Same. One of the first moments in the show that actually feels like a superhero moment. We had a couple with Starlight and Gen V, but this kinda shows that the showrunners understand the genre their making satire about. Perhaps even better than some actual superhero movies - which disregard saving or acknowledging civilians and bringing hope over cool fight scenes.
The way they treat Ashley also stands out in Season 4. A-Train wants her to get out of Vought with him, even if they don’t get far. Whereas, the very first person The Deep adds to Homelander’s elimination list is Ashley.
@@Tw1nkerbelle honestly, I don't think she's said a single genuinely kind word to any of them... more likely she was afraid of them in some capacity. but I think A-Train''s learned how messed up that was in Season 3 and decided to do better. The Deep, on the other hand, hasn't really evolved for the better.
@@atiyaxaI’d say it more that A-Train, having seen Ashley resort to ripping her hair out, began to empathise with her being stuck working for Homelander, and began to realise how much work she does to keep him and the other members of The Seven out of trouble. Homelander is fundamentally the cause of everyone’s problems, after all. The Deep, on the other hand, has no idea what Ashley does for him. We’re talking about a guy so shallow, self-interested, and ignorant that not only can he not remember Ashley’s last name (Barrett, like the .50 cal), he can’t even spell her first name right. He’s simply a moron with an entitlement complex who views sticking his tongue up Homelander’s ass as a way to keep his status. When they eventually kill him off it’s going to be so satisfying. (Nothing against Chase Crawford, of course. The fact he‘s able to portray Deep as such a shitty character shows how well he understands the role.)
He honestly really did to a degree in season 2, genuinely apologizing to starlight and took responsibility for his actions. It was probably when he rejoined the 7 that he started to completely regress all the way to the point he doesn’t even believe he assaulted starlight in the first place.
@johnclough3199 Tbf I'd argue the apology wasn't fully genuine. Maybe he thought it was, but I still think it was just him trying to salvage his reputation
It's really interesting because I always think back to that one chick The Deep hooked up with who forced herself on him by getting handsy around his gills. Like the shoe was finally (somewhat) on the other foot but be it his ego, his intelligence, or a combination of both, he didn't form a sense of empathy after it happened.
@@swaws7810 I think mainly the lesson Deep learned was that he'd always be disrespected unless he instilled fear in people. So he's following Homelander's example of trying to make people afraid of him, because it seems to be the only way to get the respect he craves. To be fair, the guy does seem to have some really awful luck with that. You'd figure an attractive, rich, superhero celebrity like him would find it easy to get sycophants and groupies but oddly enough he seems to get disrespected by everybody. I mean damn... the guy is pretty much got it all and everyone still treats him like he's a loser. Maybe he just has a fish stench going with him all the time or something, I don't know.
The ONE redeeming quality of Deep was his love and respect for sea life. After he killed his octopus, that was it. He can’t be redeemed, and he doesn’t really want to be. I hope that when he inevitably goes out, he goes out in a funny way.
As a marine life conoisseur I barrely had the same thought. But that s2 scene with a sperm whale where this dumbfuck literally standed there with that poor stranded whale to tank the boat made me think "no...there is nothing to do with him anymore". Tbf his first scene with Starlight was more than enough but everything else was an absolute downfall
I think it would be best if it's a situation where if he did the morally good thing he would've survived but instead he chose the morally evil choice and as a consequence he dies in the most painful and humiliating way becoming an afterthought
when u say he cant be redeemed u mean like he wont let himself be redeemed? coz why cant he be redeemed himself coz of that. also when u mention that he goes out u mean like he dies straight up?
This is something I love, both character went through similar things, both got kicked out, both were in the church, and both were given their position back. But while A-Train learned from it, Deep instantly went full ego again and said fuck the consequences and what he did wrong doesn't matter. With the deep also getting assaulted and hating himself I thought they were going to make him go through a redemption arc, but the moment he got the power, all the development was gone, he learned nothing, he didn't connect him being assaulted to starlight, he just saw other people as shitty but he is some awesome guy. Meanwhile A-Train instantly realizes he hurt other people the same way he was hurt
Season 3 showed how what they did in Season 1 came back to haunt him. A-Train was careless and killed Robin even laughing about it with another supe. In Season 3, his brother was hurt by a reckless Supe. Deep forced Starlight to give him a blow job to remain in The Seven. In Season 3, Homelander forces Deep to swallow something against his consent (eat Timothy) just to remain in The Seven.
@ObamaHamaHa yes but it's still similar in the fact that Homelander is pressuring Deep against his consent, especially knowing he can talk to sea creatures.
@@ObamaHamaHa repeat thT. Being forced to eat a friend. Regardless if they’re sea animals or not, they are sentient and intelligent and can talk to the Deep. So essentially like if you and your real life friend were, well, friends and then someone forces you to eat them. That is traumatizing as fuck, and I say this as a räpe surviving: they’re both traumatizing experiences.
@@bakedandbeadedthis is why I would have forgiven deep if he didn’t fall off the deep end in s4, because he lowkey went thru it and if he was willing to change, make rightful amends and be good, that would’ve been good enough to me
Wouldn't it be poetically just if the Deep, rather than meet his end at the hands of a mob of humans, met his end at the jaws of of all sea life? He'd be in the ocean and he'd see a pack of sharks or a giant octopus coming at him and he'd think they've come to bang when they start tearing him apart to avenge Ambrosius
Oh, that would be good. The right balance of karmic, undignified and downright hilarious for Kevin! Plus, I think it'd be a fitting way to kill him because the Deep's empathy for marine life was by far his brightest redeeming quality, and now he's thrown it away for power and ego in Season 4.
Great video dude, but I think you were wrong about two points on the Deep. You said the Deep doesn't have a community to fight for or care about the way A-Train does. But that's not true, the Deep has Marine Life as a community. He knows they aren't happy in captivity and in season 1, actually tries to free a dolphin on his own. However all his attempts to help Marine Life fail miserably, and he usually ends up doing more damage than good. However it was in season 3, when the Deep was forced to eat his octopus friend Timothe, this was when he truly stopped trying. When the Deep ate Timothe, he showed having privilege and fame meant more to him, than the lives of his Aquatic friends. Don't forget, in Deeps mind he sees and treats them as if they were ordinary people, so to him they where his community. The second point I think you got wrong, you said Deep is never bullied over something he can't control. But that also isn't 100% true, Deep's gills are a great cause of shame for him, he's also developed body dysmorphia from this. Homelander DOES make a direct comment about his gills calling them disgusting, and I imagine he has been bullied for this part of himself in the past, considering the shame he feels about them, to the point of crying when he looks in the mirror. I understand A-Train worked more, and Deep has been handed more privilege in life. However I think it's only fair to acknowledge things haven't been completely easy for him. I think what the Deep is missing in his life compared to A-Train is a proper mentor figure to guide him down the right path
I wouldn’t say The Deep eating Timothy meant he cared more about fame than his friends. What’s he supposed to do, say no to the most powerful being on the planet? He was in a “die or die inside” situation, and he chose the latter. You can see on his face the pure anguish, especially knowing Timothy was likely screaming out in pain or for help. I think that kind of experience would mentally mess up ANYONE.
@@gavo7911 Yeah, you make a good argument. I guess he wasn't left with much of a choice. But still after doing that, he didn't decide Vought was not worth having to potentially do something like this again. Now he's pretty much willing to do anything to stay on the Seven. And I feel like that all started with Timothy
*You are wrong on one thing* . Deep is absolutely mocked and bellitled for ONE thing he can't control. His fish powers and his gills. From day one, he had one of the goofiest powers in all of 7 (litteral Super Friends Aquaman tier). He is stuck essentialy hearing fish talk. And in one of the few empathetic scenes for Deep, he essentialy gets SAd by a woman who fetishizes his gills, and humiliates him, and then he has a breakdown about how he deep down (no pun intended) wishes he could be normal, when it was revealed HOW Supes are made
A-Train and Deep’s paralleling stories serve to paint a compelling picture about the intoxication of power and the hardships that come with self-improvement. Both characters start at the top, basking in all the power and status that being a part of the Seven brings, hit rock bottom then climb their way back to the top. But the contrast is where the characters are truly defined. A-Train has grown to understand that being a hero requires the will to make sacrifices and to actually expand your world to encompass the well-being of others. The Deep only doubles down on needing power to replace his inadequacies, using violence to feel powerful to cover up his weakness. These two characters are opposites poles that work very well in contrast to the other to tell a more complete story. A lower tier version of Butcher and Homelander.
I like how the Peak lost the only decent thing he had about himself which was caring for sea life, hopefully the octopus faked her death or his fish somehow escape and tell the creatures in the sea about what he did
@@Sonic_the_Hedge-hogthey have built in oxygen tank that they need to store water to stay on land. Deep suddenly break her tank she got no time to store water
@@aidenharris5296 the octopus only fed his narcissism, the octopus still said she loved him despite being killed and cheated on, A-Train was called out for his bullshit by his brother whom he looks up to and seek approval from, thus motivating him to be better
A train slowly seeing how none of his bad actions were worth it similar to starlight as a little girl heading into Hollywood Fish boi doubling down on his mistakes And black noir 2 just happy to be there
With A-Train his redemption arc so slow and subtle you almost don't notice it. With Deep I actually forgot about his abuse of Starlight since he's just shown as this dumbass with his head so far up Homelander's ass he's coming out of throat. Then he just goes does really violent and evil shit with no hesitation whatsoever
this is an incredible video man! I love seeing small creators work hard and make such engaging videos! I'm impressed, Thanks for the incredible watch man.
I believe The Deep was also the top student at Godolkin university or at least it's implied, there were these promotion ads for GodU of him, A-Train and Queen Maeve being shown as prominent alumni, suggesting that the three of them were ranked number 1 at the uni at some point *edit: as people point out the Deep was 6th, but 6th is still damn good
@@lewisbowie9794 oh, ok I didn't catch that, I just had a recollection of these promo ads of the three and I assumed if you are promoted to the Seven you have to be the top student but I suppose my assumption was wrong
What gets me about the scene where Deep kills his octo-gf is he smashes her tank out of anger but is then given not one, not two, but three chances to go back and help her as she struggles to breathe. he actively chooses to let her die. Deep is given multiple chances to change and be a good person but he actively chooses to be a bad person who hurts people. Personally, I cant wait to watch his downfall
Great analysis. I like that in the first season they kinda set up the opposite since we see ATrain purposefully killing his girlfriend, popclaw, trying to kill kimiko and starlight. The Deep we saw trying to rescue see life and being sexual assaulted (sort of). But the Writters let the characters evolve naturally on the seasons so they became more engaging. And kudos for the actors who play them beautifully.
It’s one is redemption, two is weakness And I think both may have said it? I think Edgar said it to Alistar and then alistar repeats it when talking to deep and atrain
Homelander is a masterfully written character, there are so many moments where you can empathize with him even after all the atrocities he's commited. His relationship with his son is also extremely interesting, as it can be argued for whether he truly loves his son or not. Some may say that he truly loves his son and cares for him, yet it can also be argued that he wants his son's love for selfish purposes.
The fact that Vought actually purposely manipulated him as a kid to be needy and attention seeking was just pure evil and made me empathise with him a little bit. I think he loves Ryan and doesn't want him to grow up like he did but also can't handle the idea of not being loved at the same time.
Homelander is fundamentally unable to love anyone since he's so broken. We can empathize with the broken child in him, but he is still irredeemable and a fundamentally evil person
I LOVE how people started talking abt this post S4, I've been talking abt their parallels and differences in direction for so long, and I think it's beautiful
In the comics these characters have reversed roles in every way but its hardly flushed out. Their dynamics and contrast is alot more clear in the show and i love that
I think my favorite bit of acting in all of season 4 was Jessie T Usher’s face during that conversation with Tek Knight, A-Train couldn’t say anything in the moment but you could see **everything** on his face in that scene, I like to think that’s the real moment where he decided this wasn’t where he wanted to be anymore
This is a great analysis! I love seeing A-Train turn heel on vought! It's a good message if you look deep enough and you seem to have done that, thank you!
A-train and the deep are my favorite characters in the show. This analysis of the deep and A-train and how they mirror eachother is good but you missed something significant about the deep. He did TRY to be a good person very shortly. When he tried to save the dolphine but failed. A-train is what the average person with superpowers would be like. but the deep is somewhat different, he seems to only really get along with sea animals. The deep does care and tries to be good. but only to the animals of the ocean, and the animals of the sea seem to care about him as well. I think you missed that the deep does try to do good things and shows compassion, just not to humans. It was when he killed his octopus girlfriend that he truly lost his only redeeming quality, which was his love and compassion for sealife
A-Train is the only superhero shown in the entire series who goes from being a part of the status quo to realizing that doing good things and real justice makes you feel good.
Theyre also both entertaining and good characters in their own way with a trains redemption arc being the culmination and journey of all thats happened in his past putting him on peoples likable character list while the deep is just comically evil and pathetic someone you absolutely want to get their shit kicked in.
I do think The Deep is a *tiny* bit more than a victim of his own choices. We see repeatedly that he's very fragile emotionally, and both we and he are constantly reminded of his inferiority to the rest of his team. On top of that he's the only one who is physically mutated which has hindered his personal life and self image, further isolating him. All this is to say that they're both a lot more similar than I think you're arguing here. *Both* are carrying the weight of things about themselves that they physically can't change and others look down on, but while A-Train has the will to better himself and eventually to strive for something bigger than himself thanks to his brother and community (and having an actually useful power at their high level), The Deep is emotionally weak without a will of his own and as a result tends to just weakly adapt to circumstances rather than try to change injustice.
Great video on A Train and The Deep you are spot on in this video. A Train’s redemption arc is one of the biggest highlights of the fourth season of The Boys.
I mean I kinda in a way disagree with “the deep never had to struggle” yeah he’s a terrible guy, but he’s also struggled with self confidence and actually loving himself for who he is, and he’s also struggled with saving sea creatures, who he genuinely loves (we don’t talk about season 4)
@@urgo5658 why u gotta start this struggling competition tho, could've just said that a-train didnt faced self-esteem issues due to his power unlike the peak
2:25 Also, unlike the Deep, A-Train has to constantly CONTINUE to fight for his power. There's more than one speedster, and like he said "no one wants the second fastest man". He has to become faster, train more, become better, all the time (which I think also contributed to his addiction). The Deep often just seems to be in the Seven because they needed some sort of water hero, and even though he's not very useful (from what we've seen at least, I'm sure he's pretty good when he's actually IN the water) he's kept around for sex appeal and to fill a quota. I'm not sure why there aren't more water heros to give HIM a good rivalry, maybe Vought just likes to keep him because he's easy to control and pretty stupid, but yeah, he never really has to do anything to keep what he has.
I can’t wait to see what S5 does with A-Train, it’s very clear he’s gonna die but I hope he goes out fighting or by sacrificing himself, whatever it is I hope it’s a major heroic act
Ngl i feel like Deep would be a cooler character to redeem and eventually have to fight the other members of the seven since the odds are always stacked against the boys. A-train being so powerful feels like a safety net
The deep has become so insufferable its so crazy. he was always been a dunce but this season hes been a menace, meanwhile A train has become a great character. I love the turn around
I hope we get another deep vs a train fight like we did near the end of season 4, if a-train kills the deep I think it would be poetic but I’m not saying that’s the only way the deep could go out
Idk if this is a hot take, but despite The Deep going off the deep end this season, I still don’t think he deserves to die the way Homelander or Firecracker does. After all, what would that accomplish? He’s a shitty person, but that’s kinda it. He’s a shitty pathetic person who has done terrible things under the thumb of a psychopath who could kill him at any moment. I don’t think he could get a full redemption like A-Train, but I think he deserves at least a moment of conviction, a moment where he can finally take back some of his agency. A happy ending would be a little unearned, but I think a good ending for his character would be to finally get away from humanity so he can be with his fish friends.
To be fair to the Deep, you forgot how he was being bullied about his gills. The guy had a huge insecurity about it and it was something he couldn't control, like you said about A-Train. It might not be a race thing but it's definitely an issue, a deformity. And this issue later turned into his weird obsessions.
The reason why atrain was able to turn around was literally his family,which the deep does not have(as far as we have seen it).Atrain used to unvind with his fam which he loves,but now his brother despises him and he cant talk with his nephews neither and that really shook him and he wants to do some good so they can be proud of him again.This literally means everything to him.He is just as a dirtbag as Deep but he knows he has to change if he does not want to lose his family.The icing on the cake was when that boy saw him at the hospital and atrain said he never felt better than in that moment. While deep had only ppl who used him,the church used him,his wife used him,HL using him..with him killing Ambrosia he killed his humanity with her,so now he can do anything,similar to HL. Plus,while Atrain isnt stupid by any means,the Deep is LOL
I did love the fact that besides Homelander all that's left of the original Seven is the Deep and A-Train, both of whom genuinely try to do good. Of course this season we've seen Deep fully give into his bad impulses and become a murderous sycophant for Homelander. A-Train on the other hand becomes completely disillusioned with Vought and takes over Annie's role as the Boys' inside man before fully quitting the Seven for good.
It’s funny because this parallel between the two in the show is the exact opposite of the way it is in the comics. In “The Boys” comic, The Deep is a black man, who is belittled for his skin color and his status as this Aquaman-like, water-themed superhero. He’s also the most level-headed of the Seven. By contrast, A-Train, in the comics, is a white teenager (19 or so) who’s has his life handed to him on a silver platter - creating this hateful, entitled, and perverted little brat. In the comics, A-Train is the one who sexually assaults Starlight at the beginning of the story, ALONG WITH killing Hughie’s previous girlfriend, Robin. Although A-Train wasn’t alone in his initial advance toward Starlight (Homelander pressured Starlight into it with him, A-Train and Black Noir), he does try to force himself on her multiple times throughout the series. While A-Train apologizes in the show and Hughie, with some time, does forgive him, in the comics The Boys capture and kill A-Train - with Hughie delivering the final blow.
Which version do you like more? I think Butcher under Kessler influence will become very comic-butcher like. It would be a good detail if they put him in all black clothes and clean shaven in the last season.
it was so sad to see Deep became got lower than he already is he used to care so much about sea creatures but after killing his octopus he became apathetic towards all the cruel actions he done.
This the deep hate is crazy, literally the only reason A train got better was cause the writers wanted him to, the deep arguably got put through more stuff, he was shamed for his body by women, he was blasted off the 7 (rightfully) and then after he did his rehabilitation became a better person. He was forced into eating he's friends watched his whale friend die it was messed up what homelander made him do, that's why he felt he was wronged and such, it was his whole arc in season 1 getting over his passed bad experiences and the crazy stuff homelander makes him do. I do understand why people hate on him so much when really and truly he's a good guy being swayed by bad forces like that really smart girl telling him to be more aggressive to none supes. Of course he didn't have to do that but if he didn't well she has homelander under her thumb so she probably could have killed him
Nono, the hate ain't crazy. 💀 Yes A-Train getting better because the writter wanted him to is literally the basis of character writting. And for what he has done: -Sexual abuse from the VERY begining -Zoophilia (consented but still) -Made a dolphin killed because he prefered dirty talking to it instead of watching the fucking road -He literally made the whale to strand and then was surprised that it got killed by a boat at full speed -The "body shaming" part came after his allegations got public and getting gill-fingered was the bare minimum of Karma he could recieve -Why didn't he ask the fisherman to put the lobster in a bag in the first place. -Tried to start a threesome with an Octopus and his actual gf (who asked) -Killed the only being that cared for his ass (Ambrosius I guess) because of his ego (ego that he got since the begining) -Yes Homelander asked him to eat Thimoty but (1) It's Homelander (2) why do you have an Octopus at work in a first place, especially if you don't like marinelife being captive And probably other stuff that I don't remember. He's not a badly written character by any mean, and the actor did a perfect job at portraying him as a douchebag but it is what it is
Actually you had it spot on until you said the deep didn’t have his community care he did it was the ocean animals which Vought denied and he rescued himself only to let them get killed which fucked him up even more every time he failed first it was the dolphin then the lobster then eating the octopus and then finally killing Ambrosious that’s what drove him to The Deep End…
A-Train and Deep are both narcissistic, somewhat cowardly and insecure men who are obsessed by how other people see them. They each have their soft spots (A-Train cares about his home community, Deep cares about his sea community). The main difference between them is that whenever Deep tries to be better the show throws it in his face and hands him failure so he has to run back to Homie with his tail between his legs. A-Train got the same treatment for a bit but now the writers decided to take the exact same plotline he had last season and rehash it... but this time play it earnestly instead of as a joke.
ok cool and all but how u gonna say its something A-train can't control and the deep can control it. No he could not control the compound V his parents gave him, his gills, and his strange power that allows him to talk with sea animals. he can't control any of it and gets made fun of for it, and honestly talking to fish like people gotta be crazy for your psyche. I'm not saying the Deep is a good guy or anything but bro definitely has his own personal issues with little to no support or guidance.... beside the octopus...... he was fuckin. I hope the deep at least gets a dope water fight if they are gonna kill him but they could honestly still somehow flip him. bro isn't that evil
the only people who make him feel bad about his gills are genuinely bad people like homelander or the girl in sandusky. most of the other reasons he gets made fun of are his actions. in general he's constantly being some mix of a genuine menace, a pathetic suckup or an insecure manchild. and as was said in the video he never reflects on this or makes any genuine attempt to change, instead he just uses any criticism he ever receives as an excuse to do more bad things even harder. homelander undergoes the exact same cycle. so i do think up to this point he's been genuinely evil but i would agree he'd be more likely to flip and self reflect than someone like homelander ever would. also agree about the psychological effects of talking to sea creatures and i love how the show actually goes into this even if its just a little
@@bighen2162 I made 1 comment and replyd to like one comment. This guy made a whole video and didn't mention the obvious point I made about his gills and talking to sea life. its my day off bitch
A-Train definitely had to fight for his position in the Seven. Season 1 had the 'race of the century' and A-Train pushing himself to his physical and chemical limits for the sake of not being kicked out of the team.
Didn't really noticed the purpose of the "blow" scene before your video (aside the power abuse), the deep goes down and A-train rise (or is shown higher). The Deep has a community, it's the sea life but unlike Aquaman, he doesn't want to live underwater (probably craving for human affection like homelander), Humanity (and mostly homelander and the seven in general) corrupted him while Arthur Curry was the King of the seas before being a member of the justice league.
A-Train and The Deep both wanted to be better. The Deep failed. After being betrayed and exploited by his church, he was brought back in by Homelander, and he did continue trying, but never got anything from it while continually seeing Homelander, literally the worst person he's ever encountered receive everything. So he quit, and begun emanating him. Why try and be better if everyone is going to hurt, betray, or take advantage of you for doing so when cruelty is the only thing you've seen work? Then, there's A-Train. A man who wanted to be better, and got every opportunity and incentive to do it. Then it paid off. With Hughie, the man he never expected forgiveness from, actually forgiving him. That smile from the child for saving MM. And being the first member of the Seven to form a friendship with Ashley. Which doesn’t sound like much, but receiving a real friend, even in good (or crime in their setting) clearly meant a lot to him. I found the Deep to be one of the most tragic character arcs in the show, seeing him try so hard only to be exploited and abused for his gullibility at every point. Until he gave up. Who knows? Maybe if Starlight had given him the same forgiveness (I'm not saying she should have. He didn't earn it, but never got the opportunity to, either) at some point that Hughie gave A-Train, he might have stuck it through.
Kinda crazy realizing the The Deep and Homlander are the last 2 members on the 7 that’ve been there since season 1. (Technically Nior has the same actor but story wise it’s a different person)
one thing I like a lot: their relationship with their respective victims during their arcs Deep while not remorseful about it at least seemed to understand that what he did to Starlight was wrong, after he gets back into the seven he becomes straight up delusional and thinks he's an innocent man who was wrongfully accused, his arc ENDS with him forgetting everything he learned and embracing delusion A-train on the other hand was both remorsless AND delusional at the beginning, legitimately convinced that Hughie's actions against him were worse tha his own, his arc STARTS when he accepts reality for the first time and acknowledges that he was the one that fucked hughie over (not viceversa) and that he needs to make up for it A-train gains Hughie's forgiveness, Deep gets humilliated by Starlight.
The Boys is probably one of the few adaptations that surpass their source material by leaps and bounds. I *never* recommend the comic to fans of the show
I appreciate that they showed a bipoc character to be one with honor. That and when this stunning show refused to kill off Brave Maeve, that was the epitome of good writing. Everyone is TIRED of the trope where the gay character dies. WE ARE SICK OF IT. Thank you
Atrain is an irredeemable character. His actions in S3/S4 were understandable but I really hope the show doesn’t make him “one of the good guys” by the end. Unless it it’s in a sacrificial moment
the Deep could be a deep character (oops) we see his inner struggles, how despite wanting to save marine life he fails and no one cares about that, and several other things making him fall into what he is now, since all His experiences guided him to the fact that if he wanted to be respected he had to be feared. But the writers don't take him seriously and only use him for jokes or to bring up Starlight's SA (for four fucking seasons for God's sake, stop it, it's already clear to me that assaulting someone is wrong)
I like that I’m not the only one. I felt like the show was slowly building up Deep vs A Train. While A Train becomes an actual hero, Deep went down the path of villain
I think you are forgetting the side of the deep he is for rejecting. it's his relationship with the water and nature. He hasn't accepted he technically the voice, a certain type of creature that can't be heard. That probably needs the most help. Yes , he has sexual relations with them, which id weird and whatever else. He has rejected that side of himself by the end of the new season. If anything, he killed it. Plus, with the whole thing with a train strat to change when he killed that guy who injured his brother. I don't think that was a sign that he was changing if anything Showed by them in planning his heart inside of him . That he was falling deeper problem that Was making him into. Which was someone to kill for his own ego and not doing what's right. That the slippery slope that homelander was pull Ryan into as well. Being able to justify killing someone. Only now that we see a train is willing to save live and not take them that he's finally starting to heal from the corruption that vought was doing to him. Unlike the deep where he's found pleasure in it.
They are both bad people who refuse to let go of their power and status for different reasons. Deep is a coward and A-train refuses to let everything he had to put up with be for nothing. In season 4 they are both given the chance to either do good or leave, but sadly one one of them takes it.
When the kid smiled at A train after he saved MM had to be my favorite moment in all of season 4
Same. One of the first moments in the show that actually feels like a superhero moment.
We had a couple with Starlight and Gen V, but this kinda shows that the showrunners understand the genre their making satire about.
Perhaps even better than some actual superhero movies - which disregard saving or acknowledging civilians and bringing hope over cool fight scenes.
That was the moment I knew that A-Train is going to die xD
@@Bards.98 I really hope he doesn't. With Ryan, Maeve, Starlight and Gen V; they make Seven.
@@alexandredesouza3692Maevr doesn't have powers anymore
@@armasapee Shit, really! Must have forgotten.
The way they treat Ashley also stands out in Season 4. A-Train wants her to get out of Vought with him, even if they don’t get far. Whereas, the very first person The Deep adds to Homelander’s elimination list is Ashley.
To be fair, Ashely hasn’t said a nice word to deep ever. I’d probably have her on top of the kill list too if I was the deep.
@@Tw1nkerbelle honestly, I don't think she's said a single genuinely kind word to any of them... more likely she was afraid of them in some capacity. but I think A-Train''s learned how messed up that was in Season 3 and decided to do better. The Deep, on the other hand, hasn't really evolved for the better.
@@Tw1nkerbellehas he ever said anything nice to her? He doesn’t respect women, let alone humans.
@@atiyaxaI’d say it more that A-Train, having seen Ashley resort to ripping her hair out, began to empathise with her being stuck working for Homelander, and began to realise how much work she does to keep him and the other members of The Seven out of trouble. Homelander is fundamentally the cause of everyone’s problems, after all.
The Deep, on the other hand, has no idea what Ashley does for him. We’re talking about a guy so shallow, self-interested, and ignorant that not only can he not remember Ashley’s last name (Barrett, like the .50 cal), he can’t even spell her first name right. He’s simply a moron with an entitlement complex who views sticking his tongue up Homelander’s ass as a way to keep his status. When they eventually kill him off it’s going to be so satisfying.
(Nothing against Chase Crawford, of course. The fact he‘s able to portray Deep as such a shitty character shows how well he understands the role.)
@@tedioussugar384 wdym by status
What’s sad about the deep is that you can tell that a little part of him genuinely wanted to change. It was not loud enough
Besides Translucent, Stormfront & Homelander I'm pretty sure most of the characters have that status.
He honestly really did to a degree in season 2, genuinely apologizing to starlight and took responsibility for his actions. It was probably when he rejoined the 7 that he started to completely regress all the way to the point he doesn’t even believe he assaulted starlight in the first place.
@johnclough3199 Tbf I'd argue the apology wasn't fully genuine. Maybe he thought it was, but I still think it was just him trying to salvage his reputation
It's really interesting because I always think back to that one chick The Deep hooked up with who forced herself on him by getting handsy around his gills. Like the shoe was finally (somewhat) on the other foot but be it his ego, his intelligence, or a combination of both, he didn't form a sense of empathy after it happened.
@@swaws7810 I think mainly the lesson Deep learned was that he'd always be disrespected unless he instilled fear in people. So he's following Homelander's example of trying to make people afraid of him, because it seems to be the only way to get the respect he craves.
To be fair, the guy does seem to have some really awful luck with that. You'd figure an attractive, rich, superhero celebrity like him would find it easy to get sycophants and groupies but oddly enough he seems to get disrespected by everybody. I mean damn... the guy is pretty much got it all and everyone still treats him like he's a loser. Maybe he just has a fish stench going with him all the time or something, I don't know.
Atrain killed his girlfriend at the start, Deep killed his girlfriend at the end.
this hits hard (literally)
Deep thoughts about the Deep🤔
And A-train was ordered
Deep did it out of anger
@@LawnXMowerXGaming a train was high
@@35pen61 he’s referring to pop claw, not Robin
“Deep, blow A-Train.”
Such an iconic line. Says it so nonchalantly lol
It’s just so out of nowhere, it cracks me up every time
I literally find myself saying it to myself its so fucking funny
hahaha
Homelander also being pissed then becoming calm after saying that😂
And even that wasn't enough to show The Deep how Starlight felt when he met her in the beginning.
A-train had a change of heart.
Literally loll
HA!!
He was a African American murderer who stole things (compound V) and ran fast.
Got a white person's heart, and now he is a good person.
Bravo Kripke
@@layelayeI mean, he is still a murderer. he did stole compound V (after taking the new heart) and he still runs fast.
@layelaye that white person was a murderer too so...
The ONE redeeming quality of Deep was his love and respect for sea life. After he killed his octopus, that was it. He can’t be redeemed, and he doesn’t really want to be. I hope that when he inevitably goes out, he goes out in a funny way.
Naaah man I love the peak, if he dies I might stop watching 😭
@@FCB_Ajelandrooshow should be over by then so 😂
As a marine life conoisseur I barrely had the same thought. But that s2 scene with a sperm whale where this dumbfuck literally standed there with that poor stranded whale to tank the boat made me think "no...there is nothing to do with him anymore".
Tbf his first scene with Starlight was more than enough but everything else was an absolute downfall
I think it would be best if it's a situation where if he did the morally good thing he would've survived but instead he chose the morally evil choice and as a consequence he dies in the most painful and humiliating way becoming an afterthought
when u say he cant be redeemed u mean like he wont let himself be redeemed? coz why cant he be redeemed himself coz of that. also when u mention that he goes out u mean like he dies straight up?
This is something I love, both character went through similar things, both got kicked out, both were in the church, and both were given their position back. But while A-Train learned from it, Deep instantly went full ego again and said fuck the consequences and what he did wrong doesn't matter. With the deep also getting assaulted and hating himself I thought they were going to make him go through a redemption arc, but the moment he got the power, all the development was gone, he learned nothing, he didn't connect him being assaulted to starlight, he just saw other people as shitty but he is some awesome guy. Meanwhile A-Train instantly realizes he hurt other people the same way he was hurt
And that's how it be sometimes. I actually thought same too. Thought Deep was going to become something more but this is an interesting parallel
Wasnt the deep in a cult not the church?
@@TheAnkleReaper2162 the church was a cult
@@TheAnkleReaper2162The church was the cult
It definitely wasn't instantly and A train is only really doing it because he hates homelander now
Not the octopus going through suffering just to be killed
sHe hAd a nAme! 0-0
@@ikazuchioni yeah put some respect on ambrosius
@@ikazuchionioctopussy 🌚
I was devestated for her. I was so hoping she’d get free somehow
Tbh I don’t understand how she died so easily we’ve seen out of the water for more than a few minutes
Season 3 showed how what they did in Season 1 came back to haunt him.
A-Train was careless and killed Robin even laughing about it with another supe. In Season 3, his brother was hurt by a reckless Supe.
Deep forced Starlight to give him a blow job to remain in The Seven. In Season 3, Homelander forces Deep to swallow something against his consent (eat Timothy) just to remain in The Seven.
I feel like being SA’d and being forced to eat a friend are kinda different, but go off
@ObamaHamaHa yes but it's still similar in the fact that Homelander is pressuring Deep against his consent, especially knowing he can talk to sea creatures.
@@ObamaHamaHa repeat thT. Being forced to eat a friend. Regardless if they’re sea animals or not, they are sentient and intelligent and can talk to the Deep. So essentially like if you and your real life friend were, well, friends and then someone forces you to eat them. That is traumatizing as fuck, and I say this as a räpe surviving: they’re both traumatizing experiences.
@@bakedandbeadedthis is why I would have forgiven deep if he didn’t fall off the deep end in s4, because he lowkey went thru it and if he was willing to change, make rightful amends and be good, that would’ve been good enough to me
But bro said fk that and fk everyone and everything, I don’t think he is coming back from that now but only s5 will tell.
Wouldn't it be poetically just if the Deep, rather than meet his end at the hands of a mob of humans, met his end at the jaws of of all sea life? He'd be in the ocean and he'd see a pack of sharks or a giant octopus coming at him and he'd think they've come to bang when they start tearing him apart to avenge Ambrosius
Oh, that would be good. The right balance of karmic, undignified and downright hilarious for Kevin! Plus, I think it'd be a fitting way to kill him because the Deep's empathy for marine life was by far his brightest redeeming quality, and now he's thrown it away for power and ego in Season 4.
@@ecthox-1mork909 karmic justice ftw
@@ecthox-1mork909he through it away for cheeks. So he has to do was put her back in the ocean. But it was too hard. Asphyxiation was easier
Then the sea would become a very diluted The Deep
i dont think regular sharks can harm the deep tbh
bro swims in the mariana trench
Great video dude, but I think you were wrong about two points on the Deep. You said the Deep doesn't have a community to fight for or care about the way A-Train does. But that's not true, the Deep has Marine Life as a community. He knows they aren't happy in captivity and in season 1, actually tries to free a dolphin on his own. However all his attempts to help Marine Life fail miserably, and he usually ends up doing more damage than good.
However it was in season 3, when the Deep was forced to eat his octopus friend Timothe, this was when he truly stopped trying. When the Deep ate Timothe, he showed having privilege and fame meant more to him, than the lives of his Aquatic friends. Don't forget, in Deeps mind he sees and treats them as if they were ordinary people, so to him they where his community.
The second point I think you got wrong, you said Deep is never bullied over something he can't control. But that also isn't 100% true, Deep's gills are a great cause of shame for him, he's also developed body dysmorphia from this. Homelander DOES make a direct comment about his gills calling them disgusting, and I imagine he has been bullied for this part of himself in the past, considering the shame he feels about them, to the point of crying when he looks in the mirror. I understand A-Train worked more, and Deep has been handed more privilege in life. However I think it's only fair to acknowledge things haven't been completely easy for him. I think what the Deep is missing in his life compared to A-Train is a proper mentor figure to guide him down the right path
And in season 4 instead of getting a mentor figure he got a person whom he could influence into being equally as shitty
@@Djirifoekrkfkf Exactly!
Spot on, having a sound headed person on your side will, pull you from some deep holes, like a-train.
I wouldn’t say The Deep eating Timothy meant he cared more about fame than his friends. What’s he supposed to do, say no to the most powerful being on the planet? He was in a “die or die inside” situation, and he chose the latter. You can see on his face the pure anguish, especially knowing Timothy was likely screaming out in pain or for help. I think that kind of experience would mentally mess up ANYONE.
@@gavo7911 Yeah, you make a good argument. I guess he wasn't left with much of a choice. But still after doing that, he didn't decide Vought was not worth having to potentially do something like this again. Now he's pretty much willing to do anything to stay on the Seven. And I feel like that all started with Timothy
*You are wrong on one thing* . Deep is absolutely mocked and bellitled for ONE thing he can't control.
His fish powers and his gills.
From day one, he had one of the goofiest powers in all of 7 (litteral Super Friends Aquaman tier). He is stuck essentialy hearing fish talk.
And in one of the few empathetic scenes for Deep, he essentialy gets SAd by a woman who fetishizes his gills, and humiliates him, and then he has a breakdown about how he deep down (no pun intended) wishes he could be normal, when it was revealed HOW Supes are made
word, but she doesn't "BDSM" him. There's enough moral panic in the world without using BDSM as this stand-in for negative sexual behaviour.
I'd say shit like knife play or bandage is pretty damn weird
She's not gonna BDSM you bro @@TheAsymmetrical
@@TheAsymmetricalright? When tf did bdsm become a verb
@@TheAsymmetrical Well, what other terms for "sadistic domination" are there?
A-Train and Deep’s paralleling stories serve to paint a compelling picture about the intoxication of power and the hardships that come with self-improvement. Both characters start at the top, basking in all the power and status that being a part of the Seven brings, hit rock bottom then climb their way back to the top. But the contrast is where the characters are truly defined. A-Train has grown to understand that being a hero requires the will to make sacrifices and to actually expand your world to encompass the well-being of others. The Deep only doubles down on needing power to replace his inadequacies, using violence to feel powerful to cover up his weakness.
These two characters are opposites poles that work very well in contrast to the other to tell a more complete story. A lower tier version of Butcher and Homelander.
you mean the leak and the peak
I have the goofiest smile on my face because of this
ur so peak for this comment
thats so peaklander of you
I like how the Peak lost the only decent thing he had about himself which was caring for sea life, hopefully the octopus faked her death or his fish somehow escape and tell the creatures in the sea about what he did
I don't think Amrocius would want revenge. She's truly loved Kevin
Octopi can survive on land for like 30 minutes so either the writers are dumb or she was trying to escape
@@Sonic_the_Hedge-hogit’s weird wasn’t the octopus out of water some episodes ago all fine
@@MAGICMUSHI3335, I can’t hold breath as much as I am able to if I don’t hold any breath before
@@Sonic_the_Hedge-hogthey have built in oxygen tank that they need to store water to stay on land. Deep suddenly break her tank she got no time to store water
A train actually has a brother, someone he looks up to, especially his nephew who he wants to connect with. The deep? Well has uh, an octopus.
That octopus was very supportive, but he threw it away for Outback Steakhouse, Flavortown, and Sage 😺
HAD an octopus
had*
See you can say that but to the deep that octopus might as well been his best friend
@@aidenharris5296 the octopus only fed his narcissism, the octopus still said she loved him despite being killed and cheated on, A-Train was called out for his bullshit by his brother whom he looks up to and seek approval from, thus motivating him to be better
A train slowly seeing how none of his bad actions were worth it similar to starlight as a little girl heading into Hollywood
Fish boi doubling down on his mistakes
And black noir 2 just happy to be there
Kinda sad when I realized Sleepy Noir isn't even really bro's with the deep, he's just getting into character.
IVAN!!
Having his murder boners and being narcoleptic
With A-Train his redemption arc so slow and subtle you almost don't notice it. With Deep I actually forgot about his abuse of Starlight since he's just shown as this dumbass with his head so far up Homelander's ass he's coming out of throat. Then he just goes does really violent and evil shit with no hesitation whatsoever
this is an incredible video man! I love seeing small creators work hard and make such engaging videos! I'm impressed, Thanks for the incredible watch man.
Dude this was genuinely such a good video! I was engaged the whole time. Really enjoyed seeing the parallels between A-Train and the Deep. Keep it up!
The Deep will probably live like in the comics just to be played off as a joke, maybe he'll become a janitor or something
Honestly id like that, itd be a great ending for him.
I believe The Deep was also the top student at Godolkin university or at least it's implied, there were these promotion ads for GodU of him, A-Train and Queen Maeve being shown as prominent alumni, suggesting that the three of them were ranked number 1 at the uni at some point
*edit: as people point out the Deep was 6th, but 6th is still damn good
Maeve and A-train were number 1 students and the deep was number 6
On gen v a train and Maeve were first. Deep was 6th
@@lewisbowie9794 oh, ok I didn't catch that, I just had a recollection of these promo ads of the three and I assumed if you are promoted to the Seven you have to be the top student but I suppose my assumption was wrong
@Aloyz3n I thought that until I seen fire cracker and I'm like, there's no chance she was even in the top 10
The Deep killing the octopus was like a bruh moment, definitely solidified this mofo does not deserve any redemption
What gets me about the scene where Deep kills his octo-gf is he smashes her tank out of anger but is then given not one, not two, but three chances to go back and help her as she struggles to breathe. he actively chooses to let her die.
Deep is given multiple chances to change and be a good person but he actively chooses to be a bad person who hurts people.
Personally, I cant wait to watch his downfall
Its quite funny how you notice that this is basically a role switch from the comics
like comics deep=show a-train.
Great analysis. I like that in the first season they kinda set up the opposite since we see ATrain purposefully killing his girlfriend, popclaw, trying to kill kimiko and starlight. The Deep we saw trying to rescue see life and being sexual assaulted (sort of). But the Writters let the characters evolve naturally on the seasons so they became more engaging. And kudos for the actors who play them beautifully.
Alistair's (or maybe stan edgar? I forgot) line from season 2 now hits different
"One is redemption, and one is weakness"
It’s one is redemption, two is weakness
And I think both may have said it? I think Edgar said it to Alistar and then alistar repeats it when talking to deep and atrain
Homelander is a masterfully written character, there are so many moments where you can empathize with him even after all the atrocities he's commited. His relationship with his son is also extremely interesting, as it can be argued for whether he truly loves his son or not. Some may say that he truly loves his son and cares for him, yet it can also be argued that he wants his son's love for selfish purposes.
That could describe a LOT of parents.
@@Saje3DProbably the vast majority of parents. We have selfish genes. We have a drive to duplicate ourselves.
The fact that Vought actually purposely manipulated him as a kid to be needy and attention seeking was just pure evil and made me empathise with him a little bit. I think he loves Ryan and doesn't want him to grow up like he did but also can't handle the idea of not being loved at the same time.
Homelander is fundamentally unable to love anyone since he's so broken. We can empathize with the broken child in him, but he is still irredeemable and a fundamentally evil person
That's why he's such an awesome villain. He's complex with good qualities but megalomaniacal.
I LOVE how people started talking abt this post S4, I've been talking abt their parallels and differences in direction for so long, and I think it's beautiful
In the comics these characters have reversed roles in every way but its hardly flushed out. Their dynamics and contrast is alot more clear in the show and i love that
I think my favorite bit of acting in all of season 4 was Jessie T Usher’s face during that conversation with Tek Knight, A-Train couldn’t say anything in the moment but you could see **everything** on his face in that scene, I like to think that’s the real moment where he decided this wasn’t where he wanted to be anymore
This is a great analysis! I love seeing A-Train turn heel on vought! It's a good message if you look deep enough and you seem to have done that, thank you!
A-train and the deep are my favorite characters in the show. This analysis of the deep and A-train and how they mirror eachother is good but you missed something significant about the deep. He did TRY to be a good person very shortly. When he tried to save the dolphine but failed. A-train is what the average person with superpowers would be like. but the deep is somewhat different, he seems to only really get along with sea animals. The deep does care and tries to be good. but only to the animals of the ocean, and the animals of the sea seem to care about him as well. I think you missed that the deep does try to do good things and shows compassion, just not to humans. It was when he killed his octopus girlfriend that he truly lost his only redeeming quality, which was his love and compassion for sealife
The Peak Vs The Leak
A-Train is the only superhero shown in the entire series who goes from being a part of the status quo to realizing that doing good things and real justice makes you feel good.
Theyre also both entertaining and good characters in their own way with a trains redemption arc being the culmination and journey of all thats happened in his past putting him on peoples likable character list while the deep is just comically evil and pathetic someone you absolutely want to get their shit kicked in.
I do think The Deep is a *tiny* bit more than a victim of his own choices. We see repeatedly that he's very fragile emotionally, and both we and he are constantly reminded of his inferiority to the rest of his team. On top of that he's the only one who is physically mutated which has hindered his personal life and self image, further isolating him. All this is to say that they're both a lot more similar than I think you're arguing here. *Both* are carrying the weight of things about themselves that they physically can't change and others look down on, but while A-Train has the will to better himself and eventually to strive for something bigger than himself thanks to his brother and community (and having an actually useful power at their high level), The Deep is emotionally weak without a will of his own and as a result tends to just weakly adapt to circumstances rather than try to change injustice.
Great video on A Train and The Deep you are spot on in this video. A Train’s redemption arc is one of the biggest highlights of the fourth season of The Boys.
Very well put together!!! Wonderful video and insightful. Youd never think of them as parallels while watching the show
I mean I kinda in a way disagree with “the deep never had to struggle” yeah he’s a terrible guy, but he’s also struggled with self confidence and actually loving himself for who he is, and he’s also struggled with saving sea creatures, who he genuinely loves (we don’t talk about season 4)
yeah A-train literally has a goated super power. I doubt he struggled that much
@@urgo5658 why u gotta start this struggling competition tho, could've just said that a-train didnt faced self-esteem issues due to his power unlike the peak
@@urgo5658he struggled with addiction during season 1
@@Notanegg. womp womp womp
Dude we are not talking about the same struggle 😂
2:25 Also, unlike the Deep, A-Train has to constantly CONTINUE to fight for his power. There's more than one speedster, and like he said "no one wants the second fastest man". He has to become faster, train more, become better, all the time (which I think also contributed to his addiction). The Deep often just seems to be in the Seven because they needed some sort of water hero, and even though he's not very useful (from what we've seen at least, I'm sure he's pretty good when he's actually IN the water) he's kept around for sex appeal and to fill a quota. I'm not sure why there aren't more water heros to give HIM a good rivalry, maybe Vought just likes to keep him because he's easy to control and pretty stupid, but yeah, he never really has to do anything to keep what he has.
I can’t wait to see what S5 does with A-Train, it’s very clear he’s gonna die but I hope he goes out fighting or by sacrificing himself, whatever it is I hope it’s a major heroic act
Ngl i feel like Deep would be a cooler character to redeem and eventually have to fight the other members of the seven since the odds are always stacked against the boys. A-train being so powerful feels like a safety net
Some would say that A-Train’s heart grew 3 sizes that day
I'd argue that Deep doing an octopus is exactly a case of him not being able to control his sexuality.
from the 1st season i really loved a-train's character. it is so good to see him redeem himself.
>deep gets a racists heart
>suddenly becomes a good person
What did they mean by this?
pfp makes this comment better
Deep?
He was really going off the Deep end this season
The deep has become so insufferable its so crazy. he was always been a dunce but this season hes been a menace, meanwhile A train has become a great character. I love the turn around
This was such a great analysis of these characters thank you!
I hope we get another deep vs a train fight like we did near the end of season 4, if a-train kills the deep I think it would be poetic but I’m not saying that’s the only way the deep could go out
Deep is literally psychologically tortured by homelander for his gills while and belittled by everyone for not being good enough.
Idk if this is a hot take, but despite The Deep going off the deep end this season, I still don’t think he deserves to die the way Homelander or Firecracker does. After all, what would that accomplish? He’s a shitty person, but that’s kinda it. He’s a shitty pathetic person who has done terrible things under the thumb of a psychopath who could kill him at any moment. I don’t think he could get a full redemption like A-Train, but I think he deserves at least a moment of conviction, a moment where he can finally take back some of his agency. A happy ending would be a little unearned, but I think a good ending for his character would be to finally get away from humanity so he can be with his fish friends.
To be fair to the Deep, you forgot how he was being bullied about his gills. The guy had a huge insecurity about it and it was something he couldn't control, like you said about A-Train. It might not be a race thing but it's definitely an issue, a deformity. And this issue later turned into his weird obsessions.
The reason why atrain was able to turn around was literally his family,which the deep does not have(as far as we have seen it).Atrain used to unvind with his fam which he loves,but now his brother despises him and he cant talk with his nephews neither and that really shook him and he wants to do some good so they can be proud of him again.This literally means everything to him.He is just as a dirtbag as Deep but he knows he has to change if he does not want to lose his family.The icing on the cake was when that boy saw him at the hospital and atrain said he never felt better than in that moment.
While deep had only ppl who used him,the church used him,his wife used him,HL using him..with him killing Ambrosia he killed his humanity with her,so now he can do anything,similar to HL.
Plus,while Atrain isnt stupid by any means,the Deep is LOL
I did love the fact that besides Homelander all that's left of the original Seven is the Deep and A-Train, both of whom genuinely try to do good. Of course this season we've seen Deep fully give into his bad impulses and become a murderous sycophant for Homelander. A-Train on the other hand becomes completely disillusioned with Vought and takes over Annie's role as the Boys' inside man before fully quitting the Seven for good.
It’s funny because this parallel between the two in the show is the exact opposite of the way it is in the comics.
In “The Boys” comic, The Deep is a black man, who is belittled for his skin color and his status as this Aquaman-like, water-themed superhero. He’s also the most level-headed of the Seven. By contrast, A-Train, in the comics, is a white teenager (19 or so) who’s has his life handed to him on a silver platter - creating this hateful, entitled, and perverted little brat. In the comics, A-Train is the one who sexually assaults Starlight at the beginning of the story, ALONG WITH killing Hughie’s previous girlfriend, Robin. Although A-Train wasn’t alone in his initial advance toward Starlight (Homelander pressured Starlight into it with him, A-Train and Black Noir), he does try to force himself on her multiple times throughout the series.
While A-Train apologizes in the show and Hughie, with some time, does forgive him, in the comics The Boys capture and kill A-Train - with Hughie delivering the final blow.
Which version do you like more?
I think Butcher under Kessler influence will become very comic-butcher like. It would be a good detail if they put him in all black clothes and clean shaven in the last season.
dude, why the comic is so bad? i dont get it
it was so sad to see Deep became got lower than he already is he used to care so much about sea creatures but after killing his octopus he became apathetic towards all the cruel actions he done.
This the deep hate is crazy, literally the only reason A train got better was cause the writers wanted him to, the deep arguably got put through more stuff, he was shamed for his body by women, he was blasted off the 7 (rightfully) and then after he did his rehabilitation became a better person. He was forced into eating he's friends watched his whale friend die it was messed up what homelander made him do, that's why he felt he was wronged and such, it was his whole arc in season 1 getting over his passed bad experiences and the crazy stuff homelander makes him do. I do understand why people hate on him so much when really and truly he's a good guy being swayed by bad forces like that really smart girl telling him to be more aggressive to none supes. Of course he didn't have to do that but if he didn't well she has homelander under her thumb so she probably could have killed him
Nono, the hate ain't crazy. 💀
Yes A-Train getting better because the writter wanted him to is literally the basis of character writting.
And for what he has done:
-Sexual abuse from the VERY begining
-Zoophilia (consented but still)
-Made a dolphin killed because he prefered dirty talking to it instead of watching the fucking road
-He literally made the whale to strand and then was surprised that it got killed by a boat at full speed
-The "body shaming" part came after his allegations got public and getting gill-fingered was the bare minimum of Karma he could recieve
-Why didn't he ask the fisherman to put the lobster in a bag in the first place.
-Tried to start a threesome with an Octopus and his actual gf (who asked)
-Killed the only being that cared for his ass (Ambrosius I guess) because of his ego (ego that he got since the begining)
-Yes Homelander asked him to eat Thimoty but (1) It's Homelander (2) why do you have an Octopus at work in a first place, especially if you don't like marinelife being captive
And probably other stuff that I don't remember.
He's not a badly written character by any mean, and the actor did a perfect job at portraying him as a douchebag but it is what it is
Justice for The Peak ✊
Actually you had it spot on until you said the deep didn’t have his community care he did it was the ocean animals which Vought denied and he rescued himself only to let them get killed which fucked him up even more every time he failed first it was the dolphin then the lobster then eating the octopus and then finally killing Ambrosious that’s what drove him to The Deep End…
A train killed robin by accident, what deep did to starlight was on purpose
A-Train and Deep are both narcissistic, somewhat cowardly and insecure men who are obsessed by how other people see them. They each have their soft spots (A-Train cares about his home community, Deep cares about his sea community).
The main difference between them is that whenever Deep tries to be better the show throws it in his face and hands him failure so he has to run back to Homie with his tail between his legs.
A-Train got the same treatment for a bit but now the writers decided to take the exact same plotline he had last season and rehash it... but this time play it earnestly instead of as a joke.
The problem is that they don't develop Deep well and they only use him for jokes and nothing more.
ok cool and all but how u gonna say its something A-train can't control and the deep can control it. No he could not control the compound V his parents gave him, his gills, and his strange power that allows him to talk with sea animals. he can't control any of it and gets made fun of for it, and honestly talking to fish like people gotta be crazy for your psyche. I'm not saying the Deep is a good guy or anything but bro definitely has his own personal issues with little to no support or guidance.... beside the octopus...... he was fuckin. I hope the deep at least gets a dope water fight if they are gonna kill him but they could honestly still somehow flip him. bro isn't that evil
the only people who make him feel bad about his gills are genuinely bad people like homelander or the girl in sandusky. most of the other reasons he gets made fun of are his actions. in general he's constantly being some mix of a genuine menace, a pathetic suckup or an insecure manchild. and as was said in the video he never reflects on this or makes any genuine attempt to change, instead he just uses any criticism he ever receives as an excuse to do more bad things even harder. homelander undergoes the exact same cycle. so i do think up to this point he's been genuinely evil but i would agree he'd be more likely to flip and self reflect than someone like homelander ever would. also agree about the psychological effects of talking to sea creatures and i love how the show actually goes into this even if its just a little
Nah.
nah u in multiple comment replying defending deep,he paying you?😂
@@bighen2162 I made 1 comment and replyd to like one comment. This guy made a whole video and didn't mention the obvious point I made about his gills and talking to sea life. its my day off bitch
Why are you so obsessed with The Deep? Or do you just like bestiality?
I always thought of deep as relatable, honestly hasn’t changed
bruh...
Don't let this man near an aquarium
dont tell me you just... octopus 🙁
@@suapanpinaor a human woman. At least the octopus was okay with it.
@@cthulhucrews6602and coming to the conclusion that the only way to be taken seriously is to inflict fear (yeah, a little edgy of me)
Great analysis
And funny enough they’re my two favorites of the show
I feel like A Train and Deep really encapsulate the idea that power doesn’t corrupt, but rather it reveals
This is hot shit my friend, keep up the good work.
I never thought about stuff like this.
A-Train definitely had to fight for his position in the Seven. Season 1 had the 'race of the century' and A-Train pushing himself to his physical and chemical limits for the sake of not being kicked out of the team.
Eye opening. Good job.
Didn't really noticed the purpose of the "blow" scene before your video (aside the power abuse), the deep goes down and A-train rise (or is shown higher).
The Deep has a community, it's the sea life but unlike Aquaman, he doesn't want to live underwater (probably craving for human affection like homelander), Humanity (and mostly homelander and the seven in general) corrupted him while Arthur Curry was the King of the seas before being a member of the justice league.
3:42 Homelander belittles him for his gills foe example. I'd say that's sth about him he has no control over.
A-Train and The Deep both wanted to be better. The Deep failed. After being betrayed and exploited by his church, he was brought back in by Homelander, and he did continue trying, but never got anything from it while continually seeing Homelander, literally the worst person he's ever encountered receive everything.
So he quit, and begun emanating him. Why try and be better if everyone is going to hurt, betray, or take advantage of you for doing so when cruelty is the only thing you've seen work?
Then, there's A-Train. A man who wanted to be better, and got every opportunity and incentive to do it. Then it paid off. With Hughie, the man he never expected forgiveness from, actually forgiving him. That smile from the child for saving MM. And being the first member of the Seven to form a friendship with Ashley. Which doesn’t sound like much, but receiving a real friend, even in good (or crime in their setting) clearly meant a lot to him.
I found the Deep to be one of the most tragic character arcs in the show, seeing him try so hard only to be exploited and abused for his gullibility at every point. Until he gave up. Who knows? Maybe if Starlight had given him the same forgiveness (I'm not saying she should have. He didn't earn it, but never got the opportunity to, either) at some point that Hughie gave A-Train, he might have stuck it through.
Kinda crazy realizing the The Deep and Homlander are the last 2 members on the 7 that’ve been there since season 1. (Technically Nior has the same actor but story wise it’s a different person)
one thing I like a lot:
their relationship with their respective victims during their arcs
Deep while not remorseful about it at least seemed to understand that what he did to Starlight was wrong, after he gets back into the seven he becomes straight up delusional and thinks he's an innocent man who was wrongfully accused, his arc ENDS with him forgetting everything he learned and embracing delusion
A-train on the other hand was both remorsless AND delusional at the beginning, legitimately convinced that Hughie's actions against him were worse tha his own, his arc STARTS when he accepts reality for the first time and acknowledges that he was the one that fucked hughie over (not viceversa) and that he needs to make up for it
A-train gains Hughie's forgiveness, Deep gets humilliated by Starlight.
The Boys is probably one of the few adaptations that surpass their source material by leaps and bounds. I *never* recommend the comic to fans of the show
I appreciate that they showed a bipoc character to be one with honor. That and when this stunning show refused to kill off Brave Maeve, that was the epitome of good writing. Everyone is TIRED of the trope where the gay character dies. WE ARE SICK OF IT. Thank you
THATS LIL RINO HE GOOD🗣️😭
Atrain is an irredeemable character. His actions in S3/S4 were understandable but I really hope the show doesn’t make him “one of the good guys” by the end. Unless it it’s in a sacrificial moment
A-Train was always a good character but he has shot up among my favorites with S4, such a well done redemption arc.
Deep thought with The Deep
the Deep could be a deep character (oops) we see his inner struggles, how despite wanting to save marine life he fails and no one cares about that, and several other things making him fall into what he is now, since all His experiences guided him to the fact that if he wanted to be respected he had to be feared. But the writers don't take him seriously and only use him for jokes or to bring up Starlight's SA (for four fucking seasons for God's sake, stop it, it's already clear to me that assaulting someone is wrong)
THE PEAK
The only redeeming quality the Deep had was his true care for sea creatures. I liked that, but now he’s just a sociopath.
Yeah though he is very careless with them, like the wake, dolphin and him killing that octopus, he’s not actually caring for them.
Tbf imagine if Homelander forced A-train to eat one of his friends alive like he did with the Deep
Deep already started from the bottom for me for how he was introduced
Marble floors beat🐐
ik i aint the only one who thought that
I thought a train dying would be the best character arc for him, but I was wrong
Is there anyone who has a had a greater arc than A Train? Its so insane
I like that I’m not the only one. I felt like the show was slowly building up Deep vs A Train. While A Train becomes an actual hero, Deep went down the path of villain
this is the inversion of their arcs in the comics somewhat
Solid video. Keep up with good work !
I think you are forgetting the side of the deep he is for rejecting. it's his relationship with the water and nature. He hasn't accepted he technically the voice, a certain type of creature that can't be heard. That probably needs the most help. Yes , he has sexual relations with them, which id weird and whatever else. He has rejected that side of himself by the end of the new season. If anything, he killed it. Plus, with the whole thing with a train strat to change when he killed that guy who injured his brother. I don't think that was a sign that he was changing if anything Showed by them in planning his heart inside of him . That he was falling deeper problem that Was making him into. Which was someone to kill for his own ego and not doing what's right. That the slippery slope that homelander was pull Ryan into as well. Being able to justify killing someone. Only now that we see a train is willing to save live and not take them that he's finally starting to heal from the corruption that vought was doing to him. Unlike the deep where he's found pleasure in it.
What’s the music that was used at the beginning boys?
if you’re talking about the background music it’s called “L’amore dice ciao”
@@damarjowvan Thank you man.
The Deep
Blowing the A-Train cooming soon to Amazon prime
bro i thought i was watching Pobelter for a second.
What do mean inverted arc?
The Peaker just gets Peaker and A-Train keeps getting more unstoppable🗿
Atrain saved Hughies girlfriend ironically
They are both bad people who refuse to let go of their power and status for different reasons. Deep is a coward and A-train refuses to let everything he had to put up with be for nothing. In season 4 they are both given the chance to either do good or leave, but sadly one one of them takes it.