCM sounds slightly more compressed and refined. Hard to pick one as a favorite, but I think I might actually like the JCM a little more than the JMP. Nice work Johann and thanks for posting!
Doesn't matter which one you pick, since both sound great and you can get a Michael Schenker tone out of both of them!!!
always felt like JMPs were more "angry" sounding, less refined. I think that comes through in this comparison. always enjoy these vids man
They’re really similar. Any differences could be explained by tube selection or slight differences in cap values or tolerances. I think they both rock!
To my ear, the JMP wins in regards to overall fullness. My hunt begins for a late 70s JMP
Man, something about those JMPs, there mids are unique. I'd go for the JMP. But that's me 🤘😆
Wow! I did a blind listen and both were almost identical with one having a slightly tighter low end. When I went back to view on my second passing I discovered it was the jcm with the tighter bottom. Excellent job again Johan. Your controlled demonstrations have really opened my ears and mind to the minute variables in the Marshall range. Thank you.
Cheers!
Glad to hear that! Cheers!
Yeah man. That's that difference in the transformers Johan mentioned . Gives that old day breath while still delivering the goods.
In my humble opinion, the difference between these 2 amps could easily be wiped out by a different speaker cab, different pre-amp or power tubes, or a mere slight twist of an EQ knob.
As to which sound I prefer of the 2 presented here, I would have to choose based on how my singer's voice and how the rest of the band would sound so as to fit into more of the unused tonal space in the mix.
Nice video, as usual.
yeah i totally agree! They have, as all marshall, different tollerance pot, maybe it's enough turn down middle a little bit on JCM800
You guys are on fire in this one. Damn! Was kinda hoping that you’d break of into a mad solo at some point. Smokin’🤘 ... I really miss my old 800 now.
Thanks man, it’s great to hear that!
I think the JMP sounded better on the chords, and the JCM better on the low range, sustained single notes. But both are super close, anyway.
I started life with an 800 in 1989. By the late 90s, I'd also picked up 2 JMP's, a 2203 and 2204 (both 1978), and sold the 800. In recent years, I've kind of regretted that decision, but less so, after seeing this video!
Final thought- MAN, Johann knows how to make those things sing. He is truly the Marshall whisperer! Kiss WISH they had written such great riffs like he does!
Both are excellent. I like the JMP slightly better. Thanks Johan!
I prefer the JMP sound by far, thanks Johan!
Same exact circuits unless the 77 is a very early non cascading gain model. They changed to cascading gain and increased plate voltages the same year basically wiring the low and high inputs in series. They both sound very close, But of course tubes and component value variations are going to sound different between the two. Just changing any tube out, say stronger/weaker, type, etc can make a difference. I have the later 1977 cascading gain JMP 2204 converted to el34's. It is a very responsive Marshall. All of the tone controls have tons of range and I love having a master volume control. Love your vids man !!
I don’t know if I can even tell the difference, but that riff your playing is boss as hell! Keep ‘em coming Johan.
This killer riff gets stuck in my head kinda Diamond Head/ tygers of pan tang love the jcm sound its got a little more balls!
They're so close it's a matter of personal preference. I prefer the JCM 800
This is a tough one since both sound fantastic. I'm leaning slightly toward the JCM800 but man, I'd take either one.
Rockin' tune, I'm listening to it again. \m/
Great video! To me they sound almost identical, and awesome. Cheers!
Johan has the goods!!! 🤘🏼😎
I’m a JMP guy. In fact I’m having one built at the moment and can’t wait to hear those glorious tones in my own home again...
Best! ✌🏼
The JMP is a hair brighter, a bit more of the upper end Marshall sizzle. The levels of OD may not be different, but the JMP is a touch brighter which I personally like.
Love'em BOTH! My ears say, the JMP is deeper dimensionally maybe a little more forward and the 800 is tighter/punchier (maybe?). Tonally very similar I think. But, the way they "deliver" the tone differently, to me is evident here. Nice job brother!
Outstanding video! I'm actually surprised how well JCM 800 Held up. I can't really hear a difference.
I got distracted by the Casverket sign (though I dont know what that is/means) and didn't even realized you changed amps... INTERESTING!
I always loved the JCM800. I've never played through a JMP, but judging by this video, I didn't really miss much. They sound very close. As always, a great jam!
I’ll take one of each and run them in stereo with the jmp just breaking up and the jcm dirty. I dare to dream. Great tune Johan..... and yes...I love the, “so, let’s go. “
My absolute favorite is the old 2203 jcm800 from 82 or something that i once had.
If i would have known any better i wouldn't sold it.
But i'm an ass so i did!
That makes two asses. I did the same thing years ago,except I sold 2 of them. AARGH!
You guys are asses 👌🏻
Well, the good thing about asses is they were placed far from the nose, usually!
GPH 2 but asses are time bombs they can explode in any second and sell plexis 😂😂😂
Still gots my 2205 from 85'..... rocks!!!!
Thanks for another GREAT video Johan! I remember less than 10 years ago the JMP combos were available all day for well under $1,000. Recently I’ve been looking and was ready to finally purchase a JMP 2204 combo, but the prices have skyrocketed!! Luckily I found a 1982 4010, the vertical input 2204 in 1x12 combo format for just over $1,000. It sounds fantastic, and the circuit is 100% stock, no mods! I think these early 80’s Marshall’s have been flying under the radar but it won’t take long for them to jump in price like the JMP. Well worth the going rate in my opinion, plus it sounds really great at bedroom levels. Thanks again for sharing.
You guys got a great groove going there that I quite forgot to assess the amps against each other. They both sounded great !!
Either one is worth picking up brother Johan!
I've played many of both models and was always
Impressed! Best of luck in your pick of amps!
Cheers from New England!
Nearly identical to me....interesting to me as I own a Dr. Z SRZ 65LE which is supposedly the "Dumble" of 2204 style amps. Never heard anything that comes close to it, astounding! Great video and playing as usual Johan....Keep on Rockin'.......LET's Go!!!!
Pick whichever is cheapest. They both sound incredibly similar. Thought you were playing Dio - Stand Up & Shout when you first started playing. Really cool!
I believe today’s lesson is... That the JCM 800 is as good a tone generator as is the JMP 50. Many may not like to hear this, but what do your ears tell you? At some point the JCM 800 was built with a PCB. I’m not sure if this one is point to point or the PCB version. BUT whatever is inside the chassis, it certainly sounded excellent. Once again, wonderful presentation and fantastic jam Johan! ;-)
Let's Go !!! Dang johan ur soo lucky to play all these killer amps !!!🤙🤙🤟🤟 great jam !!
I have a '77 JMP EL34 powered, and an '84 JCM 800 - 6550 tubes. They are similar, but just different enough to keep both! Nice demo, Johan.
I have both and run them together as my main rig! A 1981 2x12 JMP 50 watt combo and a 1983 2x12 JCM800 50 watt combo (6 knob, vertical inputs, take note kids! Lol)! The JMP runs 6550 power tubes and the 800 has KT88's. Both have their original Celestion G12M-70 speakers in them and I pair each one with Marshall 1936 2x12 cabs loaded with modern Celestion G12H-75 Creambacks!
I run them in stereo, using the "low" input on both. Set fat, pretty clean, just "edge of breakup" when you "dig in" and I push the front end with an Analog.man King Of Tone, a Nobels ODR-1, an Ibanez Mostortion and a Shin's Music Dumbloid ODS w/ Boost.
The KOT ("yellow" side) is my 1st gain stage when using my Strats, the Nobels is my 1st gain stage when using Tele's. I stack each with the Mostortion for a 2nd gain stage and the Dumbloid ODS is for heavy rock sounds. For solos I have a Tone Bender MK1 and a "violet ram's head" Big Muff stacked together in a loop.
I've tried and own a bunch of different amps (Dr. Z, hand wired AC30's, Dual Rectifiers, hand wired Deluxe Reverb, tweed Pro Amp, single ended boutique amps etc) but for live sound, nothing beats my 2 early 80's Marshalls and I'm always recieving compliments and questions about my tone ever since I set the rig up!
I'll never stop using different stuff to record or experiment with different tones at home but my main sound will always be "master volume" Marshall's. I think it's most likely because that's what I grew up hearing so it just sounds like "electric guitar" is "supposed to" sound in my mind if that makes any sense.
Thanks for posting Mr Johan....they both sounded very similar. Impressive.
Thank you! I was waiting for this comparison forever. Great one Johan!
Whenever you have Simon around during a demo, please let him play a strat through the amps you are comparing. Thanks.
You deserve to make a living off of this content. There is always someone who takes things too far...and that's awesome! Thanks.
So excited. Favorite Marshall’s right here
Cheers Jacob!
After landing my 78 50 watt JMP head and 71 cab, my wife says she stopped at a tag sale and saw a 'cute' Marshall amp. ' I'm good ,I have a Marshall!' I say! She kept insisting and I really wasn't interested and I figured this would be good for next g.a.s purchase lol. We'll eventually check it out and it's a 86 50 watt Jcm with chocolate grille! Got it for a great price and both sounded great but Guitar guilt got me! ' Why do I have 2 Marshall heads?? I'm not Slash or Joe Perry!! Sold JCM but kinda wish I had kept but it helped me score some vintage gear so......
I have a '79 JMP 2204 and an '85 JCM800 2204, both are 50w heads. I prefer the JMP. IMHO, the JMP sounds better with V30's and the JCM sounds better with G12-T75's. The JCM has more gain and it's brighter. The JMP is more organic and makes different guitars and different speakers sound better. YMMV
Both sound so good it just doesn't matter. Nice video!
They sound killer when you play that riff. The riff is what makes that amp.
Both are great amps, I own multiple of both they’re my favorite.
What matters is not the letters; what matters is the input layout: vertical inputs are mandatory.
Thanks for the demo, Johan. JMP is tweaked to reach harmonics or said differently: more responsive to picking. What a great Monday evening surprise 👍🏻 tak Johan
I like both really! The JMP is a bit more mellow sounding and the 800 has some more high end crisp. Maybe I prefer the 800 actually!
The JCM sounded a little darker than the JMP, but it was far less noticeable when the guitar tracks were soloed.
Both sound great. I like the clarity of the harmonics on the JMP. The JCM gets a little muddier in the mix, but I bet for some styles it would be better, so overall horses for courses.
I can't really tell the difference between the two amps, but the riff you played is super cool and rocking!
Great sounds. Love these Marshalls.
That’s a tasty tone in stereo, I cannot tell the difference at all... JCM for the win if it means spare cash for more gear 😋
They are both excellent amps. The best ever made imo. I own both. Most people set their 800's treble to high and make them strident. Yours is set very well here. I use my 800's more live only because they don't need to be as loud to have a full tone. Great demo.
Another great comparison Johan. You do both amplifiers great justice, as always. Now, where i am, a 50 watt JCM 800 1x12 is still available around $1,000 US, at least on the East Coast. Without having bought one myself, I wonder if one could get my JCM 2000 Triple Super Lead head (purchased for just $500 US), and played into a JCM 800 1960 4x12 ($200), to duplicate the sound that you have mastered here, just by twaeking gain settings, etc. I think a three-way is in order (no pun intended): a JMP 2204 vs. JCM 800 vs. JCM 2000! Thanks so much for your videos. Cheers, Johan, from the Midlantic States of the USA.
JMP, but only because I own one. I'd be just as happy with an 800, because there really isn't a nickel's worth of difference between them {as long as you are talking about the early 800s}. The later 800s I never cared for that much.
They are different but one is not better. That JMP gives more of a 70s tone to me while the 800 is more 80s. I would give the edge to the JMP for more character.
Dammit man that's a tough one! It seems you do better financially with the JCM, but frick dude, that expensiver JMP sounds stinkin great!
My bank account is happy that my guitar space is limited :). Another great one, thanks Johan!
Thanks Andy ;-)
Both amps sound marvelous. The JMP seems to have a more low-mid focus where the JCM has a little more upper-mid focus. I know the combo versions of the JCM's have something done to them either add or decrease midrange (I can't remember which). Maybe that might account for some of the difference, unless you've changed than for this comparison. Generally speaking, the JCM's should be a little brighter than the JMP's.
Loved it! They sounded very close to my Marshall fried ears.
Hahaha! Cheers Nathan
The JMP and JCM are pretty close to my ears, but the JCM had slightly more gain, and the JMP was more sustainy. Both sound like instant KISS tone.
I was enjoying the song so much that I forgot to listen for the difference :D I guess they sound pretty similar.
Thanks, that’s great to hear!
Yes me too... had to rewind the video twice to see which amp was playing lol
i have the JCM800 2203x and the JCM800 50w Combo. The 50w head is a 2204 the 50w combo is a 4210. My 50w Combo JCM800 is also a 1983.
They sound awfully close the same however, I feel like the JMP has a slightly better midrange response \m/
That is what I hear too and now reading it :)
Cant help but wonder if they would sound more similar if each was tweaked a bit in the mids. Then again maybe here are some characteristics that cant be changed with tone controls or eq that make the amps unique.
treble bleed cap on jmp sometimes was 5nF instead of 1nF, makes difference when gain is less than 10
Best value
@@Monomythamplification best value is zero)
Someone could correct me, but I did an analysis of the JCM and JMP circuits - they have the same parts nominals in the preamp section. This video is proof. They sound very close to eachother. JCM souds a little brighter to me, maybe this one has more precence.
Nice comparison Johan as usual.. That 77 though wins for me... the 83 doesn't sound bad, there's just a little more character and bite in the 77, both sound great.
I had to make this same decision..i choose the 800 ..wish i got the jmp..love my 800 but if i could go back...so glad to see this vid
Theres probably more difference between the cabs that where sold with the amps than in the amps themselves.
Great uptempo riffs Johan!
Thanks, glad to hear it!
i respect your opinion . .. and i enjoy your great demos and love of everything marshall
Nice vid with all the good features: split screen, some touristic view(Gasverket ! i did a little search: we had one of those big gazométre/gasklocka in my town ,Lyon, too... ), nice tune and really good (hence better than decent ;-) ) sound and chops by Johan...
No big differences between the two amps and for good reason. They are both 2204 circuit, 50 watt master volume. The JMP is a late one 'rocker switch' virtually identical to the pre 86 'vertical input' JCM800 shown..
Fine demonstration and mix! Thanks for sharing brothers!
Love Both amps of course!
Be Well Johan!
Wasn’t the JCM 800 basically a plexi with more gain and a master volume? So in theory it should be able to do plexi tones quite well? Great video as always..
The preamps are different. The 1959/1987 JMPs have two channels in parallel, no treble peaker, a large cathode cap on the "normal" channel, the ability to jumper/mix channels and no master volume. The 2203/2204 have cascaded V1a/V1b sections, treble peaker (basically a cap/resistor combo that boosts highs), a cold clipper on V1b (causes even harmonic distortion) and pre-phase inverter master volume. The phase inverter sections and power amp are very similar. All that being said, they can sound very close. JCM is easier to get in the zone at a lower volume. I've got both for the different flavors.
Both sound like great Marshalls. I'd take either one. Great video!
I prefer the JMP because it has more bite, whereas the JCM is more grainy, motley crue type sound. The difference isn't big by all means, but the AC DC live sound is pretty much perfect.. Bite and clarity over gravel and heaviness.
Jmp for me. U can tighten it up with the presence or eq knobs an eq pedal or or compressor but u can also jumper ur inputs and enjoy some insane plexi sounds or go on the low inputs and get good cleaner rocknroll blues sounds. Jcm 800 does what it does better than any amp on earth. It's tight and notes come through at high gain beautifully but I like the freedom the jmp gives. Tight but still able to get into the looser tones of the 60s/70s hard Rock-proto metal. Even without the tinkering it's pretty damn close to the jcm800!
I'd love to see you compare a Carvin Legacy 100 to a JCM800. The original Legacy Steve Vai model to me, sounds a lot like an 800 only with more articulation and "warmth". Steve has stated that he never liked Marshall tone but I hear a lot of it in this head but almost more improved in a way. Plus they have an amazing clean tone. One of the few amps that I can say actually has 2 excellent channels unlike the later 80's 2205's which had an okay clean and an okay yet treble heavy lead channel. If you ever get your hands on one I'd love to hear your thoughts.
Great shootout, this is real value, helps alot.
Answer is easy, get the JMP and a Marshall Gov'nor pedal. Instantly transforms thebJMP into an 800 and 900
I loved them both! It sounded like you were playing "Deuce" by Kiss without exactly playing it!
I think the 2204 is the single best Marshall circuit. You can get beautiful cleans out of them too.
Yeah its a favorite of mine too
Killer tone and tune! To me the JMP sounds a bit more vintage, but, if they were both run through the same cabinet, I bet they would sound more the same?
It should be noted that if you can't get a good sound out either a 77 or 83 2204, then you might need to take some lessons. With that in mind, the amps from 77-78 are some of the best that Marshall ever built. As a result, I prefer the 77 JMP 2204 before a JCM-800 2204. I certainly regret selling my 77 2204 whereas I rarely miss the comparatively fizzy spunding 82 4010 Combo I sold a decade ago. I like my 78 Hiwatt SA112 or late 60's Traynor YBA-1 more than most any Mush-all amp though. It really comes down to personal taste.
I'd be happy with either amp, but I'm partial to the slightly darker tone of the 800. Since they're similar, it would be rad to use a strong overdrive with a JMP (RAT2 or red Maxon 808x), take it out on stage and make the kids see and hear how cool it is to crank some grindcore and death metal with the vintage amps.
Nice work Johan. The JMP perhaps has slightly more clarity, and the JCM a little more compression. This is more likely related to valves than the circuits perhaps. It would be interesting to also hear a vertical input 2204. Either way, they're a solid gigging rig. My vertical input 2204 never lets me down!
Another great video Johan! I actually like the JCM800 a little better. Surprised, I usually prefer the JMP! Cheers & "Let's Go!"
I am sure Johan was listening to some Swedish Death Metal back in the early 90s
@Johan, no question here really.. buy both 😎 more = more. Rock on!!
I have one of each and they sound practically identical - at least my ears are too destroyed to hear any difference.
Perfect timing. I happen to be looking at all available JMPs and 800s on the Danish market these days. Good to know that the cheaper option is still very good. Id prefer a JMP MKII, because that’s what i have tried and fallen in love with in the first place. There’s quite a few of them available right now, bit I was so dissapointed to find two of then had been modded and/or reduced to 50w. I can’t believe anyone would do that to a rock classic like this... And even more crazy since it’s a Master volume model in the first place. Heresy and a crime against rock n roll.
Johan - Another fabulous video from you, as always! These are two amps that I have seriously considered acquiring for quite some time. Both sound very similar to one another. I know that the JCM800 circuit was based off of the JMP, so it makes sense that they should sound very close.
A question for you. With the JCM800, how different is the sound and amp characteristics of the amps that feature vertical input jacks versus the later year amps with the horizontal input jacks?
Both are equally awesome in a similar but different way