Thanks Acnaros, I really appreciate that!! I'll keep working on guides for sure :) And if you ever have specific things you want to see, please let me know in comments (I've got a large list working, but keep track of every idea I think I can do).
@@JustFacts42 Mid-mid to late-mid probably. Tho definitely not a team for early-gamers! Most of the runes I'm using are above the level that's needed for the team. Only Julie truly has that minimum damage threshold, and all the monsters could be 40 speed slower. By the time someone is doing r5 regularly, they should be able to make this team work
@@JustFacts42 There's no clear definition of early/mid/late game, and I certainly respect yours :) But what you explained is my exact definition of the line between mid-mid and late-mid, except for the RTA part which would come WAY after the rest of what you said. One important thing tho - you don't have to jump straight to r5. Raiding provides 20% of a runes value, and the drops in R3 may be a little lower but work just as well and are very attainable at earlier stages of the game. Starting to raid as you enter mid-game will speed your pace up a TOOOON. Imo it's better to have 20 excellently runed mons than 60 poorly runed ones.
Great video, love your content and you thoroughly explain everything while showing how you got there with the optimizer. Will be building this when my Jule is finished!
Discovered your channel yesterday, just subbed. I have to say, it's a case of #feelsbadman when I'm running sub 1 minute dungeons, score SSS on wind/fire/water rift beast, clear toah most months (can't beat artamiel at floor 80), then to see this video with 'mid-game runes' that's better than anything I have.
Heya M Leet, glad you found the channel and subbed! To be fair - mid-game is the longest stretch of the game. These are like "later mid game runes." Also all you need is the damage output, not the speed - it's just that the runes I had had some extra speed. The average sets in that video are around 90% efficiency, and would be fine if the efficiency was even lower (i.e. if they had no speed) so it isn't that high for fully gemmed and grinded runes. It's just that the stats syngerized well :)
Thanks for the video. It was really informative! I am more of a casual, not knowing as much about the ingame mechanics as you guys do, so I just kinda snipe teams and also try to build them. Worked on BJ5 so now I can try to get stable faster Cairos teams. Thx for the tips, will check out your other videos too.
Awesome comment Data, I appreciate it :) Good luck with the team building! I've got a video with the 7 most common mistakes for BJR5 too, if you happen to still be working on that team. Feel free to drop any questions in the comments of any video, any time ;)
Thanks Remi :) I've done several videos that were more in-depth with the optimizer (each focusing on different things). The thumbnails on them are awful thoguh and they tend to get overlooked hehe. Optimizer thumbnails are hard - there's no real image to make people think of them. Anyway, you may enjoy this video: ruclips.net/video/MYmWL4T4Rzs/видео.html
Assuming my math is correct (not my strong point), Sophia with 85% accuracy will Def Break the mid boss just over 97% of the time. This compares to an 85% accuracy Loren skill 1 95% and skill 2 87% successful Def Break. Of course Sophia will likely do more damage than Loren on the same runes as well, plus has elemental advantage to to help survive the odd boss hit. Sophia is the far superior choice in both theory and thanks to your video, in practice too.
Man really nice analysis. That's pretty cool, I feel like you did a better breakdown than I did haha. But yeah you nailed all the key points! The one other point to add - if the midboss/boss drop to below 30% health before Lyn goes, then Lyn will use her S3 100% of the time. So Sophia's damage also works to increase the frequency of Lyn using S3. To be fair: Loren's main advantage is the atk bar pushback - the Loren team will pretty much never fail because the Boss never gets his AOE attack. This Sophia team fails between 0.5 and 1.0% of the time. But (for me personally) saving 10-15seconds on average is worth the 1-in-100+ fail rate :)
I won't discuss the damage aspect as you covered that pretty well. i will cover the landing def breaks though. The important thing to know is that first an activation check is done and then if activated a resistance check. 30% activation with full skillups for Sophia S3, 70% not to activate odds of just not activating 5 times in a row is then 70%*70%*70%*70%*70% which is roughly 16.8% chance to never even activate not even worrying about times it activates and resists. P(A) = 0.3, P(~A) = 0.7, P(A and R) = 0.045, P(A and ~R) = 0.255 the overall math would follow... P(~A)**5 * nCr(5,0) + P(~A)**4 * P(A and R)**1 * nCr(5,1) + P(~A)**3 * P(A and R)**2 * nCr(5,2) + P(~A)**2 * P(A and R)**3 * nCr(5,3) + P(~A)**1 * P(A and R)**4 * nCr(5,4) + P(~A)**0 * P(A and R)**5 * nCr(5,5) using combinations nCr and probability of not activating and resistance given activation the final results are about 22.95% chance to never get a defense break due to resistance or not activating.
@@stephensimpson7794 So.. we have to start here by saying that you're completely right, Sophia is not 100% activation on her S2, thus my math was WAY off. However, I just double checked, she's actually 60%, so the true rate is even lower than noted above. This was a really valuable catch on your part / oversight on mine, thank you for that! Also thank you for what was one of the most detailed and in-depth comments I've received on any video. I personally found it useful (not the least of which because it caught a mistake I made), but also really appreciated the time and thought that went into it!
Sophia is a key for this team, but Lushen opens up a LOT of other team options for you too, all of which are good. Good luck - hope he comes up in rotation soon (I haven't checked, is he scheduled yet?)
Thanks James!! Had kind of been thinking that there's a lot of TOA stuff out there already, but I'm definitely open to the idea. I'll take a look around and see if I can do something that's unique/new :) If you have any suggestions / requests, please let me know also!
Luna is the best of course, but if you don't have Lyn probably don't have Luna. You can try Sig, Kro, or Naomi - but in all of those cases it raises the rune quality requirements for everyone but Julie. So if you aren't able to get the rune quality high enough to be stable, you might also try (in this turn order): Lushen(L), Galleon, Sabrina, Naomi or Kro, Talia. That team ran 20-21s best times for me (faster than the Julie team), though the average time was slower.
hey me again :D just out of curiousity what is the point of bringing lushen for the final clear when his initial intend to solo clear no longer is necessary? would it not be better to bring in a abigail for additional defense break options on the giants (especially the mid boss with its insane resistance stats)? :p
It's an interesting thought. Kind of the same as I mentioned in Dragons, I went with Lushen to control turn order and cooldown cycling. Abigail's attacks will be random and may not clear the wave, which can result in Julie getting hit (affecting S3) or Sophia taking a 2nd turn (affecting cooldown cycling). The biggest thing here tho is that all of those are Nat5s. Lushen is something almost everyone has built and skilled, which makes it an easily repeatable team :p With that said, there's likely options beyond Lushen that could be effective. It would have to involve an AOE defense break to be an appreciable upgrade. Ethna does that for example, if her damage could be forced high enough to clear the wave. But the AOE is on her S2, so the AI may not be forced to use it. It would also result in turn cycling and she only has a 2 turn CD, so I don't know if there would be enough consistency. Teshar might do more damage to the boss, but since he would be acting before the def break it wouldn't be significant. Savannah has an AOE def break but it's a 5 turn CD, etc.
@@XennialGamer If Julie goes first, Abigail will use her S3 to clear the rest of the wave. And to do that she has alot less rune-requirement than Lushen. in theory Lushen has 0 rune requirement to finish waves but that would be a complete waste. The only upside here would be the fact that Lushen has more easily accessable skillups through Jojo fusion. However the additional value she brings into the team, compared to Lushen, especially in Necro and Dragons can make a major difference for people that can not safely breach the 148 speed requirement on the slowest unit for safeclearing all dungeons.
She's good for top speed records but not super reliable. Her AI isn't the smartest unfortunately, and her damage is too low so she has to serve as both defense breaker and brander.
I am torn because If I use the event I could copy this same team. But I have a GB10 team 45-55 secs. But I was also thinking, I need to make my DB10 and NB10 Teams better and faster.. I have Talia, And Deva. If I was to use the event to get a twin. I am not sure what twin I want. and suggestions???
Heya Rodrigo - if you're happy with your GB10 times then it's not essential to make them faster. Especially if you're f2p or close to it, and don't mind spending the time to use your energy. Definitely completing a twins set is more important - I'd take Sabrina, because Sabrina+Talia is awesome in a lot of areas, including all Caiross dungeons and rifts. In the end you'll get way more upgrades that way :) (PS: Shaina is a little more useful than Sabrina, but Shaving 3 Chakrams without Talia is a waste - Sabrina lets you use both Talia and Deva!)
@@XennialGamer Thank you for replying back so fast.. I slept on it before choosing. And I was thinking the same thing. And I chose Sabrina. I really enjoy your content.
I would think you could substitute with Arang more easily than Naomi. In both cases you might have a slightly higher rune requirement, I'm not positive. Or possibly substitute Sophia with Loren and then Lyn with Arang, to control the bosses attack more. It'll be slower but should work :)
For GB10, the mid-boss has like 160 resistance. Obviously 100 is the max, so it just counts as 100. That means you need 85% accuracy to minimize the odds of it resisting you. If Sophia doesn't def break mid-boss, the run goes very slow, and can even potentially fail. The rest of the monsters are lower res - I forget the exact, I think final boss is 60%, which means that you'd need the 45% you mentioned. But the mid-boss is the key to the whole team, so you want Sophia at 85%+ :).
Sadly you just have to wait and eventually get lucky. And if you're F2P it takes longer, and especially if you're a newer player when there are so many different priorities :( But you may want to check out this video by Ace, too: ruclips.net/video/-AnlAP4qzdQ/видео.html
I actually got my giants team to 29sec using Lushen (L), Galleon, Sigmarus, Laika, Lyn. Laika is nice as he can finish off the giant on his own assuming he does not get chain stunned.
Arang is a very effective GB10 monster, but I'm not sure she'd work in this team. Not enough negative affects for her S3 to scale off of, and not a reliable enough AI. She works better in more traditional lushen teams, or maybe with a loren-type team
Heya Toze, yes they should be able to work as a replacement. Talia's AI is unreliable, so the average time is a bit slower, and you MAY need the monsters to be a little bit tankier to survive consistently (I'm not sure). But the Julie/Lushen/Sophia combo will definitely work with just 2 nukers after them :) Luna is awesome there too. The main thing is, you must have enough damage to clear the midboss in 1 rotation of the 5 monsters to keep the turn cooldowns in sequence.
This team kind of needs Sophia to be stable. Without her, you could try something like Julie, Lushen, Sabrina, Lyn, Talia (that attack order) maybe, though I haven't tested that comp. Or perhaps Galleon, Lushen, Sabrina, Lyn, Talia (in that order)
@@eljonbacongco4186 Luna should work nicely in place of Lyn (I don't have Luna - want to trade? haha). Yeah you'll always want Talia to move last, because her damage increases if the boss is below 50% health. According to the wiki, the fastest monster in DB10 is 135 speed. So you'd need a "combat speed" of 135.01+ with your slowest monster to move ahead of the boss. To calculate combat speed, take the monsters BASE speed, multiply by speed tower %, then if using a speed lead, separately multiply by speed lead %, then add that to current speed. Example: Monster has base speed of 103. Speed tower is 11%, and speed lead is 24%. 103*11% = 11.33 103*24% = 24.72 Runes are +91 speed Combat speed = 103 + 91 + 11.33 + 24.72 = 230.05. However, I believe that Luna needs a "speed gap" between herself and the monster either in front or behind her. Since I don't have Luna, I'm not sure the exact mechanics, but Seiishizo has a great video that explains the speed tuning. I can't remember which video, but it was one of the GB10 or DB10 videos. Just skim through them until you see the one where he's using Luna, he explains it in great detail: ruclips.net/user/Seiishizovideos?view=0&sort=dd&flow=grid
I'm planning to go back through and try to test for the minimum stats a bit on DB10 and GB10. But finding the time has been tough, it's a long process :p And it's a little tricky for me to do, because these are generally my lowest efficiency runes already (obviously tons of damage output of course, not saying bad runes - just that most of my runes are gemmed/grinded). Anyway - message me on Discord, XennialGamer#4428, and I can give you the rough guidelines of where I think they are. It won't be exact since I haven't tested for the bottom yet, but I can give you a starting point.
Yeah the Lyn AI is unfortunately not great. Very few monsters have a fully reliable AI. The only way to "force" Lyn to use her S3 is to get the boss below 30% health before Lyn's turn, which requires a super high rune quality. But the only monster I know of that can replace her and have 100% AI is Luna, which is an LD4 that most people (including me) don't have. That's why I put my Lyns on violent, so there's that's slight extra chance of a proc into S3 if she misses using it the first time.
The best substitute is unfortunately Luna (who I don't have either). You can also try some other Boss-HP scaling damage dealers (Teshar, Sigmarus) or wind nukers (Naomi, Aeilene) but I'm not sure how reliable they would be - it could be that they'd work but require crazy high rune quality :/.
hoping i can get my julie and lushen to clear the trash waves and i can use orochi and kro to nuke and dot the boss my runes arent very good so i doubt i have the damage to nuke the boss before he swipes which is where the dots come in XD
That would be awesome if it works, good luck Jake! Just kind of a crazy thought here. And there's a really good shot this won't work, like 75%+ chance it'll fail haha. But it could be worth a try: Use Veremos as the 5th monster in that comp, but make him SUPER slow, like under 120 speed, so that he acts after the crystal defense breaks you but before the boss swipes, to clear the defense break. Again this probably won't work. But when we're being creative, it's the trial and error that guides us :p
@@XennialGamer thanks haha i have been using my Vero less and less since Fran and Loren have been shaping the meta since my return to the game thanks for the reply :ad
@@XennialGamer you are also the first person who hasn't replied with "just get better runes" which I appreciate (I know that's the final answer in the long run but when you spend 1000 crystals on energy refreshes and you don't get a single rune that you can use on anybody it gets frustrating. BUT HEY that's the name of the game XD)
@@jakenator13 Haha the reality is that yes, you'll need better runes. The question isn't do you need them, it's how do you get them. That's how I progressed in the game. I kept trying weird stuff trying to speed up my progress. A lot of it was dumb (especially in retrospect) and some of it was maybe smart but needed better runes, or "worth testing" but didn't work, whatever. The point is, I had fun trying all that stuff, and I learned the game a lot through the process. Runes come with time. And unfortunately, they come with a LOT of time. It's the brilliance and the frustration of SW all wrapped into one. It's frustrating that it takes so long to get good runes and good monsters and everything else. But it's brilliant too: it's why the game is still thriving after 6 years. Because if it was fast and easy to have everything, then there would be no challenge and people would've quit 5 years ago once everyone was equally strong and done progressing (which is what happens to most games of this nature).
@@XennialGamer you make a very good point about playing the long game and not doing everything quickly. I am also returning after about a 3 year break (i was to busy in college to play) but its like i am starting all over again adapting to the new meta which has been a load of fun and helping me make it through all this quarantine stuff
how would you run it without lyn? I considered building a 2nd kro. atm i'm considering a few options have them in order of turns jullie > lushen > loren > kro > sigmarus (idk sig came to mind as a %hp temp. i lack high burst ST) jullie > lushen > loren > sophia > kro jullie > lushen > sophia > kro > aarang (aarang can basically solo the giant if it comes down to it. but would have to build it) jullie > lushen > sophia > sigmarus > kro jullie > lushen > loren > sabrina > talia (somewhat risky if talia dies to a def broken counter. since loren doesn't do enough vs sophia as a backup) jullie > lushen > sophia > sabrina > talia (less risky. sophia is a backup dmg dealer) If someone does find out how 2 sophia works i'd be glad to use that. i'd jullie > lushen > sophia > sophia > kro. but I can't commit that much to sophia without knowing how effective it is atm.
So Loren's got advantages and disadvantages compared to sophia. Advantages are primarily atk bar pushback and fewer hits (less revenge procs on final boss). Disadvantage is lower damage output. I'm not sure I'd run the two together though - that would probably be stable, but I think it would be consistently slow. (Most Loren teams are consistently slow which is actually why I put this together). Since I haven't tested the AI mechanics of a lot of those teams it's hard for me to say what's best. Most look like they'd work, so it comes down to speed and stability. With that said, I've used other Sabrina/Talia teams against the boss and found them to be effective and fairly stable, but definitely slower on average. That's largely due to the unreliable def break, which Sophia would address in your last comp (I prefer that over the Loren one). I do think I tested sabrina/talia when I made my GB10 team and it was slower, but I don't really remember the times now. So I guess I'd say go with Julie->Lushen->Sophia start, and then your choice (or testing) of a combination of "Sabrina+Talia" or 2 of the 3 of Kro, 2A Naomi, and Arang. (I like the wind monsters, easier to rune and attribute advantage).
@@XennialGamer will do. this upcoming FRR i have a lot of testing to do. wasn't here last week so i missed one, and lots of additional runes to mess around with. my current team is lushen, loren, kro, sabrina, talia. It holds my current record of 23 seconds, and averages 28-32 per. occasionally i'll get a 35-40 if lushen derps to hard, and it can fail one every 120ish runs (if lushen derps too much on wave 3, and nobody kills any crystals. the double Aoe plus freezes can kill if rarely. )
@@Kyle-jb7dc Heya Kyle, I'd suggest logging 50-100 runs with your current team. If your average is under 30sec, I'm not sure you'll get that much faster by changing teams - not enough faster to be worth the work anyway. Although if you're runing Julie for the DB10 team, then it may be worth making the transition just to consolidate runes and mons :) FWW - I logged about 400 runs through various tests, and my team (with Lyn) averages about 27sec with a best time in the 23sec range, and a fail rate of around 1%. Though I still believe a second Sophia would shave the average down by 2 seconds and eliminate the fail rate entirely. I can't believe I still haven't drawn one!
@@XennialGamer oh i've logged probably at least 500 with it lol probably closer to a thousand . . . I do agree with you that it's not a necessity. I'm doing it mostly to reduce the lushen requirements so i can use semi throw away set for on my 2nd unskilled lushen (currently arena fluff lushen). Then my primary lushen can be adjusted to a fat lushen for siege. At the moment I can't build a fat lushen without compromising my gb10. I plan to build jullie for siege anyway so it accomplishes multiple things. the only unit i'd have to build that I'm not already would be Sophia. Which is why the curiosity.
@@Kyle-jb7dc Ahh that makes perfect sense. It's actually how I got started making this team in the first place too, freeing up better runes to move to PVP monsters :p! Good luck, and let me know how the team building goes. I plan to update this and the DB10 video in the next month or two, as a lot of people have had a lot of good questions/insights, so anything you learn will be helpful to share!
LOL - yeah I desperately want to build and max a second Sophia for this team even LOL. (Or, better yet, just pull a Luna.. that seems a bit less likely though). As for Sylphs.. don't forget Aschubel, a 4th awesome Sylph since the buff!
Hey Elie, unfortunately I don't have Luna, so I am not super familiar with her mechanics. I understand the basics, but for something that requires such precise speed tuning I recommend watching videos from the people who have tested her, which is Seiishizo first and foremost. Here's a link you can try - he mentions Luna in several of his dungeon videos, I can't remember which one has the most detail, but I skipped forward and saw there was at least some discussion on her in this video: ruclips.net/video/1nruk1oh-4c/видео.html If you need more explanation about speed tuning, check his other GB10 videos as well. At least one of them went into pretty big detail about the speed gap required between Luna and the final DD :). Hope this helps!
@@potatomatop9326 Hehe thanks bro! Yeah I started late it's been a lot of work to try to catch up :p 1-shot the Necro waves is sick. I was able to make my Julie 1-shot GB10 waves, but I needed 10 or 11 fight sets and couldn't make a stable team around her in those sets (I've somehow never gotten a fight CD rune of any quality). Those runes can be buffed with the right gems/grinds down to 6 or 7 fight sets.. but I've got a long ways to go to do Necro 1-shots :p
@@XennialGamer you are amazing man! It took me 1100 days to do all those things lol i bet your julie's gonna 1 shot nb10 1 and 3 very soon. As for me, i'm a bit lost and down cuz i can't make my bastet 99 + 220 with will i'm starting to lose hope lol. Stay op my brother!
@@potatomatop9326 Hehehe well.. I have the benefit of working from home so I can farm ALL DAY :p Also I think the game was a bit easier when I started, having twins and such ;). Can you do Bastet 99+220 in max res for now? Not nearly as good, but it's a nice bridge! (My Bastet is only 99+196 so........... LOL).
Luna would work, that way you can use an LD4 instead of an LD3 :p Sometime soon I want to do an update to this video, and run some testing on alternatives for Lyn. I still genuinely believe that a double-sophia comp would be stronger than using Lyn, not that having 2 skilled up nat4s is any easier. But there may be other alternatives as well. I actually bought an FRR ticket a couple of weeks ago so I could do testing for GB10 and DB10 video updates. I started by updating Shaina, which broke several other monsters.. and somehow that led to a cascade affect and I spent 14 hours doing an FRR on my own monsters instead LOL, never got to the video updates... Maybe not the wisest purchase I've made...
Funny, I actually tested an Arang comp yesterday, though not that specfic one (used Lyn instead of Naomi, otherwise the same). I couldn't do enough damage if Arang derped tho, and my turn cycle was getting thrown off on midboss. And that was with a really strong rune set on Arang. The team definitely worked and was stable - it was just a bit slower on average. With that said, there's a lot of alternative teams out there. My fastest team I think was Lushen Galleon Kro Lyn Lyn... I ran that team for a while and it regularly got lower times than the one in this video. But it also derped more and was slower overall on average...
That's awesoome, congrats Leo!!! :) I used to use a somewhat similar team which is what I set my best time with as well, I only switched to the team with the pierrets because it created greater consistency - but there are definitely a lot of great teams out there if you don't have Sophia :)
@@XennialGamer Yes, I am currently waiting to get Julie to use your db10 team. Thank you very much for your tutorials, they helped me a lot to understand how to improve my times.
@@leovf4230 Good luck, I hope you pull Julie soon!! Remember her S3 will need to be maxxed as well unfortunately though. And you're very welcome, I'm really glad you found them useful :)
Heya Adamus, that's unfortunate to not have any of the 3. One f2p upgrade you might find is using 2A Naomi over Kro though :) Kro hits slightly harder, but Naomi has attribute advantage and brands out of her passive, plus she doesn't need crit rate so shes easy to rune.
I wouldn't call this helping the newbies. Looking at the stats it's not anyone short of someone who is guardian rank's "leftover" runes. Those stats are decent to good and (not) most players leftover runes. That being said you can scale it down quite a lot and be successful.
Agreed this wouldn't be leftover runes at mid-game. But it should definitely be accessible runes for anyone who has started raiding.. and raiding is the real catalyst of the transition from mid to end game. Ofc efficiency is not the only measurement of value, but it provides a good point of reference: the rune sets on this team are largely in the 88-90% efficiency range, while guardian level runes are usually 100%+ and G3 level runes would be more like 115%. And as you mentioned, they could still be scaled down further (particularly the speed, which could be dropped much lower with no change at all to the effectiveness of the team).
Make's me sad how you talk about focus runes, sinse many of my best runes are focus.... Anyway, quality content as aways. And sinse I may get a second accout, I may actualy try to make my dungeons faster so I can farm all of those f2p crystals on 2 accounts. On one f2p account is just no worth the effort, sinse I would just run out of crystals faster lol.
Heh.. yeah I have a few monster focus runes. I even use one on Bastet (broken set). It's just that for pvp units, I prefer stuff that influences the fight more directly than just the monster's stats (will, nemesis, destroy, etc.), so it's nice to be able to use those big focus runes on pve mons instead :)
Yes.. another comment on this video broke the math down perfectly. Sophia's activation rate is 60%, and the boss has 15% res against Max Sophia, so this will work out to about 25% missing armor breaks :p
Thanks Jan. I seriously appreciate that - and yes, it genuinely helps. Seeing the subs and comments is entirely what motivates me to make more videos! :)
I used something similar before changing to this team, had about the same 20 second record and it was safe. But the average time was much slower, too many Lushen derps that could cause 40-50sec runs :p This team has a lower top time, but a much better average time (for me anyway)
Heya adfs. Mid-game is the longest stretch of the game in Summoners War. The rune sets themselves are all below 90% efficiency, and if you remove the unnecessary speed they'd be closer to 85% - that is definitely mid-game, but it's also probably the mid or later stages of mid-game that come after you are raiding regularly. Calling them "mid-mid-game" or "late-mid-game" runes would confuse people tho :p
Finally a SW youtuber who helps the newbies and not just poping up "Arena, GW Fights"...
Keep the awesome work Xen, the for the guides
Thanks Acnaros, I really appreciate that!! I'll keep working on guides for sure :) And if you ever have specific things you want to see, please let me know in comments (I've got a large list working, but keep track of every idea I think I can do).
Mid game runes... hahaha not... early late game to mid late game.... if he was helping noobs he would have done midgame runes..
@@JustFacts42 Mid-mid to late-mid probably. Tho definitely not a team for early-gamers! Most of the runes I'm using are above the level that's needed for the team. Only Julie truly has that minimum damage threshold, and all the monsters could be 40 speed slower. By the time someone is doing r5 regularly, they should be able to make this team work
@@XennialGamer if your doing r5 regularly your late game as everything is on speed farm and your prepping serious rta... how do noobs know this better
@@JustFacts42 There's no clear definition of early/mid/late game, and I certainly respect yours :) But what you explained is my exact definition of the line between mid-mid and late-mid, except for the RTA part which would come WAY after the rest of what you said. One important thing tho - you don't have to jump straight to r5. Raiding provides 20% of a runes value, and the drops in R3 may be a little lower but work just as well and are very attainable at earlier stages of the game. Starting to raid as you enter mid-game will speed your pace up a TOOOON. Imo it's better to have 20 excellently runed mons than 60 poorly runed ones.
Great video, love your content and you thoroughly explain everything while showing how you got there with the optimizer. Will be building this when my Jule is finished!
Woot - thanks Austin, and good luck with the team building!! :)
Discovered your channel yesterday, just subbed. I have to say, it's a case of #feelsbadman when I'm running sub 1 minute dungeons, score SSS on wind/fire/water rift beast, clear toah most months (can't beat artamiel at floor 80), then to see this video with 'mid-game runes' that's better than anything I have.
Heya M Leet, glad you found the channel and subbed!
To be fair - mid-game is the longest stretch of the game. These are like "later mid game runes." Also all you need is the damage output, not the speed - it's just that the runes I had had some extra speed. The average sets in that video are around 90% efficiency, and would be fine if the efficiency was even lower (i.e. if they had no speed) so it isn't that high for fully gemmed and grinded runes. It's just that the stats syngerized well :)
Excellent content!
Thanks ti titi!! I really appreciate that!
Thanks for the video. It was really informative!
I am more of a casual, not knowing as much about the ingame mechanics as you guys do, so I just kinda snipe teams and also try to build them. Worked on BJ5 so now I can try to get stable faster Cairos teams. Thx for the tips, will check out your other videos too.
Awesome comment Data, I appreciate it :) Good luck with the team building! I've got a video with the 7 most common mistakes for BJR5 too, if you happen to still be working on that team. Feel free to drop any questions in the comments of any video, any time ;)
Great work mate. Hopefully, this vid could improve my acc quite a lot. Cheers.
Thank you sir, good luck I hope it helps! :)
Really liked the guidance on the optimizer.
Thanks Remi :) I've done several videos that were more in-depth with the optimizer (each focusing on different things). The thumbnails on them are awful thoguh and they tend to get overlooked hehe. Optimizer thumbnails are hard - there's no real image to make people think of them.
Anyway, you may enjoy this video: ruclips.net/video/MYmWL4T4Rzs/видео.html
Assuming my math is correct (not my strong point), Sophia with 85% accuracy will Def Break the mid boss just over 97% of the time. This compares to an 85% accuracy Loren skill 1 95% and skill 2 87% successful Def Break. Of course Sophia will likely do more damage than Loren on the same runes as well, plus has elemental advantage to to help survive the odd boss hit. Sophia is the far superior choice in both theory and thanks to your video, in practice too.
Man really nice analysis. That's pretty cool, I feel like you did a better breakdown than I did haha. But yeah you nailed all the key points! The one other point to add - if the midboss/boss drop to below 30% health before Lyn goes, then Lyn will use her S3 100% of the time. So Sophia's damage also works to increase the frequency of Lyn using S3.
To be fair: Loren's main advantage is the atk bar pushback - the Loren team will pretty much never fail because the Boss never gets his AOE attack. This Sophia team fails between 0.5 and 1.0% of the time. But (for me personally) saving 10-15seconds on average is worth the 1-in-100+ fail rate :)
I won't discuss the damage aspect as you covered that pretty well. i will cover the landing def breaks though. The important thing to know is that first an activation check is done and then if activated a resistance check.
30% activation with full skillups for Sophia S3, 70% not to activate
odds of just not activating 5 times in a row is then 70%*70%*70%*70%*70% which is roughly 16.8% chance to never even activate not even worrying about times it activates and resists.
P(A) = 0.3, P(~A) = 0.7, P(A and R) = 0.045, P(A and ~R) = 0.255
the overall math would follow...
P(~A)**5 * nCr(5,0) +
P(~A)**4 * P(A and R)**1 * nCr(5,1) +
P(~A)**3 * P(A and R)**2 * nCr(5,2) +
P(~A)**2 * P(A and R)**3 * nCr(5,3) +
P(~A)**1 * P(A and R)**4 * nCr(5,4) +
P(~A)**0 * P(A and R)**5 * nCr(5,5)
using combinations nCr and probability of not activating and resistance given activation the final results are about 22.95% chance to never get a defense break due to resistance or not activating.
@@stephensimpson7794 So.. we have to start here by saying that you're completely right, Sophia is not 100% activation on her S2, thus my math was WAY off. However, I just double checked, she's actually 60%, so the true rate is even lower than noted above. This was a really valuable catch on your part / oversight on mine, thank you for that!
Also thank you for what was one of the most detailed and in-depth comments I've received on any video. I personally found it useful (not the least of which because it caught a mistake I made), but also really appreciated the time and thought that went into it!
Great work 👍👍
Thank you so much 😀
well done, keep it up with guides.
Thanks Rick!!!
never heard of this rune optimizer, looks nice.
Ace has a great video on how to install it: ruclips.net/video/mC0IfGJS6MM/видео.html
I have nearly all units used besides sophia and lushen, im waiting for lushen in rotation
Sophia is a key for this team, but Lushen opens up a LOT of other team options for you too, all of which are good. Good luck - hope he comes up in rotation soon (I haven't checked, is he scheduled yet?)
@@XennialGamer should be around in two weeks
@@kenpachifriedchicken5087 Awesome, good luck!! :)
@@XennialGamer i got lushen from the stones yay
@@kenpachifriedchicken5087 Gzzzz!!! Super happy for you :) Remember you can skill him up with JoJo fusions too!
Hey great content! Any plans to do Toa guides? Thx
Thanks James!! Had kind of been thinking that there's a lot of TOA stuff out there already, but I'm definitely open to the idea. I'll take a look around and see if I can do something that's unique/new :) If you have any suggestions / requests, please let me know also!
Who can I replace Lyn with? Sig maybe?
Luna is the best of course, but if you don't have Lyn probably don't have Luna. You can try Sig, Kro, or Naomi - but in all of those cases it raises the rune quality requirements for everyone but Julie. So if you aren't able to get the rune quality high enough to be stable, you might also try (in this turn order): Lushen(L), Galleon, Sabrina, Naomi or Kro, Talia. That team ran 20-21s best times for me (faster than the Julie team), though the average time was slower.
I finally got all the runes and skill ups for this team so I'm gonna do my best
Good luck Reiner!!! I hope it rocks for you!
does the wind julie need to be max skilled for her to s3 the midboss and main boss?
Unfortunately yes, you'll need to have S3 max on both Julie and Sophia (the wind one).
Xennial Gaming okeydoke! Time to hit the guild shop. Thanks for reply
@@Wampa0ne Anytime - good luck getting the skillups!!
hey me again :D
just out of curiousity what is the point of bringing lushen for the final clear when his initial intend to solo clear no longer is necessary?
would it not be better to bring in a abigail for additional defense break options on the giants (especially the mid boss with its insane resistance stats)?
:p
It's an interesting thought. Kind of the same as I mentioned in Dragons, I went with Lushen to control turn order and cooldown cycling. Abigail's attacks will be random and may not clear the wave, which can result in Julie getting hit (affecting S3) or Sophia taking a 2nd turn (affecting cooldown cycling). The biggest thing here tho is that all of those are Nat5s. Lushen is something almost everyone has built and skilled, which makes it an easily repeatable team :p
With that said, there's likely options beyond Lushen that could be effective. It would have to involve an AOE defense break to be an appreciable upgrade. Ethna does that for example, if her damage could be forced high enough to clear the wave. But the AOE is on her S2, so the AI may not be forced to use it. It would also result in turn cycling and she only has a 2 turn CD, so I don't know if there would be enough consistency.
Teshar might do more damage to the boss, but since he would be acting before the def break it wouldn't be significant. Savannah has an AOE def break but it's a 5 turn CD, etc.
@@XennialGamer If Julie goes first, Abigail will use her S3 to clear the rest of the wave. And to do that she has alot less rune-requirement than Lushen.
in theory Lushen has 0 rune requirement to finish waves but that would be a complete waste.
The only upside here would be the fact that Lushen has more easily accessable skillups through Jojo fusion.
However the additional value she brings into the team, compared to Lushen, especially in Necro and Dragons can make a major difference for people that can not safely breach the 148 speed requirement on the slowest unit for safeclearing all dungeons.
hey xennial i have a maxed dark harpy so i was wonder if she's good for a reliable giants b10 speed team
She's good for top speed records but not super reliable. Her AI isn't the smartest unfortunately, and her damage is too low so she has to serve as both defense breaker and brander.
I am torn because If I use the event I could copy this same team. But I have a GB10 team 45-55 secs. But I was also thinking, I need to make my DB10 and NB10 Teams better and faster.. I have Talia, And Deva. If I was to use the event to get a twin. I am not sure what twin I want. and suggestions???
Heya Rodrigo - if you're happy with your GB10 times then it's not essential to make them faster. Especially if you're f2p or close to it, and don't mind spending the time to use your energy. Definitely completing a twins set is more important - I'd take Sabrina, because Sabrina+Talia is awesome in a lot of areas, including all Caiross dungeons and rifts. In the end you'll get way more upgrades that way :)
(PS: Shaina is a little more useful than Sabrina, but Shaving 3 Chakrams without Talia is a waste - Sabrina lets you use both Talia and Deva!)
@@XennialGamer Thank you for replying back so fast.. I slept on it before choosing. And I was thinking the same thing. And I chose Sabrina. I really enjoy your content.
Can i substitute the Lyn with an Arang or Naomi?
I would think you could substitute with Arang more easily than Naomi. In both cases you might have a slightly higher rune requirement, I'm not positive. Or possibly substitute Sophia with Loren and then Lyn with Arang, to control the bosses attack more. It'll be slower but should work :)
Why so high accuracy? Isn't there a cap on 45 % or something?
For GB10, the mid-boss has like 160 resistance. Obviously 100 is the max, so it just counts as 100. That means you need 85% accuracy to minimize the odds of it resisting you. If Sophia doesn't def break mid-boss, the run goes very slow, and can even potentially fail. The rest of the monsters are lower res - I forget the exact, I think final boss is 60%, which means that you'd need the 45% you mentioned. But the mid-boss is the key to the whole team, so you want Sophia at 85%+ :).
I’ve had Sophia ready to 6* for a while. Now I will do just that and get loren out of the team.
Awesome, let me know how it goes! :)
Hi, do sophia and julie need to full skill on this team? Tysm
Their S3s need to be max, the others don't matter. Crossing my fingers that that helps you make it hehe
Any idea..how can summoners get Lyn?..
Sadly you just have to wait and eventually get lucky. And if you're F2P it takes longer, and especially if you're a newer player when there are so many different priorities :(
But you may want to check out this video by Ace, too: ruclips.net/video/-AnlAP4qzdQ/видео.html
I actually got my giants team to 29sec using Lushen (L), Galleon, Sigmarus, Laika, Lyn. Laika is nice as he can finish off the giant on his own assuming he does not get chain stunned.
LOL kinda crazy using Laika, but it makes sense too. I wonder if Garo would work under the same premise - seems like he actually might...
@@XennialGamer Laika does some nice big damage on the mid boss and giant with his S2.
Wait.. if the enemie is bellow 70% hp lyn does the 3rd skill 100%?
Unfortunately no, if the enemy is below 30% she will do 100% 3rd skill :/
Do you think arang with her s3 could fill the role of a second def breaker/big dmg for boss.
Arang is a very effective GB10 monster, but I'm not sure she'd work in this team. Not enough negative affects for her S3 to scale off of, and not a reliable enough AI. She works better in more traditional lushen teams, or maybe with a loren-type team
Can Sabrina and Talia be a replace for kro and Lyn?
Heya Toze, yes they should be able to work as a replacement. Talia's AI is unreliable, so the average time is a bit slower, and you MAY need the monsters to be a little bit tankier to survive consistently (I'm not sure). But the Julie/Lushen/Sophia combo will definitely work with just 2 nukers after them :) Luna is awesome there too. The main thing is, you must have enough damage to clear the midboss in 1 rotation of the 5 monsters to keep the turn cooldowns in sequence.
OK xennial thanks a lot. 😄Keep good work
Sabrina and Talia will proc the counter attack which may prove a danger to the run if you do not kill the giant quick enough.
What if you don't have sophia, what other monster that good def break, i remember i have sophia but i feed it, I'm so dumb
This team kind of needs Sophia to be stable. Without her, you could try something like Julie, Lushen, Sabrina, Lyn, Talia (that attack order) maybe, though I haven't tested that comp. Or perhaps Galleon, Lushen, Sabrina, Lyn, Talia (in that order)
@@XennialGamer i have luna already, what is the spd req for dungeons without max tower
@@XennialGamer I'll use luna, i don't have lyn, and talia will be the last one to move?
@@eljonbacongco4186 Luna should work nicely in place of Lyn (I don't have Luna - want to trade? haha). Yeah you'll always want Talia to move last, because her damage increases if the boss is below 50% health. According to the wiki, the fastest monster in DB10 is 135 speed. So you'd need a "combat speed" of 135.01+ with your slowest monster to move ahead of the boss.
To calculate combat speed, take the monsters BASE speed, multiply by speed tower %, then if using a speed lead, separately multiply by speed lead %, then add that to current speed.
Example: Monster has base speed of 103. Speed tower is 11%, and speed lead is 24%.
103*11% = 11.33
103*24% = 24.72
Runes are +91 speed
Combat speed = 103 + 91 + 11.33 + 24.72 = 230.05.
However, I believe that Luna needs a "speed gap" between herself and the monster either in front or behind her. Since I don't have Luna, I'm not sure the exact mechanics, but Seiishizo has a great video that explains the speed tuning. I can't remember which video, but it was one of the GB10 or DB10 videos. Just skim through them until you see the one where he's using Luna, he explains it in great detail: ruclips.net/user/Seiishizovideos?view=0&sort=dd&flow=grid
@@XennialGamer wow thanks a lot, btw I'm a f2p and got lucky to pull luna haha, need to skill her up
Is there any way to get the min stat requirements? Started new guild and would love to give team to guild.
I'm planning to go back through and try to test for the minimum stats a bit on DB10 and GB10. But finding the time has been tough, it's a long process :p And it's a little tricky for me to do, because these are generally my lowest efficiency runes already (obviously tons of damage output of course, not saying bad runes - just that most of my runes are gemmed/grinded).
Anyway - message me on Discord, XennialGamer#4428, and I can give you the rough guidelines of where I think they are. It won't be exact since I haven't tested for the bottom yet, but I can give you a starting point.
I’m totally going to build this now lol. Just found it weird how my Necro and dragon teams are 100% but my giant’s is 95%
Heya Cosmic, this is an old video from before the B12s. Keep in mind that this team is for GB10 :)
@@XennialGamer haha okiedokie just helping my friend build his team because he has the exact same monsters as yours
I've found that my Lyn is consistently not using her S3 for db10, do you have an idea why that may be ?
Yeah the Lyn AI is unfortunately not great. Very few monsters have a fully reliable AI. The only way to "force" Lyn to use her S3 is to get the boss below 30% health before Lyn's turn, which requires a super high rune quality. But the only monster I know of that can replace her and have 100% AI is Luna, which is an LD4 that most people (including me) don't have. That's why I put my Lyns on violent, so there's that's slight extra chance of a proc into S3 if she misses using it the first time.
any substitutes for lyn?
The best substitute is unfortunately Luna (who I don't have either). You can also try some other Boss-HP scaling damage dealers (Teshar, Sigmarus) or wind nukers (Naomi, Aeilene) but I'm not sure how reliable they would be - it could be that they'd work but require crazy high rune quality :/.
hoping i can get my julie and lushen to clear the trash waves and i can use orochi and kro to nuke and dot the boss my runes arent very good so i doubt i have the damage to nuke the boss before he swipes which is where the dots come in XD
That would be awesome if it works, good luck Jake! Just kind of a crazy thought here. And there's a really good shot this won't work, like 75%+ chance it'll fail haha. But it could be worth a try: Use Veremos as the 5th monster in that comp, but make him SUPER slow, like under 120 speed, so that he acts after the crystal defense breaks you but before the boss swipes, to clear the defense break.
Again this probably won't work. But when we're being creative, it's the trial and error that guides us :p
@@XennialGamer thanks haha i have been using my Vero less and less since Fran and Loren have been shaping the meta since my return to the game thanks for the reply :ad
@@XennialGamer you are also the first person who hasn't replied with "just get better runes" which I appreciate (I know that's the final answer in the long run but when you spend 1000 crystals on energy refreshes and you don't get a single rune that you can use on anybody it gets frustrating. BUT HEY that's the name of the game XD)
@@jakenator13 Haha the reality is that yes, you'll need better runes. The question isn't do you need them, it's how do you get them. That's how I progressed in the game. I kept trying weird stuff trying to speed up my progress. A lot of it was dumb (especially in retrospect) and some of it was maybe smart but needed better runes, or "worth testing" but didn't work, whatever. The point is, I had fun trying all that stuff, and I learned the game a lot through the process.
Runes come with time. And unfortunately, they come with a LOT of time. It's the brilliance and the frustration of SW all wrapped into one. It's frustrating that it takes so long to get good runes and good monsters and everything else. But it's brilliant too: it's why the game is still thriving after 6 years. Because if it was fast and easy to have everything, then there would be no challenge and people would've quit 5 years ago once everyone was equally strong and done progressing (which is what happens to most games of this nature).
@@XennialGamer you make a very good point about playing the long game and not doing everything quickly. I am also returning after about a 3 year break (i was to busy in college to play) but its like i am starting all over again adapting to the new meta which has been a load of fun and helping me make it through all this quarantine stuff
how would you run it without lyn? I considered building a 2nd kro.
atm i'm considering a few options
have them in order of turns
jullie > lushen > loren > kro > sigmarus (idk sig came to mind as a %hp temp. i lack high burst ST)
jullie > lushen > loren > sophia > kro
jullie > lushen > sophia > kro > aarang (aarang can basically solo the giant if it comes down to it. but would have to build it)
jullie > lushen > sophia > sigmarus > kro
jullie > lushen > loren > sabrina > talia (somewhat risky if talia dies to a def broken counter. since loren doesn't do enough vs sophia as a backup)
jullie > lushen > sophia > sabrina > talia (less risky. sophia is a backup dmg dealer)
If someone does find out how 2 sophia works i'd be glad to use that. i'd jullie > lushen > sophia > sophia > kro. but I can't commit that much to sophia without knowing how effective it is atm.
So Loren's got advantages and disadvantages compared to sophia. Advantages are primarily atk bar pushback and fewer hits (less revenge procs on final boss). Disadvantage is lower damage output. I'm not sure I'd run the two together though - that would probably be stable, but I think it would be consistently slow. (Most Loren teams are consistently slow which is actually why I put this together).
Since I haven't tested the AI mechanics of a lot of those teams it's hard for me to say what's best. Most look like they'd work, so it comes down to speed and stability.
With that said, I've used other Sabrina/Talia teams against the boss and found them to be effective and fairly stable, but definitely slower on average. That's largely due to the unreliable def break, which Sophia would address in your last comp (I prefer that over the Loren one). I do think I tested sabrina/talia when I made my GB10 team and it was slower, but I don't really remember the times now.
So I guess I'd say go with Julie->Lushen->Sophia start, and then your choice (or testing) of a combination of "Sabrina+Talia" or 2 of the 3 of Kro, 2A Naomi, and Arang. (I like the wind monsters, easier to rune and attribute advantage).
@@XennialGamer will do. this upcoming FRR i have a lot of testing to do. wasn't here last week so i missed one, and lots of additional runes to mess around with.
my current team is lushen, loren, kro, sabrina, talia. It holds my current record of 23 seconds, and averages 28-32 per. occasionally i'll get a 35-40 if lushen derps to hard, and it can fail one every 120ish runs (if lushen derps too much on wave 3, and nobody kills any crystals. the double Aoe plus freezes can kill if rarely. )
@@Kyle-jb7dc Heya Kyle, I'd suggest logging 50-100 runs with your current team. If your average is under 30sec, I'm not sure you'll get that much faster by changing teams - not enough faster to be worth the work anyway. Although if you're runing Julie for the DB10 team, then it may be worth making the transition just to consolidate runes and mons :)
FWW - I logged about 400 runs through various tests, and my team (with Lyn) averages about 27sec with a best time in the 23sec range, and a fail rate of around 1%. Though I still believe a second Sophia would shave the average down by 2 seconds and eliminate the fail rate entirely. I can't believe I still haven't drawn one!
@@XennialGamer oh i've logged probably at least 500 with it lol probably closer to a thousand . . . I do agree with you that it's not a necessity. I'm doing it mostly to reduce the lushen requirements so i can use semi throw away set for on my 2nd unskilled lushen (currently arena fluff lushen). Then my primary lushen can be adjusted to a fat lushen for siege. At the moment I can't build a fat lushen without compromising my gb10. I plan to build jullie for siege anyway so it accomplishes multiple things. the only unit i'd have to build that I'm not already would be Sophia. Which is why the curiosity.
@@Kyle-jb7dc Ahh that makes perfect sense. It's actually how I got started making this team in the first place too, freeing up better runes to move to PVP monsters :p!
Good luck, and let me know how the team building goes. I plan to update this and the DB10 video in the next month or two, as a lot of people have had a lot of good questions/insights, so anything you learn will be helpful to share!
God, now both the pierret family and the sylph family are good enough to build all 3. ran out of skillups for sophia :(
LOL - yeah I desperately want to build and max a second Sophia for this team even LOL. (Or, better yet, just pull a Luna.. that seems a bit less likely though). As for Sylphs.. don't forget Aschubel, a 4th awesome Sylph since the buff!
Xenial can you help me how double turn Luna ?
Hey Elie, unfortunately I don't have Luna, so I am not super familiar with her mechanics. I understand the basics, but for something that requires such precise speed tuning I recommend watching videos from the people who have tested her, which is Seiishizo first and foremost. Here's a link you can try - he mentions Luna in several of his dungeon videos, I can't remember which one has the most detail, but I skipped forward and saw there was at least some discussion on her in this video:
ruclips.net/video/1nruk1oh-4c/видео.html
If you need more explanation about speed tuning, check his other GB10 videos as well. At least one of them went into pretty big detail about the speed gap required between Luna and the final DD :).
Hope this helps!
Almost same team!
Julie sophia luna luna abigail.
Double Luna. RIP. Man I wish I had Luna ;).. Nice rune quality to 1-shot the waves with Julie BTW!
@@XennialGamer thanks bro! Julie can also 1 shot waves 1 and 3 of nb10. Julie sophia luna eva and abigail. You op for 500 days bro!
@@potatomatop9326 Hehe thanks bro! Yeah I started late it's been a lot of work to try to catch up :p 1-shot the Necro waves is sick. I was able to make my Julie 1-shot GB10 waves, but I needed 10 or 11 fight sets and couldn't make a stable team around her in those sets (I've somehow never gotten a fight CD rune of any quality). Those runes can be buffed with the right gems/grinds down to 6 or 7 fight sets.. but I've got a long ways to go to do Necro 1-shots :p
@@XennialGamer you are amazing man! It took me 1100 days to do all those things lol i bet your julie's gonna 1 shot nb10 1 and 3 very soon. As for me, i'm a bit lost and down cuz i can't make my bastet 99 + 220 with will i'm starting to lose hope lol. Stay op my brother!
@@potatomatop9326 Hehehe well.. I have the benefit of working from home so I can farm ALL DAY :p Also I think the game was a bit easier when I started, having twins and such ;). Can you do Bastet 99+220 in max res for now? Not nearly as good, but it's a nice bridge! (My Bastet is only 99+196 so........... LOL).
as always all you have to do summon lyn. like i can choose witch ld3 ill get after 3 years of playing this game...
Luna would work, that way you can use an LD4 instead of an LD3 :p
Sometime soon I want to do an update to this video, and run some testing on alternatives for Lyn. I still genuinely believe that a double-sophia comp would be stronger than using Lyn, not that having 2 skilled up nat4s is any easier. But there may be other alternatives as well.
I actually bought an FRR ticket a couple of weeks ago so I could do testing for GB10 and DB10 video updates. I started by updating Shaina, which broke several other monsters.. and somehow that led to a cascade affect and I spent 14 hours doing an FRR on my own monsters instead LOL, never got to the video updates...
Maybe not the wisest purchase I've made...
Arang ( L) / julie / lushen / Naomi / Sophia ( not better ? )
Funny, I actually tested an Arang comp yesterday, though not that specfic one (used Lyn instead of Naomi, otherwise the same). I couldn't do enough damage if Arang derped tho, and my turn cycle was getting thrown off on midboss. And that was with a really strong rune set on Arang.
The team definitely worked and was stable - it was just a bit slower on average.
With that said, there's a lot of alternative teams out there. My fastest team I think was Lushen Galleon Kro Lyn Lyn... I ran that team for a while and it regularly got lower times than the one in this video. But it also derped more and was slower overall on average...
Hi i actually got 22sec with lushen loren kro lyn naomi i dont have pirriets and my towers are lvl 5
That's awesoome, congrats Leo!!! :) I used to use a somewhat similar team which is what I set my best time with as well, I only switched to the team with the pierrets because it created greater consistency - but there are definitely a lot of great teams out there if you don't have Sophia :)
@@XennialGamer
Yes, I am currently waiting to get Julie to use your db10 team.
Thank you very much for your tutorials, they helped me a lot to understand how to improve my times.
@@leovf4230 Good luck, I hope you pull Julie soon!! Remember her S3 will need to be maxxed as well unfortunately though. And you're very welcome, I'm really glad you found them useful :)
I dont have lynn , sophia, and julie. My team is Lushen, sig, fran, loren, and kro sadly, the best time I can do is 45secs
Heya Adamus, that's unfortunate to not have any of the 3. One f2p upgrade you might find is using 2A Naomi over Kro though :) Kro hits slightly harder, but Naomi has attribute advantage and brands out of her passive, plus she doesn't need crit rate so shes easy to rune.
I wouldn't call this helping the newbies. Looking at the stats it's not anyone short of someone who is guardian rank's "leftover" runes. Those stats are decent to good and (not) most players leftover runes. That being said you can scale it down quite a lot and be successful.
Agreed this wouldn't be leftover runes at mid-game. But it should definitely be accessible runes for anyone who has started raiding.. and raiding is the real catalyst of the transition from mid to end game.
Ofc efficiency is not the only measurement of value, but it provides a good point of reference: the rune sets on this team are largely in the 88-90% efficiency range, while guardian level runes are usually 100%+ and G3 level runes would be more like 115%. And as you mentioned, they could still be scaled down further (particularly the speed, which could be dropped much lower with no change at all to the effectiveness of the team).
good
Thanks! :)
Make's me sad how you talk about focus runes, sinse many of my best runes are focus....
Anyway, quality content as aways. And sinse I may get a second accout, I may actualy try to make my dungeons faster so I can farm all of those f2p crystals on 2 accounts. On one f2p account is just no worth the effort, sinse I would just run out of crystals faster lol.
Heh.. yeah I have a few monster focus runes. I even use one on Bastet (broken set). It's just that for pvp units, I prefer stuff that influences the fight more directly than just the monster's stats (will, nemesis, destroy, etc.), so it's nice to be able to use those big focus runes on pve mons instead :)
Mhh.. my julie has 98 cr and bether CD and atk and lushen durps sometimes because julie just crits 1 time or something xD
What might be happening is Julie kills some monsters while leaving others over 30%?
20% of the time there is no armor break.. is this normal? xd
Yes.. another comment on this video broke the math down perfectly. Sophia's activation rate is 60%, and the boss has 15% res against Max Sophia, so this will work out to about 25% missing armor breaks :p
:( can't do it either but pulled a lushen
Aww... yeah this is more of a comp for mid-game, or late-midgame. But gz on the Lushen, he's a huge step forward towards your first speed team!
I think the content you put out is great! Keep up the good work. Hit the subscribe button and liked the video. Hope it helps!
Thanks Jan. I seriously appreciate that - and yes, it genuinely helps. Seeing the subs and comments is entirely what motivates me to make more videos! :)
only if we had lyn
I use Loren, lushen, sig, kro, Lynn. 21 sec record. 100% safe
I used something similar before changing to this team, had about the same 20 second record and it was safe. But the average time was much slower, too many Lushen derps that could cause 40-50sec runs :p This team has a lower top time, but a much better average time (for me anyway)
Don't have lushen, water Pierrette nor light Amazon :D
Aww - I hope you pull Lushen especially, and Julie soon!
julie and sophia are effective with full health... works well with chasun..
like for you dog
Thanks darck!! :)
this runes not a mid game
Heya adfs. Mid-game is the longest stretch of the game in Summoners War. The rune sets themselves are all below 90% efficiency, and if you remove the unnecessary speed they'd be closer to 85% - that is definitely mid-game, but it's also probably the mid or later stages of mid-game that come after you are raiding regularly. Calling them "mid-mid-game" or "late-mid-game" runes would confuse people tho :p