Retroaktiv PG-2K controller for the Roland JX-3P & MKS-30 (& all Kiwi mods) | Review/Demo
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- Опубликовано: 12 июл 2024
- The PG-2K controller from Retroaktiv can control any JX-3P. Factory 3P, Kiwi modded 3P or any 3P/MKS-30 CC modded model. In the case of the Kiwi, all Kiwi mods are supported and it makes it so much easier to use the arcane Kiwi mod.
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This unit looks amazing. The JX3P was the first synth I ever bought and is still my favorite synth today. A couple of years ago I returned home to the UK and got it out of storage to find that the internal memory had gone and that I had lost all my presets which was a shame as they featured on all my early vinyl releases. These days I have the Roland Boutique version but it's not quite the same as having the beast up and running. Cheers!
Cheers
I've been testing one of these for a few weeks now; it is superb! I agree with all of the points you make, such a great unit!
Thanks for the demonstration. That's basically everything i was looking for in a controller alternative for the JX-3P. Looks very awesome.
Cheers!
Awesome! Love the 3P, great demo of the PG-2K
Cheers!
Great Presentation Espen! Love the 3P and It opens up a new range with the PG-2K Controller! ;-) Cheers!
Cheers!
Really nice that they replicated the period Roland look too!
Great timing! Just got a JX-3P yesterday and i'm looking for a programmer right now.
I’m so proud for you that your sounds are getting bundled. Well done! Very well deserved!
Thanks Zoe! :)
My first "major" synth was a Roland JX-8P. I haven't used it in many years but I bet it still works!!! Cheers mate.......
This is FANTASTIC! I need one... for my stock 3P! Thanks Espen!
Cheers!
Awesome. I can't wait until I get mine!
Oh my! As a Kiwi-3P owner with their Patch Editor, I know how empowering these controllers are. However, the PG2K might deserve a chance. Thanks for enlightening me about it.
Cheers!
Great product, great presentation! Thank you very much!
Cheers!
This is wonderful!! I need one of these for my JX-3P!! And he makes a similar device for the DW6000 and DW8000. I guess I need both!!
Beautiful controller! I'm loving the MPG-8 for the JX-8P but this one is off the charts nice.
You have again snuck in a possible hint to a up-coming video (I hope) on the MWXT. You have the same vintage one as I have. Love those wavetable synths.
I love them too. ;-)
I've just ordered the modern incarnation of the Organix mod for my 3p. I hope (and suspect) that this would work with this. More research to follow... Thank you for this video, Espen!
For details about the controller check with Retroaktiv directly. Cheers :)
If they kept the CC IDs the same as the original, then there should be no problem.
Nice! I've been fixing up my 3P recently and thinking about a controller unit. Will give this a look
Amazing to see a new PG200 type machine, my original blew up and I managed to get another. Great review 😁
Cheers!
how does a pg blow up?
One of the chips overheat, I had smoke coming out of the buttons, I checked and others have had the same problem
@@alancheatley4378 damn fingers crossed mines not close to that point
I've put a tiny stick on heatsink on the LM311 chip lol
I had the pleasure of going to the workshop of KiwiTechnics in their early days and purchased a Patch Editor from them.
I admit previously I’ve thought the retroactiv controllers were nice quality units but overpriced for what they offer - but this unit is really impressive😮😮...adds a lot more useful features than just a lightly updated version of the original controller. Especially with the large & useful screen! Deserves to be really successful ! (& hopefully they’ll bring out future editions versions for synth I own 😁)
It's still overpriced in terms of making music with a fair amount of money.
All is relative.
@@EspenKraft Yup. You couldn't pay me to make sounds on a Kiwi-synth using the Kiwi user interface. It's insane the number of button presses that are required to do even a simple thing like change the MIDI channel.
@@retroaktivsynthesizers5075 I agree- I have one😉- love the synth but just changing arpeg clock rate etc just too complicated without a display ( never use sequencer for that reason)- hope you consider at a kiwi-106 version in future....
I have the DW8P. It would pretty cool if you could show how to create some basic user midi maps to control other synths. Just a quick run through of some basic envelopes, cutoff, resonance, levels, and changing waveforms and what not. Just basic sound shaping stuff. Thanks as always for sharing the new gear and your knowledge.
No more videos with this controller at this point. I'm sure Retroaktiv will have "tutorial" videos for the controller, but check with them on that. I just made some shots of what I like about this. To control other synths I prefer a more generic controller I can set up myself. I have such a video on my channel. Cheers :)
@@EspenKraft Thank you very much for the reply. I will be sure to look into both things. Thanks for all you do for the community. I always enjoy your videos.
Thank you for this amazing video. Btw is it really necessary to hold down a button while recording notes to the sequencer? Feels weird and unnatural to me somehow. Is there a way to do this differently and more in the flow? Thank you again sir. Can the internal sequencer still be used easily all tho the controler is running?
Thanks! Read the manual, it'll tell you exactly how to operate the sequencer. This is a very simple step sequencer and you have to combine the keyboard notes and the tie- or rest buttons to program it.
The controller can be used to edit the synth sound while the sequencer runs.
Awesome. Question, does this introduce velocity sensitivity similar to the organix mod? Thank you!
Not from the keys of course, but over MIDI.
Wonder if I can get this to control my juno di, which is very software editor dependent for making more in depth sound changes.
Cool video man. The one thing that kills the original style controllers for me is that you have to set the switch on the rear panel of the JX3-P to “Programmer” to edit a sound, and so you can’t feed the synth a MIDI sequence and edit a patch at the same time. Is this possible with the retroaktiv? I can’t find any info on this online (mine is a stock 3P by the way)
Sure you can, but you have to have a modified 3P in terms of MIDI.
@@EspenKraft ah, fair enough. Thanks for the reply
Hey there I was wondering if with this controller you still need the midi mod to use the programmer in real time on the Jx3p?
Wait, if I have a stock JX3P, does this allow me send midi from my daw so I can control with the programmer?
This thing looks **awesome**! I am curious though, why only 32k onboard? Is that like a million patches and plenty or was there a technical reason? Just asking bc memory is so cheap these days I'm sort of surprised 32k is a thing that can be bought anymore.
We use FRAM memory because it is nearly indestructible. It's not cheap like nor flash, but it is the most reliable. We didn't want to get into using memory that can develop bad sectors over time. There are different types of memory for different applications. If you look at memory for microcontrollers, it's not usually very big, ranging from a few k to a couple of megs. With NOR-FLASH and stuff like that, it gets bigger, but requires more program memory and bandwidth to maintain. For the SD and USB type of memory, yes it's cheap, but there are a lot of requirements that a small microcontroller-based system like PG-2K can't handle. In terms of the types of memory used with a system like ours, something that's small like 32k can cost a few bucks for a single memory chip.
hi Espen with the upgrades can I still use the original pg 200 for the non kiwi stuff? for example the filter cut of
I don't get what you mean? You mean using the PG-200 with a Kiwi update? The PG-200 cannot be used on a Kiwi updated JX-3P.
so with the kiwi the pg200 no longer works for nothing? not even for the original parameters for example opening the filter?
No. It canot be used anymore on that synth.
As the original JX3p cannot recive midi CC, Can you send midi CC to the retroactive to change the stock jx3p parameters as a work around for the old system?
Sort of. Check the manual for the PG-2K, page 29. CC TO PG-200 TRANSLATE
I hope Retroaktiv re-release the MPG-50 and MPG-70 with this larger more usable display!!
We did release MPG-50 mkII with a larger display. The new MPG-70 units also have this larger display. Sadly, there is not room for the really big OLED on those 2 units without significantly increasing the size of the units. Moving forward, I'm trying to only use the big OLED shown on the 2K.
Just curious about the name "Kiwi Mod". Does that mean that the person/company that does this comes from New Zealand (my country)?
Well, they're a very well known company that makes a lot of mods (boards and otherwise) for many classic synths. They are indeed from New Zeeland. Auckland.
www.kiwitechnics.com/about.htm
The manual states "The PG-2K sequencer will not work with stock JX-3P, as the stock unit does not have support for MIDI or PG-200. " Does it not work with the stock JX-3P sequencer? It looks like you said it would at 5:32
Any questions in regards to the PG-2K must be addressed Retroaktiv directly.
The stock 3P sequencer is not midi addressable, which means the PG-2K has no way of programming that on a stock 3P.
So are you now recommending the Kiwi3P mod...? You were pretty clearly against it in your previous video! What changed your mind?
This video was made before the "warning" video. This video is about the controller. And it works on the Kiwi mod. And stock. A big selling point for the maker of the controller. I don't talk about my feelings for the Kiwi mod in this video, I just point out the facts about the controller and what it will do. ;-)
@@EspenKraft Ah, I should have checked the dates on the videos! I assumed that they were made in the order that I watched them - my mistake! I just picked up a 3P with PG200 and I love it, but I want to be able to send midi notes AND tweak the knobs. Looks like I need something like the Organix or Tauntek mod…
Aaaaah, the glorious 12-bit sound of the early 80's. Why can't modern gear offer at least the option to switch to 12-bit?
I've always wondered whether just replacing the modern DAC with a 8/12-bit like the one on the JX-3P would give you that instant 80's sound. Or would the CPU calculations preceding the DAC also need to be 12-bit?
That wouldn't work. The DAC in the case of the 3P is only controlling the resolution of the sliders. The waveforms on this are not wavetable based, so the DAC resolution doesn't have anything to do with them or what you hear, beyond the resolution of the LFO waveforms and the envelopes. If you wanted a "12-bit sound", then something like the DSS-1 would be an example of a device that uses 12-bit samples, where you actually do hear the 12-bit quality.
@@retroaktivsynthesizers5075 Well, I did check the JX-3P architecture before posting. The CPU is directly linked to the DAC. The DAC processes the digital output of the CPU with either 8-bit of 12-bit precision.
Starting from a 32- or 64-bit CPU in today's world, why would it not be possible to make that CPU send 12-bit values to a 12-bit DAC?
@@jacquesmertens3369 You can use a 12 bit dac with a 32 or 64 bit CPU. I misread the comment and thought you were talking about replacing the DAC in the synth itself.
Will I be able to use this controller with the bare 3P with no kiwi mods?
Of course.
Almost a hydrasynth😂
Wish it worked for the 8p
They have other controllers for that.
The MPG-8 is what you're looking for, and it looks like it's still on sale.
No way would I pay $650 for this. I want a knob box for my ESQ-1, and Stereoping has one for ~$500. Forget it. I'll wait for Behringer to release their BCR replacement for $150.
No one will force you to buy it. ;-)
Despite what people think, the BCR-2000 will not work for a good number of Kiwi parameters, especially anything requiring bidirectional communication. And functions like the envelope mod select (Where you've got to select the envelope, the polarity, and the envelope amount separately) will take up a full page of knobs there. We've done a lot of streamlining to the interface, where 2+ parameters will be combined on a single control (Like the bipolar env amount sliders), which allows us to have a fairly uncluttered control surface and user interface. There is a lot going on behind the scenes here to make this a seamless control surface. That's why it took almost 2 years of coding to do it. We're supporting 6 separate synths, each with its own CC, sysex, and DAT(Bank/object dump/receive) format. It's not just a control surface. It deals with everyaspect of the MIDI implementation for all of these. If we just wanted a bunch of knobs on a box, then yes, it could be done cheaper. But for something this complex with the amount of features it has, is going to be priced higher, and we're also catering to a very niche market here. If you're interested in seeing everything this unit does (Most features are not covered in this video), the manual is posted on the page that Espen has linked to. If you compare the available programmers feature by feature, I know of none that have the feature set the PG-2K has. I understand the price isn't for everyone. Luckily, there's plenty of other options, including free iPad editors. It just depends on what you want and need.
Your hands aren't in sync with your voice. It's infuriating:)
Fury has a lot of energy.