Kobe Bryant vs Michael Jordan: Who Is ACTUALLY Better?
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- Опубликовано: 18 сен 2024
- The Great Kobe Bryant vs. Michael Jordan Debate Gets SOLVED Once And For All! 😉
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Everybody wanna talk about "Competition"
In the Lakers' 3 Peat they faced 90 Year old Reggie, The Bum Ass New Jersey Nets, AND Allen Iverson whose second best player was Eric Snow. TF OUTTA HERE! THOSE WERE THE EASIEST FINALS EVER!!! Looooolllll y'all be talking about MJ easy competition... The Odds of Lakers winning those titles must've been highest in NBA History!
MJ faced the Lakers who were a DYNASTY and beat them.
He faced Clyde Drexler who to that point people were saying were Equal To or Better than him. All he did was hit 6 Straight 3s in an NBA Finals game and shrugged at You in THE MOST GANGSTER thing anybody has ever done.
He then went up against Charles Barkley who got the MVP that year and AGAIN MANY PEOPLE THOUGHT he was better than Jordan AND That Phoenix Suns team was called "The Team of Destiny" which won 60 games that year.
MANY NEW AGE PEOPLE FORGET BASKETBALL WAS A BIG MAN'S GAME UNTIL MAGIC, LARRY, and finally HIS AIRNESS took it to another level.
What did MJ do to Barkley? Dropped 55 on his head in the Finals, no game 7, all doubts removed.
When Michael Jordan stepped on that Court there was NO DOUBT in anybody's mind who the best player Was... The CRAZY CRAZY CRAZY thing is...
WAIT FOR IT KOBE FANS...
KOBE WAS THE SAME BUT SLIGHTLY LESS ATHLETIC AND FOR A SHORTER PERIOD.
By "the same" I mean there was a 3 Year period where Kobe was as Feared and as Deadly.
But MJ did it better, for longer, and with a little more Grace.
LOVING THIS DEBATE APPRECIATE YOU GUYS MAN ❤
Let's be clear here. Kobe wouldn't be half the player he was if he wasn't literally learning from Michael Jordan. And he still wasn't better than Jordan
Yes he wasn't better. That being said HOW MANY people had MJ as a hero and tried to replicate his game and came nowhere close? Ummm EVERYBODY. So the fact that Kobe was able to come as close and still carve out a HOF career is pretty Spectacular!
Kobe is right there with mj,,, stop the disrespect
They’re super close. MJ is only better because of his athleticism that he was gifted with, Kobe had to work harder so he ended up more skilled.
Can we please stop this narrative, it's incorrect..Kobe faced better competition than both MJ and Lebronze..Kobe beat more 50 plus teams than ANYBODY in NBA history..🐍🐍🐍🐍🐍🐍
He was the closest thing to Jordan and his skills overall were better than Jordan.... People dont realize kobe played against better players and teams than Jordan did... I believe if kobe played the same time Jordan did he would have more than 6 rings... Kobe went against way better teams and beat more .500 teams than anyone other player has...
Huge Kobe fan but even I know who the GOAT is.
Yup. But damn looking over the Stats it was closer than I thought in certain categories!
Latinos aren't known for standing up to the truth or being well informed bro. Stand down
Stats aren’t everything. #Mike changed the game #Forever and they’re still chasing #TheGOAT✨
Cap
@@garrettedison4466🧐
In the last dance documentary Kobe says: "I truly hate having discussions about who would win one-on-one. You heard fans saying, ‘Hey Kobe, you’d beat Michael one-on-one’ and I feel like, yo, what you get from me is from him. I don’t get five championships here without him. ‘Cause he guided me so much and gave me so much great advice.”"
Kobe is definitely on my mount Rushmore. Jordan, Magic, Kobe and Kareem
Love this point! So many young people forget how much MJ influenced today's game and was EVERYBODY'S HERO! Not just basketball players.
What a tribute Kobe paid to him night in and night out 🙏🏽🫡🔥
Kobe isn't top 5 bro
Pc jargon nonsense. Kobe harder defense league slower pace no illegal d rule for auto spacing
@@MFjaYWiLL he better than lebron. Lol
Michael Jordan. Done.
It's mike 7 days a week...Mike was more accomplished...More accolades..Eye test..Mike..The only thing kobe did better was shot more long balls..Mike is the GOAT 🐐
@@thengyang5537 The One 🫡
Jordan could do everything Kobe could but kobe couldn’t do everything Jordan could.
Well Said.
I guess in an overall sense. But Jordan never put up 80 or outscored an entire team by himself after 3 quarters.
@@MichaelBrown-dc4zz No Jordan never put up 80. I believe his highest was 63 but not because he couldn’t. Kobe studied everything about Jordan from his skill set, efficiency, style of walk to what he ate and how he trained. Kobe even wanted to know what Jordan said to opposing players and how he trashed talked them. Kobe mimicked second three peat MJ. 80’s MJ was a problem! That’s where Air Jordan came from. Kobe couldn’t palm the ball or have the athleticism. That’s what separated them.
@@WinfordStraub All that doesnt matter. The fact is Kobe did some shit no one else other than Wilt has done. The idea Jordan could do everything Kobe did is false. Period. Oh well Jordan could have if he tried doesn't cut it.
@@MichaelBrown-dc4zz If you know how efficient he was and his playing style yes he could.
Jordan was a technical masterpiece on the court , and Kobe was an emulator. They are not the same, not even close.
Jordan was a Masterpiece agreed. But to say Kobe didn't come close isn't factually true! One is Super Great and the other is The Greatest. That's the way I see it!
Not even close?? Lmaoo u don't know basketball then
Kobe didn't just emulate but he was the better shooter, better footwork and defender.
@@VihanVictoryou forgot he actually credit his footwork from Hakeem and surprisingly Michael Jackson.
Great point! Lol funnily enough I bring that cup in my Anthony Edwards vid, where BOTH Kobe and MJ learned from Hakeem The Dream!
With this guy's eloquent speaking alongside with the deadpan humor in the editing (which is a nice touch), this guy will stride far
Hey Thanks A lot! Seriously. It means a hell of a lot 🫡💪💜
This isn't even a close debate when you break this down rationally.
Closer than I thought! I had the same notion going in.
Kobe didn’t start beating Michael Jordan teams until he was with the Washington Wizards and was way over the hill. Jordan s teams in 96 97 98 not Kobe team went to the finals and won each time. It amazes me how many people make up things to support an athlete when the facts are there to easily disprove what they are saying.
Jordan is just better player overall period. There is no question here, but there are true statistical facts. And how could you ever say Kobe was more skilled than Michael Jordan when there is obvious visual and statistical proof to the contrary. It is okay to say you just like Kobe more, but better player ,no lol.
Kobe was literally a copycat. Other than 3 point shooting Kobe was not on Jordan’s level. And I contend that even the three point shooting was not a good thing because Jordan was just better at getting good shots. And better ball handler? Just no!!
Kobe Is In A Lower GOAT Tier Than MJ And Bron. Its Not Really A Debate, He Doesnt Has The Most MVPs Or Finals MVPs Of The Decade People Claiming He Ran.
Yeah I think the lack of Regular Season MVPs really hurts his Case. What I found interesting too is he was regarded as the Greatest Scorer ever by many, but only 2 scoring titles to MJ 10!
@@VoidVirtue But he was the most feared Offensive option in the League for a long time. He might not've "run the league" but nobody wanted that smoke with Kob.
@@VihanVictor Kobe Was Truly Only MJ Level For About 4 Years Maybe From 06 To 2010, 01 To 03 He Was Lethal But Not Peak MJ Level. Kobe Was Never Like A 87 To 93 MJ Really, He Showed Shades But He Was Mostly A 97 98 Jordan For Kobes Best Years, Where LeBron Was A Whole Different Kind Of Beast That Dominanted To A Level That Truly Rivals MJ And Kareem. Kob Is A Top 7 8 To To 10 All Time For Me, Not A Top 5.
@VihanVictor I Agree The 2000s Kobe Was The Top Guard Fasho ! But I Got Shaq At The Top Of That Era, Then Duncan, Then Kobe Bean.
@@VoidVirtueYes very good points, I have no qualms! Agreed. Very happy you said Tim Duncan too, only REAL hoopers know 👌🏽
Kobe was a better 3 point shooter and ball handler. But when Kobe said Mike is the goat in 03 and 08 I don't dispute that. He respected Mike and other NBA greats before him. Not like Balco.
He aint BETTER 3pt shooter,
@@TheDocmike23🗣️🎯EXACTLY ! OR BALL HANDLER .>🎤 🏀🗑️🤾⛹️
Looolll you guys are savage. I like Balco 😂😂😂
Jordan the better shooter overall but Kobe's era were more focused on 3's that's all.
Why do you need to Yell all your points? 😅
Why the trash can emoji? You really think Kob was that bad?
You'd Be Wrong.
Really enjoyed your content!
Hey thanks so much brother 🫡👊🏽🙏🏽
Let me be clear when I say this Kobe was the CLOSEST thing to mj but he wasn’t mj and yes I saw mj and Kobe play
Agreed. And LUCKY YOU!!! WISH I was fortunate enough to watch either.
MJ had a better career, but 06 Kobe is much better than any version of MJ. 10X better 3pt shooter, better handle, better midrange than young MJ. Mj was just a lot more athletic than Kobe and took smarter shots. But let's not just state opinions. Look at facts. 06 Kobe was the best scoring season of all time (not counting Wilt). The league ppg was 96ppg and Kobe averaged 36. When MJ average 37 the league ppg was 110. If you convert it Kobe would average 42ppg today. Also zone was banned when MJ played. Going against a zone is A LOT harder to score. 05 and 06 is hand down the toughest defense era in nba history. Now the shit Kobe was doing in 06 was video game level. He outscored entire teams. Average 50 for 2 weeks. Average 40 for a month. The difference is Kobe turns into an excellent 3pt shooter when he's hot with Curry range. It allows him to hit 60+. Hard to rack up those numbers without a ton of 3s.
Now MJ is the goat, even Kobe said so. But 06 Kobe and 3 peat Shaq are imo the best primes of all time. 1 other thing. MJ shot the ball a shitload more than Kobe. 06 and 07 were the ONLY seasons Kobe took MJ quantity of shots.
@@GJG_3 Yes, MJ definitely had a better career. He also had much better stats. You said to look at the facts yet you state contradicting opinions.
For starters you say Kobe had better mid-range than young MJ. At the same time you compare Kobe's peak season with Jordan's 3rd season when he didn't hit his prime yet. The reason MJ averaged 37 PPG is because he was the only scoring option on the team. Peak MJ would've averaged more in the same circumstances. So your point is moot.
The zone argument. True. But at the same time Kobe benefited from rule changes implemented for 04/05 season to curtail hand-checking. Not to mention the defensive 3-sec violation.
Essentially NBA wanted to make scoring easier and allow easier penetration to ultimately enable player to take higher percentage shots. The rule changes favored mostly athletic, perimeter players like Kobe and MJ (and you noticed yourself MJ was more athletic hence he'd benefit from those rules even more).
Bottom line the hardest defense ever was late 90s, early 00s. Anything starting from 04/05 cannot be considered the toughest defense anymore. How many 60+ point games did Kobe have prior to 04/05? Let me tell you -- ZERO. His career high was 56 until then.
Any version of peak Jordan (87/88 to 92/93) was far better than any version of Kobe. Kobe's peak might have been a little better than 2nd Treepeat MJ. That's it.
@@GJG_3lmao no. Not even close bro sorry
@@GJG_3Kobe didn't say MJ goat lol. MJ isn't. Kobe just being respectful. He knows he's better lol. All legends will credit anyone else legendary but they all know or think they're better LMAO
Michael Jordan is literally kobe with Russell Westbrooks athleticism, kyries finishing, kawhi handsize and defense with Zach lavines vertical
Bahahaha best description yet! So Damn True! Young MJ was an athletic marvel who was already super skilled and smart. Then as his athleticism diminished, became the most unstoppable Post scorer with the best most unguardable AND efficient shot in NBA History after the Sky Hook: The Fadeaway 💪🫡😎
This isn’t a debate this is why ppl use lebron
I hear ya but A LOT of people find that comparison hard because their position and playing styles so different!
Jordan easily greatest of all time 😊
Nope never win wo pip
Bro... Bron didn't win without PRIME D WADE KYRIE AND AD. The teammate argument is whack because all these guys were the BEST player on their teams, THAT'S what counts!
I love both but people completely screw up perspective.
Jordan came to a team where he immediately was the number one option. They built the team around him. Kobe came to a team where he had to wait for his shot because he was right out of high school. And they didn't build the team around Kobe, they built it around Shaq, so Kobe had to defer to him in the first few years of his career. Michael never had to deal with that.
So, the stats don't tell the whole story because Kobe ended up becoming more skilled than Michael. He learned from him and nearly improved on most of his attributes.
I wonder what would've happened if Jordan had to play with a Shaq. Does he still have 10 scoring titles? Does he still get all 6 finals MVP's? And what if Kobe went to a team where they built it around him. Does he win more MVP's. Does he win more scoring titles?
This is what I Factor into it when comparing these two. And honestly, I would still give the slight edge to Michael, but because of those other things and what Kobe had to over come, I think it's a hell of allot closer than what people think.
Totally! Very good points. But one could argue that Michael still had to earn that #1 billing despite the Bulls' intentions because the GM Rod Thorn at the time said "Jordan wasn't our first option"
But yes, you make some great points. Given the level of dominance that Shaq displayed, it'd be hard to give ANYBODY else the Finals MVP.
Lot closer than people allow for, AGREED! 🫡
You ask on who "actually" is better like it's an actual debate Lol, MJ there's your answer.
Kobe and Jordan are the ones ppl should debate about bei g goat.....lebron has no reason to be in the convo at all...he failed way too many times to even be in the convo as goat
50% Agree. I think he's done enough as an OVERALL player to be #2 on the list.
Where I do agree is, there's failures and then there's FAILURES.
Even though I'm Heat to the grave, what we saw in 2011 was one of the most confusing, bewildering, and ultimately disgusting performances.
I WILL NEVER STAND FOR INDIFFERENCE. You don't get to pick and choose when to Show Up.
That's ONE BIG WAY Kobe edges him.
I don't care what anyone has to say either.
It's Simple like this: If there's two or let's say 3 guys and they're all similar EXCEPT ONE GUY IS BETTER THAN BOTH IN CERTAIN MEANINGFUL CATEGORIES!
Losing to Dallas Mavs in 2011 removed him
From GOAT because the other guy never EVER cheated the Game like that.
Yes to Bron's credit he matured and grew up
and became who he is, but we are talking about the ONE GUY.
People who watched Michael Jordan knew that he was not only willing, but was GOING TO DIE OUT THERE to make sure the Fans went home pleased and happy.
How can we just dismiss that level of Custodianship? MJ cared about the entire league, WAS PURE CLASS with the Media despite the INSANE ATTENTION. They were so below the belt with him about his Dad yet he just exuded pure class. Best Is: Before Bron started to Gas up his own Hype Train Michael Jordan was his hero and idol just like everyone ever 😂
@@VihanVictor I agree with everything you said... Yes that 2011 was a huge failure but when I was watching it and Maimi was up 2-1 and LeBron started talkin shit to dirk nowinski and making fun of him when he was sick (which is totally uncalled for and shows poor sportsmanship), and for dirk to comeback and win was priceless.... How do u talk shit then play like crap and cause ur team to lose?... Thats why LeBron cam never be goat...he failed in the worst ways possible.... If kobe had that Miami team he would've 3peated for sure... Kobe was going to almost 3peat with just Gasol playing in the harder western conference... Thats why I have kobe and mj on a different tier then everyone else...
I’m pick mj over Kobe any day of the week period
Can't Blame Ya!
Dwade is closer to Kobe then Kobe is to Jordan
I can see that. You know I'm on board for anything D Wade. As big of a fan that I am, I feel Wade's injuries prevented him from being as great as Kobe. Without THAT many injuries I think Wade could've given both Kobe and Lebron a run for their money.
Jordan never took advice from Kobe lol
Lol I know I somewhat misspoke. I meant more in a life sense that they both had high regard for one another and valued each other's Friendship off the court.
Exactly
Kobe’s Vegeta who has a better character arc than Gooku
Lol sure? Don't fully understand the reference but I don't live under a rock so I can extrapolate 😂🫡👍🏽
The only part of Kobe's game that truly resembled Jordan was the fade away J in the post, and that was late yrs Jordan. MJ's hang time, Palming, head and palm fakes, come from nowhere blocks, pickpocketing, lightning quick closing out passing lanes, hanging double / triple clutch layup package, cat quick first step, dishes from the air, extra gear vertical, and especially taking contact in the air and 1's.
Kobe didn't really do any of that, and any of it that he did do was nowhere near Jordan's level.
Love it. Gives me goosebumps seeing and hearing people appreciate MJ as much as I do. That extra gear vertical while palming the ball like Kawhi style is NUTS. Even Phil said it himself that MJ would beat Kobe 1-1 because "he had the hand."
I agree that Kobe should be top 2 or 3 it’s crazy that people are making these videos but the public refuses to put Kobe up there. They still have him in the bottom 10 or right out of the top 10. And I disagree that they both taught each other different things Jordan taught Kobe and that is it he was Kobe‘s mentor
Having Kobe out of Top 10 is not Crazy, it's DELUSIONAL AND WRONG!
You're right, in terms of Basketball I'd say it was Teacher-Student. I meant more in terms of life and business and how they approached the Game, MJ and Kobe had a close relationship. But yes MJ was his Mentor without a Doubt.
I don’t think it’s a debate that Kobe is more skilled than MJ. Go watch both their highlights, MJ relied on his athleticism for his fancy layups and dunks. Kobe was more fundamentally sound and flashier with his dribbling and shot creation. He could make any shot, however contested.
True but he also took a lot tougher shots. But as you rightly point out it could be because of inherent Gifts.
you must be on high drugs to think that KOBE was more skilled than JORDAN...you know that FUNDAMENTALS are skills...
fancy lay-ups also skills..
you said KOBE was more fundamental than JORDAN 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Now this comparison makes sense but still MJ is the goat.
Agreed Sir 💪
I think Michael had a tougher on-defense and he read moves better which netted him those steals. On offense he seemed to read moves ahead and needed less dribbling. He appeared to choreograph moves by a second ahead of time. He was also constantly looking for ways to penetrate so on off ball situations he never stopped moving which tired out his opponents tremendously. Michael could iso easily but the opposing team had to think about every other route the offense would come so they're just mentally getting burned chasing after the multiple ways the Bulls would get their points.
Kobe looked like his offense was more "reaction" to the defense and required a lot of handling. They're pretty to look at but it often caused him to get trapped against the defense. Of course he made those tough shots anyway but looking back at it he seemed to have just fight harder than smarter. He loved the 3 ball a bit too much so he wasn't running the triangle very dynamically by making everyone attacking the paint or mid range more. Also Kobe never stole or blocked as much as Michael did.
When he became the captain after Shaq left, he was a bit too selfish as a leader and din't cultivate the other guys more.
I always think it like this. Michael in that 2008 finals is not losing to the Celtics. Paul Pierce is a big SF but he cannot physcally stop Michael. KG talks a lot of smack but he cannot shut Michael down with his attitude. Both Michael and Kobe were psychopaths on the floor. But I have to give the edge to Michael for tormenting his opponents with words and scowling alone aside from his skills.
Very very well said! My only real critique of Kobe is what you rightly asserted: I think he was a little too ball dominant a lot, and his trust in his teammates also was never on Par with MJ. I don't see Kobe passing to Kerr or Paxson. MJ ALWAYS MADE THE RIGHT PLAY!!!
Dude played the game for that One Fan who had saved up all their Money and seeing HIM for the first time! Different Frequency. THE GOAT.
Neither is the goat. Keep their greatness in the eras they thrived which is modern day post 80s
MJ is clearly better. Not by much at all. Has nothing to do with rings or athleticism or awards based on opinion since those things are not pure measurements of an individuals abilities to contribute to a team by any stretch of the imagination. No amount of rings or awards or athleticism is magically gunna make you better than someone who’s just an overall better more skilled player than you in the sport of team basketball
MJ is Slightly better producer of each major category and harder rules he dealt with while Kobe dealt with harder comp his last 2 chips but easier comp his first 3 chips
MJ and Kobe and bron are nowhere near the goat. And that’s what people are truly scared to say cuz most people today are either too uneducated and casual to understand the game or are bought out or caught up in emotional ties to what they young minds grew up on including young minded GenX
Loooolll these takes are from all over the place!
Jordan didn't just thrive in "modern day post 80s" given that he was drafted in 1984 and produced some of the greatest seasons ever DURING that time.
There's only 5 real GOAT Contenders, so if not MJ then who? Kareem? Magic?
Agree with some of your points, esp with the rings/athleticism comment.
But Michael Jordan is the GOAT, truthfully it's not close if you take EVERYTHING into account!
@@VihanVictor far from truthfully. You cannot provide consistent logical correct unbiased information to present MJ as the goat just like you cannot for many others. Takes from supposedly all over the place Is irrelevant. The truth is the truth
1980s MJ was amazing but there’s far greater seasons than that and it’s a fact MJ did not win chips till things got significantly easier in the 90s. Not as easy as shaq had it when he won chips but a clear much easier path than 80s regardless
“Only 5 real GOAT CONTENDERS” that’s head cannon just as the names listed is head cannon. Magic isn’t even clearly better overall than Mike tho it’s very close
Post prime Wilt has embarrassed prime Kareem overall and post retirement Wilt embarrassed prime magic in competitive pick up. That goes to show how much prime Wilt is above both
Wilt is the goat hands down. No one in history was great enough to force as many rule changes nor was as versatile from their position nor was battle tested with the level of difficulty and challenges he faced nor overcame greater odds as often and lost with easier circumstances as little as Wilt, and end of the day, above all else, no one who can be considered a better scorer and passer than wilt, is remotely close to wilt in defense and rebounding relative to position or in general. He’s far greater at defense and rebounding than anyone else would be as much greater than him at passing and scoring esp with fg and the rules and defense and hoops and pace and minutes/fatigue of his era and that he played and dealt with
The goat convo scorer, goat convo fg scorer, goat rebounder, goat convo defender, and can even rival goat passers at his peak. No one is that overall great not even close
Wilt
Bill russsell
Kareem
Bird
West
Elgin
Doc
All better than MJ magic bron kobe etc
MJ Oscar and magic are neck and neck for the last 3 spots of the top 10 but you can objectively see those 7 have superior games all around than Mike when comparing tools
If you go by “everything” and include silly things like awards rings and analytics and other contextless things, you can make a case for Mike over some guys he doesn’t belong over but you’ll never be able to do it for someone like wilt who has beaten a far superior dynasty and chip streak than Mikes team was himself let alone him never beating one, more records than MJ has awards anslytics and rings combined, analytics that far surpass MJ when you research wilts defense and blocks, far more stat titles, more impressive impact having opinions from all eras and goat tier players from different positions including Mike and mikes idols emulating wilts moves as a big all before the media era that heavily propagated Mike and bron. More rule changes forced to the game etc… and is far closer to Mike in rings awards and analytics without wilts blocks research, than Mike is close to wilt in versatility feats, win over fully in tact dynasties, records, stats, rule changes forced to the game, goat convo over as many different major categories, physical tools and attributes, competition and domination over position and superior teams and superior supporting cast and hof challenge success etc…
I’m not even sure MJs career would survive a Rucker park summer league game past his prime in the 70s just to keep his game sharp like how Wilt and wilts peers did yearly
Bro what In Tarnation are you saying? NOT ONE of those players had superior game to MJ.
*I'd like to add Personally that I PREFER to rate guys from the 30-32 team era. I SEE an argument for a Wilt in terms of Stats, but when there's 6 Teams, you're 3 feet taller than everyone, AND there was no goal tending rule... Dude vultured his teammates points AND lost to Bill Russell all the time.
DOES WINNING COUNT YES OR NO?
DOES COMPETITION MATTER? I'll answer the second... YES.
Your argument they had the most rule changes with Wilt is neither here nor there. The Game and league were in their nascent stages, the league was bankrupt and about to Shut down. If we use the STATS argument it's Lebron.
The Rucker Park comment is a.) emotional and b.) factually incorrect because when Kobe played at Rucker HE SMOKED THOSE FOOLS! Jordan would've been even better.
It's not close. MJ is like Usain Bolt, we'll never see a full package like that ever again.
Michael Jordan is not only the Greatest Player of All Time in Basketball, they said it best in Last Dance: "Michael Jordan was better at his job than anybody has ever been at any Job." Them's the FACTS KID!!! He's the Greatest athlete of all time, the Greatest role model, the MOST successful businessman POST playing career. Still commands the MOST RESPECT, doesn't even use Instagram.
Fudge that scene in Last Dance where you see Leonardo DiCaprio trying to get 1 SECOND with MJ, A GLANCE!!! THIS WAS LEO AFTER TITANIC!!! Michael Jordan didn't even who tf he was 😤
@@VihanVictor reading is your best friend. So is research. Stay educated youngin. None of your comment is grounded in reality and like God said, people suffer due to their lack of education. No one was 3 feet taller than everyone else lmaooo like what are you 10 years old? There was never a single season where wilt was in the league with someone more than just 1 inch shorter than him, (high jump champ dukes, Tom, mel etc) several years with players multiple inches taller than him, (Kareem, high jump champ Halbrook etc) and a league avg of 6’6 the same as 2022 and centers 6’10.5 same as 2022
So why cap? Cuz your full of emotion and bias no logic or research
8-14 teams is Wilts era. Never in history has their been 6 teams. Wilt won more and dominated in multiple categories all the same as teams increased debunking any notion that more teams makes it more difficult
Bigger than that, logically if you cut teams in half only best of the best will make your new smaller league with no room for lesser players and players who didn’t make it constantly striving to get better or good enough to get in one day more than a league with far more opportunities to make it
So it is not logical to think less teams means less skill or comp or inferior era. Totally full of bias and emotion to think that illogically
The rules and pace and style of play ensured that wilts era was all that and then some making sure not only the best of the best we’re allowed in the league but that max integrity and difficulty to play and science to play was kept at an all time high as a result. Hence why all the superteams and HOFs and better all around players top to bottom exist in wilts more than any other era
You prefer a 30-32 team era cuz you are stuck on what the media fed you and prefer that which is in reality inferior as they did not even make their rules difficult to even try to ensure a higher level of skill with their players. Not to mention the 3 pt line and slower pace of play due to lack of ball movement and over dribbling concepts of hero ball and still with those easier rules and easier defenses and easier reinforced hoops to make goals on, they could not separate themselves much in FG% from wilts era (90s worse FG than the 70s for gods sake) and could not outscore them whatsoever despite a massive energy conservation and a 3 pt line just as eras after them could not touch wilts era
Also even assists were counted far easier in MJs time than wilts time which shows wilt is even a likely better passer in general let alone relative to position just like how he’s a better rebounder and defender relative to position and in general than jordan is and with MJs rules of legal backdown punishment and wrist carrying wilts field goal scoring is in a different multiverse than MJs relative to position and obviously in general naturally so.
Meanwhile wilts rules cause MJs assists to drop and makes things harder for MJ as he will has out easier and will be hitting the deck far harder than his complaints against Detroit with far more physical behemoths like Unseld, Reed, thurmond Bellamy wilt Beaty dukes etc… sending him to the floor for coming into their domain and no flagrants to help him whatsoever MJ will be great but no where near as great as he was in his own time in wilts era. Everything benefits wilt 10fold with only defensive 3 second to try and slow wilt down which won’t work since wilt is used to such a faster pace than everyone else and constantly moving in and out the paint when need be guarding 1-5 when need be.
Far more advantages MJ has in his era than wilt had in his. Not even close
Maybe lebron is great in his era and Kobe too. But the statistic talk itself Jordan is the greatest of them all. For me next to him is Kobe…
MJ The GOAT 🐐 💯
There is a difference between better and greater?
Not for Me, and def not in this Case!
Basic 15yrs lng si jordan nag laro pero yan na ang nakuha nya panu pa kaya kung kasing tagal nya si lebron
No entiendo ka pero slamat para comment RUclips 👌🏽💪🫡
Sorry statically jordan was better than kobe in ever aspect of thr game.
Thr knock on jordan was his 3pt shot but its the same as kobes.
Kobe just played longer so his career stats are higher
Hell jordans rookie season was statically bettet than kobes mvp season
MJ WAS Better! But given how legendary Kobe is, it's CRAZY to think there was a player who was clearly even Better 🫡
@@VihanVictor kobe only gets compared to the 96 to 98 Mike.
That 84 to 93 Mike was a totally different animal
Gil has always been dumb and now nick comes second. How is kobe's competition better than mj's. Kobe's even lucky je's got shaq so early in his career lol
Exactly!!! Such a pathetic argument. We gotta stop penalizing dudes for things they can't control.
Gilbert Arenas was an a*hole during his playing career and Now he's the biggest clown commentator. Thanks for the content Gil 🤡
Kobe came to a stacked Lakers team as a rook: Eddie Jones,Nick Van Excel,Shaq,Elden Campbell,etc,etc,.imagine if MJ had all these vets playing for the Bulls when he was a rook.
@@user-be7tc2bd6e Lolol MJ had Vets, they just weren't very good 😂
@@VihanVictor Correct.
Dwayne Wade??? Really? He let his son transition because his wife has the only balls in the family.
Whoa whoa whoa 😳 You are out of line sir.
@@VihanVictor Sir I’m a 72 yr old grandmother and the only ones out of line are those who think that bs is ok to push on our kids! Ever watched his podcast with his he/she kid??? It’s disgusting and so is he!
Alright Kobe is my favorite player and Jordan is the GOAT no doubt…. But you played semantics with Anthony Edward’s statement…. He may not have clarified but we all know he meant at or around his position and being clear…. Kobe played more talent at his position. But yes, without Michael no Kobe and honestly Michael did it better….. but I dare anyone to compare pg- sf and tell me Michael played similar talent….. love the vid btw…. I’m a fan of the vids but just like to debate 😂
Hahaha thanks a lot G! I see where you're coming from, I took his statement literally and thought he was criticizing the WHOLE league.
Ya Kob def played better talent, esp if you consider the rise of TMac, Vince, and of course D Wade!
Man Young Mike was not from this Season Planet. I also could watch his fadeaway all day every day!
Let’s be clear everyone don’t say it’s mj, Gil said himself that Kobe was the best player he ever seen… dirk said it.. dwade said it.. tmac said it curry took mj out of his starting 5 line up and threw Kobe in it.. Scottie said Kobe was better.. Dwight Howard said it a lot of players say Kobe… mj was just blessed with the better team to accomplish more.. and to be honest the league didn’t want Kobe to be the best.. after that court case it was down from there
1. Gilbert Arenas is a clown and a self centered moron.
2. That is CAP. BOTH TMac AND WADE say MJ is their GOAT, and NOBODY will change their Mind, esp D Wade who's best friends with Bron.
Kobe isn't the better player, but the fact he came close is highly highly impressive.
Tim Grover said it best: With his gifts Michael was able to work a lot smarter and more efficiently than Kobe. I think that's the best distinction.
It’s MJ and I don’t think it’s particularly close
Cuz you're incapable of thinking. You guys are least educated generation lol
🧐
Who do you think is GOAT?
I have a simple system. I give a half point for a finals appearance and 1 point for a regular season mvp, finals mvp and nba title.
The caveat is you need to at least win 1 finals mvp or mvp to be on the list. I deducted 6 points from a Bill Russell because his era had so few teams at one points
MJ 20
Kareem 18.5
LeBron 17
Russell 16.5
Magic 15.5
Duncan 13
Kobe 11.5
Shaq 11
Bird 10.5
Steph 10
Wilt 10
KD 7
Hakeem 6.5
Jerry West 6.5
Moses 6
Jokic 5.5
Isiah 3.5
KG 3
Dirk 3
Karl Malone 3
*point
This was the original goat debate even tho we all kno MJ is the goat we aleays had a MJ n Kobe debate. Its MJ n Kobe 1a 1b
Exactly! Rightfully so too! I dunno if Kob is 1b anymore given LeBron, but I'm willing to hear arguments.
Would you watch a Kobe vs. Bron video?
@@VihanVictor I'm willing to debate for Kobe being 1b. Of course more in depth comparison between the 2 would be a great video in my opinion. What is your top 10?
@@SilentMovements305he’s nowhere near 1b. Mj is by far the goat and no one comes close 😂
@@jasonmoukala8909 I said what I said
@@SilentMovements305 and I said what I said😂😂😂
Kobe is the most skilled player I have ever seen. Worked harder than everyone including Jordan. But Jordan worked smarter, was more efficient, more athletic, was the main guy for all 6 championships and ultimately came first. When you revolutionize the game including the shoe industry it's hard to top that in my opinion. Now if we put Kobe's skills in Jordan's body then you actually may have a better basketball player. But would he have needed to wake up at 4:00 in the morning if he had Jordan's gifts (Hand size, Vertical)? Who knows. Maybe A.I (not Allen Iverson) will figure this one out for us. Peace.
@@neoskybeats Excellent point! Very well said. That's a point most people miss, is how much MJ revolutionized the shoe game and truly SAVED the NBA like Magic and Bird!
@@VihanVictor Thanks. Nice video. Keep it up.
@@neoskybeats Thanks a lot B 🙏🏽
Are sure about that
@@courtneybenton9381 Which part are you referring to? I’m not sure about anything. It’s just my opinion. I did say Jordan was better. Where’s the disagreement? From your comments that seems to be your conclusion as well.
Kobe got 3 rings handed to him but Shaq. Pau arguably gave him another. If you bring up championships but the player wasn’t the best player on their team, that doesn’t make sense. If lebron wins 3 rings starting now, being the best player you wouldn’t change your mind. Bringing up doing more in less time is irrelevant. That just means that MJ could have lost in the finals or got swept again in the playoffs.
Lol bro what are you saying? You are WRONG WRONG WRONG lol.
To begin with, if Bron won 3 MORE RINGS at the age of 100, OF COURSE it would change my mind! Except the likelihood of that is so damn small You and I both have a better chance of winning the Lottery. Second of all, as a LIFELONG HEAT FAN... HOW do you explain 2011? That ish is unforgivable and REMOVES him from GOAT. Now is Bron a Top 3 player all time? Yes.
Kobe didn't have rings "handed" to Him, he was the second best player AND the FIRST CHOICE when they needed a bucket outside of 3 feet.
Also huh? DOING MORE IN LESS TIME is absolutely relevant! Also, we can guess all we want, but it's pointless! We could also say if MJ didn't quit after first 3 Peat they would've won 8 in a row and the GOAT debate wouldn't even occur like Gretzky in Hockey, it would just be accepted.
You trippin without Kobe Shaq wouldn't have those 3 rings. Shaq had Penny n got swept how many times? Exactly. Shaq won one more after leaving LA while Kobe won 2. Again no Kobe no rings for Shaq. Kobe was the main reason they got outta the western conference those 3 years. Shaq was getting bodied by bugs in the paint n wasn't the main scoring option in those runs. And he along wit others that agree are right. MJ did it in less time is more impressive than taking multiple years to do it. You jus don't like the argument cuz it's pertaining to your favorite player.
4:07 MJ wasn't penalized like that lol. Jokic is Luka is. MJ fans damage control everything. He didn't deserve anything in 90s like Miami LBJ or prime Steph. Best help tax. Legends say they thought Scottie was 2nd best in 90s. 92 they thought he was best player on dream team. Apparently LBJ all around game is so great but not Scottie?? Proof old heads don't care about defense like they claim
Ummm YES HE WAS penalized like that! You're telling me AFTER REPEATING then going to a 3rd Straight Final that the MVP that year was Charles Barkley? HELL NO.
1997, you really think Malone deserved it over MJ? No way man.
Them dudes were GLAZING Scottie because in fact, of all the players there, HE WAS THE WORST!!! He was also not gonna get any shots, so they hammed him up as a Defender.
Equivalent to when Big Bro brings little Bro to the Park and his friends trying to be Nice that's IT!
1992 was the start of Jordan's ABSOLUTE PRIME, he was already considered the best player but SNATCHED the title of being best by whooping them dudes in Practice!
Don't believe me let Magic tell you himself.
Same old regurgitated comments with new FOOL'S 😢
*FOOLS* No apostrophe needed 🤡
Why didn't you bring up the fake stats thing
Meh. Don't really believe it that much plus doesn't take too much away from MJ.
As long as you compara MJ to
an actual winner who was cold blooded it is a fair comparison.
Looked like him, played like him, won ALMOST as much 🫡
MJ the one true NightKing.
@@VihanVictorcringe ass comment
I knew that video was wack 😂😂😂😂 🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️
There is a fuckin gap between both its not because kobe has the same will desire passion or what you want that he is on the same level. Heresye.
It's spelled "Hearsay" first of all. Second of all, it's not "hearsay" if multiple people see it and agree with it. Do the world a favor and STAY AWAY from the Law, because you clearly can't spell or listen.
I literally said "MJ IS CLEARLY THE SUPERIOR PLAYER" what more do you want? If I'm speaking English (which I think I am thought gets murkier by the day) I'm unable to be clearer in my Assertion!
Has nothing to do with what I want Lolol that's strange I spend half the video talking stats 😂🤦🏽♂️🧐
@@VihanVictor ok sorry did not heard ''clearly superior'' my bad
@@TheDocmike23Lol you crazy B insulting a whole ahh vid even though I AGREED 😂
All Good though Lolol
@@VihanVictorhe's clearly not lol
You're logic is off, not taking into consideration a tougher opponent is just silly 😂😭 so fighting prime Mike Tyson is like fighting Wilder i guess 🙄 🐍🐍🐍🐍
Not Exactly. It's more like you saying "Tyson Fury isn't the GOAT because he didn't fight Mike Tyson or Muhammad Ali." It's a pointless argument. Plus I acknowledged that Kobe had stronger opponents but MJ had to deal with way tougher Defense. It's also CAP that MJ didn't play against ELITE talent. Boston Celtics 1986 team considered Top 3 greatest ever, The Bad Boys were absolute ruffians who could REALLY Play, and Utah Jazz with Malone and Stockton, one of whom has 14k assists and the other who is STILL Top 5 in Scoring EVER and has more points than MJ himself.
@VihanVictor You're deflecting and contradicting yourself..how Jordan played against harder defense when Kobe putting up elite numbers in the lowest scoring era in modern history!! So I'm paying attention to what ur saying 🐍🐍🐍
@@kevinthomas177 Not at all. First of all stop with the snake emojis ya weirdo.
Are you going to argue against that when MJ played the defense was way more Brutal? Because sorry man, thems the facts. Kobe and MJ crossed over, so this notion you are presenting is FALSE, because they're not that far removed from each other.
I didn't deflect once: Even in the video I said that Kobe played against better competition, but that's not the ONLY consideration and MJ had tougher things too, plain and simple.
YOU are the one who used the Boxing Analogy and conveniently now not addressing it! Do you penalize Tyson Fury for not fighting Ali? NO.
All I'm saying is we can't Penalize dudes for when they were Born!
@VihanVictor Lmao this dude just called me weird 😂 🤣..my guy it sound like u just started watching basketball..I grew up watching and actually played ball..nun weird about Kobe 🐍🐍
@@kevinthomas177 Lolol how does that make sense? I'm talking about an Era BEFORE the one you're talking about! By definition that means I started watching Ball a long time ago!
You are a tad weird for following up every assertion with Snake emojis, especially given you just revealed your age, no offense taken though 😂
I grew up watching Ball too AND playing... Too bad my work ethic couldn't overcome my non athletic genetics!
I grew up watching the late great Kobe AND MJ. I thought Kobe was an offensive juggernaut, but to me MJ was the next level!
Mi nor Kobe will never suit up for another NBA game again 😂... Jordan is old as the bible and raising his daughters and kobe is a $hit stain on a patch of grass 😂😂😂...its over ladies 😢 its 2024......# the future is relevant 😮
The future is relevant, your comments are Not. Don't ever disrespect ANYBODY like that, that's not On. Basketball only please.
Kobe > MJ
Notice how Jordan fans never hesitate to bring up his scoring stats from that era in the GOAT debate, yet convieniently never bring up him losing over and over again in the playoffs.
Ya'll act like MJ won the championship every year he played.
Kobe sacrificed his scoring, elevating teammates, taking players like Pau Gasol (0-12 prior to Kobe in the playoffs) and Shaq (Swept in the playoffs multiple times prior to Kobe in the playoffs) through the statistically most difficult Western Conference Playoff Gauntlet, going 7-0 in the WCF in the 2000’s, 11-1 in playoff series WITHOUT SHAQ from 2008-2010, and somehow MJ the less skilled player with the easier path to his rings is the GOAT because he has 1 more ring playing along side 3 HOFamers (Pippen, Rodman, Kukoc) in a weaker conference ?
Does that even make sense ?
In the playoffs, Jordan averaged 7 more points on 5 more shots, is that efficient or selfish in your opinion. Would that fly against the stacked Western Conference which Kobe had to go through ?
In the playoffs Jordan’s eFG% was 50% and Kobe’s was 48%, is that enough of a difference to give the GOAT nod to Jordan ?
Afterall isn’t winning all that matters ?
Kobe WITHOUT Shaq :
508-458 in the regular season
59-42 in the playoffs.
Jordan WITHOUT Pippen :
154-170 in the regular season
1-9 in the playoffs.
What’s more compelling in Kobe’s favor, Kobe’s playoff and regular season competition was significantly more difficult. No excuses.
Context & Commentary :
There is no way Jordan is a better player than Kobe Bryant.
Put Jordan in his prime in Kobe’s era against Kobe’s competition, factoring in variables such as the slow pace, and low scoring games of Kobe’s era, bigger, taller, faster, more athletic defenders of Kobe’s era, zone defenses, without doubt Jordan scores less, wins fewer rings, shoots a lower FG%, and simply would not have the 6 rings, nor the scoring titles (competing and defending against the likes of Durant, Lebron, Iverson, Wade, McGrady, Carmelo, Harden, Kyrie, Westbrook, etc.), nor many of the other accolades and accomplishments that he has.
Very very good points for the most part. I can only speak for myself in this regard: I'm WELL AWARE of how much MJ lost, and for ME, THIS is why I love his Arc. The amount of failure this man endured before finally breaking through is what truly has Inspired Me countless times to keep Persevering.
BUT. ONCE MJ BROKE THROUGH, NOBODY could see him. NOBODY.
The defense in 80/90s was much more brutal and difficult to score on because dudes could tackle you and beat you up. Kobe NEVER had to endure that type of Defense.
"Without Pip" yeah well when your second best player is Orlando Woolridge vs Kobe who was mostly surrounded by good-great players.
He elevated Pau Gasol? You mean the guy who was #1 option in Memphis and had the NBA screaming bloody you know what because it made Lakers a super team? Kobe DEMANDED better players and got them.
You accuse us of leaving things out but conveniently mention that not one of the "hall of fame players" he played with were even close to #1 options anywhere else.
Rodman and Kukoc were from the second 3 peat. Is a young Pippen a HOF player? Is ANY version of Scottie a HOFer without MJ? No Chance. Was Bill Wennington and Cartwright equivalent to Lamar Odom and Pau? Was Horace Grant equal to Shaq? What about Robert Horry who bailed out the Lakers multiple times?
Also, as much as I love Kobe, there are TWO finals where he became a non factor, once against Detroit and another against Boston. To his credit he took his game to another even higher level, but MJ is the Superior player, Phil said it himself.
@VihanVictor Yeah Pau Gasol, the guy who hadn't won a playoff game before joining Kobe, and was labeled as soft. And yeah before MJ had Pippen he didn't have much talent around him, but he did have Charles Oakley who was the rebounding champ. Compare that to when Kobe was playing with Smush and and Kwame 2005-07, at least Kobe won more than 1 playoff game. MJ was 1-9, and no Pippen isn't equal to Shaq but he was a great and had a big impact, Phil at one point said he was the best player on the team. Scottie was the greatest wing defender ever and he could do it all. Scottie made it to the WCF in 2000 but lost to Kobe. MJ never won without Pip. Kobe proved he could win without Shaq and they said he couldn't. The Detroit and Boston teams Kobe lost to in the finals were better than any team MJ went against in the finals, I doubt MJ could've beat them either, so going back to the competition aspect. Kobe beat the superteam Celtics in 2010 who had 4 hall of famers. MJ never beat a team on that level. As far as defense, MJ admitted he wouldn't have had the career he had if he played against zone defense. In fact MJ only shot 42% when he played against the zone, so it definitely would've hurt his stats. Kobe played against better athletes and defensive schemes.
it should be kobe vs lebron
Would you watch that? I'll gladly do it.
LUKA already better than KOBE...KOBE is one of the most overrated players ever..him and LEBRON arent really TOP 15 players
@@onlyfacts3178 With respect... WHAT THE HECK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? Wow. Don't have time for this nonsense!
@@VihanVictor KOBE missed the play-offs or struggled to make the last spots 7 seasons of the 7 he didnt had SHAQ or GASOL..
GASOL and SHAQ were the WINSHARE LEADERS of KOBE team meaning they were the most important players.
KOBE cant be a TOP 15 player when he missed the play-offs on his prime...you cant be considered a TOP player when you cant even make your team a PLAY-OFF team...
SHOOTING the ball 27 times dont mean you are good, he lead the league in POINTS 2 times..i can name several SG that did better than THAT...
KIDS this days think the NBA started in 2000
Lol Yes the kids for sure think the league started in 2000 but that ain't me 😉
Bron and Kobe are FOR SURE Top 15 players. What about 2007 when he took them to playoffs and were up 3-1 against Phoenix? He didn't have Gasol yet!
Also what about Bron? May not be better than MJ but he's an all time Great, easily top 5 all time.
Lol you dope. I said "EASILY TOP 5" Alongside Kobe and Mike! I think he's #2 all time.
Maybe learn how to read Good before getting all Fussy? 😂
@@VihanVictor im sorry but I was messaging to onlyfacts I'm not sure why it went to u because he said lebron is top15 with Kobe which is ridiculous personally I don't care about Kobe Bryant and his stats are mediocre lol but that guy should have never said lebron is top15 that pisses me off lol he obviously doesn't know lebron James lol because king James has the greatest stats of all NBA players so lebron is objectively the goat but Michael Jordan is arguably the goat because he probably has the greatest legacy ever but he isn't the the greatest player ever that's lebron James and Kobe Bryant should never be in the goat conversation he's nowhere near the top players like lebron James or Michael Jordan but a lot people think Kobe Bryant is a top player simply because he imitates Michael Jordan which is ridiculous lol
Kobe played against better teams and players.. Thats a fact... If kobe played in Jordan's Era he would've won more than 6 rings...
Nope. Kobe ain't beating the 86 Celtics or Bad Boys, we saw what happened with the new age replicas and it wasn't pretty.
@@VihanVictor Ur trippin...u think the 01-02 Lakers can't beat the 86 Celtics?... Looooool ...ur joking right?
@@rudykadous40052001 Lakers needed a highly corrupt referee to win, and they still got taken to Game 7 OT By Sacramento Kings. Don't forget Kobe elbowed Bibby in the face with of course a NO CALL.
You're trippin bc you're using revisionist history. Everybody wanna talk about "Competition"
In the Lakers' 3 Peat they faced 90 Year old Reggie, The Bum Ass New Jersey Nets, AND Allen Iverson whose second best player was Eric Snow. TF OUTTA HERE! THOSE WERE THE EASIEST FINALS EVER!!! Looooolllll y'all be talking about MJ easy competition... The Odds of Lakers winning those titles must've been highest in NBA History!
@@VihanVictor yall be actin like kings didn't have a sick ass squad and didn't have the best record in the NBA that year.... If that kings team played lebrons miami superteam they would've flat out won them.... And your talkin about the 99-2000 Lakers...im talking about the 2001-2002 Lakers who has the 3rd best regular season record , and tied golden state for the best record in the playoffs going 15-1 ... That Lakers squad would molly woopp any team lebrons been on, won the 86' Celtics, and even then the 92'bulls ...period