Why Everyone HATED Nu-Metal (sad but true)
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- Опубликовано: 16 май 2024
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Why did everyone hate nu-metal bands like Korn, Linkin Park, Slipknot and Limp Bizkit? I look at the REAL reasons why nu-metal was hated.
Edited by Tim Gilli: bit.ly/tmgprmba
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0:00 Intro
2:21 Nu-metal vs traditional metal
5:55 Hip-hop influences
9:32 The media's hate for nu-metal
12:41 Frat bros?
15:44 Ingroup outgroup bias
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Why is there a metallica song in the nu metal video in the title 🤣🤣
kinda gross
nothing but garbage
Music elitism is so ridiculous.
Sucks that Deftones briefly got stuck in the nu metal casket....and why is new spelled nu? Lol
Fred was a marketing genius. Not only did he own the rights to Limp Bizkit merch but he also owned the rights to “Fuck Limp Bizkit” which were sold on hats and shirts in the 2000s so he made money off both his fans as well as his haters.
Do you have a source for this info?
@@theTYTAN3 Your mom knows all about it, I asked her last night.
oh, like Gene Simmons of Kiss. Just ask him.
@@theTYTAN3Elvis did it too. It's nothing new pal
His stipulation for Limp Bizkit's music being used in a video game (he has to be a playable character) is my favourite. Chad businessman.
looks like finn was low on rent again
Correction: nu-metal pays my MORTGAGE, not my rent ☺️
@@ThePunkRockMBA ah yes, my apologies
I thought u did it all for the nookie @ThePunkRockMBA
Have been a homeowner for 10+ years It’s still rent, your landlord is just the bank vs a person. Both have the ability to send a sheriff to your home to kick in you out if you don’t pay.
@@ThePunkRockMBA your hustle is appreciated
If it wasn't for nu-metal, I wouldn't have gotten into rock and metal in general at all.
Same here. It’s still not metal
Same
Just wanted to give a shoutout to Max Cavalera from Sepultura/Soulfly here, he came from the old school thrash metal scene but embraced new metal instead of shunning it.
He hasn't released anything nu metal related since 2004 but he says the next Soulfly album is gonna hit back at that sound. So he embraced this sound twice, let's see how it goes 🔥
Everybody makes mistakes.
But he came around and is now touring with Igor playing their first 2 albums
Yeah but Soulfly were real metal man. Max does rule!!! He embraced it all till Killswitch Engage! lol I was reading an interview and he’s old like me and unfortunately we used to use the word gay as a negative adjective and he was saying about Killswitch “I was like ‘what the fuck is that? That’s gay!” Bahahahaha. The damned editor wouldn’t take it out. We are from a different time it’s not right but when you say a word so often for so many years it slips out! It sucks but it does! Anyways poor guy and I REALLY think after this Farewell tour, you’ll see Max and Igor in a Sepultura reunion. I have zero doubt.
Yeah and he shouldn't, cause Sepultura was a much better thrash tyan nu metal band and Soulfy just sucks. Personal opinion ;-)
@@matthieurenaudet8960 Are talking about early Soulfly or their later stuff? They changed to a more thrash/groove oriented sound at around 2005 (the song frontlines is a great example of that, it sounds like early Sepultura).
People say nu-metal was rejected by the old guard (which is true) but nu-metal bands didn't claim to be metal either. They called themselves Alternative bands.
Yep. And alternative stations of the times played them on air. Regular stations didn't. Gen Z weren't around yet so they don't have a basis to make claims.
Yes! I grew up believing that the heaviest things I’ve listened to were “alternative” bands. And now all of a sudden they are “metal”.
That's the crux of the "hate" I think. They simply were not metal bands. No reason to draw the ire of the metal community by pretending they were.
If black guys had made this music, it would have been seen as aggressive hip hop with guitars. Too little focus on melody or harmony to fit in with much contemporary traditional thrash or glam metal.
This shit probably owes more to punk than metal.
I would argue that’s only because “Alternative” Rock was essentially co opted by the Grunge scene at the time. If “Nu-Metal” is a term that was retroactively chosen to describe every band mentioned in this video, there’s a reason for it - it just fits. In the 2000s, when this stuff dominated air time on radio stations, no one ever called it Alternative, but gave it mocking nicknames like “Generic Rage” or “Pop Metal”.
@@RichardRemer "nü-metal" is a branch of punk. A better title for it would be something like "altcore" or "punk-hop" or something...
Temu and Numetal.
Finn needed that Costco run covered.
Nothing says punk rock like forced-labor sponsorships 🤘
He's better than a temu promotion. I was disappointed to see that.
Well tbh, Nu-metal kinda is metal from Temu, so it fits
Fr temu is worse than wish like wtf
@@dukejohn5608 'mu metal
I absolutely love when you bring it back to a "can't we all get along", "we all love music, right" sort of lesson! Especially, when it involves interesting psychological concepts. That's why I love the channel. Awesome video!
IKR
The most trippy part of this is I just finished writing an essay on populist rhetoric and one of the devices we were discussing was “in-group vs out-group”, and it just tripped me out to hear you mention it in this video!
Somehow, this seems eerily-relevant to the Aaron Bushnell Embassy incident... What a time to be alive
@@rbruch98 What is that supposed to mean? Are you seriously pulling a lame centrist view on the conflict lmao
@@WinterandNoodle centrists are better described "status quo extremists who are scared of change" tbh
I hope the essay involved an in-depth analysis about how ingrained power structures (inside and outside of government) work to put opposition views into out-groups that they predefine to rob them off legitimacy.
The idea that Korn isn’t technical is completely insane
exactly ahah and most of the thrash bands (excluding some specific cases like testament, S.T, megadeth etc who had great guitarists) were totally crap technically. Guitar heroes from the 80's all come from the hair scene for a reason.
Yeah monkey brought 7 string guitar into style again
And Fieldy use his bass technically as a percussion instrument, yeah they are not technical insane
@@myroniannyTestament are really good players, Megadeth would never stand a chance against most school bands if it wasn't for Poland and Friedman. Korn, though, are just as weak. Their music is simple enough to allow for truly seamless timing cut-and-align, that's why their studio recs sound as if they can pull it off. You open a real live show with camera audio, and Korn's “technicality” vanishes in a glance, they sound like they have no idea what drums are and why you must lock in with them perfectly (that is, in reality, play a tiny variable bit later than the drums, nothing of MIDI fashion here).
@@hectorrivera4005it's slapping...like in jazz.
A friend of mine once said when I expressed surprise that Korn was still around "there will always be 9th graders."
😂😂 Holy shit, that’s funny.
Well, people who listen to the same music as they did in high school will always be 9th graders
He gets older , they stay the same age… keep an eye on your friend 😅
@@smokinnplatez1426woah.....what do u listen to?
@@microchrist6122 it was a girl and she passed away 2 years ago during covid so even if she was a threat it's gone now. But she was just as surprised as me
I'll be 39 this year, nu-metal was the soundtrack to my teen angst into adulthood. I remember it falling out of favor and I had no idea that it resurged in popularity until I watched this. Your videos always give me the best nostalgia 💜
Same
Middle school days
Same. I'm turning 39 in May. Nu metal is extremely nostalgic for me. Love it or hate it.
already 38 going 39 bro,nu metal was my go to with my brother during early 2000s
The part that made this video great for me was the last bit about outgroup bias, glad that you analyze these things from a psychology and we get to learn something new. Thanks a bunch!
...because only metalheads have outgroup bias, right?
Finn really doesn’t discriminate against any paid sponsors. Didn’t expect to see Temu on here lol
everyone has a price... no hate though, I would too
TEMU is really, really bad
Finn isn't a rock/punk writer or professional. His past and most of his career was in marketing. The dude is an advertiser that's what he does. That's why he does so much shit you'd never see a real punk doing. Also notice how little he talks about punk? All he talks about is Emo, Nu-metal, pop, trap/rap and never punk.
I love supporting the Chinese Communist Party through American Capitalism
Ok, but that nose trimmer.
Yes! Temu! Nothings more punk rock than forced labor in a genocide! Hell yes! This is what the Dead Kennedys made music for!
Wait till you hear about Nestle, a more accepted company that does the same thing that we are putting a side-eye :)
Had the same feeling
😂 thank you
I'm sure The Dead Kennedys never got something out of it either.
Did you post this from your iphone?
I think Pantera was overlooked here as their groovy style of metal went against many thrash conventions and surely had a huge impact of later Nu Metal bands.
Bruh not the Temu sponsorship please. Look into their sketchy CCP affiliation.
Hahahaha
That's the smallest problem with temu
Yeah, the type of shit that is currently going on in Xinjiang internment camps is a pretty decent reason not to work with them no matter their offer
I was never ashamed of a fact that I grew up listening to Limp Bizkit in parallel with Led Zeppelin. Sometimes I would need a whole lotta love and sometimes I would just break stuff.
My friends and I all loved nu metal when it came out. We didn't know what it was called but we felt it, and it was amazing.
SAME, i heard korn like late 93 early 94. a Buddy of mine somehow got a fucking demo tape or someshit they had. Then i remember when the album dropped we all got it. I dont know people who hated it, it blew the fuck up, sold more then any other metal band out there. Started selling out arena's. Shit was nuts. Im sure hardcore thrash metal heads didnt like it, but for quite a few years, they were huge.
Wow so deep.
Same ❤❤
@@laurakeightley9882 Gross
Same here
Nu-Metal has and always will be my favorite Metal Sub-Genre.
S.O.A.D, KoRn, Slipknot, Deftones, Drowning Pool(Sinner album especially), Staind(atleast early on), Adema(with Mark Chavez), Static-X, Limp Bizkit, Linkin Park, Mudvayne, P.O.D and atleast a dozen more are all some of my favorite artists ever, and always will be.
It has energy, passion, very diverse sounds(seeing almost none of those bands I listed sound exactly like one another), the fact they went against the meta of what Metal was at the time deserves it's own credit for sure, and just has crazy levels of grit.
Cool video dude. 🙏🔥
oh damn I forgot about Adema
@@jojo-xh5ik Yeah, were always one of my favorites. Maybe not as successful as Mark Chavez's half brother Jonathan Davis and KoRn was, and sadly left after the first 2 (3 if counting the Immortal EP) projects and after that I stopped following their new releases as the new singer wasn't my thing. Would recommend checking out the first few projects of theirs again, they still hold up as well. 🙏🔥
Dude, such a good vid. The one thing I've really appreciated about this channel (and your eponymous) is recognizing gatekeeping tendencies. Even in my 30's I was having stupid reactions/opinions to different music, and vids such as this have helped put perspective and made me recognize those foolish, inane barriers. Keep it up!
I feel like the genre of Nu Metal is so open to interpretation that it makes it hard to put it in a box and judge people who listen to it. For instance, Mudvayne, Linkin Park, and Rob Zombie sound so completely different, but they're all in the same genre. Meanwhile, other genres and sub-genres of music have a very set sound.
Exactly. All of the bands from that era basically have their own sound and a unique one at that. Incubus sounds nothing like SOAD. Mudvayne sounds nothing like Limp Bizkit but they all got lumped in together due to the era. Most creative time in the history of metal. All of the top tier bands especially have totally unique sounds.
@@pelicanspalacex8861 100%
Grunge had a similar thing with its sound. Almost no 2 bands had much sound in common. It was more a general feeling and message. Ironic that a genre like metal, which was supposed to be about freedom and expression, became so homogenized that anything out of the norm was bad.
Something something you were the chosen one, you were supposed to stick it to the man, not join him.
@@balthezaar100it’s also ironic how metalheads always claim that metal is all about the music and not the image, yet, metalheads started losing their minds back in the 90s when they saw alternative and nu metal bands rocking short hair, lose fit urban casual clothing, rather than having long hair and wearing tight spandex leather pants, till this day, it’s still like that, if you wear any casual clothing like American eagle instead of a denim jacket with 1,000 band patches that you don’t even listen to on them, you’re a “poser”. I thought metal was alll about breaking rules and going against the norm? Most alternative subcultures are like that, punk, goth, crust punk, they’re all about non-conformity “freedom of expression” until you actually want to act different from the rest. They’re basically dogmatic systems at this point and have nothing to do with conformity.
@@marioncarbonell6047 tbh that's no more different than how rap fans were in the '90s, they were even more unaccepting of different people who weren't dressed exactly like them with a ballcap/sports jersey, baggy jeans/trendy shoe brands, but everyone conveniently forgets that just because they just wanted metal to become more wigger and less metal, which makes about as much sense as getting upset that rap doesn't sound more metal than it does by now.
If you want to REALLY stick it to a group's status quo of standards, try wearing a "Lone Wolf, No Club" clothing item in a biker bar around some 1%er outlaw bikers for all their damn cultural gatekeeping crap lol every group has standards, and you can get offended if you weren't accepted but you're just pissing in the wind hahaha
“Conformity packaged as rebellion” - was that a reference to the Anthrax song “Packaged Rebellion”?
Perfect description of nu metal. Lazy, manufactured angst.
I dare every music fan, music lover, and even every metalhead (old-schoool, nu-school, whatever), watch Korn's performance at Woodstock 99 and not be amazed. I watched it a while back. They played an absolutely flawless set in front of 200,000 plus people. From what I gather, the crowd was so large, you could see the soundwaves travel through the ocean of people as they jumped up and down to the beat of the music. I don't know about the rest of Nu-Metal but that performance alone is one for the history books. And in many ways it says a lot about how well the music these bands made connected to the youth at the time, and why it became so popular not only in the US but internationally. It speaks truth about how disenfranchised our generation felt back then.
I can be impressed by their performance but that doesn't mean I think the material is any good.
i really like your videos, especially from this channel. i'm a teen girl and i started getting into metal like 6 months ago and one thing i noticed is how much people love to hate things. it's like the moment a metalhead realizes they don't like a mainstream band, they think they must be sooo cool and unique because of it when it's just as shallow as liking a band bc it's popular.
🙌 THIS!!!
One thing everyone misses when talking about what NuMetal meant to us all.... it took away the "unachievability" of making great music unless everyone was a Steve Vai. It turned off great musicians who had great music in their head, but didnt have the same guitar skills as Kirk or Wylde. Thats what was so life changing for me because i had all this music in my head that I wanted to write but knew my music wouldnt sell because of the lack of skill. Once Korn broke, all of a sudden all my detuned music finally had somewhere to call home. It also helped to open up other musicians to join me in writing because they no longer felt like they were wasting their time working on music that wouldnt sell. They saw an opportunity for them to step up and show off because guitars no longer led everything all the time. You had a chance to do really nice groove building instead of having to use blastbeats for an hour straight.
i did get pissed at metalcore coming in and burning the world out on "pop turned punk" covers because that was one of my favorite things to do.
dude crossover thrash (as opposed to regular thrash metal) was already doing that it in the '80s, see Storrmtroopers of Death (almost no guitar solos) and Method Of Destruction.
Also Prong was already doing those same swaggering groove metal riffs that Korn was doing back in '92 lol
That was the only thing I ever really appreciated about the whole scene, personally. The music definitely wasn't my thing; I grew up in the Northeast US punk and hardcore scene, which was already entering its prime beatdown phase at the time, which always seemed like the authentic version of what nu metal was trying really hard to pretend to be.
But I never cared much for metal in the first place, because so much if it requires so much technicality and skill that it immediately discounts most of its audience. What really made me fall in love with punk and hardcore at such a young age was how approachable the scenes were, how little there was separating the bands from the fans. Hell, getting to open at least a few shows for the band that first got you into the scene was almost like a rite of passage at a certain point.
So while I personally found nu metal corny as hell, way too polished/overly produced, and just a really cheap knock off of the music I was already listening to, I never didn't see the appeal for certain folks. And wouldn't judge people for their taste in music, period. That's a really shitty thing to do to people just trying to enjoy themselves. Nu metal definitely wasn't for me, but neither were dozens of other genres blowing up around that same time. And I still had friends into most every one of those, too.
Idk the first part can still be a thing for many but the other one just seems like a personal issue.
my favorite quote from peter steele " dont mistake lack of tallent for genius"
Holy shit Finn thank god. It’s been a whole day since I’ve heard you talk about nu metal. I was about to break stuff
Hey now you don’t wanna be the first one to complain
😂😂😂😂😂😂 This just in - some people hate a genre of music! (Though of course Finn would say “everyone” instead of some people.”)
😂
nice one
It seems to me that the inflluences and ideas of Faith No More are completely underrated.
Maaaan, I feel like so much of certain genres like rock, country, and rap/hip hop have the most strictest gatekeepers and start the biggest hate trains. So many people are so loud about their hatred for nu-metal but when you look at the amount of streams and views and likes to a lot of the songs that are considered by in large as “cringe”, the numbers just aren’t adding up. I’m calling BS on most of those people hopping on the hate bandwagon.
I'm in my mid 40s and was in high school when Nu-Metal started popping up everywhere. Never understood why there was so much hate against it because there were so many underground Nu-Metal bands that sounded great. I've always been very open minded with music and til this very day I still go to concerts from all different metal sub-genres. Death metal, death core, black metal, metal core, industrial metal, thrash, nu-metal, etc etc. Even go to rap shows still (not mumble rap though lol).
Most of the hatedom around Nu Metal was more the third wave of it and Limp Bizkit more Fred Durst and their copycats who then went butt rock later on.
Most music critics are just hipsters who live on the West and East Coast that who don't want anything to do with the Midwest
I remember as a teen thinking that there was always a tinge of racism and classism behind some of the more extreme Nu Metal hatred. lol I remember seeing this UK blogger calling Mike Shinoda a nu-metal n-word (hard R). I wasn't surprised though, bc it was a UK blogger...
Agree and to an extent me and my Hispanic friends all got into nu metal
Lol. What the hell Mike Shinoda is half white and half Japanese.
@@ChristopherPiper-iu3ks lol it was a UK based blogger.
It's interesting that Slayer did eventually take on the influence of nu metal. You can first hear it on Diabolus In Musica, where it's kind of unconvincingly welded onto their own style, but by the following album, God Hates Us All, the influence had been incorporated organically (e.g. Threshold, and the chorus of God Send Death).
We still have gatekeeping and elitism to this day, but I'm glad for these points in this video.
Great video! Numetal will always have a place in my heart. It helped me get through being a sad and angry teen. I really like the ending expectations.
Hey, I stayed at home and listened to the Smiths. But I also dug Rage and Deftones. Still do. Plus, I grew up to become a journalist. Tastes vary in everything. Great vid Finn!
Smiths🤮
The funniest thing about this video title is that Metallica's "Sad But True" is actually a pre-cursor to Nu-Metal.
It's based around a Groove-Metal riff, and was massively popular. I think it was a real gamechanger that set the stage for the "Groove obsession" of the 90s with a lot of bands moving to either Groove Metal or Nu-Metal.
Pantera also played a huge part in that, but i guess Metallica did that to a more mainstream degree
@@laurisaarinen1126 dude metallica just slowed down what they were already playing on And Justice for All and made it simpler, Pantera was more of the true groove metal but tbh even technical thrash metal bands like Coroner went the groove metal route by '93 because more of the faster bands got sick of playing fast all the time and started to experiment more with groove along with other thrash bands like Overkill, also in '93
Metal itself had doom metal coming out in the '80s playing slow, it's just that doom metal kind of lost out somewhat to thrash because everything was getting faster and faster and moshpit culture was getting popular in the era of Jolt Cola whereas doom metal was just hearkening back to Black Sabbath and culturewise had nothing new to offer except more of the same old headbanging, even if the doom riffs were killer
Alternative metal and bands like circa-'92-and-onward-era Prong whom Jonathan Davis of Korn had mentioned as an influence were more instrumental in creating the nu-metal sound, especially the more swaggery riffs that Korn played
By that logic, Metallica's "The Thing That Should Not Be" (also D-Standard tuning, also slow tempo) is a precursor to nu-metal.
Which is completely bollocks.
I loved nu metal when it started. Korn, Deftones, Sevendust, Coal Chamber, etc. But just like all genres, at some point the record labels started manufacturing copycats of these bands and they killed the genre. It happened with grunge and it happened with pop punk and so forth.
42, loved Nu-metal since day one. The haters ended up being the actual losers, so win for us.
I remember in highschool when that first Korn album came out it was huge in Riverside CA. Everybody was listening to it. Korn, ICP, Deftones, Marilyn Manson that was the sound of the Inland empire in the late 90's.
What's up.. from Orange County...
I never got into the music...but I could recognize it for being New..
A new style.. unique to itself...
Like what you want...
I also called this era and bands..
Monster Truck Metal...
Such a necessary video, Fynn! Here in Brazil at the time they would call anyone who listened to Nu Metal as Emo, because most people simply didn't have the slightiest idea of what Emo and Nu Metal was.
Weird. Everyone that I knew that liked rock, loved Nu Metal. South African here. Big fans. Still playing it now. It's definitely the groove, the recall ability on the song. A solo is difficult to recall.
Punk Rock sponsored by Temu.
Stop watching.
That last comparison to people judging everyone based on minor differences really hit home today. Today at work our entire crew discovered we judged people on 3 criteria. You either hold a culinary degree (good/bad), you are in your position based on experience (good), or you have a culinary certificate (fucking awful).
TEMU is not punk rock wtf. I know you gotta pay the bills, but c'mon man.
I have always loved and still do love nu metal and all the other alternative metal genre.. In the mid to the end of 90's thise band sounded like they are from future, super cinematic and deeper that anything pre-grundge era..
I also remember the subgenre of Latin-tinged nu metal. Puya, Ill Nino, Forty Below Summer and of course P.O.D. and Soulfly on occasion. While I didn't really like those bands per se, I was a fan of blending jazz elements with metal so I found some of their stuff interesting. A for effort.
Love 40 Below Summer
Ill Niño!
@@stephsteph4503 oh yeah 💯
I grew up in Wyoming and was introduced to nu metal when my dad ordered some country cds from a magazine and they sent some free cds, Korn best hits vol 1, system of a down mesmerize, and stonesour
Hell yeah! I’m cracking up you mentioned Youngstown, Ohio 🤘
Yup I remember in high school, there was a huge divide between the "purist" who listened to the "big 4" ( metallica, megadeath, anthrax and slayer) and us "white trash kids" who listened to deftones, korn, limp bizcuit, static x etc etc. I mean we also listened to the big 4 as well and honestly I love all of it, but many fierce debates and minor fist fights were the norm from the mid 90s and early 00s at my school over this shit lol.
As of 2021, Korn had sold more than 40 million records worldwide.
Limp Bizkit has sold an estimated 40 million albums worldwide.
As of 2019, Slipknot has sold 30 million units of records worldwide.
Ye, looks like it.
I was very shocked when that Woodstock '99 documentary mentioned how the frat bro types all liked Korn. Where I'm from it didn't seem like the frat types like Korn, I always thought Nu Metal was mostly kind of outsider kids who didn't fit in with the frat bros and in some case some the "white trash" types. I personally thought the genre went stale around 04/05 and started gravitating more towards heavier music. I rekindled my love of thrash which I grew up listening to as a kid a bit before Nu Metal came out. I've tried relistening to Nu Metal and while I still like a small amount of it like Deftones, SOAD pre Hypnotize, and Hybrid Theory by Linkin Park I find most of it pretty bad by today's standards in the era where we saw New Wave American heavy metal and then a lot of Crossover bands starting to become the face of underground heavy metal.
Same here in Norway. Pure fans were outcasts / nomads / independents who had their own distinct identity.
With that said I don’t think I’ve ever recalled any beef between any “camps”. I was more into thrash/death/black at that time but we were hanging out with people whom favoured all kinds of genres. Regardless if it was emo, prog, brutal, heavy or punk.
Great video! (90's kid here) The part were you explained the psychology behind everything was top notch, thank you! Also I was told to listen to the ''guitar solos'', not electronic sh@t. Maybe I was that elitist kid back then, but cmon, grow up. (Zakk Wylde was so honest and respectful and understanding) Music has endless possibilities.
Temu ad? So hardcore dude. We should definitely listen to this guy about rock.
I was there for the first time round, I was (and still am) so into most of the bands from the time. I'm happy to see kids walking around these days in Deftones shirts etc.
I cant get down with Nu Metal anymore, but my hat will forever be off to Korn's self titled release.
I still want a set of bagpipes.
One of your best recent video, I like the approach!
I saw Korn open for Danzig, had no clue who they were. It blew me away. Threw their second album out the window. SOAD I like still.
I loved Korn up to Untouchables. After that something changed with their music
at 42 i feel legally obligated to comment i was around during nu metal. it was honestly kind of fun time but yes also i was a teen so the obvious connections there, i played sports in hs in the 90s and had kids of different races and backgrounds on my teams and i can assure you in the weight room when a limp bizkit or korn song came on everyone in there was hype
I was the opposite. I started with Korn, Incubus, Staind, and especially the Deftones and by 2000 abandoned it for the Velvet Underground and artists like Ziggy Stardust. After three years the formula that Korn invented became so mass produced by other second tier bands that even Korn sounded like an imitation of itself.
I remember reading somewhere that Chino said the guys from Korn would always ask the Deftones to go on tour with them. And they’d always refuse, which would piss Korn off. But the Deftones said they hated the Nu-Metal label and felt it was a fad. They didn’t want to be lumped in with that scene. They didn’t see themselves as doing the same thing. They were definitely smart to distance themselves from it.
Nu Metal was my childhood genre! Hate them or love them, admit that they're have been popular then. 😊
The final 4 minutes of this video, are why I’m subscribed and look forward to uploads. Your analysis always zooms out in such beautiful ways. Thank you man.
When nu-metal started blowing up, the reason I never really got into it was because they decided to make Fred Durst and Limp Bizkit the face of nu-metal. Manufactured commercialized pre-packaged teenage angst and permission to behave like a lout.
And I think that's where a lot of the contemporary criticisms of nu-metal came from. Keep in mind that later breakout acts like Linkin Park didn't come around until 2000, so at the time, "nu-metal", for the media and the masses, was Korn and Limp Bizkit, but mostly Limp Bizkit, and namely, Fred Durst.
Also, the term "nu-metal" wasn't really used much then. They were mostly referred to as just "rap-rock", and the assumption was that it was mostly guys rapping over chunky guitar riffs, which at the time, wasn't really appealing to anyone over the age of 18 (but it was *super* appealing to anyone 18 and under). Unlike Run DMC/Aerosmith or Public Enemy/Anthrax, these weren't collaborations of established and highly talented artists from two different genres of music, they were just a mush of mediocre talent creating a whole new genre.
How about Sepultura doing a 90 degree turn and starting numetal with bloody roots?
Keep the music conversations coming man! I may not agree with everyone on here or every thing you say. But thats the beauty of music and having a discussion. Keep it going man!
ok man
Entire History of Metallic Hardcore, Metalcore and 2000’s-2015 hardcore video essays next
I want a deep dives!
Very interesting. Personally, I felt at that time that nu-metal clothing and style were also close to the skate culture that I liked, but your analysis pretty much nails it.
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really good video as always, thanks so much!
Mid 90s teen here, and nu metal was, and still is, amazing. A lot of us grew up with thrash metal, hair metal, and grunge. While those were still around in the 90s, it's felt like we didn't have our own sound until nu metal. 16 year old me was all over KoRn, Orgy, Limp Bizkit, Deftones and so on. A lot of it still holds up today, and I still regularly listen to these bands. Some are even still really consistent with the quality of music they put out. Deftones being a stand out. So there's definitely a longevity to the genre that might've not been expected. It made history and changed metal and that to me is just proof of how important it really was.
TEMU, really? TEMU is like ordering Wish on Wish.
Ben Folds "Rockin' the Suburbs" desperately needed to be referenced in this video. 😂
"Y'all don't know what it's like! Being male, middle class, and white!"
Another insightful banger from TPRMBA!
Keep up the dope videos!
You could just as easily say each generation has their own music style they gravitate too.
When I was a teenager it was all about Hard Rock, Traditional Metal and Thrash, then Grunge hit the scene and the younger teenagers gravitated to it and turned that into a phenomenon. As Grunge died out Nu-Metal took its place as the next young generation gravitated to that.
Operating under these waves of Grunge and Nu-Metal, the Metal scene itself kept progressing along and more and more underground sub-genres were born or being improved up. Sub-Genres like Black Metal, Death Metal, Grindcore, Progressive and Power Metal, Technical Death Metal, Doom and DoomDeath Metal.
In my mind and following Metal since the late 80s, Nu-Metal was like a completely different planet more akin to Grunge than a natural appendage to the establish genres of Metal.
0:42 Nu Metal was hated by metalheads and music "critics". So, I think Emo is the most hated genre of music ever, 'cause it was hated by pretty much everybody, whether you were a rock fan or not. Any fan of any other subgenre of rock hated Emo, and fans of other genres of music that had nothing to do with rock also hated Emo. And since I was really into both Nu Metal and Emo back then, I could feel the hatred in both of them. The hatred towards Nu Metal involved racism, while the hatred towards Emo involved homophobia. I know people who got beaten up for listening to Emo music, but I don't know anyone that was physically hurt for liking Nu Metal.
Emo is the worst. I agree
That hatred for emo had nothing to do with homophobia. Emo was just seen as "for pussies" and Nu Metal was "harder". And, when comparing Dashboard Confessional and The Used to Korn and Static X, you can see why.
@@BlackHatAndy It had *everything* to do with homophobia. You have no idea how many times me, my friends and people that I didn't even know got called f@gg0t and stuff like that. If you Google search "emo and homophobia" you'll find several people talking about that, so it wasn't just a regional thing, unfortunately.
@@Vinicius_Berger I mean, we all called people that and it had nothing to do with actually being gay though. It was just an insult like any other.
Metal has it's issues with racism but so did the Emo crowd.
As a black kid growing up I felt that a big reason for all the hate was definitely race motivated. All the hate for the "rap-core" and for the "baggie jeans" was just code for "let's make metal white again". Nu-metal's appeal for me was precisely how diverse it was. While "real metal" was just white dudes with long hair that didn't want people like me at their shows, nu-metal had people of color, latinos, asian, women, straight, queer. Also the Nu-metal sound was my biggest gateway into so many different genres. Korn alone was a mix of goth frontman, funky bass, industrial guitars, hiphop drums and alt rock lyrics (most of early Korn and nu-metal is songs about being bullied by frat dudes).
How many "real" metal concerts have you gone to? I have never heard anyone or see anyone treat someone poorly, because of their race, at the countless concerts I've been to. Your race baiting and stereotyping is sad.
As one of the people against nu metal (in the 90s), my issue was exactly the opposite.
In 1992: Rage Against the Machine hit the scene with a metal/funk/hip-hop fusion, whose lyrics were calling out systemic racism, police brutality, wealth inequality, and imperialism. As a highly politically charged band, they only released an album every 4 years....this left a void in the market, and over the decade, dozens (if not hundreds) of bands labeled "nu-metal" flooded that void with a similar sound, but no real message beyond "I'm sad and angry"
Socially attuned fans of Rage saw this as a step back, and a ploy by record labels to wash RATM out of the spotlight. (They would later have their whole discography banned from public radio after 2001)
As a black kid. Yup, has to become a race issue.
I had no older siblings or cousins to introduce me to music. After buying pop records and what was on TRL, when I turned 12 and Limp Bizkit came out they were for sure almost the ONLY band I listened to. For 2 years, until Blink came out and Limewire searches of the bands they thanked in their liner notes changed my life.
This is an incredibly well, put together video. Cheers Finn
Pretty good vid. I'm an old school metalhead. I never really got into nu-metal, but I never hated it either. To me it was just another of the many branches on the metal tree.
Brilliant. Thank you for high quality content like this.
Finn, I’m sorry that you had to talk about NuMetal again…but your discussion about larger societal problems presented in this piece of history, and the educated points you share, are why I keep coming back.
Not that I don’t love the genre here, (having graduated HS in 1998). But I love your psychological and economical breakdown that encourages me to be more open-minded.
And I’m also a Kpop fan…thanks to my ex-wife, who is now also married to a Vietnamese person. 😅
I stan Blackpink over BTS. 🫢 But I’m an American, and Teddy Park is too. Like Fred Durst, he knows exactly what he is doing.
PS: I grew up in the western Washington too. And miss it terribly. Like you, I’ve spent my life living all over the U.S. And I am extremely grateful for the perspective I’ve gained from it.
Love for the fly-over states.
Great vid, you touched on all the points I would have and more. I always liked nu-metal because of the groove and attitude, even though im a hardcore thrash guy, all heavy music I support.
Great analysis! I would add the significance Grunge played on the music scene (not just Nirvana) and Pantera in the metal genre. Pantera brought those groovy sounds, those big breakdowns and also, left the makeup - tight leather for a more natural look and comfortable clothes, the ones you would use everyday. They even made Halford were baggy clothes XD
As a 34 year old that went through his formative years in the late 90s and early 00s Nu Metal plus heavy doses of Grunge and post Grunge was my music life...
I think it really connected with a lot of people from all walks of life from urban to suburban and rural who just wanted music that sounded cool and aggresive ... Me and a lot of my generation found OG hair and arena metal ridiculous and found a home in the more brooding and dark Nu Metal... I totally agree with your take that flyover midwesterners and southerners are hated and shit on constantly by society and "progressive writers" im orgainally from NYC and thus you would expect that I would have great acess to all kind of live music ... But the truth is for the music I like, I was way more likely to find it in Florida or Viginia or Ohio than NYC...
As ive grown and learned of course I can appreciate and love more technical bands like Trivium and Amon Amarth; however there will always be a place in my heart and the hearts of millions of blue collar types.. military or ex military, Law Enforcement, firefighters, tradesmen ect for Nu Metal and the raw emotion and aggression and digestibility regardless of musical education.... F the music snobs
I got to see Korn open for Sick of it all and Orange 9mm back in ‘94. I was completely blown away! Instant fan. Then they released their second album and I was over it.
I'm not sure where you are from but in Chicago, we loved when Korn broke and the following bands like Deftones and even Limp Bizkit came out. We were used to hearing new musical styles pop up and this was just another new thing for us to enjoy.
I loved hair metal in the 80’s, not a fan of thrash, but when mu metal started up, it never caught on with me and I’m fine with that. I can thank Headbanger’s Ball for introducing me to stoner rock groups like Kyuss….
Great analysis Finn! And you were spot on, how the animosity for the “new thing” called nu metal wasn’t like the metal before it, but that can’t exactly be a bad thing, just a different thing!
Korn’s debut is album is amazing. From the opening of Blind to Johnathan’s breakdown at the end of Daddy. 30 years old this year and it's influence can still be felt today.
Dude, great video. Great analysis.
I went to highschool in the late 90s and early 2000s and Nu-Metal was very popular with the people I hung around. I was always more partial to industial but I definitely had my favorite songs in the genre.
Speaking of staying home and listening to the Smiths in high school... I was also listening to At The Gates, Discharge and Sisters of Mercy while nu-metal was happening and the same beef was happening between metal, post-punk, goth, crust, street punk and d-beat. I found a group of people who really didn't care about it. It was the people running independent record stores. They just like music. I ended up getting into power pop and pub rock, glam and soul... Listen to everything. Broaden your musical pallete.
Zakk Wylde said they tried to put him in a mold like Limp Bizkit to make him more Hip Hop, I'm glad he stood his ground and disregarded it but he's still a victim of change just like everyone else. He went from bell bottoms Aquanet hair and cowboy boots to looking like an Outlaw Biker.
I have to leave a comment.
Just found out of your channel couple of hours ago.
The amount of work and information put on these videos is insane.
I might be stating the obvious, but this is free content. Quality content.
Amazing job
A great article, thank you.
I'm having a great time with this channel. Impeccable research and presentation. Are you interested in doing videos about the 'Bad Brains', 'Venom' and/or King Diamond?
I'm almost 30 (28) and definitely remember the nu metal hate from scrolling on 4chan in the late 2000s
What about Alice in Chains which they came out of the grunge era. Jerry's playing was and is somewhat complex. The music was very well thought out and executed.
you nailed it . and i would add ,when nu metal was early on, alot of us metal heads got into it ,then when it blew up and was on mtv toward the late 90s early 2000s then more common people started jumping on the band wagon
So sad and hypocritical. No one calls trashy rap music "blk trash." It saddens me how anti-wht racism is tolerated in our society. All hatred should be condemned
just brought me back to ozzfest 2000 with this! i like your vibe and channel, subbed!
You saw Ozzfest back in 200 A.D.? Wow you must be the oldest commenter here. What was it like living in ancient times?
I was 18 in 94, loved thrash pre 90s, but fell out of love with it around the time grunge hit. Pantera and White Zombie were pretty huge in that time, and I think inspired some of the NuMetal bands. Korn at the time was just a weird band to me, but I liked what I heard. I was guilty around 98 of arguing on AOL that it sucked because of the lack of solos 😂 I also still listen to SoaD a lot. Always thought the fashion styles were tacky but whatever (as I sit in my boring outfit influenced by grunge).