Cor that's nice 😃I didn't realise it had a MK1 one National engine in there ! Brings back memories of the bus firm I worked at in the late 1990's. They had a few T reg Nationals, from 1979, so they were approaching twenty years old by then and none of those were keen on starting up after being stood in the yard all night. Sometimes the battery went flat with all the exertion and I hated giving them such a hard time firing up, as, ideally, they should have been heading into preservation. (sadly the national lottery failed to come up with my set of numbers - I'm still waiting now, lol) Once they managed to start though, they were lovely to drive in spite of their age. I feel fortunate, to have been in the right place at the right time to enjoy them 🙂
Never good to keep pushing the starter when the engine doesn’t want to start immediately. Push the starter button for 10 seconds maximum, release the button and try again after another 10 seconds. You’ll see cold starts will go easier. Besides, the starter motor isn’t overheating and will last so much longer. Do not overrev a cold diesel, never do it like in the vid. And, the 0.510 didn’t kill Leyland. Leyland killed itself due to mismanagement in the Ivory Tower(s). Something almost the entire British car industry suffered from at the time. This railcar in essence is a National Mk.1. Hence the 0.510.
Hear hear well said! Starter motors are so designed to be operated a few SECONDS & that is why they have no cooling arrangements on them like built in fans, cooling holes or fins. They draw as much as 400 amps plus from the battery & hence the thick, heavy duty cable used, the seperate solenoid switch & the 4 brushes they have inside them too. Over revving a cold diesel engine is a complete no-no, there is no need for it & frankly it achieves absolutely nothing whatsoever in the long run except future damage to engine.
Eventually evolved into the pacer train we all know and love! The 0510 engine didn’t end up in it though, I’m guessing the 0680 or the TL11. Someone more informed will enlighten us.
@@willswheels283 That is not the point! You don't take it out on the engine like that just because it took its time to fire on all cylinders, no need for it at all! You will wreck the engine eventually if you keep doing this to it, not funny or clever whatsoever!
The tl11 leyland engine takes forever to start anyway like the leyland 510. 680 is better at starting which they used in the earlier first gen dmu's. Cummins like the pacer and sprinters are alot easier to start maintain and keep running. Hence why they put cummins in all the pacers apart from 140 and 141 except 141113 which has the cummins. Its the only class 141 with a cummins and only one in preservation due to the others being a leyland engine pain in the ass to maintain
That is sure excessive! That starter motor must have been pretty warm & batteries half discharged when engine did fire up & then the engine was revved hard straight from cold! The worst thing you can do to any engine surely! These engines had no glow plugs fitted originally.
Surely that is the worst possible thing to do is to rev the guts out of a cold engine like that when it did eventually start & bearing in mind there were probably no glow plugs fitted. Not a clever or funny thing to do to any cold engine be it a petrol or diesel engine, you'll wreck it in no time if you keep on doing that to it every time from cold! Am glad the batteries were in a very good state of charge to power the starter motor that length of time it was energized, by the time the engine fired I bet that starter motor would have been pretty warm to the touch & the batteries must have been pretty drained by at least half! Hope those batteries got a good charge from the dynamo/alternator!
A train that looks like a bus! Must have been very rare even back in the day.
my word that really didn't want to start! Fascinating sounds. Would love to hear it in motion too....
Cor that's nice 😃I didn't realise it had a MK1 one National engine in there ! Brings back memories of the bus firm I worked at in the late 1990's. They had a few T reg Nationals, from 1979, so they were approaching twenty years old by then and none of those were keen on starting up after being stood in the yard all night. Sometimes the battery went flat with all the exertion and I hated giving them such a hard time firing up, as, ideally, they should have been heading into preservation. (sadly the national lottery failed to come up with my set of numbers - I'm still waiting now, lol)
Once they managed to start though, they were lovely to drive in spite of their age. I feel fortunate, to have been in the right place at the right time to enjoy them 🙂
It was trialled in the US as well!
Ah, yes, the classic Leyland National startup sound. Brings back childhood memories!
Never good to keep pushing the starter when the engine doesn’t want to start immediately. Push the starter button for 10 seconds maximum, release the button and try again after another 10 seconds. You’ll see cold starts will go easier.
Besides, the starter motor isn’t overheating and will last so much longer. Do not overrev a cold diesel, never do it like in the vid. And, the 0.510 didn’t kill Leyland. Leyland killed itself due to mismanagement in the Ivory Tower(s). Something almost the entire British car industry suffered from at the time. This railcar in essence is a National Mk.1. Hence the 0.510.
Hear hear well said! Starter motors are so designed to be operated a few SECONDS & that is why they have no cooling arrangements on them like built in fans, cooling holes or fins.
They draw as much as 400 amps plus from the battery & hence the thick, heavy duty cable used, the seperate solenoid switch & the 4 brushes they have inside them too.
Over revving a cold diesel engine is a complete no-no, there is no need for it & frankly it achieves absolutely nothing whatsoever in the long run except future damage to engine.
Looks like an advanced prototype Russian people carrier.
A Leyland national train!
Eventually evolved into the pacer train we all know and love! The 0510 engine didn’t end up in it though, I’m guessing the 0680 or the TL11. Someone more informed will enlighten us.
O.510 Leyland I'm guessing?
You're right. Probably the only rail vehicle to have this type of engine. Fine on a bus, but underpowered on a railbus because of its extra weight.
So... a minute of constant starter motor followed by full throttle?! Poor engine- no wonder it struggles to start! :-/
Chris Richmond I think all that cranking would have circulated the oil around the engine by the time she fired up though.
@@willswheels283 That is not the point! You don't take it out on the engine like that just because it took its time to fire on all cylinders, no need for it at all!
You will wreck the engine eventually if you keep doing this to it, not funny or clever whatsoever!
The tl11 leyland engine takes forever to start anyway like the leyland 510. 680 is better at starting which they used in the earlier first gen dmu's. Cummins like the pacer and sprinters are alot easier to start maintain and keep running. Hence why they put cummins in all the pacers apart from 140 and 141 except 141113 which has the cummins. Its the only class 141 with a cummins and only one in preservation due to the others being a leyland engine pain in the ass to maintain
Revving an engine right after a cold start? Yeah sure, that‘s how they last longer.
Exactly! The worst possible thing you can do to any cold engine be it petrol or diesel! Eventually they will go BANG if you keep on doing that!
Did lev1 ever run a regular service on the mainline or did it just serve as a prototype?
Yep - early 1980 it ran along the East Suffolk Line between Ipswich and Lowestoft.
Birth of the pacer
Just to prove it's a national on a freight car body, they stick a 510 engine in it.
Brilliant
Could of primed it first before burning the starter motor out like that.
There isn't many of these left because of this reason
That is a bit excessive, I think maybe the glow plugs are dead. prime before trying to start.......
No glow plugs on these. compression only. hot days fine, wintry mornings no hope. Always wondered how wiring never melted.
That is sure excessive! That starter motor must have been pretty warm & batteries half discharged when engine did fire up & then the engine was revved hard straight from cold!
The worst thing you can do to any engine surely! These engines had no glow plugs fitted originally.
Didn't that use to be a Leyland National?
Yes it did, it was the pacer prototype
Yep pacers are basically buses onto old carriage chassis, terrible things if you ask me.. 😲
@@Z_eroR sounds nice though
@@grahamemmett I guess idfk
@@Z_eroR but pacers don't have bogies like a carriage just fixed wheels.
a mitey triump of british engineering.
Looks like a bus made into a rail car.
That is exactly what it is
Sounds like a 510, the engine that killed Leyland.
Thrust bearing sounds a bit dry !!! Needs a good clearout
Ouch. Poor starter... at least give her a bit of heat down the intake manifold...
Train bus!
You have been drinking water.
The poor Lucas starter motor.
Surely that is the worst possible thing to do is to rev the guts out of a cold engine like that when it did eventually start & bearing in mind there were probably no glow plugs fitted.
Not a clever or funny thing to do to any cold engine be it a petrol or diesel engine, you'll wreck it in no time if you keep on doing that to it every time from cold!
Am glad the batteries were in a very good state of charge to power the starter motor that length of time it was energized, by the time the engine fired I bet that starter motor would have been pretty warm to the touch & the batteries must have been pretty drained by at least half!
Hope those batteries got a good charge from the dynamo/alternator!