The Most Controversial Mechanic In Guilty Gear (Again)
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- Опубликовано: 30 июл 2024
- #fightinggames #guiltygear #guiltygearstrive
If there's one thing Guilty Gear players are talking about, it's about how much the new mechanic, Wild Assault, has changed the game for the worse. Let's look at the mechanic, what people don't like about it, and what could be done.
0:00 - intro
0:39 - last patch and a quick review
3:16 - why people wanted nerfs
4:50 - is this fixed?
6:30 - the new complaint
10:18 - shouold they do anything?
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Игры
maybe Assaults could be tweaked on character basis. If the range of white is too much for Goldlewis but Potemkin maybe needs it, then just make it shorter for Goldlewis.
Exactly
pot's WWA actually had less range then goldlewis last patch that was changed this patch
I would assume what the patch WOULD DO in the first place???
Character specific mechanics isn't something strive does, so unlikely we'll go back to old GG things like that
Nah Goldlewis needs this. It's not fair that bridget, testament, and happy chaos mains have the ability to quite literally keep him from getting in as all times
White WA is his only forward advancing move that.
Nago has dash, potemkin has his tackle, bedman has his spin.
And despite it having invincibility, it's not even frame 1 you could literally hit him out of it.
I cannot contain my excitement to watch players wait a whole patch just for blue Wild Assault to be broken next.
Same, it's just gonna move around every patch
Yea…it’s kind of annoying. You got to love patch culture. I actually love this version of GG, but I f they decide to buff blue WA, that would make my Faust happy😂.
Fausty wausty will win again
I'm cool with that since I play Elphelt/Brisket lmao
Feels intentional
Wild Assault 2: electric boogaloo
I think it's definitely a much better experience then it was before. I see why this change does super juice gold Lewis and give Nago yet another super strong option.
But Pot and Bed kinda need some help. Those 2 have struggled quite a bit so having a strong option to close the gap is nice. I think they should start adjusting per character instead of just color overall.
I think this version is much more balanced and the overall nerf to possitive really makes the game feel much better and pressure the attacker to make something happen after wall break.
That said, goldlewis makes me want to evaporate from the world.
In a game where neutral skips are everywhere, I think wild assault can be overwhelming. But sometimes gives characters the option to use burst for other options which can be better than doing an offensive burst. Like I would argue 2 uses of WWA vs Axl is better than using burst offensively to keep him from converting a close range hit into putting you full screen all over again.
Some characters benefit from it more than others (like Goldlewis) and i think the devs should try balancing it amongst characters by making them less homogenous (which is a recent balance direction that I feel like the devs are going away from like getting rid of weight classes and making everyone the same weight).
I do think using burst as a resource for something else besides risc/damage/tension IS quite interesting, and probably one of the most interesting new ideas in this game.
WWA helps Bedman a lot, I’m loving it so far.
Hey, what is the name of the mod that youre using to view frame data on moves in training mode?
current version of the game definitely reined things in nicely
i'm surprised they weren't more heavy handed with RWA but considering how nerf heavy this patch was overall, i guess its fair that seemed cautionary about it
im a little annoyed that sol seems to be going back to the relative state he was in at the end of s2 but he's still in a better way rn both in terms of character feel as well as balance relative to the rest of the roster than he was at the end of s2 so there's that.
very glad i have actual roundstart options against nago and that HC got shot
concerned about what arcsys decides to nerf on sol in the coming patch (in march i think???) unless they actually decide to finally hit clean hit HVV in which case it was a very, *very* long time coming
Never seen any big body use wild assault so to me it's a non issue. However, does the Nerf to red wa mean you can't use it in specific combos anymore? I was working on a Gio Combo that uses it to gain corner to corner carry with wall break and it would suck if all the time spend learning that is wasted now.
for me it's only certain characters that WA feels bad on. all the white wild assault characters feel fine until they use it as an advancing dp and get hard oki, them just tossing it out on block and using the plus frames feel fair, even for gold lewis. But now that those players are getting smart about using it, using the quick one instead of charging it, potemkin players do white wild assault at round start and then hard guessing and using potemkin buster, it's not that fun, you can tell very strong white WA character players are using it like the OP move it is now.
I just wish you retained burst meter when you land a blue burst, like before in season 2. It would make the snow ball effects from WA less common, if you had more opportunity to get out of it. Very frustrating that they changed that.
I wish we had a separate meter that's just blue burst lmao.
Since burst refill is faster now, doing half full probably is too much, but do it like a positive bonus where the refill for limited time is increased
Way better than last patch. Even at like floor 9 where I was the red wild assault meta was pretty annoying and boring. Obviously as a Bed main I think this patch is good lol but even objectively speaking it feels way better, sans Goldlewis stock rising.
There's still some problems with WA, positive and RC creating a critical mass of too much offense, but it isnt quite as game deciding and oppressive, and deflect shield being better helps find spots to interact with seemingly infinite pressure.
Positive atm is much more char specific than before, which I think is nice.
i like the game a lot right now. WA is fun and now that the burst reduction/positive gain/red is all more reasonable i really have no complaints, since i can still be a red wa -> fafnir on block clown with sol and my options with anji don't feel quite as limited as before. white WA jumpscares from goldlewis are eh, but nago was jumpscarey anyway and i want potemkin players to be happy even though i'm not one of them. i can't really complain much about it only feeling like a negative for a single character compared to like, half the roster as it was before. people are being a bit dramatic.
i'd assume bedman? players are happy to but i never run into them. are they happy? did it help?
Personally speaking, Bedman players are very happy. We’re having the same amount of fun (appeal of maining a low tier) but are winning more haha
I would like for white wild assault's flash to happen frame 1 so it's a lot more reactable and doesn't necessarily change the balance of the game, by the time the sfx and flash happens and you react to it it's already too late to input anything, but if you look at the startup of the animation frame by frame there's about 4-6 frames of nothing before it, which is kind of annoying, this could also go for all the other wild assaults tbh, besides that I think strive is in a great spot, everyone has counterplay and no one really breaks the game too crazily, even Nago who's extremely strong this patch is much more deal-withable than the previous top tiers that had dominated the game
Something crazy was how I tried looking at the burst gauge and still couldn't react ;;
While not a competitive player, I definitely felt like this current patch is very nice in his it feels like there aren’t ‘useless’ low tiers and ‘godlike’ high tiers. The difference has been further decreased.
Only thing that’s confusing is how the lower tiers (not bad by any means) have stayed relatively the same, as if they just don’t want those characters to be seen as very good.
The only other thing I really really want is then to continue implementing more moves for characters, especially base roster. Or rework certain moves slightly.
I say this because with how fun they designed the dlc characters, I feel like to a certain level, that should be incorporated in the base roster as well.
One slight rework I want is Ky’s DI (Ky main here). The issue is, I don’t know how it should be done. It is quite literally in most higher levels, not as useful as an option than using RC for mix up or something. But at the same time, increasing the health limit could make Ky too strong with his chip damage.
Maybe they could actually rework the way ky plays with DI beyond damage, speed, frame buffs (yes, there’s some extra stuff as well). Change his heavy hadouken be like the dust version in Xrd? Give him additional normals from Xrd (people have made mods that make Ky Xrd version)? Or maybe supers have different properties beyond higher damage? Something that makes DI not only useful, but memorable.
And obviously, I want this applied to the other characters that need it. Like May is very fun, but she and many characters feel like they’re missing that one thing to make them standout (and I don’t think her dolphin cancel is that, but it is useful)
i havent played GGST in a minute, but i was like oh, GL and Pot having it isnt the end of the world, it's like, strong but fine, then you said nago had WWA, why the hell would they give that to nago of ALL characters
u said only four characters have red wild assault at 11:04, think u meant white
My big issue is the insane burst generation we've got now that WA removes hardly any burst gage. It doesn't feel right that you can read the burst, block it appropriately and win the round but your opponent is already at 75+ gage. Characters with weaker midscreen conversions are heavily disadvantaged by the extra burst generated from wall sticks. It also gives a massive advantage to one player in round 3 unless the player who won round 2 was able to do it without using burst or WA.
All I'm reading is that it's either good, or just what it always was? Round 2 burst usage was always something you had to keep in mind since day 1 of the game. Also no one liked the WA removing enough gauge to not have an out.
Tbh, when it comes to Strive I was hoping they'd push the individual mechanics of each character more instead of going for more universal options. At least some characters get one new special in the coming year but I always felt like the linear gameplan and homogenized characters compared to previous titles was Strive's biggest issue.
We've seen in many FGs which focus on system mechanics that it often comes down to who among the cast makes the best usage of those universal mechanics instead of more unique character traits themselves. SF6 falls into this category and also Strive but with the latter I had the hope in 2019 that they'd somehow make up for that during its lifespan.
Approaching Strive's fourth year I'm kinda bummed out that this probably won't happen anymore.
I'm starting to accept that this game just isn't for me, and that I should probably just get into SF for a more footsie-based game. I just wish that the offense in SF was a bit more interesting than boiling down to strike throw for most characters.
Its a poorly designed game and its undeniable at this point but ppl will come flocking to the defense of it like sheep.
Boot up some Granblue Rising
try gran blue bro. its a good balance of this game and sf i feel. and its free to try
You can attempt to play neutral in SF6 but beware of DI. It's a mechanic you need to have reaction time in order stop your opponent from skipping neutral. You could set up a frame trap or try to shimmy your opponent but the fact that DI is fast enough to fuck up your commitment to a combo string or oki setup feels scrubby.
Genuinely feel like I fight system mechanics more in SF than the actual characters.
But if you want a really neutral based game play try for GranBlue Rising it's really good with only like 2 or 3 outliers.
As a casual I'm def enjoying this patch. I main Nago with zato and Baiken on the side but with all my characters I feel like I can win games and have fun while doing it.
If they nerf WWA, all i ask is you give GL an actual advancing move that's not tied to his burst or meter. He's the only heavy without a forward lunging move, and I refuse to be in a position where Happy Chaos, Brigette, Tesatment, etc. can keep GL out while also being able to approach on a whim when I don't have 50 burst for WWA.
Even among the heavy characters, GL does not have a forward advancing move. (Nago has dash, Bedman has spin, Pot has tackle and brakes)
GL needs WWA for some way to approach and not get his normals hit outside his range by most of the cast.
only if they give GL drone back and reduce drone and 6h startup by 20 frames
Why do people call the "Red" wild assault red if its orange?
why is red hair red and not orange?
@@user-cc3ef7qh1x what?
Red is the official name, for some reason.
5:42 how does the CH effect the launcher?!?!
Lingering slow down effect from the Counterhit extends the hitstun/Hitstop and reduces gravity of follow up attacks, I'm not 100% certain on the values but the stronger the level of the Counterhit the longer the effect lingers.
I love Goldlewis. His design being scary without forcing armor into the kit was cool design. I really do not think this mechanic is fun at all, just makes characters more similar in gameplan and rounds less interactive. Its kinda fun of course but I really hope it is not a forever in the game mechanic.
Not really a problem, if zoners can burst to send you to the other side of the screen, the heavy bois should have a way to dash. Burst is a finite resource.
I still enjoy the game, but I am tired of and done trying to understand some of ASW's choices with balancing characters. I'm tired of characters like Nago and Ram who have always been strong getting no nerfs or nerfs that come with buffs to other things keeping them high tier. While they give other characters nothing or insignificant changes or at worse nerf characters who didn't deserve it.
a guilty gear game where the power level of charecters arent close like that is just a guilty gear game. nago isnt as crazy as he use to be but hes still a "one shot charecter" once you understand that you cant just play for fun. im just glad hc got nerfed so we dont have to watch evo with him spaming to win. maybe asuka could but hes no were as cringe
hey LK have you been playing some granblue lately?
granpoo stinks
hes waitng for 2b
Let Goldlewis have something, he needs SOMETHING to move with HC as a matchup.
I personally think wild assault should not take away opponent burst gauge. Strive is already a 2 combo game if you optimize, and taking burst away screws the defender more than the fact that they are already on defense in GG
Alternatively if the damage was lowered a bit such that strive was a 3 combo game instead of a 2 combo game, being able to lock someoens's burst wouldn't be that oppressive. I just particularly hate checkmate scenarios. It doesn't feel good to hold onto burst after getting combo'd once and then get WA'd and die anyway
I dont even think the wild assaults need to be tweaked per character, instead just change the characters that benefit from it the most to be balanced in the way the devs were originally intending, like: nerf nago's other options that do similar things.
White WA is so broken on Goldlewis. I have a friend who play him. He can use it 3 time by round. And if counter you in the air with it its a free combo.
I play on the regular against a good (better than me honestly) Goldlewis player, I'm trying to main Elphelt right now so in some ways matches go better for me than when I played Sol but White WA really makes me go "don't blame the beast, reflect on yourself".
WA made the game worse. It is such a frustrating mechanic to face and leads too hard into looping hkd wallbreaks and pressure off of random normals
Thankfully most of the updated versions have been making the game better, it's not perfect but the overall balancing has generally improved. Here's hoping to more consistent updates.
Overall the patch is awesome, I am back into the game in a big way. But yeah goldlewis is true silly mode right now
Since they nerfed the Sol several times in a row I stopped playing Strive, this wall-busting meta made me drop the game
please make blue WA super broken next so budget can be a menace again plase arcsys
The bed stays winning
Neutral skip strive: overwhelming assault
i mean, the move isn't called "Reasonable Assault."
we were better off when OWA was the broken one
I miss Gatling man
Am I hearing wild assault, wall assault or something else? I swear my hearing and deciphering is fucked up right now.
It's wild assault
Hey, Tekken player here. I started playing GG two years ago and im convinced that this game is for people that want a roster of "almost broken" characters which can get boring fast.
i miss s2
CAN'T DODGE THIS!
STRIKE THROUGH! (I hate pot)
Im sorry I cant get past the use of "it could spell your doom"
is there a guilty gear mechanic that isn’t controversial
Just Block?
@@dragonic22 it was controversial for being bit too hard.
Pot can combo his white
As a nago player I can see why people complain about white wild assault. I think that it should less be used as a pressure tool after a block string and more of a tool that helps in match ups like hc asuka and axl.
Beyond overall white WA nerfs (of which I saw coming from its initial release), I would personally hope they make the charged version the only one that can hard kd after wall splat, and make it cost 3/4s your burst instead of half.
You are a crazy person
@@serius9894 uh, alright
White is too much for anji to handle.
I can't lie, I don't even know if WWA is the most controversial thing anymore with how many people are bitching about RISC now
You could have just said "fighting game players complain" and just ended the video, and I would've liked the video.
They do animate awkwardly lmao.
On one hand fuck nago and Goldlewis, on the other hand pot and bedman kinda need the extra help. So either only nerf it for those two or give pot and bed more buffs to compensate if all 4 WWAs are getting nerfed.
As a goldlewis main we need this to get in. Not fair that all other heavy characters in this game have at least 1 forward lunging move that not tied to WWA.
Goldlewis literally has to run in to start his pressure as a heavy and make sure he's keeps on you in order to win games. Bedmans and literally zone a GL player if they wanted to. Pot has a high damaging command grab and Nago is Nago.
GL players have done nothing wrong to deserve any nerfs when literally all characters have better mobility than him.
I’ve been a white wild assault hater since day 1 I knew it was a matter of time before people got annoyed by it
I'm kinda glad ASW decided to make Strive deeply unfun for me in S3, it made me start playing Xrd again (I started a little in the rollback beta, again for a little with the rollback release) and I have to say I'm having so much fun with that game.
Hopefully ASW will finally come right with Strive (and add Jam) and I can come back again.
For now, I'll keep working on Xrd, it's hard but rewarding and the beginner activity these days feels pretty high (for a game that doesn't generally over over 100 average daily active users)
new offensive mechanic? more like new offensive mechanic
I'm just a hater and hate big body characters so whenever they're eating good I'm annoyed
Goldlewis main here, for the most part a large portion of the Goldlewis community would agree with WWA being too strong and would be happier with the pre-patch version of it.
Nah they took away drone and now they trying to take away our only forward advancing move that not even invincibility frame 1?
Why would any Goldlewis player purposely want to get nerfed 😂?
He blinks so often in videos but at tournament he's fine.
what a weird thing to comment on
I have lost all interest in strive until they add Jam, the online lobbies are a joke and there's nothing there for me that's worth dealing with this WA nonsense or top tiers that have been eating glue since day one, still happy for the people that enjoy it.