Vampiric Bloodline Budget Precon Upgrade Guide Crimson Vow | Command Zone 433 | Magic The Gathering
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- Опубликовано: 11 окт 2024
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Show Notes:
Commanding a legion of vicious vampires doesn’t have to mean breaking the blood bank! This episode, Josh Lee Kwai and editor Manson Leung bring you our 10-card budget upgrade guide for the new “Vampiric Bloodline” Crimson Vow preconstructed deck. We’ll recommend 10 cards to add and 10 to remove (for about $30) to help you really raise the stakes at your commander table!
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What We Talked About on The End Step:
My Name (Netflix)
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Commander Rules and Ban List:
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Bit of a correction on Relentless assault; Relentless Assault specifies that it untaps all creatures THAT ATTACKED this turn. When Strefan puts a creature into play TAPPED AND ATTACKING, it has not been declared as an attacker that turn and thus would NOT get untapped for the extra combat, but getting two swings with your board and Strefan is still cool and powerful so I like the addition I just saw one minor error I wanted to point out 😊
Also the new vampire doesnt have haste so untapping wont matter anyway ;)
And people say MTG is too complicated
It would still count, tapped and attacking will count it as a creature that has "attacked" as well, it only does not trigger abilities such as "when this creature attacks" but anything that says "attacked" works, such as boast, etc, attacked just needs to see a creature that attacked, whether it was declared an attacker or not, the haste is a problem though 🤣
I see in in the rules where you're right, but if you don't mind I've got a question. What happens if I were to use "Olivia, crimson bride" to bring in "lim dul's paladin"? would the defending player still lose life if the paladin isn't blocked?
@@erikkeskinen2479 yes
as a newer player, this deck was extremely fun to play out of the box.
To me was pure pain like my first commander precon...
All this high production and the episodes doesn't have time stamps. Fantastic and useful information here nonetheless!
I absolutely love this precon. Blood token shenanigans is so much fun. I absolutely love having the ability to bring in big vamps so fast.
Here are the changes they made, of course be sure to tune in for the discussion around each choice.
In:
Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief
Inspiring Statuary
Crypolith Fragment
Spear Spewer
Stormfist Crusader
Relentless Assault
Seize the Day
Gonti’s Aether Heart
Lightning Greaves
Patriarch’s Bidding
Out:
Shadowgrange Archfiend
Imposing Grandeur
Vampire Nighthawk
Molten Echoes
Dark Imposter
Anje’s Ravager
Stromkirk Condemned
Bloodsworn Steward
Indulgent Aristocrat
Rakish Heir
I would like to see a second Upgrade Video where you include cards from VOW as well. Maybe a budgetless one too.
Really excited to build the partner commanders from this deck. I love the Goad mechanic, especially since my casual playgroup uses the combat phase much more often.
The new Anje is great here for some extra drain and such.
I thought the same but realized that due to their filming schedule (before release of the set) they don’t know prices of upcoming cards and therefore cannot tell if it’s budget friendly or not.
It also good for her ability to create blood tokens when a vampire enters the battle field because Strefan sacs two blood tokens to bring a vampire onto the battlefield.
Yea I definitely put her as the commander because I already have a home brew Anje deck but I wanted to see how well she would do in this precon as the commander
The way they were talking about Strefan's first ability made it sound like it only triggers if it was an etb even though it isn't
agreed- it’s an every end step when he’s out
@@Alexis-re3kt and it’s only when a player takes damage so if the player didn’t take damage because they defend with a creature or spell he wouldn’t get a blood token.
@@chilitaco2719 Hence all the cards that ping all players
How would reckless fireweaver fit into this deck?
Would u be able to make extra blood? Cuz u make blood in ur end step and when a blood enters it would do 1 dmg to every opponent. Would that make blood again or no cuz its ur end step already and u already made ur blood?
I can see it working cuz some vampires make blood when they come out unto the field tho.
@Jesus Pabon If you're making blood tokens in your end step, then reckless fireweaver's ability won't make you any additional ones. However, there are a lot of ways to get blood tokens before your end step that would net you more blood tokens because of RF. Of course, RF is for any artifact, so not just blood tokens.
I wouldn't necessarily say that the +1/+1 counter theme in the build isn't meant for going wide, but its likely intended to go big.
You should put the power level you feel the deck is before/after the upgrades.
Yeah, it would be very helpful
This is what I feel is missing from all deck tech videos. Anything can look good on paper but how good is hard to tell.
its probably the same after upgrade tbh - 3/4 casual
@@21Kikoshi blood tokens just in general suck, wasnt impressed with that precon at all. i think it comes with a blasphemous act atleast though which a noob will def need in another deck someday.
@@bennycostello2472 sounds like you didn't play with the deck
loved Manson's choices here for additions. - Also the card Voldaren Epicure from the Crimson Vow main set might be a good inclusion as well as a really cheap play that pings all opponents, creates a blood token etc. to enable some of the decks synergies.
Nadier's Nightblade pings each opponent whenever you sac Blood tokens & gains you life
I have two opinions about this episode. First, channel fireball market place was not a good shopping experience for me. Found 11 cards I wanted, came to $13 but then they wanted $16 in shipping. Maybe not all experiences are like that but definitely did not go through with the purchase.
Second, UltraPro sleeves are absolutely NOT the best sleeves. They might protect your cards but trying to shuffle with them is absolutely abysmal. They are so "sticky" when trying to shuffle. This is even their eclipse sleeves. Dragon Shield are absolutely without a doubt #1 for sleeves.
Agreed with Dragon Shield
Agreed, Ultimate guard are second, ultra pro not even third probably. I love their deck box, binders and playmats but except from Eclipse sleeves, which are deece, their sleeves are terrible
100% agree with Dragon Shield nothing else comes close
Yeah, Ultra Pro doesn’t understand what the word “Matte” actually means. Their “matte” sleeves are glossy as fuck
Nah it wasn't a pleasant experience for me as well I picked out 38 cards and they wanted close to 40 in shipping no thank you
I'm actually new to magic you guys were the ones who got me into it
That's awesome, welcome to Magic ! And don't forget: It's all about having fun, if you want to play "bad" cards because you think they're fun, just go for it !
@@Nr4747 thanks I just got my first deck as well so excited and will do
They're the ones who got me out of magic
@@anthonymarciano6050 I'm sorry to hear that
Dennis travels it can take a little time to find the play style that really brings a smile to your face. Don't hesitate to ask questions and try other decks...and while one turn win exists think twice before Smokestacks, Annihilator or Armageddon....or in other words cultivate the Gathering and the Magic will happen on its own.
After playing an upgraded Strefan for a couple of weeks. He churns out big vamps surprisingly often that you don't really need much ramp. The new Olivia and Drana from Zendikar Rising helps you put out extra vampires by discarding your big vamps to the graveyard. Tutors are also very powerful since you can cheat them directly the turn you tutor. It's so effective that it's worth playing diabolic tutor in a budget.
With my experience playing the precon, molten echos ends up being an mvp every game I draw into it. In my playgroup that mostly centers around slinging massive creatures, strefans ability ends up not being too terribly useful and he works better as a blood token generator. With molten echos out I'm usually able to get around my pods massive creatures by going wide and tall, there's also enough creatures in the deck that give you advantages when attacking ir dealing damage such as buffing up your vamps for each one that deals combat damage, or stealing as much life as there are attacking creatures. Going wide with tall creatures works fairly well, and it's how I was able to deal 73 damage on turn 8.
Two of my favorite cards in my Strefan deck are Olivia's Attendants as the make lots of blood and Reckless Fireweaver as he does a lot of damage blood.
Great tip on using Blood Tokens with Inspiring Statuary to reduce non-artifact casting costs! That gives Olivia's Attendants a useful role outside of Vampire decks.
I think it’s really interesting how they incorporated more madness synergy into these new blood tokens, and I like the approach of making it more of a go tall instead of the wide deck so that I don’t have to compete with Edgar. But because I already have an Edgar deck, I feel like most of this deck is just utility to modify decks and already have. I already have a powerful Edgar Markov deck, but watching this gives me all kinds of crazy ideas for this pre-con and I can’t wait to try it.
Also I like the shift towards Rakdos instead of Mardu. Makes for cheaper mana base improvements.
decent into avernus is like the perfect card for the deck. it lets you get blood tokens at the end of every turn. as well as ramp
Another random consideration here is Vampire Neonate. Can fill a similar role to Spear Spewer and has vampire/life drain synergy, but the downside is costing 2 mana per turn and it doesn't give you a Blood for hitting your own life total. Warlock Class can also help with draining opponents and ultimately doubling up your damage.
Warlock Class wouldn't help with Strefan's end-of-turn ability though, would it?
@@MakiMaki. @Sandro (サンドロ) so my understanding of this particular interaction is that *if* a creature died on your turn, both Strefan's first ability and Ability I of Warlock Class go onto the stack at the start of your end step, allowing you to stack them such that every opponent gets drained and then you get a Blood token for each opponent.
The one question I still haven't been able to find an answer to: does Strefan's first ability still go onto the stack at the start of your end step if *zero* players lost life that turn? I believe it should based on the wording of similar abilities.
I won with Gonti’s Aether Heart. It’s legit. At end of my turn Urza player tapped out ( he has Evacuation in hand) I responded by activating GAH then proceed to win the game.
I’d add a card called stensia masquerade. 2 and a red, gives attacking creatures you control first strike and whenever vampire you control deal combat damage to players they get a +1 counter. It also has madness for the same cost as the cmc. So it makes all your vampires increasingly bigger and harder to block, and it works with the rummaging.
Stensia Masquerade is actually in the precon deck already, so clearly WotC had the same idea.
Vampires are a real powerful creature type. Can't hardly wait for my pre-orders to finally arrive.
I just ordered the deck a day ago, this came at the perfect time, thank you!
I feel that blood gives you a good path towards a reanimator sub-theme :)
My suggestions for upgrading the deck would also be:
- New 4MV Anje (VOW)
- New 6MV Olivia (VOW)
- New 6MV Olivia’s Attendants (VOW)
- 6MV Vein Drinker (C17)
- Reanimate
- Animate Dead
- Living Death
- New 3MV Vamps Vengeance (VOW) (= mini board wipe + blood)
I also like 3MV Anje (C19) with Falkenrath Gorger.
I like Court of Ire to do some damage and add monarch to the game, vampire cutthroat to sneak a little damage in each turn, Heirloom Blade to help keep your hand full of vampires, and Florian, Voldaren Scion to help draw cards off the damage you do, Anger to discard to a token and give everything haste. I also like liquimetal torque for the deck, i feel like it came with a lot of artifact destruction out of the box and it helps get more mileage out that.
I'm new in magic and this is my first deck.
This video came in a great time
Welcome to the game! Hope it treats u well, though ur wallet may not like it much haha!
Welcome brother, enjoy :)
Welcome !
The original Edgar Markov precon was my first commander deck. Welcome new blood to the vampire family!
My buddy played this deck in our group a few days ago and it was really cool, even just out of the box. Have fun!
I just wanna say without seeing the video yet, it may not be a vampire (unless you wanna throw in a maskwood nexus or something). But with how easy it is to make the blood tokens (artifacts). But hellkite tyrant is a pretty solid addition to the deck.
On this episode of "What cards are going to spike today?" Lmao
Every episode of CZ be like
always a big fan of these. trying to guess beforhands what goes in and comes out is always a fun mini game
Manson managed the budget really well.
I have Edgar to build around and I'm looking forward to get this box too. I will for sure switch out some cards you have spotted here.
Thanks for a great show!
RE Bloodsworn Steward, I think you're right, but there is some advantage after Strefan has been killed and you recast him - more value as soon as he comes out. I'd still probably cut though. Better haste enablers...
I think Vampire Nighthawk is still a good card to run in Strefan since you can run lords and whatnot. Also as mentioned, you don't want to use Strefan's ability here on this card, but a 3 mana creature with 3 keywords on a decent body, I feel is still worth it.
You don’t really wanna run lords in a deck that is going tall rather than wide.
@@hiddenleaf414 Good point, going tall does not need that many lords! I do think it depends on the overall deck construction and play style as well. Strefan loves big Mana Value vampires, but not many have over 4 power. Having some vampires like Captivating Vampire, Vampire Socialite or Drana, Liberator of Malakir is not a bad idea though. They offer some good back up to the already big creatures and offer needed support to the smaller Value creatures. Might be able to bring in a 2/3 flyer as a 4/5 instead. I appreciate your opinion though, spot on! Have a good day.
Just got Vampic bloodline for Christmas this video been incredibly helpful
Did Josh read Strefan correctly? He makes blood tokes at the end step not as an etb
I was going to say the exact same thing
Just bought the deck, going with Olivia, Crimson Bride as my leader. Working on switching out a few cards for better ones.
A couple of misreads on cards this go around which is unfortunate. Maybe more of a focus on upkeep table drain like Triskaidekophobia or the black Sanctum would have been nice as Strefan's ability is repeatable.
I bought the deck after playing it several times with different variation, including olivia, crimson bride and some of the main set blood token creature's, blood tokens become your ramp. With strefan the only spells you end up playing are cheap creatures or sorcery's, especially because a lot of the cheaper creatures have a lot of vampire synergy. Whereas the expensive cards are more effectively played by sacking tons of blood tokens. Main strategy is always pinging someone or atleast yourself every turn to create atleast one blood per turn. It also has just enough ramp to get strefan out early and use him as ramp.
Pulse Tracker and Vicious Conquistadors are great include, they ping all opponents on attacks, and they only cost 1 black.
Would switch out the demon for Arterial Alchemy. In this deck, you probably don't want to spend 2 mana just giving a +2/+0 on a single creature as equipment.
Cranial plating is better if someone's goal is to buff up a creature.
Thx for the Video :) Interesting you didnt mention the olivias. I also added Olivia crimson bride, olivia voldaren, olivias attendants, voldaren estate and other cards making me bigger or add to the blood token theme like Vampire socialite, Florian Voldaren Scion, Voldaren Bloodcaster etc. I laso experiment with Agadeems Awakening and Crackle with Power (because i have them lying around).
And there are a lot more cards to take out, like Stromkirk Occultist, Crimson Honor Guard, Vampiric dragon, or all the madness stuff wich dont work for me like Avacyns judgement. I also took Mob Rule out. This makes no sense in this deck in my eyes. Better to add another variable board wipe like Plague Wind or Garruks Wake or other Stuff.
And i also took Vampiric Nighthawk out and added Nighthawk Scavenger (also one of the cards i had lying around ^^). And with adding Olivia it is also an idea to add other legendary vampires like Zagras.....(yep, had him lying around, too...XD).
With the primary usage of blood tokens being sacrifice. I feel like Mayhem Devil is an honorary vampire.
There are a few other artifact sac matter cards that this applies to as well.
@@joshholmes1372 ooh really?
That card finds its way into every Rakdos deck regardless of the srategy.
Blood tokens don't sacrifice.. they discard
@@viktoryegorov2721 reading the token explains the token
Picked this up to act as a foundation for Evelyn, the covetous, can't wait to tear it down and build it back up
Molten Echos seems amazing. Play it then next turn play blood artist and chain reaction and just smile. You could also cheat out scion and blaphemous act with it as a follow up for massive amounts of treasures.
Massive amounts of treasure? How? Scion of Opulence triggers only at non-token Vamps.
Endstep is always worth the try...thanks for the recommendation
if you have not watch K dramas before, you can also try an older Netflix series "Memories of Alhambra". It has a pretty cool concept to the backdrop of the story.
And there goes my Christmas bonus
Shadowgrange has been great in my Olivia, Crimson Bride deck. People see me Entomb moving to combat and the look on their faces tells all. This card is great. Would I put it in a Vampire tribal deck? Not too sure about that.
I really like impact tremors for the deck.
I'm going to combine the deck with the Anje Falkenrath deck for the madness
This is the way.
I would def be playing vampire nocturnes in this deck
25:15 Cards to add
38:00 Honorable Mentions
43:07 Cards to cut
I'm old enough to get the "it's like Sylar from Heroes" joke
It's just like that kkkk
I miss that show :(
@@Smutter86 ever tried to watch it again?
I bet you'd stop missing it kkk
There are thing that's better to keep the memory
@@GabrielSilva-mv4fm I've watched it more than once. Still as good as the first time :)
I finally got my hands on this man.
Mansungs "S-T-A-T-S" was awesome!
Please please please do updates to these videos!!!
I wonder how many cards have been released since that you would swap out for
Cryptolith Fragment is so good in this deck. It triggers Stefan for all players.
i use lorian as my commander and he works really well for the deck
I don't agree with your philosophy on Bloodsworn Steward. If you can't attack with Strefan on turn 4, then there's no reason to NOT play the Steward first. That way, next turn you get the extra 2 damage and a 4/4 body on top of it.
Like what Josh said the +2/+2 to only your commander isn’t a big deal, and if they are going more for the artifact/blood token theme, which they are, then getting Strefan down asap is more of the goal. Especially since they are playing cards like Spear Spewer or Cryptolith Fragment which come out before Strefan so you can get the 4 Blood Tokens on the turn Strefan comes out.
@@hiddenleaf414 Not quire without haste enablers, you essentially put your commander out for 1 rotation to be answered to. With the Steward, you could delay playing your commander and avoid any sorcery speed removal and still get to attach with Stefan on T5 (similar to playing Stefan on T4 and attacking on T5). Additionally if you think someone may be holding up removal for Stefan, you then have the additional option to play around the removal and still threaten to attack with Stefan next turn.
@@gabrielsoo2939 You need the blood tokens first. We aren’t talking about Strefan attacking. His trigger happens at end step. He doesn’t need to attack. We are talking about getting Strefan down asap so you can get the blood tokens. That’s literally in the gameplan for this video.
Really looking forward to this precon
I’m planning on putting a bunch of other vampires that give me vampires for free into this deck such as Olivia crimson bride and drana the last bloodchief
Molten Echoes almost looks better to me in Edgar than this deck when you have something like Coat of Arms out. But I don't think there is much room at 4 mana in that deck anyway to cut something for this effect. I'm sure there is a better home for this somewhere though.
Mob Rule + Relentless Assault is big win con to be ignored.
What about volderen bloodcaster when one of your nontoken creature dies create a blood token transforms into blood at summoner when you get 5 or more blood tokens then at the beginning of your combat you can pick a blood token and it turns into a 2/2 bat blood token and it doesn’t get summon sickness. Or blood fountain cost
You should have maybe added Sanctum of Stone Fangs.
Do you guys have links for buy lists for your upgrade recommendations?
God I got the Heroes reference
Great analysis and suggestions!
Finally this video came out 😪!
Play with wilhelt the rotcleaver!! It's my fav deck by far
Did Josh think strefan triggered when it enters. It triggers on your end step
Any advice on the Rakdos challenger deck?
Why molten Echoes is cut? Im new at MTG. Is it copy all abillites and effects?
Happy thanksgiving
Molten Echoes was such a pointless inclusion in the precon - and such a feel-bad during my first game with it. Luckily I realised the non-synergy myself here, I just stopped by to see whether you'd bring it up, and explain it to anyone who maybe hadn't figured it out yet.
So far I've only added DeLina and she makes the etb's in this deck fatty
Edit: this deck plays so fast I needed more card draw than just the blood tokens
Laurines goad is also underrated
Yeah someone definitely took out some cards and replaced my box never buying from ebay again
An-YUH like Anya
Another great video!
Nice Video! 👍
Lol, that's gonna be a strong "nty" on the Stormfist Crusader. Giving my opponents 3 cards for 3 blood tokens doesn't seem worth it to me. Also another pass from me on Patriarch's Bidding. I'd rather run Haunting Voyage; it's more expensive to cast, but can get back all of your stuff only, and you won't lose it to a wheel or something (assuming you foretell it beforehand.)
Given how many people I know play tribal decks, I wasn't a fan of the Patriarch's Bidding either. I didn't put it in mine or my wife's deck either for this exact reason. I do have Haunting Voyage, so I may sub that in instead. Either that or grab one of my other vamps I pulled from VOW. Thanks for the insight! :D
What about Westgate Regent???
I’m baffled they added Blood Tokens but didn’t add any new Madness cards…
Yep!!!
Oh sweet its vampires!
Cards you missed: anything with the text discard a card draw how many ever cards
Yes another command zone to entertain me
Josh I got a question if Stefan has the assault suit on it can I still trigger his ability even if they don’t attack I know they would come in tapped if it does work but I can’t attack on someone else’s turn so I’m asking
Every reference to "you" on a permanent on the battlefield refers to its controller, not its owner. If someone else gains control of Strefan for the turn, _they_ would get the triggers, not you.
From the rules: "109.5. The words “you” and “your” on an object refer to the object’s controller, its would-be controller (if a player is attempting to play, cast, or activate it), or its owner (if it has no controller). For a static ability, this is the current controller of the object it’s on. For an activated ability, this is the player who activated the ability. For a triggered ability, this is the controller of the object when the ability triggered, unless it’s a delayed triggered ability. To determine the controller of a delayed triggered ability, see rules 603.7d-f."
@@therealax6 thanks
ok, its no budget upgrade, but sorin imperious bloodlord and Bloodline Keeper would be a great addition to this Deck also.
Quick comment: Josh kinda took over this time! Gotta let your cohost talk a bit too and explain his thoughts!
When can we expect the GameKnight Deck Boxes to arrive? Last update was in October??
What mtg life counter app do you guys use on game knights
Lifelinker. It's their own app :)
51:40
Guys
Playing the steward before strefan does not slow him down
He come iut the next turn with haste AND additional attacker to earn more blood tokens
They weren't claiming that the Steward *slows Strefan down*. They're explaining that it doesn't *speed him up*. Which is just true. You can: a) play Strefan on turn 4 with no haste and attack with him turn 5; or b) play the Steward turn 4 then Strefan turn 5 with haste and attack. In both scenarios, you're not attacking until turn 5. So the Steward does absolutely zero to help speed him up.
And course corrected midway.
The vampire deck has a similar name to the 2017 deck.
Nearly the same, 2017 was vampiric bloodlust
Hoping for a non-budget guide for the original Edgar Markov deck
The commander f eels more suited for Brawl than commander. Was hoping for a Mardu option for Edgar.
What ever happened to Mel?
For real. I haven’t seen her with the crew for years. I don’t follow her personal media so I’m not sure if maybe she’s had something going on.
Think she works for wotc now
@@andreviljoen7157 thought she died...
Every game i get an early rakish heir out i start running away with. The deck gits hard and the steady growth gets rapidly problematic. Also easy upgrade tip improve your blood production especially in the early game it pays off in fast strefan activations more than a spear spewer woukd