Well as impressive as this video is- I’m thoroughly impressed!- it’s relatively basic, though multi step, math so if it didn’t add up there was a simple error in not adjusting for one or more of the binary possibilities
Thank goodness none of the secret exits outright require the switch palaces. (I know some intend for you to get them, but there are ways around them all.) I can’t even imagine the scenarios that would need to be played out in that case.
Yeah, the closest I can think of are Vanilla Secret 1 that almost requires the blue switch, but theoretically can be gotten without it. The other one is how green and red switches are very helpful for the Star World 4 secret exit, but not quite necessary. Maybe you need all of them to access the special world, from star world 5? But I think you can bypass that with a blue Yoshi.
I was wondering about that. It’s been ages since I’ve played through the game, so I couldn’t remember if there was a switch palace requirement to reach certain exits.
It wasn't on the chart, but 37.5% of the Marios would have visited the Super Secret Area, grabbed some free power ups, maybe a Yoshi, then turned right back around to the ghost house they just came from.
Looking at the logic map/flowchart, the star road's direct expressway to bowser's front door is the dealbreaker. since so many of the Marios end up 50/50'ing funneling through it in one way or another, to wind up at the game's final level, it's not surprising that the levels immediately preceding that skip have the fewest %.
If you treat all entrances to the Star Roads as dead-ends, the calculation is actually pretty simple. All areas receive 100% of Marios (except the Butter & Cheese bridges, but they are created from a single fork, so it's 50/50, and they rejoin). So the only real division would be if there are multiple routes through a world. And there are 3 areas with significant multiple routes (rather than just a single fork like Vanilla Dome). Those being Donut Plains, Forest of Mystery, and Valley of Bowser. In VoB, Valley 3&4 have the least number of Marios, at 25% (there were two dividing lines). Donut Plains has a similar sequence of secret exit divisions, which leads to Donut Secret 2 and Donut Secret House receiving 25% of Marios. Also, Top Secret Area is visited by only 25% of Marios. Forest of Mystery is pretty complex, but because the Star Road is considered a dead end, its levels all get more than 25% of Marios playing them. So it's ultimately a 5-way tie. And since this tie still includes the same levels as this analysis deduced, I'd say that the analysis did discover something useful here.
@@harrybest2041 No, it leads to the FRONT door. Valley of Bowser 2 (secret exit) is what leads to the Valley Fortress, which THEN leads to the back door.
I thought this was going to be a video about each level's merits in terms of game design. Like... "Why did they even include this level? It doesn't have any interesting gameplay mechanics and doesn't challenge the player in any meaningful way, so it's unnecessary and could've been replaced with a more interesting concept."
Yeah, that's what I thought this was going to be too. I assumed I'd be getting a critique and examination of game design. But no, it's just a dude reading numbers to me for 15 minutes.
This was and still is my favorite 2D Mario game because of all the interesting paths you can take. The fact that it’s pretty open-world blew my mind because I was used to games like New Super Mario Bros. World 4 was especially interesting
Okay, you absolutely MUST find the most unnecessary level in Super Mario Bros 3. Those warp whistles in World 1 are going to send the train off the rails and into the river below with all of the possibilities.
@@marshaltito641 No, it's not as simple as that. The worlds you can warp to with a warp whistle depend on which world you're in. I believe that Worlds 1-3 can warp you to 2,3,4, Worlds 4-6 to 5,6,7, and World 7 to World 8. But that's only if you didn't use a whistle immediately beforehand. If you use a whistle to go to World 2 and then immediately afterwards use a second whistle, you get the options of 5,6,7. And, you can actually use a whistle in the warp zone to go directly to World 8 (speedrun strats baby). Then you have to consider that half of the Mario population that enters 1-3 and 1-Fortress won't do the secret exits to get those whistles.
My guess as to what would happen is that after the Warp Whistle is obtained, every time you go into a new level, half of the Marios instead choose to use the warp whistle
My guess is that every time a whistle is obtained it will be used immediately, and the Marios split into thirds to equally go into the sets of three pipes
@@visualgagging Though ultimately, it'll be for little gain. Since regardless of how the group is split, it'll have most Mario's continue on as normal, unless they do the Double Warp Whistle trick to skip all the way to World 8. Then the pre-requisite would be that Worlds 1-3 and 1-F be complete, then after 1-F, the Whistles are consumed. It's a mess of statistical uncertainties and assumptions they won't just do 1-3, skip 1-4, then hit 1-F or if they complete 1-4.
I'm guessing that it would get more complicated than people think. Some players may use the warp whistle immediately from 1-3, to then choose either World 2, World 3, or World 4, _or_ just go to World 1-Fortress (or maybe even go to World 1-4, if they wanted, so you could split this into 1/5ths _But_ if players choose to go to 1-Fortress (either immediately, or after 1-4 first), and they get the second whistle, then they have more choices. They can use the first whistle to get to the Warp Zone, then they have 4 options. They can go to World 2, 3 or 4, _or_ use the second warp whistle to go to World 8 _OR_ they can use the second whistle, in either Worlds, 2, 3, or 4, to then have 3 further options each, to Worlds 5, 6 or 7, which means from World 1, you have a total of 10 options so far. _BUT_ ... yes, more buts.... what about if a player use a warp whistle to get to World 2, then gets a third warp whistle from the enemy battle course in World 2, then uses their second warp to get to the Warp Zone, and then uses that third warp to get to World 8? And in terms of every new level = half, that makes sense, in theory, but does it work like that? From 1-F(ortress), for example, 1/2 warp, 1/2 go to 1-5 From 1-5, 1/4 warp, 1/4 go to 1-6 From 1-5, 1/8 warp, 1/8 go to 1-A(irship) And so on, but then the 1/8 that warped from 1-5, 1/32 may choose to go to Worlds 2, 3 or 4, each, or go to World 8, if they have two whistles, then from the 1/32, in Worlds 2, 3 and 4, at this point, 1/96 go to Worlds 5, 6 or 7. But if the 1/32 that went to World 2, instead choose to get the last whistle so they have two again, then it goes more complicated. You can warp from World 2, to World 5, and then from World 5 to World 5 (again), World 6, or World 7. Players are unlikely to warp from World 5 to World 5, so we'd probably choose World 6 or World 7. But if a player warps from World 2 to World 6, they also have the choice of World 5, World 6 or World 7. Before you think "Why choose to go to World 5 from World 6?" How about this, for example. Play gets 2 whistles from World 1. They _don't_ use any whistles yet, and simply get to World 2 normally. They then get the third whistle from World 2, and then use their first whistle to Warp to World 6 (because it's an option, and why not) They then complete some levels of world 6, but then decide they want to go to World 5, instead, so they use a second warp whistle to go to World 5. Why would they do this? Why not. World 5 hasn't been completed yet, so why not? But then, they might decide, screw this, and just use the last whistle to warp to World 7. But what if we just completely ignore the whole Warp Zone altogether? IT's already complicated with 1-3, and 1-4 alone, since, after 1-2, and everyone knows you have 3 stages to choose from. You can go straight to 1-F. But you can also choose to either complete 1-3 first, or 1-4, first before 1-F. And futhermore, you can then choose to complete 1-4, after 1-3, before 1-F, or 1-3 after 1-4, before 1-F. Ignoring warp whistles, obviously 100% of players play 1-F, but the percentage of players that play 1-3 and 1-4 each, will either be 50% each or maybe 66.667% each or something.
@@scmtuk3662 I’m pretty sure the consensus is that each player moves forwards, meaning that if they warped to World 6, they can only warp to World 7 the next time they use the whistle.
I’m curious, if a thousand people were polled on the levels they played, how would the results be different? Because, while this is fascinating, it is inaccurate representation of how people play to evenly split at every secret.
@@JoshuaBarkdull actually given the way that these would work Yoshi's house would have 100% attendance since it is the first playable area you can enter so you'd have 100% go in and then branch of to YI1 and YI2 as they did here in this video leaving the end result entirely unchanged
I would have said yoshis island leading to the switch palace on the left. It's a dead end and you're making negative progress. It's the definition of unnecessary. I didn't understand any of the logic to this video.
@@gamesfond it's simply really. The logic of this video is that players would experiment with where to go so if we assume every junction in the game splits them off evenly how many players end up visiting every level
You would be right but this dude overcomplicates the question to give a more objective answer. It’s boring. Doesn’t help that he sounds like a middle schooler wearing a suit.
i was so excited to see star world and forest of illusion. so many marios wound up in star world, and having almost half of all of them go through the special world is hilarious. forest of illusion was incredible.
I thought I'd seen it all, but this is the first time I found out about Soda Lake. I always wondered where the Torpedo Teds from the credits were the whole time lol
I doubt they would care much. After all, it doesn't say anything about the levels being bad. Plus, this entire schematic takes some assumptions, like every fork in the roud going 50/50 and that no-one backtracks unless they need to. Which would both be inaccurate to actual players.
this isn't about which levels are forced entries (if it was this would leave half the game at 0% entrance rate) so Yoshi's House would have 100% attendance.
I think NSMB DS would be good for this series because of how both W4 and W7 are optional. Also, world 7 has some weird secret exits near the end that would be interesting for this type of video.
And the fact that you can straight from World 1 to World 5 to World 8 using the cannons accessed by the secret exits from World 1's Tower Level and World 5's Ghost House.
Whenever I see these video in my feed I always instinctively think its one of those "this level fucking sucks and heres why" videos but then I click on it and I remember
I think the main reason this game sees the fewest visitors in the late levels is quite simply the star road having the high amount of entry points it does have, absorbing a chunk of players at each entrance and not releasing them before the very end. And since each potential entry point sees a drop in players doing the main levels instead of the star road, the levels just naturally see fewer players the more star road entrances come before them. I think it'd be interesting to analyse what attendance would look like if we banned the star road, and assumed that every entrance to it is a dead end.
Hey CmeeCraft! Big fan of you and especially this unnecessary level series! It actually inspired me to do this for one of my favorite ROM hacks, Newer SMBW. I've already finished it and I just want to say keep up the good content!
I'm thinking maybe one of the Star World levels. Specifically Star World 3. I have no idea why, but that's just a hunch I have. Edit: I guess not Edit 2: I figured Forest of Illusion would be confusing Edit 3: pretty much the entirety of Chocolate island is useless lol
Wow! It was crazy to try to follow all of this, can't imagine all the time you put into making this! You really deserve more views and subscribers! I have been a fan for almost 2 years now, you do not disappoint when you upload!
I've been anticipating this video ever since the first most unnecessary video. It turned out nicely. Keep up the good work, I really enjoyed the video :)
Subscribed! I know this is just an experiment on a Mario game but it’s the one Mario game I’ve always enjoyed. Especially all the levels. So thank you and keep up the awesome work!
I love math vids like this. The only thing I'd want to tack on that it seems like you missed is that 37.5% of Marios would detour to the "TOP SECRET AREA" from the Donut Plains Ghost House before doubling-back from the dead-end and rejoining the crowd of 75% strong to Donut Plains 3.
Here's a good challenge that may take a while: 'How many fight do you have to move in to beat Luigi's Mansion 3' Essentially you must go through the game and every time you enter a fight you must stop completely in your tracks. You can turn around but you cannot move as Gooigi. A fight is only truly a fight if the ghosts are hostile, the ghosts are capturable and Luigi is trapped in the room. TIP: getting hit can be very useful for movement so stock up on gold bones
So, fun fact, my first Mario World playthrough completely accidentally skipped basically the entirety of the game. I did Yoshi's Island 100%, then went to Donut Plains 1 and from there went through the Star Road and straight to Front Door.
I really dislike that so many secret exits are required to beat the game, kid me was stuck multiple times until I looked the paths up. Wonder how many kids just gave up at Forest of Illusion... And a small subset of that would be 'how many kids broke their controller over Forest of Illusion 3'
I think SMW has the best overworld map for a 2d Mario platformer to date. The fact that there are so many different ways to get somewhere means you get a lot of replayability in the game. It is also a game where almost no two people are going to take the same route the first time through. I beat SMW by going through Star world 2 in Vanilla Dome.
This is a really cool, numerical look at the routing of this game, well done. Just a set of quick notes for you, while neither of these affect the overall numbers, there's a few interesting things I'd like to note that may affect percentages in certain spots: 1) I'm not sure I heard a discussion about the Marios that head to Donut Secret 2 from Donut Secret House, which rejoin the main group at Donut Plains 3. 2) While this is a dead-end and the Marios just rejoin the main group immediately, Donut Ghost House (NOT Secret House) has a Secret Exit for the Top Secret Area. 3) So funny thing about the Marios that enter Star Road from Soda Lake or the Forest Fortress without finding the Blue Switch Palace: they encounter an unassailable dead end at Star Road 5, which is not easily cleared without either having hit all four Switches, OR from carrying the Blue Yoshi from Star Road 2 to Star Road 5. Each Mario that encounters this will pretty much be heading back to the Front Door via the Star Road 5 Warp.
I think the Forest Ghost House dead end, and all other looped exits, should have been counted as technically, it would split the group, sending half back, rinse and repeat, causing an improbable infinite loop for a few unfortunate people.
If you're doing it with static split paths, it's going to be the last two levels before Bowser's Castle. If you do it with reason applied, it'll be Soda Lake. Watching you do the first few levels, it looks like it'll be the last two before Bowser's castle.
Even as a teenager playing SMW when it first came out, I couldn't get over just how many different paths there were, and an insanely huge number of secret levels. It was one of the only games that I was able to complete 100%. And believe you me, I was so proud of completing it fully. World was probably my favourite Mario game to play of all time.
One thing to consider though is that some secret exits may require the switch palaces, so some Marios won't be able to take that path. I know this could throw a whole other wrench into the statistics and all though, and make it much more complicated Another thing is that, while I guess statistically those two Valley of Bowser levels are the most "unnecessary," really the most unnecessary ones are the Special World levels as they award no progress toward the end game at all and might as well not exist as far as beating the game is concerned. Really those levels should probably be counted more like how 3-3 in NSMBWii was counted in that video, with zero Marios going there. Otherwise, great video as always!
Yes! You're back! I just had a thought for a future video. What if you combine your Mario Galaxy and Kirby No Jump Videos together and make a "Can I beat Mario Galaxy without Jumping?" video?
This is wicked fascinating. Now I want to know, what is the most unnecessary level in Super Mario Bros 3 considering the fact that there are warp whistles.
I think a better way of describing the Secret Star Road is like this: Mario is limited to 1 pass through the Secret Star Road, to prevent infinite loops. Therefore, all Marios dropped back at Yoshi's House will be evenly distributed back through the World again, increasing the percentage of subsequent levels proportionately to previous figures. This would increase the percentages for the final two levels, but they would remain the lowest compared to other levels.
Well of course it'd be one of the levels near the end if you go by that Star World nabs a higher and higher percentage of Marios as you progress. Honestly was thinking something more like the last switch palace but I didn't think Star World would be unexittable except to Bowser's castle. If you go through special world, it takes you back to the start, which I thought would lead to potentially being able to go anywhere. Not that anything in the video was wrong as it's all up to the creator to decide such rules.
Well, the explanation of the premise of this video was pretty darn confusing, but once I figured out what was being said, I was thouroughly interested.
personally for the secret exit that leads backwards to forest of illusion 1 i would count that as some marios repeating the level and as the number of times it is played increases, the amount of marios increases, and therefore there are infinity marios
If you really think about, based on the rules of another video (the Marios' sole interest is progression), all Special World levels should actually have 0% attendance because none of them help progress toward the end of the game. But by that logic an absolute ton of levels would be ignored (all Palaces, all levels in Valley of bowser beyond the path leading to the backdoor, etc), so I guess that rule isn't applicable here. And that's excluding Star World as a shortcut, considering how the shortest path to the end is via... it.
Rn imma guess that it's the final special world stage, dont remember what it's called. Edit: I dont like where this is going... especially how he's deciding it... Edit 2: Ok, but I think realistically it's still the least useful.
I love this but I have to be pedantic, because the special world dumps you out at the very start of the game and not in the star world does this not provide for another opportunity for players to get to levels they haven't visited yet? For example that contingent that took the first star world exit will be now provided a choice after donut 1, go to donut 2, go to donut ghost house, or donut secret 2. I guess this is really only a question because it is impossible to backtrack by simply going backwards after completing the special world. I'd love to see what you could make out of this variation.
but by that logic they could decide to go along normally after hitting the normal exit of a star world level, since those also make mario automatically go back to their corresponding star roads
I'm confused. By the rules established in the NSMBW video, 0 players would go to the Switch Palaces since they do not grant forward progression. (Actually, I argue that NSMBW is wrong in this scenario as the player doesn't know before hand that 3-3 isn't going to do anything.)
I can't even imagine how painful creating the chart for Forest of Illusion must have been
I am currently stuck in the forest of Illusion
Bruh people are always stuck in Forest of Illusion, why not just commit deforestation smh
im watching this and am left severly confused
flashbacks of the rocky mountain world thing on NSMBU
@Ethan Ethan 1. Finding a secret exit is hard
2. I am past it now
They really aren't lying when they say Super Mario World is open, the amount of paths you can take in this game is insane.
There are 96 exits
@@thatskitguy yes I know, I'm just commentanting on the amount of paths there are in Super Mario World.
I find the forest to be super weird. Other Mario games have secret paths, but the idea of forcing the player to find a secret exit is just weird
@@matthewhubka6350 It’s not called the “Forest of Illusion” for nothing.
@@matthewhubka6350 Always thought that the Forest of Illusion's purpose was to teach about the feature of secret exits to newcomers
I feel like it must be really satisfying when you reach 100% at the end, meaning you calculated everything correctly.
you know, I haven't thought about that...
Well as impressive as this video is- I’m thoroughly impressed!- it’s relatively basic, though multi step, math so if it didn’t add up there was a simple error in not adjusting for one or more of the binary possibilities
I was on 95/96 for so many years, then just played one of the ghost houses, exited a particular way and then got the 96/96. Felt great!
Thank goodness none of the secret exits outright require the switch palaces. (I know some intend for you to get them, but there are ways around them all.) I can’t even imagine the scenarios that would need to be played out in that case.
I genuinely thought there was one and I got so worried for CMee’s sanity
Thank you for mentioning because I was curious about this.
Yeah, the closest I can think of are Vanilla Secret 1 that almost requires the blue switch, but theoretically can be gotten without it. The other one is how green and red switches are very helpful for the Star World 4 secret exit, but not quite necessary.
Maybe you need all of them to access the special world, from star world 5? But I think you can bypass that with a blue Yoshi.
@@protoman1365 You can just use a blue yoshi. I normally just get the blue yoshi from star world 2 and use it for the rest of star world.
I was wondering about that. It’s been ages since I’ve played through the game, so I couldn’t remember if there was a switch palace requirement to reach certain exits.
It wasn't on the chart, but 37.5% of the Marios would have visited the Super Secret Area, grabbed some free power ups, maybe a Yoshi, then turned right back around to the ghost house they just came from.
Top secret area
For some reason Top Secret Area and Yoshi's House are not in this video.
@@Taurwathwylth Yeah because they technically aren't "levels"
@@davinchristino Hmmmmmmm!
Not so secret after all.
Looking at the logic map/flowchart, the star road's direct expressway to bowser's front door is the dealbreaker.
since so many of the Marios end up 50/50'ing funneling through it in one way or another, to wind up at the game's final level, it's not surprising that the levels immediately preceding that skip have the fewest %.
If you treat all entrances to the Star Roads as dead-ends, the calculation is actually pretty simple. All areas receive 100% of Marios (except the Butter & Cheese bridges, but they are created from a single fork, so it's 50/50, and they rejoin). So the only real division would be if there are multiple routes through a world.
And there are 3 areas with significant multiple routes (rather than just a single fork like Vanilla Dome). Those being Donut Plains, Forest of Mystery, and Valley of Bowser.
In VoB, Valley 3&4 have the least number of Marios, at 25% (there were two dividing lines). Donut Plains has a similar sequence of secret exit divisions, which leads to Donut Secret 2 and Donut Secret House receiving 25% of Marios. Also, Top Secret Area is visited by only 25% of Marios.
Forest of Mystery is pretty complex, but because the Star Road is considered a dead end, its levels all get more than 25% of Marios playing them.
So it's ultimately a 5-way tie. And since this tie still includes the same levels as this analysis deduced, I'd say that the analysis did discover something useful here.
Doesn't the Star Road lead to the Back Door?
Edit: I was wrong.
@@harrybest2041 No, it leads to the FRONT door. Valley of Bowser 2 (secret exit) is what leads to the Valley Fortress, which THEN leads to the back door.
I thought this was going to be a video about each level's merits in terms of game design.
Like... "Why did they even include this level? It doesn't have any interesting gameplay mechanics and doesn't challenge the player in any meaningful way, so it's unnecessary and could've been replaced with a more interesting concept."
I've got a list of those kind of levels.
Yeah, that's what I thought this was going to be too. I assumed I'd be getting a critique and examination of game design. But no, it's just a dude reading numbers to me for 15 minutes.
@@Treyworld nope not me
I thought that with the previous video I watch of his. I knew what I was getting into here.
This was and still is my favorite 2D Mario game because of all the interesting paths you can take.
The fact that it’s pretty open-world blew my mind because I was used to games like New Super Mario Bros. World 4 was especially interesting
Super Mario Bros 3 is better but this is my #2 2D mario game
Okay, you absolutely MUST find the most unnecessary level in Super Mario Bros 3. Those warp whistles in World 1 are going to send the train off the rails and into the river below with all of the possibilities.
Guessing every given level (pre-W8) has a 50% chance to use the warp whistle, and a 16.6% chance to go to 2/3/4 or 5/6/7
@@marshaltito641 No, it's not as simple as that. The worlds you can warp to with a warp whistle depend on which world you're in. I believe that Worlds 1-3 can warp you to 2,3,4, Worlds 4-6 to 5,6,7, and World 7 to World 8. But that's only if you didn't use a whistle immediately beforehand. If you use a whistle to go to World 2 and then immediately afterwards use a second whistle, you get the options of 5,6,7. And, you can actually use a whistle in the warp zone to go directly to World 8 (speedrun strats baby). Then you have to consider that half of the Mario population that enters 1-3 and 1-Fortress won't do the secret exits to get those whistles.
@@tylerlarsen1842 Forest of Illusions: Hahaha I'm confusion
Smb3: Pathetic
Not sure this is really possible with the same methodology, since there is the concept of "saving warp whistles for later".
Well, if you do Mario 3, good luck calculating the Warp Whistle.
My guess as to what would happen is that after the Warp Whistle is obtained, every time you go into a new level, half of the Marios instead choose to use the warp whistle
My guess is that every time a whistle is obtained it will be used immediately, and the Marios split into thirds to equally go into the sets of three pipes
@@visualgagging Though ultimately, it'll be for little gain. Since regardless of how the group is split, it'll have most Mario's continue on as normal, unless they do the Double Warp Whistle trick to skip all the way to World 8. Then the pre-requisite would be that Worlds 1-3 and 1-F be complete, then after 1-F, the Whistles are consumed. It's a mess of statistical uncertainties and assumptions they won't just do 1-3, skip 1-4, then hit 1-F or if they complete 1-4.
I'm guessing that it would get more complicated than people think.
Some players may use the warp whistle immediately from 1-3, to then choose either World 2, World 3, or World 4, _or_ just go to World 1-Fortress (or maybe even go to World 1-4, if they wanted, so you could split this into 1/5ths
_But_ if players choose to go to 1-Fortress (either immediately, or after 1-4 first), and they get the second whistle, then they have more choices.
They can use the first whistle to get to the Warp Zone, then they have 4 options.
They can go to World 2, 3 or 4, _or_ use the second warp whistle to go to World 8
_OR_ they can use the second whistle, in either Worlds, 2, 3, or 4, to then have 3 further options each, to Worlds 5, 6 or 7, which means from World 1, you have a total of 10 options so far.
_BUT_ ... yes, more buts.... what about if a player use a warp whistle to get to World 2, then gets a third warp whistle from the enemy battle course in World 2, then uses their second warp to get to the Warp Zone, and then uses that third warp to get to World 8?
And in terms of every new level = half, that makes sense, in theory, but does it work like that?
From 1-F(ortress), for example, 1/2 warp, 1/2 go to 1-5
From 1-5, 1/4 warp, 1/4 go to 1-6
From 1-5, 1/8 warp, 1/8 go to 1-A(irship)
And so on, but then the 1/8 that warped from 1-5, 1/32 may choose to go to Worlds 2, 3 or 4, each, or go to World 8, if they have two whistles, then from the 1/32, in Worlds 2, 3 and 4, at this point, 1/96 go to Worlds 5, 6 or 7.
But if the 1/32 that went to World 2, instead choose to get the last whistle so they have two again, then it goes more complicated.
You can warp from World 2, to World 5, and then from World 5 to World 5 (again), World 6, or World 7. Players are unlikely to warp from World 5 to World 5, so we'd probably choose World 6 or World 7.
But if a player warps from World 2 to World 6, they also have the choice of World 5, World 6 or World 7.
Before you think "Why choose to go to World 5 from World 6?"
How about this, for example.
Play gets 2 whistles from World 1.
They _don't_ use any whistles yet, and simply get to World 2 normally.
They then get the third whistle from World 2, and then use their first whistle to Warp to World 6 (because it's an option, and why not)
They then complete some levels of world 6, but then decide they want to go to World 5, instead, so they use a second warp whistle to go to World 5. Why would they do this? Why not. World 5 hasn't been completed yet, so why not?
But then, they might decide, screw this, and just use the last whistle to warp to World 7.
But what if we just completely ignore the whole Warp Zone altogether? IT's already complicated with 1-3, and 1-4 alone, since, after 1-2, and everyone knows you have 3 stages to choose from. You can go straight to 1-F. But you can also choose to either complete 1-3 first, or 1-4, first before 1-F. And futhermore, you can then choose to complete 1-4, after 1-3, before 1-F, or 1-3 after 1-4, before 1-F.
Ignoring warp whistles, obviously 100% of players play 1-F, but the percentage of players that play 1-3 and 1-4 each, will either be 50% each or maybe 66.667% each or something.
@@scmtuk3662 I’m pretty sure the consensus is that each player moves forwards, meaning that if they warped to World 6, they can only warp to World 7 the next time they use the whistle.
i think this is the last game that has that many secret exits
You mean the first game?
@@RGC_animation Both. No other game has nearly this many
The new soup games have about 3 per world
Stanley's parable? ;)
Super Mario Land 2 and the first Wario Land (SML3) have a few, but not nearly as many.
Me: this is a kids game. The chart can't be that confusing.
Forest of Illusion: hahaha secret exit goes *brrrr*
But what is the least necessary level in Hotel Mario
It's a tie.
Between all of them.
Y E S
@@bitratebenny2856 that’s actually true because hotel Mario doesn’t have a world map
I Heard Of You WaluigiGoesWa
The game itself was unnecessary
I’m curious, if a thousand people were polled on the levels they played, how would the results be different? Because, while this is fascinating, it is inaccurate representation of how people play to evenly split at every secret.
my prediction: yoshi's house
I was expecting that too but sure if he realized it's a playable level. Which shows how useless it is
@@JoshuaBarkdull actually given the way that these would work Yoshi's house would have 100% attendance since it is the first playable area you can enter so you'd have 100% go in and then branch of to YI1 and YI2 as they did here in this video leaving the end result entirely unchanged
I would have said yoshis island leading to the switch palace on the left. It's a dead end and you're making negative progress. It's the definition of unnecessary. I didn't understand any of the logic to this video.
@@gamesfond it's simply really. The logic of this video is that players would experiment with where to go so if we assume every junction in the game splits them off evenly how many players end up visiting every level
You would be right but this dude overcomplicates the question to give a more objective answer. It’s boring.
Doesn’t help that he sounds like a middle schooler wearing a suit.
"to put it more concisely: *less concise answer*"
i was so excited to see star world and forest of illusion. so many marios wound up in star world, and having almost half of all of them go through the special world is hilarious. forest of illusion was incredible.
I thought I'd seen it all, but this is the first time I found out about Soda Lake. I always wondered where the Torpedo Teds from the credits were the whole time lol
every red level and ghost house has multiple exists, yellow levels have one exit. that how you know about soda lake
@@AndrewJW Every ghost house except one, the Vanilla Ghost House.
You really take into consideration how many paths are in this game when you find out that just over 5% of players would take the normal path.
I wonder how the people that worked on the level feel about it being called the most unnecessary
I doubt they would care much. After all, it doesn't say anything about the levels being bad.
Plus, this entire schematic takes some assumptions, like every fork in the roud going 50/50 and that no-one backtracks unless they need to. Which would both be inaccurate to actual players.
Remember, all this ranking is completely arbitrary.
I imagine that’s not the only level they worked on, and they probably contributed to much more necessary ones as well.
Teacher: The test isn't that confusing
The test:
This game shows how open it is right from the beginning I mean what other Mario game lets you play every level in the game before playing level one
Yoshi's House. It is a skippable "level" and you can clear every single exit without so much as entering Yoshi's House
this isn't about which levels are forced entries (if it was this would leave half the game at 0% entrance rate) so Yoshi's House would have 100% attendance.
@@trueMCGRaven How would it have 100% attendance if it is optional and doesn't grant any progress towards Peach?
What program did you use for the flowchart?
I predict the Back Door of Bowser’s Castle.
After watching - I wasn’t THAT far off...
thank you RUclips algorithm, this is a series I didn't know i needed!
I think NSMB DS would be good for this series because of how both W4 and W7 are optional. Also, world 7 has some weird secret exits near the end that would be interesting for this type of video.
And the fact that you can straight from World 1 to World 5 to World 8 using the cannons accessed by the secret exits from World 1's Tower Level and World 5's Ghost House.
1:50 I predict Soda Lake. I never even knew that level existed until years later and It only leads to another Star Road entrance.
you fool!!!!!! because most of the marios go to world star before meeting up at the end, not that many are left to split paths
Whenever I see these video in my feed I always instinctively think its one of those "this level fucking sucks and heres why" videos but then I click on it and I remember
I think the main reason this game sees the fewest visitors in the late levels is quite simply the star road having the high amount of entry points it does have, absorbing a chunk of players at each entrance and not releasing them before the very end. And since each potential entry point sees a drop in players doing the main levels instead of the star road, the levels just naturally see fewer players the more star road entrances come before them.
I think it'd be interesting to analyse what attendance would look like if we banned the star road, and assumed that every entrance to it is a dead end.
That one secret level gives you the fire flowers cape feathers and Yoshi
holy crap, i can’t even begin to imagine the amount of work put into this. you just earned a sub!! :)
I want another Mario game as open as this one.
Hey CmeeCraft! Big fan of you and especially this unnecessary level series! It actually inspired me to do this for one of my favorite ROM hacks, Newer SMBW. I've already finished it and I just want to say keep up the good content!
I'm thinking maybe one of the Star World levels.
Specifically Star World 3. I have no idea why, but that's just a hunch I have.
Edit: I guess not
Edit 2: I figured Forest of Illusion would be confusing
Edit 3: pretty much the entirety of Chocolate island is useless lol
Wow! It was crazy to try to follow all of this, can't imagine all the time you put into making this! You really deserve more views and subscribers! I have been a fan for almost 2 years now, you do not disappoint when you upload!
watching this in math class, this is much more important percents than the ones we’re learning now
sans pfp
@@marshmallowdub that’s literally my self made avatar wth
I've been anticipating this video ever since the first most unnecessary video. It turned out nicely. Keep up the good work, I really enjoyed the video :)
So the secret exit has a secret exit which has a secret exit. IN THE SECOND WORLD.
the star world has 4 secret exits plus one super secret exit.
Yes, you could go eight straight levels that all hage secret exits.
Could u upload an image of the whole logic map? cause that looks WAY cool!
It would fit as a wall painting lol
I have been waiting so long. Thank you for making this.
Me halfway through this video: "aayyy like your funny words magic man"
I love this series! Keep up the great work 👍
I thought that this was going to be a rant about some random level in Super Mario World, but this was fun to watch too! Subscribed!
Subscribed! I know this is just an experiment on a Mario game but it’s the one Mario game I’ve always enjoyed. Especially all the levels. So thank you and keep up the awesome work!
After making this game's title screen theme my alarm, I will never be able to listen to it without flinching.
Yeah you've got to be careful with alarms.
I’m guessing it’s gonna be some levels from world 3 above the cave
I love math vids like this. The only thing I'd want to tack on that it seems like you missed is that 37.5% of Marios would detour to the "TOP SECRET AREA" from the Donut Plains Ghost House before doubling-back from the dead-end and rejoining the crowd of 75% strong to Donut Plains 3.
He also missed 100% Yoshi's House.
Neither of those levels grant any progress towards saving Peach, therefore none of the Mario's went there.
Here's a good challenge that may take a while: 'How many fight do you have to move in to beat Luigi's Mansion 3'
Essentially you must go through the game and every time you enter a fight you must stop completely in your tracks. You can turn around but you cannot move as Gooigi. A fight is only truly a fight if the ghosts are hostile, the ghosts are capturable and Luigi is trapped in the room.
TIP: getting hit can be very useful for movement so stock up on gold bones
Have you tried this
@@Matt-xv9tc I have but I never finished it and never came back to it because I was too busy with newer games
I can’t believe how many options are open to you as a player, I don’t really notice it that much when playing, but there’s a lot
So, fun fact, my first Mario World playthrough completely accidentally skipped basically the entirety of the game. I did Yoshi's Island 100%, then went to Donut Plains 1 and from there went through the Star Road and straight to Front Door.
The fact that I’ve never seen those floating island platforms proves this video lol
I really dislike that so many secret exits are required to beat the game, kid me was stuck multiple times until I looked the paths up. Wonder how many kids just gave up at Forest of Illusion...
And a small subset of that would be 'how many kids broke their controller over Forest of Illusion 3'
Content: Super Mario World
Description: Today we search for the most unnecessary level in New Super Mario Bros Wii.
Edit: He fixed it nvm
Lol.
I think they edited the description to correct it lol.
Even now, I didn't know Butter Bridge and Soda Lake even existed. No matter how many times I've played that game. Crazy!!
I think SMW has the best overworld map for a 2d Mario platformer to date. The fact that there are so many different ways to get somewhere means you get a lot of replayability in the game. It is also a game where almost no two people are going to take the same route the first time through. I beat SMW by going through Star world 2 in Vanilla Dome.
Such passion behind these ludicrous calculations, I LOVE IT!!!
This is a really cool, numerical look at the routing of this game, well done.
Just a set of quick notes for you, while neither of these affect the overall numbers, there's a few interesting things I'd like to note that may affect percentages in certain spots:
1) I'm not sure I heard a discussion about the Marios that head to Donut Secret 2 from Donut Secret House, which rejoin the main group at Donut Plains 3.
2) While this is a dead-end and the Marios just rejoin the main group immediately, Donut Ghost House (NOT Secret House) has a Secret Exit for the Top Secret Area.
3) So funny thing about the Marios that enter Star Road from Soda Lake or the Forest Fortress without finding the Blue Switch Palace: they encounter an unassailable dead end at Star Road 5, which is not easily cleared without either having hit all four Switches, OR from carrying the Blue Yoshi from Star Road 2 to Star Road 5. Each Mario that encounters this will pretty much be heading back to the Front Door via the Star Road 5 Warp.
I think the Forest Ghost House dead end, and all other looped exits, should have been counted as technically, it would split the group, sending half back, rinse and repeat, causing an improbable infinite loop for a few unfortunate people.
CMeeCraft: Time for one of those unnecessary videos.
Me: Then why did you do it?
You know, for fun!
Because they are fun
@@haronka They are, indeed
Man, ever since your first unnecessary video I knew this game had to be done. It did not disappoint.
This was such a great rabbit hole to get sucked into. Great video!
I love how eventually, more Marios end up at Star Road than in the main levels.
Your brain is probably on fire after doing all the math
I'm predicting it's the level with Torpedo Ted as most players never even know it exists.
which?
leave the name
@@Cootshk They only appear in one level, but I was wrong anyway.
@@Cootshk It was Soda Lake.
@@zeldagamer2123 oh ok ty
I knew soda lake but I forgot the torpedo teds (maybe bc I haven't played it recently)
All levels from Donut Plains 2 to Larry's Castle are unnecessary.
Thank you, Star Road!
If you're doing it with static split paths, it's going to be the last two levels before Bowser's Castle. If you do it with reason applied, it'll be Soda Lake.
Watching you do the first few levels, it looks like it'll be the last two before Bowser's castle.
Even as a teenager playing SMW when it first came out, I couldn't get over just how many different paths there were, and an insanely huge number of secret levels. It was one of the only games that I was able to complete 100%. And believe you me, I was so proud of completing it fully. World was probably my favourite Mario game to play of all time.
Now we need the most unnecessary star in SM64. Let's see how much this hurts all of our brains.
Me, at 3 AM, with no fucking clue what these numbers mean:
I like your funny words, magic man
Soda Lake because I didn't know how to get there when I was a kid.
It took me when I got out of high school.
One thing to consider though is that some secret exits may require the switch palaces, so some Marios won't be able to take that path. I know this could throw a whole other wrench into the statistics and all though, and make it much more complicated
Another thing is that, while I guess statistically those two Valley of Bowser levels are the most "unnecessary," really the most unnecessary ones are the Special World levels as they award no progress toward the end game at all and might as well not exist as far as beating the game is concerned. Really those levels should probably be counted more like how 3-3 in NSMBWii was counted in that video, with zero Marios going there.
Otherwise, great video as always!
Also you could make the flowchart public because it is pretty cool
Yes! You're back! I just had a thought for a future video. What if you combine your Mario Galaxy and Kirby No Jump Videos together and make a "Can I beat Mario Galaxy without Jumping?" video?
That is 100% a no, but how many jumps is a bit of an interesting question
Yes, the game I wanted to see!!! I love this!!! Thank you CmeeCraft!!! I love your vids
When you dream about a math test you didn't study for
The insanity of these secrets are why Mario became what we see in TerminalMontage. He just wanted to be free
This is wicked fascinating. Now I want to know, what is the most unnecessary level in Super Mario Bros 3 considering the fact that there are warp whistles.
*narrator talking about all these secret exits I should know about*
Me: *Wait hold up...*
I think a better way of describing the Secret Star Road is like this:
Mario is limited to 1 pass through the Secret Star Road, to prevent infinite loops. Therefore, all Marios dropped back at Yoshi's House will be evenly distributed back through the World again, increasing the percentage of subsequent levels proportionately to previous figures. This would increase the percentages for the final two levels, but they would remain the lowest compared to other levels.
You must have had a blast with Forest of Illusion
This is the perfect game for this kind of video. It’s probably the Mario game with the most secrets to date!
Well of course it'd be one of the levels near the end if you go by that Star World nabs a higher and higher percentage of Marios as you progress. Honestly was thinking something more like the last switch palace but I didn't think Star World would be unexittable except to Bowser's castle. If you go through special world, it takes you back to the start, which I thought would lead to potentially being able to go anywhere. Not that anything in the video was wrong as it's all up to the creator to decide such rules.
I've never seen this series or this channel at all, so I thought this was a once-off thing about some level that somebody doesn't like.
Well, the explanation of the premise of this video was pretty darn confusing, but once I figured out what was being said, I was thouroughly interested.
Wait this video came out 6 minutes ago, well that’s quite early
This was truly unnecessary, but ended up being really interisting and entertaining to watch!
Ooh, delicious flowcharty goodness. Time to see what else this channel has on the menu.
personally for the secret exit that leads backwards to forest of illusion 1 i would count that as some marios repeating the level and as the number of times it is played increases, the amount of marios increases, and therefore there are infinity marios
If you really think about, based on the rules of another video (the Marios' sole interest is progression), all Special World levels should actually have 0% attendance because none of them help progress toward the end of the game. But by that logic an absolute ton of levels would be ignored (all Palaces, all levels in Valley of bowser beyond the path leading to the backdoor, etc), so I guess that rule isn't applicable here. And that's excluding Star World as a shortcut, considering how the shortest path to the end is via... it.
Rn imma guess that it's the final special world stage, dont remember what it's called.
Edit: I dont like where this is going... especially how he's deciding it...
Edit 2: Ok, but I think realistically it's still the least useful.
I love this but I have to be pedantic, because the special world dumps you out at the very start of the game and not in the star world does this not provide for another opportunity for players to get to levels they haven't visited yet? For example that contingent that took the first star world exit will be now provided a choice after donut 1, go to donut 2, go to donut ghost house, or donut secret 2. I guess this is really only a question because it is impossible to backtrack by simply going backwards after completing the special world. I'd love to see what you could make out of this variation.
but by that logic they could decide to go along normally after hitting the normal exit of a star world level, since those also make mario automatically go back to their corresponding star roads
Not even 4 minutes in and we got the decimal point involved. Much hype.
Teacher: the test is not confusing
The test: forest of illusion
Wow.... a video game and a math lecture combined into one!
I'm confused. By the rules established in the NSMBW video, 0 players would go to the Switch Palaces since they do not grant forward progression. (Actually, I argue that NSMBW is wrong in this scenario as the player doesn't know before hand that 3-3 isn't going to do anything.)
The rules have changed.
Now, these Marios no longer know if an exit would open a new path or not.
this video was so cool to watch thanks for the great content
I love this whole concept. Have you considered using Sankey diagrams to show population flow?
I love this video! If it's possible, could you link the graph of all the Mario's paths?
How do you even think of these ideas haha, these vids are so strange but also fascinating as well