One of the dark sides of the Rebel Alliance was the type of Rebel cell. If an Imperial was taken prisoner, that depends on what type of cell that took you. There are some Rebel groups that will not take prisoners. For example, the Free Ryloth Movement killed every Imperial they found, even if they were unarmed. Some cells will torture you and then kill you.
@@luulasmene7786 that isn't right bro. It will only justify when Vader, Death Troopers, shadow troopers, and stormconmandos slaughter them. Mon Mothma was right, you have to be different than your enemies if you want to achieve peace. Otherwise the cycle of hate and murder will continue
There’s also the story of TK-462, who lost his sister to the hands of rebels stealing from his farm. They attempted to steal air scrubbers from his family, and when it failed, his sister was crushed to death under them.
That’s the thing about rebellions. Often the reason people join a faction isn’t based on belief or anything deep but rather joining the faction opposed to the one that hurt you or your people/family
Yup. It’s just a cycle of revenge. Nothing to do with good and bad. Merely my tribe trying to survive and be dominant and being involved in a reciprocal battle of revenge and dominance with your tribe. Rebels are little fucks just like the empire. It’s just that the empire are the guys in control. So the underdogs are always rooted for because they’re the “disadvantaged” group.
"Good people, remarkable people are killed meaninglessly. That's war, and that's terrorism. The sin of wars and terrorism, in the end, comes down to that." - Yang Wenli
Andor is really good, and it makes me wish there was a mich greater variety in the star wars shows we have. Gritty war dramas, adventure shows, horror specials. The star wars universe can host them all, not just «the mandalorian-esque».
I think this new year (when Im writing this comment) their going to focus on expanding their current show in the early year. Then later on they will add new shows.
Sadly people like Luthens assistant r needed to keep the cause going and to keep people in check and to do things that r sadly needed for certain types of missions sadly.
@@Kolokommouna true I only say sadly is due to those type of people willing to sacrifice anyone and anything even if that person is an ally but u r right it is necessary and unfortunate.
It’s the dark truth of the Alliance. The heroic freedom fighters we seen in the movies managed to get there, no small thanks to the people like the Partizans. The ones who’s willing to cross any bridge,commit any crime and kill anyone in the name of Victory.
I think the darkest moment was when the rebels threatened to kill the commander’s wife and son. It shows that they were ready to kill two defenceless civilians just to get what they wanted done.
I'd say it was less of a dark hidden truth and more of a brutal reality. The Rebels were always going to have to commit questionable things because they had no choice if they wanted to win, the difference between the Rebels and the Partisans was morality where the Rebels always tried to preserve them while the Partisans sacrificed them to achieve goals. There was no rule playing, especially as the Empire was not going to play by the rules under Palpatine. In fact, those that did try to play by the rules in the Empire and be genuinely good people who wanted to bring order were often fucked over because of many in the Imperials upper ranks and even below, hence why so many just decided to join the Rebels. Really you could make a parallel video looking at the good members of the Empire and how they were screwed over by their own ranks because they didn't want to do atrocities, didn't want to commit violence, disliked the criminal corruption that existed within the ranks, and etc. The Empire did promise peace, order, and security but often delivered on the opposite.
With hindsight (imagine having this written a year ago), it represents Ukrainians, they do the best they can, and they try to be a better person than the Russian prisoner, but there is hatred and passion. War is not a game, it's a prison.
One kind of rebellion I haven't seen before, but would be really interesting is a rebellion against Palpatine, not to restore democracy, but to depose him so that he could be replaced with a trustworthy and compassionate emperor. A rebellion that is firmly against the Rebel Alliance, anti-Palpatine, but not necessarily anti-Empire. I imagine their tactics would be more covert and focused on espionage and assassination to get results than guerilla warfare and revolution, a "shadow war"; and it's members would be thousands of double-agent stormtroopers, army and navy officers, ISB and intelligence officers, and such.
The comics are doing a big saga focusing on Crimson Dawn (from Solo) with Qira trying to stop the Sith. You should give it a look. Her methods actually tick most of the things you mentioned.
There’s a story about normal farmer boy who just wanted to live his life until a bunch of rebels killed his family and taking his family’s food for their war effort. Overcome with grief, rage and hatred he joined the storm trooper corps to kill rebels he later died to a rebel girl child soldier. He laugh in irony he and the child are the same.
The Rebel Alliance was facing the strongest military might that the Galaxy has ever seen, and there are no doubt that many Rebel Cells were more akin to Terrorists rather than the freedom fighters.
While that was probably true, the Rebel Alliance was formed from the groups that at least publicly rejected that sort of behavior. The Partisan Front and others were never officially in the Rebel Alliance because they were more like Terrorists than Freedom Fighters.
I was going to say this as well. No doubt many rebellions, carried out by well-meaning people who were fighting a just war, still ended up themselves doing objectionable things.
The irony of all is that when you stop to think about it, whether or not you say you did the right thing in the end there will still be a backlash that you still didn't take into account. Or sometimes even though you might be doing something great, there will be always someone working behind the scenes that exploits you.
Look at fury in where the ss officer was executed just for being ss, there is also story of American national guard unit commiting war crime and patton brushed it under carpet He told them to kill them all
For me, it Rogue one is the only Star Wars movie that Disney has made that didn’t leave me pissed. They really dropped with ball with the sequel trilogy, it was just so jammed packed full of stupid stuff, and rehashed plots from the original that I didn’t even like the fan service stuff. I mean visually the movies are awesome, but they felt like the Indiana Jones crystal skull movie, all fluff and crazy impossible stuff, way too much fan service way too little story. What little story there was completely betrayed the movies that had come before.
I must say, I love how the music plays through your intro. It adds to the flow of the content and it just feels right. Please, keep this style 🙏 As always, your videos are awesome. Huge fan!
Yes, please list them, in both legends & canon. Also, after that, various forms of infighting, primarily within the Galactic Empire & Rebel Alliance (I remember some from playing the PC Flight Sims _TIE Fighter_ & _X-Wing Alliance_ )…
Now to be fair, the destruction of the Second Death Star was truly a terrible thing, because of something Randall from the movie Clerks pointed out about it. Randall: The first Death Star was manned by the Imperial Army. The only people on board were Stormtroopers, Dignitaries, Imperials. So when they blew it up, no problem, evil is punished. The second time around it wasn't even done being built yet it was still under construction. So a construction job of that magnitude would require a hell of a lot more manpower than the Imperial Army had to offer. I'll bet they brought independent contractors in on that thing; plumbers, aluminum siders, roofers. In order to get it built quickly and quietly they'd hire anybody that could do the job. You think the average Sstoormtrooper knows how to install a toilet main. All they know is killing in white uniforms. Dante: All right, so they bring in independent contractors, why are you so upset at its destruction? Randall: All those innocent contractors brought in to do the job are killed. Casualties in a war they had nothing to do with.
The death of those conscripted or hired to build a war machine is tragic, but the war machine must be stopped. It's a clear cut, understandable and moral aim in winning a war. Destroy the other side's massive, terrifying, planet-destroying weapon. To not have done so when they believed they had a chance would have meant planets worth of civilian deaths, many times those working on building the weapon. It's not a kind choice to make, but it is a necessary one.
@@FairbrookWingates One of many necessary evils doubt done during the Galactic Civil War. Still, I would hope the more morally good and kind Rebel leaders would at least send condolences to the families and friends of the innocent they killed, maybe even a gift basket.
Andor shows you the true colors and reality of a war. Good isn't always good, and bad isn't always bad. You've always seen the shades of grey. The Empire weren't all bad or crazy zealots of Palpatine. Take a look at Mayfield. Dude was an ex-sniper for the Empire but he was in it like it was supposed to be, a job. Many stormtroopers and officers were just regular people working for the Empire. And the Rebels weren't all Luke Skywalkers or Leias, many joined them because they didn't like the Empire, but just because you just don't like the Empire, it doesn't make you a good person. In Rogue One, Andor himself explains that many people in the Rebellion were spies, and assassins, and by the looks of Andor Episode 6, many rebels were probably also kidnappers, kidnapping kids or family of important Imperial officers and using them as bait.
This was an interesting video for you to make, it's very rare the dark side of the Rebellion is explored, just like the light side of the Empire is rarely explored. On the subject of the Death Star, one point I've argued is that the Rebels should have infiltrated it to liberate the POWs (because I highly doubt Leia was the only POW the Empire had on the Death Star), ensure minimum casualties, and execute high profile Imperial officers before destroying the Death Star. Sure, it would be risky, but it would have at least showed the Rebels were better than the Empire, and maybe even cause some Imperials to change sides. Also, unrelated to the Rebellion, both the Destruction of Alderaan and the destruction of the DS-01 (official designation for the first Death Star) were Tarkin's fault.
Wonder how many Skeens eventually turned into Han Solos by the end... Must've been more then just him or they'd NOT lasted long enough to not only get strong enough but ALSO powerful enough basically nothing the Empire had left could stop them. In a few things, even Saw at the end wasn't willing to go too far.
@@justnoob8141 he started out as a "Skeen", "skine" or whatever his name was too... BUT he turned out to be more noble then let on in the end. BUT he was ALSO upfront about his original "selfishness" an being in it for himself with the rest of the Rebels he'd met from the start... Ironic since he ultimately came back an was critical in the Original Death Star's destruction backing up Luke when he needed such support most. Which ALSO if memory serves was before Vader made it personal for Han torturing and imprisoning him once or twice far as I'm, or think I'd known anyways, aware. Even more funny seeing as ultimately he'd become a VERY key and important Rebel leader an perhaps even one the few Rebels capable of taking on even some the most elite and deadliest enemies the Empire could throw at someone and STILL possibly escape or even win. Which leads some to speculation that he was perhaps a little bit Force Sensitive too perhaps an no one was left to really catch it. Least no one around that'd dare try an such
@@justnoob8141 Han Solo was a smuggler that just cared for himself, or at least that's what he wanted to be seen like. Of course his origin movie and ANH shows you that deep down he was a good guy. But many rebels were Han Solos that didn't give a damn about anybody else besides themselves. To quote Solo: "Look, I ain't in this for your revolution, and I'm not in it for you, Princess. I expect to be well paid. I'm in it for the money"
Don't forget a lot of actual criminals joined the Rebel Alliance or were employed by them. The Empire to a degree tolerated certain criminal activity (better the devil you know then the one you don't) but didn't want the criminals to be so powerful inside the Empire that they could overtly takeover the Empire.
Just to be clear. This video mischaracterizes Andor. He isn't part of the Rebellion yet. He was a hired hand. He shot Skeem because he revealed his true self, someone untrustworthy. If he was willing to steal the money, then he's also willing to take the money by force, and worse yet, sell the team out to the Empire. He forced Andor's hand, and was killed.
I would like to this channel show us the Imperials who are actually good people and believe in the Empire because of the traumas they received from the Clones Wars.
Tower of God is a good series if you want to see an example of a rebel faction that has long fallen to corruption, scheming and violence of violence's sake.
Unrelated but something I noticed is that Nemik before he dies in the ship he was telling Cassian to climb, which is the one of the things K2 said before he died. Literally in the exact words too, not “ Climb Now “ just “ Climb “
No side in any war is composed simply of angels fighting for a cause, there are also the rogues, the devils and the bloodthirsty butchers also making use of said fight to service their own diverse goals and motives.
1:49 I think that saw Guerrera never saw that by doing his actions it just gives the people reason to support the empire and its policies I mean, even ruthless, pragmatic, military leaders in history, kept the people to their side I mean, if there’s two terrible monsters finding each other you will always side with more powerful monster
Geetsly: "Just because a cause is good, doesn't mean that bad people won't use it a cover for their own purposes." Me: I wouldn't call some of these guys "bad" per se. They're just better at charging through bureaucratic bull$#!t, and using blasters to burn down anyone who gets in the way.
The only conflicting opinions people should have on Saw are how he should be dealt with. He's like Kyp Duran to me, an edgy "hero" who they went a little too hard with, At least saw has a few good appearances... Kyp is just a bad character
Honestly, there's no such thing as good guys in war. Everyone sacrifices something and principle is often the first casualty, followed closely by the soul of everyone involved.
Legends, but the worst thing a supposed "hero" ever did was destroying Cardia with the Suncrusher. The fact the perpetrator never answered for his planetcide just because he was Force-sensitive proved the Rebels were just as willing to tolerate the worst of crimes just because it was done by someone they considered one of their own. At least Tarkin blew up with the Death Star.
I'd much rather be a Mandalorian, it would suck to be in the Empire or the Rebels. At least the Mandalorians were kinda independent and forged their own path.
That's the sad truth about serving and protecting the greater good. One day, you're just chilling on a one-week break while helping out family, friends, and maybe even a faithful and loving significant other, and in the other, you're leading a shadow ops taskforce whilst blatantly *pacifying* an otherwise fanatical yet unprepared Multiversal terrorist hate group by any merciless fashion available, all for the cause of eliminating them via karmic justice and necessity (and the slight bias of helping out friends... what with, hmm, them being a queer couple about to be assassinated by said group). (Interesting that Moff Panaka lives in Legends and vanishes from history later on, yet has a lasting demise in the Alt-universe.)
Well, that is life sometimes. You do at least try to take some prisoners through right? As much as I love karmic justice, it doesn't always have to mean the cold-blooded murder of everyone in the group. (Interesting indeed. He was probably one of the more reasonable Moffs and one of the Militarists who had legitimate and good reasons to want more weapons and an army. After all, his planet was invaded and nearly conquered and the Republic could do little to help at the time, so it makes sense he would be for an army and more military control to ensure this doesn't happen again).
@@zexalbrony4799 the republic was incapable of doing anything without greedy bureaucrats obstructing action with their “committees” and Chancellor Finis Valorum was a total pushover who lacked resolve to drain the swamp of corruption
@@neofulcrum5013 true I’m not saying the rebels didn’t mean too kill innocent people but with war innocent people die , but the empire is far worse then the rebels.
The fact folk have conflicted opinions on saw is litteraly just because the vast majority of civies have no clue what rebellion, war and guerrilla warefare is
How many ads do you need in one video? I love this channel but the ads are honestly getting to be too much. I really hope you consider less ads in the future, since it's hard to stay immersed in a video when it's interrupted for an ad for tic toc.
There are no rules in war and the rules sre made by the winners of the last war. The rules make you fight there way , the way they have more experience in , the way that gives them the best chance to win again. The way that best suits there military.
Andor actually makes you think whether who you consider are the "good" or "bad" guys. For me no one is good, actually everyone is kinda bad. It's the grey/neutral point. The Rebels were happy of using kids as hostages for their own personal benefit. And the Empire approved Martial law on every planet of the Galaxy, having Stormtroopers wrongfully arrest citizens, (a clear example of abuse of power) and even having sadistic K2 Droids choke you.
How different is Skeen to a young Solo? I’m sure a young Solo would have bolted with all those credits? I think we all agree Solo turned out alright in the end?
You could argue at times han was a self serving opertunist and leia calls him out on it a lot as he falls for her inba new hope and even on hoth. which makes sense tha his son has is own goals in the 1st order times and you didn't really need a crystal ball understand that. I would say even most didn't like the empire and 1st order but it was far worse and wide spread due to the power of the empire.
Eh still, while I am a fan of the Galactic Republic in the Clone Wars, I feel it should be pointed out at least the Rebellion-most of the time-had to do dirty stuff. Everybody else didn’t have to go extra though. We already know full well all the horrific stuff Count Dooku and Emperor Palpatine pushed their soldiers and followers to do in the Separatist Alliance and the Galactic Empire. Hell, the Separatist Alliance basically is the Rebel Alliance gone evil, or corporate. But in Canon, it is the Galactic Republic which starts construction on the Death Star and they still keep a clone trooper military instead of replacing them with regular soldiers like what the Empire did. There still were times the Jedi and Clones were forced to do morally questionable things since the Separatists are the worst war criminals, with the exception of the Empire and Sith who far surpass them. And we know a lot of the policies and the war itself was supposed to scare people into giving power to Palpatine. Still, the Death Star has to be considered overkill. Even if the Separatists were building one, the Jedi if they knew about it would argue to just attack the construction site and also the many projects involved in it. Why waste money building a weapon of war for a conflict that might end before it’s done? Unfortunately, probably for the same reasons the Empire kept building it: To use fear to keep anybody from causing trouble, seceding, or rising up again. Now that isn’t to say I don’t want to see the dark side of the Rebellion. It’s basically been the only Canon faction to not be taken through the ringer. We’ve even seen corruption and incompetence plague the Galactic Republic and the New Republic. Still, as much as I like to drag the Rebellion to the same level as everybody else, they at least had no choice. They were dealing with a faction that made superweapons as much as the Separatists before them.
This is not the rebel Alliance that George Lucas created the rebel Alliance that George created was a symbol of hope they didn't tie up hostages and point blasters at the back of children's heads
The Rebel Alliance was actually based upon the Viet Cong militants, the communist group that often performed terrorist acts against people in South Vietnam
I honestly think ruthless tactics against a ruthless regime aren’t necessarily evil. To a certain existent I really do think the ends did justify the means. The empire was a police state with eyes everywhere, leave no witnesses and provoke over reaction wherever possible. Obviously don’t resort to civilian targets but if an imperial loyalists is a threat, eliminating that threat is worth it.
F*CKING. FINALLY!!!. Finally they represent the rebels in their true colors, now for stormtroopers being badass killing machines. Too bad the show aint as successful, but thats what you get for dividing the fandom for years.
@this city is really looks like a city and people doing whatever they want to under the guise of "freedom" any better? Committing crimes, slavery, and generally making lives miserable?
As much as we want to see the rebels as the heroes they arnt, the rebel alliance was made up as terrorist smugglers and criminals. The rebels were forced to recruit these scum because they were the desperate and selfish. The rebels killed thousands of storm troopers who were nothing but civilians of the empire who chose to become soldiers to support their families and their homes. The rebels has no qualms with killing people who were imperial citizens as the rebels were so blinded by their so called “freedom” they did not see a grey area your either an imperial or a rebel and imperials no matter how innocent were seen as guilty. At the end of the day the rebels were terrorist and criminals and although the empire had some cruel actions like alderan they were doing it for a safe and controlled galaxy where every species and planet could have a fair chance and a job. The rebels failed to achieve this as after the battle of Endor the rebels failed to keep order and many planets that were prosperous were run by bounty hunters assassins and warlords. The rebels did not save the galaxy, they only caused it to become more divided.
@@christieblackwood7807 Unfortunately it's too late. Disney had every opportunity to make amazing Star War content and instead made substandard content and milked Nostalgia. Andor might be good but at this point a large amount of the Fanbase has moved on.
@@aster4jaden Bruuuuh, not this again. The original trilogy was blatantly good vs. evil. It wasn’t the original Lucasfilms that introduced the now Legends “Gray Jedi” and it isn’t until the modern era, and especially when Disney took over, that you began to see nuance in good vs evil from their movies to the cartoons and books to the live-action movies and film. I’m not a Disney apologist but I do know not to jump on the bandwagon and crap all over them with retread debunked flimsy retread arguments as well.
Andor has been so good because Disney hired Directors that truly take serious their productions, not weird shows like Book of Boba Fett and even at a less degree, The Mandalorian. I love Mando but I love much more Andor because even if it's fiction you find topics that you can relate to real world problems
![The BRUTAL Training Camps of the Empire Explained [There is no Failure, Only Death!]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/XnS3Oi3raD4/mqdefault.jpg)
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
One of the dark sides of the Rebel Alliance was the type of Rebel cell. If an Imperial was taken prisoner, that depends on what type of cell that took you. There are some Rebel groups that will not take prisoners. For example, the Free Ryloth Movement killed every Imperial they found, even if they were unarmed. Some cells will torture you and then kill you.
common Free Ryloth W
Another reason why these savages must be eliminated.
Don’t forget the partisans who are basically radicals
@@luulasmene7786 that isn't right bro. It will only justify when Vader, Death Troopers, shadow troopers, and stormconmandos slaughter them. Mon Mothma was right, you have to be different than your enemies if you want to achieve peace. Otherwise the cycle of hate and murder will continue
Still more of a chance than the Empire gave prisoners.
There’s also the story of TK-462, who lost his sister to the hands of rebels stealing from his farm. They attempted to steal air scrubbers from his family, and when it failed, his sister was crushed to death under them.
That’s the thing about rebellions. Often the reason people join a faction isn’t based on belief or anything deep but rather joining the faction opposed to the one that hurt you or your people/family
Yup. It’s just a cycle of revenge. Nothing to do with good and bad. Merely my tribe trying to survive and be dominant and being involved in a reciprocal battle of revenge and dominance with your tribe.
Rebels are little fucks just like the empire. It’s just that the empire are the guys in control. So the underdogs are always rooted for because they’re the “disadvantaged” group.
Here's the cold reality of war: even heroes become monsters. Killing is damaging to you, no matter your morals.
War is hell
"Good people, remarkable people are killed meaninglessly. That's war, and that's terrorism. The sin of wars and terrorism, in the end, comes down to that." - Yang Wenli
Never expected a quote from LoGH would be here. Nice one 👍
Andor is really good, and it makes me wish there was a mich greater variety in the star wars shows we have. Gritty war dramas, adventure shows, horror specials. The star wars universe can host them all, not just «the mandalorian-esque».
I think this new year (when Im writing this comment) their going to focus on expanding their current show in the early year. Then later on they will add new shows.
Luthen is a hardline rebel but thankfully he doesn’t seem to want to go to lengths as radical as Saw Gerrera.
..but Luthen's "assistant" will go to those lengths!
@@gr8tbigtreehugger to protect the cause from caving in on itself
Sadly people like Luthens assistant r needed to keep the cause going and to keep people in check and to do things that r sadly needed for certain types of missions sadly.
@@markcrum5312 it is not sad. Unfortunate maybe, but not sad. If it is necessary, it should happen.
@@Kolokommouna true I only say sadly is due to those type of people willing to sacrifice anyone and anything even if that person is an ally but u r right it is necessary and unfortunate.
It’s the dark truth of the Alliance.
The heroic freedom fighters we seen in the movies managed to get there, no small thanks to the people like the Partizans. The ones who’s willing to cross any bridge,commit any crime and kill anyone in the name of Victory.
I think the darkest moment was when the rebels threatened to kill the commander’s wife and son. It shows that they were ready to kill two defenceless civilians just to get what they wanted done.
So far, i could safely say Andor's the best live action SW show...
I'd say it was less of a dark hidden truth and more of a brutal reality. The Rebels were always going to have to commit questionable things because they had no choice if they wanted to win, the difference between the Rebels and the Partisans was morality where the Rebels always tried to preserve them while the Partisans sacrificed them to achieve goals. There was no rule playing, especially as the Empire was not going to play by the rules under Palpatine. In fact, those that did try to play by the rules in the Empire and be genuinely good people who wanted to bring order were often fucked over because of many in the Imperials upper ranks and even below, hence why so many just decided to join the Rebels.
Really you could make a parallel video looking at the good members of the Empire and how they were screwed over by their own ranks because they didn't want to do atrocities, didn't want to commit violence, disliked the criminal corruption that existed within the ranks, and etc. The Empire did promise peace, order, and security but often delivered on the opposite.
With hindsight (imagine having this written a year ago), it represents Ukrainians, they do the best they can, and they try to be a better person than the Russian prisoner, but there is hatred and passion. War is not a game, it's a prison.
One kind of rebellion I haven't seen before, but would be really interesting is a rebellion against Palpatine, not to restore democracy, but to depose him so that he could be replaced with a trustworthy and compassionate emperor.
A rebellion that is firmly against the Rebel Alliance, anti-Palpatine, but not necessarily anti-Empire.
I imagine their tactics would be more covert and focused on espionage and assassination to get results than guerilla warfare and revolution, a "shadow war"; and it's members would be thousands of double-agent stormtroopers, army and navy officers, ISB and intelligence officers, and such.
The comics are doing a big saga focusing on Crimson Dawn (from Solo) with Qira trying to stop the Sith. You should give it a look. Her methods actually tick most of the things you mentioned.
that would make sense, countries and empires like China, Soviet Union, Rome, even the Nazis had these types of shadow wars throughout history.
I'm kinda getting Alpha Legion vibes from that
There’s a story about normal farmer boy who just wanted to live his life until a bunch of rebels killed his family and taking his family’s food for their war effort. Overcome with grief, rage and hatred he joined the storm trooper corps to kill rebels he later died to a rebel girl child soldier. He laugh in irony he and the child are the same.
Corps, not core.
The Rebel Alliance was facing the strongest military might that the Galaxy has ever seen, and there are no doubt that many Rebel Cells were more akin to Terrorists rather than the freedom fighters.
While that was probably true, the Rebel Alliance was formed from the groups that at least publicly rejected that sort of behavior. The Partisan Front and others were never officially in the Rebel Alliance because they were more like Terrorists than Freedom Fighters.
I was going to say this as well. No doubt many rebellions, carried out by well-meaning people who were fighting a just war, still ended up themselves doing objectionable things.
The difference is which side you're on.
@@FallenRingbearer
THE FORCE ITSELF: 🖕😶
@@jasoethesentienteyeshapedg4847 Easy there 0.o
This is what I love about Andor the show shows us that the rebel alliance wasn’t as squeaky clean as we’ve always been lead to believe
The irony of all is that when you stop to think about it, whether or not you say you did the right thing in the end there will still be a backlash that you still didn't take into account. Or sometimes even though you might be doing something great, there will be always someone working behind the scenes that exploits you.
Just goes to show you that not all members of the Alliance are good people. Just like not everyone in the Empire are evil.
Look at fury in where the ss officer was executed just for being ss, there is also story of American national guard unit commiting war crime and patton brushed it under carpet
He told them to kill them all
Geetsly’s: The rebel alliance weren’t all good guys
Saw Gerrera and his partisans: enter the chat
Saw was a homicidal maniac. I honestly don't understand what the Rebel Alliance needed from him or his people.
The Partisans hearts were in the right place but they're methods were definitely extreme.
@@dred9174 yeah, how you conduct war is kind of a big deal… especially considering trying to win hearts and minds across the galaxy against an Empire
@@richardlahan7068 probably muscle and expendable people willing to go on impossible assignments against the Empire
🤷♂️
There are heroes on both sides. But evil is everywhere in war.
It’s not how we choose to fight, but what’s important worth fighting for
Andor is the first piece of star wars media I've watched in a long time that actually made me feel something...
For me, it Rogue one is the only Star Wars movie that Disney has made that didn’t leave me pissed. They really dropped with ball with the sequel trilogy, it was just so jammed packed full of stupid stuff, and rehashed plots from the original that I didn’t even like the fan service stuff. I mean visually the movies are awesome, but they felt like the Indiana Jones crystal skull movie, all fluff and crazy impossible stuff, way too much fan service way too little story. What little story there was completely betrayed the movies that had come before.
I’m glad you’re finally covering post-clone wars content past the bad batch. It opens a lot of possibilities
Definitely keep these videos going! Andor is a masterpiece sad how some can’t see this!
I must say, I love how the music plays through your intro. It adds to the flow of the content and it just feels right. Please, keep this style 🙏 As always, your videos are awesome. Huge fan!
Yes, please list them, in both legends & canon. Also, after that, various forms of infighting, primarily within the Galactic Empire & Rebel Alliance (I remember some from playing the PC Flight Sims _TIE Fighter_ & _X-Wing Alliance_ )…
Now to be fair, the destruction of the Second Death Star was truly a terrible thing, because of something Randall from the movie Clerks pointed out about it.
Randall: The first Death Star was manned by the Imperial Army. The only people on board were Stormtroopers, Dignitaries, Imperials. So when they blew it up, no problem, evil is punished. The second time around it wasn't even done being built yet it was still under construction. So a construction job of that magnitude would require a hell of a lot more manpower than the Imperial Army had to offer. I'll bet they brought independent contractors in on that thing; plumbers, aluminum siders, roofers. In order to get it built quickly and quietly they'd hire anybody that could do the job. You think the average Sstoormtrooper knows how to install a toilet main. All they know is killing in white uniforms.
Dante: All right, so they bring in independent contractors, why are you so upset at its destruction?
Randall: All those innocent contractors brought in to do the job are killed. Casualties in a war they had nothing to do with.
The death of those conscripted or hired to build a war machine is tragic, but the war machine must be stopped. It's a clear cut, understandable and moral aim in winning a war. Destroy the other side's massive, terrifying, planet-destroying weapon. To not have done so when they believed they had a chance would have meant planets worth of civilian deaths, many times those working on building the weapon. It's not a kind choice to make, but it is a necessary one.
@@FairbrookWingates One of many necessary evils doubt done during the Galactic Civil War. Still, I would hope the more morally good and kind Rebel leaders would at least send condolences to the families and friends of the innocent they killed, maybe even a gift basket.
A contractor follows his heart, not his wallet.
@@TJDious Well said. Was hoping someone would make that comment.
Andor shows you the true colors and reality of a war. Good isn't always good, and bad isn't always bad. You've always seen the shades of grey.
The Empire weren't all bad or crazy zealots of Palpatine. Take a look at Mayfield. Dude was an ex-sniper for the Empire but he was in it like it was supposed to be, a job. Many stormtroopers and officers were just regular people working for the Empire.
And the Rebels weren't all Luke Skywalkers or Leias, many joined them because they didn't like the Empire, but just because you just don't like the Empire, it doesn't make you a good person. In Rogue One, Andor himself explains that many people in the Rebellion were spies, and assassins, and by the looks of Andor Episode 6, many rebels were probably also kidnappers, kidnapping kids or family of important Imperial officers and using them as bait.
War is messy but there is a difference between conducting War and conducting war crimes
Exactly, in war everyone will get their hands dirty, it's up to you to decide whether you clean it up or keep 'em dirty.
This was an interesting video for you to make, it's very rare the dark side of the Rebellion is explored, just like the light side of the Empire is rarely explored.
On the subject of the Death Star, one point I've argued is that the Rebels should have infiltrated it to liberate the POWs (because I highly doubt Leia was the only POW the Empire had on the Death Star), ensure minimum casualties, and execute high profile Imperial officers before destroying the Death Star. Sure, it would be risky, but it would have at least showed the Rebels were better than the Empire, and maybe even cause some Imperials to change sides.
Also, unrelated to the Rebellion, both the Destruction of Alderaan and the destruction of the DS-01 (official designation for the first Death Star) were Tarkin's fault.
Wonder how many Skeens eventually turned into Han Solos by the end... Must've been more then just him or they'd NOT lasted long enough to not only get strong enough but ALSO powerful enough basically nothing the Empire had left could stop them. In a few things, even Saw at the end wasn't willing to go too far.
I definitely forget something about Han Solo here, can you give me a recap?
@@justnoob8141 he started out as a "Skeen", "skine" or whatever his name was too... BUT he turned out to be more noble then let on in the end. BUT he was ALSO upfront about his original "selfishness" an being in it for himself with the rest of the Rebels he'd met from the start... Ironic since he ultimately came back an was critical in the Original Death Star's destruction backing up Luke when he needed such support most. Which ALSO if memory serves was before Vader made it personal for Han torturing and imprisoning him once or twice far as I'm, or think I'd known anyways, aware. Even more funny seeing as ultimately he'd become a VERY key and important Rebel leader an perhaps even one the few Rebels capable of taking on even some the most elite and deadliest enemies the Empire could throw at someone and STILL possibly escape or even win. Which leads some to speculation that he was perhaps a little bit Force Sensitive too perhaps an no one was left to really catch it. Least no one around that'd dare try an such
@@justnoob8141 Han Solo was a smuggler that just cared for himself, or at least that's what he wanted to be seen like. Of course his origin movie and ANH shows you that deep down he was a good guy. But many rebels were Han Solos that didn't give a damn about anybody else besides themselves.
To quote Solo: "Look, I ain't in this for your revolution, and I'm not in it for you, Princess. I expect to be well paid. I'm in it for the money"
Love this channel. You give people something to think about.🤔
In other words war brings out the best and worst in people.
Very well put. I especially appreciated the line you drew connecting Saw and Skeen.
Don't forget a lot of actual criminals joined the Rebel Alliance or were employed by them. The Empire to a degree tolerated certain criminal activity (better the devil you know then the one you don't) but didn't want the criminals to be so powerful inside the Empire that they could overtly takeover the Empire.
Just to be clear. This video mischaracterizes Andor. He isn't part of the Rebellion yet. He was a hired hand. He shot Skeem because he revealed his true self, someone untrustworthy. If he was willing to steal the money, then he's also willing to take the money by force, and worse yet, sell the team out to the Empire. He forced Andor's hand, and was killed.
Yes, make a separate video on bad things done.
Wish you would do in depth analysis of each andor episode. Kind of surprised not doing it.
As far as we know, nothing the Alliance did ever compared to the destruction of Alderaan or Operation Cinder...
I would like to this channel show us the Imperials who are actually good people and believe in the Empire because of the traumas they received from the Clones Wars.
“The Rebel Alliance wasn’t all Sunshine and Rainbows”
[Alderaan has entered the chat]
GLORY FOR THE REBLION
Your right it wasnt just sunshine and rainbows, it was also clovers and baloons
Everyone gangster until Wulf Yularen comes into play.
Tower of God is a good series if you want to see an example of a rebel faction that has long fallen to corruption, scheming and violence of violence's sake.
I might have to give that a look
Unrelated but something I noticed is that Nemik before he dies in the ship he was telling Cassian to climb, which is the one of the things K2 said before he died. Literally in the exact words too, not “ Climb Now “ just “ Climb “
All political movements are ultimately co-opted by opportunists
Cassius lol @1:00 idk if that was edits but for a second I thought I ventured into some Roman history 😅
During war it is not about who is right or wrong: It is about how much they hate each other.
For the rebel alliance
For the Rebellion! For the Republic!
all of you are lame
No side in any war is composed simply of angels fighting for a cause, there are also the rogues, the devils and the bloodthirsty butchers also making use of said fight to service their own diverse goals and motives.
Indeed
Cheers@@ChaseDaOrk3767
Can you list any good lives lost in the destructions of imperial command ships or the Death Stars?
1:49 I think that saw Guerrera never saw that by doing his actions it just gives the people reason to support the empire and its policies I mean, even ruthless, pragmatic, military leaders in history, kept the people to their side I mean, if there’s two terrible monsters finding each other you will always side with more powerful monster
Geetsly: "Just because a cause is good, doesn't mean that bad people won't use it a cover for their own purposes."
Me: I wouldn't call some of these guys "bad" per se. They're just better at charging through bureaucratic bull$#!t, and using blasters to burn down anyone who gets in the way.
The only conflicting opinions people should have on Saw are how he should be dealt with. He's like Kyp Duran to me, an edgy "hero" who they went a little too hard with, At least saw has a few good appearances... Kyp is just a bad character
Honestly, there's no such thing as good guys in war. Everyone sacrifices something and principle is often the first casualty, followed closely by the soul of everyone involved.
"You either die a hero..."
Or live long enough to finish that sentence.
Yes, "become a villain", we know the drill.
Legends, but the worst thing a supposed "hero" ever did was destroying Cardia with the Suncrusher. The fact the perpetrator never answered for his planetcide just because he was Force-sensitive proved the Rebels were just as willing to tolerate the worst of crimes just because it was done by someone they considered one of their own. At least Tarkin blew up with the Death Star.
Good video
You call rebels I called and traders to the Empire
Video Idea: Planet Ossus Explained
I'm a proud supporter of the Rebel Alliance but even I'm aware of their darker side
Among all the imperial fanboys praising the empire, you’re a breath of fresh air.
@@neofulcrum5013 I yet have to come across any empire fanboys in this comment section.
@@marcusrauch4223 give it some time here. You’re hanging around the right place. Same for GT.
It's no wonder r he rebellion organized itself into a designed military
War is hell no matter what era.
This is why I stick to the empire at least they keep their brutally open like a book.
I'd much rather be a Mandalorian, it would suck to be in the Empire or the Rebels. At least the Mandalorians were kinda independent and forged their own path.
Not exactly a high bar
That's the sad truth about serving and protecting the greater good. One day, you're just chilling on a one-week break while helping out family, friends, and maybe even a faithful and loving significant other, and in the other, you're leading a shadow ops taskforce whilst blatantly *pacifying* an otherwise fanatical yet unprepared Multiversal terrorist hate group by any merciless fashion available, all for the cause of eliminating them via karmic justice and necessity (and the slight bias of helping out friends... what with, hmm, them being a queer couple about to be assassinated by said group).
(Interesting that Moff Panaka lives in Legends and vanishes from history later on, yet has a lasting demise in the Alt-universe.)
Well, that is life sometimes. You do at least try to take some prisoners through right? As much as I love karmic justice, it doesn't always have to mean the cold-blooded murder of everyone in the group.
(Interesting indeed. He was probably one of the more reasonable Moffs and one of the Militarists who had legitimate and good reasons to want more weapons and an army. After all, his planet was invaded and nearly conquered and the Republic could do little to help at the time, so it makes sense he would be for an army and more military control to ensure this doesn't happen again).
@@zexalbrony4799 the republic was incapable of doing anything without greedy bureaucrats obstructing action with their “committees” and Chancellor Finis Valorum was a total pushover who lacked resolve to drain the swamp of corruption
Moff Panaka experienced the trade federation takeover and the senate was overrun by venal dickbutts
The one act from the rebels that was the worse was the death star destruction many families and workers died on the station
A parallel to the empire destroying Alderaan with families living on there
@@neofulcrum5013 true I’m not saying the rebels didn’t mean too kill innocent people but with war innocent people die , but the empire is far worse then the rebels.
@@thetaker6086 with the Death Stars it was collateral as they had very few options on beating that WMD beyond destroying it.
@@neofulcrum5013 agreed and I don’t blame them im only speaking from your average civilian point of view
This show is right up there with the clone wars, avatar the last air bender and breaking bad as one of the greatest tv shows ever made
The fact folk have conflicted opinions on saw is litteraly just because the vast majority of civies have no clue what rebellion, war and guerrilla warefare is
Kelly's heroes, they stole gold from the natzies, under the cover of war , outstanding
I wonder how his eyes changed from blue to green to brown over time
Is there any other franchise that's has the same or more lore then star wars. Ships/planets/ species/ vehicles/ food and so on and so on.
How many ads do you need in one video? I love this channel but the ads are honestly getting to be too much. I really hope you consider less ads in the future, since it's hard to stay immersed in a video when it's interrupted for an ad for tic toc.
There are no rules in war and the rules sre made by the winners of the last war. The rules make you fight there way , the way they have more experience in , the way that gives them the best chance to win again. The way that best suits there military.
With Andor , I really sympathy with the Empire
Andor actually makes you think whether who you consider are the "good" or "bad" guys.
For me no one is good, actually everyone is kinda bad. It's the grey/neutral point. The Rebels were happy of using kids as hostages for their own personal benefit. And the Empire approved Martial law on every planet of the Galaxy, having Stormtroopers wrongfully arrest citizens, (a clear example of abuse of power) and even having sadistic K2 Droids choke you.
Isnt is Cassion?
How different is Skeen to a young Solo?
I’m sure a young Solo would have bolted with all those credits?
I think we all agree Solo turned out alright in the end?
If you want to make an omelette you have to break some eggs.If you want to win a war you gotta play dirty.Wars are not won with good hearts
I have always been of the opinion that Steela Saw's sister would have been ashamed of him if she knew what he became.
She was the better of the two of them not basically an imperial in all but faction like he was
Cassius Andor 😂
You could argue at times han was a self serving opertunist and leia calls him out on it a lot as he falls for her inba new hope and even on hoth. which makes sense tha his son has is own goals in the 1st order times and you didn't really need a crystal ball understand that. I would say even most didn't like the empire and 1st order but it was far worse and wide spread due to the power of the empire.
Saw was a hero
Eh still, while I am a fan of the Galactic Republic in the Clone Wars, I feel it should be pointed out at least the Rebellion-most of the time-had to do dirty stuff. Everybody else didn’t have to go extra though. We already know full well all the horrific stuff Count Dooku and Emperor Palpatine pushed their soldiers and followers to do in the Separatist Alliance and the Galactic Empire. Hell, the Separatist Alliance basically is the Rebel Alliance gone evil, or corporate. But in Canon, it is the Galactic Republic which starts construction on the Death Star and they still keep a clone trooper military instead of replacing them with regular soldiers like what the Empire did. There still were times the Jedi and Clones were forced to do morally questionable things since the Separatists are the worst war criminals, with the exception of the Empire and Sith who far surpass them. And we know a lot of the policies and the war itself was supposed to scare people into giving power to Palpatine. Still, the Death Star has to be considered overkill. Even if the Separatists were building one, the Jedi if they knew about it would argue to just attack the construction site and also the many projects involved in it. Why waste money building a weapon of war for a conflict that might end before it’s done? Unfortunately, probably for the same reasons the Empire kept building it: To use fear to keep anybody from causing trouble, seceding, or rising up again.
Now that isn’t to say I don’t want to see the dark side of the Rebellion. It’s basically been the only Canon faction to not be taken through the ringer. We’ve even seen corruption and incompetence plague the Galactic Republic and the New Republic. Still, as much as I like to drag the Rebellion to the same level as everybody else, they at least had no choice. They were dealing with a faction that made superweapons as much as the Separatists before them.
EU version of Empire for life.
"Brilliant writing" is a huge stretch imo lmao
The Senate is the truth.
This is not the rebel Alliance that George Lucas created the rebel Alliance that George created was a symbol of hope they didn't tie up hostages and point blasters at the back of children's heads
Thats not realistic
The Rebel Alliance was actually based upon the Viet Cong which performed numerous atrocities against civilians
The Rebel Alliance was actually based upon the Viet Cong militants, the communist group that often performed terrorist acts against people in South Vietnam
I honestly think ruthless tactics against a ruthless regime aren’t necessarily evil. To a certain existent I really do think the ends did justify the means. The empire was a police state with eyes everywhere, leave no witnesses and provoke over reaction wherever possible. Obviously don’t resort to civilian targets but if an imperial loyalists is a threat, eliminating that threat is worth it.
I sence a parallel
F*CKING. FINALLY!!!.
Finally they represent the rebels in their true colors, now for stormtroopers being badass killing machines.
Too bad the show aint as successful, but thats what you get for dividing the fandom for years.
How Andor's brilliant writing exposes the lack of brain cells of much of the SW fandom.
AND♥R
You call it Rebellion and Rebels
I call it Terrorism and terrorists
We are not the same
amen
Shocker. The rebels weren't as good as people thought.
@this city is really looks like a city and people doing whatever they want to under the guise of "freedom" any better? Committing crimes, slavery, and generally making lives miserable?
@this city is really looks like a city better than living under an illusion of freedom. that's for sure.
As much as we want to see the rebels as the heroes they arnt, the rebel alliance was made up as terrorist smugglers and criminals. The rebels were forced to recruit these scum because they were the desperate and selfish. The rebels killed thousands of storm troopers who were nothing but civilians of the empire who chose to become soldiers to support their families and their homes. The rebels has no qualms with killing people who were imperial citizens as the rebels were so blinded by their so called “freedom” they did not see a grey area your either an imperial or a rebel and imperials no matter how innocent were seen as guilty. At the end of the day the rebels were terrorist and criminals and although the empire had some cruel actions like alderan they were doing it for a safe and controlled galaxy where every species and planet could have a fair chance and a job. The rebels failed to achieve this as after the battle of Endor the rebels failed to keep order and many planets that were prosperous were run by bounty hunters assassins and warlords. The rebels did not save the galaxy, they only caused it to become more divided.
The rebellion shattered the galaxy into Somalia with countless warlords vying for power over systems
They should have killed off the Geonosian. Like seriously Disney, look up their history and culture. Especially Lesser's cane.
The Rebellion was lame there week as fug and do bad stuff to people this is totally not a Storm troper righting this message.
Democracy is cringe
Brilliant writing?
Ehh
Video Idea: How Disney Ruined Star Wars
It was ruined a long time ago andors really good though
@@christieblackwood7807 Unfortunately it's too late. Disney had every opportunity to make amazing Star War content and instead made substandard content and milked Nostalgia. Andor might be good but at this point a large amount of the Fanbase has moved on.
Always that one person
@@aster4jaden Bruuuuh, not this again. The original trilogy was blatantly good vs. evil. It wasn’t the original Lucasfilms that introduced the now Legends “Gray Jedi” and it isn’t until the modern era, and especially when Disney took over, that you began to see nuance in good vs evil from their movies to the cartoons and books to the live-action movies and film. I’m not a Disney apologist but I do know not to jump on the bandwagon and crap all over them with retread debunked flimsy retread arguments as well.
Andor has been so good because Disney hired Directors that truly take serious their productions, not weird shows like Book of Boba Fett and even at a less degree, The Mandalorian. I love Mando but I love much more Andor because even if it's fiction you find topics that you can relate to real world problems
saw gerrera is cool
It was until show writers decided that the rebel alliance needed to be al queda