I feel like Glen Fricker should do some tests with this as well! I could totally see him running some pre-recorded DI's through some amps and taking a look at the null tests to see the differences in tone.
You beat me to it! But the BrownBox doesn't come with a frequency response chart!!! Then again neither does a tone pot and capacitor. His rebuttal will be an "in a metal band mix context." But yeah, I use mine for a feel thing more than a tone thing.
Fricker literally said a 5150 and a re to basically sound the same. Don't look at him for anything audio. He's neat for some screaming and ranting. Nothing more.
Clean consistent power!!! Most people don’t realize how everyone on your grid is pushing noise voltage drops and spikes into your mains. Conditioning your power is a huge aid in so many ways. Your gear will thank you.
This really helps make the case for using a Kemper or something similar when touring. I prefer the real tube amp sound, but for consistency and reliability, I think the writing is on the wall. Recording is a completely different story though. Thanks for the video, you've been Fluff and I've been entertained!
I struggled with a lot of tube amps feeling extremely stiff and unplayable, but only some of the time. Then, I found out my voltage was 123-125. When the space heater turned on my amp sagged a bit and felt great. Took me a while to realize what was happening. The space heater would have such a draw on the circuit that it would drop the voltage by almost 5 volts. So I got one of these to compensate. Use it all the time. Just not with a space heater 🙂
Lets say they don't affect the tone, the fact that they save the life of the tubes and amp itself make the unit well worth the buy in price. I kept blowing tubes left and right in a few of my vintage amps until I got these.
I have one of these. I bought it because we have high wall voltage where I live (123-124 V) and this allows me to reduce the input voltage down to 120 and then attenuate from there. I usually run mine around 117-118 v and I find that's a really good spot personally. If you live somewhere with high wall voltage, this is the easy answer. There are also Variacs which do a similar thing but they sometimes require a separate multimeter for testing voltage and I think there's a Furman power conditioner which lets you choose the voltage for multiple power outlets. I find this more convenient and cheaper than the Furman and I think it also has additional filtering on the power to reduce interference from other devices on the power such as a computer. I do think there's another device that's superior if you're traveling internationally which should be in Angus Young's rig rundown. It does a similar deal with power regulation, choosing the output voltage, and can take a line with low voltage and up the voltage so it's okay too use, etc. It costs more than most nice tube amps though since it's a medical device.
These are great to have just to keep your amp running as designed, especially vintage amps that were designed with power transformers designed to run on 110 volts. This keeps the filament circuit for the tubes running at the correct transformed voltage.
@@BenState yes, but it does have a lot to do with the heater circuit as well. The tubes need 6.3 volts. If the transformer is designed for 110 volts AC and the source is giving 120 volts, now the transformed voltage for the heaters is higher than 6.3 volts. The voltage for the plates is higher too.
@@BenState The “balance resistors” that some amps have in the filament supply are to form an artificial center tap if the transformer does not have one, can also control hum. Many of the amps I’ve worked on do not have a circuit in place to regulate heater voltage. Maybe a rectifier circuit to transform it to DC, but that still doesn’t control voltage level.
The EVH Variac thing. The reason for that was he plugged in a UK made 240v amp into a US 120v socket. “Why does this thing sound weird?” This is before amps has a power switch to change voltage. He bought a Variac and dropped the transformer input to match the 120v out of the wall. He wasn’t going for a ‘magical’ sound. He realized going down to 90v would drop the volume. The amps didn’t have master volumes either. That’s all it was.
I believe so. I've lived in more than 1 place with questionable wiring, and when I was on tour there were so many power related issues and sometimes, even with a rack unit with an identical setting I could not get the tone I wanted
Here where i live in Quebec the voltage is very inconsistant . Now i know back in time why i hate/love my jcm800 tone ! Probably the variation in voltage . My dual rectifier sound always the same no matter what ! 🤘🏼
You can tell by the current draw that the Orange needs to be biased a lot warmer. It’s probably in the 35 to 40% range right now. You don’t need to crank it, but you’re probably hearing a lot of crossover distortion like it is. The Marshall is probably perfect where it is.
i have one for my 1960 Bassman and 69 Super. I can hear the difference and it has to be better for my old amps to run at the power they were designed for.
I remember the small town bars , all were different , That time the room wasn't large but my classic 50 was really quiet, I really had to turn it up I knew the power was iffy.
If it would be such a big game changer there would be definitely more of these devices from different manufacturers out there. I am always suspicious when there is only device in the market supposedly doing the trick for you.
What I am hearing at the lower voltages is that Orange muddy OD that I don't like about Orange Amps, and which doesn't exist at 120v. The Marshall had a similar effect, but the lower voltage seemed like more useful a tone.
Well by lowering the line voltage you're messing with the tube heaters as well as bias so yes its gonna make a big difference. Big name acts like AC/DC use the Kikisui power conditioner unit
I have experienced similar problem with Engl Fireball (the only tube amp I ever owned and it never left home). On somedays it sounded, what I can best describe, as unfocused (not sure what exactly was going on with the sound, but I didn't like it at all). I've bought cheapest stabilizer with good reviews (something like 30$ cheap) and the problem was gone. I'm sure as hell you don't need "guitar" stabilizer for that, unless you want to spend significantly more money for fancier box
I tried recording an album with tube amps and gave up because tone changed from day to day, or even same day. Since a few years back I'm digital only and way more happy with consistancy
Dumb question: I just run my amps through a furman power conditioner, so what is the difference between this unit in the video and what power conditioners do?
This was interesting. I also like the Marshall at the lower voltage as well. Would this have anything to do with different voltages used by UK and USA? I’m including the difference of our 60hz to UKs 50hz… idk just wondering.
Get a PowerPlant from ps audio , just for the fun of it , see if there is a difference in normal from the wall power and power from a high end power "conditioner"
If the wiring in the place where you plug your guitar amp into isn't grounded right. It will make your tube amp buzz like crazy. Especially if they're single coil pickups in the guitar and aren't properly shielded and grounded. Weak voltage will make your amp perform poorly too.
I tell you i can hardly get a good clean tone in my travel trailer. I can but the gain picks up some strange stuff pretty quick. Gain up im like matt pike.
🤔🤔🤔 the voltage have to be at a stable level (240volt) and the quality of the power , filter out the noise and stuff Does the box clean up the power ??? Or just a voltage regulator ???
The hum comes from ground potential being way way off neutral. It should be within a volt. This is not only annoying put potentially dangerous should you use a mic or something that's grounded right, you could get a shock. It's just a wiring problem though, very fixable.
Considering this, does anyone know what kind of effect the voltage selection switches on the back of the amplifiers would have if you were to change the setting, regardless of what the wall outlet is providing?
That sounds like a bad idea to mess with multiple voltage reduction mechanisms at the same time. You'll either reduce the voltage low enough that the amp just stops working because it doesn't have enough power or if you somehow boost the voltage it could fry the amp.
I think you are hearing things or not really getting what you are hearing.....yes you lose power...but I find that when amps are overvolted (with power fluctuations...) they get REALLY mid woofy and just oversaturated....getting the voltage right makes that kinda woofiness go away and it gets cleaner and (I would say more hi fi,)...there is a crispness and immediacy to an amp PROPERLY driven...and to me it gets laggy and you lose all note definition when the voltage is wrong (you call sag..I DONT hear THAT at all, you arent really low enough for proper sag in a working am anyway) ALLRIGHT..I do hear a little sag
its not. its just more bs that guitarists think they need. if any noise passes through the full wave filtered rectifier then the amp is trash, broken or needs bias adjustments to match the intended wall voltage.
It would be more interesting to test the voltage in these various places on tour to see if you're actually getting voltage attenuation or if the perceived differences are just a product of the different rooms. I'd hazard to guess you're probably getting 120V everywhere you go and the differences have little to do with power conditioning.
During the parts of the video where he quickly switches between bypassed and 100%, compensate for the volume changes on your end. Maybe your ears are picking up on something mine aren't, but I really think this pedal is just a reverse clean boost.
So this has NOTHING to do with noise and everything to do with voltage changes the B+ which effects the bias of the tubes/circuit. Beyond that a simple variac does the job FOR WAY LESS MONEY to maintain the voltage at the biased requirement for the amp. Any other claim is nonsense as a well filtered full wave recitified amp will not see any wall AC in the signal path. So, mostly this is nonsense, beyond maintaining a stable voltage at the designed circuit requirement.
These differences are so subtle and so unimportant, it might be a good idea to stop worrying about micro differences in tone and focus on playing, improving and writing something good, a good song with bad tone is better than a bad song with good tone
FOR SURE fluctuations in power effect the amps sound...that why I FINALLYT got a Variac to regulate my power (they only cost around 50-100 bucks...what you are promoting is hundreds (yes it does it for you...a variac you have to adjust manually)I should point out it is TUBE amps that are subject to this./...solid state does not have this issue
I feel like Glen Fricker should do some tests with this as well! I could totally see him running some pre-recorded DI's through some amps and taking a look at the null tests to see the differences in tone.
You beat me to it! But the BrownBox doesn't come with a frequency response chart!!! Then again neither does a tone pot and capacitor. His rebuttal will be an "in a metal band mix context." But yeah, I use mine for a feel thing more than a tone thing.
Why not someone who's intelligent instead?
@DrewKane because you're so intelligent
Thought the same!
Fricker literally said a 5150 and a re to basically sound the same. Don't look at him for anything audio. He's neat for some screaming and ranting. Nothing more.
Clean consistent power!!! Most people don’t realize how everyone on your grid is pushing noise voltage drops and spikes into your mains. Conditioning your power is a huge aid in so many ways. Your gear will thank you.
Stop talking nonsense. If AC noise gets past a well filtered full wave rectifier the amp is garbage or broken.
This really helps make the case for using a Kemper or something similar when touring. I prefer the real tube amp sound, but for consistency and reliability, I think the writing is on the wall. Recording is a completely different story though. Thanks for the video, you've been Fluff and I've been entertained!
I struggled with a lot of tube amps feeling extremely stiff and unplayable, but only some of the time. Then, I found out my voltage was 123-125. When the space heater turned on my amp sagged a bit and felt great. Took me a while to realize what was happening. The space heater would have such a draw on the circuit that it would drop the voltage by almost 5 volts. So I got one of these to compensate. Use it all the time. Just not with a space heater 🙂
Buddy of mine called his band Spaceheater. Could never get his sound quite right out playing. But down in the basement practice area, money everytime.
What happens when the space heater turns on when this thing is on? Does it drop it even further down than you set it on the brown box?
@@braddtatum yep. Just a few volts. But by the time I dropped the voltage with the brown box a few more volts weren’t as noticeable.
That FFAA shirt is killer - saw them this summer and picked up the same shirt 👍🏻
Lets say they don't affect the tone, the fact that they save the life of the tubes and amp itself make the unit well worth the buy in price. I kept blowing tubes left and right in a few of my vintage amps until I got these.
I have one of these. I bought it because we have high wall voltage where I live (123-124 V) and this allows me to reduce the input voltage down to 120 and then attenuate from there. I usually run mine around 117-118 v and I find that's a really good spot personally. If you live somewhere with high wall voltage, this is the easy answer. There are also Variacs which do a similar thing but they sometimes require a separate multimeter for testing voltage and I think there's a Furman power conditioner which lets you choose the voltage for multiple power outlets. I find this more convenient and cheaper than the Furman and I think it also has additional filtering on the power to reduce interference from other devices on the power such as a computer. I do think there's another device that's superior if you're traveling internationally which should be in Angus Young's rig rundown. It does a similar deal with power regulation, choosing the output voltage, and can take a line with low voltage and up the voltage so it's okay too use, etc. It costs more than most nice tube amps though since it's a medical device.
same!
You need a different amp.
These are great to have just to keep your amp running as designed, especially vintage amps that were designed with power transformers designed to run on 110 volts. This keeps the filament circuit for the tubes running at the correct transformed voltage.
Nothing to do with the heater circuit and everything to do with the tube dissipation levels as designed by the circuit intention.
@@BenState yes, but it does have a lot to do with the heater circuit as well. The tubes need 6.3 volts. If the transformer is designed for 110 volts AC and the source is giving 120 volts, now the transformed voltage for the heaters is higher than 6.3 volts. The voltage for the plates is higher too.
@@douglasdog1 The have balance resistors....
@@BenState The “balance resistors” that some amps have in the filament supply are to form an artificial center tap if the transformer does not have one, can also control hum. Many of the amps I’ve worked on do not have a circuit in place to regulate heater voltage. Maybe a rectifier circuit to transform it to DC, but that still doesn’t control voltage level.
@@douglasdog1 elevated heater voltage usually improves hum.
The EVH Variac thing. The reason for that was he plugged in a UK made 240v amp into a US 120v socket. “Why does this thing sound weird?” This is before amps has a power switch to change voltage. He bought a Variac and dropped the transformer input to match the 120v out of the wall. He wasn’t going for a ‘magical’ sound. He realized going down to 90v would drop the volume. The amps didn’t have master volumes either. That’s all it was.
Id be curious to hear if any change in tone is heard sending this into a power conditioner.
EVH said his sweet spot was a t around 80-90 volts.....🎸🤘🎸
He said a lot of things that were bs to put people off his tone trail. Common knowledge.
I believe so. I've lived in more than 1 place with questionable wiring, and when I was on tour there were so many power related issues and sometimes, even with a rack unit with an identical setting I could not get the tone I wanted
What an interesting idea for a video! Something that everyone should take into account
The tone and feel is definitely influenced by how the electric Ampage is being pushed by your local grid. It effects so many facets of the tone.
Your comment proves you have completely no idea.
Here where i live in Quebec the voltage is very inconsistant . Now i know back in time why i hate/love my jcm800 tone ! Probably the variation in voltage . My dual rectifier sound always the same no matter what ! 🤘🏼
You can tell by the current draw that the Orange needs to be biased a lot warmer. It’s probably in the 35 to 40% range right now. You don’t need to crank it, but you’re probably hearing a lot of crossover distortion like it is.
The Marshall is probably perfect where it is.
i have one for my 1960 Bassman and 69 Super. I can hear the difference and it has to be better for my old amps to run at the power they were designed for.
I remember the small town bars , all were different , That time the room wasn't large but my classic 50 was really quiet, I really had to turn it up I knew the power was iffy.
Just got one of these and wish I would’ve had it when I played out all the time. Every outlet in my house brings in 125v.
If it would be such a big game changer there would be definitely more of these devices from different manufacturers out there. I am always suspicious when there is only device in the market supposedly doing the trick for you.
What I am hearing at the lower voltages is that Orange muddy OD that I don't like about Orange Amps, and which doesn't exist at 120v. The Marshall had a similar effect, but the lower voltage seemed like more useful a tone.
Woah, that was a bigger difference than I thought. Wonder if this is also a good simulation of overall plate voltage as well?
yes, that's all it is, B+ voltage matching tube dissipation requirements. nothing more.
Well by lowering the line voltage you're messing with the tube heaters as well as bias so yes its gonna make a big difference. Big name acts like AC/DC use the Kikisui power conditioner unit
I have experienced similar problem with Engl Fireball (the only tube amp I ever owned and it never left home). On somedays it sounded, what I can best describe, as unfocused (not sure what exactly was going on with the sound, but I didn't like it at all). I've bought cheapest stabilizer with good reviews (something like 30$ cheap) and the problem was gone. I'm sure as hell you don't need "guitar" stabilizer for that, unless you want to spend significantly more money for fancier box
Eddie thought it could, different places different power supply. Do something to fix it. Thanks EVH for the brown sound.
EVH used a unit like this, I just don't know if he went up or down in the voltage.
I tried recording an album with tube amps and gave up because tone changed from day to day, or even same day.
Since a few years back I'm digital only and way more happy with consistancy
Dumb question: I just run my amps through a furman power conditioner, so what is the difference between this unit in the video and what power conditioners do?
This was interesting. I also like the Marshall at the lower voltage as well. Would this have anything to do with different voltages used by UK and USA? I’m including the difference of our 60hz to UKs 50hz… idk just wondering.
Get a tech to change the circuit resistors to get the dissipation levels you want. Then buy a cheap variac to keep it there.
If it's all analog, reducing voltage only reduces volume, except for weird bias settings. Just like the video sounded like.
Get a PowerPlant from ps audio , just for the fun of it , see if there is a difference in normal from the wall power and power from a high end power "conditioner"
If the wiring in the place where you plug your guitar amp into isn't grounded right. It will make your tube amp buzz like crazy. Especially if they're single coil pickups in the guitar and aren't properly shielded and grounded. Weak voltage will make your amp perform poorly too.
If it isn't 'grounded right' its outright dangerous and you shouldn't be plugging anything into the power.
I tell you i can hardly get a good clean tone in my travel trailer. I can but the gain picks up some strange stuff pretty quick. Gain up im like matt pike.
ai think i saw a rig rundown that angus young pushes his marshalls to 246v or something like that.
What does the voltage knob do does that change the grit too ?
🤔🤔🤔 the voltage have to be at a stable level (240volt) and the quality of the power , filter out the noise and stuff
Does the box clean up the power ??? Or just a voltage regulator ???
Noise will not get through a well filtered full wave rectifier unless the amp is broken or badly designed.
I bought one and ended up returning it. When I ran any of my amps through it, the amp would have a horrible hum.
The hum comes from ground potential being way way off neutral. It should be within a volt. This is not only annoying put potentially dangerous should you use a mic or something that's grounded right, you could get a shock. It's just a wiring problem though, very fixable.
I bought one a few years back. Every place we play the power just isn’t consistent. Great investment.
Cheap variac would do the same job.
Considering this, does anyone know what kind of effect the voltage selection switches on the back of the amplifiers would have if you were to change the setting, regardless of what the wall outlet is providing?
Fry your input transformer....
That sounds like a bad idea to mess with multiple voltage reduction mechanisms at the same time. You'll either reduce the voltage low enough that the amp just stops working because it doesn't have enough power or if you somehow boost the voltage it could fry the amp.
Ah, I was coming to say, “isn’t that the whole idea with the power variax”.
I think you are hearing things or not really getting what you are hearing.....yes you lose power...but I find that when amps are overvolted (with power fluctuations...) they get REALLY mid woofy and just oversaturated....getting the voltage right makes that kinda woofiness go away and it gets cleaner and (I would say more hi fi,)...there is a crispness and immediacy to an amp PROPERLY driven...and to me it gets laggy and you lose all note definition when the voltage is wrong (you call sag..I DONT hear THAT at all, you arent really low enough for proper sag in a working am anyway) ALLRIGHT..I do hear a little sag
My tech will make a power conditioner that plugs into the club’s mains and has 4 plugs for 155.
How is this better than a Variac?
its not. its just more bs that guitarists think they need. if any noise passes through the full wave filtered rectifier then the amp is trash, broken or needs bias adjustments to match the intended wall voltage.
isn’t this what van halen did to get his brown sound through a marshall?
i should’ve kept watching. you mentioned this lol
Or you go with a variac for $70.00 with the digital face
It would be more interesting to test the voltage in these various places on tour to see if you're actually getting voltage attenuation or if the perceived differences are just a product of the different rooms. I'd hazard to guess you're probably getting 120V everywhere you go and the differences have little to do with power conditioning.
During the parts of the video where he quickly switches between bypassed and 100%, compensate for the volume changes on your end.
Maybe your ears are picking up on something mine aren't, but I really think this pedal is just a reverse clean boost.
Duh, Variac
So this has NOTHING to do with noise and everything to do with voltage changes the B+ which effects the bias of the tubes/circuit. Beyond that a simple variac does the job FOR WAY LESS MONEY to maintain the voltage at the biased requirement for the amp. Any other claim is nonsense as a well filtered full wave recitified amp will not see any wall AC in the signal path. So, mostly this is nonsense, beyond maintaining a stable voltage at the designed circuit requirement.
These differences are so subtle and so unimportant, it might be a good idea to stop worrying about micro differences in tone and focus on playing, improving and writing something good, a good song with bad tone is better than a bad song with good tone
FOR SURE fluctuations in power effect the amps sound...that why I FINALLYT got a Variac to regulate my power (they only cost around 50-100 bucks...what you are promoting is hundreds (yes it does it for you...a variac you have to adjust manually)I should point out it is TUBE amps that are subject to this./...solid state does not have this issue
Terrible name for a product. Brown box makes me think butt hole.
Tone comes from the speakers
not true at all. they are highly important, but they aren't the only link in the chain.
Stretching it and gimmicky.
BUY A VARIAC IT WILL DO THE SAME AND SAVE YOU 350!!!!!!!
ALL RIGHT..that last part is a lie..YOU KNIOW WHAT A VARIAC IS I KNOW YOU DO PAL!!!!!!!!
Why the Smurf-hat, though?
Its called fashion, sweetie.