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How to play Tyranids in 9th edition - Tips from 40k Playtesters
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- Опубликовано: 11 июл 2020
- Learn the new tricks and tactics you will need to play Tyranids in 9th edition from a team that has been playtesting the game for months. We take you through all the biggest nerfs and buffs to the Tyranids army along with the core strategies and thoughts on list creation.
Don't miss all our other 9th edition launch coverage including battle reports and tactics videos covering nearly all factions in the game.
1:25 "they are really good at holding the board!"
9:50 "this army suffers from multiple turns of shooting."
Essentially, nids went from bugs you saw in starship troopers, to bugs you saw from a bugs life.
Jokes on you, flick and his friends won that fight
i dont mean to be off topic but does any of you know a method to get back into an instagram account?
I was stupid forgot the password. I appreciate any assistance you can give me.
@Turner Everett Instablaster ;)
Lore:tyranids are the most terrifying and destructive species that even chaos and necrons are scared and lot of factions have to team up to defeat them
Tabletop:a 500 point space marines list can kill a 2000 point nid list and the marines only lose 2 squads
To be fair. That IS how it works in the lore... So I guess Nids should just be allowed to take twice as many points? Seeing how they always outnumber everyone except the orks.
@@Cha-Khia Then just half the points cost of the nids.
even tau suffer if they dont spam their big mecha like ritptide...
I have seen 1000points of 9edition space marine dab on 2k point of eldar or tau
Thing is the "holding power" they were talking about kind of fits with Nids lore. They send waves and waves of bodies into their foes to just outnumber them. Unfortunately the game can't reflect that accurately so winning the objective by just surviving long enough for "a second wave" of nids to come kind of fits.
@@nickwoollon9855 holdings power as in holding objectives. All the time tyranids are an invading force that should need to survive against there enemy,there enemies should have to survive agility them true horde fashion
It’s really refreshing to watch a video about Nids that isn’t so pessimistic, thanks
"out hold your opponent" ... that feels so anti-tyranid for a species 100% build around invasion. I hope there's a codex adjustment.
This. I hate playing the objective game with nids. The last years of Tyranid play have been gettin ahead on points in the early game and getting tabled turn 4 because no staying power, lose by a landslide. 9th ed looks to be more of the same. Rush to the objectives with fragile troops, stand there while your MC's can't kill anything, get annihilated. Fun times.
And as a slow player, I hate to hear it will become an even slower army to play. I'm thinking shelfing my nids and quitting the hobby.
@@vaettra1589 I feel pretty much the same way.
I'm sure GW said that armies would Recieve their own secondaries so this is kind of coming..?
@@fluffcrunchmini4572 Believe it when I see it. It could help but you are limited to how much you can score via secondaries.
I just saw that Striking Scorpion gave out all the point costs, it was helpful to see that marines are going to be paying through the nose to field a battalion. That might help with the small claustrophobic board with cluttered LOS blocking terrain.
Maybe, just maybe some armies won't be utterly shot off the table when tactical doctrine rolls around.
@@fluffcrunchmini4572 not sure how a secondary will change playstyle. "You know that castle that will table you in a round if you charge? Free points if you don't wipe this turn!"
Summary: Two units are good. Biovores are good for move-blocking with their bad shots (don't expect to kill things), and the Zoanthropes are good at soaking up damage. Nothing else can survive while sitting on objectives, and nothing is strong enough to push enemies off objectives. Your main hope is to take a skew list of max models to try an unsatisfying win, but even that isn't likely.
Yay.
Considering all the other "tips from playtesters" so far have been actually exciting things that the armies can do, this makes me terrified. And I think GSC takes things even worse. What's that video going to be? "Ridgerunners plus an Alpha Biker is strong and can survive for a while, but you need to just take a ton of models, hope your opponent has minimal blast weapons, and not actually play the game in order to win."?
Best way to play Tyranids in 9th, after last Firstborn SM buff announcement? Well:
-put them on the shelf
-cover them with a light cover to prevent dust or into a closed buffet
-wait for codex to see if they'll buff them anywhere next to playable against actual SM level
(optional)- depress meanwhile, prepare a rope if they don't do anything special once codex out.
(Alternative to all above) -get the feeling SM will never ever be a bad army and just begin one.
Enjoy your day :)
PS: apply to any non-SM army :)
As a nids player, this edition is honestly depressing
You can tell Cruddace got his hands on 9th as well
One way to keep the moral is to look at the chaos daemons codex. 8th has been terrible for them but it will be worst in 9th ^^'
@@jean-philippehaufroid6425 chaos daemons got far more legwork than nids did
desperately need a new codex. RIght now the models are too expensive for what they offer and even with a rebalance, how they are being asked to play is sad.
@@Zach0451 I see you have never open their codex.
some of their rules doesn't work, their more iconic unit are whiper of the table after 1 turn, They are almost a only melee army, you can't take different daemon in the same dettachement (forcing you too have multiple detachement), they must be in big number to achieve anything, the different gods are terribly balance between them, their power and stratagèmes are divided in 4 different faction, ...
You can try to win in some tournament with the tyranid. That's why people are still using them. You can't with daemons.
They have no legwork. They are paraplegic.
@@jean-philippehaufroid6425 if you think you can win Anything with Nids I'd really encourage you to try.
I wish the Games Workshop (GW) team would show a bit more creativity when it comes to Tyranids (bugs). The goals of a bug player should be completely different from thier opponents.
"Capture and hold?" "Seize objectives?" How about EAT EVERYTHING!!! and a few more.
They should add points for destroyed units in melee
I live in fear now of that new Primaris hammerfall drop turret. The one with deep strike, 72” S6 heavy *2D6* blast superfrag missiles, getting automatic 12 shots thanks to the new blast rule, and 8 heavy bolters. I’m pretty sure a marine player could deep strike one of those in my path and obliterate nearly my whole army.
Feels bad man, that I have to worry about getting tabled by an inanimate building.
So you mean, when he fires His high strengt weapons into a unit with very cheap T3 models?
Some of whom are likely to survive and give a very small target to further invaluate any more shots allocated to the unit?
Sure, I'm shivering in fear.
We don't know ots 8 heavy bolters as it is an array. It is likely 2-3 of them overall
@@Gnarlf the fucking thing has heavy flamers. the deepstrike will guarantee your swarms get instantly deleted if they come within the area of the bunker. its stupidly OP area denial
12 shots into 300 termagants... that gonna take a while.
@@notaninquisitor7274 The real threat are the 8 heavy bolters. We don't know if they are "standard" heavy bolter and what is the BS but the rule leaked for them is terrifying for a tyranid player: you shoot with them multiple times until all the target within range and sight have been shot at.
If Biovore keep "Infantry" keyword, move them before shootin' to "miss" easier.
Them: "Probably best at holding the middle of the board"
Me: oooh so like every army u have covered so far?
The sad part is that it is so true, that the secondary to attack on all fronts is actually hard for nids to accomplish.
I've watched at least 10 nid batreps for 9th and nids haven't won a single one. Im very worried for them
MWG Nids vs Space Wolfes
It think they won. Close but still a win.
Nah space wolfs won that one it was so close though. I thought the nids had won till the points were added up
It was a crap wolves list too
@@etherealhawk it's not like the nids list was competitive
Please, I just got into the game and bought like $600 worth of Tyranids
Bro, you missed out on 8th Nids. Honestly best edition I have played with, truly a swarm worth fearing.
Nothing is stopping from playing 8th edition. Unless you are only looking to play competitively. My friends and I play for the fun not tournaments. We decided to only play 8th edition, at least until GW has updated most or all of the army codexes and rules. So it may be a couple years until we pick up 9th edition rules.
Christopher Plummer sure I don’t plan on going competitive but I don’t want to get my ass kicked casually either
John .W I’ve done well in 8th
@John .W - if you're new to the game you're going to get your ass kicked. BUT!! Learn and adapt, just like the Hive Mind. I got my butt whooped so bad by friends in 6th and 7th... But because I adapted and almost never played the same thing twice (unlike my marine buddy who was 1-trick pony) I ended up surprising them a lot and winning even in 7th edition. Best advice: Play the Objective. Don't worry about tabling the enemy. And have fun!!
how to play Tyranids in 9th. have good friends who don't mind a bit of homebrew and narrative play
I really fear Nids are just gonna be a bottom tear army (again) this edition :S
It's 7th edition, but without little game breaking mechnics.
Maybe in tenth they’ll get a buff
Just wait for the Codex ^^
@@Melkor1205 yeah they will have 6 pages of carnifexes with slightly different load outs.
Nids lost most thier wargear, the bio morphs are embarrassingly limited and the one strength they had....numbers...nobody will now play.
Unless they get new units and some severe rule changes, they will be target practice for the Primari-sues.
what rules do you need to play Tyranids? Can you do that with just the Tyranid Codex or do you need another rule book? My son wants to play them and I don't know anything about the rules.
"How to Play Tyranids in 9th edition"
That just sounds like losing with extra steps :(
@William Lynch I run Death Guard actually; but I’d love to play ‘Nids, and I absolutely would, were they even a little more viable. Admittedly, I’m a bit out of the loop; I haven’t looked at data on the ‘Nids in about 6 months, so maybe they improved, but I’m not going to spend literally hundreds of dollars to build an army that will be shot off the board turn 1. That’s not fun.
I wish they'd make Tyranid Warriors stronger. They're just a tad too expensive for their datasheet and it's a real shame
They might get a (relative) points drop...
@@leegarner4592 I think hes talking about $$ expensive.
Quite a bunch of money for a troop.
Aren't warriors like 20 pts and 3 wounds?
@@MARStheFORSAKEN Only if you don't give them a gun of any kind and leave them with only a chainsword equivalent melee weapon.
Compare that to an intercessor that has 1 less wound for a higher armor, a gun, higher BS, and an extra attack for the same points
compare that to a Runtherd it could be worse just saying
Based purely on unit rules so far I think the Warrior style army will be the way to go for Nids (my preferred way since 7th TBF). Of course it's going to depend on points and I've got a horrible feeling Nids will get absolutely shafted because Cruddance hates Nids.
Agreed Warriors look better then ever. I still like my Termagants and mommy, but Hormagaunts are worse then in 8th and Genestealers got the shaft in points and rules.
Warriors, Hive Guard and Tyrants is just about all you'll see from me now.
@@ogsnoop2126 Playing with basic math alone, a group of five assault intercessors up against a unit of twenty hormagaunts will pretty much wipe out over half the gaunts at the cost of most of one Primarine in one round, then finish the job in the second.
I get that the Space Marines are the flagship line, but you'd think GW would at least _try_ to balance out the costs so comparable units would be comparable in performance.
@@stormisuedonym4599 the new points are back to 8th edition standards for Termagants. I am so happy about this, because they were punished for no reason initially. I understand your concerns, but there are methods within every games for mitigation, so I am less concerned.
I have played nids well enough and long enough to challenge my space marine friends now. Thanks for your math hammer, but I feel Termagants are viable option now.
Also 20 man Gant units are heresy, if it ain't 30 it is no good.
Thats a pretty long list of negatives for an already fairly weak army.
don't worry, us nid players are used to GWs hatred.
Nids are a high skill cap army....
@@mon929 In other words... shit
@@mon929 No. they're an army with shit rules because GW can't hire people who actually like tyranids to design their codex.
@@mon929 by skill cap, you mean the skill of not just switching to Space Marines like GW wants everyone to do?
As a new player, I really wanted to get started with Tyranids, but this is looking incredibly bleak
I'm still buying them cuz they look cool
@@magicmanscott40k Rule of cool always wins!
As an old tyranid player. I enjoy eating most opponents for lunch.
Main way to play Tyranids.......to hold and outlast the enemies shooting. What an absolute joke.
What ar we, Death Guard?
Not to mention the changes to modifiers killed the armies mechanics since the dawn of time. My Space Dinos will be waiting for a codex and maybe then see some play, but not likely...
I feel like a lot of things were skimmed over here. Nids are really squishy. They don't have any durability. They have awful AP on most weapons. They have issues with the t7 3+. They have awful shooting. With blast, coherency and combat attrition, nids are going to die super fast. Doesn't matter how quickly you can cover the board if your opponent can kill 60 models in exchange for losing 5-10 themselves. Most nid lists will be tabled by turn 3.
To be fair. Combat atrition is only a thing if you are out of synapse. And compared to previously, you probably loose öess to atrition that to the old moral system
Looks and on paper, but theory doesn’t always translate 1:1 to practice. They’ll be somewhat survivable due to the change to LoS and terrain
The worst thing to me is Hormies costing as much as ork boyz:’(
RIP nids, still paying for their sins in 4th edition.
what sins in 4th? they weren't good then either?
@@alexmacdougall5700 they were pretty fucking good.
I even commented on Frontline gaming that I'm shelving Tyranids this edition.
Gotta play market ball with GW if you want to win.
They were good in 4th, not broken though.
And Cruddance has been dicking them into the ground ever since for winning against his Marines.
Alex Macdougall THE Alex Macdougall? From art of war?
"You are an example of what will take you down". HAHAHA! *sad tyranid noises, this is top 3 my favorite army i am sad
swarm without swarm. really?
Ah my favourite troop choice
Squads of rippers
Am I the only one who cares that the Red Terror can no longer use a CP on the roll to eat an enemy character?
Who am I kidding - of course nobody else cares. >.< I'm one of about 5 people who have that model.
I did exactly his and got 3 more points after eating a full health attack bike in an ITC game like 2 days ago, it breaks my heart that it's going away T_T
@@itcamefromthedeep I care now that I realise
I'm pretty sure our termagants and hormagaunts are dead units now, genestealers still have a place but you'll see 5 man rippers and warriors fielded as our troops from now on. Hive guard are still a real threat and will probably be the only elite units taken besides zoanthropes. Carnifex and exocrine will also be probably the only heavys we bring besides the occasional mawloc. Our army is gonna have like 1 or 2 ways to play until we get an updated codex, and idk that itll help much anyway
The patch to the codex probably won't help. Shame, Blood of Baal is so good.
I hope they devour the damn Aeldari aliens that will buff the shit out of their forces to make them fun again.
@@rf-cattleprod6207 that patch isn't as good as it should be, just look at what everyone else got.
@@Ghorda9 Oh I am aware. 9th is the SM edition. Total joke for swarms, hordes and mobs.
In the new edition genestealers are 17 points base each. I think it’s dumb
Did they strip infantry from Biovores in 9th? They're infantry in 8th, so I figured they'd still be subject to move-and-shoot penalties
Biovores have the keyword "Infantry" in the codex, as you mentioned. Unless the Xenos listings change that status in 9th until we get a new codex - "Infantry" they are.
Biovores are infantry and do suffer a penalty for moving and shooting heavy weapons. In this case that is a perk as you want them to miss to make more bodies on the board to block movement.
Unless they really did think biovores don't get a penalty for moving cause they think they are not infantry, then they are very much mistaken unless something has changed regarding the unit or the weapon.
After the battle report disaster, I think these two guys should've lead this video with a disclosure that "We are not Tyranid players!".
Btw, the first list they talk about here at 20 minutes in is 2125pts in 9th ed - Swarmlord, Malanthrope, 120 Gants, 18 Zoanthropes and 6 Hive Guards.
I get the second list to 2303pts in 9th ed - 50 Genestealers, 6 Hive Guards, 9 Biovores, 3x3 Ripper Swarms, and assuming a Neurothrope, a Malanthrope, and a Broodlord (for all those Genestealers).
Makes you wonder what weird point levels they've been playing.
If you're going to bang the play tester drum, first make sure you know what you're talking about and that you recomment correct army lists. The concepts aren't bad though.
Could be playing off PL
Good job guys! I gotta say, despite the pre-order misshap from GWs side, the community has really done a stellar job, both content creators and players, to spread the word and hype/talk about this new edition! Love it!
Sounds bleak dudes. Man I play Orks and Nids. Both not great by the sounds.
What's wrong with Orks?
Could be worse. You could be playing CSM
Orks and Nids are my two favorite armies so I definitely feel you. Luckily I've always enjoyed a heavily mechanized guard and space marines.
Orks can atleast run a mechanized division, so I doubt they will be as shelved as your Space Dinos.
This is your periodic reminder that there is no "U" in Termagant.
But soon u will be
Thanks for taking the time to do these videos guys. Biovores are infantry units, which is beneficial to move them to increase their BS in order to miss and create the mines.
I think Maleceptors have got play in 9th...I believe Zoanthropes are a trap tbh.
MSU Genestealers is something that’s got legs also, there’s nowhere on the new size board a Genestealer can’t get to.
It will be KK hive fleet choice will be the most likely combination again.
Looking forward to playing nids again when tourneys get back up and running.
Played around 300 gants in 8th several times and loved it. With -1 from Malanthrope and 6++ it’s hard to shift. But with the new coherency-rules I need to practice the movement even harder. Thanks guys for the tips and tricks, see you out there!
Ok so what are the positives??
james borrett no
No such thing
Having just re-watched this video: you know when you’re in trouble when you need tactics tips on how to shovel off your miniatures...
Great video, I loved the format and the chemistry between the commentators!
Biovores are infantry so they suffer the penalty for moving and fire heavy weapons. Additionally, if they have to synapse in range they get another -1 to hit for their instinctive behaviour which has no effect but would counter any positive modifiers. So moving or not being in synpase are both ways to make them hit on 5+ which is actually great to achieve what you showed in the video. Additionally, this helps them to perform in a non kronos army cause you dont wanna actually hit.
Ok, they die so damn easily, getting in synapse is harder due to coherency, they only really charge two to three times a turn so overwatch is still going to effect them, more tanks on the field which nids can't kill. Basically I won't be touching the 3-4k points I have. Sad and salty
Yuuup, at least nids will still be valid in Kill Team, all 250 points you take there...
I'm looking at running a Hydra battalion with 100 Hormagaunts (3x30, 1x10), 2x Neurothropes, 2x Lictors, 1x Maleceptor and 3x Biovores, backed up with a Kronos patrol of walking Tyrant w/ Venom Cannon, 1x3 Rippers 5x Hive Guard and 2x Exocrine w/ Dermic Symbiosis.
Haven't been able to play test it yet but the theoretical strat is rather than keeping the Gaunts alive, deliberately rush them into opponents on objectives or in their deployment. Then use Death Shriek (Psychic) and Caustic Blood (strat) to inflict some MW when they die. Sure it's 2d6 per model, and only on a 6+, but it would be enough to severely hamper opponent's damage output later in the game. 30 Gaunts, average of 10 MW, on a hot roll even as high as 20 MW, enough to put a sizeable dent in even the toughest opponents. In the case of DG, they likely wouldn't kill the Gaunts fast enough to move past them.
Lictors deep strike to get board-control based secondaries
Maleceptor to give Gaunts -1 to hit from shooting
Biovores for dropping mines/controlling opp movement
Hive Guard for powerful, non-LOS shooting (good Marine killers)
Exocrines for strong firepower support
Hive Tyrant protects the big guys in the backfield from opp deep striking, while also having reasonably good shooting itself
Rippers for holding own DZ objective, or potential to deep strike as well depending on the matchup
Would love to hear your thoughts Titans!
Perhaps Tyranids need to have their own unique rules/mission sets/org charts separate from the rulebook? I think they should have more of a deathmatch-vibe on the tabletop, they're there to consume their opponents and planetary resources, not sit on arbitrary objectives.
That would honestly be pretty cool. Seeing Nids hit the table and whatever you where trying to play before doesn't matter, "fight for survival", that is the objective now.
I know folks have been calling them "Dakka-Fex" for a while, but I still know them as "Devil-Fex".
I'm looking forward to them having a strong role again as well as MSU Warrior broods and having a lot of troops choices on the board to control the battlefield objectives. Seems like high model count armies will have great potential, in a little different flavor than the big swarmy brood lists - but with a few big swarmy units being good to mix in. Thinking of the possibilities!
This video really highlights how weird my Nid list is. None of the negatives applied to me because my "troops" are Zoanthropes. No charging, wrapping, or worrying about Blast for me.
I’m at nearly 2,000 models for my hive fleet. Coming in at around 54k in points. Love this video and looking forward to testing some of these ideas out. Thanks guys
Really curious to hear your thoughts on Warriors with Enhanced Resistances. They were probably my favorite pick out of Blood of Baal and I think they will be even stronger in 9th. I was surprised they didn't get a mention.
I run mine as Jormungandr so they effectively have a 3+ save that ignores -1 and -2 AP. Boneswords and Deathspitters.
That's a lot of work to build a unit that is worse than the average space marine
Rando chiming in with his own thoughts.
I've been hearing a lot of people took warriors with enhanced resistance and jormungandr (myself a couple times). The morale immunity is really nice and the S5 AP-1 guns and S8 AP-2 D:D3 on a deepstrike can really shift an opponents attention, claim a corner of the board, potentially remove that Russ equivalent for 2CP shooting again, but I've not really been needing them to survive more than they already do. If tou deepstrike them, positioning is really a greater factor in their survival than ignoring AP-1/2 seeing as their 3 wounds makes them somewhat efficient targets for multi-damage AP-3 weapons which I find frequently turned their way.
I've had better results running termagants with jormungandr and enhanced resistance with a buffed up tervigon. They essentially become this 30 wound unit with a 5+ invuln against AP-1/2 and can only take 1 damage at a time, so low fire rate and high damage AP-3 weapons are really inefficient to shoot them with. On gants I'd say it's better than a permanent catalyst, especially since a lot of now blast weapons like battle cannons and manticors are only AP-2 or less and conventional saves stop multi-damage where as a catalyst has to roll on each wound. It really helps against some of their greatest enemies like tactical doctrine salamander flamer bombs. You can pop catalyst on 1 damage weapons and watch as the salamander spend 2CP to max fire their AP-1 veteran flamer squad to kill a grand total of 12 gants, 10 of which are replaced next turn, and then you get to smite a bunch of them, bypassing their storm shields (true story). I've found this combo even when stood in the open to require a much greater point commitment to remove from the board then the 300 point (or 390 points with a neurothrope) put in to build it. I haven't tried it yet with a malanthrope yet, though that might be going overboard. It's firepower is poor but it has obsec and at least 1 psyker, and with the right buffs on the tervigon the combo is harder to remove than a baneblade, though the enemy will be able to pick favoured targets with any weapon so you have to keep that in mind when mathammering.
I think jormngandr warriors will still have a place, but more as a deepstrike bomb with some raveners or a trygon to shift a side of the map in your favour, potentially popping another vehicle here or there with the venom cannons, rather than being a main beat-stick/damage sponge unit. Again, those big tasty 3 wound models make them viable targets for heavy AP-3 weapons so enhanced resistance is kinda wasted on them. This is against anything other than middle-ground blast weapons or tactical doctrine bolt rifles which you're better off just hiding from at this point (unless they're like manticors ofc). In ITC tournaments as far as I know you can choose which unit to put enhanced resistance on at the start of each individual match if you're buying it with CP, so you can always just switch it to your warriors if you see a lot of LoS ignoring AP-2 multi-damage in your opponents list.
I kinda just went off on one there and couldn't stop myself from going off topic haha. I'll leave it as it is though, 'tis food for thought.
@@Zach0451 yeah you are right we should all just play space marines .
@@TheMultipleJakes Nah, not what I said at all.
We should probably pay attention to what things cost for what they offer though, and tyranid warriors are simply too expensive when compared to similar units from other factions.
Hobo Frodo so we should play space marines?
Kraken Genestealers, advancing, moving again with onsalught charging, fighting, consolidation and 2CP to fight again. small board, tying up a couple of units, wiping out at least 1. Imagine it, embrace it.
Bro you for forgot the most broken of all
*look in the book at the swarmlords ability*
We're gonna need a bonus battle report of the soul crushing tyranid list just swamping some marines
100% agree playing the mission is priority for this army. However, points are really going to make or break nids. Small note biovores are infantry, which kind of do make them better because of the penalty to move. Love the videos, keep up the great work.
Short answer.... don't
At least until GW stops nerfing nids into the ground.
Sad Tyranid noises
My soul crushing list idea consists of a big blob of zoanthropes, two tervigons, and the rest of the army is termagaunts, hormagaunts, and gargoyles. Because, as you said, they won't be really effective at killing, I give everything invulernable saves. The tervigons both get the 5++, and I use the custom hive fleet 6++ for the swarm (and the second trait would be the -1 ap in CC for larger unit). Durability is the name of the game, and I imagine 200+ models would be hard to chew through fast enough to win the mission overall. Huge model count, invun saves everywhere, durable synapse. I'm excited to try it out!
Sadly, You'll probably only have about 80-90 models with the new point values for everything. I'm looking forwards to 9th ed, but my nids aren't.
@@Cha-Khia Using the points leaks I calculated I could indeed fit 30x7 gaunts plus Tervigons and some additional units in a 2k list.
love these videos! I'm really getting a good feel for how 9th ed is going to work and how armies will play. when you guys talk about the lists, could you maybe have the lists show up at the bottom of the screen or maybe link them in the description? thanks!
So nothing has changed... A fast moving horde army that we are encouraged to play passive with.
Mal with HG and gants is still one of the best lists with the edition of bios. IMO the best way to play nids is boreing. Just sitting back and wait instead of charging and using your speed was lame in 8th and I hated every game because I feel forced to play thus way.
I hope the point changes are not too bad. So maybe warrior's and raveners will be wirth bringing.
And I still don't see the point of bringing any monsters but the terv and cans. Carns can have a decent b.s. and S for guns. And tervigon can keep the troops coming, or do we have to pay for the troops coming back from the tervigons ability even if it's replenishing an existing unit?
Do you want to fully charge your oponents army instead and ram it into the ground?
Take massive ammounts of hormagaunts, spread them out in their frontline and then do a multi-not multi charge. Somehow nobody talks about the fact, that you can still pile into a unit, that you haven't cahrged. Sure you can't attack them, but that is not the reason you charge it. You just bind them up, so they can't do what they want and next round you slam a bunch of carnifexes into them.
If you want to play a thematic and fluffy army, then just do that. it is still better than before, because your units can't be shot as easily as before. And if your oponent is loading up with blast-tanks then guess what. Those things can't shoot into combat, so they are f... if you touch them as they were previously.
@@Gnarlf this is pretty much what I do already. But it's not as affective as other lists. Im happy with the overwatch rule changes, but I was just hoping that tyranids would get a bit more diverse or have other strats that don't rely on geanstealers. If your runing an assult focused army. This week will be our groups firat time testing the newer rules we know, so I'll have a better grasp of the changes then.
Gnarlf, sadly this list suffers against armies like knights, who can just ignore the hormaguants and just dunk on anything with more than 1 wound, guard can just set up multiple layers of screens and blast it off the table, with the new changes to eldar, it’s unlikely the bugs can break down the wave serpent, and space marines, well, space marines roflstomp everything.
So this list is fun and thematic, but it just struggles to deal with armies that can either outmelee it or can set up good enough screens. Because it relies too much on cheap melee units and not durable monsters. So sadly, this one probably isn’t super competitive.
@@Gnarlf how is it better than before when infantry cost more so you bring less, blast let's the enemy kill more on approach, and vehicles can keep engaging in melee even after you tie them?
As I said before. Today I tested the new rules and even took point changes into consideration.
Fought eldar bail'tan (sorry for messed up name)
I did hive fleet leviathan (would have bin better with jorm)
2 units of 11 termagants (flesh borers) toxinsack
2 units of 4 warriors (deathspitters) toxinsack
3 biovores
3 venoms
1 unit of 9 rippers
Tervigon and tyranid prime.
Biovores are better and against infantry or key targetscan be great for keeping units from walking free.
Warriors are good with 3 woumds and same stats as primaris. And even better with the prime.
Gants were nothing special but my oponant was infantry heavy, so single minded annihilation/scorch bugs is still good for that.
Venoms actualy did very well for keeping my people safe when moving to the OBJ. And rippers are another good distraction or holding OBJ.
Yes I did win, but becides the biovores being usefull. I didnt win by swarming my opponant. I won because I held points. Yes a win is a win. But it was just a boreing game.
IMO. point changes or no, the way to win with bugs is to survive and hold OBJ. I think termagants, rippers and biovores are gonna be the best to do this. Spend 1 CP to deepstrike rippers and lock up a unit. And use a big blob of biovores(6) to do the same with mines to another. Then sit on the OBJ with termigants and a venomthrope. But if you are like me, then warriors with death spitters and hormigaunts with toxinsack if you wanna play agro, and throw the adaptive phisiology that gives talons a -1ap. AND USE BIOVORES
I just got into 40k so I am very new to everything and tyranids are my first army, unfortunately for me though my brother plays t’au and I’m currently going on a 0-3 losing streak against him. So I’m trying to learn as much as I can to secure my first ever 40k victory so this was a huge help!
Out of A Dark sense of Humor from a Nids player since 5th edition... Do you have anyone else to play the game with? If not... You will have a Very bad time.
William Torres Well I have a friend who plays Space Wolves but I actually haven’t played against him yet, plus due to quarantine I am mainly just challenging my brother (t’au)
@@kuraiakarui8815 Then if they don't bring Hyper competitive lists it's possible. But man beating Tau is an uphill battle in the best of cases and nigh impossible when they tune lists against you as a Nids player. Hope your brother, like my Tau friend, has some lists that run subpar units just for the fun of it.
there's a stratagem for lictors where they can ignore overwatch if they just came out of deep strike. charge your lictor in, and then the unit you actually want to charge with. i didn't find tau too bad when i played them, but i did get first turn...
@@williamtorres4140 He likes running the 8 against me so I often fight that. Don't know if that's a positive or a negative, he also says that their are worse match-ups for tyranid's, if so what are some of the worst that I should be wary of? And is the t'au the worst against me?
How I see it is armies have 3 choices for ranged weapon load outs.
1. Lots of high Ap weapons
2. Lots of blast
3. A little of both
Unless they choose correctly to hard counter you (going horde or monsters) you can target the few main threats. My feeling is people will be more worried about tanks than hordes as less armies can horde.
Plus the blast isn't stronger it just removes the randomness for the equation. When you play againest lucky people it doesn't really change much
Draw of nids, a tide of freaky monsters
9th gameplay "prob want squads"
Lol great changes there sure itll go over well
I don't get why everyone keeps dissing the nids, I'm here like I've won 18 out of the 20 9e games I've played. Dakafexes with custom hive fleet works so well against everything. Only losses being against cheese of the utmost quality.
Poor nids are the dead last faction in 9th unless the point changes are supremely friendly to them
Knights are way worse off, unless you are just playing a kill em all mission for laughs. At least tyrands can actively compete in the primary.
As an update the points changes were supremely UN friendly to them and they are dead last. The were pretty great to knights though.
spoiler alert: they won't be
Ok thanks GW for completely screwing tyranids AGAIN!!!! My tyranids will continue go be shelved. Im so fed up with GW.
@Keith Marshall it's all fun and games till the competitive lists can't even compete with casual lists this edition, mark my words.
Stop giving GW money, its simple.
So after the point hike leak ... I dunno. Nid Infantry got a 20% price hike on average, the biovore saw a whopping 25% hike in price so that screen trick and geometry just got expensive. In contrast the acid spitting Tyranofex is only a 9% cost hike, dakka-fexes only 5%, and in general nidzilla shooters are very cost effective.
Tyranid army is no longer a horde/swarm army, that's for sure.
they increased hive guard by like 120%, probably hitting primaris sales
@@tomgilesmarvoloryley Shockannons are 0 and Impalers down, net change is +1 for shock and something like +5 to +10 for impaler
I hope the codex fixes the 'Nids. Give us ways to not get shot off the table turn 0, but please keep us aggressive. The Drukhari are a good example: They're fast, lightly armored, and hit like a truck. 'Nids are fast, lightly armored, and hit like a used tissue. Make Carnifex either hurtier or tankier. Make Hive Tyrant actually good. Please, GW. Stop buffing Space Marines and give us SOMETHING.
I think a huge unit of warriors COULD have potential this edition. I feel like there's always some guy who tries to make warriors work, but hear me out. 9 jormungandr warriors with enhanced resistances, catalyst, and in malanthrope/venomthrope range could be really hard to deal with. Ignoring -1/-2 AP, a 3+ save w/ 5+ FNP and -1 to hit. You can pop the -1 dmg stratagem if they are about to get blasted by something seriously terrifying like a leviathan etc.
Wasn't that good in last edition, much worse now with Blast and new Coherency changes for >5 units
People will need to build with primaris in mind, and anything that can handle primaris can rip warriors to shreds. Having an unkillable 9 man unit is also a bit pointless, because warriors are never going to be doing enough damage to force the enemy to deal with them. The enemy can mostly just ignore them and kill everything else.
I don't get why tau gets their full over-watch every turn still,
But nids don't get an Anti-restriction to the conga rule due to synapse linking.
wtf GW why you gotta nerf the nid tendrils
Synapse just needs to be reworked, its a cool idea that makes the army weaker in the end. Having to hide your big bugs to not lose it is kind of anit-thematic, often causing nids to play passively for a turn or two to maximize their army as a whole.I'm not a nid player, but I hate their rules, always seemed like they couldn't fully unleash like they really would want to.
4th ed.. thats when they really were monsters
Da Barr Laboratories ah the glory days
How to play Tyranids in 9th - Don't.
I am now a space marine player even though I have a lot of nids and I like them but what can you do
Cant wait for the new codex to drop! Im just glad "blast" weapons cant be used in melee so the zerg rush is still there just gotta get to the model before it blows everything away 😆.
"They are a lot better. We have a faction focus on them next week along with a battle report."
That was your words! They are as shit as always, maybe worse in this edition.
Won 2 ITC tournaments with a nidzilla list... they aren’t bottom tier by any means.
@@mon929 those were iron man tournaments, meaning the models that died stayed dead
turns out having a gimmick unit that could respawn your infantry would be good
@@mon929 Good for you, but only to win with luck is not a real win. Tyranids are to expensive in points and have a lackluster codex!
@@d3rralle964 isn't a game of dice luck?
IDK Shooty-Kronos was doing fine in 8th post space marine nerf. In that small window before tournaments ended due to COVID where they were getting wins. A lot of the LoS & Move-Shoot changes seem to positively affect them. I think everyone is over-focusing on the "shoving 90 genestealers down my opponent's throat turn 1" list, which hasn't been good for years.
Thanks for the video.
Nids are my faves.....but that was a boring and bad joke in the 8th ed (no models, bad rules, boring to play,....).
A "lore list" was bad....and looks already bad in thie edition too (gaunts hordes? * hysterical laugh *).
Everything sounds against Nids....and that was already one of the worst Codex.
I hope we'll have a new good codex and models this year....
Ok I'm new to the whole table top aspect of WH40K. I am in the process of research and purchasing my first Tyranids army. Also I hear them talking about there list of units in the army but it would be real nice if someone could assist me in having a actual List typed down of what one would need. Instead of them just saying it. Something to look back on and check off
Everyone is forgetting about warriors. Will need to look at Leviathan or Jormagundr instead of kraken Kronos. That will give resilience. Us the warriors adaptation and stratagems. This brings the army to the MSU style 9th appears to be favoring.
Nid players are just stuck on the kraken GS swarm with Kronos shooting. Gonna have to rethink.
I used warriors a lot actually, played as either Kraken (I really like melee) or Leviathan (the FnP is alright, but I like the strats and relic the most), and Kronos was/is to good to pass up, even now I think.
I'm not much of a competitive player, but I had more than a few games where I get tabled regardless of what I bring in turn 3-4, that wasn't fun, and with the points increases, changes to objectives, and the lack of staying power Nids have, I don't think 9th will be a good start of Nids, I hold out some hope it will get better, but GW's recent history doesn't favor that kind of thinking.
I haven't started watching the video yet. Let me guess, is the answer "don't play them"?
Biovores are infantry, so just move them back and forth and you are missing 2/3 of the time ;) spore mines for days
Which is actually beneficial since you can stop enemy charges and shooting that way.
Have you guys been playtesting Tyranids against Iron Hands Executioners on unchargeable platforms?
I played a casual 1100pts battle with a friend vs. Imperial Guard.
I killed about 173pts worth of guard. They tabled my entire army (Literally everything except a couple Zonethropes cowering behind cover at the back)
By turn 3.
holy fuck...
Biovore went from biomass snipers in 7th to a unit that does nothing 58% of the time at best. Why waste 150pts for a meme wall when for 70pts I can chuck 10 gargoyles up the board that with Kraken can easily move at best 36" in one turn.
Because they'll nerf that too.
For genestealers you can take nodes to hide in instead so it's not as bad as you would think. Maybe termagaunts and tervigons are the way to go as you can still regenerate termaguants over and over again
Hey guys, what do you think of this 1000p starterlist:
HQ: Neurothrope
Troops: 3x warriors with boneswords and deathspitters
Elites: 2x 3 hive guards
Heavy support: 2 Exocrines
1002p. I wanted a more elite list and thought these were really good units. Also I would use hive fleet kronos for the re rolling 1’s!
Pretty good list. The only thing I would change is to make the Hive guard one unit. Nids generally like to be in bigger blobs for psychic powers, strategems, and adaptive physiology. The Hive guard are a good unit to give either dynamic camouflage or enhanced resistance.
Thanks! Yes I was thinking of doing that but I thought when I have 2 units, I could play the objective game better! But I think you are right and its better for them! Thanks for your feedback!
Was looking forward for this video but sad with the content. Obviously nids are in a bad place if they only showed us 2 examples and the rest talking point about biovores.
Biovores are infantry. So they do have move and shoot penalties with heavy weapons, they can also be targeted with Single Minded Annihilation stratagem.
QUESTION: when the leaks about the full rules of actions was published i noticed a thing that i found...strange we can say. When a character perfoming an action is aura abilities switch off until the action ends, but on tyranids this means that his synapse too go off and almost all character are synaptic creature...is a really strict interpretetion or is really like this? Is probable to see an FAQ on this at the release? thank for the help and sorry for my bad english xD
Good spot. Not sure if it counts for psychic actions as well.
Just waiting for them to inevitably get a Primaris treatment aka a new line of Tyranids. Unlike with SM there won't be an argument on if they're getting replaced though. Primaris Tyrant Guard for instance?
They starting to push GSC a fair bit in recent times.
New Tyranid named character: Hobo.
Hold the Board!
Hold Board!
Hol Boar!
Hobo!
Pros:
Monsters are more dangerous now that they can shoot in melee
Monsters are safer because of the new cover rule
Cons:
Blast kills your infantry.
No more conga lining infantry
Sounds like it’s Nidzilla Time.
The yellow colour is really good.
I'm here, patiently waiting for Sister's video. Keep going, you are awesome
Sounds like there is going to be some major changes to this army in 9th,
Otherwise how would they keep this army from disappearing, Unless.... thats what GW wants
If the only army they have that's worth bringing ends up being primaris marines, the game dies and GW with it. I doubt they want to "get rid of" any faction, but with the direction they're going the game as a whole may die before any one faction does.
@@Cha-Khia - agreed. ive been a die hard Imperial fan since i started with 40k; and always found myself coming back to SM's for various reasons even after looking at other armies.
Now though its just plain boring to be a SM player. i mean, yeh you've got new toys and constant updates but this isnt the Horus Heresy (again) where its astartes vs astartes, its supposed to be 40k where you fight various factions.
I just hope that once the Primaris get their new models released, we'll see some love for the rest of the factions because as i said, its boring when the meta is filled with the same thing over and over again :/
I think i'd run a lot of hormagaunts because of pressuring them to use cp to overwatch.
Wish the exocrine could shoot stuff out of line of sight.
Yea, like a mortar shot
I just got alpha struck off the board turn 1 and totally wiped away turn 2. Killed 3 models. Vs Imperial Guard shooty army rerolling like Gesus would. The guy ignored all terrain rules cause too hard for him and I want being competitive whatsoever, never have. Very friendly game as you can imagine... Lots of fun when 1 person wants a friendly game and the other brings an optimised list..
Oh yeah and I'll add that I'm a noob at playing. Been collecting for ages but rarely played. First 9th game. And he made me charge over the longer side of they board. I honestly felt cheated, that's why I don't usually play games with my collections
Why didn’t you mention Tyranid warriors? If you give them the adaptive physiology of ap -1 and -2 is 0 there save will be a 4 up plus the stratagem that reduces damage by one against tyrand warriors (one cammand point). You can give them catylist. 5 up feel no pain. Those guys should be the one on obgectives
Zoanthropes do it better for not many more points.
Hugo Santos Zoanthropes are way more expensive than warriors are, at 40 points a model versus 25 for a kitted out warrior. But they also don’t have ObSec, so if someone tries to hold an objective with elites, like you’re doing with the ‘thropes, the warriors would take priority.
You can tell this edition is going to suck when testers have to tell us it's good.
I was halfway through painting an army when 9th was officially announced, I stopped completely. I even stopped painting side projects for other armies I had. I just pushed models into a box, stored them in a corner and cleaned up my workstation. It's been weeks. I no longer care about anything coming out for 40k currently.
I keep listening to people try an pump up this edition but it makes me feel like if it needs this much life blown into it, it's probably going to be awful. 40k is going to be a bloated corpse of what it should be. 9th edition is New Coke. It's freakin Crystal Pepsi. This is like the time I drove a stolen car through a neighbor's yard and all my parents could say was, "Why? Why did you do that? None of this makes sense."
GW is me, 9th is that guy's car and I am now my parents. Thanks, GeeDub, I didn't need that.
I can't tell if this is an ironic comment or not
@@harrycox804 It's not.
i feel ya :/ was looking at trying to get into 40k again with 9th but with the obscene amount of clout regarding SM's (and the stupid amount of OP'ness they get) i cant really be arsed.
And then looking at AoS and how downtrodden it feels in comparison to 40k, lol. If it aint SM then it aint worth GW's attention really, and i find that both appalling and sad, and im an avid Imperial fan. the new Primaris stuff looks cool, but theres too much of it all at once. and its only going to get worse in the coming months as they get their 9th ed 'dex, the new rules and abilities that work with 9th thst further unbalance the game in their favour... /sigh
guess GW dont want everyones money like we seem to think, haha
@@Shaabhekh Well geedubs said it, 'if you don't like it, you won't be missed.'
biovore mines sound great for charging flamers/undesirable things now. they either take the single overwatch of the turn, or bring the target into melee where they cant use it anyway
Great job !
Good old Geoff's nids... 🙏🏻🙏🏻
what about stringing your termagants out 1-2-1-2-1-2-1-2-1 etc? If you put your pairs of 2 in direct contact with each other and each one just within 2" of the singles that precede and follow them in the chain, you can string the unit out even further than the 5-model trapezoids, as youre only using 33% of your models to maintain coherency rather than 40%. And at the very worst you lose only 1 model to coherency checking if you couldn't predict how your losses would go, or you had to take from only one end because you needed the other end to maintain proximity to an objective, a buffing model etc.
Really want to start playing this game
Was kinda obvious after the first thirty seconds what they really are thinking...
14:24 praising the new terrain rules 5" tall that makes the Tervigon Obscured to anything drawing line of sight OVER the terrain piece. Fails to note the tail sticking out of the SIDE of the terrain piece. That Tervigon can be blasted with impunity by anything being setup to the right (from the Tyranid players perspective) in the enemy deployment zone. And if it were set up a little further towards the center to prevent this, its tongue would be sticking out on the OTHER side, making it a free target for shooting by anything deployed centrally. This is how most terrain pieces are - not built to make it a good game for big monsters.
Not 100% sure at the moment, but please check the rule again.
Iirc they obscuring is only negated if one model in the shooting unit can draw line of sight to the entire base of the unit, they shoot at.
@@Gnarlf You're confusing Obscured with Dense Cover. Obscured makes no mention of base at all, you only need to see 1mm of any part of the model sticking out on the side of a ruin to shoot it, as long as the line doesn't pass over any part of the ruin.
@@vaettra1589 1mm of the base specifically.
The way terrain works helps (slightly) with spindly bits, which Nids are well known for, in 8th, it was pretty much a forgone conclusion to try and hide anything of mine save for rippers and gaunts, due to their spindly nature, 9th has helped fix this due to needing both line of sight to the model, and depending on the terrain, a 1mm line base to base.
@@Cha-Khia @Cha-Khia Blankenship Model. Read the Obscured text box. As Gnarlf, you're confusing Obscured with the rules for Dense terrain.
In summary; if you play Nids in 9th your not going to have a good time..
Man I love the yellow you used.