Marvel ruined MJ so much, I genuinely don’t want these two back together. The only version where I care for the pairing is in Ultimate Spider-Man (2024)
You know what I want? If they are forced back together, then this time, she needs to earn him back. No forgiving; MJ needs to try and fail multiple times to get Peter back. They want to keep jackpot fine, but she doesn't get a pass with Peter when this Paul BS is over.
It's a shame because MJ used to be one of the most likable and charismatic characters in fiction. There was nothing about her that needed to be "changed" or "fixed". All this is just another proof there's no point to give Peter any other love interest. If they were willing to disgrace his soulmate THIS bad just to keep her away from him, who else stands a chance.
The best way for 616 Spider-Man to be right now is to be Anderw Garfield Spider-Man, he has no more Love Interest and actually likes being Spider-Man for once and maybe give MJ a taste of her own medicine I.E her powers get in the way with her relationships to the point she begins to empithize with Peter and feels sorry but for the mean time when ever she comes back to Peter he just goes "I missed the part where thats my problem" and distances himself from her until the writers come up with something.
Nick Spencer gave us hope, and Zebb Wells took that crushed it under his feet. And laughed at us while doing it. This whole run should get retconned out of existence. Like fast. But nope i don't think we are going to be so lucky.😢
That's what makes it so messed up! People have been wanting to the two together for the longest and along are Nick Spencer who didn't just throw them together and call it a day but did it in an amazing way makes both characters great.....Then the very second Zebb Wells hit the door running from day one it was like you hear a voice going, "AND THAT'S ENOUGH OF THAT!" I mean it wasn't just him and MJ that whole run but turning poor Pete into this character that a simple jay walker could beat down and have him begging to stop. Even now with the new agent spider woman/Web-head, they are already setting up this almost Black Cat type thing with her finding Peter to be a total bore and almost pure Fangirl with Spiderman...and fixing his problem....
People should forget about this crap I can make a better Spiderman stort then those marvel crappy writers Not just me everyone who understands pete can make a better story then those shit fks Writers really writing their wild fetishes and disgusting imagination
@@RickyUzumaki993 Well, the short of it is: He went through a divorce a year or two ago His ex-wife left him for someone with two kids does that sound familiar Yeah he should go to therapy instead of taking out on a fictional character
Ultimate Spider-Man MJ has been Amazing and I fricking love that she's the one who came up with Pete's Superhero name in this universe and she seems like such a cool mum
My head canon is that this MJ is just a demonic doppelgänger made by Mephisto after One More Day. It’s an easy retcon that can be made so long as both editorial and the writer are willing to make it canon. Also a good callback to the water clone from the Fox Spider-Man cartoon.
No. This time it is Blackheart. Since they cross paths several times i. The old stories. The lad needs attention in Marvel media to be honest. And it is about time Mephisto and his crusty old presence has to be replaced with something new.
That panel made my stomach turn inside out. You know that feeling when a person you knew for a long time that you considered a friend talks shit about you behind your back? That one
This is why I vote for Blackheart for a hell lord. Blackheart is democratic as opposed to Authoritarian from his own words when he stabbed Mephistopheles with a pure blooded knife.
I feel like it would end better if Paul dumps MJ before he mysteriously fades from existence, MJ realizes her mistake, but Peter moves on and gets ready to have a kid with someone else, thus she ends up missing out on having the real thing with the person too good for her.
Nah MJ deserves better. Her character shouldn't get ruined just because of one bad writer assassinating her character. Also I don't want Mephisto to win. I rather MJ and Peter to get back together just to spite Mephisto and the Spiderman writers
6:35 "is there a way to save her character?" Nah dawg, she's gone, i'm sorry for Mayday but no hommie deserves the shit that has been throwed at his face, be it from MJ or Well's self insert. Morrigan is a fucking succubus and even she is a viable option when compared to MJ bro.
Marvel has ruined Mary Jane as a character, so much to the point that I really don't want her and Peter to get back together. Peter needs to move on and find a different love interest, literally almost anyone would be better than her.
Yeah but every time he does move on they screw him over in that relationship, but him with MJ again and screw him even harder with her than the last time. At this point if they got back together again the only way I can see them screwing him harder than before is if MJ because one of his main villains....and they are crazy enough to do that lets be honest. I really wish they went the way of renew your vows, that was amazing, fun, and people just love it. But something about when you do stories like that or Super Sons, writes HATE IT and I don't know why.
Mary Jane Watson is supposed to be Peter Parker/Spider-Man's love interest. She is supposed to be a supporting character like Aunt May, Harry Osborn, or J Jonah Jameson, it's fine of who she is. she doesn't need to have an active role in the spider man mythos all the time. she doesn't need to be a hero or villian or some convoluted love interest that the writers thought just to keep Spider-Man suffering or some weird insert fetish for a character *cough cough, paul. what makes her character great what she means to Peter and what Peter means to her. What makes these two love each other how do they both make each other grow what kind of actual hardships can they go through not this on and off again bs relationship. how they move foward together ready to face anything that stands in their way.
Incorrect. What the character needs is to be well written and have a three-dimensional personality. And not just only be the love interest to one guy, who seemingly cannot be able to balance his work and personal life. And also, do you not know how to construct a proper sentence ? That wall of text was difficult to read.
@@seeleunit2000 You don't have to be three dimensional to be good character. Speaking of Mary Jane Watson, she was always three dimensional character. People often think character has to be doing something equivalent in story as the main character but they can be just supporting character. That's why I said, what she means to peter and what peter means to her. Where the two create unique bond with each other to help one and another through anything. I guess you think MJ would be more interesting if she some dorky half ass superhero who doesn't need to have serious relationship.
100% Marvel RUINED Mary Jane Nick Spencer did a brilliant job fixing things they broke, but Marvel didn't like that and that he was on his way to undo OMD, so they hijacked his story and made it about Sins Past instead and had Wells break them up again. and I absolutely do not believe when Lowe said we did not hire Wells to break them up. My only hope is Wells follows through when he said he going to put the toys back where he found them at the end of his run. but at this stage, I don't even believe that.
the thing that gets me. way back in secret invasion, 50 states initiative, i swear there was a girl named something like spinner, that showed up for, like, three pages with the exact same superpower. spin a wheel(s) get random set of super powers.
If they wanted to give Mj powers, is fine with me. the powers given by Paul are not a problem to me, is the fact that her powers are random, yet she gets what she needs in any situation and they are not very clever, so it just ends up being boring.
If they want to fix her powers they have to do what Ben 10 does. By often giving her the wrong powers in the wrong situations, she has to be creative with her powers
@@joopvanhedel1372it does need to progress with her being more comfortable with the randomness. Go from classic to reboot ben in os constantly complained about not getting what he wanted but reboot just goes with it
Marvel Editorial knew what they were doing giving MJ powers. They just made Zeb the triggerman. And hey. If they want to keep Peter and MJ apart out of spite, I can want them together for the same reason. I know exactly what they want me to think: "If this is the case, I'd rather never see them together again." Nice try, Marvel. Nice try.
I think the idea of making Mary Jane have powers is so that she is more self-revealing and not so dependent on Peter for sales, just so that no writer in the future will undo the relationship with Paul's selft insert, I think that It was a plan by Zebs to keep Mary Jane with her self insert and that no one would stop her, it's like my theory, I think that later they are going to add a Zendaya who will be Peter's new girlfriend, it would be extremely funny XDDD
I don’t think Zeb understand how much of a bad idea making sure a self insert character stick around is in marvel because at this point they should be called traumarvel I remember in the hell fire gala that a robot skin Mary Jane alive and use her skin as a suit to enter the gala she was a side character then , self insert characters like Korean boyfriend from John Kent Superman and I’m not star fire were smart enough to make sure they had their fun and then their self insert disappeared for good, because once the writer leaves they have to leave their new toys behind for someone else to play with and eventually break them,their self insert eventually getting what’s coming to them and people will cheer , also remember that the way cómics work is not you ask for the character you give an idea and then marvel or dc give you characters to play your history out so imagine that with Paul essentially because he was what was available,imagine someone made a fanfic were everyone loves their character but then someone at marvel says ok your turn is over and hands out your self insert to someone else and that person make him do the most heinous horrible things a person can do and now everyone in the marvel universe is trying to kill him and everyone else is portrayed in the right and the fans are cheering,that bound to hurt the ego because that’s the author essentially they made them into a villain and everyone else Is happy about it
Also doesn't help that Paul isn't established as anything more than a cockblock. There's nothing interesting to continue. He's been such a dick to Peter that it's easier to see him become the full villain he doesn't want to become. If he does stay, it'll only be because he's tied to Mary Jane who's tied to Peter.
@@bryanwoods3373what bothers me is Paul is kinda the reason MJ was even put in that horrible place and yet the story refuses to acknowledge that. Not to mention the story constantly tries to bend over backwards to justify MJ’s side of things but never acknowledges peters side. Dude went from having the love of his life to not only losing her but losing her to an NPC in a couple hours. But the story just say boo hoo she’s moved on get over it.
At this point marvel literally has only one choice to make sure they don't lose money is to give peter back his marriage since the book is constantly losing them money
Please, they ruined her in original game. With her being annoyed that Peter doesn't like the fact that his GF throws herself headfirst into danger (spying on armed thugs, mercenaries, etc).
I'm glad to have a cllection of the Marvel adventures Spiderman series where i can pop in and say hello to Peter and Chat. No unnecessary relationship drama. Just a fun and wholesome relationship in the background of some Spiderman adventures.
@darkshadowx803 that's very possible but its depends how they write the retcon for example it was a bad dream for Peter or hell time travel But what you say comes true MJ will be forgotten forever
I think this is something more deeper than just Paul. He's part of the problem, but not the whole thing, the main problem here is Marvel destroying their previous work to sell morbidity pandering.
It's like they went onto get rid of all the things that made MJ work, she's completely out of character and I don't even understand at this point why other than to just make people mad.
They don't want to even do that to. They want to make her a lesbain or a bisexual women who prefers women(which is a retcon to make her more like Catwomen,again). At best,they will always make her his rebound that never last,for some dumb reason. Hell,they will make an else world where Black Cat actually has a healthy romantic relationship with Peter Parker as Spiderman. This people don't want Peter to be happy 😂.
@@rachetmarvel931 Maybe they should tell stories where even after Black Cat goes straight she has to deal with someone she wronged when she became the Queenpin trying to get revenge on her/ruin her life
@@bobkane432nope, just lazy pandering. A shame. I think Peter David did a good job with her when he was putting out Symbiote Spiderman. She was very likeable.
I can't really give an opinion on MJ as Jackpot as I haven't read the series. As for the whole Paul thing I figured since it effects other heroes and their stories like Kamala Khan they won't just retcon it, but I honestly figured they were gonna claim some clone story arc where during her time in the alternate dimension MJ was cloned, with the one being with Paul as the clone and the OG MJ still being around but somewhere else.
Either that or Mephisto kidnapped MJ and replaced her with a demon in disguise to put a wedge between Peter and MJ. Though the clone thing could work too. Like maybe MJ died in the other world and Paul tried making things right by making a clone to replace her for Spidey. Only for it not to work out as planned. Either version could lead to a story where SM has to go yo Hell to save her (or her soul at least). Only for Peter to get his hands on the original deal he made with Mephisto, and has to make the choice to destroy said deal.
first of all I must clarify that I didnt read any of Zebb's recent comics, so I am taking the "no explanation at the time" at face value here, that said even I am well aware of the Paul situation. Now, I am just gonna drop an opinion here, you are free to hate it if you dislike.....but ironically....if his idea was to break up Peter and MJ, I think it would have been a better idea to make a situation somewhat similar to the infamous mephisto deal, only this time write Peter make a selfless dicision to wish for Mary Jane to have a happy and safe life because he is afraid of losing her.....wich would obviously be reverted later down the line but i think you get my point..... it would be an unpopular decision with the fans?....probably yes....but at least that sounds like something peter would be capable of doing for protecting someone he loves.
I really don't understand how writers think THIS is something fans what to see. Well, nothing I can do so all-aboard the succubus train (if Mephisto was scared of Mayday kicking his ass in the future to the point he had to erase Peter and MJ's marriage, then he'd really shit himself when he sees the child of Spider-Man and Morrigan).
MJ isn't the problem it's editorial I really hope they retcon all this in the future because i really want them together again despite everything Also MJ is the only romance that will get Peter somewhere Gwen is long dead Felicia won't change in the long term so she will still be a morally grey character which will make her and Peter's relationship impossible And every other is not as important So it has to be MJ, just not the MJ from recent runs
Marvel editorial has hated MJ ever since she got with Peter. And One More Day is the official fxck you to us in regards to that marriage/relationship. And I'm fairly certain it will never go back 🤦🏾♂️ LOL
Personally I never liked Marry Jane, nearly every comic about spiderman forces his character to always revolve around her and she always is nearly the reason every time Peter has it rough.
I don’t remember where I saw it but the thing that made me hate Mary Jane. Was when Peter was battered and bruised she decided to yell and berate him and throw the “great responsibility” line at his face.
I personally just don't look at comics anymore, DC and marvel have this "throw it at the wall and hope it sticks" mentality I just can't bear anymore. We all watched it happen with cinema and it's been going on even longer with comics and I'm just done, it's impossible to have a character you genuinely like when they are being changed, retconned constantly, changed for a boost in sales, and stories like this just being an absolute spit in the face to readers who have given these books a chance and wasted their time on em. Old comic fans just didn't know what they had in the 80s- early 2000s, i dont even know how honestly considering they were doing this same thing, i think the difference is that this type of stuff has run its course. Marvel desperately needs to reboot all their franchise and change their business model when it comes to writing cause this is getting old, stale, and insulting. Not even just talking about Marry Jane, Marvel and DC are in a constant war of do this better do that better, and in the end it's become a battle of out stupiding the other. Comics are not what they used to be
Bad mystery box story telling that had no payoff whatsoever. If you are gonna write a What did Peter do storyline you would think Zeb would have worked out what Peter did to make everyone mad at him. Just a terrible run all around
Its not gonna be any different. If they wont let him be with the character he has the most history with then what makes you think a new relationship would be any better
To this day I can't understand, why did Spider-Man make a deal with Mephisto? Peter Park has met Dr. Strange, Johnny Blaze, both who'd tell him that Mephisto is a trickster and he will screw you over. Is Peter Parker so fundamentally stupid he'd believe Mephisto? He'd know the first second that Mephisto will play him.
Seriously, I understand that every comic book gets a different writer that has on to the mythos or take something away, but it would be nice if there was any rules stipulated that you had to at least, keep continuity in mind. It would make things less convoluted. And also, I wouldn't mind the fact of Mary Jane had superpowers and was also just doing her own thing, I just wish however it wasn't automatically rectoned. It gets added and it gets taken away just as fast. And sometimes it would just be nice if the writers would stop always having to come up with convoluted romance plots and cheating plots and plots of someone getting Stockholm from getting kidnapped... I would like Mary Jane to be a three-dimensional character with some agency. Besides down the line we all know this is going to get reset and Spider-Man and Mary Jane get back together again somehow.
Ngl I really like the spider gwen comics. I think ultimately Gwen is getting better treatment than MJ. Not to mention 616 Gwen is still the same person and the ghost spider is just an alternate reality version. So any character changes good or bad isn't a reflection on the Gwen who died. MJ however is presented as the 616 version and it's awful.
Personally I think the only way they can fix MJ is to have it be revealed that this wasn’t even the real MJ but rather a clone or puppet created by mephisto or jackal or whoever. The damage to the character is so extensive that the only way to fix it is the comic book character equivalent of a factory reset.
The Spider-Man Editorial office have missed the point of MJ. I believe that they can salvage MJ, they just need to find a good way to redeem her and an even better way to retcon the Wells run.
Just make her reflect on her decisions, realize she was unfair with Peter and talk things out. But wait, they don't return together in one issue, like any real life broke outs that wants to return, make them be first distance try to get close again and slowly building up trust again. And so she's redeeming herself by earning and working on it.
I actually like Jackpot. Her motivations for becoming Jackpot were "I couldn't save my kids from forces out of my control, but I can save other people," which is kinda a spin on how Peter had the chance to save Uncle Ben from getting killed but didn't. I just think that Marvel needs to have both Spidey and MJ interact more. I really enjoyed the mini-arc where they teamed up, and I can see MJ still grounding Peter while playing an active part in his superhero life.
This has been why, aside from real life economic concerns, I haven't been collecting issues of this run. Marvel wants Pete young and single (and broke) so he can appeal to potential readers who aren't in their 40s and 50s. I get it. But that's why you have Miles, Gwen, and Kamala. At least I'm sure that's what some Marvel writers and editors had in mind for them. Newer audiences to identify with newer characters so the older characters could be allowed to grow up: Scott marries Jean (or lives with Emma, depending on the timeline), Remy marries Rogue, Kate Pryde and Illyana Rasputin take their places as major players in the X-books. Sadly, someone at the Spider-Office did not get the memo, or ignored it completely. I suspect Marvel editorial was trying to metaphorically do a Superior Spider-Man again, only they replaced MJ with the version of herself came back with Paul. It'll be a decade at least before MJ and Pete even look like they can be together again, because the comments section is right: if they're going to do this, MJ has to earn her way back into Pete's life. As someone who's seen Pete go through a zillion love interests, I am tired. I just want to see him settled with someone, the way I want to see a dear friend finally sort out his love life. Pete could easily have been happy and grounded (more or less) with Carlie or Felicia or even, of all people, Bobbi. Any one of them could have contributed something different long-term to the Spider-Man mythos and kept Pete a proper adult. Sadly Bobbi has a Carol problem (Capt Marvel was also linked to Pete, and they each belong in someone else's book). And Carlie was so badly scarred from the Superior Spider-Man run that she's permanently left NYC. Felicia also represents an end- Peter accepting adulthood and leaning more into a shared super-heroic life- which was probably why Zeb Wells broke them up too. I'm not going to shit on Wells, because I'm almost certain his writing has been informed by Marvel Editorial. I just can't bring myself to be enthusiastic about his run. If I come back at all, it'll be because of something seismic, and I'm betting it won't happen for another 10 years. Can't wait that long. I got stuff in my life that needs addressing.
So….her “boyfriend” gave her a roulette system, but also built in the possibility that it might kill her? What the fuck? What the actual fuck? It’s like they’ve taken the core concept of Ben 10’s powers, and made it really, and I mean REALLY shitty. Like, why even give her that randomised gimmick? For a pinch when she needs to power us in a hurry and doesn’t have time to think, then sure, I can see a randomiser working, but if all the powers are in there, just give her the bloody choice. This isn’t a toy commercial, they don’t need to sell different power sets. Geez…..
He broke mj and Peter cuz zeb wanted black cat and Peter to be together but in a few issues zeb wells broke them up for no reason and then black cat rebounded with this hacker girl (she’s canonically bi sexual ) who tried to blackmail Mary Jane and all of New York with a fake app as Mary Jane’s first major villain
Yes. JAckpot is dumb and a stain on the character but ruin her. If the original plan of "what did Peter do" had panned out and she had some reason to leave Peter and not be with him, that would be another black mark but wouldn't ruin her. But when Dead Language came out and the story was just....she fell in love with someone else and left Peter for them...that's what ruined her. Because now you've taken your romantic heroine and said there's a limit to her love and Peter isn't even the one she considers her one. The entire relationship with Paul starts with her being disloyal to and faithless towards Peter, assuming he would never save her despite all the evidence to the contrary. That would be bad enough, because it makes her weak (again) and disloyal, but when Peter shows up and proves that her assumption was a mistake, the fact that she still chooses to stay with Paul is just a death sentence for the character in her role. Nothing stops her from being with Peter. He doesn't care or immediately forgives whatever she did in the other dimension. And it isn't like Peter and MJ just met. The last time they saw each other in the 616 he was moving in with her at HER request. Their relationship is fully developed...and she chooses Paul. And if she's willing to choose Paul then she's willing to choose somebody else in the future. It completely ruins any romantic possibility. Of course, the caveat is that all of that is wildly out of character for MJ. She just wouldn't do any of that. She wouldn't start a relationship with Paul while waitng for Peter and she certainly wouldn't stay with him rather than go back to Peter. But it must be undone. MJ cannot have ever willinging entered into a relationship with Paul. Make this one a fake, or make her under Mind Control, or whatver you want to do, but that's the thing they have to do. Fans should demand it.
hmm i know maybe wild but my unrealistic tin theory is : in some dimension out there this Wells, actually changed his first name from Harison to zeb, that means he's actually the Reverse Flash , a guy with plenty of experience at nuking hero romantic life mehahaha, right Barry? [the "it was me Barry" meme on spidey in incognito ???]
marvel doesnt understand their fans and also dont understand their character. this "spider-man must always depressed and must be a playboy" is a problem. they just made another new person for him to have a relationship with. i think peter has more ex's than most if not all in comics. funny thing is there are only a few main couples in comics that everyone knows, superman and louis and peter and mj. yea there are others but those are the top two and peter and mj have been broken up longer than they were together. that alone shows marvel doesnt get it. add in Ultimate Spider-Man's sales and theres even more proof. current marvel will never get it. they are to old and out of touch. even if Ultimate Spider-Man it their number one comic for the next 10 years i still dont think they will get it. it will take a major change at the top. the question is when will this ever happen?
I used to love Spider-Man. I grew up with a very shitty life, and seeing Parker get through his trials with friends and family by his side, something I really didn't have, always gave me hope. Then One More Day happened. And I'm not saying its the problem. I'm saying it was the start of the problem. They took his family away. Then later they made his friends hate him. and eventually, I grew to hate the series. Not because of Spider-Man, but because now I was reading about a person leading a shitty life with no real friends left and no real family left. I was already living that life; I didn't want to read about the person that gave me hope living that life. And every time it looks like he is going to get the life they took from him back, they rip it away in the cruelest and most awful ways (Ben becomes a villain, Mary Jane leaves him for a fucking self-insert character, his next girlfriend leaves him because their relationship is TOO healthy, etc.). The people now who are in charge of Spider-Man (and the ones before them for almost 20 years) hate him, and they do not hide this hate. Its why I don't have high hopes for the future of USM. That hate will bleed into it eventually. And it's going to get worse, because we are going to start getting to the point where the current team has only ever seen this hate for the character, and to them, that's how it's always been, so that's how it should be. And one of (if not the) flag ship characters will go from being the face of their company to being another joke character like the Kangaroo, Trapster, Hypno-Hustler, or Doctor Bong.
I think they're building up more stuff to give Peter Parker the boot. Won't surprise me now she's going to end up lecturing Spider-Man if he makes a mistake or if the two ever cross paths with bad circumstances. And probably cast a " great power comes to a great responsibility" back in his face. Honestly, if I was writing Spider-Man right now, I'd probably keep him distant away from this new MJ. If I can't undo it.
There's a problem where male superheroes get with either super-powered females or non-powered females, but actual female superheroes usally always get paired with superhero males and nearly never with non-powered ones. It feels like Marvel tried to fix this problem by spliting Peter and MJ apart, giving MJ powers and making her date a non-powered character who's specifically created to replace Peter and has no personality what so ever.
I saw this in another comment and i fully support it Peter and MJ shouldn't get back together anymore And in the case that Peter and MJ are forced to be together, now MJ has to earn it, not her forgiving Peter, but now she's in the wrong, she should try to earn Peter's trust once again, but have it that it takes her real effort, she squashed and destroyed Peter's heart, she has to fight for him to forgive her
At this point I’d rather they just write off Mary Jain , and Paul who feels like a self insert she got turned into jackpot so Paul could be this super smart guy who found a way to give he every power. She was almost used as a way for him to show off
Mj doesnt fit being a superhero and why cant spider-man 616 go out with women like silk, black cat, kitty pryde, liz, betty brant or silver sable? And ultimate spider-man mj is awesome but current 616 mj... is not as likeable.
Don't mind MJ having powers. I do like Marvel taking chances, but they should have invested more time into it. It's hard for dudes who've only known MJ as the girlfriend/Wife character to suddenly do more than just be supporting cast. I like the idea, but Jackpot seems kinda like a missed opportunity. I think the super tights for MJ would work better if she had powers that took some training to use. Like imagine her, wanting to help, but she's not sure if she's got a handle on her powers and might just mess things up. The Jackpot powers seem fine, fun, and groovy. But the Spiderman universe characters usually have powers that kinda come with some sort of cost or at the very least, at the expense of someone else? I feel if her power were something she could toil with, that would be something the fans could get behind. Seeing her have to struggle and maybe that could bring her closer to understanding her hubby more or maybe it would even drive them temporarily more apart.
Marvel ruined essentially most of Peter Parker and his dynamic with a lot of his supporting cast, not just MJ IMO. I do think you hit the nail on the head though, all these could have been compelling stories but Marvel rushed again. Then again, they already turned fans away with the the Paul stuff. I character that they've failed to get over as well. With all that said, I do think these characters(except Paul just cut their losses with him) can be salvaged. They are just going to have eat some crow through the story and characters. MJ, Pete and Felica, they are going to have to go through some hard time and redemption to get fans back on their side. And
Marvel haven't ruined Mary Jane. But they have misused the character, and the fans of the character. She was always awesome, and she didn't need superpowers to be awesome. But, Marvel have done this many times before. This is just the latest instance. So, while I was tempted to pick up a Spider-man comic again, Marvel once more showed me that I didn't need to bother. I left during the OMD story, and didn't look back. The stories leading up to that catastrophy being some of the best comics Marvel have ever done in terms of character growth and development. And it was all centered around Peter, MJ and May as a family. Heck, Spider-man was a teacher for a time. A school teacher. Few jobs are more grounded than that.
Mary Jane left Peter Parker. A superhero who deals with cosmic threats.
She left him for Paul. A guy who struggles with IKEA furniture.
Yep Morrigan really incinerated Paul there.
@@nowan6221knew someone would comment that...
I get the reference but all the more reason for Peter to keep his distance away from her.
I’m not going to defend Paul but i’ll agree that Ikea furniture is annoyingly hard sometimes.
Goddamn!!!!!! 😮😮
There's a good reason why people are shipping Spider-Man with Morrigan.
Amen
@@randomcenturion7264which is weird considering she loves Johnny blaze ghost rider
Where did that come from anyway?
@@MSKS-jl2qk Marvel vs. Capcom
When did this become a thing? I keep getting recommended like comics of them and I’m confused
Marvel ruined MJ so much, I genuinely don’t want these two back together. The only version where I care for the pairing is in Ultimate Spider-Man (2024)
Canon period.
And renew your vows MJ for me. Makes you realize she only truly matters when paired with peter
You know what I want? If they are forced back together, then this time, she needs to earn him back. No forgiving; MJ needs to try and fail multiple times to get Peter back. They want to keep jackpot fine, but she doesn't get a pass with Peter when this Paul BS is over.
Marvel Comics: WE WIN!
@@dubbman44 peter: sorry MJ this is a jackpot this time I refuse to take.
You know its bad when a literal succubus is a better partner for our boy, Peter.
Who’s the succubus?
@@bloodbrothers6556Morrigan Aensland from Darkstalkers
@@osdragonblast3305 thanks 👍
Peter doesn't care if MJ does mind him being late
Oh,That's A Very Nice Pairing. Very,Very Nice. Especially Considering The Fact The Morrigan Kinda Moves And Fights Like A Spider.@@osdragonblast3305
People need to realize that MJ isn't a bad character she just has bad writers. Marvel Editorial is a joke. They ruined my girl MJ.
Couldn’t have said it better myself
Yes, but at the same time, I always want Peter with Felicia
So other words, she's a bad character now, lol.
True, and all feels spitfull against the fans.
Making her a bad character, you can’t have one without the other.
“He’s not a murderer, he just fired a loaded gun” 😂
It's a shame because MJ used to be one of the most likable and charismatic characters in fiction. There was nothing about her that needed to be "changed" or "fixed". All this is just another proof there's no point to give Peter any other love interest. If they were willing to disgrace his soulmate THIS bad just to keep her away from him, who else stands a chance.
The best way for 616 Spider-Man to be right now is to be Anderw Garfield Spider-Man, he has no more Love Interest and actually likes being Spider-Man for once and maybe give MJ a taste of her own medicine I.E her powers get in the way with her relationships to the point she begins to empithize with Peter and feels sorry but for the mean time when ever she comes back to Peter he just goes "I missed the part where thats my problem" and distances himself from her until the writers come up with something.
Technically that was Gwen Stacy at first, but the killed her of and havent brought her back to life still
I know, right? This is just… frustrating.
@@forickgrimaldus8301
Agreed
Nick Spencer gave us hope, and Zebb Wells took that crushed it under his feet.
And laughed at us while doing it.
This whole run should get retconned out of existence.
Like fast.
But nope i don't think we are going to be so lucky.😢
That's what makes it so messed up! People have been wanting to the two together for the longest and along are Nick Spencer who didn't just throw them together and call it a day but did it in an amazing way makes both characters great.....Then the very second Zebb Wells hit the door running from day one it was like you hear a voice going, "AND THAT'S ENOUGH OF THAT!" I mean it wasn't just him and MJ that whole run but turning poor Pete into this character that a simple jay walker could beat down and have him begging to stop.
Even now with the new agent spider woman/Web-head, they are already setting up this almost Black Cat type thing with her finding Peter to be a total bore and almost pure Fangirl with Spiderman...and fixing his problem....
Just don't buy marvel products, not for a boicots but to protect your mental healt, whats the point of suporting somone that laugts at your pain?
People should forget about this crap
I can make a better Spiderman stort then those marvel crappy writers
Not just me everyone who understands pete can make a better story then those shit fks
Writers really writing their wild fetishes and disgusting imagination
Felicia has Bad Luck Power
MJ has gambling powers lmao
😂😂😂
Peter should just head to the MVC dimension and ditch MJ for Morrigan.
I don't know where this idea keeps coming from, but why the hell not?
@@silverblade357morrigan and Peter flirt in the Marvel vs Capcom games.
Black cat and gwen stacy are good too now days writers just forget about them because they dont want spider man to be happy
Zeb Wells ruined Mary Jane, just like everything else he's written for Amazing Spider-man.
Well, knowing his current emotional state... That man needs help
Agreed
@@JIMT412
… I know I’m going to regret this… but do tell.
@@RickyUzumaki993 Well, the short of it is:
He went through a divorce a year or two ago
His ex-wife left him for someone with two kids does that sound familiar
Yeah he should go to therapy instead of taking out on a fictional character
@@MattRogan28
On god fucking damn it…
not only did Paul push parker into the portal Mary jane was right there so basically Paul kidnapped her and she got Stockholm syndrome and married him
At least have some truth to what you're saying.
I'm not a big fan of the Jackpot thing
Me neither
It COULD work (the identity motif, not necessarily the superpower), if this wasn't part of this bullshit Paul crap plot.
I don't think anybody does. It's so out of character for MJ
Ultimate Spider-Man MJ has been Amazing and I fricking love that she's the one who came up with Pete's Superhero name in this universe and she seems like such a cool mum
It won't be long before the hate that the heads of Marvel seem to have for Spider-Man bleeds into it. Mark my words. I don't even give it a year.
My head canon is that this MJ is just a demonic doppelgänger made by Mephisto after One More Day.
It’s an easy retcon that can be made so long as both editorial and the writer are willing to make it canon.
Also a good callback to the water clone from the Fox Spider-Man cartoon.
Spiderman: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp 💦💦💦💦💧💧💧🌊🌊🌊
The real MJ might be dead and we don't know.
I feel like this might literally be what they will go with
No. This time it is Blackheart. Since they cross paths several times i. The old stories. The lad needs attention in Marvel media to be honest. And it is about time Mephisto and his crusty old presence has to be replaced with something new.
Yeah they did ruin Mary Jane I swear I saw a comic panel where Mary Jane Said Peter's pain is her gain.
I think that was annual 1 of the recent ASM volume
That panel made my stomach turn inside out. You know that feeling when a person you knew for a long time that you considered a friend talks shit about you behind your back? That one
Mephisto pulled an Eren Yeager on Marvel.
This is why I vote for Blackheart for a hell lord.
Blackheart is democratic as opposed to Authoritarian from his own words when he stabbed Mephistopheles with a pure blooded knife.
I feel like it would end better if Paul dumps MJ before he mysteriously fades from existence, MJ realizes her mistake, but Peter moves on and gets ready to have a kid with someone else, thus she ends up missing out on having the real thing with the person too good for her.
I agree with your take
Nah MJ deserves better. Her character shouldn't get ruined just because of one bad writer assassinating her character.
Also I don't want Mephisto to win. I rather MJ and Peter to get back together just to spite Mephisto and the Spiderman writers
Turning Mary Jane into jackpot was always a garbage idea from the start and freaking crap to it’s ending in my opinion.
Yes, they ruined her. And the only way to save her is to retcon the entire run.
They could retcon Paul as Mephisto in disguise. Then it all makes sense, because it's his latest attempt to keep Peter and MJ apart.
Agreed
@@gregbasore2108
I’d like that
6:35 "is there a way to save her character?"
Nah dawg, she's gone, i'm sorry for Mayday but no hommie deserves the shit that has been throwed at his face, be it from MJ or Well's self insert.
Morrigan is a fucking succubus and even she is a viable option when compared to MJ bro.
Black cat and gwen stacy are good too but you know about writers they cant let pete have healthy relationship afterall
Marvel has ruined Mary Jane as a character, so much to the point that I really don't want her and Peter to get back together.
Peter needs to move on and find a different love interest, literally almost anyone would be better than her.
Yeah but if they do that then the readers get pissy about it, also the writers screw it up
Congratulations. You've basically fallen for Marvel's gambit. Your reaction is EXACTLY what they want.
Yeah but every time he does move on they screw him over in that relationship, but him with MJ again and screw him even harder with her than the last time. At this point if they got back together again the only way I can see them screwing him harder than before is if MJ because one of his main villains....and they are crazy enough to do that lets be honest. I really wish they went the way of renew your vows, that was amazing, fun, and people just love it. But something about when you do stories like that or Super Sons, writes HATE IT and I don't know why.
Let it be Silk.
Dumbest comment ever.
That's what they want! They want You to hate her as much as they do
Mary Jane Watson is supposed to be Peter Parker/Spider-Man's love interest. She is supposed to be a supporting character like Aunt May, Harry Osborn, or J Jonah Jameson, it's fine of who she is. she doesn't need to have an active role in the spider man mythos all the time. she doesn't need to be a hero or villian or some convoluted love interest that the writers thought just to keep Spider-Man suffering or some weird insert fetish for a character *cough cough, paul. what makes her character great what she means to Peter and what Peter means to her. What makes these two love each other how do they both make each other grow what kind of actual hardships can they go through not this on and off again bs relationship. how they move foward together ready to face anything that stands in their way.
MJ suppose to be what Lois Lane to Clark/Sups, but apparently we can't have that
@@doubleoz1such a shame.
Mary Jane Watson is supposed to be Peter Parker's soulmate and wife. But you know Marvel can't have that.
Incorrect. What the character needs is to be well written and have a three-dimensional personality.
And not just only be the love interest to one guy, who seemingly cannot be able to balance his work and personal life.
And also, do you not know how to construct a proper sentence ?
That wall of text was difficult to read.
@@seeleunit2000 You don't have to be three dimensional to be good character. Speaking of Mary Jane Watson, she was always three dimensional character. People often think character has to be doing something equivalent in story as the main character but they can be just supporting character. That's why I said, what she means to peter and what peter means to her. Where the two create unique bond with each other to help one and another through anything.
I guess you think MJ would be more interesting if she some dorky half ass superhero who doesn't need to have serious relationship.
100% Marvel RUINED Mary Jane
Nick Spencer did a brilliant job fixing things they broke, but Marvel didn't like that and that he was on his way to undo OMD, so they hijacked his story and made it about Sins Past instead and had Wells break them up again. and I absolutely do not believe when Lowe said we did not hire Wells to break them up.
My only hope is Wells follows through when he said he going to put the toys back where he found them at the end of his run. but at this stage, I don't even believe that.
Agreed
the thing that gets me. way back in secret invasion, 50 states initiative, i swear there was a girl named something like spinner, that showed up for, like, three pages with the exact same superpower. spin a wheel(s) get random set of super powers.
Yep. MJ is the 3rd person to have these powers and / or identity.
if i was in control, id retcon the entire thing as peter being stuck in an illusion
I’d make it a bad dream.
If they wanted to give Mj powers, is fine with me. the powers given by Paul are not a problem to me, is the fact that her powers are random, yet she gets what she needs in any situation and they are not very clever, so it just ends up being boring.
So basically Scarlet Witch before House of M?
If they want to fix her powers they have to do what Ben 10 does. By often giving her the wrong powers in the wrong situations, she has to be creative with her powers
@@joopvanhedel1372it does need to progress with her being more comfortable with the randomness. Go from classic to reboot ben in os constantly complained about not getting what he wanted but reboot just goes with it
I don't know why they need to give her powers. She doesn't need them. She needs better writing, not a gimmick.
I am sorry but that powers given by paul is worse because she get confident enough to insult peter to convince him to let go to me MJ is dead sorry
And regardless of everything she’s still his soulmate… just, take a moment and process that little fact.
If only zebb understood that.😭
Marvel Editorial knew what they were doing giving MJ powers. They just made Zeb the triggerman. And hey. If they want to keep Peter and MJ apart out of spite, I can want them together for the same reason. I know exactly what they want me to think: "If this is the case, I'd rather never see them together again."
Nice try, Marvel. Nice try.
I think the idea of making Mary Jane have powers is so that she is more self-revealing and not so dependent on Peter for sales, just so that no writer in the future will undo the relationship with Paul's selft insert, I think that It was a plan by Zebs to keep Mary Jane with her self insert and that no one would stop her, it's like my theory, I think that later they are going to add a Zendaya who will be Peter's new girlfriend, it would be extremely funny XDDD
Zendaya was such a boring and nothing character lol. She really had nothing going on outside of her time with Peter Parker
I don’t think Zeb understand how much of a bad idea making sure a self insert character stick around is in marvel because at this point they should be called traumarvel I remember in the hell fire gala that a robot skin Mary Jane alive and use her skin as a suit to enter the gala she was a side character then , self insert characters like Korean boyfriend from John Kent Superman and I’m not star fire were smart enough to make sure they had their fun and then their self insert disappeared for good, because once the writer leaves they have to leave their new toys behind for someone else to play with and eventually break them,their self insert eventually getting what’s coming to them and people will cheer , also remember that the way cómics work is not you ask for the character you give an idea and then marvel or dc give you characters to play your history out so imagine that with Paul essentially because he was what was available,imagine someone made a fanfic were everyone loves their character but then someone at marvel says ok your turn is over and hands out your self insert to someone else and that person make him do the most heinous horrible things a person can do and now everyone in the marvel universe is trying to kill him and everyone else is portrayed in the right and the fans are cheering,that bound to hurt the ego because that’s the author essentially they made them into a villain and everyone else Is happy about it
Also doesn't help that Paul isn't established as anything more than a cockblock. There's nothing interesting to continue. He's been such a dick to Peter that it's easier to see him become the full villain he doesn't want to become. If he does stay, it'll only be because he's tied to Mary Jane who's tied to Peter.
@@bryanwoods3373💯👏🏻
@@bryanwoods3373what bothers me is Paul is kinda the reason MJ was even put in that horrible place and yet the story refuses to acknowledge that. Not to mention the story constantly tries to bend over backwards to justify MJ’s side of things but never acknowledges peters side. Dude went from having the love of his life to not only losing her but losing her to an NPC in a couple hours. But the story just say boo hoo she’s moved on get over it.
Me to MARVEL Editorial:
"You Maniacs! You blew her up! Ah, damn you! God damn you all to Hell!"
then we all wake up to a bunch of dancing monkeys singing "Dr. Zaius, dr. Zaius."
At this point marvel literally has only one choice to make sure they don't lose money is to give peter back his marriage since the book is constantly losing them money
Marvel's Spider-Men 2 they ruin mary Jane Face😓
Please, they ruined her in original game. With her being annoyed that Peter doesn't like the fact that his GF throws herself headfirst into danger (spying on armed thugs, mercenaries, etc).
I'm glad to have a cllection of the Marvel adventures Spiderman series where i can pop in and say hello to Peter and Chat. No unnecessary relationship drama. Just a fun and wholesome relationship in the background of some Spiderman adventures.
Bring back the original Gwen Stacy for Peter.
personally I hope they retcon the whole paul problem
@darkshadowx803 that's very possible but its depends how they write the retcon for example it was a bad dream for Peter or hell time travel
But what you say comes true
MJ will be forgotten forever
I think this is something more deeper than just Paul. He's part of the problem, but not the whole thing, the main problem here is Marvel destroying their previous work to sell morbidity pandering.
It'd be kind of cool if Paul was Mephisto.......
Good video Jugs. With production value like this you will get 1k in no time.
It's like they went onto get rid of all the things that made MJ work, she's completely out of character and I don't even understand at this point why other than to just make people mad.
Just make Black Cat Spiderman's main love interest
They don't want to even do that to. They want to make her a lesbain or a bisexual women who prefers women(which is a retcon to make her more like Catwomen,again).
At best,they will always make her his rebound that never last,for some dumb reason. Hell,they will make an else world where Black Cat actually has a healthy romantic relationship with Peter Parker as Spiderman.
This people don't want Peter to be happy 😂.
@@rachetmarvel931 Is making her LGBTQ supposed to be some half assed redemption arc for that time she went full crime boss
@@rachetmarvel931 Maybe they should tell stories where even after Black Cat goes straight she has to deal with someone she wronged when she became the Queenpin trying to get revenge on her/ruin her life
But then wouldn't that just be like DC pairing Batman with Catwoman?
@@bobkane432nope, just lazy pandering. A shame. I think Peter David did a good job with her when he was putting out Symbiote Spiderman. She was very likeable.
I can't really give an opinion on MJ as Jackpot as I haven't read the series. As for the whole Paul thing I figured since it effects other heroes and their stories like Kamala Khan they won't just retcon it, but I honestly figured they were gonna claim some clone story arc where during her time in the alternate dimension MJ was cloned, with the one being with Paul as the clone and the OG MJ still being around but somewhere else.
Either that or Mephisto kidnapped MJ and replaced her with a demon in disguise to put a wedge between Peter and MJ.
Though the clone thing could work too. Like maybe MJ died in the other world and Paul tried making things right by making a clone to replace her for Spidey. Only for it not to work out as planned.
Either version could lead to a story where SM has to go yo Hell to save her (or her soul at least). Only for Peter to get his hands on the original deal he made with Mephisto, and has to make the choice to destroy said deal.
first of all I must clarify that I didnt read any of Zebb's recent comics, so I am taking the "no explanation at the time" at face value here, that said even I am well aware of the Paul situation.
Now, I am just gonna drop an opinion here, you are free to hate it if you dislike.....but ironically....if his idea was to break up Peter and MJ, I think it would have been a better idea to make a situation somewhat similar to the infamous mephisto deal, only this time write Peter make a selfless dicision to wish for Mary Jane to have a happy and safe life because he is afraid of losing her.....wich would obviously be reverted later down the line but i think you get my point..... it would be an unpopular decision with the fans?....probably yes....but at least that sounds like something peter would be capable of doing for protecting someone he loves.
peter had a better relationship with kitty pride in the ultimate universe
I really don't understand how writers think THIS is something fans what to see.
Well, nothing I can do so all-aboard the succubus train (if Mephisto was scared of Mayday kicking his ass in the future to the point he had to erase Peter and MJ's marriage, then he'd really shit himself when he sees the child of Spider-Man and Morrigan).
MJ isn't the problem it's editorial
I really hope they retcon all this in the future because i really want them together again despite everything
Also MJ is the only romance that will get Peter somewhere
Gwen is long dead
Felicia won't change in the long term so she will still be a morally grey character which will make her and Peter's relationship impossible
And every other is not as important
So it has to be MJ, just not the MJ from recent runs
morrigan
They ruin mary jane.
Marvel editorial has hated MJ ever since she got with Peter. And One More Day is the official fxck you to us in regards to that marriage/relationship.
And I'm fairly certain it will never go back 🤦🏾♂️ LOL
Personally I never liked Marry Jane, nearly every comic about spiderman forces his character to always revolve around her and she always is nearly the reason every time Peter has it rough.
I wish they bring back that one x-men character that spider-man dated that can talk to animals, I can't remember her name or the comic
Was it "Song"? That one Spiderman story that has anime lile style.
Her name is Chat
I know to how save Mary Jane's character. Just bring her back together with Parker. One More Day should have been retconned over a decade ago.
It all boils down to "the writer's barely disguised fetish".
How is this channel not more popular
It can be explained that Mephisto is behind Paul to stop Peter and MJ (she's just mind-controlled this whole time) from being happy together.
Or just make it so it wasn’t the real MJ so Peter isn’t a cuck. That cuck stuff is gross and pathetic. I wouldn’t want her after that.
Not only did Marvel ruin MJ, they also ruined Peter Parker and Ben Reilly
Agreed
I don’t remember where I saw it but the thing that made me hate Mary Jane. Was when Peter was battered and bruised she decided to yell and berate him and throw the “great responsibility” line at his face.
It was at one of the hellfire parties after he saved her and tried to talk to her . Not even get back together talk
I personally just don't look at comics anymore, DC and marvel have this "throw it at the wall and hope it sticks" mentality I just can't bear anymore. We all watched it happen with cinema and it's been going on even longer with comics and I'm just done, it's impossible to have a character you genuinely like when they are being changed, retconned constantly, changed for a boost in sales, and stories like this just being an absolute spit in the face to readers who have given these books a chance and wasted their time on em. Old comic fans just didn't know what they had in the 80s- early 2000s, i dont even know how honestly considering they were doing this same thing, i think the difference is that this type of stuff has run its course. Marvel desperately needs to reboot all their franchise and change their business model when it comes to writing cause this is getting old, stale, and insulting. Not even just talking about Marry Jane, Marvel and DC are in a constant war of do this better do that better, and in the end it's become a battle of out stupiding the other. Comics are not what they used to be
They are ruining her character hoping that fans would hate her getting back with peter
And it’s slowly working
Bad mystery box story telling that had no payoff whatsoever. If you are gonna write a What did Peter do storyline you would think Zeb would have worked out what Peter did to make everyone mad at him. Just a terrible run all around
Our boy Peter Parker has been through so much pain that he needs to move on an leave MJ in the past and find a new flame that cares about him.
Its not gonna be any different. If they wont let him be with the character he has the most history with then what makes you think a new relationship would be any better
To this day I can't understand, why did Spider-Man make a deal with Mephisto? Peter Park has met Dr. Strange, Johnny Blaze, both who'd tell him that Mephisto is a trickster and he will screw you over. Is Peter Parker so fundamentally stupid he'd believe Mephisto? He'd know the first second that Mephisto will play him.
Seriously, I understand that every comic book gets a different writer that has on to the mythos or take something away, but it would be nice if there was any rules stipulated that you had to at least, keep continuity in mind.
It would make things less convoluted. And also, I wouldn't mind the fact of Mary Jane had superpowers and was also just doing her own thing, I just wish however it wasn't automatically rectoned.
It gets added and it gets taken away just as fast.
And sometimes it would just be nice if the writers would stop always having to come up with convoluted romance plots and cheating plots and plots of someone getting Stockholm from getting kidnapped... I would like Mary Jane to be a three-dimensional character with some agency.
Besides down the line we all know this is going to get reset and Spider-Man and Mary Jane get back together again somehow.
I think they also ruined Gwen Stacy.
Didnt they already try that with sins past
Ngl I really like the spider gwen comics. I think ultimately Gwen is getting better treatment than MJ. Not to mention 616 Gwen is still the same person and the ghost spider is just an alternate reality version. So any character changes good or bad isn't a reflection on the Gwen who died. MJ however is presented as the 616 version and it's awful.
@darkshadowx803 The saturation and obsession that Marvel has with the character means that many are already beginning to hate her.
@@Usernamesdontmatter1Gwen is the Harley Quinn of Marvel.
Personally I think the only way they can fix MJ is to have it be revealed that this wasn’t even the real MJ but rather a clone or puppet created by mephisto or jackal or whoever. The damage to the character is so extensive that the only way to fix it is the comic book character equivalent of a factory reset.
The Spider-Man Editorial office have missed the point of MJ. I believe that they can salvage MJ, they just need to find a good way to redeem her and an even better way to retcon the Wells run.
Just make her reflect on her decisions, realize she was unfair with Peter and talk things out. But wait, they don't return together in one issue, like any real life broke outs that wants to return, make them be first distance try to get close again and slowly building up trust again. And so she's redeeming herself by earning and working on it.
@@JIMT412also she should kick out Paul and flip him off on his way out.
Peter should start dating Silk
Spiderman dodged a bullet.
I feel bad for paul. His soul belongs to Mj, that is, until she makes a deal with Mephisto. Sorry, paul.
If everyone is super!...Then no one will be
Yeah it called a Fanfic
Very informative
Jackpot part: So the writer took the OG Ben 10 Omnitrix randomness and made it a game mechanic.
I actually like Jackpot. Her motivations for becoming Jackpot were "I couldn't save my kids from forces out of my control, but I can save other people," which is kinda a spin on how Peter had the chance to save Uncle Ben from getting killed but didn't.
I just think that Marvel needs to have both Spidey and MJ interact more. I really enjoyed the mini-arc where they teamed up, and I can see MJ still grounding Peter while playing an active part in his superhero life.
This has been why, aside from real life economic concerns, I haven't been collecting issues of this run.
Marvel wants Pete young and single (and broke) so he can appeal to potential readers who aren't in their 40s and 50s. I get it. But that's why you have Miles, Gwen, and Kamala. At least I'm sure that's what some Marvel writers and editors had in mind for them. Newer audiences to identify with newer characters so the older characters could be allowed to grow up: Scott marries Jean (or lives with Emma, depending on the timeline), Remy marries Rogue, Kate Pryde and Illyana Rasputin take their places as major players in the X-books. Sadly, someone at the Spider-Office did not get the memo, or ignored it completely. I suspect Marvel editorial was trying to metaphorically do a Superior Spider-Man again, only they replaced MJ with the version of herself came back with Paul.
It'll be a decade at least before MJ and Pete even look like they can be together again, because the comments section is right: if they're going to do this, MJ has to earn her way back into Pete's life. As someone who's seen Pete go through a zillion love interests, I am tired. I just want to see him settled with someone, the way I want to see a dear friend finally sort out his love life. Pete could easily have been happy and grounded (more or less) with Carlie or Felicia or even, of all people, Bobbi. Any one of them could have contributed something different long-term to the Spider-Man mythos and kept Pete a proper adult. Sadly Bobbi has a Carol problem (Capt Marvel was also linked to Pete, and they each belong in someone else's book). And Carlie was so badly scarred from the Superior Spider-Man run that she's permanently left NYC. Felicia also represents an end- Peter accepting adulthood and leaning more into a shared super-heroic life- which was probably why Zeb Wells broke them up too.
I'm not going to shit on Wells, because I'm almost certain his writing has been informed by Marvel Editorial. I just can't bring myself to be enthusiastic about his run. If I come back at all, it'll be because of something seismic, and I'm betting it won't happen for another 10 years. Can't wait that long. I got stuff in my life that needs addressing.
It's so pathetic that i sincerely think 616 version of two characters is beyond saving. The only spider-man and mj i care about is 6160
6160?
@truthspreader1996 the Ultimate universe
@@TimilehinOlaokun Oh!!!
@@truthspreader1996 The maker didn't choose his original 1610 universe, instead he alter the history of 6160 for himself
@darkshadowx803 Not as good, but at least better than 616
So….her “boyfriend” gave her a roulette system, but also built in the possibility that it might kill her?
What the fuck? What the actual fuck? It’s like they’ve taken the core concept of Ben 10’s powers, and made it really, and I mean REALLY shitty. Like, why even give her that randomised gimmick? For a pinch when she needs to power us in a hurry and doesn’t have time to think, then sure, I can see a randomiser working, but if all the powers are in there, just give her the bloody choice. This isn’t a toy commercial, they don’t need to sell different power sets.
Geez…..
Agreed
He broke mj and Peter cuz zeb wanted black cat and Peter to be together but in a few issues zeb wells broke them up for no reason and then black cat rebounded with this hacker girl (she’s canonically bi sexual ) who tried to blackmail Mary Jane and all of New York with a fake app as Mary Jane’s first major villain
I think the only way this makes sense is if this whole Paul fiasco was a gambit made by Mephisto to break Spider-Man
Stupedest thing tha paul was not able to get himself out of that dimention. But building devise that can "create" ALL marvell powers, easy...
Ben 10 called, he wants his Omnitrix back.
If there's going to be another secret wars I would like it if they replace Peter and mj with there ultimate counter parts
Yes. JAckpot is dumb and a stain on the character but ruin her. If the original plan of "what did Peter do" had panned out and she had some reason to leave Peter and not be with him, that would be another black mark but wouldn't ruin her. But when Dead Language came out and the story was just....she fell in love with someone else and left Peter for them...that's what ruined her. Because now you've taken your romantic heroine and said there's a limit to her love and Peter isn't even the one she considers her one.
The entire relationship with Paul starts with her being disloyal to and faithless towards Peter, assuming he would never save her despite all the evidence to the contrary. That would be bad enough, because it makes her weak (again) and disloyal, but when Peter shows up and proves that her assumption was a mistake, the fact that she still chooses to stay with Paul is just a death sentence for the character in her role. Nothing stops her from being with Peter. He doesn't care or immediately forgives whatever she did in the other dimension. And it isn't like Peter and MJ just met. The last time they saw each other in the 616 he was moving in with her at HER request. Their relationship is fully developed...and she chooses Paul. And if she's willing to choose Paul then she's willing to choose somebody else in the future. It completely ruins any romantic possibility.
Of course, the caveat is that all of that is wildly out of character for MJ. She just wouldn't do any of that. She wouldn't start a relationship with Paul while waitng for Peter and she certainly wouldn't stay with him rather than go back to Peter. But it must be undone. MJ cannot have ever willinging entered into a relationship with Paul. Make this one a fake, or make her under Mind Control, or whatver you want to do, but that's the thing they have to do. Fans should demand it.
That's one way to get fans to stop begging for the marriage to come back I guess
hmm i know maybe wild but my unrealistic tin theory is : in some dimension out there this Wells, actually changed his first name from Harison to zeb, that means he's actually the Reverse Flash , a guy with plenty of experience at nuking hero romantic life mehahaha, right Barry? [the "it was me Barry" meme on spidey in incognito ???]
Paul could join the sinister 6 hes done more damage to spidy then they ever did.
This why manga is superior
Don’t have to worry about 1 writer fucking it up
marvel doesnt understand their fans and also dont understand their character. this "spider-man must always depressed and must be a playboy" is a problem. they just made another new person for him to have a relationship with. i think peter has more ex's than most if not all in comics. funny thing is there are only a few main couples in comics that everyone knows, superman and louis and peter and mj. yea there are others but those are the top two and peter and mj have been broken up longer than they were together. that alone shows marvel doesnt get it. add in Ultimate Spider-Man's sales and theres even more proof. current marvel will never get it. they are to old and out of touch. even if Ultimate Spider-Man it their number one comic for the next 10 years i still dont think they will get it. it will take a major change at the top. the question is when will this ever happen?
I used to love Spider-Man. I grew up with a very shitty life, and seeing Parker get through his trials with friends and family by his side, something I really didn't have, always gave me hope. Then One More Day happened. And I'm not saying its the problem. I'm saying it was the start of the problem. They took his family away. Then later they made his friends hate him. and eventually, I grew to hate the series. Not because of Spider-Man, but because now I was reading about a person leading a shitty life with no real friends left and no real family left. I was already living that life; I didn't want to read about the person that gave me hope living that life. And every time it looks like he is going to get the life they took from him back, they rip it away in the cruelest and most awful ways (Ben becomes a villain, Mary Jane leaves him for a fucking self-insert character, his next girlfriend leaves him because their relationship is TOO healthy, etc.). The people now who are in charge of Spider-Man (and the ones before them for almost 20 years) hate him, and they do not hide this hate. Its why I don't have high hopes for the future of USM. That hate will bleed into it eventually. And it's going to get worse, because we are going to start getting to the point where the current team has only ever seen this hate for the character, and to them, that's how it's always been, so that's how it should be. And one of (if not the) flag ship characters will go from being the face of their company to being another joke character like the Kangaroo, Trapster, Hypno-Hustler, or Doctor Bong.
Namor: I am the worst marriage homewrecker!
Magneto: No, I am the worst marriage homewrecker!
Paul: *Amateurs*
It’s silk time baby
I think they're building up more stuff to give Peter Parker the boot. Won't surprise me now she's going to end up lecturing Spider-Man if he makes a mistake or if the two ever cross paths with bad circumstances. And probably cast a " great power comes to a great responsibility" back in his face. Honestly, if I was writing Spider-Man right now, I'd probably keep him distant away from this new MJ. If I can't undo it.
There's a problem where male superheroes get with either super-powered females or non-powered females, but actual female superheroes usally always get paired with superhero males and nearly never with non-powered ones.
It feels like Marvel tried to fix this problem by spliting Peter and MJ apart, giving MJ powers and making her date a non-powered character who's specifically created to replace Peter and has no personality what so ever.
Calm down, Barry bee 😭 3:11
I saw this in another comment and i fully support it
Peter and MJ shouldn't get back together anymore
And in the case that Peter and MJ are forced to be together, now MJ has to earn it, not her forgiving Peter, but now she's in the wrong, she should try to earn Peter's trust once again, but have it that it takes her real effort, she squashed and destroyed Peter's heart, she has to fight for him to forgive her
YES, marvel has ruined MJ!!
Can you imagine if Spidey has an enemy who was in gambling by any CHANCE? (aka Nicholas Powell)
These are the worst Spider-Man comics of all time. Spencer was bad, it was like reading the Tick, but Zeb Wells is worse.
At this point I’d rather they just write off Mary Jain , and Paul who feels like a self insert she got turned into jackpot so Paul could be this super smart guy who found a way to give he every power. She was almost used as a way for him to show off
Marvel as a whole jumped the shark years ago. It's not likely that it can be saved, but does it really deserve to exist at this point?
Mj doesnt fit being a superhero and why cant spider-man 616 go out with women like silk, black cat, kitty pryde, liz, betty brant or silver sable? And ultimate spider-man mj is awesome but current 616 mj... is not as likeable.
Don't mind MJ having powers. I do like Marvel taking chances, but they should have invested more time into it. It's hard for dudes who've only known MJ as the girlfriend/Wife character to suddenly do more than just be supporting cast. I like the idea, but Jackpot seems kinda like a missed opportunity. I think the super tights for MJ would work better if she had powers that took some training to use. Like imagine her, wanting to help, but she's not sure if she's got a handle on her powers and might just mess things up. The Jackpot powers seem fine, fun, and groovy.
But the Spiderman universe characters usually have powers that kinda come with some sort of cost or at the very least, at the expense of someone else? I feel if her power were something she could toil with, that would be something the fans could get behind. Seeing her have to struggle and maybe that could bring her closer to understanding her hubby more or maybe it would even drive them temporarily more apart.
Marvel ruined essentially most of Peter Parker and his dynamic with a lot of his supporting cast, not just MJ IMO. I do think you hit the nail on the head though, all these could have been compelling stories but Marvel rushed again. Then again, they already turned fans away with the the Paul stuff. I character that they've failed to get over as well. With all that said, I do think these characters(except Paul just cut their losses with him) can be salvaged. They are just going to have eat some crow through the story and characters. MJ, Pete and Felica, they are going to have to go through some hard time and redemption to get fans back on their side. And
I'm happy Zeb Wells is no longer writing Spider-Man. But the damage is done.
Marvel haven't ruined Mary Jane. But they have misused the character, and the fans of the character. She was always awesome, and she didn't need superpowers to be awesome. But, Marvel have done this many times before. This is just the latest instance. So, while I was tempted to pick up a Spider-man comic again, Marvel once more showed me that I didn't need to bother. I left during the OMD story, and didn't look back. The stories leading up to that catastrophy being some of the best comics Marvel have ever done in terms of character growth and development. And it was all centered around Peter, MJ and May as a family. Heck, Spider-man was a teacher for a time. A school teacher. Few jobs are more grounded than that.