The Hype For Star Citizen is Real This Time (Ft. SaltEMike) | Launch Sequence Podcast
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- Опубликовано: 2 авг 2024
- Star Citizen has had its ups and downs, and oftentimes the news surrounding these times can be exaggerated. With so many additions coming soon to Star Citizen, and so many major statements being made, it can be hard to know if it’s time to get truly excited. Today I’ll be discussing the current outlook for Star Citizen based on recent news, and how it has affected SaltEMike’s hype for the future.
Today’s Guests:
@SaltEMike
Twitch - Twitch.tv/SaltEMike
RUclips - / saltemike
Twitter - SaltEMike
ToC:
00:00 Introduction
03:20 What Games Are You Playing?
09:25 What Is Star Citizen Doing Right?
14:40 New Dynamic Events?
19:55 What’s Star Citizen Doing Wrong?
34:50 Employees Leaving CIG
42:50 Update Schedule For The Year
50:45 Cargo Missions & Freight Gameplay
01:06:40 Major Design Decisions
01:19:30 Could Star Citizen Reach Mass Appeal?
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Игры
Space tomato and Saltemike 🤯
Salted Tomatoes
Space Salt FTW
Oh damn! Wish I would have been able to catch this live on Twitch with you, Tomato. Cool combo! My two favourite SC content creators.
Two of my favorite SC creators and I enjoyed the podcast, thanks for doing it!
Elite had trade routes that worked with a back-end database system of sypply vs demand. The missions in ED were often just deliver X amount of stuff to this place there and you got the commodities with that mission, if you invested somre money in you could take extra goods of this commidity to sell on the side and because the missions took demanded items you would make a decent profit. This also teached you what was needed where without looking up all sorts of guides. I feel like CIG could take that Idea and run with it.
52:35 I honestly think it would he cool if you can eventually buy a "home" location that is your own personal instance where you can choose to invite people or orgs. This way you can keep and hoard all your little treasures or items you want to keep for you! Let the goblins horde
amen
Exactly, They have SO MUCH space IN SPACE lmao. give us all Personal space stations that sits out in space and can be customizable(obviously nothing too in depth) where we change the color scheme and furnishing schemes etc.
In context of the cargo missions, IRL there are large haulers which take a lot of cargo but take longer and typically have to go through a hub. Expediters are small vans that can take small amount of cargo but can go to point to point and are much faster. You pay more per pound/kilo because of this.
Early backer: Don’t get hyped yet. It’s been all talk. Get hyped after the patch drops and CIG has told the truth.
Hope your cat is doing well Mike👍
Fingers crossed. I think youtube picked up on me hearing about Lola cause I got recommended a video about a future kitty kidney treatment.
ruclips.net/video/w05AH-3Vog0/видео.htmlsi=afG-yPMsqWGyGKW_&t=11
It would be nice if the cargo missions were dynamic. A beacon goes out saying they need Titanium. Once a mission generates the value of the product will be high if sold there. As haulers sell the value goes down until they have a surplus. Then they will still buy but for less than market value. Discouraging sales there.
It works right now because we only have 1 system, but once we get closer to a One Shard One Universe, i won't make sense. A Player Driven Economy will solve this naturally in terms of what is going on in the universe, if there is a war, discovery of a rich planet, high demands, etc.
The way it will be done is eventually, we will have live feed of the system economy on dashboard, mobiglass app, or some sort, like in TDD. Youll know where to sell or buy your stuff anywhere. Eve Online did it, and it works flawless.
I honestly think stealing and trolling will be a non issue.
What I expect is the ability to press charges on strangers for lots of things.
A player loads up items owned by you in his ship in range of your scanners, you get a small temporary thing you can click to say he's stealing (or not click if it's a friend helping) and depending on the value of the item it will lower the person's reputation a certain amount, and if that person is brought to justice ai if he ends up in jail you could get a small partial financial compensation for the harm he's done to you. Perhapse that compensation is based on the amount of ore he mines while in jail.
I would hope cargo missions can progress to quite large amounts, either requiring you to take multiple trips or group up with others in multiple ships and convoying for speed and security. However that might be at odds with freight elevators if your friend can't land in your hangar. Maybe sharing a cargo mission means your buddy can call up the same batch of cargo to their hangar.
The commodity vs mission cargo discussion:
I could see commodity being for freelance cargo haukers trying to make their own routes and just buying and selling their own goods.
Missions could have pre paid cargo by the contract giver that then pay you to transfer, or the open call is for a specific company on planet that they need the material immediately and in lore that company is paying you instead of just the market exchange TDD terminals they have now.
Basically, NPCs you sell to vs the current TDD commodity trading
pretty insightful stuff thanks for the podcast you should do more with Mike and maybe another guest too. Great to see this colab
"You need to change your name man, to SugarMike"
Holding Mike's beer
"I absolutely hate..."
I hope they don't go too far with attempting mass appeal but the point about WoW is a big one. Consider that survival games are popular though, as well as FPS games. Star Citizen has the potential to blend these things in a whole new but still familiar way.
I believe in a world where the game can let a player just hop on to shoot things in FPS while still having it tie into the rest of the game in a symbiotic way. Think of the WoW players who only PVP or only raid who rely on all the people who actually bother with crafting and other things. It probably won't ever be as easy to just pick up as something like COD, but I think it can be something that appeals to people who like both loot/item-based AND shooters which is still a pretty big crowd. I think it can still do this while being the deep and immersive space sim that many of us also want it to be.
I hope one day to RP as a broke civilian opportunist with no ship, and I like that there can be potentially many different roles with a natural progression in the cargo industry in game. I could get a job in my starting city or local distribution centre loading/unloading plenetside traders, build rep as a good box monkey and work on the big Hulls at orbital stations... maybe find a job on a deep space crew as a loader/gunner, get pirated and kidnapped by slavers 10 systems away, escape in a snub craft but with no QT drive and limited fuel, find an abandoned outpost on a remote moon but end up marooned...survive 3 days until completely out of food and water then decide it's bettter to go quick rather than starve, so take a walk with no helmet. lol. Technically that all could be possible in SC, and I'd rather play a nobody on adventures than be the captain of a capital ship.
"Distribution centers, the big giant microcosms of all FPS-related gameplay" said Jared in SCL a few days ago. So, distribution centres are all about shooting, then.
Well, you had that split between S42 and the PU. Now that both get 'reunited' on the dev side, you don't need two directors running mostly the same thing I guess. Same with the assistant directors.
i think albion online is a really good direction/ example for how Star Citizens level of security should work.
On the topic of skins - what do you think about "paint shops" where you can apply skins on looted items (it should be very cheap), and if you buy it at a weapon shop, you can choose a skin there. If a looted item has a skin, it stays when you pick it up.
I like the way you think. Having a paint for a ship be a physical item in your inventory is a really silly thing IMO. And yeah, they should have just stuck with the tried-and-true skins for player items. It's dumb having a whole new item just because it looks different.
Very much looking forward to what we can do with this game.
I feel that someone like Todd Pappy may have left for one of two reasons.
Either SC has reached a point where he's satisfied with his work and that the project will be fine without him, so he can finally rest and move on... Or he believes the project is going in a bad direction that he doesn't like and has no power to change it.
Its one or the other. And we'll find out which one this year.
I've had two occasions in my work life where I wanted out even though the jobs were good considering alternatives in the location or site... and the pay was above average.
Yet 10 yrs doing the same thing more or less can drive some people stir crazy.
Great episode. I'm curious what they do with cargo missions, if it has value, what stops you from selling it somewhere instead of delivering, or offloading it to a friend or being pirated, crashing (ship or server) and so on.
Just delivering things you can't otherwise sell would at least work for now and would make cargo elevators at outposts quite "safe".
I hope we can order snubs and ships and be able to load them up on the larger ships, like fitting a Carrack with it's snub ship.
I think that's about how it will be
I hope there's a full wipe with 3.23. I need the incentive to get back into the PU. I'm spending most of my SC time in AC these days because I feel as though every drop has been wrung out of the PU.
I wouldn’t be surprised, with the whole new economy changes being worked in, as they have mentioned on SC Live
@@mattst2717 Elaborate please or link with timestamp
Do think they wipe for 3.23 and pyro (4.0) or just one? Seems like the are trying to full wipe less and less.
@@StatikXero Who really knows but I feel that 4.0 is some time off yet. They haven't really got the replication layer working smoothly let alone server meshing so it could still be years away. .. With all the stuff coming with 3.23 I reckon it would be a good time for a fresh start but I have no idea what CIG thinks about it.
@@BobWobbles
Good point! i forgot about the server meshing and replication layer stuff. I suppose 3.23 would be as good a time as any then.
I don't think death of a spaceman is coming, especially not to the level they originally discussed. They have to know who their player base is. And yes, they have to cater to their player base.
I loved this episode. Always great to see you and SaltEMike together in a show. Y'all touched on something in the middle with instanced hangars. I hope they treat personal hangars as a property you can purchase in game. You get your one free one on your home planet, but then you could buy or rent other locations too. It would be a good money-sink for sure. GTA does it, and so does CP2077 plus many MMOs, so I don't see that sort of thing NOT happening with SC.
Great video, Space and Salty need to do more of these.
I believe its possible to have save zones organicly because of the sheer amount of space people have to traverse. If you have long term reputation, unlawful palyers cant refuel in UEE space so they won't be able to travel to the core systems unless they organzie a bunch of starfarers. That amount of organization will already prevent most players from making the trip. Also we have choke points with the jump points where they can easily set up turrets etc. I want them to at least try before just slapping a no combat zone on.
love salt on my tomatoes
Runescape, living between Lumbridge and Varrok. Then, when your 100+ hours in, you head to the wilderness and face other players, high teir enemies, and fee and far between places to restock.
Thats how i imagine SC systems eventually
3.23 is keeping me from jumping into the PU myself. Not because it isn't fun, though. There are just so many new features coming I can't be bothered to play until they are in game.
Last video I watched from Cool Worlds had the word phrase “Salted Star” and Tomato starts with the Salt master Salt E Mike
Commodity Trading will never go away because of two ships. Banu Merchantman and Drake Kraken Privateer. People want to live out their inner Marco Polo.
1:05:00 I wouldnt mind if the game produces cargo missions, since we would 3rd party websides anyway elite dangerous style. or have a stock market app, but i dont want to fly in and check locations manually
So easy to fix the items problem salty mike got. Make them stolen once the item has been claimed. And every time you claim an item, the item respawn time gets longer and more expensive. If done more than once, maybe a day or week. Getting scanned with stolen items will get you in truble every time you get scanned and done.
Love that Salty Mike is talking about Albion! So cool to hear worlds collide.
I'd like it if the planet to port cargo missions will be the local runs with smaller amounts and then they all go to another port via a large manifest haul on a Hull-C.
Adding an npc scort system would make money actually a thing to want to keep earning... Same with destructible bases in pyro.
I may be an odd one here, but my two favorite features coming in this update is the character creation and mobiglass. I loved how when they added the hair in 3.22 it gave much needed life to the verse. I'm excited that the CC will do the same but on a broader scale. Being able to identify someone by their look and voice versus just a name tag.
Not even the Star map? Yikes that is a bit odd yes. Apparently you don't fly a lot or you're fine with the Star map as is...
Anyone know the name of the Outro sng?
I always wondered why it was "salty" Mike because I only know him through your last two or so streams with him. :-) Maybe "SweetT Mike" now?
He describes perfectly his these cargo missions SHOULD run, though.
1:15 "they've been able to keep punching it up" (cig about cit con hype)
Would you say that Citizen Con is "punching above its weight?"
If so, do we expect a nerf?
Dont worry boiz! Sometimes you need a little change in what your playing and then coming back refreshed.
My best friend is holding off from playing sc right now until 3.23 is coming.
Also as a owner of almost every kind of ground vehicle in the game i cant wait for 3.23 to come ❤
As someone who has been testing/playing sc since 2013-2014 the constant thing about the game is change. When you accept that the game is more alive im really amazed and happy.
Really great show thank you both
Excellent conversation...
Two of our top content creators.
SugarMike is possibly the best thing you've said.
IMO cargo missions don't make sense long term. What I think will happen is that locations will put out BUY orders for X amount of material. There will be some game mechanic that determines how much of that BUY order you can fulfill at once, and what the time limit will be, e.g. reputation. The BUY order doesn't care HOW you fulfill the mission, doesn't tell you what ships to bring, where to buy the stock from, where to mine it from, etc. That's on the player to figure out. CIG will have to implement a trading app, so that we can see real-time prices at all (legal) locations, in all systems. Then you decide, well, we need 4,000 SCU of Titanium, and the balancing distance and cost, the "best" price is in Terra. At Terra, there are a bunch of SELL orders for Titanium. You fulfill those contracts by spending the money, so that you have a bunch of Titanium waiting for you at a station in Terra now. Then it's just a matter of taking your ship to Terra, loading everything up, and bringing it back and fulfilling the contract you accepted. If you do it faster than the deadline, you get a higher reward. If you fail to do the mission, you take a reputation hit, and the BUY order you took returns to the overall pool.
a simple fix was always to turn sub store items into skins, they can be infinitely reapplied to new items, but become locked to the owner so that way we cant turn around and sell them to other players.
we dont lose the things we paid for, and we dont remove their "worth" from the game.
Gainning credits will matter when they do the wipe and they assure that will be the last one. Hope that's when they got the server meshing and all the pieces work as intended, reputation and economy.
Phase 1 appears to be grab data on XT opperatives (Data Heist), Phase 2 is a bunch of bounty missions taking out those opperatives... not sure what happens beyond that but I know SPK is involved
Game needs to be fun to play, inmersive, make you feel you progressing, not to easy not to hard. Voila!
Big hype for cargo elevators! I love moving boxes... I thoung although community is apprehensive, they will get on board. People do a lot of seemingly boring, simmy, trucker type stuff in this game already! I think thry gonna love it. And if they dont, timers with a cost or hull c trading will be there for them
In regards to DoaSM you need to make sure medical and insurance is working successfully before you even humour the idea!
Greatest crossover ever ! Love you both. Thanks for the content as always ! 🥂
Awesome discussion !
Yo we need more info about this new YT Premium membership feature! I've been Premium user since when it first started or something and I'd toss my 10 bucks towards Tomato ASAP
When you said SugaMike, I laugh so hard my gut hurt!
Great talk as always 🍅❤
This year is just gonna be weird. Weird in a "I've been neglected for years and now I'm getting attention, but I don't quite trust that they aren't trying deceiving us" kinda way.
I don’t often agree with Mike but this time and in long form I really have found myself resonating with a lot of what he’s saying.
I honestly can’t imagine being in his position having backed for so long and seen such slow and disjointed progress.
I’ve backed from 3.17 and even I’m exhausted from the lack of gameplay and excessive ship sales and promises.
Great show all around and very balanced. Sugar Mike thooooo 🤔 😅
Two of my favorites. 🤯
They should be like tomato said. Big freighters go to distribution centers and small ships and argos shuttle freight to planet. Small freighters can go directly to planets. They need to study modern freight movement with ships, trains, trucking and hot shots or even couriers. Very simple but Noone seems to be thinking of it.
Players could get direct contracts based on reputation and not need brokers or go independent.
Also, we don't need freight loading. in the future, ships would be loaded by robots or drones.
Get HYPE!
I'm certainly not going to spend more than 5 minutes moving cargo around by hand. But that doesn't mean that this isn't someone else's preferred gameplay.
Have you played Myth of Empires? It's a medieval Ark Survival Evolved with castle building and sieges. Markiplier did a funny video about it 2 years ago.
Is there any details on there being a wipe for 3.23? Also, do you happen to know if there will be any missions for Touring class ships. I finally got my hands on a 600i Touring, although there's nothing for it to do now, will 3.23 hold any promise for gameplay in that direction? (people hauling)
Its a dam good job ST is a good listener, I watched i listened and sadly I still wont return to Salty Mikes content, looking forward to your next and yes always good to have a different viewpoint even though I often do not agree. Sadly my view of the marketing of SC and the way so much is effected in respect to the creators the good and the bad aspects have changed my view to this type of discussion and RSI is partly to blame using creators to promote the product and those same creators accepting the fact as it generates income, I guess I am saying however good the content created by you all there is something I just find wrong with the way this all works. But that's modern life and know i am in the minority.
Bone!
same ol'bull
Perhaps they would actually have gone for a stable engine and then put in an actual game enviorment that would not waste your game time with disconnects
Every time I log into CS I see NPCs standing on top of stuff and clipping through stuff and I think well, no progress made. The "hype" is just hype if they can't fix even the smallest of bugs.
I suppose these guys don't know since they don't engage in piracy. But a of 3.22 if you take some else's cargo from their ship in common array you get charged with theft. And each box is a new charge. I have gotten CS3 from committing no crime other than moving boxes from an M2. I imagine if you take some one else's cargo from a landing zones you get the same rules for CS applied for theft.
Mike's take on Todd Papi is the only professional, reasonable take. People live lives, and people have needs, I don't believe Todd would leave the game in a bad place. I don't believe CIG would leave Todd in a bad place. Even if one of those things did happen, it's not the end of the world. The best thing to do, in situations like this, is to treat everyone's needs with respect and look for the best way to proceed.
What about bosses and boss loot
Mmmmm salty roasted tomatoes
Is Tood Papi leaving CIG?
Todd is gone, yes.
@@Lord_Kantor Damn, I don´t like the new
I think it’s probably better off for everyone he didn’t really seem all that excited about what he was doinf
@@thesneak86 I noticed that too... Not quite the enthusiasm as others at CIG. 10 yrs was enough or it was the Job done, time to move on thing.
Insecure people panic over someone changing a job place, there are several people who leaves for personal reasons. Almost 10 years at one place is a long time and it is perfectly natural.
The complaints about last week’s SC Live in regards to “Not in 3.23” are kinda silly because they had already spelled out in previous videos what 3.23 was going to hold. The people who don’t follow SC super closely and only tune in to big info dumps like Citcon and SC Live Would be severely disappointed if there isn’t a Q/A that clarifies what is in the new patch as well as WHAT IS NOT in the patch. If you know what to expect, you won’t be disappointed at patch launch. This Q/A lowers people’s expectations to a healthier limit to prevent disappointment. To get irritated or mad about them answering questions that US, the community, asked is dumb and a waste of time. Just accept what we get this next patch because even in their more infant stages this patch, with just half of what they are saying will be in it, will be an amazing patch.
I am not a big fan of how negative Mike is and his content but this was a good interview. Keep up the good content Tomato!
I think it provides a nice balance to everyone else's enthusiasm. His outlook is usually much more realistic, and I appreciate it.
Thanks for the feedback. @@CeesaX
did they ever say there wouldn't be skills at all? wasn't it just abstract skills that you unlock with points?
I think not having skills that you have to unlock is good as long as there's still mechanics with some kind of gating, be that player real skill or some kind of tool, gear or ships. The promise of mechanics requiring player skill is very cool but it doesn't seem to be where the game is going and that's sad.
I don't think it'll ever be a poont system. It's planned more like a light version of Tarkov where doing things raises it's stat. So decreased stamina use from doing lots of running/vaulting perhaps, or recoil control from a lot of full auto. Equally this could work the other way, perhaps building resistance from frequent use of painkillers.
@@Anonnymouse53 That's in my opinion one of the worst possible systems, though, because it removes all player agency or skill from the task. And/or creates very artificial skill farming actions that make the player's experience less gameplay oriented and more grindy.
Like jumping with a backpack full of trash across the map in tarkov to level up strength. Or crafting a thousand iron daggers in skyrim.
I sincerely believe if there are perks to be gained that make your character better at doing certain things, those should be gained naturally by playing. And that can't be enforced if there's a stupid meta way to increase those abilities.
If it were my decision to design this I would oppose, and if production pushed for such a shallow system I would add treadmills and weightlifting to the game. And basically a training rig for every single skill in the game that makes your skill go up faster than doing the real thing in any way.
This would make players incentivized to follow a skill farming method that is both immersive and intended by design, however weird it feels. A bit like in gta san andreas.
@@PolBlanesCebrian You're right, this will undoubtedly get botted. Possibly they could restrict it to actions taken in a gym or shooting range. In fairness it works pretty well in Tarkov - but in Tarkov all you do is combat.
However, I'm pretty sure based on what I've heard there will never be a points base skill system in SC & that's just a game design decision.
Personally I'm OK with it, so long as they are minor buffs - especially anything that concerns combat.
I dont feel like killing a player or stealing a ship is griefing. Now doing it to the same person over and over where they cant play sure.
100% agree, people these days (especially streamers) can't distinguish the differences.
Griefers were always players who continuously kills the same person to stop them having any fun.
And then there's the random encounter than engages you in normal PVP.
So tired of hearing about all the things. Cant wait for June so we can actually get it in our hands.
What I hope is the retrieval system won’t dupe anything, it will remove it from the game once you reclaim it
The reason why SC might feel more dead than ever despite features galore we're having is because neither of those features are actually part of the core that would turn SC into a real game: progression, upkeep, economy, properly organized group play
InspiredMike
aww dang allready bought Helldiver2 lol guess this game can wait anither year lol
: )
Yes! Death to commodity trading! It makes no sense in SC. The entire point of Quantum is to generate CONTRACTS that players compete with NPCs/AI for.
o7
Q1 almost done, nothing has changed. CIG has already postponed some content. Idc what they’re working on, what they hype, whatever ISC they do. The only thing that matters is what they actually release in a good state.
For sub items and loose them. There is a simple solution...
Make all sub items a skin or craftible that takes resources. That way it takes effort to recover them.
If a sub has an issue with it, they can grow up and feel scammed, as the harsh reality is that dupping benefits noone.
Citizen con in the 42'th week of the year - coincidence. With their anounced special event on the 18'th
Feeling downed on ship is yes .. felt!
The most dusappointing for me was mining gameplay loop with all those bits and heads. Should some exists? Heads yes but not so many kinds I am lost just with that and heads should be exchangeable from withon ship on all ships, bits hell fuck NO TO GIMMICK HARD CORE TIME WASTER.
I currently pledged for.... I font remember the name... 3 head mining ship. I don't know how it holds today but essentially stopped mining altogether the patch we were told "but you know... because you have 3 heads then you should get friends if you want the same rock you were mining previous patch".
Fuck friends, fuck mining.
And then.... and them today we see mining ship WITH their own refinery....
WHAT THE FUCK!
The Argo Mole is for MULTICREW mining. Trying to use it for solo mining is... possible but not its intended purpose. For solo asteroid / atmosphere mining get the Prospector.
I disagree with Mike heavily on the reclaim situation:
Other MMO's have handled this in the past by binding the item to your character, and then only giving you the option to delete the item if you want to remove it from your inventory/bank. Just setting a flag on the item, and forcing a "no more than one in inventory/bank" system like literally every other MMO on the market would solve the entire issue that Mike has with the system, which is super rare items getting duplicated or handed out. Same flag could lock it to your inventory if you die, that way it can't be looted off you.
As it stands, no one will ever take out their armor or guns they received as rewards, because if you die? That's it. It's gone. There are really no other games that have the balls to do that, because it'd be a legal nightmare to have an item you paid money for be removed from you outside of TOS abuse. So as it stands - Let people reclaim items, limit them to one on your person or in your bank at a time, and then flag it to be "soulbound"/untradable/unlootable.
Easy fix for duping items. You can only repair an item if your account owns that item. If you loot an account item, you can use it. But when it breaks due to wear and tear, its garbage.
This aint no patch for me, its a bloody rework lol
I think people forget every player isn't simply "this" or "that" kind of player. Yeah, I like dangerous, challenging content sometimes, but in a MMORPG you can't for the player to simply log out if he's tired after work or can't pay full attention because he's playing alt-tabbed waiting for a call from work. The whole idea that each player plays a single way 100% of the time is just so weird coming from adults who actually play games...
They wont deliver shizzle
make ground vehicles good. Make some sort of environmental be it weather/ Electronic interference like the movie AVATAR "blue alien" That makes flying difficult to impossible and the storm or interference could last forever like the eye of Jupiter or the mountains of AVATAR and make it to where you would need the ground vehicles to traverse it