Banning Basho but keeping Jailbreak would be a fun compromise. If you still want a core that makes Zimms miss, you can give up 1400 AP, 100 stability and 2% of generator adjustment for that, just don't cry when it crumbles like a wet paper towel.
I found it difficult going from basho to another core and I was curious as to why, I just started playing a month ago and I'm on my first playthrough but with the aggressive style of 432 I noticed I'd take more damage when fighting st range and when I was up close id be able to dodge better.
This actually makes me not feel crazy when I've fought Evil Gods in ranked and always build reliable stagger while climbing with them but miss nearly every shot while falling (from the same range, sometimes even CLOSER). Such jank man.
The thing about snail legs is that you can't give them nacht+alula QBs and also can't reasonably give them LW neutral speed, so the missing hitboxes aren't so impactful (and besides, the main basho core issue is the misplaced center point)
I enjoy going as full Basho build without weapons to invade people's games in the Co-Op mod, I never knew about this bug but it does explain how I was able to evade people while boosting around haha.
This isnt really a bug, I just dont think they were meticulously testing the hit reliability of the cores and they intended to had the fcs lock on at the same poiny on each corr because it is just much easier from a design perspective. Especially since the Basho core is so chunky.
I've reinstalled this game recently and been fighting in A ranks, Playing with my LRA and Harris. I've noticed a lot of people running Basho Core and I was wondering why I'm never hitting those guys. Worst part is when i finally stagger them and shoot a charged shot. That shit just flies above their heads because I shot too early.
I don't understand, the basho core hitboxes match the model well? The core is physically shorter than some of the other ones so it's more difficult to hit with shotgun pellets? Yeah, and? What is the "broken" part?
The issue is that the point that your FCS aims for is way higher than it should be on the BASHO core. Instead of being at the centre-of-mass (dead centre on the Core), it's nearly three quarters of the way up it. Meaning there's a lot more empty space in the cone of fire. Which just gets worse when the AC is falling through the air (because your aim point tends to lag behind an AC's movements). Combine this with a big chunk of the back not taking hits (which doesn't seem big... until you land and expose that bit, or an opponent flanks you), and the buffs the BASHO parts have received, and there's a _problem._
This is so much worse than I thought. I was on PC seeing this basho cheese in 9/10 of my games after rank reset. Im gonna sit another season out. its just going to be nothing but basho in ranked 1s now until a patch and who tf knows when that is. Really sucks fromsoft cant do multiplayer
It's a bug since for every other core, their lock on point is in the center of their chest. There's no other excuse for why Basho and Jailbreak have this issue other than it being a bug.
The completely lower stats are what makes the difference. Jailbreak is a Meme. Period. But with the bug, it actually may be a semi-viable part. Not even necessarily GOOD, just more viable than it was. If all the aiming and hitbox info was correct, Jailbreak core wouldn't see play outside of challenge runs or meme builds.
Even if the lock on point is intentional, the fact that your shots can pass through an enemy mech and not deal damage is 100% not intentional, nor is it fun to play against.
I dont think the game benefits from having these bugs, unbalanced part either. My brother started playing it less than a week ago, he imidiatlly started kiting with with duel laser rifles and two 4 packs of missles. He said it was "easymodo" the truth is the game benefts player for being unorignal, and trying less in general. Shotguns, box esjins, kite builds in general. even Pilers have to rely on 4 seconds of stun extension to to get an ohk. Shotguns run you down and micro stun you out of 3/4 your AP. Or maybe you peek and run with aoe attacks. or maybe you missle rat, or lcd lcs on heavys. However there are a good handful of players that have oringal parts and styles, and want to fight a good match more than they want to win.
Armored Core has always had a meta, even in the games before AC6. The idea of a "perfectly balanced" Armored Core game is frankly absurd, because Armored Core has never been balanced. No FromSoftware game has been balanced. There's always been a meta build that stands above the rest. However, since Armored Core at it's core isn't a competitive PvP game, that doesn't really matter. Frankly, all this hemming and hawwing about "broken" builds is just humorous to me.
@ I’ve played all the other games, 4a and 5 didn’t have meta, not by the final patch. But there where bugs in the games that produced meta builds until they where patched out. It matters because frankly it defeats the purpose of the game. Why have all these parts if people copy cat builds to cheese the online play?
@@matthewhanson498 Last time I checked, the purpose of the game was to build whatever you wanted and have fun. Not, to have a perfectly balanced online play. Again, NONE of Fromsoftware's games have ever been competitive games in any way, and I highly doubt that will change anytime soon. ACFA absolutely had a meta, although that meta very heavily changed depending on the skill ceiling of the players you played against. I can't speak for Gen 5 though, never vibed with it.
@ it doesn’t take perfect balance, more difficult playstyles should be more rewarding. I think my issue is that people would be playing whatever they want and having fun, but when they try they lose to the same 5 builds the whole time. Then they stop having fun, and stop playing what they want, they play a boring broken copy cat build so they can win too, and when those victories start to feel as hallow as they actually are, they stop playing the game. I don’t want that. I want people to fall in love with ac like I did. I will be playing armored core my whole life, From learning to balance PvP and fix their netcode will make a better game that more people can enjoy
@matthewhanson498 Ok, either your memory is bad or you're full of shit. 4th and 5th gen absolutely had meta cheese lmao 4th gen had VTF missiles, motocobra machine gun, slug cannon, the most cheese grenade cannons that you didn't even have to stop to fire, Kojima weapons that could straight up one-shot you, and not to mention TELEPORTING BLADERS. And not only that, PvP players will tell you not to use half the parts online because they're useless, whiiiiich encourages copycat builds 5th gen was probably the most balanced in the series, and even that had meta cheese. Some of it included gatling guns, shotguns, heat machine guns, sniper cannon tanks, heat-piledrivers that could one-shot you and were surprisingly easy to land, and the biggest meme amongst them, THE DAMN AUTOCANNON TANKS. And if you wanted to get even more cheesy, you could just equip high stability arms that not only made your guns more accurate, THEY ALSO MADE YOUR GUNS SHOOT FASTER So yeah, metal builds aren't a new thing in Armored Core, and anyone pretending otherwise either never played the games or are just bullshitting for the sake of their nostalgia goggles
The hurtbox isn't the issue. Where the game chooses to lock on is. Instead of aiming for center mass, it aims at the head. This is really bad, especially for shotguns and single shot weapons like your various rocket/grenade launchers that are now way more prone to missing now that they're aiming at something they can't feasibly hit.
@lykos9836 you know what it also counters? Every other build. There's no counterplay to a bugged part. You either use the same part or hope that your opponent is bad at the game. If you face off against someone like Discoh or Farquad who know what they're doing, then it doesn't matter if you're on the same level as them. You just lose.
@lykos9836 melee is normally used as a punish tool, something you'd use on an opponent when they're stance-broken. Which, you know, means you break their stance with some kind of weapon. Normally, a gun. And then you run into the same issue of your shots phasing through the opponent. When I say this affects all builds, I mean ALL BUILDS.
Striker you are always talking about how laser blade is not viable however on Xbox there is a top 20 player who runs it. The build is three missiles and laser blade. It plays as a kite and then laser blades in combination with the slow moving missiles to stagger and then assault armor try it out. And plz teach me how to dodge laser blade. One setup has coral missile, javelin beta, split missiles and the other has javelin beta, duo two, pfal.
There like oh doesn't matter on size or shape then you could use anything and and doesn't matter cause they all have the same hit box and it shouldn't be that way there shape is better for a reason just like weapons just make them all shoot same power and same speed and what ever then doesn't matter
Love that Therapist got nuked less than a week after being “overbuffed” yet Basho core and Snail legs have been quietly enabling an entire cheater ecosystem for over a year with zero consequences. Anyone arguing this game doesn’t deserve to be dead is delusional. 😂
It's crazy - this is a "Broken bug" that is completely a non-issue if you aim manually lol. I have literally never had any issues with this core vs others because I just maim / softlock and maim always goes where you aim it. Idk, doesn't seem like something to ban a part over when the solution is literally just don't let the game do all the aiming for you
Nope. Jailbreak core is allowed because it's so weak and busted by low stats. Bug actually makes it semi-viable and not just a bad meme part. BASHO is what is banned. How's your fight club doing BTW? Seems being populated by rats is better than having no one around at all at this point
Pretty sure if Basho core was broken then it'd be Jailbreak core... just saying.
Get out 🗣👉
Banning Basho but keeping Jailbreak would be a fun compromise. If you still want a core that makes Zimms miss, you can give up 1400 AP, 100 stability and 2% of generator adjustment for that, just don't cry when it crumbles like a wet paper towel.
This build had nothing on Zimm shield and you know it
It's so funny this has likely existed for over a year and nobody realised because basho core was so bad nobody used it.
I use it. 😢
ALOT OF PEOPLE HAVE NOTICED. These guys did the work though, thanks....yaw
I’ve seen these weird ass looking basho light weights for a long time now and always wondered what the deal with it was. Now we know.
I found it difficult going from basho to another core and I was curious as to why, I just started playing a month ago and I'm on my first playthrough but with the aggressive style of 432 I noticed I'd take more damage when fighting st range and when I was up close id be able to dodge better.
Used since day1
It's really funny seeing people argue that something shaped like a giant brick was intentionally designed to be harder to hit.
BAWS witchcraft strikes again
Same feeling as belkan witchcraft
"Theres a part of me that really loves the jank."
Are you a fan of New Vegas or Sonic by chance?
"it just works"
I am a big fan of Skyrim and Borderlands. So I definitely do like jank in my video games lol
Or just old 2000s FromSoft games, theyre full of that but are still cool.
Little ziyi supremacy
0:54, Raven wrote this because he got tired of not being able to stagger the RLF'S ACs
This actually makes me not feel crazy when I've fought Evil Gods in ranked and always build reliable stagger while climbing with them but miss nearly every shot while falling (from the same range, sometimes even CLOSER). Such jank man.
Love how Snail legs have has a bit of a smaller hit box than it should have while it's kick hit box be wild lmao
It's amazing how Basho, the ugliest core in the game, which goes with like, literally no other part in the game, is consistently the best arms or core
It literally just how meta works, it’s Stats a Polarized towards specific areas for a reason
The thing about snail legs is that you can't give them nacht+alula QBs and also can't reasonably give them LW neutral speed, so the missing hitboxes aren't so impactful (and besides, the main basho core issue is the misplaced center point)
What about the huge armor benefits while your also doing the Obito thing with like 25% of the hits that do hit??
so basically ACs players just discovered how much your profile matters in armored warfare?
It’s not that, the auto targeting doesn’t target the basho core correctly
No, it's a programming error.
the fact it's been the game the whole time and it's never been reported till this patch is so funny
This is actually such a hilarious finding, I guess people better start manual aiming on ladder haha.
Seeing the snail legs hit box much more convinced that pb20 was more cheese than anything!!!
It's sad that Basho is so messed up, given how cool and balanced it'd be otherwise.
I enjoy going as full Basho build without weapons to invade people's games in the Co-Op mod, I never knew about this bug but it does explain how I was able to evade people while boosting around haha.
This isnt really a bug, I just dont think they were meticulously testing the hit reliability of the cores and they intended to had the fcs lock on at the same poiny on each corr because it is just much easier from a design perspective. Especially since the Basho core is so chunky.
I've reinstalled this game recently and been fighting in A ranks, Playing with my LRA and Harris. I've noticed a lot of people running Basho Core and I was wondering why I'm never hitting those guys. Worst part is when i finally stagger them and shoot a charged shot. That shit just flies above their heads because I shot too early.
I don't understand, the basho core hitboxes match the model well? The core is physically shorter than some of the other ones so it's more difficult to hit with shotgun pellets? Yeah, and? What is the "broken" part?
The issue is that the point that your FCS aims for is way higher than it should be on the BASHO core.
Instead of being at the centre-of-mass (dead centre on the Core), it's nearly three quarters of the way up it. Meaning there's a lot more empty space in the cone of fire.
Which just gets worse when the AC is falling through the air (because your aim point tends to lag behind an AC's movements).
Combine this with a big chunk of the back not taking hits (which doesn't seem big... until you land and expose that bit, or an opponent flanks you), and the buffs the BASHO parts have received, and there's a _problem._
This isn't a bug, its just an overlooked design.
the hero of rubicon is back to give us more tournaments lets go!
Ban Box! Ban Snail Legs! (*Raises pitchfork and torch!*)
What bothers me is to miss the shots at near point blank range, that shouldn't be... possible...
If all you want to do is end our fight quick, I'll alt-f4. Can't get quicker than that.
I do wonder if this big exists for more than basho. There’s a couple cores I have a hard time hitting because I shoot over their head.
This build has nothing on Zimm shield. Stop it
good call, was sick of box countering my builds
Somebody just overlooked one of the cores all the Japan players are using 😂
Obligatory "all of this just works" - Todd Howard
except ac6 has FAR fewer bugs than the most bug free bethesda game.
@@drwilyecoyote5357 true but still
Goodybe Basho+lamm legs double melee, i will miss you.
basho nacht setup but you only bring two coquilettes
*IT TOOK ME, TEN YEARS TO FINAAAAALY ANSWER SOOOOMETHIIIIIIING...*
All of these are just speculated theory without a gameplay footage
That's so dumb it's wider then most then tall as other is taller and thinner so shouldn't matter it's not broken
This is so much worse than I thought. I was on PC seeing this basho cheese in 9/10 of my games after rank reset. Im gonna sit another season out. its just going to be nothing but basho in ranked 1s now until a patch and who tf knows when that is. Really sucks fromsoft cant do multiplayer
There's like 20 people who still play AC6 online...
@haydentravis3348 I get games instantly and usually with someone different each time. I dunno
@@haydentravis3348 21
Is this an actual bug or is it a design issue that we are just now seeing because previously it had poor stats and ugly visual appearance?
It's a bug since for every other core, their lock on point is in the center of their chest. There's no other excuse for why Basho and Jailbreak have this issue other than it being a bug.
Ricochet off the front?
It's a relative term to gun fire lol
From Lil Ziyi to BEEG Ziyi to teeenytiny ziyi
Jailbreak is just a beat up Basho. It makes sense to me for the ban to cover both cores.
The completely lower stats are what makes the difference. Jailbreak is a Meme. Period. But with the bug, it actually may be a semi-viable part. Not even necessarily GOOD, just more viable than it was. If all the aiming and hitbox info was correct, Jailbreak core wouldn't see play outside of challenge runs or meme builds.
Is this even a glitch? Are we sure this isn’t by design?
Even if the lock on point is intentional, the fact that your shots can pass through an enemy mech and not deal damage is 100% not intentional, nor is it fun to play against.
I dont think the game benefits from having these bugs, unbalanced part either. My brother started playing it less than a week ago, he imidiatlly started kiting with with duel laser rifles and two 4 packs of missles. He said it was "easymodo" the truth is the game benefts player for being unorignal, and trying less in general. Shotguns, box esjins, kite builds in general. even Pilers have to rely on 4 seconds of stun extension to to get an ohk. Shotguns run you down and micro stun you out of 3/4 your AP. Or maybe you peek and run with aoe attacks. or maybe you missle rat, or lcd lcs on heavys. However there are a good handful of players that have oringal parts and styles, and want to fight a good match more than they want to win.
Armored Core has always had a meta, even in the games before AC6. The idea of a "perfectly balanced" Armored Core game is frankly absurd, because Armored Core has never been balanced. No FromSoftware game has been balanced. There's always been a meta build that stands above the rest.
However, since Armored Core at it's core isn't a competitive PvP game, that doesn't really matter. Frankly, all this hemming and hawwing about "broken" builds is just humorous to me.
@ I’ve played all the other games, 4a and 5 didn’t have meta, not by the final patch. But there where bugs in the games that produced meta builds until they where patched out. It matters because frankly it defeats the purpose of the game. Why have all these parts if people copy cat builds to cheese the online play?
@@matthewhanson498 Last time I checked, the purpose of the game was to build whatever you wanted and have fun. Not, to have a perfectly balanced online play. Again, NONE of Fromsoftware's games have ever been competitive games in any way, and I highly doubt that will change anytime soon.
ACFA absolutely had a meta, although that meta very heavily changed depending on the skill ceiling of the players you played against. I can't speak for Gen 5 though, never vibed with it.
@ it doesn’t take perfect balance, more difficult playstyles should be more rewarding. I think my issue is that people would be playing whatever they want and having fun, but when they try they lose to the same 5 builds the whole time. Then they stop having fun, and stop playing what they want, they play a boring broken copy cat build so they can win too, and when those victories start to feel as hallow as they actually are, they stop playing the game. I don’t want that. I want people to fall in love with ac like I did. I will be playing armored core my whole life, From learning to balance PvP and fix their netcode will make a better game that more people can enjoy
@matthewhanson498
Ok, either your memory is bad or you're full of shit. 4th and 5th gen absolutely had meta cheese lmao
4th gen had VTF missiles, motocobra machine gun, slug cannon, the most cheese grenade cannons that you didn't even have to stop to fire, Kojima weapons that could straight up one-shot you, and not to mention TELEPORTING BLADERS. And not only that, PvP players will tell you not to use half the parts online because they're useless, whiiiiich encourages copycat builds
5th gen was probably the most balanced in the series, and even that had meta cheese. Some of it included gatling guns, shotguns, heat machine guns, sniper cannon tanks, heat-piledrivers that could one-shot you and were surprisingly easy to land, and the biggest meme amongst them, THE DAMN AUTOCANNON TANKS. And if you wanted to get even more cheesy, you could just equip high stability arms that not only made your guns more accurate, THEY ALSO MADE YOUR GUNS SHOOT FASTER
So yeah, metal builds aren't a new thing in Armored Core, and anyone pretending otherwise either never played the games or are just bullshitting for the sake of their nostalgia goggles
Oh no its hurtbox is shaped exactly like the core is BAN IT
The hurtbox isn't the issue. Where the game chooses to lock on is. Instead of aiming for center mass, it aims at the head.
This is really bad, especially for shotguns and single shot weapons like your various rocket/grenade launchers that are now way more prone to missing now that they're aiming at something they can't feasibly hit.
@NathanTruby that all sounds like meta pick having a counter which is a good thing.
@lykos9836 you know what it also counters? Every other build.
There's no counterplay to a bugged part. You either use the same part or hope that your opponent is bad at the game. If you face off against someone like Discoh or Farquad who know what they're doing, then it doesn't matter if you're on the same level as them. You just lose.
@NathanTruby try some melee.
@lykos9836 melee is normally used as a punish tool, something you'd use on an opponent when they're stance-broken. Which, you know, means you break their stance with some kind of weapon. Normally, a gun.
And then you run into the same issue of your shots phasing through the opponent. When I say this affects all builds, I mean ALL BUILDS.
It's not a bug, it's a feature.
Striker you are always talking about how laser blade is not viable however on Xbox there is a top 20 player who runs it. The build is three missiles and laser blade. It plays as a kite and then laser blades in combination with the slow moving missiles to stagger and then assault armor try it out. And plz teach me how to dodge laser blade. One setup has coral missile, javelin beta, split missiles and the other has javelin beta, duo two, pfal.
W negev
Late to the video but this explains so much smh
I'm a basho main so rip father basho lol also basho has always been shorter that's not new it's been like this on release
There like oh doesn't matter on size or shape then you could use anything and and doesn't matter cause they all have the same hit box and it shouldn't be that way there shape is better for a reason just like weapons just make them all shoot same power and same speed and what ever then doesn't matter
Love that Therapist got nuked less than a week after being “overbuffed” yet Basho core and Snail legs have been quietly enabling an entire cheater ecosystem for over a year with zero consequences. Anyone arguing this game doesn’t deserve to be dead is delusional. 😂
Ya'll are calling it a bug, but to me it looks like deliberate positioning by the DEVs. Banning a core over something like this is really dumb.
Yeah this looks 100% intentional.
And the hitbox hollow sections are 100% there to standardize core hitboxes to improve consistency.
So... Skill issue? I see i see
You can hardly call it a skill issue when your shots literally pass through an enemy and they take 0 damage
Fum
time to spam basho core until its nerfed lol
Its not a bug 🤓
It's crazy - this is a "Broken bug" that is completely a non-issue if you aim manually lol. I have literally never had any issues with this core vs others because I just maim / softlock and maim always goes where you aim it. Idk, doesn't seem like something to ban a part over when the solution is literally just don't let the game do all the aiming for you
Bans jailbreak core because it'll ruin match quality, unironically allows RATs to ruin match quality🥴🤷🏻♂️
Nope. Jailbreak core is allowed because it's so weak and busted by low stats. Bug actually makes it semi-viable and not just a bad meme part. BASHO is what is banned. How's your fight club doing BTW? Seems being populated by rats is better than having no one around at all at this point
And just to be even more forward about it, how messy is it that someone that bans an entire PLAY STYLE is daring to comment on a part ban?
Jailbreak core isnt banned lol
You did say you were going to ban it but the same logic applies to basho core📠🤷🏻♂️
For the same reasons that they are banning this part, because it lowers the quality of matches📠🤷🏻♂️
I have experienced no problems with the core it doesn’t not need to be banned
Did you watch the video before commenting? Kinda doubt it.
"It's not broken if I win with it." ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
BRUH JUST PLAY THE GAME